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Please give us back Rapid Maneuver!

  • johnebrown
    johnebrown
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    SydneyGrey wrote: »
    Good luck doing those Psijic quests without Rapids, people.

    Wow good point - forgot about that.
  • JoeCapricorn
    JoeCapricorn
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    I do all of my surveys on my main character because he has the Ring of the Wild Hunt and can NYOOOOM to all the nodes. I've attempted to even hike it to each survey, gathering up the nodes in between. I got a few Aetherial Dusts that way. But that is still time consuming. Hopping on a mount and not using rapids would still be time consuming, as I estimate I am only marginally faster than me running with Wild Hunt.

    I do my writs on a six day cycle. It is OCD to the core because even the alchemy quests are perfectly synchronized - they go on an 8 day cycle, everything else is on a 3 day cycle, I craft everything ahead of time for 10 out of 11 toons, each 6 days I open up all the boxes at once and gather the surveys in the bank to put on my main. So every six days, I have to do those surveys when I have time, or they build up. When they build up, not a big deal, just more surveys and more mats. Fortunately, on my main, Rapids is to stay, I have 10 in Assault and Support on my main.

    But when I am playing on any of my alts, Rapids have been stolen away. I feel empathy for those who never PVPd and only used Rapids as a means to get around. This change was a rude awakening and for us (I don't really read about PTS stuff) came as a total shock.

    I simp for vampire lords and Glemyos Wildhorn
  • johnebrown
    johnebrown
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    Tandor wrote: »
    keoma01 wrote: »
    Everybody without exception needs rapid and quite a lot of people needs vigor as well. For first glance it almost doesn't matter which one is the first skill.
    But in reality you need to follow a group in Cyrodiil if you want to level your skill line and without rapid it is a very frustrating experience. You can't go to resources in time and so on.
    Rapid is a fundamental skill for being able to get vigor, but vigor doesn't really help you to get rapid.
    Please drop hubris and change this back.

    It isn't true that "everybody without exception needs rapid". In my case, six years on with 40+ characters not one of them has ever used it.

    However, and I say this as someone who has also never done PvP in ESO (as opposed to other games) - if you want a PvP skill, be prepared to do the PvP content to earn it.

    I Don't know how many times I have to say this: We did earn it according to the requirements of the game. Most of these people are complaining about what was taken away that they already had. Rapids was the first skill you could earn so it was very easy. It's not so bad if for every new toon you make you have to put some effort into it to get Rapids, but it is a big issue when it is taken away from almost all your toons after you had already acquired it. So now we have to spend 20,40,60 or more hours to reacquire what we already had earned according to the games requirements. How long to get 48 toons from assault level 2 to Assault level 5? I don't even want to think about it. It's just not right.
  • Thechuckage
    Thechuckage
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    wolonggong wrote: »
    [snip]

    Anyone could use it, before. Not everyone did.

    [snip]

    I really do not see why a player would spend a point on a skill, to not use often, when it has ONLY ONE PURPOSE and ONE REASON TO GET IT...to move faster.

    Seriously. Been playing on and off since beta and I rarely go more than an hour without seeing someone smash that skill the second they mount up to get to where they are going, or seeing someone using it while traveling myself. This idea that people are spending a point to unlock a speed buff and not use it is just plain ridiculous.

    But no no, this skill, that just so happens to be the one that was changed, is the one skill in game people are going to spend a point on to not use, because, the change needs defending!

    [snip]

    There are more skill points in game than most builds will ever need. Fully fleshed out tank, with multiple crafting skills maxed and still have un-used skill points. Its entirely possible to put skill points to something and it rarely or even never gets used.

    [snip] I'm not working for ZoS. Cant do anything to help you. I can tell you they aren't likely to change their stance, based off previous experience.

    [edited for baiting]
    Edited by ZOS_Lunar on August 26, 2020 12:32PM
  • johnebrown
    johnebrown
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    Ackwalan wrote: »
    Just stop already. Not having rapids does not prevent you from doing anything.

    It prevents me from going as fast as I used to be able to and as fast as I want to.
  • Athan1
    Athan1
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    Abandoning the game bc of the change of order in one skill is overreacting [snip] do some pvp if needed. It's just 3 extra levels.

