Why nerf Iceheart?

Shantu

There's just something about this that is highly disturbing. ZOS continues to hemorrhage the enjoyment out of the game in the name of abstract standards few in the player base who actually support the company find any use or need for. Now they blatantly gut a popular set to hype something new they want you to pay for and mask it with lip service to standards. This kind of behavior inspires precious little good will and motivation to continue.

Taloros

A change that's either stupid (in overestimating the set's usefulness) or selfish (to promote a new DLC).

Both aren't acceptable.

The changes posted later reek of bad conscience, but neither the reasoning nor the compromise excuse the original mistake.

Just leave the set alone. In fact, stop changing existing stuff at all. The positive changes were seriously outweighed by the negative, the pointless, the confusing changes during the last year (e. g. Caltrops).

Juhasow

Xvorg wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

In short : because it's very powerfull set. From DD perspective it's most powerfull defensive set used atm , leaving many other defensive sets far behind. Other defensive sets have hard time competing with set that extends users health by 9k every 6 seconds with very easy proc conditions. It's almost like increasing users defense by 50% passively. And it's monster set so it just requires 2 armor slots which allows for building high defense without any drastic changes to the setup.

It's one of the sets that makes healers less usefull in many types of content and makes people way more careless about mechanics which in longer run makes people weaker players in general. Both of those things are not good for the health of the game despite the fact players are benefiting from the set itself. But there are certain reasonable levels of how much benefit set can provide and Iceheart brings simply too much to the table too easily.

How is that Iceheart is stronger than Blood Spawn or Troll king (the other 2 viable monster defensive sets, because Skelly was the strongest some time ago)?

By the way IH proc conditions are not so easy to meet. You are forced to run crit chance to make it reliable which you cannot build as tanky as you might imagine.

Everyone I know says the set is not OP, but by no way it is useless. It is pretty niche.

On the other hand, Slimecraw makes healers even less useless. Do we nerf slimecraw too? What about solo players?

If we want to keep the game consistent, OK, lets tweak some sets. But nerfing them into oblivios seems just wrong. And you know what's worst? ZoS is going to sell a set that procs on channel which is easier to proc than IH, but that eventually will keep a shield up 100% time. On a Templar that's a bubble for using your main spammable, but not a simple bubble, just one with minor protection. Now tell me about sets that make people way more careless about mechanics.

Oh, I forgot Chudan that could give you a bubble with like 8 k armor if you put a shield glyph on an infused weapon

Iceheart is stronger then bloodspawn or troll king because of many different reasons. Namely because those other sets helps Your health bar when it takes damage when iceheart simply stops the damage from interacting with Your health bar. To proc bloodspan You need to take damage to proc troll king You need to heal Yourself while under 50% health. Comparing bloodspawn or troll king defensive strenghts to iceheart in PvE is laughable. Iceheart leaves both of those sets far behind. Guess which one of those 3 montster sets allows to survive 21k one shot mechanic when You have 20k health ? Iceheart is literally extending Your health bar by 9k. In PvE it can absorb sometimes more then 50% of incoming damage which means that damage will not affect Your health. It's like getting 50% damage mitigation bonus. There is no other monster set that can come close to that in PvE.

Iceheart proc conditions are extremly easy to meet. And no You're not forced to run high crit build for that. Wheter You have 40% crit or 70% crit You'll proc iceheart almost on cooldown as mag DD because DoTs plus light attacks plus skills gives You enough entries for the proc to happen. Also it's not like mag DDs are avoiding having 50%+ crit these days or they're forcing themselves to that.

Since camouflage hunter changes people dont even have to use slimecraw to get minor berserk. Most of the instances where healers are being replaced with another DD are dungeons and arenas, And when people are going there in 3DD team they'll most propably choose iceheart over slimecraw because main obstacle to overcome as 3DD team is surviving mechanics (I am of course excluding things like non DLC dungeons which can be cleared half naked). And easy survival gives You better damage boost then minor berserk. That is why for example in vBRP 3DD runs mag DDs are commonly using iceheart not slimecraw. With slimecraw Your DPS will be lower then with Iceheart because You'll have to waste too much time on staying alive. Iceheart solves that issue passively and You can focus way more on doing damage so at the end it beats slimecraw offensively. So it actually beats offensive and defensive sets.

