Story Mode Dungeons: Do we want them?

Dusk_Coven

YES. We want a story mode.

witchdoctor wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

In ESO I suspect what would also happen is you get kicked.

I don't think there is an equivalent in ESO. Those decision points tied up everyone, regardless if it was your 1st or 101st time doing a FP.

So your suggestion would mean there could be 4 people all at different quest stages? Sounds like it could be a mess without putting everyone at the same quest stage though.
Right now the person furthest ahead pushes the story events forward. And that's a problem.
SWTOR solved it by locking the dialog progress but even there, people moving ahead can trigger events causing those left behind to completely miss them.

As for finding a useful group in ESO... the population is making that harder and harder. No one deserves to waste their time.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/509871/zos-please-my-3rd-day-back-in-pvp-and-i-am-forced-to-play-solo-in-cyrodill-why-pc-na#latest

TheFM

NO. Do not add a story mode.

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

curtisnewton wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

If you wanted a single player game, eso was never the game for you. ever. They cater to everyone, and you are not the crowd they are catering to when it comes to dungeons. And yes, demon dogs should be able to kill you quickly.

Tbh the game being mmo shouldn't affect the content available. Especially since the game has such a big casual community from TeS games. Now i agree that skill points should not be given on story mode (even though they are tied to the quest, so if it is implemented they will probably put it in anyway) because it will lower the initiative to go multiplayer for dungeon skill points (i would totally take all my tank toons for quick rushed story mode for skill points ez, and thats already a huge reason against it)

shifting to spending dev time on a story mode would take away somewhere else.

Do you think it is really a lot more than sth. Like:

If player count = 1
Then mobstrength factor = 0.2

?

Story mode sounds so big, but in fact.. Just being easier with weaker enemies would be already ok. As there is already a deep scaling mechanic in place I doubt much dev time was lost.
And gaining a 60% more happy player base (according to the polls) should be worth it anyway. And how can sth. Optional offend anyone is beyond me.

Same could be said about an instance for vet mode overland.

So you'd be cool with a vet overworld with no rewards? Because almost everyone who wants a vet overworld wants additional rewards while almost no one is asking for any type of reward for story mode dungeons, including that funky skill point you keep holding on to lol.

Anyone who has seen your posts knows the real reason why you are opposed to a story mode dungeon and in both instances you are in the minority. As you so nicely told another, if a challenging overworld is what you desire, ESO is not the game for you. It's a storybased MMO first and foremost.

Let that sink in.

No, if you put more effort in you get more rewards, as is the case in vet dungeons. More effort - more reward, less effort - less reward.

Exactly what I thought, you have zero interest in challenging content you just want extra rewards.

Let's be real here, for hardcore players,
the ones banging on about this challenging content is challenging the 1st time, maybe the 2nd as well. By the 3rd time you know what to expect and how to overcome it.

With that out of the way, you are now free to reap the additional rewards from "challenging" content that is no longer a challenge for you.

I found Maelstrom Arena extremely challenging the 1st few times, now it's a cakewalk.

I found Demon Souls challenging the 1st few times. No longer. Are they supposed to constantly redo overworld every update to keep up?

Nope, thereby leaving you what you really want, access to easy rewards because the content is no longer challenging.

Yes,go ahead and tell me what I think, clearly you know better than I do, that's hilarious.

TheFM

NO. Do not add a story mode.

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Tell you what, you can have a solo mode when we get a vet overland mode.

Ergo, never.

It's called Craglorn but you don't want to go there.

Ok, you can have one dungeon. If you wanna use that comparison.

Why not? And when ZOS sees how many people use Story Mode, they'll give us more.
You don't use vet zones they gave you, so no more for you.

There are no vet zones, lol. Imperial city is the closest you get in no cp, and I am constantly there.

TheImperfect

YES. We want a story mode.

curtisnewton wrote: »

On the other hand instead of making a solo story mode, why not make a forced first run slow mode. If one group member didnt finish the dungeon yet, all npc talk is unskippable for all members and everything is slow, players cant move in scenes. The whole time is frozen until the last player listened to all talks, looted all boxes and read all books.

I can live with that.

In some scenes, for example if an important npc dies, i want to breath, listen to rain, wind or water streams and make a small break for maybe 2 - 5 minutes, depends.

Sometimes theres a beautiful place, sky, ornaments, i like to watch those things actually. I am sure for all players to wait for me is better than enabling a solo mode. Also i want players in silly outfits to be invisible or forced adventurer outfit..
Solo mode, who needs that pfff?

