Upcoming Changes to Battleground Queues

Lordtalon90

That's cool, we like to be able to select deathwatch only. But can we please get some more battlegrounds maps? We haven't had any since either Morrowind or Summerset I believe. Private queues for tournaments would be nice too but I'm not asking for too much

Tommy_The_Gun

Um... I think that those changes hardly matters as long as we have DC / Hrothgar meta. BGs (in any game mode) are just not enjoyable...

colossalvoids

So if I'm getting this correctly people who prefer actually playing the modes that they were given should avoid playing BG's for some time for you to get relevant data?

Merforum

Elyox wrote: »

CaffeinatedMayhem wrote: »

Welp, it's not like I was playing BGs anyway... *because* people treat every game like a Deathmatch. Which has ALWAYS been the case.

It was marginally ok during "all solo can pick game mode". Honestly tho, there isn't a simple solution to this problem.

Well, I have a solution but no one will like it:

Group only Deathmatch queue.
Solo for all other game modes.

>:D

Group only bad modes and solo only deathmatch :D

Yes but you have that backwards, group/solo for deathmatch, and solo only for random (and making sure random solos are NOT backfilling deathamatch queue). Then everyone is happy.

Ezhh

I enjoy death match, but you know what I enjoy more - variety! Also the ability to choose what I queue for to work on achievements. I was trying for the purple dye for capturing flags (Grand Standard Bearer) for a long time now and cannot ever seem to land in the right game mode. This will just make it impossible.

Beardimus

Odd test. As long as the other modes come back in to Gina's point fine.
DM is the dullest category as far as I'm concerned if I want that i go Cyro.

Would be very stale if it remains DM only for months in this test.

Lastly, just increase penalties for non objective play of you want to reduce DM action in objective maps.

Or offer choice queue

moo_2021

ServerusEcru wrote: »

Well, I have a solution but no one will like it:

Group only Deathmatch queue.
Solo for all other game modes.

>:D

Darian_Rath wrote: »

I like deathmatch and all, but this is the wrong approach. First Zos forces all the DMers into the war games and ruins the experience for those who like them. Now they're just flat out removing war games to appease the DMers. Removing 80% of BG content is not an improvement.

They should have made a solo and group DM queue and a solo war games queue.

Totally agree. If any group joins solo they could be guaranteed to join the same game together but the group should be split randomly across 3 teams.

nowthatsaplan

Way to push out the casual players. You're seeing every match turn into a deathmatch because you're forcing hardcore players into matches with casual players who would rather do land games. Farming kills of causal players in pve gear isn't impressive. Go back to giving us the option to choose deathmatch OR land games. It shouldn't be all or nothing. 😡

jaws343

I'll definitely be playing BGs more with this update. The non Deathmatch modes are horribly balanced towards avoidance of conflict, especially tankier characters. And without being able to decide the match type you wanted, the imbalance in some of the game modes was staggering at times. Nothing like being able to do almost no damage to the chaos ball carrier, or being completely unable to kill the tank sitting in front of the relic for 15 straight minutes.

Zyva

This is awful. What about all the achievements? what about the loot tied to specific modes?

And isnt the purpose to go in and kill everyone anyway? Just let people pick their modes again for heavens sake if you are that worried.

clearly

[snip]

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6953919

You will also no longer be able to choose a game type; this is to reduce the risk of further splintering the queue on top of the Group or Solo options. We look forward to seeing you all back in groups in the Battlegrounds, and we will continue to monitor the feedback and participation after this change goes up with U28.

only took one full year to realize [snip]

[Edit for bashing and profanity]

method__01

about damn time

VaranisArano

So now that all the "play the effing objective" game modes are off the table...

What's the plan for achievements and style pages?
There's a lot of mode-specific achievements.
Flag games have a chance to reward Stormlord style pages.
Land Grab games have a chance to reward Fire Drake style pages.

Do the folks who want those things just have to put their hunt on hold for a while until the Devs work out how to add those modes back in?

Decimus

A big problem with the existing game modes is that they actively discourage PvP.

Fighting for a flag is always going to be worse than going for an empty flag and avoiding PvP.

Why? Because the respawn times are too fast and people you killed will just move on to an empty flag on the other side of the map.

The 3-way format also efficiently kills the PvP element when it comes to objective games - while you are fighting for the objective in one of the Capture the Relic spawns (infinitely, because of the fast respawn times - you can wipe an entire team only to have a respawner interrupt you), the 3rd team will just walk to your empty relic and cap it. This is not "strategic" nor fun, and just discourages people from engaging in PvP


These game modes need a complete revamp, and this game still needs a 2v2/3v3 arena format with proper performance based leaderboard (i.e. not how much one plays but how well they play).

SirLeeMinion

Hmm... I liked the other modes, but oh well. I don't expect this change will add to BG interest, but we'll see.

What I'd really like to see is the solo queue placed as default and the group queue the one you switch to enter. I've been amazed how few guildies know a solo option exists. I generally exit the solo queue after about five minutes and join the team queue solo just to get a match. As a result, I've mostly given up on BGs.

Anyammis

Decimus wrote: »

A big problem with the existing game modes is that they actively discourage PvP.

Fighting for a flag is always going to be worse than going for an empty flag and avoiding PvP.