New monster set is not easier to proc lol. Proc condition for that new monster set is its biggest weakness. Also bubble from mother ciannait set is not giving You minor protection. Check Your infos before commenting on something. So at the end it'll be bubble weaker then current iceheart with way worse proc conditions and only 1 class will be able to more or less use it realiably when other classes would have to switch to heavy attack rotations to benefit from it. That is way way weaker then current state of Iceheart on live server and even trying to compare them both is laughable. And suggesting that it would make You careless about mechanic more then iceheart on live server is just delusional.

Shield glyph on infused weapon+chudan is too much of a DPS loss especially that many setups already have their resistance buffs active anyway. Iceheart gives You similar or better defense and You loose just 1 offensive piece for that not 2 pieces and enchant. You can say whatever You want and theorycraft how much You want but nothing will beat Iceheart on live server when it comes to improving survival for DD. That is why most of the top score teams running vBRP with 3DD have mag users wearing it. And if top players that perfectly knows their rotations and mechanics still choose that set it means it's even stronger for unexperienced players that are learning the game. That menas it's not only very strong but unlike many other sets it's very strong for everyone.

Joy_Division

Only ZOS can make it so an old set introduced years ago that I've never heard only one complain about, is not on Alcast's builds, and has never been whined about by PvPers somehow has spawned a 17 page thread in just 3 days.

I used to play with a guildie who insisted on wearing this set and he died so often that we had to grind Undaunted, we wouldn't use zone chat because we were afraid he'd offer to help and wind up dying and thus blowing 50 points for no a death run. They design the PvE content around one-shots that this set cannot save players from. It's not nearly the carry ZOS is making it out to be.

Moloch1514

Joy_Division wrote: »

Only ZOS can make it so an old set introduced years ago that I've never heard only one complain about, is not on Alcast's builds, and has never been whined about by PvPers somehow has spawned a 17 page thread in just 3 days.

I used to play with a guildie who insisted on wearing this set and he died so often that we had to grind Undaunted, we wouldn't use zone chat because we were afraid he'd offer to help and wind up dying and thus blowing 50 points for no a death run. They design the PvE content around one-shots that this set cannot save players from. It's not nearly the carry ZOS is making it out to be.

The problem is that Alcast started promoting Solo builds and uses Iceheart. He solo'ed both new dungeons and hyped Iceheart in his Youtube videos of those solo runs. Then he also had a video of these original PTS patch notes laughing about the new monster set being garbage compared to Iceheart.

Then ZOS nerfs Iceheart.

Xorsius

Joy_Division wrote: »

Only ZOS can make it so an old set introduced years ago that I've never heard only one complain about, is not on Alcast's builds, and has never been whined about by PvPers somehow has spawned a 17 page thread in just 3 days.

I used to play with a guildie who insisted on wearing this set and he died so often that we had to grind Undaunted, we wouldn't use zone chat because we were afraid he'd offer to help and wind up dying and thus blowing 50 points for no a death run. They design the PvE content around one-shots that this set cannot save players from. It's not nearly the carry ZOS is making it out to be.

Actually, Iceheart is on Alcast's builds, at least one of them. His MagSorc solo and vMA build is how I first found out about it and started using it here.

Dusk_Coven

Moloch1514 wrote: »

The problem is that Alcast started promoting Solo builds and uses Iceheart. He solo'ed both new dungeons and hyped Iceheart in his Youtube videos of those solo runs. Then he also had a video of these original PTS patch notes laughing about the new monster set being garbage compared to Iceheart.

Then ZOS nerfs Iceheart.