In another game I played where that happened (I think it was Guild Wars 1 but not sure) the players who had already done it chewed out and were otherwise horrible to new players who wanted to watch cinematic or slow down their play and it made the experience terrible.

BejaProphet

I think it’s fair to point out, it is entirely reasonable to want to go at a good pace when you’ve done a dungeon 100 times.

Nobody should ever act like a jerk about it. But neither should it seem strange. As a tank I often feel pressure to pull at an aggressive pace to make the dungeon fun for players who are very experienced at it.

Linaleah

YES. We want a story mode.

witchdoctor wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

witchdoctor wrote: »

It might not have been in this thread, and whilst I am positive I recall the poster's username, I won't tag them.

A comment was made that one of the 'problems' with the quest structure was the need to 'coordinate the clicking' as you proceed through quest dialogue.

I'd appreciate someone giving a real world example of how the formatting and delivery of the quest in a dungeon prohibited them from completing the quest.

1. Not due to player behaviour
2. Not hyperbolic, 'Devil's Advocate,' or it happened to my guildie's cousin

An actual example; e.g., Selene's. Which, as I recall, does not have that issue as I have continued reading quest dialogue long after my party mates accepted and went off to engage in pleasant negotiations with the native Bosmers.

you are mixing up progressing the quest and ENJOYING the quest. progressing the quest for skill points requires minimal to no interaction, as long as at least one person progresses it - you are probably going to have it register.

however- ENJOYING the quest kinda comes with wanting to enjoy ALL of the dialogue. which... you cannot.

this is not unique to dungeons, BTW - more then once I would approach my quest target area only to realize that someone has already started the event so I had a choice to make - join in or walk away and restart after they are done, so that I get to see all of the event and listen to ALL of the dialogue.

but its a little easier to walk away when someone progresses out in a world quest before you, so you walk in on the middle - and redoing it. walking away from the dungeon, requires trying to find a group... again.

the very same dungeon you mention. Selene. first person to zone in - starts in game discussion between NPC's that culminates in them acknowledging your presence and making the quest available for pick up. if you are not the first person to zone in - you miss out parts or all of that discussion. it may seem like a small thing, but it adds up. there are a lot of these scenes in Selene's actualy, that trigger the moment first person approaches the trigger spot - from the earliest failed negotiation, to portaling in dying mage, etc. you lag behind? you miss those. and while you said "not due to player behavior" player behavior is exactly the problem. other players.

sometimes, you still have an option to talk to npc's. and sometimes - they run off. sometimes they do not, but you get much more limited dialogue ou of them, something in a vein of - we gotta get moving etc etc.

@Linaleah
Thank you for responding. I was 99% sure it was you.

You have identified several things which, and truly no offence is meant, that IMO are 'individual player problems.' [Player] cannot schedule. [Player] cannot find like-minded people. [Player] feels 'bad.'

But you have also identified what is perhaps a technical issue. One that can, and IMO should, be addressed.

Perhaps the easiest solution is to replace the trigger that causes the quest to auto-advance with a prompt that asks, 'Join quest in progress? Yes or No.'

I would agree with you that technical behaviour, which you are right, can be found open world too, is annoying.

I would further agree that quests which involve the death of a boss should not stop a player from advancing the quest. I'm thinking Vaults of Madness, where I suspect, but am not sure, that your progress is stymied if Grothdar dies before you have finished speaking to the ghost trapped in Death's Head (which is easy enough on normal).

Otherwise, my opinion, for what it is worth (except as a subscriber), is I would prefer ZOS to not spend resources on a solo version dungeons.

aside from the fact that scheduling etc problems is literally the reason why groupfinder was added - to allow players to run dungeons regardless of their personal situation (so individual player issue is a valid driver for design decisions) and the fact that originally - the quests were .. ugh, I cannot remember the word, not precisely instanced, but you would not see your friends your were grouped even while standing next to each other with if you were on a different leg of a quest, there is a specific word for it that I cannot remember right now. but the point is, at launch you didn't have a problem of showing up in a middle of in game quest event happening, but you had a problem of not being able to have an option to play in a group - so current technical situation IS the fix. and shall I remind you of a 2 minute timer, up from 30 seconds that we have at the end of the dungeon? a timer that people complained about because they cannot be bothered to walk for a few seconds to the entrance, timer that was ADDED to allow people to turn in the quest for a skill point? forget about enjoying it, just the simple act of turning it in, which again - is a player problem for not waiting, but it got a technical in game solution.

