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Streak and convert spamming is a huge issue plaguing this game
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oxygen_thief✭✭✭✭✭
✭Joinovikova wrote: »
All the other unblockable stuns are melee range and or single target. Not a huge aoe range gap closer/escape tool that can stun entire groups while doing damage. Not even close to balanced.
They also don't ramp up their costs, fail on uneven terrain and force a 180 upon you which is impossible on console.
If we're balancing, then put those on the other CCs. You'll quit in a day.
I would gladly take streak for turn evil/fear for all the utility and the cc it provides.
I can see the utility, but you don't want the CC if you have Turn/Fear. Mind the 180!
Streak stuns people behind you too. And does damage.
But you need to turn around to hit the stunned people behind you. Impossible to do in time on console, before they break free and block your frag.
Damage isn't a deciding factor. It's a weak AoE. Neat, but not worth risking whiffing the stun.
Well I don't know what it's like on console, I play on PC — and if I ever get Streaked, by the time I break free I already have curse on me and depending on lag, possibly Wrath. The Sorc is then spamming Force Pulse waiting for Frags to proc & if I try to cloak they streak into me again, pulling me out — they only need to keep me out of cloak for 2 more seconds before Curse Procs, Frags likely already has, and then once that's cast, Wrath, all the while spamming Force Pulse.
Literally every somewhat competent Sorc does this exact combo — if it wasn't easy & effective, that wouldn't be the case.
Oh, and Streak does more damage than Swallow Soul, Ricochet Skull, Screaming Cliff Racer, Force Pulse, and various other abilities that actually require you to aim. So basically this "weak AOE" does the damage of a spammable to everyone in their path, (and behind them) every time they use it. What's another unblockable AOE/gap closer/escape tools that can do that? And why must sorcs always pretend that everything in their toolkit is weaker than it actually is?
sorcs do the combo because they don't have any other:) streak definetly doesn't do more damage than force pulse and if you don't know how to fight when you are exposed I can suggest you to slot image. I use hurricane on my magsorc to play against such nbs. it allows to avoid additional streaking and save some magicka1 -
Langeston✭✭✭✭✭
✭
They do it because it's brain-dead easy & hits like a truck. If they didn't have such a nice pre-packaged burst combo, they'd actually have to think for themselves & I think you'd see a much wider variety of sorc gameplay.oxygen_thief wrote: »Joinovikova wrote: »
All the other unblockable stuns are melee range and or single target. Not a huge aoe range gap closer/escape tool that can stun entire groups while doing damage. Not even close to balanced.
They also don't ramp up their costs, fail on uneven terrain and force a 180 upon you which is impossible on console.
If we're balancing, then put those on the other CCs. You'll quit in a day.
I would gladly take streak for turn evil/fear for all the utility and the cc it provides.
I can see the utility, but you don't want the CC if you have Turn/Fear. Mind the 180!
Streak stuns people behind you too. And does damage.
But you need to turn around to hit the stunned people behind you. Impossible to do in time on console, before they break free and block your frag.
Damage isn't a deciding factor. It's a weak AoE. Neat, but not worth risking whiffing the stun.
Well I don't know what it's like on console, I play on PC — and if I ever get Streaked, by the time I break free I already have curse on me and depending on lag, possibly Wrath. The Sorc is then spamming Force Pulse waiting for Frags to proc & if I try to cloak they streak into me again, pulling me out — they only need to keep me out of cloak for 2 more seconds before Curse Procs, Frags likely already has, and then once that's cast, Wrath, all the while spamming Force Pulse.
Literally every somewhat competent Sorc does this exact combo — if it wasn't easy & effective, that wouldn't be the case.
Oh, and Streak does more damage than Swallow Soul, Ricochet Skull, Screaming Cliff Racer, Force Pulse, and various other abilities that actually require you to aim. So basically this "weak AOE" does the damage of a spammable to everyone in their path, (and behind them) every time they use it. What's another unblockable AOE/gap closer/escape tools that can do that? And why must sorcs always pretend that everything in their toolkit is weaker than it actually is?