Maybe ZOS should check their spelling because the set is called "IceHeart", not "Alcast".
Simply wearing it does not grant you all the solo-ing vMA-ing powers of Alcast.

Katahdin

This set is far from OP

The damage iceheart provides is so immaterial that anyone that runs it gives up a lot of damage for a small amount of mitigation. No one runs it for its damage. There are much better options.

It is used by stam dps to give a little bit of survivability when progressing and learning vet trials and in situations where you don't have a healer. I use it to help mitigate the damage when doing portals in VCR and VSS on my stamblade.

Mother Cwhateveritis is no good for stam at all so would have no incentive to farm it anyway and makes this change even stupider if that's the real reason.

This nerf to Iceheart damage mitigation will hurt the average players trying to progress and complete vet trials

Remove the mediocre damage and keep the mitigation. Give ice role players another option for their ice damage aesthetics.

Starlock

I’m not going to slog through 17 pages, but I’m going to add in a voice of confusion to the pile.

I use iceheart on one of my characters because it fits her theme. She’ll be okay because she reformed as a part-time healer, but I really do not understand the three fold hammer taken to this set. The cooldown increase will be especially annoying, but even worse on top of the reduced shield and cut on the damage it does (which was never great anyway).

Alienoutlaw

what gets my goat is the shameful way the team on last nights stream just shrugged of the "in the news" and made a joke about the communities response to the nerf............

Dusk_Coven

Alienoutlaw wrote: »

what gets my goat is the shameful way the team on last nights stream just shrugged of the "in the news" and made a joke about the communities response to the nerf............

Just like they laughed off the mention of when old bugs like running-on-your-horse might get addressed when they had the 2020 reveal. They turned it into a joke so immediately I wondered whether it was all rehearsed.

Xvorg

Juhasow wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

In short : because it's very powerfull set. From DD perspective it's most powerfull defensive set used atm , leaving many other defensive sets far behind. Other defensive sets have hard time competing with set that extends users health by 9k every 6 seconds with very easy proc conditions. It's almost like increasing users defense by 50% passively. And it's monster set so it just requires 2 armor slots which allows for building high defense without any drastic changes to the setup.

It's one of the sets that makes healers less usefull in many types of content and makes people way more careless about mechanics which in longer run makes people weaker players in general. Both of those things are not good for the health of the game despite the fact players are benefiting from the set itself. But there are certain reasonable levels of how much benefit set can provide and Iceheart brings simply too much to the table too easily.

How is that Iceheart is stronger than Blood Spawn or Troll king (the other 2 viable monster defensive sets, because Skelly was the strongest some time ago)?

By the way IH proc conditions are not so easy to meet. You are forced to run crit chance to make it reliable which you cannot build as tanky as you might imagine.

Everyone I know says the set is not OP, but by no way it is useless. It is pretty niche.

On the other hand, Slimecraw makes healers even less useless. Do we nerf slimecraw too? What about solo players?

If we want to keep the game consistent, OK, lets tweak some sets. But nerfing them into oblivios seems just wrong. And you know what's worst? ZoS is going to sell a set that procs on channel which is easier to proc than IH, but that eventually will keep a shield up 100% time. On a Templar that's a bubble for using your main spammable, but not a simple bubble, just one with minor protection. Now tell me about sets that make people way more careless about mechanics.

Oh, I forgot Chudan that could give you a bubble with like 8 k armor if you put a shield glyph on an infused weapon

Iceheart is stronger then bloodspawn or troll king because of many different reasons. Namely because those other sets helps Your health bar when it takes damage when iceheart simply stops the damage from interacting with Your health bar. To proc bloodspan You need to take damage to proc troll king You need to heal Yourself while under 50% health. Comparing bloodspawn or troll king defensive strenghts to iceheart in PvE is laughable. Iceheart leaves both of those sets far behind. Guess which one of those 3 montster sets allows to survive 21k one shot mechanic when You have 20k health ? Iceheart is literally extending Your health bar by 9k. In PvE it can absorb sometimes more then 50% of incoming damage which means that damage will not affect Your health. It's like getting 50% damage mitigation bonus. There is no other monster set that can come close to that in PvE.

