The Elder Scrolls Online

Update 40 featuring the Endless Archive is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/categories/pts
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• [COMPLETE] PC/Mac: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – October 2, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC)
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• Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – October 4, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – October 4, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)

Upcoming Changes to Battleground Queues

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  • Unknown_Redemption
    Unknown_Redemption
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    ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
    Hello all!

    When Battlegrounds first launched, we initially saw some data and feedback showing a preference specifically towards the Deathmatch game mode. With the recent removal of the option to choose a game mode when queuing for a Battleground, we’ve now seen an uptick in players choosing to treat any game mode as Deathmatch. In an effort to increase Battleground population and interest, the Solo and Group queues will only offer the Deathmatch game mode for a period of time. This change will occur during next week's maintenances, on September 20 for PC/Mac/Stadia and September 22 on consoles.

    After we have a chance to digest some of the feedback and data from this experiment, we’ll decide on what the next steps should be for Battleground queue options and consider the best way to add the other Battleground game modes back in.

    Thanks for your continued interest and support! We’re excited to hear what you think.

    Will you consider removing the achievement requirements for the BG Housing items?
  • Nirntrotter
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    Wow, sorry what? I mean, I generally agree with the sentiment that the non-DM modes are poorly designed and that taking choice away from people generally does not fix the problem or make them suddenly like what they didn't like in the first place. Mid-scale battleground modes are usually my favourite content in MMOs, except for ESO, so yeah, I get it. I just wonder what this will mean going forward. Wouldn't want to get stuck with achievs that I suddenly can't complete anymore.
    Grand Warlord Arodel, Gryphon Heart
    <Serenity>
    AD MagDK, *2014, PC-EU | 49k+ achievement points
  • Jaimeh
    Jaimeh
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    I don't run BGs too often, but personally I like crazy king, and it's a pity they are disabling it along with the other modes, even temporarily, in favour of death match. These modes also have achievements associated with them as well, so if someone wants to go after them, they'll have to wait if and when they come back @ZOS_GinaBruno?
  • Luke_Flamesword
    Luke_Flamesword
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    Lol, if we will have only deathmatch for now, can we at least have working achievment for kills (I really want this red dye)

    https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/579613/pit-hero-achievement-bugged/

    It's not working since last Midyear mayhem in June - it's almost 3 months now without any feedback...
    PC | EU | DC |Stam Dk Breton
  • Soul_Soliloquy
    Soul_Soliloquy
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    Much sadness, flag games are my fave BG’s
    GM Waking Dreams | PC NA
  • ClawOfTheTwoMoons
    ClawOfTheTwoMoons
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    Personally the only objective mode I like is crazy king, but if this means I don't have to play chaos ball or CtR I'm fine with it~
  • Foto1
    Foto1
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    thanks, Zos! we have been waiting for this for almost a year. it makes sense to return to pvp again
    PC/EU CP 1200+
    Artaxerks stamina dk khajiit
    Wayna Qhapaq magicka dk argonian
    Rorekur stamina sorc orc
    Maria de Medici magicka sorc breton
    Cordeilla stamina warden wood elf
    Quienn Gwendolen magicka warden high elf
    Nefertari stamina necro khajiit
    Boadicea Icenian magicka templar dark elf
    Clarice de Medici healer nb breton
  • FrankonPC
    FrankonPC
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    Coerfroid wrote: »
    Really? This is very sad news.
    Removing the tactical game-modes will remove a lot of fun and excitement.
    A lot of players enjoy the tactical elements over blunt ganking and playing for objectives actually encourages teamplay.

    Yes, there will alway be the random group that just won't grasp how the objectives work and end up with twice the kills and half the victory points. But it only takes so long to learn.

    It would be a very bad move to remove them completely and I trust in the commujnity to give a constructive feedback about it.

    Now, if there are those who actually prefer a dedicated deathmatch mode over random tactical modes, then separate queues may be the answer.

    I think you and a few other people in this chat are underestimating how team oriented deathmatch actually is.

    If you look at domination, on some maps and a lot of the time you're encouraged to go to individual flags and take them yourselves. Don't fight anyone, just flip flags.

    Crazy king is the same thing after more than one flag. Just go to the new spawn.

    Capture the relic is side swiping a group that went too far in on another relic, you're more successful by doing what others are not doing.

    TDM on the other hand requires no weak links, healers are rewarded more because they're the most valuable asset in tdm and if you go off by yourself, you get rekt.

    Pure tanks aren't as valuable in TDM, but tanky players with damage or roots/snares can be based on group dynamics.

    A lot of the flag games could be great if they were tinkered with, but they more often than not do not promote what you say you enjoy. Adjusting them would be great for everyone.

  • FrankonPC
    FrankonPC
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    Skoomah wrote: »

    The underlying reason a lot of BG players ignore game mode objectives is because the game mode objectives are poorly designed because they actively encourage people to not fight each other to win the game.