sorcs do the combo because they don't have any other:)
According to ESO-Skillbook.com it does, however I just jumped on my magsorc and indeed it does less damage. In any case, it does that damage to everyone within an area of roughly 20x6 meters.streak definetly doesn't do more damage than force pulse
That's be great if I could fit it, but unlike magorcs magblades don't have abilities with everything under the sun crammed into them — everything is spread out among separate abilities. If I wanted to be able to approximate what Streak does I'd need to slot 3 separate abilities to accomplish it, and every one of those abilities costs as much or is more expensive than Streak.and if you don't know how to fight when you are exposed I can suggest you to slot image. I use hurricane on my magsorc to play against such nbs. it allows to avoid additional streaking and save some magicka
As I said, relative to other classes' abilities, Streak is overloaded. You guys have no idea how good you have it.Edited by Langeston on March 12, 2020 10:28AM0 -
Langeston✭✭✭✭✭
✭It is a good combo. But it is never a instakill against good player. Good players will dodge or block your frags after the stun. Especially dks, Templar, Warden and Necro are to tanky for this!
And Streak has 33% less dmg than Spammables.
Streak is a great Ability and Should be made blockable again.
But please don't spread such nonsense!!!
Ok, I hopped on my sorc and apparently it doesn't do as much damage as Force Pulse. I based my comment on just looking at the skill descriptions on ESO-Skillbook.comNo, Streak is definitely not dealing more damage than Force Pulse and so. WTH?
(o_0)
In your example, what if your opponent just uses a detection potion? If being knocked out of Cloak is the reason you die, then anyone can do that just fine. You could also use a shield, heal, roll out of cone or Shade to mitigate a follow-up hit, but I guess those are bugged, as is every single NB skill, right? Hell, I could probably easily kill you on DK with Talons. Any mag build with Elemental Ring. Any stam with Steel Tornado. You die because you get outplayed, not because of Streak.
The rest of my post stands though. As a magblade I need 3 separate abilities to accomplish what Streak does, and none of them do so as effectively & as easily. Relative to other skills in the game, Streak is overloaded.
[edit] Oh, and if you're playing one of (if not the) strongest mag class in the game and you kill the weakest (by far) spec in the game, you haven't "outplayed" them. That'd be like me bragging about beating my grandma in arm wrestling.Edited by Langeston on March 12, 2020 10:42AM0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Cloak is damage mitigation and re-positioning. Hardened Ward is just damage mitigation. Merciless is burst and damage mitigation. Frags are just burst. Don't just pick cherries to fit your argument!
There was a chart here a while ago... It showed a list of buffs and debuffs classes had access to. NB had twice as many as sorc. That was before the hefty nerfs to NBs, when they were at the top. And it's the reason why they have less of them now.1 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭
They do it because it's brain-dead easy & hits like a truck. If they didn't have such a nice pre-packaged burst combo, they'd actually have to think for themselves & I think you'd see a much wider variety of sorc gameplay.oxygen_thief wrote: »Joinovikova wrote: »
All the other unblockable stuns are melee range and or single target. Not a huge aoe range gap closer/escape tool that can stun entire groups while doing damage. Not even close to balanced.
They also don't ramp up their costs, fail on uneven terrain and force a 180 upon you which is impossible on console.
If we're balancing, then put those on the other CCs. You'll quit in a day.
I would gladly take streak for turn evil/fear for all the utility and the cc it provides.
I can see the utility, but you don't want the CC if you have Turn/Fear. Mind the 180!
Streak stuns people behind you too. And does damage.
But you need to turn around to hit the stunned people behind you. Impossible to do in time on console, before they break free and block your frag.
Damage isn't a deciding factor. It's a weak AoE. Neat, but not worth risking whiffing the stun.
Well I don't know what it's like on console, I play on PC — and if I ever get Streaked, by the time I break free I already have curse on me and depending on lag, possibly Wrath. The Sorc is then spamming Force Pulse waiting for Frags to proc & if I try to cloak they streak into me again, pulling me out — they only need to keep me out of cloak for 2 more seconds before Curse Procs, Frags likely already has, and then once that's cast, Wrath, all the while spamming Force Pulse.
Literally every somewhat competent Sorc does this exact combo — if it wasn't easy & effective, that wouldn't be the case.