Iceheart proc conditions are extremly easy to meet. And no You're not forced to run high crit build for that. Wheter You have 40% crit or 70% crit You'll proc iceheart almost on cooldown as mag DD because DoTs plus light attacks plus skills gives You enough entries for the proc to happen. Also it's not like mag DDs are avoiding having 50%+ crit these days or they're forcing themselves to that.

Since camouflage hunter changes people dont even have to use slimecraw to get minor berserk. Most of the instances where healers are being replaced with another DD are dungeons and arenas, And when people are going there in 3DD team they'll most propably choose iceheart over slimecraw because main obstacle to overcome as 3DD team is surviving mechanics (I am of course excluding things like non DLC dungeons which can be cleared half naked). And easy survival gives You better damage boost then minor berserk. That is why for example in vBRP 3DD runs mag DDs are commonly using iceheart not slimecraw. With slimecraw Your DPS will be lower then with Iceheart because You'll have to waste too much time on staying alive. Iceheart solves that issue passively and You can focus way more on doing damage so at the end it beats slimecraw offensively. So it actually beats offensive and defensive sets.

New monster set is not easier to proc lol. Proc condition for that new monster set is its biggest weakness. Also bubble from mother ciannait set is not giving You minor protection. Check Your infos before commenting on something. So at the end it'll be bubble weaker then current iceheart with way worse proc conditions and only 1 class will be able to more or less use it realiably when other classes would have to switch to heavy attack rotations to benefit from it. That is way way weaker then current state of Iceheart on live server and even trying to compare them both is laughable. And suggesting that it would make You careless about mechanic more then iceheart on live server is just delusional.

Shield glyph on infused weapon+chudan is too much of a DPS loss especially that many setups already have their resistance buffs active anyway. Iceheart gives You similar or better defense and You loose just 1 offensive piece for that not 2 pieces and enchant. You can say whatever You want and theorycraft how much You want but nothing will beat Iceheart on live server when it comes to improving survival for DD. That is why most of the top score teams running vBRP with 3DD have mag users wearing it. And if top players that perfectly knows their rotations and mechanics still choose that set it means it's even stronger for unexperienced players that are learning the game. That menas it's not only very strong but unlike many other sets it's very strong for everyone.

Have you tried the set?

By the way, if you read again I never said that the set gave you minor protection, just that templars will have a proc on MC with major protection http://prntscr.com/qyqel9

Currently they something similar on IH, but I have seen 0 templars using that set.

By the way, following your logic, combat physician is much stronger than IH since it as set that works on any heal. I would like to see who wears that set for end game.

ESO_Nightingale

Joy_Division wrote: »

Only ZOS can make it so an old set introduced years ago that I've never heard only one complain about, is not on Alcast's builds, and has never been whined about by PvPers somehow has spawned a 17 page thread in just 3 days.

I used to play with a guildie who insisted on wearing this set and he died so often that we had to grind Undaunted, we wouldn't use zone chat because we were afraid he'd offer to help and wind up dying and thus blowing 50 points for no a death run. They design the PvE content around one-shots that this set cannot save players from. It's not nearly the carry ZOS is making it out to be.

When the patch first dropped my eyes were only on glacial presence. Turns out just about everything else this patch is godawful. Iceheart being nerfed like this is just *** disgusting. This patch is just horrible and it just keeps getting worse.

Joy_Division

Moloch1514 wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Only ZOS can make it so an old set introduced years ago that I've never heard only one complain about, is not on Alcast's builds, and has never been whined about by PvPers somehow has spawned a 17 page thread in just 3 days.