    [edited for baiting]
    Edited by ZOS_Lunar on August 26, 2020 12:18PM
    Athan Atticus Imperial Templar of Shezarr
  • johnebrown
    johnebrown
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    Jaraal wrote: »
    Jaraal wrote: »
    The absolute LEAST they could do is lower the requirements to get Rapids. The best they could do is also make it require Assault 2, because this is a skill a LOT of people have on their bar.

    But you’re missing the point. The point of the change was to make Rapids harder to get, so you will be more likely to purchase speed upgrades from the crown store. Vigor is just a diversion.

    To Oblivion with that point. I want to say stronger words but I also want to come across as respectful and courteous.

    ZOS has listened to the community in the past and I hope they will listen once more in this instance.

    We have been vehemently protesting this change for weeks on the test server, as well as in the open forums. I’m not sure why you feel they will listen now when they have ignored us all along.

    I don't know, maybe they are hiding & just waiting for us to go quietly into the night?
    If we do, they definitely won't change it.
  • johnebrown
    johnebrown
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    [snip]
    wolonggong wrote: »
    Elsonso wrote: »
    Outside of Cyrodiil, where Assault 5 is going to be common, I rarely see anyone using Rapid Maneuvers except for a few higher level crafting resource farmers. i would suggest that fewer people are using it for PVE, as a percentage of the total population, than the percentage of people running Stamina.

    That is pure BS. Everyone that has it uses it to get to anyplace they are going FASTER.

    Anyone could use it, before. Not everyone did. This isnt the first time skills have been moved around inside the trees and is likely not the last.

    If this really is the straw that broke the camels back, then that sucks. Or adapt and overcome. More threads are not likely to have a positive outcome - vMA showed us that.

    Not likely is just that. I'm not likely to win the lottery either, but I still buy tickets.
    Edited by ZOS_Lunar on August 26, 2020 12:33PM
  • johnebrown
    johnebrown
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    It would be irresponsible of them for them to not comment on this matter directly at some point this week (probably not tonight, it is past midnight here)

    An acknowledgement of the issue at hand, at the very least.

    Then they need to LISTEN to us. Give our rapids back! #FREETHERAPIDS

    Yes - or they get no pudding :)
  • kendellking_chaosb14_ESO
    kendellking_chaosb14_ESO
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    Noisivid wrote: »
    Noisivid wrote: »
    this, I've been running battleground in an attempt to grind alliance war skill line to get Rapids back. 3 hours so far and probably another hour to go. Multiply that by over ten non-pvp characters. I could just buy the skill line as it's maxed on a few actual PvP characters but no. I'm not going to do that even if they drop the cost to 500 crowns.

    at this rate is will take me over 50 hours in game to grind back to where i was. I don't think that's going to happen either.

    I'm seriously considering quitting the game.

    Ummm no way dude if you have PvP characters you know how easy it is to get rank 5 heal if you pve toons are magic just pop on a healing staff and heal zergs for 30 minutes it’s literally the super fast way to grind PvP.

    um, "yeah, way dude".

    I did't want to go into Cyro without Rapids as that's a pain due to traveling speeds. so I was running Battlegrounds. It's easy to check the time when you start and then when you stop. It's even easier to set a timer on your phone. This includes the que time, not just the time actually in the BG. So yeah, I'm dead certain about the time elapsed. And this would need to be done on multiple characters to get back a skill I've been using since launch.
    It's just un-fun, kind of like when a serious PvPer has to run the same dungeon over and over and over to get that one piece of gear they need.

    also, most of my characters are stam builds, only a few use vigor. They're all more than just "viable"

    funny thing is if I had Rapids and needed to grind something out in PvP I would just go to Cyrodil and do it there. But I don't have Rapids on these characters anymore...