Oh, and Streak does more damage than Swallow Soul, Ricochet Skull, Screaming Cliff Racer, Force Pulse, and various other abilities that actually require you to aim. So basically this "weak AOE" does the damage of a spammable to everyone in their path, (and behind them) every time they use it. What's another unblockable AOE/gap closer/escape tools that can do that? And why must sorcs always pretend that everything in their toolkit is weaker than it actually is?
sorcs do the combo because they don't have any other:)
According to ESO-Skillbook.com it does. And it does it to everyone within an area of roughly 20x6 meters.streak definetly doesn't do more damage than force pulse
That's be great if I could fit it, but unlike magorcs magblades don't have abilities with everything under the sun crammed into them — everything is spread out among separate abilities. If I wanted to be able to approximate what Streak does I'd need to slot 3 separate abilities to accomplish it, and every one of those abilities costs as much or is more expensive than Streak.and if you don't know how to fight when you are exposed I can suggest you to slot image. I use hurricane on my magsorc to play against such nbs. it allows to avoid additional streaking and save some magicka
As I said, relative to other classes' abilities, Streak is overloaded. You guys have no idea how good you have it.
Your pics might be true to but different website with give different numbers for same skills you can go and check the wiki for instance. I suggest you get an in game tooltip and compare. My streak on does 5.5k while my force pulse deals around 8.7k. Fyi, according to skillbook, streak is only 15m. Also, according the patch notes pre-horrow storm, streak damages enemies in a conal effect, cone start wides then narrows down at the end; players at the end of streak will be stunned but will not recieve any dmg.
Also, since you are a very exp player, can you come up with another combo for magsorcs to use in pvp? Their current combo might be brain dead and I believe it is not due to it require good timing. Every class has a specific combo most players of that class use because it is most effective, their moghy be alternative to it that do simolar dmg but not for magsorcs. I don't play magsorc for pvp, only pve strictly, but only other combo or build viable to magsorcs is I believe( I could be wrong) is to be the zos build and combo related to it, and I think that is a much hated set up that the current one.
Few tips for fighting magsorcs in case you jave trouble. I suggest you fight in doors, open world their playground as much as it is for nightblade snipers. Fighting indoors will not only limit the travel didtance for you, but it also hinder their streaks. If you are a big fan of fighting out in the open, fight in slopes, streak only good in even trerrains. Also, much like how a detect pot is counter for nightblade cloak, you can say the immovable pots are anti magsorc burst combo since they despretly need it to kill someone and without it they can't secure kills 70% of the time. Use immovable pots when they set up their combo, then block and heal or go offensive because most of the time only way to kill sorcs is to be offensive rather than being defensive.Edited by universal_wrath on March 12, 2020 10:41AM0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭You gotta get into the habit of looking closer. The stats you see on eso skillbook are old. They do not mention the final destination AoE stun, but have the old cone-only version.Edited by Lord-Otto on March 12, 2020 10:43AM1 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It is a good combo. But it is never a instakill against good player. Good players will dodge or block your frags after the stun. Especially dks, Templar, Warden and Necro are to tanky for this!
And Streak has 33% less dmg than Spammables.
Streak is a great Ability and Should be made blockable again.
But please don't spread such nonsense!!!
Ok, I hopped on my sorc and apparently it doesn't do as much damage as Force Pulse. I based my comment on just looking at the skill descriptions on ESO-Skillbook.comNo, Streak is definitely not dealing more damage than Force Pulse and so. WTH?
(o_0)
In your example, what if your opponent just uses a detection potion? If being knocked out of Cloak is the reason you die, then anyone can do that just fine. You could also use a shield, heal, roll out of cone or Shade to mitigate a follow-up hit, but I guess those are bugged, as is every single NB skill, right? Hell, I could probably easily kill you on DK with Talons. Any mag build with Elemental Ring. Any stam with Steel Tornado. You die because you get outplayed, not because of Streak.
The rest of my post stands though. As a magblade I need 3 separate abilities to accomplish what Streak does, and none of them do so as effectively & as easily. Relative to other skills in the game, Streak is overloaded.
[edit] Oh, and if you're playing one of (if not the) strongest mag class in the game and you kill the weakest (by far) spec in the game, you haven't "outplayed" them. That'd be like me bragging about beating my grandma in arm wrestling.
Thing is everyone knows that magnb is weaker. I’m pretty sure things have been balanced between certain classes right now and others they just haven’t gotten to yet. It’s the only thing that makes sense.