I used to play with a guildie who insisted on wearing this set and he died so often that we had to grind Undaunted, we wouldn't use zone chat because we were afraid he'd offer to help and wind up dying and thus blowing 50 points for no a death run. They design the PvE content around one-shots that this set cannot save players from. It's not nearly the carry ZOS is making it out to be.

The problem is that Alcast started promoting Solo builds and uses Iceheart. He solo'ed both new dungeons and hyped Iceheart in his Youtube videos of those solo runs. Then he also had a video of these original PTS patch notes laughing about the new monster set being garbage compared to Iceheart.

Then ZOS nerfs Iceheart.

I see. I guess that explains why. It doesn't change my opinion though. Just because someone who is super experienced can solo content, does not mean the gear they used is OP and has to be nerfed. I recall seeing a video of Andy S soloing a Trial, what good players with deep knowledge of the game can do is what is "carrying" them.

That ZOS initially believed that a monster set that would give a 3K damage shield every 10 seconds after casting a channel ability was even remotely desirable shows they are way overestimating the potency of these defensive sets.

Juhasow

Xvorg wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

In short : because it's very powerfull set. From DD perspective it's most powerfull defensive set used atm , leaving many other defensive sets far behind. Other defensive sets have hard time competing with set that extends users health by 9k every 6 seconds with very easy proc conditions. It's almost like increasing users defense by 50% passively. And it's monster set so it just requires 2 armor slots which allows for building high defense without any drastic changes to the setup.

It's one of the sets that makes healers less usefull in many types of content and makes people way more careless about mechanics which in longer run makes people weaker players in general. Both of those things are not good for the health of the game despite the fact players are benefiting from the set itself. But there are certain reasonable levels of how much benefit set can provide and Iceheart brings simply too much to the table too easily.

How is that Iceheart is stronger than Blood Spawn or Troll king (the other 2 viable monster defensive sets, because Skelly was the strongest some time ago)?

By the way IH proc conditions are not so easy to meet. You are forced to run crit chance to make it reliable which you cannot build as tanky as you might imagine.

Everyone I know says the set is not OP, but by no way it is useless. It is pretty niche.

On the other hand, Slimecraw makes healers even less useless. Do we nerf slimecraw too? What about solo players?

If we want to keep the game consistent, OK, lets tweak some sets. But nerfing them into oblivios seems just wrong. And you know what's worst? ZoS is going to sell a set that procs on channel which is easier to proc than IH, but that eventually will keep a shield up 100% time. On a Templar that's a bubble for using your main spammable, but not a simple bubble, just one with minor protection. Now tell me about sets that make people way more careless about mechanics.

Oh, I forgot Chudan that could give you a bubble with like 8 k armor if you put a shield glyph on an infused weapon

Iceheart is stronger then bloodspawn or troll king because of many different reasons. Namely because those other sets helps Your health bar when it takes damage when iceheart simply stops the damage from interacting with Your health bar. To proc bloodspan You need to take damage to proc troll king You need to heal Yourself while under 50% health. Comparing bloodspawn or troll king defensive strenghts to iceheart in PvE is laughable. Iceheart leaves both of those sets far behind. Guess which one of those 3 montster sets allows to survive 21k one shot mechanic when You have 20k health ? Iceheart is literally extending Your health bar by 9k. In PvE it can absorb sometimes more then 50% of incoming damage which means that damage will not affect Your health. It's like getting 50% damage mitigation bonus. There is no other monster set that can come close to that in PvE.

Iceheart proc conditions are extremly easy to meet. And no You're not forced to run high crit build for that. Wheter You have 40% crit or 70% crit You'll proc iceheart almost on cooldown as mag DD because DoTs plus light attacks plus skills gives You enough entries for the proc to happen. Also it's not like mag DDs are avoiding having 50%+ crit these days or they're forcing themselves to that.