    Okay no now you're spreading disinformation you can just death port (die and rez at a far keep or outpost you don't need a horse to PvP at all you have like 2 or 3 front lines you can death port or just teleport there. Yes you need a horse to push keeps but you don't need one to play Defense.
    Chaos Shadow-Scale: Shadow Archer
    Chaos Death-Scale: Shadow Knight
    Tanks-With-Sap-Essence: Dark Mage
    Dark Brotherhood Listener: Blade of Argonia
    Chaos Dragon-Scale: Draconic Shield Master
    Chaos Light-Scale: Marsh Paladin
    Chaos Lightning-Scale: Daedric Master
    Hurricane Chaos: Storm Archer
    Bask-In-My-Light: Warrior of The Light
    Forged-In-Dragon-Fire: Pyro Mage
    Guardian of The Hist: Light Mender
    Chaos of Black Marsh: Master of The Burning Sword
    Star of Chaos: Frost Blade Champion
    Chaos-Lightning-Tower: Lightning Shield Master

    For the King of Argonia
    May Sithis hold back his Void
  • kendellking_chaosb14_ESO
    kendellking_chaosb14_ESO
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    Nicole94 wrote: »
    Noisivid wrote: »
    this, I've been running battleground in an attempt to grind alliance war skill line to get Rapids back. 3 hours so far and probably another hour to go. Multiply that by over ten non-pvp characters. I could just buy the skill line as it's maxed on a few actual PvP characters but no. I'm not going to do that even if they drop the cost to 500 crowns.

    at this rate is will take me over 50 hours in game to grind back to where i was. I don't think that's going to happen either.

    I'm seriously considering quitting the game.

    Ummm no way dude if you have PvP characters you know how easy it is to get rank 5 heal if you pve toons are magic just pop on a healing staff and heal zergs for 30 minutes it’s literally the super fast way to grind PvP.

    Why say things that are not true? No "zerg" moves in slowmo... Without rapids you catch one or two loadscreens and you and your resto staff will arrive AFTER the point flips. I don't understand why they even allow these dumb comments like "It only takes 30 min" or "follow the zerg" It just isn't true. And I have 6 of 15 with Alliance War rank 10.
    You are giving bad information and hope that who you give it to will not know better.

    Wow way to flag yourself as a true PvEer cause if you really had 6 at rank 10 you would know that zerg and groups of all sizes nearly always pickup PuG healer cause free heals. I have NEVER had a complain that we had too many heals. Please stop spreading fear it's 2 hours to get to rank 5 as DPS, 30 minutes as a healer cause the AP just flows.
    Chaos Shadow-Scale: Shadow Archer
    Chaos Death-Scale: Shadow Knight
    Tanks-With-Sap-Essence: Dark Mage
    Dark Brotherhood Listener: Blade of Argonia
    Chaos Dragon-Scale: Draconic Shield Master
    Chaos Light-Scale: Marsh Paladin
    Chaos Lightning-Scale: Daedric Master
    Hurricane Chaos: Storm Archer
    Bask-In-My-Light: Warrior of The Light
    Forged-In-Dragon-Fire: Pyro Mage
    Guardian of The Hist: Light Mender
    Chaos of Black Marsh: Master of The Burning Sword
    Star of Chaos: Frost Blade Champion
    Chaos-Lightning-Tower: Lightning Shield Master

    For the King of Argonia
    May Sithis hold back his Void
  • OldManJim
    OldManJim
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    Ackwalan wrote: »
    OldManJim wrote: »
    Ackwalan wrote: »
    OldManJim wrote: »
    Ackwalan wrote: »
    OldManJim wrote: »
    Ackwalan wrote: »
    Just stop already. Not having rapids does not prevent you from doing anything.

    Obviously you don't have to get to keeps or dragons, harrowstorms etc in a hurry then... Good for you.

    There's always another keep or dragon, harrowstorm etc, so why hurry.

    Because I prefer not to waste my time playing horse simulator. Just because you don’t like to rush doesn’t mean others can’t.

    Sounds more like you failed to have a plan. You can look at the map and see where the zergs are, then you can either get ahead of them to defend the keep or help take it, depending on which side you are on.

    I don’t PvP, so your point is moot. This may come as a shock, but there are other uses for rapids in the game.

    If you want to get raids quickly you can use the zergs to gain lots of AP. So have a plan, look at the map, and either defend against them or aid them. Would you do a trial without a plan?

    My new plan:
    1. <Remain silent>
    2. See step 1.
    PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
  • johnebrown
    johnebrown
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    wolonggong wrote: »
    [snip]

    Anyone could use it, before. Not everyone did.