how do you fix this in a group context while keeping the flow of the quests AND not annoying your players in a process? your suggestion of "join quest in progress" will work for overland. it will NOT work inside dungeons where answering no means you don't get to do the quest OR get a skill point. if you want that skillpoint and say yes (btw, you do get this prompt already if you zone into a dungeon when someone already talked to npc and skipped through the quest dialog to get it moving - off the top of my head, spindleclutch 1, if you say no to the prompt and your group members started moving - npc's are running ahead and you don't get to pick up that quest yourself, or experience any of the dialogue)

the simplest solution is - do NOT put part of the expansion story into the dungeon, like they used to do. but apparently, isolated dungeon stories inside dungeons that were too challenging for a good chunk of players to be fun - resulted in lower DLC dungeon engagement and sales.

next simplest solution? is not figuring out how not to have events trigger until everyone is there and keeping all the dialogue independent thus slowing down the group arbitrarily and annoying players and causing story players to be kicked. the next simplest solution is a separate mode - using something like Meridia's buff from vestige story. since the biggest offenders are DLC dungeons and none of the recent ones have unavoidable group mechanics, they don't even need to make any other adjustments other then "if buff present, no achievements or dungeon sets drop"

LoneStar2911

YES. We want a story mode.

Linaleah wrote: »

the quests were .. ugh, I cannot remember the word, not precisely instanced, but you would not see your friends your were grouped even while standing next to each other with if you were on a different leg of a quest, there is a specific word for it that I cannot remember right now.

"Phased" is the word you're looking for, I believe.

tomofhyrule

YES. We want a story mode.

It's interesting to read this topic since there are basically two different people making completely different arguments here, which don't necessarily negate each other. It almost feels like so many people are talking past each other and are so adamant about their viewpoint that they don't notice the other side is arguing something completely different.

The people who want stories for the most part want to go through a dungeon at their own pace, listen (not just read, actually hear the voice acting that ZoS paid some actors to do) to all of the dialogue, and see the story play out for themselves. Most people are fine with this having little in the way of rewards, since getting to see the story is reward enough.

The people who are against story-difficulty dungeons are adamant that they don't want fewer people in the group finder, as if dungeons are soloable people will stop PUGging, and believe that high-level rewards should only go to those who do high-level work, including grouping in an MMO.

So a story mode dungeon with little-no rewards would not affect group B, and then that would also prevent the group A from slowing down farming runs... That actually sounds like a win-win.

Now I assume that most people who group do dungeons for the rewards. So if we had solo-difficulty dungeons with low rewards (maybe green set pieces tops, no skill point), that's not going to pull people from the pool of people who want to farm monster helms. And if we force people to group, that's not going to pause the story long enough for those who want the story to hear it - you can only have one person at a time get the dialogue, and most people aren't going to be happy with breaking up a dungeon run and waiting 5-10 minutes every step just so someone can listen to some NPC talking. Besides, how many of the DLC dungeons have special mechanics? Wouldn't it be great if people had some idea of the layout beforehand? What's to say that someone who does a dungeon for the story won't go back to the dungeon to group now that they know the layout and want to the the skill point and rewards.

I'm all for stories in dungeons. I always take my time to listen to all of the dialogue as I'm playing - sometimes I'll even walk, not run, just to enjoy the overland. I favor the RP aspect of Elder Scrolls games. I'm too scared to do a dungeon yet, and one of the main reasons is that I don't want to be that loser who makes my whole group lag behind for any reason. I'd love to see the story and get the layout first, but the only dungeon I've soloed is FGI on an alt character. I want to work up to eventually running vet DLCs (I want that Beast personality so bad), but I know I need to git gud first.

I suggest that, anyone who thinks that the people who want stories just "find a group," go ahead and put your money where your mouth is: offer that you will run a dungeon with someone who wants the story. And then let them take the lead with the pacing and quest so they can see it all at their pace. Let us know if you like waiting for someone else, or if you'd rather they do that solo first and then they can come back and speedrun it with you so you both can get the drops.

Sevn

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

curtisnewton wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

If you wanted a single player game, eso was never the game for you. ever. They cater to everyone, and you are not the crowd they are catering to when it comes to dungeons. And yes, demon dogs should be able to kill you quickly.

Tbh the game being mmo shouldn't affect the content available. Especially since the game has such a big casual community from TeS games. Now i agree that skill points should not be given on story mode (even though they are tied to the quest, so if it is implemented they will probably put it in anyway) because it will lower the initiative to go multiplayer for dungeon skill points (i would totally take all my tank toons for quick rushed story mode for skill points ez, and thats already a huge reason against it)

shifting to spending dev time on a story mode would take away somewhere else.