Why? Because the respawn times are too fast and people you killed will just move on to an empty flag on the other side of the map.

The 3-way format also efficiently kills the PvP element when it comes to objective games - while you are fighting for the objective in one of the Capture the Relic spawns (infinitely, because of the fast respawn times - you can wipe an entire team only to have a respawner interrupt you), the 3rd team will just walk to your empty relic and cap it. This is not "strategic" nor fun, and just discourages people from engaging in PvP


These game modes need a complete revamp, and this game still needs a 2v2/3v3 arena format with proper performance based leaderboard (i.e. not how much one plays but how well they play).

I agree a lot with this as well which is why I feel them rethinking objectives is important. Making objectives interactive and requiring a mix of strategy and pvp power is important, not just blindly fighting or objectives that can be won by playing avoid the mob. I know comparable games/game modes to eso often have games like relic cap be more like both teams have a cart going from point a to point b, the teams have to strategize to stop/slow the enemy cart while also pushing theirs along, both require teams to fight eachother to win but it also requires the strategy of not having too many defend (meaning your cart never moves) or too many go aggro (meaning the enemy team can speed their cart along uncontested). Giving objectives battle buffs also helps, maybe even a objective where npcs interfere or carry their own buffs if slain forcing teams to fight eachother for the last hit of the mob. They have a lot of options out there and I hope they find good feedback in this thread.

xDeusEJRx

Update is whatever. Either way I get kills because I just kill anyone who comes near the objective. This just makes it easier for me. I'm just happy there's gonna be no more 40k-50k health block tanks joining games being annoying since they won't be able to actually contribute to TDM. It's annoying getting hit with 20k hrothgars because of block tank builds in BGS

SkaraMinoc

Thank you for listening and taking a step in the right direction with this experiment.

Greasytengu

So instead of removing all choice from Battleground, why not give back the choice to pick what mode you want to play?

divnyi

IMO you'd better leave soloQ as is, so objective players have someplace to go.

vesselwiththepestle

I don't like that I can't use my Cyrodiil setups in BGs, because you removed proc sets from Ravenwatch. Either remove proc sets from Battle Grounds, too, or, well, I guess I won't play BGs anymore whatever queue modes you add or remove.

ListerJMC

I love battlegrounds and play them fairly regularly, but Deathmatch is one of the most boring modes for me personally - and playing the same mode over and over again, even if it is one I like, sounds dull. I can't see newer or more casual players being drawn to a repetitive game where you're only rewarded for kills and they'll probably just be fodder, either, so I'm not sure how this will do for a numbers increase in the long run.

And what if you like to play a support role? This makes about as much sense to me as "we realised most people queue as damage in dungeons, so we're trialling damage-only dungeons".

I do hope there's a solution that comes out of this doesn't remove the other modes permanently. Also, what about achievements for the other modes? Should I be rushing to try and finish those?

Taggund

The problem with BGs is the solo queue can take forever, so you have to choose the group queue to get anything. Solo should be the default option, and groups should be able to take the drop down for that queue.

However as a objective based pvp player, deathmatch only just does not offer a good alternative. Lately I've been leveling my alts in BGs, and now if deathmatch is the only option, i'll most likely avoid that till the "test" is over. It is OK to be an option, but not the only option.

B0SSzombie

Ha, joke's on you! Deathmatch is the one mode I absolutely hate in PVP games! Now, there is a 0% chance I'd ever play Battlegrounds.

spartaxoxo

This sucks a lot for people who prefer the other game modes. I don't see why those of us who like them should be prevented from playing them entirely until you brainstorm something else.

SimonThesis

This is DUMB! While I do agree battlegrounds needed reworks. Playing on my alt healers I really enjoyed healing Chaosball and Capture the Relic. How are my healers supposed to get KBs in deathmatches? Just because some people don't understand how to be in a group, don't take away these options for everyone. @ZOS_GinaBruno

spartaxoxo

Also, why are you rewarding gameplay sabotage by punishing the people who had their game sabotaged?

Rittings

Hmmm a few things will go missing with this change though...

Achievements & Titles & Dyes
Style Pages that are connected to their respective game modes

What is to become of these? Are they going to be possible to attain in Deathmatch modes??

Why not make it a "fuzzy" queue? So... you can basically queue for multiple modes at the same time (so if I wanted to avoid Deathmatch, I just queue for Flag and Land grab games... a bit like the option when queuing for specific dungeons

SimonThesis

Exactly, why are we catering to the people who can't follow the rules of the game and be part of a group? If they can't follow the objectives just ban em don't take away options from everyone else.

Sluggy

I stopped doing BGs a long time ago. I might consider returning due to this however, the second i saw the announcement I knew it wasn't going to go over well. I guess 'the data' will be the final decider there.

However, can ZoS tell us: are they going to continue their, frankly, terrible precedent of not not including any kind of in-game announcement, indicator, UI element, or otherwise any indication to the casual players that do not come to the forums to find out about these things? We already have a no-proc Cyrodiil that provides exactly ZERO indications to anyone that certain equipment doesn't work. Are we going to keep rolling down this hill and stop next at "let's not actually inform anyone there are no matches other than deathmatch'. It's stuff like this that is FAR more worrisome to me.