    [snip]

    I really do not see why a player would spend a point on a skill, to not use often, when it has ONLY ONE PURPOSE and ONE REASON TO GET IT...to move faster.

    Seriously. Been playing on and off since beta and I rarely go more than an hour without seeing someone smash that skill the second they mount up to get to where they are going, or seeing someone using it while traveling myself. This idea that people are spending a point to unlock a speed buff and not use it is just plain ridiculous.

    But no no, this skill, that just so happens to be the one that was changed, is the one skill in game people are going to spend a point on to not use, because, the change needs defending!

    [snip]

    There are more skill points in game than most builds will ever need. Fully fleshed out tank, with multiple crafting skills maxed and still have un-used skill points. Its entirely possible to put skill points to something and it rarely or even never gets used.

    [snip] I'm not working for ZoS. Cant do anything to help you. I can tell you they aren't likely to change their stance, based off previous experience.

    I think your point about skill points is valid to a degree - but I think it also depends on the toon. I have 359 SP On my main toon and I'm sure there is SP allocated there that is hardly if ever used. But on some of my alts I use for crafting I may only have 90 or 100 SP which means all skill points are used up to get as much out of them as possible (at 100 SP I cannot max hirelings) and I have rapids on ALL crafting alts. Since there is a tradeoff to consider I would not put a SP in rapids if I did not feel I needed it. That said, you are right about the hyperbole. This is obviously a touchy topic.
    Edited by ZOS_Lunar on August 26, 2020 12:34PM
  • Jaraal
    Jaraal
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    It would be irresponsible of them for them to not comment on this matter directly at some point this week (probably not tonight, it is past midnight here)

    An acknowledgement of the issue at hand, at the very least.

    What would you expect them to say?

    "Yes, we know it's harder for you to get Rapids, and that's the point! We want you to pay for lessons, skill lines, and two person mounts so you can be as fast as you once were! But in the meantime, please enjoy the latest part of our Performance Upgrade: slowing players down so the servers don't have to do as many calculations!"

    Like that's going to happen. Enjoy the silence.
  • Zephiran23
    Zephiran23
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    Using Rapids in PVE - are you observing PC or console versions of the game? Addons make using it much easier on PC.

    Cyrodiil introductory quest - this takes far longer than 30 seconds if you don't skip it. A level 10 mount with maybe a couple of points in speed upgrades can't complete 1 leg of the riding in that time. not all of us want to live in a post-truth world.
  • OldManJim
    OldManJim
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    ZoS is sitting back and watching the community tear themselves to shreds, while they've obviously had a memo forbidding them to engage us about the issue.

    It's a disgusting way to run customer relations.
    PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
  • Jaraal
    Jaraal
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    johnebrown wrote: »
    Jaraal wrote: »
    Jaraal wrote: »
    The absolute LEAST they could do is lower the requirements to get Rapids. The best they could do is also make it require Assault 2, because this is a skill a LOT of people have on their bar.

    But you’re missing the point. The point of the change was to make Rapids harder to get, so you will be more likely to purchase speed upgrades from the crown store. Vigor is just a diversion.

    To Oblivion with that point. I want to say stronger words but I also want to come across as respectful and courteous.

    ZOS has listened to the community in the past and I hope they will listen once more in this instance.

    We have been vehemently protesting this change for weeks on the test server, as well as in the open forums. I’m not sure why you feel they will listen now when they have ignored us all along.

    I don't know, maybe they are hiding & just waiting for us to go quietly into the night?
    If we do, they definitely won't change it.

    We had a 70 page thread about them taking away our 20 years of Bosmer stealth on a whim because somebody decided that both Bosmer and Khajiit shouldn't be stealthy at the same time, and since Elsweyr was coming soon, that Khajiit should be the focus at our expense. They got tired of hearing from us, and just locked the thread. And here we are 18 months later, and still no promised make up stealth methods.

    These guys are the masters of waiting for us to go quietly into the night. Remember that uptick in communications that they promised us months ago? Yeah, me neither.
  • JoeCapricorn
    JoeCapricorn
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    I'm with johnebrown, two of my alts are pure mules that don't have any combat or armor skills - all of the points are in crafting. That is all they do. They don't get soulgems, lockpicks, food or potions. It would be impossible in their current state to fight in anything. Now, when I leveled them up to 50 and gathered skyshards, I did both of them as a cookie cutter magplar build. Julianos, Torug's Pact, blah blah blah. I can probably do that again, but that is a lot of hassle. I think I might just move those two to Vivec.