Do you think it is really a lot more than sth. Like:

If player count = 1
Then mobstrength factor = 0.2

?

Story mode sounds so big, but in fact.. Just being easier with weaker enemies would be already ok. As there is already a deep scaling mechanic in place I doubt much dev time was lost.
And gaining a 60% more happy player base (according to the polls) should be worth it anyway. And how can sth. Optional offend anyone is beyond me.

Same could be said about an instance for vet mode overland.

So you'd be cool with a vet overworld with no rewards? Because almost everyone who wants a vet overworld wants additional rewards while almost no one is asking for any type of reward for story mode dungeons, including that funky skill point you keep holding on to lol.

Anyone who has seen your posts knows the real reason why you are opposed to a story mode dungeon and in both instances you are in the minority. As you so nicely told another, if a challenging overworld is what you desire, ESO is not the game for you. It's a storybased MMO first and foremost.

Let that sink in.

No, if you put more effort in you get more rewards, as is the case in vet dungeons. More effort - more reward, less effort - less reward.

Exactly what I thought, you have zero interest in challenging content you just want extra rewards.

Let's be real here, for hardcore players,
the ones banging on about this challenging content is challenging the 1st time, maybe the 2nd as well. By the 3rd time you know what to expect and how to overcome it.

With that out of the way, you are now free to reap the additional rewards from "challenging" content that is no longer a challenge for you.

I found Maelstrom Arena extremely challenging the 1st few times, now it's a cakewalk.

I found Demon Souls challenging the 1st few times. No longer. Are they supposed to constantly redo overworld every update to keep up?

Nope, thereby leaving you what you really want, access to easy rewards because the content is no longer challenging.

Yes,go ahead and tell me what I think, clearly you know better than I do, that's hilarious.

I'm not. I'm simply telling you what I would do. As I said, if they were to introduce vet zones with increased rewards for free I'd be all over them. Why? Because I'm part of the tiny percentage of players that can complete hardcore content like Maelstrom and would take advantage of the system.

It wouldn't be long before I was mowing down this new content and start farming the daylights out of it for maximum profit. Hell I'd group up with other players who couldn't handle hardcore content but wanted access to the new shinys and sell carrys.

I'd make a killing off the mats alone since these zones would be barren like Craglorn. Just off the top of my head I can think of 3 or 4 ways to exploit these new challenges that are no longer challenging.

But I'm sure none of that even crossed your mind.*Rolls eyes*

Alinhbo_Tyaka

Yes. Although I don’t want a story mode, let people who want it have it.

Sylvermynx wrote: »

Garreth17 wrote: »

Story mode dungeons are bad simply because you can hardly experience the story. Everyone's always in a rush, i can't find time to read the dialoges

Eh, we don't have story mode dungeons. That's what we're asking for. "because you can hardly experience the story" etc. I think you got your post a bit confused.

I read it as having stories (i.e. quests) in dungeons is a bad idea based on the rest of the comment.

Given the current dungeon design I have to agree but a story mode would fix this better than removing quests from the dungeons. Final Fantasy XIV had a similar issue by having story cut scenes in their instanced content. It only exacerbated the problems we see here with trying to enjoy the quest. Their solution was to move the story outside the actual run which allowed the player time to read/see the content but also made the actual run feel less involved in what was going on.

Linaleah

YES. We want a story mode.

Amber322 wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

the quests were .. ugh, I cannot remember the word, not precisely instanced, but you would not see your friends your were grouped even while standing next to each other with if you were on a different leg of a quest, there is a specific word for it that I cannot remember right now.

"Phased" is the word you're looking for, I believe.

YES, thank you! that is exactly the word!

Sevn

I think it should be noted that ZOS makes content for profit. They're not now including ongoing stories in DLC dungeons to encourage grouping, they are seeking to get the casuals to buy more DLC packs, and I have to believe it's having a negative impact as I for one dropped my sub to avoid them and I'd assume story fans still aren't buying them.

I'm not interested in the lore and I can only imagine other players who aren't either get more and more irritated running these already more difficult content with players who want to experience the story. Even if it is a story I'm interested in I don't need or want to sit thru it half a dozen times. It's not the story players fault, it's ZOS's, but that irritation gets passed on to the players.

It's a win/win if they separate players interested in experiencing the story from the players only interested in beating the dungeon. More players buy dlc packs and speed runners/gearheads get a quick smooth run. How this is being missed is baffling to me.

snoozy

YES. We want a story mode.

Sevn wrote: »

It's a win/win if they separate players interested in experiencing the story from the players only interested in beating the dungeon. More players buy dlc packs and speed runners/gearheads get a quick smooth run. How this is being missed is baffling to me.

an excellent point that most people voting 'no' apparently don't get or maybe just didn't consider yet.

it is a win/win indeed!

Linaleah

YES. We want a story mode.

Sevn wrote: »

I think it should be noted that ZOS makes content for profit. They're not now including ongoing stories in DLC dungeons to encourage grouping, they are seeking to get the casuals to buy more DLC packs, and I have to believe it's having a negative impact as I for one dropped my sub to avoid them and I'd assume story fans still aren't buying them.

I'm not interested in the lore and I can only imagine other players who aren't either get more and more irritated running these already more difficult content with players who want to experience the story. Even if it is a story I'm interested in I don't need or want to sit thru it half a dozen times. It's not the story players fault, it's ZOS's, but that irritation gets passed on to the players.

It's a win/win if they separate players interested in experiencing the story from the players only interested in beating the dungeon. More players buy dlc packs and speed runners/gearheads get a quick smooth run. How this is being missed is baffling to me.

THANK YOU.

and as it was pointed out few pages ago, sometimes playing for story and playing for gear/mechanics - DOES overlap in the same player/person. BUT very rarely at the same time in the same run. when you plan to keep repeating a dungeon, you really want to bring it to maximum possible speed, so that you could run more dungeons in less time.

now.. i haven't dropped my sub to avoid DLC dungeons, but i HAVE almost entirely stopped doing randoms on max level characters. so... there's that.

Mannix1958

Yes. Although I don’t want a story mode, let people who want it have it.

Heelie wrote: »

Iccotak wrote: »

Heelie wrote: »

Normal dungeons are already very easy, I don't believe that cater to the lowest denominator. I don't believe all content should be accessible to the people that don't want to put in the effort to actually prepare for the content, already I think normal trials were a huge mistake, same goes for normal version of vet dungeons.

No content is that hard in this game that it's impossible to complete for a semi-casual player, from a story point of view.

Except the large majority of people asking for Solo are not looking for faster/easier ways to grind loot & XP. In fact people have already proposed a system that explicitly prevents people from gaining the dungeon rewards and would treat it like any overland quest.
Nor is this something only the lowest common denominator wants - as it has been requested by many veterans of the game that regularly do group content.

Most people that are requesting this feature want it so then they can take their time to explore the story & lore in the dungeon without being rushed by a group.
It's not controversial nor is it a big deal.
It is a reasonable request especially now that ZOS is now making the Dungeons even more connected to the main story of the Season.

you can solo any normal dungeon in the game using legendary gear and a single skill, so that is not argument for a story mode dungeon, plus it's an MMO it's supposed to be played with other people that is the entire point of online games.

Its also not true.

arun_rajputb16_ESO

YES. We want a story mode.

Yoshihito wrote: »

Might I suggest playing The Elder Scrolls 1-5? This is an MMO, not a single player game. There are other games for a solo experience.

ZOS have said over and over that TESO is not an MMORPG. It's a different kind of game.

The very first quest in the game is solo only

There are multiple quests that are solo only

This game is for solo, small groups, medium groups and large groups. There is plenty to do for all and every player, whether in a group or not.

TheFM

NO. Do not add a story mode.

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

curtisnewton wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

If you wanted a single player game, eso was never the game for you. ever. They cater to everyone, and you are not the crowd they are catering to when it comes to dungeons. And yes, demon dogs should be able to kill you quickly.

Tbh the game being mmo shouldn't affect the content available. Especially since the game has such a big casual community from TeS games. Now i agree that skill points should not be given on story mode (even though they are tied to the quest, so if it is implemented they will probably put it in anyway) because it will lower the initiative to go multiplayer for dungeon skill points (i would totally take all my tank toons for quick rushed story mode for skill points ez, and thats already a huge reason against it)

shifting to spending dev time on a story mode would take away somewhere else.

Do you think it is really a lot more than sth. Like:

If player count = 1
Then mobstrength factor = 0.2

?

Story mode sounds so big, but in fact.. Just being easier with weaker enemies would be already ok. As there is already a deep scaling mechanic in place I doubt much dev time was lost.
And gaining a 60% more happy player base (according to the polls) should be worth it anyway. And how can sth. Optional offend anyone is beyond me.

Same could be said about an instance for vet mode overland.

So you'd be cool with a vet overworld with no rewards? Because almost everyone who wants a vet overworld wants additional rewards while almost no one is asking for any type of reward for story mode dungeons, including that funky skill point you keep holding on to lol.

Anyone who has seen your posts knows the real reason why you are opposed to a story mode dungeon and in both instances you are in the minority. As you so nicely told another, if a challenging overworld is what you desire, ESO is not the game for you. It's a storybased MMO first and foremost.

Let that sink in.

No, if you put more effort in you get more rewards, as is the case in vet dungeons. More effort - more reward, less effort - less reward.

Exactly what I thought, you have zero interest in challenging content you just want extra rewards.

Let's be real here, for hardcore players,
the ones banging on about this challenging content is challenging the 1st time, maybe the 2nd as well. By the 3rd time you know what to expect and how to overcome it.

With that out of the way, you are now free to reap the additional rewards from "challenging" content that is no longer a challenge for you.

I found Maelstrom Arena extremely challenging the 1st few times, now it's a cakewalk.

I found Demon Souls challenging the 1st few times. No longer. Are they supposed to constantly redo overworld every update to keep up?

Nope, thereby leaving you what you really want, access to easy rewards because the content is no longer challenging.

Yes,go ahead and tell me what I think, clearly you know better than I do, that's hilarious.

I'm not. I'm simply telling you what I would do. As I said, if they were to introduce vet zones with increased rewards for free I'd be all over them. Why? Because I'm part of the tiny percentage of players that can complete hardcore content like Maelstrom and would take advantage of the system.

It wouldn't be long before I was mowing down this new content and start farming the daylights out of it for maximum profit. Hell I'd group up with other players who couldn't handle hardcore content but wanted access to the new shinys and sell carrys.

I'd make a killing off the mats alone since these zones would be barren like Craglorn. Just off the top of my head I can think of 3 or 4 ways to exploit these new challenges that are no longer challenging.

But I'm sure none of that even crossed your mind.*Rolls eyes*

Keep telling me what I think, tell me how things work. You clearly know better what I think than myself.

MornaBaine

YES. We want a story mode.

redlink1979 wrote: »

If you need to run dungeons in a "slow mode", run them with friends/guild mates willing to run them like this.

While this looks like a reasonable suggestion on the surface it CAN be difficult to get such a group together. If the story mode confers no rewards then there's no harm in making it a solo experience. Ideally you'd be able to group for it if you WANTED to experience it with your friends as well.

MornaBaine

YES. We want a story mode.

Fata1moose wrote: »

Solo mode dungeon yes, I don't quite want to call it "story mode" because that implies very easy combat. I want something a bit more where there are still mechanics but it scales for solo.

Also a veteran overland is something that needs to be added too on the opposite side of the spectrum it's too easy in groups or even solo for high level characters.

I feel like this is a separate issue but yes I'd LOVE to have all dungeons scale for a solo mode. I know some mechanics would have to be reworked though to allow solo play as there are things that require multiple players working in tandem to accomplish. So it might be too big a project for all the dungeons. But I would definitely like to see it implemented on the DLC dungeons. Even though I sub I buy the DLC that especially appeals to me. Thus far I have paid for no dungeons simply because I cannot solo them.

Strike_Maximus

YES. We want a story mode.

Personally I would love to see a story mode there really is no downside, some folks just want to experience the story and not rely on others to be patient or carry people who are just their for the story who may be inexperienced.
Give story mode limited rewards to prevent farming gear/money from being too easy and make it completely optional so those who are not interested don't have to deal with it, everyone is happy then.

As a side note, I believe adding a practice vet dungeon mode (with no rewards no XP ect) would be helpful to some as well to teach groups mechanics without doing the whole dungeon or only get to one part of the dungeon only to find that they can't finish. New dungeons on vet are getting more mechanic heavy and this practice mode would improve group performance and more people might be inclined to learn and try if they had this environment. And no you would not be devaluing achievements etc because technically you're doing this learning anyway when running in a normal/vet dungeon environment.

TheFM

NO. Do not add a story mode.

MornaBaine wrote: »

redlink1979 wrote: »

If you need to run dungeons in a "slow mode", run them with friends/guild mates willing to run them like this.

While this looks like a reasonable suggestion on the surface it CAN be difficult to get such a group together. If the story mode confers no rewards then there's no harm in making it a solo experience. Ideally you'd be able to group for it if you WANTED to experience it with your friends as well.

Step 1 : Log in to forums
Step 2 : Start a thread about starting aguild that focuses on story and lore in dungeons
Step 3 : Profit.

Sevn

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

curtisnewton wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

If you wanted a single player game, eso was never the game for you. ever. They cater to everyone, and you are not the crowd they are catering to when it comes to dungeons. And yes, demon dogs should be able to kill you quickly.

Tbh the game being mmo shouldn't affect the content available. Especially since the game has such a big casual community from TeS games. Now i agree that skill points should not be given on story mode (even though they are tied to the quest, so if it is implemented they will probably put it in anyway) because it will lower the initiative to go multiplayer for dungeon skill points (i would totally take all my tank toons for quick rushed story mode for skill points ez, and thats already a huge reason against it)

shifting to spending dev time on a story mode would take away somewhere else.

Do you think it is really a lot more than sth. Like:

If player count = 1
Then mobstrength factor = 0.2

?

Story mode sounds so big, but in fact.. Just being easier with weaker enemies would be already ok. As there is already a deep scaling mechanic in place I doubt much dev time was lost.
And gaining a 60% more happy player base (according to the polls) should be worth it anyway. And how can sth. Optional offend anyone is beyond me.

Same could be said about an instance for vet mode overland.

So you'd be cool with a vet overworld with no rewards? Because almost everyone who wants a vet overworld wants additional rewards while almost no one is asking for any type of reward for story mode dungeons, including that funky skill point you keep holding on to lol.

Anyone who has seen your posts knows the real reason why you are opposed to a story mode dungeon and in both instances you are in the minority. As you so nicely told another, if a challenging overworld is what you desire, ESO is not the game for you. It's a storybased MMO first and foremost.

Let that sink in.

No, if you put more effort in you get more rewards, as is the case in vet dungeons. More effort - more reward, less effort - less reward.

Exactly what I thought, you have zero interest in challenging content you just want extra rewards.

Let's be real here, for hardcore players,
the ones banging on about this challenging content is challenging the 1st time, maybe the 2nd as well. By the 3rd time you know what to expect and how to overcome it.

With that out of the way, you are now free to reap the additional rewards from "challenging" content that is no longer a challenge for you.

I found Maelstrom Arena extremely challenging the 1st few times, now it's a cakewalk.

I found Demon Souls challenging the 1st few times. No longer. Are they supposed to constantly redo overworld every update to keep up?

Nope, thereby leaving you what you really want, access to easy rewards because the content is no longer challenging.

Yes,go ahead and tell me what I think, clearly you know better than I do, that's hilarious.

I'm not. I'm simply telling you what I would do. As I said, if they were to introduce vet zones with increased rewards for free I'd be all over them. Why? Because I'm part of the tiny percentage of players that can complete hardcore content like Maelstrom and would take advantage of the system.

It wouldn't be long before I was mowing down this new content and start farming the daylights out of it for maximum profit. Hell I'd group up with other players who couldn't handle hardcore content but wanted access to the new shinys and sell carrys.

I'd make a killing off the mats alone since these zones would be barren like Craglorn. Just off the top of my head I can think of 3 or 4 ways to exploit these new challenges that are no longer challenging.

But I'm sure none of that even crossed your mind.*Rolls eyes*

Keep telling me what I think, tell me how things work. You clearly know better what I think than myself.

Well at least we agree I do know better and know how things work!

DreamsUnderStars

YES. We want a story mode.

FF14 had this thing for their irritatingly hard solo story intances where if you die on the first try you get an a buff that makes you stronger.

GW1 had henchmen that you could take with you out in the world zones, though your drops and gold were nerfed considerably.


I would like solo mode dungeons, but I would also like to have the devs actually play test their creations with a non-GM character, maybe a level 50 with only 80 CP and geared with greens or something.

snoozy

YES. We want a story mode.

BejaProphet wrote: »

I have become genuinely curious whether this is just a couple players making lots of noise or if this is something the community wants. So let’s get some numbers. Feel free to say why but please refrain from criticizing others or invalidating their view. There are several other threads where you have had that chance. Let’s let the numbers speak for themselves here.

669 votes as of right now, 78% in favour of story mode.

is this about the size of the regularly active forum population? i assume most people who saw this thread already voted by now...

can we get this to 1000 votes?

TheFM

NO. Do not add a story mode.

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

curtisnewton wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

If you wanted a single player game, eso was never the game for you. ever. They cater to everyone, and you are not the crowd they are catering to when it comes to dungeons. And yes, demon dogs should be able to kill you quickly.