Since camouflage hunter changes people dont even have to use slimecraw to get minor berserk. Most of the instances where healers are being replaced with another DD are dungeons and arenas, And when people are going there in 3DD team they'll most propably choose iceheart over slimecraw because main obstacle to overcome as 3DD team is surviving mechanics (I am of course excluding things like non DLC dungeons which can be cleared half naked). And easy survival gives You better damage boost then minor berserk. That is why for example in vBRP 3DD runs mag DDs are commonly using iceheart not slimecraw. With slimecraw Your DPS will be lower then with Iceheart because You'll have to waste too much time on staying alive. Iceheart solves that issue passively and You can focus way more on doing damage so at the end it beats slimecraw offensively. So it actually beats offensive and defensive sets.

New monster set is not easier to proc lol. Proc condition for that new monster set is its biggest weakness. Also bubble from mother ciannait set is not giving You minor protection. Check Your infos before commenting on something. So at the end it'll be bubble weaker then current iceheart with way worse proc conditions and only 1 class will be able to more or less use it realiably when other classes would have to switch to heavy attack rotations to benefit from it. That is way way weaker then current state of Iceheart on live server and even trying to compare them both is laughable. And suggesting that it would make You careless about mechanic more then iceheart on live server is just delusional.

Shield glyph on infused weapon+chudan is too much of a DPS loss especially that many setups already have their resistance buffs active anyway. Iceheart gives You similar or better defense and You loose just 1 offensive piece for that not 2 pieces and enchant. You can say whatever You want and theorycraft how much You want but nothing will beat Iceheart on live server when it comes to improving survival for DD. That is why most of the top score teams running vBRP with 3DD have mag users wearing it. And if top players that perfectly knows their rotations and mechanics still choose that set it means it's even stronger for unexperienced players that are learning the game. That menas it's not only very strong but unlike many other sets it's very strong for everyone.

Have you tried the set?

By the way, if you read again I never said that the set gave you minor protection, just that templars will have a proc on MC with major protection http://prntscr.com/qyqel9

Currently they something similar on IH, but I have seen 0 templars using that set.

By the way, following your logic, combat physician is much stronger than IH since it as set that works on any heal. I would like to see who wears that set for end game.

Which set Iceheart on live server or mother ciannit on PTS ? I've tried both but I just to be clear what You're asking about. And results are that mother ciannit on PTS cant come even close to Iceheart on live server. In real fights iceheart not only gives You more shield but also is keeping higher uptime then new monster set because You wont use chanalled/cast time attack excatly every 6 seconds when cooldown ends but You'll do damage every second to proc iceheart after cooldown ends. Plus it shows how weak mother ciannit is if You can only bring one class as an example where it can work , knowing full well that on other 5 classes it will be useless.

Well argument about minor protection is nonsensical then because if You have iceheart on live server You are also getting minor protection when using jabs and You have Iceheart shield active almost on cooldown. You're getting minor protection anyway so why You use that as an argument for new monster set when jabs meet the requirement to proc both of those sets reliably. Also it's minor protection not major (check what You've wrote).

Umm You're saying that You've never seen magplar running with iceheart ? Well that means You should see ophthalmologist immidiately. I've actually got worlds best score at the time in vBRP few months ago and we were running as 3 magplar DDs all wearing iceheart. If You want I can show You screen from log from that run showing how much damage Iceheart absorbed. Spilers ahead : it was a lot of damage absorbed. Iceheart is commonly used by lot of magicka players and when I see people call it "niche set" it makes me laugh. It's a "niche set" that somehow huge chunk of mag DDs (and sometimes even stam) have in their inventory. Nerf of niche set is not generating avalanche of comments within one day. Seeing how many people is complaining about that nerf we can easily call Iceheart one of the meta sets because it's commonly used by lot of people.