    As for the rest of my characters, it varies. One is nearly at Assault 5. I might start with him, see how much it takes. Many are at Assault 2. I was going to take my second oldest character out to do Skyshards since for a while she was a mule (because she was AD and I am EP loyal) but I have since alliance changed her to Pact.

    And no, I don't think they have an official policy of "silence", they have to comment on this sooner or later. I hope. Maybe tomorrow? Maybe sometime later this week? The devs have lives too and there is still the pandemic that is going on.

    I'm tired, it is past 2 AM. We're not going to get a comment from them at all tonight. Devs have to sleep too you know. But I'll be checking this thread in the morning or afternoon or whenever I awaken.
    I simp for vampire lords and Glemyos Wildhorn
  • OldManJim
    OldManJim
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    And no, I don't think they have an official policy of "silence", they have to comment on this sooner or later. I hope. Maybe tomorrow? Maybe sometime later this week? The devs have lives too and there is still the pandemic that is going on.

    As far as I'm aware, they never responded to the recent VMA weapon debacle...

    PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
  • JoeCapricorn
    JoeCapricorn
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    The vMA weapon thing didn't impact nearly as many players as this does. This has wide ranging effects, from casual crafters to sole PvErs who just want to get around quickly on their mount.
    I simp for vampire lords and Glemyos Wildhorn
  • Eiagra
    Eiagra
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    Jaraal wrote: »
    Noisivid wrote: »
    I did't want to go into Cyro without Rapids as that's a pain due to traveling speeds. so I was running Battlegrounds.

    This. Lots of folks are joining matches and just going AFK and tabbing out to surf the web. Lose enough matches and you'll get there eventually.

    Hey, that's a handy idea...

    Addendum: Since I generally don't do PvP content, what's considered the best/most polite way to let your team know you plan to int for Rapids? Is there an option for serious players to boot you and you re-queue so they can compile a legitimate team? Or would it be best just to form a party of four who plan to intentionally throw?
    Edited by Eiagra on August 26, 2020 6:32AM
          In verity.
  • edges_endgame
    edges_endgame
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    Rapids are part of the PvP quest line. Requires to gain AP, meaning PvP.

    I don't understand the issue here. If you want other skills, you got to grind or quest as well.
  • Anfieldkris
    Anfieldkris
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    Eiagra wrote: »

    Hey, that's a handy idea...

    Addendum: Since I generally don't do PvP content, what's considered the best/most polite way to let your team know you plan to int for Rapids? Is there an option for serious players to boot you and you re-queue so they can compile a legitimate team? Or would it be best just to form a party of four who plan to intentionally throw?


    See the numerous other threads from players extremely frustrated about being unable to group queue got battlegrounds. Doing what’s suggested and going AFK basically screws over your three teams mates who may have spent 20 minutes waiting for the queue to pop, only to then find they have no chance.

    (*messed up quote again)
    Edited by Anfieldkris on August 26, 2020 7:16AM
  • Tandor
    Tandor
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    Jaraal wrote: »
    Tandor wrote: »
    keoma01 wrote: »
    Everybody without exception needs rapid and quite a lot of people needs vigor as well. For first glance it almost doesn't matter which one is the first skill.
    But in reality you need to follow a group in Cyrodiil if you want to level your skill line and without rapid it is a very frustrating experience. You can't go to resources in time and so on.
    Rapid is a fundamental skill for being able to get vigor, but vigor doesn't really help you to get rapid.
    Please drop hubris and change this back.

    It isn't true that "everybody without exception needs rapid". In my case, six years on with 40+ characters not one of them has ever used it.

    However, and I say this as someone who has also never done PvP in ESO (as opposed to other games) - if you want a PvP skill, be prepared to do the PvP content to earn it.

    But before yesterday, there wasn't actually any PvP involved in getting Rapid Maneuvers.

