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Real stamwhip
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ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭A Magicka skill on a dot is fine like soul trap or even blockade, but on a spammable it would seem like you'll never sustain it, ESPECIALLY in PVP.
PvE.. you might : Charged x combustion and battle roar you might actually get away with it using tri stat food and all other stamina skills; too lazy to do the math, will you parse for me. I'm a MagDK
This would be doomed to fail in PvE as well. The DK as a classes heavy relies of outside source of crit chance to deal sufficient damage.0 -
ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »What does it matter if it's Poison Damage in 2021? Ignoring anything about sustain and costs, what? Swamp Raider and Scavenging Demise? It will hit harder against Heavy Armor if it's Flame, also gives us a way to proc Burning. The only other thing I can think of is Poison Whip would hit WW harder, on Flame it will hit Vampires a little harder until Undeath makes it not, but I'm probably missing something.
Also this way we can choose between the different secondary effects of the two morphs, which is nice, rather than just getting 1 Stam morph.
It matters because you are still relant on a status effect for sustain, and if you are not using flame claw and breath you already have less ways to sustain a mag skill. The only way I could see this working is if poison and burn status gave both resources.0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Miloscpolski wrote: »you already have 7 sourses of spammble ability for stamdk, whip of magdk is already scaling from primaty dmg, leave alone magdk's whip pls
Do you have an issue with the current change to let it scale off Weapon Damage as on PTS? People were saying it should have an additional function - change to cost Stam if Stam is the higher resource. Neither of these take anything away from MagDK. You don't want to lose a morph or you don't want StamDK to be able to use the skill at all?ke.sardenb14_ESO wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »What does it matter if it's Poison Damage in 2021? Ignoring anything about sustain and costs, what? Swamp Raider and Scavenging Demise? It will hit harder against Heavy Armor if it's Flame, also gives us a way to proc Burning. The only other thing I can think of is Poison Whip would hit WW harder, on Flame it will hit Vampires a little harder until Undeath makes it not, but I'm probably missing something.
Also this way we can choose between the different secondary effects of the two morphs, which is nice, rather than just getting 1 Stam morph.
It matters because you are still relant on a status effect for sustain, and if you are not using flame claw and breath you already have less ways to sustain a mag skill. The only way I could see this working is if poison and burn status gave both resources.
Ah, maybe I should've clarified all of my comments pertain only to PvP.
Edited by Urzigurumash on September 22, 2021 8:42PMXbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast0 -
ke.sardenb14_ESO✭✭✭@Urzigurumash
My argument still holds in PvP, because you are using a skill that doesn't provide you stamina resources(i.e. Poisoned).
In PvP I'd be even less inclined to use the skill considering my armor, rotations, and burst heal all cost mag.0 -
Wellsley✭✭✭Seems to me the best solution is to change to cost Stam if Stam is the highest resource.
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robbolicious✭✭yep literally just change the ability cost to scale with your highest offensive resource, problem solved.Edited by robbolicious on September 24, 2021 9:37PM2
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axi✭✭✭✭✭I think for stam DK ZoS is seeing molten whip more like an burst tool rather then a regular spammable. Don't forget class already have stamina based spammable so suddenly dk would become the only class with 2 stamina spammableif cost would be also changed to stamina or to higher resource.0
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BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭I think for stam DK ZoS is seeing molten whip more like an burst tool rather then a regular spammable. Don't forget class already have stamina based spammable so suddenly dk would become the only class with 2 stamina spammableif cost would be also changed to stamina or to higher resource.
Don’t forget the other morph of whip looking more and more like the skill stam dks will run. Actually dk won’t be only class with 2 stamina spammables technically necromancer has 2 spammables one in skulls the other in the scythe skill under the tanking line0 -
KhajiitLivesMatter✭✭✭✭I think for stam DK ZoS is seeing molten whip more like an burst tool rather then a regular spammable. Don't forget class already have stamina based spammable so suddenly dk would become the only class with 2 stamina spammableif cost would be also changed to stamina or to higher resource.