Well You're really bad at following my logic. Combat physician is a 5 piece set so You need to make bigger adjustment to Your setup and You'll have to loose 5th piece bonus from one of Your sets and usually 5 piece bonus sets on magicka DDs in PvE gives bonuses bigger then 2nd pice of monster set other then iceheart. If You would choose to wear combat physicial for example instead of monther sorrow or false god and then choose some other monster set instead of iceheart then You would loose a lot compared to running with iceheart and 5 piece false god or mother sorrow. Also critical healing from DD perspective is harder to achieve then critical damage. Especialy that combat physician requires to actually heal someone which means that person need to loose health 1st and get it critically healed. So combat physician works after Your health bar takes damage when Iceheart prevents Your health bar from taking damage. Combat physician basically have 2 requirements : someone needs to take damage and get critical heal. So it cannot prevent You for example from one shot mechanic if You were not getting damage seconds before that one shot when on the other hand Iceheart will work in that situation. That is big difference and adventage on Iceheart's side.

TheUndeadAmulet

People are less complaining about the nerf to iceheart and more about how ZOS nerfs the fun out of everything imo. Iceheart was just the breaking point.

Alienoutlaw

TheUndeadAmulet wrote: »

People are less complaining about the nerf to iceheart and more about how ZOS nerfs the fun out of everything imo. Iceheart was just the breaking point.

nope defo about the nerf

Stibbons

I think Sorc shieldstacking with this set was overperforming is the reason to this nerf.

Olupajmibanan

Stibbons wrote: »

I think Sorc shieldstacking with this set was overperforming is the reason to this nerf.

Definitely but it arrives a little late. Sorc shieldstacking is dead for more than half year.

DreadDaedroth

Uhm so this set was sooo strong and overpowered that it needs an adjustment exactly in the second week of PTS ,after years and years of use with even the slightest hints of a problem, when a similar but less appealing set it's being released...

I don't think they'll admit their mistake and revert the changes but just slightly alter the numbers of the new version so it'll look like they listen to the base when the reality is different.

Altyrann

Not sure I've ever seen this level of response on the PTS server before. There might be a hint in that somewhere...

goldenarcher1

Gina did say on ESO live there are more changes to Iceheart in the final PTS patch next week,which may or may not pacify the forum anger,but we will see.

Daedric_NB_187

Yamenstein wrote: »

jecks33 wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We’ve been reading everyone’s feedback about the recent change to Iceheart (not just on the forums, but other channels and sources as well) and we appreciate you taking the time to let us know your thoughts. We know it’s frustrating to see a strong set get adjusted in this way, but it was a necessary step to bring it a little closer in strength with existing and upcoming sets.

That said, based on some in-game data, testing, and the feedback we’ve been reading, we’re going to make further adjustments to this set in next week’s PTS patch. The plan is to make the baseline function meet the same standards as the Mother Ciannait set, with a 5k shield that lasts up to 6 seconds with a 6 second cooldown. With Iceheart's auxiliary function being focused on preserving the shield to get as much effectiveness out of the damage as possible, and Ciannait around rushing in boldly to break the shield to maximize the Magicka gain, there will be a better parity between the two that helps them both meet our standards as well as feel different from an engagement standpoint.

Sorry Gina but this is the wrong way, adjustements (nerfs) are never well acepted. Instead of nerfing everything to "bring it a little closer in strength with existing and upcoming sets", buff older useless sets, make new sets more desirable and not the only possible choice.

Buffing older sets would mean buffing alll monsters and content as well, wouldn't it ? Otherwise the difficulty of the game goes down further because the sets got buffed.

I have no problem them needing iceheart, as long as it's done right.

They want to have all sets on the same level.

If they give OP sets in DLC then everyone complaining about this nerf will then instead just complain about the payable content being better. Pay to win! Yay. *Sarcasm*

So because they can't do that, when they bring out new sets they'll be forced to make sure they are in line with older sets. Especially when they are similar.

Could they have made the new monster set better than it currently is ? Sure! They could. It's not very original I agree with that.

But people who think Iceheart didn't need a nerf is just delusional.

There is always one lol.