    I can’t tell you how many times I’m playing Domination and opponents run away from me when they see me running up to them to fight them at a flag.

    Crazy King isn’t much different because it’s just Domination with moving flags. People run away from actually fighting you.

    Capture the Relic is the same. People just pick up the relic and run away from you. They pop an immovable potion as they are grabbing the relic and run off.

    Chaos Ball is slightly different. You get mega tanks that don’t actually fight and just hold the ball the entire match. Or you engage in fighting against another team and half the match is over as the Chaos ball holder is way on the other side of the map.

    The common denominator here is that those game modes actively discourage fighting.

    Deathmatch minded players are looking for a boxing match. The other game mode players are looking for track and field. It’s two completely different types of sports.

    Exactly this. There's no contention over flag games, if there is you typically lose. If domination had one or two less flags it would be a great game mode because it's contested flags. Still flag oriented to win, but you have to fight to win them. In its current state you don't fight if you want to win.

  • gariondavey
    gariondavey
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    VaranisArano wrote: »
    gariondavey wrote: »
    Coerfroid wrote: »
    ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
    Hello all!

    ...we’ve now seen an uptick in players choosing to treat any game mode as Deathmatch...

    Am I the only one that feels reminded of the movie "Idiocracy"? So there is a number od players unable to grasp objectives and they are getting to decide how the game is to be played?
    What will be next? Removing tank roles because " ...an uptick of players choosing to fake-tank..."?

    Really, I do appreciate devs looking into the issue of queue times and decrease of interest, but I do think they are on the wrong road here.

    How about a "ranked mode" that may be deathmatch-only for simplicities sake, with weekly/mothly ranking rewards and a "casual mode" for players that prefer tactical game-modes that employ teamplay and skill?

    Coerfroid I don't think you understand...

    Dm players could easily, and have, been able to win at any game mode.
    We prefer to play games as dm because it requires the most pvp skill vs avoiding players and actual pvp combat. I'm a member of one, if not, the biggest bg guilds on pc na. It is full of very talented players who enjoy fighting against other players in complete pvp combat.

    Acting like dm players are dumb is disingenuous and inaccurate.

    And for what it is worth, most of us would be fine with group dm queue + solo random queue (with a slight increase in dm frequency vs the current likelihood of getting dm).

    Let's see if I can figure out the logic of this.

    "We can totally win all the "play the objective" games if we played the objectives but we choose not to play the objective because that's not what we want to do. But we would totally win if we did."

    Okay.

    Because when you don't play the objective, you lose.

    I believe you. You would totally win if you played the objective. Most players who are good at killing are also good at doing the type of PVP that happens to succeed at BG objectives.

    However, from my perspective, I'm afraid the only thing I can see is that your team lost, because you weren't playing the objective.

    Do what makes you happy, I guess.

    Depends what you consider "winning" :wink:
    PC NA @gariondavey, BG, IC & Cyrodiil Focused Since October 2017 Stamplar (main), Magplar, Magsorc, Stamsorc, StamDK, MagDK, Stamblade, Magblade, Magden, Stamden
  • jaws343
    jaws343
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    FrankonPC wrote: »
    Skoomah wrote: »

    The underlying reason a lot of BG players ignore game mode objectives is because the game mode objectives are poorly designed because they actively encourage people to not fight each other to win the game.

    I can’t tell you how many times I’m playing Domination and opponents run away from me when they see me running up to them to fight them at a flag.

    Crazy King isn’t much different because it’s just Domination with moving flags. People run away from actually fighting you.

    Capture the Relic is the same. People just pick up the relic and run away from you. They pop an immovable potion as they are grabbing the relic and run off.

    Chaos Ball is slightly different. You get mega tanks that don’t actually fight and just hold the ball the entire match. Or you engage in fighting against another team and half the match is over as the Chaos ball holder is way on the other side of the map.

    The common denominator here is that those game modes actively discourage fighting.

    Deathmatch minded players are looking for a boxing match. The other game mode players are looking for track and field. It’s two completely different types of sports.

    Exactly this. There's no contention over flag games, if there is you typically lose. If domination had one or two less flags it would be a great game mode because it's contested flags. Still flag oriented to win, but you have to fight to win them. In its current state you don't fight if you want to win.

    Domination would be far better as straight king of the hill in one spot. Whoever can hold the 1 point the longest for the match wins.

    Same for Crazy King. 1 spot that rotates, forcing everyone to that one spot to fight over it.
  • Woozywyvern
    Woozywyvern
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    If this is a permanent change, please make the Assault and Support Skill Lines available in other areas of the game.
    'What we do in life, echoes through Eternity.'
  • MurderMostFoul
    MurderMostFoul
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    Lady_Galadhiel wrote: »
    For real? Ok so people really only want to see the easiest and most banal game mode Bgs have to offer?

    As someone who has literally played and won 1,000s of BG matches, I don't understand how people can possibly believe that deathmatch is "easiest."