    The entirety of unlocking the skill was exactly this: Be lvl 10, press L, queue into any Cyrodiil campaign. Zone in, talk to the lady with an arrow over her head. She tells you to deliver something somewhere else in the base. Then that person tells you to go talk to the siege trainer... still within the safety of your own area. Talk to the siege person, boom, you get 2 skill points and are now lvl 2 in Assault and Support. Press K, buy your Rapids, and leave.

    As of now, this is all you have to do to get Vigor instead. But you will have to do a lot of fighting to get up to rank 5 and buy the riding skill you have already enjoyed for years.

    Actually, you didn't even need to go to Cyrodiil at all to get the the skill, you could get it through the daily login rewards. Several of my characters have it on that basis, none has ever used it.
  • RodneyRegis
    RodneyRegis
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    guess I was right to always level up my alts using daily BGs since they came out then :)
  • Wytch
    Wytch
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    WARNING!!! I will censor myself to avoid having my 2 cents deleted. I will mostly use a random number of * to do this to avoid getting deleted based on what they might think I implied. I want each individual that reads this to know that I am not angry at any one person (except maybe whatever person said "yes, that sounds like a good idea.") I still place the odds of my reply (possibly this entire thread) getting deleted near 100%.

    To the teabaggers saying "it only takes 30 minutes to grind it out" - maybe for you pvpers it's POSSIBLE for SOME of you to do it that fast. Guess what... this isn't a pvp only game. This isn't even a pvp-centric game. ST*U with that white noise! There are a lot of us that hate pvp so much that just seeing the letters "pvp" makes a vein in the neck throb. I only have ONE (1) toon that has lvl 5 pvp skills and that took FIVE ************* years to get!

    Devs (or whomever) - you wanted to make vigor more accessible to lowbie stam players... fine. whatever. that didn't mean you couldn't still keep rapids at lvl 2 or maybe 3. You could have moved vigor to the support tree even where it makes more sense to be as a freaking HEALING skill! Goddess forbid you actually give stam toons some healing abilities on par with mag toons, that sort of devilry can't be allowed can it. I play stam characters. I NEVER used vigor. I never have, and I never will. Even if I were ********* insane enough to make a new character again. I would stick to what I always did when leveling... POTIONS! Were you trying to entice more people into pvp? because if so... this is the WRONG **** **** ********* ***** way to do it!

    To everyone saying "pvpers have to grind pve content to get the best gear so it's only fair" I can only ask "What freaking planet are you living on mate?" all the best pvp gear is... guess where... in pvp content. The one exception to that might be the monster helm. To get that does not require some epic grind fest. It requires a SINGLE run thru one vet dungeon. If you're really so pvp that you never do any pve content to get keys for the shoulders, then you should already have enough AP to buy the shoulder from the gold vendor.

    To everyone saying those of us considering leaving are being childish etc... it's not JUST this one thing that is making us consider leaving. It's the fact that this is just another example in a long line of changes that didn't need to be made where the community has been very vocal and very IGNORED! There's a problem with something, post it in the forum and get ignored. Problem still exists weeks/months/years later? Post again but then oops... thread deleted for being necroed even tho it was about something that never got fixed.

    Gina, bless her soul, tries her best but is only a community manager. The community managers can't actually do anything to have an effect on the game other than to tell those that can how outraged we are, and then THEY get ignored or fobbed off. This is NOT acceptable. I have heard from literally hundreds of people (in streams and guilds chats etc) complain about this, that, or the other thing. I try to tell them "bug report it or mention it on the forums! the squeaky wheel gets the oil!" And they ALL without fail, respond with some version of "it doesn't matter, it just gets ignored anyway." Just hearing that from every single player I talk to about reporting/posting makes me feel pretty $#!77% about the state of the game and the company's relationship with the players.

    As a side note relating to pvp... This change for rapids combined with the fact that there are skyshards behind enemy gates gives me and others the impression that ZOS is ABSOLUTELY FINE with player griefing.

    I've heard one tin-foil hat theory that actually sounds slightly plausible about this change. Remember that testing in cyrodiil that got announced for this month (I don't remember the exact dates) and now this? The ever-growing problems in cyrodiil are SERVER issues! They need more (and/or upgraded) server hardware/bandwidth to fix those problems (and probably a better game engine too). They are NEVER going to do that tho so what's the fix? P!$$ off enough people into leaving the game so that the servers can cope a bit easier with the reduced load. Having worked in the tech field myself, including working with server farms and game servers, I can tell you, there is a lot less tin foil hat in that theory than you might think.

    Something I didn't notice about this until seeing this change... It looks like Assault is the only skill tree where the ULTIMATE ABILITY is the second ability you can get in that tree. Vigor at 2, the ************ ***** ************ ultimate at 4, and then rapids at 5 and so on etc. I might be wrong on if it's the ONLY skill tree to work like that, but even if there are other skill trees that work like that, THEY need to be fixed, not more made to be just as broken.

    I left WoW for locking stupidly basic $#!7 behind mandatory pvp. One thing is for certain. I am not paying another cent for anything in this game (no crowns or houses or plus or dlc etc) until this is reverted or Rapids made to at MOST require lvl 3. In the meantime, I am going to keep my eye out for a different game or maybe even consider just being done with MMOs entirely. Something else I will likely be doing is warning anyone that asks me about ESO to "consider it with caution." Too many of us have been wronged up the back passage and others should be cautious of that when shopping around for a potential game to sink their money into.

    As a closing note, I would like to say my self-censoring in this post has been legendary considering how absolutely ******* LIVID I AM. Angry and Livid don't even do it justice! I hate pvp with the fiery passion of 10,000 exploding supernovae! I am galaxies beyond angry so I think my restraint here has been freaking epic level. So, if this post does get deleted, I have a copy of it that I will blast all over social media as a warning to anyone thinking about playing ESO. And, here's the rub. This only gets blasted out across the internet like an echo thru the grand canyon if it gets deleted (or significantly modified) from here. Otherwise, it stays here, safely tucked away on the forums to get buried and ignored like every other complaint ever made in the freaking history of the game.
  • OldManJim
    OldManJim
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    Wytch wrote: »
    To everyone saying those of us considering leaving are being childish etc... it's not JUST this one thing that is making us consider leaving. It's the fact that this is just another example in a long line of changes that didn't need to be made where the community has been very vocal and very IGNORED!

    This is why I've cancelled both my subs. Until they start listening &fix this change, ZoS won't be getting another cent from me.

    PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!
  • Daemons_Bane
    Daemons_Bane
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    Jaraal wrote: »
    The point of the change was to make Rapids harder to get, so you will be more likely to purchase speed upgrades from the crown store. Vigor is just a diversion.

    Gotta love conspiracy theories
  • Rowjoh
    Rowjoh
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    Rapids is a global skill. Vigor is a niche skill in comparison.

    Vigor is a stamina based skill only, isn't even that great as its not even a burst heal and only lasts 4 secs, whereas Rapids is much more important as mobility in Cyrodiil is key and a huge quality of life thing in PVE.

    The patch notes state: "Vigor: This ability is now first in the skill line to unlock, and has swapped places with Rapid Maneuvers in efforts to help builds focused on Stamina to have a healthier leveling experience".

    This simply isn't true as Vigor is a non-essential skill while levelling a character/alt and there are many other alternative and better ways of getting heals or health recovery while levelling in PVP as a stam user.

    This change has alienated a large number of players and I don't see Vigor users exactly whooping with unbridled joy either so the change couldn't have been made for gameplay reasons.




    Edited by Rowjoh on August 26, 2020 11:26AM
  • BalticBlues
    BalticBlues
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    Many CRAFTING/STORAGE ALTS do not have COMBAT skills/sets.
    ALL skill points go into CRAFTING (and 1 into RAPIDS)
    Now, AFTER 6 YEARS, you take away our rapids?

    ALL PLAYERS can benefit from Rapids - ONLY STAM PLAYERS can benefit from Vigor.
    Because of this, probably more players will be punished than pleased by the change.
    ZOS, this is a RPG. Please do not take away skills from us what we earned in the game.

    Solution suggestion as a compromise:
    DAILY LOGIN REWARDS of September could be 10x enough AP TO RESTORE RAPIDS.
    If 10 alts could restore their rapids, most players should be fine; others also would enjoy the AP.

    Edited by BalticBlues on August 26, 2020 12:28PM
This discussion has been closed.