Someone would have to be incredibly biased or an idiot to think things are balanced right now. I don’t see the point of piling on magsorc when it isn’t the strongest class right now.Edited by Iskiab on March 12, 2020 11:44AMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
Condemned and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten0 -
Langeston✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Actually, those pics are wrong. I jumped on my magsorc and compared the two and Streak does do 66% of the damage. As far as 15m, that's how far the magsorc travels — the stun and damage actually extends 5m or 6m beyond their starting point, that's why I said 20m. As for the cone, I didn't check that out, but I do know that I get both damaged and stunned near the end of the sorc's path (and as I said, a good distance behind their starting point). I suppose I could jump on my sorc again to test the boundaries of it, but honestly after playing a magblade for so long my sorc almost kind of disgusts me. I actually dislike playing it because of having to play against it. Irrational? Probably. But the gameplay just seems so stale.universal_wrath wrote: »Your pics might be true to but different website with give different numbers for same skills you can go and check the wiki for instance. I suggest you get an in game tooltip and compare. My streak on does 5.5k while my force pulse deals around 8.7k. Fyi, according to skillbook, streak is only 15m. Also, according the patch notes pre-horrow storm, streak damages enemies in a conal effect, cone start wides then narrows down at the end; players at the end of streak will be stunned but will not recieve any dmg.
Probably not, and that's the problem. If those 3 skills were more in line with the rest of the Sorc toolkit, then I think you'd probably see players coming up with other combos. The skills involved in that combo do more damage than I can dream of as a magblade, and they're all basically on autopilot. Take Crystal Frags and Merciless Resolve for instance: from a pure damage standpoint, Merciless does roughly 20% more damage. Great, right? But Merciless requires a minimum of 6 GCDs to be usable (it's always longer than that, sometimes much longer) while I've had Frags proc 4 times in 4 consecutive GCDs. Now of course that's close to a best case scenario, but over the course of a BG deathmatch, Frags should proc at least twice as often as Merciless, and that's being very conservative. That's a minimum of 66% more damage just between those two skills, (and that's if Merciless actually lands — it seems like more often than not it doesn't.) Hell, Frags hits harder than my ultimate (if my ult even lands, which again is dubious). Haunting Curse & Mages' Wrath are similarly easy to use, and all do more damage than every ability available to my magblade except Merciless (which again, is probably the most tedious skill in the game & is unbelievably unreliable.)Also, since you are a very exp player, can you come up with another combo for magsorcs to use in pvp? Their current combo might be brain dead and I believe it is not due to it require good timing. Every class has a specific combo most players of that class use because it is most effective, their moghy be alternative to it that do simolar dmg but not for magsorcs. I don't play magsorc for pvp, only pve strictly, but only other combo or build viable to magsorcs is I believe( I could be wrong) is to be the zos build and combo related to it, and I think that is a much hated set up that the current one.
I play mostly BGs. In any case, with the state that magblade healing is in, fighting indoors is pretty much always a death sentence. I have been using immovable pots, but they seem to only prolong the inevitable. Magblades simply cannot compete with the damage that Sorcs put out, the healing available to them, or their defensive shields. It's just not a level playing field.Few tips for fighting magsorcs in case you jave trouble. I suggest you fight in doors, open world their playground as much as it is for nightblade snipers. Fighting indoors will not only limit the travel didtance for you, but it also hinder their streaks. If you are a big fan of fighting out in the open, fight in slopes, streak only good in even trerrains. Also, much like how a detect pot is counter for nightblade cloak, you can say the immovable pots are anti magsorc burst combo since they despretly need it to kill someone and without it they can't secure kills 70% of the time. Use immovable pots when they set up their combo, then block and heal or go offensive because most of the time only way to kill sorcs is to be offensive rather than being defensive.1 -
Langeston✭✭✭✭✭
✭It is a good combo. But it is never a instakill against good player. Good players will dodge or block your frags after the stun. Especially dks, Templar, Warden and Necro are to tanky for this!
And Streak has 33% less dmg than Spammables.
Streak is a great Ability and Should be made blockable again.
But please don't spread such nonsense!!!
Ok, I hopped on my sorc and apparently it doesn't do as much damage as Force Pulse. I based my comment on just looking at the skill descriptions on ESO-Skillbook.comNo, Streak is definitely not dealing more damage than Force Pulse and so. WTH?
(o_0)
In your example, what if your opponent just uses a detection potion? If being knocked out of Cloak is the reason you die, then anyone can do that just fine. You could also use a shield, heal, roll out of cone or Shade to mitigate a follow-up hit, but I guess those are bugged, as is every single NB skill, right? Hell, I could probably easily kill you on DK with Talons. Any mag build with Elemental Ring. Any stam with Steel Tornado. You die because you get outplayed, not because of Streak.