Waynerx8

Will be looking forward to seeing how their new MMO will be received, given that people can now see their blatant business model/cash grabbing.

that_goat

One has to ask themselves if these sorts of changes are done with fun and player experience in mind or if it's just to make the game more frustrating for average players so that convenience is easier to sell. The explanation of "set do not meet our standards" is so nebulous and hand wavey that it likely means the actual reason is something that would have bad optics if it were made public.

naturebased

that_goat wrote: »

One has to ask themselves if these sorts of changes are done with fun and player experience in mind or if it's just to make the game more frustrating for average players so that convenience is easier to sell. The explanation of "set do not meet our standards" is so nebulous and hand wavey that it likely means the actual reason is something that would have bad optics if it were made public.

Playing the new dlc dungeons on vet to earn mother cincinatti is going to be 10x harder than earning iceheart helm on vet

Bexy

goldenarcher1 wrote: »

Gina did say on ESO live there are more changes to Iceheart in the final PTS patch next week,which may or may not pacify the forum anger,but we will see.

The best change would be not changing Iceheart at all.

SidraWillowsky

Bexy wrote: »

goldenarcher1 wrote: »

Gina did say on ESO live there are more changes to Iceheart in the final PTS patch next week,which may or may not pacify the forum anger,but we will see.

The best change would be not changing Iceheart at all.

Yeah, IMO the only acceptable change would be a full reversion. But that's not going to happen.

Juhasow wrote: »

Iceheart is stronger then bloodspawn or troll king because of many different reasons. Namely because those other sets helps Your health bar when it takes damage when iceheart simply stops the damage from interacting with Your health bar. To proc bloodspan You need to take damage to proc troll king You need to heal Yourself while under 50% health. Comparing bloodspawn or troll king defensive strenghts to iceheart in PvE is laughable. Iceheart leaves both of those sets far behind. Guess which one of those 3 montster sets allows to survive 21k one shot mechanic when You have 20k health ? Iceheart is literally extending Your health bar by 9k. In PvE it can absorb sometimes more then 50% of incoming damage which means that damage will not affect Your health. It's like getting 50% damage mitigation bonus. There is no other monster set that can come close to that in PvE.

You realize that ALL shields do this, right? I'm not sure why you're acting like Iceheart is the only way to do this- Dampen Magicka, for example, caps out at 60% of max health, so if I'm running vMA with 18k health, that's an 11k damage shield. You're talking about this "health bar extension" like it's something unique to Iceheart.

Juhasow wrote: »

And if top players that perfectly knows their rotations and mechanics still choose that set it means it's even stronger for unexperienced players that are learning the game. That menas it's not only very strong but unlike many other sets it's very strong for everyone.

Why on earth is this a problem? Do you think that the unworthy lowbs shouldn't have access to this because in your head they're not "worthy" of completing the content without what you deem this "crutch" set? IT'S A GOOD THING that EVERYONE has access to this. Are you happier with this new abomination of a monster set being introduced because it's only going to help templars? I don't get it. The fact that the unworthy are able to also beat vBRP is seemingly somehow not OK with you, and I find that really elitist and weird. I've got Flawless Conqueror both with and without Iceheart and could not possibly care less how other people get the achievement. If someone can do it (themselves, obviously I'm not talking about people who pay others to log into their account and run for them) then good on them- period.

Dusk_Coven

goldenarcher1 wrote: »

Gina did say on ESO live there are more changes to Iceheart in the final PTS patch next week,which may or may not pacify the forum anger,but we will see.

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Granicus wrote: »

Second, any ‘compromise’ feels like “let’s nerf it so much that when we back off a little, they’ll shut up, accept it AND be happy again.”

Yup, it's a type of trickery. People lose sight of the fact that the original premise -- nerfing the set at all -- is flawed when they accept a compromise position.

Altyrann

goldenarcher1 wrote: »

Gina did say on ESO live there are more changes to Iceheart in the final PTS patch next week,which may or may not pacify the forum anger,but we will see.

Thanks. Missed that so good to hear. Fingers crossed they end up buffing it!