Don’t forget the other morph of whip looking more and more like the skill stam dks will run. Actually dk won’t be only class with 2 stamina spammables technically necromancer has 2 spammables one in skulls the other in the scythe skill under the tanking line
nb has 2 to suprice atack and essence drain1 -
BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭KhajiitLivesMatter wrote: »I think for stam DK ZoS is seeing molten whip more like an burst tool rather then a regular spammable. Don't forget class already have stamina based spammable so suddenly dk would become the only class with 2 stamina spammableif cost would be also changed to stamina or to higher resource.
Don’t forget the other morph of whip looking more and more like the skill stam dks will run. Actually dk won’t be only class with 2 stamina spammables technically necromancer has 2 spammables one in skulls the other in the scythe skill under the tanking line
nb has 2 to suprice atack and essence drain
I wasn’t really considering essence drain as that is purely an aoe skill but ya it could count to be technical0 -
VarisVaris✭✭✭✭✭I think for stam DK ZoS is seeing molten whip more like an burst tool rather then a regular spammable. Don't forget class already have stamina based spammable so suddenly dk would become the only class with 2 stamina spammableif cost would be also changed to stamina or to higher resource.
You can't define poop fist as a spammable, it simply isn't one2 -
red_emu✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Be careful what you wish for. Since the whip has secondary effects, it would be likely that if they change it to stamina cost it will have:
a. Damage halved compared to magicka version
b. Cost increased to 4-6.5k stamPC - EU:
Falathren Noctis - AD MagNecro
Falathren - AD StamSorc
Falathren Eryndaer - AD StamDen
Falathren Irimion - AD MagPlar
Talagan Falathren - AD StamDK
Falathren Infernis - AD MagDK
Your-Ex - AD MagBlade0 -
BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭Be careful what you wish for. Since the whip has secondary effects, it would be likely that if they change it to stamina cost it will have:
a. Damage halved compared to magicka version
b. Cost increased to 4-6.5k stam
If anything they will likely combine molten whip and flame lash and give stamina something different for an effect.
It’s very unlikely they are gonna increase cost to amounts you mentioned as this will be far above the standard spammable cost. Halving the damage is unlikely as well as this also would put it below the standards ZoS has established in regards to spammable skills.Edited by BattleAxe on September 28, 2021 8:16PM0 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Be careful what you wish for. Since the whip has secondary effects, it would be likely that if they change it to stamina cost it will have:
a. Damage halved compared to magicka version
b. Cost increased to 4-6.5k stam
If anything they will likely combine molten whip and flame lash and give stamina something different for an effect.
It’s very unlikely they are gonna increase cost to amounts you mentioned as this will be far above the standard spammable cost. Halving the damage is unlikely as well as this also would put it below the standards ZoS has established in regards to spammable skills.
I care about one thing and one thing only - I need those Flaming Eyes. If that's taken off Molten it should be moved to the base ability.Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast1 -
BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Be careful what you wish for. Since the whip has secondary effects, it would be likely that if they change it to stamina cost it will have:
a. Damage halved compared to magicka version
b. Cost increased to 4-6.5k stam
If anything they will likely combine molten whip and flame lash and give stamina something different for an effect.
It’s very unlikely they are gonna increase cost to amounts you mentioned as this will be far above the standard spammable cost. Halving the damage is unlikely as well as this also would put it below the standards ZoS has established in regards to spammable skills.
I care about one thing and one thing only - I need those Flaming Eyes. If that's taken off Molten it should be moved to the base ability.
I was thinking more so flame lash going being the base ability molten whip would be magical and then you would have toxic sting or something that sounds poison like for stam whip morph1 -
Urzigurumash✭✭✭✭✭
✭Urzigurumash wrote: »Be careful what you wish for. Since the whip has secondary effects, it would be likely that if they change it to stamina cost it will have:
a. Damage halved compared to magicka version
b. Cost increased to 4-6.5k stam
If anything they will likely combine molten whip and flame lash and give stamina something different for an effect.