The rest of my post stands though. As a magblade I need 3 separate abilities to accomplish what Streak does, and none of them do so as effectively & as easily. Relative to other skills in the game, Streak is overloaded.
[edit] Oh, and if you're playing one of (if not the) strongest mag class in the game and you kill the weakest (by far) spec in the game, you haven't "outplayed" them. That'd be like me bragging about beating my grandma in arm wrestling.
Thing is everyone knows that magnb is weaker. I’m pretty sure things have been balanced between certain classes right now and others they just haven’t gotten to yet. It’s the only thing that makes sense.
Someone would have to be incredibly biased or an idiot to think things are balanced right now. I don’t see the point of piling on magsorc when it isn’t the strongest class right now.
My intention wasn't to pile on, my initial comment was simply in agreement that Streak is overtuned relative to other abilities. (Of course most abilities seem overtuned when your on a magblade — don't get me started on Blastbones, Boneyard, Toppling Charge/Sweeps, or Northern Storm/Permafrost.) What irks me is that ZOS put most of these abilities together in their current forms after they completely gutted NBs, because apparently their toolkit was supposedly "OP." That's why I'm not necessarily confident that ZOS intends to expend a whole lot of effort rebalancing them.
I just want some semblance of balance. And to be honest, after seeing all the Sorcs in NB threads attempting to perpetuate the myth that NBs are somehow "OP", I don't particularly care how that balance comes about.Edited by Langeston on March 12, 2020 12:07PM0 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It is a good combo. But it is never a instakill against good player. Good players will dodge or block your frags after the stun. Especially dks, Templar, Warden and Necro are to tanky for this!
And Streak has 33% less dmg than Spammables.
Streak is a great Ability and Should be made blockable again.
But please don't spread such nonsense!!!
Ok, I hopped on my sorc and apparently it doesn't do as much damage as Force Pulse. I based my comment on just looking at the skill descriptions on ESO-Skillbook.comNo, Streak is definitely not dealing more damage than Force Pulse and so. WTH?
(o_0)
In your example, what if your opponent just uses a detection potion? If being knocked out of Cloak is the reason you die, then anyone can do that just fine. You could also use a shield, heal, roll out of cone or Shade to mitigate a follow-up hit, but I guess those are bugged, as is every single NB skill, right? Hell, I could probably easily kill you on DK with Talons. Any mag build with Elemental Ring. Any stam with Steel Tornado. You die because you get outplayed, not because of Streak.
The rest of my post stands though. As a magblade I need 3 separate abilities to accomplish what Streak does, and none of them do so as effectively & as easily. Relative to other skills in the game, Streak is overloaded.
[edit] Oh, and if you're playing one of (if not the) strongest mag class in the game and you kill the weakest (by far) spec in the game, you haven't "outplayed" them. That'd be like me bragging about beating my grandma in arm wrestling.
Thing is everyone knows that magnb is weaker. I’m pretty sure things have been balanced between certain classes right now and others they just haven’t gotten to yet. It’s the only thing that makes sense.
Someone would have to be incredibly biased or an idiot to think things are balanced right now. I don’t see the point of piling on magsorc when it isn’t the strongest class right now.
My intention wasn't to pile on, my initial comment was simply in agreement that Streak is overtuned relative to other abilities. (Of course most abilities seem overtuned when your on a magblade — don't get me started on Blastbones, Boneyard, Toppling Charge/Sweeps, or Northern Storm/Permafrost.) What irks me is that ZOS put most of these abilities together in their current forms after they completely gutted NBs, because apparently their toolkit was supposedly "OP." That's why I'm not necessarily confident that ZOS intends to expend a whole lot of effort rebalancing them.
I just want some semblance of balance. And to be honest, after seeing all the Sorcs in NB threads attempting to perpetuate the myth that NBs are somehow "OP", I don't particularly care how that balance comes about.
That’s natural given how the game has progressed. I think magsorc started the game as one of the best classes so people have a high expectation for it to perform well. Vs if a class starts weaker they’re happy if it just does okay.
People also gravitate to the strongest classes, so you’ll get more opinions about their needs. Like right now I’m pretty sure werewolves are the weakest spec in the game, but for most it’s a non-issue because almost no one plays them.Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
Condemned and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten0