CleymenZero wrote: »I guess my first question is whether it is even realistic, from the game/server perspective, to upgrade them? Is it even something that they could do, and get it right? I mean, I can see the "no soup for you" coming from them, but there might be more to it than just an arbitrary "no" decision.
They can change a set bonus and name on a whim but not rename current vMA weapons and add a bonus to them?
You do a good job adding to my point. If it is so simple to upgrade, then I think they would have done it, or will do it before it goes live. I don't subscribe to the conspiracies about wanting people to grind so they spend more time in the game, or some convoluted theory about sales of the game, that they are just mean, that they are stupid or clueless, or even that there must be something worse in the patch notes and this is a distraction. They might prove me wrong. They have in the past. Until that happens, I gotta figure that there is more to this than we are able to see.
I don't mind zos making vets having something to do. This game has become so stale. Ive had those vma weapons since 2016. If they raise the level cap and make some stuff perfected and the gear is worth getting good more things to do and theory craft. It all depends how they go about it.
dickeybarret wrote: »For one, I'm glad more players will have access to DSA and VMA equipment. Having people geared properly can only help things on the whole. However. Being one that has spent plenty of hours and 100s of runs getting what I need from that place, the notion of having to do that all again sorta makes my stomach turn. Simple solution. IF coding to upgrade everyone who currently has VMA/DSA weapons is too hard, simply mail people the corresponding perfected item if they have a VMA/DSA weapon in their inventory (as since right now the only way to acquire them is through vet) before the patch goes live. Then the people that invested time and effort don't feel like they wasted their time, while still keeping things accessible to the larger playerbase. Just my 2 gold on things...
To be honest, I can see both sides. On one hand, those people who are not (yet) up to the level of beating vMA will now get a chance of getting a decent, almost BIS weapon. That's a good thing.
Of course, this devaluates the time and effort of those people who have farmed the weapons in vMA. Not just that, but also the time that went into transmuting all the weapons. Now, we all know the usual cycles in MMOs. All items will eventually rotate out of the meta and will be replaced by better alternatives at some point. However, expecting the players to do farm the content AGAIN is a bit cheeky and, to be honest, lazy. And I don't buy the story that it is not possible to upgrade existing weapons, but if that's what they say, ok.
I think ZOS should come up with at least a gesture of good will when this goes live. Something like 3 weeks of double drops in vMA and vDSA? Maybe a temporary NPC that transmutes perfected vMA/DSA weapons for gold?
Kingslayer513 wrote: »I'm a software engineer and can tell you that this is exactly how it would be done, as efficiently as possible. All the current item IDs already drop from vet arenas. Simply update their stats to perfected. You don't even have to change any of the loot tables. Then make new item IDs for the nonperfected weapons. Add those to the loot tables for normal arenas only. Simple.
Right, which simply says that there is more to this than that.
It will be interesting to see if they add to this story with some official reason behind this.
price101610 wrote: »Have final drop include a special key like undaunted, then have the maelstrom merchant sell specific weapons for 5 keys each. Kizna could do the same in vdsa.
CleymenZero wrote: »Now the mentality of "if they could do it they would" I gotta say I'm always surprised when I hear people say this.
It's data and databases and that can be modified en masse quite easily. It doesn't even require you to code much. I guess a vulgarized version of it would be: create a copy of maelstrom weapon but with different item code (or wtv they use). Modify metadata for current weapons (renaming, changing stats or bonuses wtv). The end.
It's actually much easier to do this than to let's say, design and create an entire zone with quests, voices etc etc.
It is 100% to make people grind for more gear. 100%. They want us to spend more time i game and they know people will need the perfected version. Changing the item is easier than changing mechanics and actually making a hardmode to eqrn a perfected item. Nope. Do the same content for a better item cause the one you previously earned is now less valuable. Epic strat zos. Epic strat.
cosplayerrain wrote: »Soooo, ppl will be able to do Normal and get the same stuff that ppl have farmed vet. I think it should be upgraded to perfected automatically.
If a new person comes in and does normal and gets the same weapon that when I first started farming it wasn’t even a guarantee drop on vet doesn’t seem right.
It’s great that they’re giving newer players a more equal playing field. But why make everyone else have to re farm it??
Thevampirenight wrote: »Weapons are weapons some might be very good but there is so many weapons sets and weapon types from other areas of game play that just farming for this one kind is really kind of silly to me. Why not make do with a lessor version?
Even if its not as good why not use it?
Me I would use a blue or green imperfect staff or whatever its not much of a big deal to me.
So Yes they will add a new type of weapon farm to the game or new weapon based on a previous weapon that got nerfed and then reintroduced ( hopefully that isn't the case as that would be a crappy move and I could understand people being upset if it was like that.) if you don't want to do it and you don't want to farm for it then just don't and just stick with what you have.
That is my advice to everyone here, farm if you must but if you don't have to just don't bother. Just use a subpar set or weapon or whatever and you'll do just fine. Don't need Vma or Vdsa Perfect to play the game.
Speaking for myself, the issue is not the one stat for min/maxing. It’s the fact they’re telling me all my time and effort on vMA was worth jack s. and only qualified me for normal rewards. They are literally telling me to do the same exact content for the upgraded version and treating me as if I’d never cleared vMA at all.
SidraWillowsky wrote: »I hadn't thought about this initially, but I wonder if the reason our weapons aren't getting converted is that this update is going to involve a complete overhaul of MA and DSA. It's really the only reason I can think of for this decision.