It’s very unlikely they are gonna increase cost to amounts you mentioned as this will be far above the standard spammable cost. Halving the damage is unlikely as well as this also would put it below the standards ZoS has established in regards to spammable skills.
I care about one thing and one thing only - I need those Flaming Eyes. If that's taken off Molten it should be moved to the base ability.
I was thinking more so flame lash going being the base ability molten whip would be magical and then you would have toxic sting or something that sounds poison like for stam whip morph
Well that's a good idea. I just want those Flaming Eyes though. This skill could do damage to me and I'd still equip it for the eyes. (kidding)
Xbox NA AD / Day 1 ScrubDK / Wood Orc Cuisine Enthusiast2 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭We need a stamwhip with a stamina cost, not just scalling with hightest offensive stats.
Only this would "finally end the fiery and age-old debate over getting a Stamina Whip".
Maybe next week ? 🤔
Its never happening, I'm moving to New World soon, permanently,
So don't do that, don't me hope.Edited by Ragnarock41 on September 30, 2021 12:11AM1 -
Wellsley✭✭✭Ragnarock41 wrote: »We need a stamwhip with a stamina cost, not just scalling with hightest offensive stats.
Only this would "finally end the fiery and age-old debate over getting a Stamina Whip".
Maybe next week ? 🤔
Its never happening, I'm moving to New World soon, permanently,
So don't do that, don't me hope.
If it doesn't happen, the "fiery and age-old debate over getting a Stamina Whip" will continue1 -
pylbSoul ShrivenI'd rather have it use magicka, having a "free" spammable is pretty great for sustain. It'll pair great with Bahsei too.0
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GRXRG✭✭✭✭redspecter23 wrote: »MashmalloMan wrote: »On another note, a magicka cost sounds like a massive sustain buff if a Stam DK can manage it.. Thats like 6-8 casts every 14s at 2300 magicka? A drain of 1300 magicka a second, may be possible to handle with some burning procs via combustion, but I doubt you can fit FoO in there too.
That's the potential right there. If you can find a way to make it work on your magicka pool without giving up too much, then it's a sustain dream having your spammable not cost any of your primary resource.
Right now on my stamdk I am sustaining Volatile Armor, Flames of Oblivion, Shattering Rocks, Molten Armaments and Coagulating Blood with Orzorga food, Death's Dealer and Battle Roar passive.
With the buff to Battle Roar and combustion I think you can sustain decently Molten Whip, used it as burst, but not Flame Lash used as spammable.
The only problem is I really do not have a slot to fit them since I am using Master Dw with Rending Slashes.
The only "semi flex spot" slot is the snare removal, but it's too good not to use it since Dk is naturally super slow and if you are snared you are pretty much dead.
And yeah I am using a weird Dw/SnB setup kinda hybrid-ish to have a really good Coag tooltip.
But even in a more standard 2h/SnB Dk, replacing dizzy with Whip, noy sure you can really sustain it as spammable, because you don't run orzorga in that setup, but lava food or artaeum... So yeah.0 -
Bl4ckR3alm93✭✭✭Extinct_Solo_Player wrote: »Urzigurumash wrote: »Extinct_Solo_Player wrote: »Change is so dumb, why do half baked changes when you can just do the Change properly by scaling the skill cost based on whichever resource is highest.
I don't know, I've always played semi-hybrid and although I've never consistently stuck with Pelinal's+Whip, I always found sustain to be quite good with it. DK might have the best hybrid sustain in the game, to re-iterate.
If this new Whip is only good for the semi-hybrid StamDK, so what?
I mean i shouldn't be forced to play a hybrid just to be able to use lash as a spammable like really? In a pvp scenario my mag pool is already used up by fragmented shield, cauterize, volatile armor. In my opinion it would be better to add highest resource scaling to the skill cost that way no one really loses out on how they want to play.
I definitely agree that this should happen0