    It is far easier to win objective modes where you can entirely avoid combat. Just sprint to open flags in domination and crazy King, sneak capture flags in capture the relic, and grab and run away with the ball in chaos ball. Those basic tactics are incredibly easy, and make winning feel cheap. It's far more difficult to consistently win player versus player combat engagements, have proper target selection, threat assessment, death avoidance, and team combat coordination, all which are required to win a game of death match. Sure, if you happen to be on a stacked team in death match against significantly inferior opponents, it'll be easier. But that's true of objective modes as well. But when team power levels are at least somewhat balanced, winning death match presents the greatest challenge.

    I pvp because I enjoy creating builds and testing them in dynamic combat against other players. BG death match is the best forum to do so. All the other BG modes de-emphasize combat, and hence fail to provide adequate assessment of the combat power of builds, or the combat skill of players.

    “There is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so.”
  • KhajiitLivesMatter
    KhajiitLivesMatter
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    ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
    Hello all!

    When Battlegrounds first launched, we initially saw some data and feedback showing a preference specifically towards the Deathmatch game mode. With the recent removal of the option to choose a game mode when queuing for a Battleground, we’ve now seen an uptick in players choosing to treat any game mode as Deathmatch. In an effort to increase Battleground population and interest, the Solo and Group queues will only offer the Deathmatch game mode for a period of time. This change will occur during next week's maintenances, on September 20 for PC/Mac/Stadia and September 22 on consoles.

    After we have a chance to digest some of the feedback and data from this experiment, we’ll decide on what the next steps should be for Battleground queue options and consider the best way to add the other Battleground game modes back in.

    Thanks for your continued interest and support! We’re excited to hear what you think.

    give us cp bgs thanks
  • tomofhyrule
    tomofhyrule
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    Coerfroid wrote: »
    ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
    Hello all!

    ...we’ve now seen an uptick in players choosing to treat any game mode as Deathmatch...

    Am I the only one that feels reminded of the movie "Idiocracy"? So there is a number od players unable to grasp objectives and they are getting to decide how the game is to be played?
    What will be next? Removing tank roles because " ...an uptick of players choosing to fake-tank..."?

    I know you're joking, but I definitely feel the overlap between the "We should only have DM for BGs since nobody likes objectives and everyone just makes it DM anyway!" and the "We should only have non-DLC dungeons in the random queue since nobody likes DLC dungeons and everyone just burns through mechanics anyway!" arguments.

    ...which means I can feel the overlap between the "I don't play BGs since I hate that it always turns into DM and I get mocked for trying to play objective" and the "I don't PUG dungeons since I hate that people fake roles and speedrun through and I get mocked for wanting to actually play with proper roles" arguments.

    I will say that DM vs. Objective BGs do require a different build - DM needs a more bursty build, whereas the objectives favor more tanky styles, and that's not something a lot of casual PvPers have access to, particularly those that main support roles in PvE. I can see how it would be beneficial to separate DM and Objective based on builds. However, there are a number of people who like to play objective and not DM, and this 'solution' just drives them away from PvP by making it completely impossible to even try to play their favored mode.

    Is driving people away from PvP really going to help much, considering the population isn't as big as many on the forums want to think it is?
  • CaperGuy
    CaperGuy
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    ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »
    Hello all!

    When Battlegrounds first launched, we initially saw some data and feedback showing a preference specifically towards the Deathmatch game mode. With the recent removal of the option to choose a game mode when queuing for a Battleground, we’ve now seen an uptick in players choosing to treat any game mode as Deathmatch. In an effort to increase Battleground population and interest, the Solo and Group queues will only offer the Deathmatch game mode for a period of time. This change will occur during next week's maintenances, on September 20 for PC/Mac/Stadia and September 22 on consoles.

    After we have a chance to digest some of the feedback and data from this experiment, we’ll decide on what the next steps should be for Battleground queue options and consider the best way to add the other Battleground game modes back in.

    Thanks for your continued interest and support! We’re excited to hear what you think.

    What I think, is that in an ideal world Zenimax would curb the behavior of the players treating any type of game mode as Deathmatch by perhaps de-incentivizing, I.E. - give 0 AP / 0 item rewards and/or a deserter debuff if they do this. The tricky thing though, which is why I don't think that would happen is that I don't see how you could easily determine that through code automatically because it's a bit too much of a subjective thing. Plus you have new players who don't know what to do in the first place, so it could risk punishing them by mistake. Then there could be the case of players who want to pretend it's a Deathmatch not actually caring about the AP/rewards in the first place.

    The more I think about it, all I can think of that would help curb that problem of players treating any game mode as Deathmatch....would be to bring specific game mode queuing back. Hopefully that would reduce the behavior in Chaosball/Capture modes, etc. Or maybe give groups the option to duel other groups in 2v2s, 3v3s, etc, or to queue into a no reward BG map against a specific other group.
    Characters:

    Trivalaur - Breton Templar(Healer)
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