Speaking for myself, the issue is not the one stat for min/maxing. It’s the fact they’re telling me all my time and effort on vMA was worth jack s. and only qualified me for normal rewards. They are literally telling me to do the same exact content for the upgraded version and treating me as if I’d never cleared vMA at all.
You did the content, and you got the reward you were looking for. They have not said that your reward is changing, so you still have your reward. It has not changed. It is still the same weapon.
Alinhbo_Tyaka wrote: »SidraWillowsky wrote: »I hadn't thought about this initially, but I wonder if the reason our weapons aren't getting converted is that this update is going to involve a complete overhaul of MA and DSA. It's really the only reason I can think of for this decision.
Then ZOS should have said as much. They could have mentioned that they were being overhauled and as part of that the weapons were changing without giving up any details.
I personally don't think it has to do with any rework but more to do with them adding the weapons to normal modes of the trials [snip] To make running vMA worthwhile the reward needs to be better than nMA so they provide a Perfected weapon. This makes sense. However to not upgrade those players that have already completed vMA makes no sense and will result in alienating more players. All I can figure is ZOS seems to have forgotten they aren't he only MMO out there.
Alinhbo_Tyaka wrote: »SidraWillowsky wrote: »I hadn't thought about this initially, but I wonder if the reason our weapons aren't getting converted is that this update is going to involve a complete overhaul of MA and DSA. It's really the only reason I can think of for this decision.
Then ZOS should have said as much. They could have mentioned that they were being overhauled and as part of that the weapons were changing without giving up any details.
I personally don't think it has to do with any rework but more to do with them adding the weapons to normal modes of the trials and laziness on the part of the developers. To make running vMA worthwhile the reward needs to be better than nMA so they provide a Perfected weapon. This makes sense. However to not upgrade those players that have already completed vMA makes no sense and will result in alienating more players. All I can figure is ZOS seems to have forgotten they aren't he only MMO out there.
Speaking for myself, the issue is not the one stat for min/maxing. It’s the fact they’re telling me all my time and effort on vMA was worth jack s. and only qualified me for normal rewards. They are literally telling me to do the same exact content for the upgraded version and treating me as if I’d never cleared vMA at all.
You did the content, and you got the reward you were looking for. They have not said that your reward is changing, so you still have your reward. It has not changed. It is still the same weapon.
Except my reward did change. When I have gotten my vMA weapons they still had one-peice set bonuses. When ZOS has removed that bonus, my rewards did indeed change retroactively. Not even talking about those who have gotten those weapons as enchants and not set pieces. So no, it is definitely not the same weapon.
In case of nerfs everything gets changed retroactively, but since this time it is a rare case of something getting buffed it is acceptable for us to re-farm again? This kind of hypocritical thinking is absolutely asinine.
typo
Alinhbo_Tyaka wrote: »SidraWillowsky wrote: »I hadn't thought about this initially, but I wonder if the reason our weapons aren't getting converted is that this update is going to involve a complete overhaul of MA and DSA. It's really the only reason I can think of for this decision.
Then ZOS should have said as much. They could have mentioned that they were being overhauled and as part of that the weapons were changing without giving up any details.
I personally don't think it has to do with any rework but more to do with them adding the weapons to normal modes of the trials and laziness on the part of the developers. To make running vMA worthwhile the reward needs to be better than nMA so they provide a Perfected weapon. This makes sense. However to not upgrade those players that have already completed vMA makes no sense and will result in alienating more players. All I can figure is ZOS seems to have forgotten they aren't he only MMO out there.
Wheeler is on the combat team, so it is not his place to reveal information about any changes being made to the dungeons and arenas. I think he has actually said this, in the past. The comment from Wheeler was also a "sound bite", with no real substance. It was the minimal answer to a question. He should have provided more details, rather than just providing the minimal answer. People would still be raging, but at least they would have a better reason for why they are raging.
Finn is the one that would be talking about an overhaul. He has no reason to comment, since we are on the eve of the patch notes being released. Any such overhaul would be mentioned there.Speaking for myself, the issue is not the one stat for min/maxing. It’s the fact they’re telling me all my time and effort on vMA was worth jack s. and only qualified me for normal rewards. They are literally telling me to do the same exact content for the upgraded version and treating me as if I’d never cleared vMA at all.
You did the content, and you got the reward you were looking for. They have not said that your reward is changing, so you still have your reward. It has not changed. It is still the same weapon.
Except my reward did change. When I have gotten my vMA weapons they still had one-peice set bonuses. When ZOS has removed that bonus, my rewards did indeed change retroactively. Not even talking about those who have gotten those weapons as enchants and not set pieces. So no, it is definitely not the same weapon.
In case of nerfs everything gets changed retroactively, but since this time it is a rare case of something getting buffed it is acceptable for us to re-farm again? This kind of hypocritical thinking is absolutely asinine.
typo
Point taken, but I am willing to wager that you did not throw the weapon in the trash, either.
This time, it does not look like they are making any changes to the weapons, so my point still stands. That means it will be the same weapon that it is today. If you are using it, it will perform the same.
If you had it before the set bonus change you mentioned, and you are still using it, then you have obviously come to terms with that change.
I guess my first question is whether it is even realistic, from the game/server perspective, to upgrade them? Is it even something that they could do, and get it right? I mean, I can see the "no soup for you" coming from them, but there might be more to it than just an arbitrary "no" decision.