Tbh the game being mmo shouldn't affect the content available. Especially since the game has such a big casual community from TeS games. Now i agree that skill points should not be given on story mode (even though they are tied to the quest, so if it is implemented they will probably put it in anyway) because it will lower the initiative to go multiplayer for dungeon skill points (i would totally take all my tank toons for quick rushed story mode for skill points ez, and thats already a huge reason against it)

shifting to spending dev time on a story mode would take away somewhere else.

Do you think it is really a lot more than sth. Like:

If player count = 1
Then mobstrength factor = 0.2

?

Story mode sounds so big, but in fact.. Just being easier with weaker enemies would be already ok. As there is already a deep scaling mechanic in place I doubt much dev time was lost.
And gaining a 60% more happy player base (according to the polls) should be worth it anyway. And how can sth. Optional offend anyone is beyond me.

Same could be said about an instance for vet mode overland.

So you'd be cool with a vet overworld with no rewards? Because almost everyone who wants a vet overworld wants additional rewards while almost no one is asking for any type of reward for story mode dungeons, including that funky skill point you keep holding on to lol.

Anyone who has seen your posts knows the real reason why you are opposed to a story mode dungeon and in both instances you are in the minority. As you so nicely told another, if a challenging overworld is what you desire, ESO is not the game for you. It's a storybased MMO first and foremost.

Let that sink in.

No, if you put more effort in you get more rewards, as is the case in vet dungeons. More effort - more reward, less effort - less reward.

Exactly what I thought, you have zero interest in challenging content you just want extra rewards.

Let's be real here, for hardcore players,
the ones banging on about this challenging content is challenging the 1st time, maybe the 2nd as well. By the 3rd time you know what to expect and how to overcome it.

With that out of the way, you are now free to reap the additional rewards from "challenging" content that is no longer a challenge for you.

I found Maelstrom Arena extremely challenging the 1st few times, now it's a cakewalk.

I found Demon Souls challenging the 1st few times. No longer. Are they supposed to constantly redo overworld every update to keep up?

Nope, thereby leaving you what you really want, access to easy rewards because the content is no longer challenging.

Yes,go ahead and tell me what I think, clearly you know better than I do, that's hilarious.

I'm not. I'm simply telling you what I would do. As I said, if they were to introduce vet zones with increased rewards for free I'd be all over them. Why? Because I'm part of the tiny percentage of players that can complete hardcore content like Maelstrom and would take advantage of the system.

It wouldn't be long before I was mowing down this new content and start farming the daylights out of it for maximum profit. Hell I'd group up with other players who couldn't handle hardcore content but wanted access to the new shinys and sell carrys.

I'd make a killing off the mats alone since these zones would be barren like Craglorn. Just off the top of my head I can think of 3 or 4 ways to exploit these new challenges that are no longer challenging.

But I'm sure none of that even crossed your mind.*Rolls eyes*

Keep telling me what I think, tell me how things work. You clearly know better what I think than myself.

Well at least we agree I do know better and know how things work!

Yep, clearly you know better than I do what I think. You should call the CIA, they need people who are psychic.

snoozy wrote: »

BejaProphet wrote: »

I have become genuinely curious whether this is just a couple players making lots of noise or if this is something the community wants. So let’s get some numbers. Feel free to say why but please refrain from criticizing others or invalidating their view. There are several other threads where you have had that chance. Let’s let the numbers speak for themselves here.

669 votes as of right now, 78% in favour of story mode.

is this about the size of the regularly active forum population? i assume most people who saw this thread already voted by now...

can we get this to 1000 votes?

You can get all the yes man votes you want, until you send out an email to all players or isn't even nearly representative of the actual population.

TheFM

NO. Do not add a story mode.

zvavi wrote: »

Two main downsides.
1. More instances on the server side means more lag, rip PC EU.
2. Some players that came for the single player, have stayed for the multiplayer, if dungeons had story mode, those players wouldnt stay, and eso would lose customers.
3. Stop flooding the forums with the same thread.

Oh the mimimi is strong with them, until the game suits their needs 100 percent, they won't be happy

zvavi

NO. Do not add a story mode.

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

curtisnewton wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

If you wanted a single player game, eso was never the game for you. ever. They cater to everyone, and you are not the crowd they are catering to when it comes to dungeons. And yes, demon dogs should be able to kill you quickly.

Tbh the game being mmo shouldn't affect the content available. Especially since the game has such a big casual community from TeS games. Now i agree that skill points should not be given on story mode (even though they are tied to the quest, so if it is implemented they will probably put it in anyway) because it will lower the initiative to go multiplayer for dungeon skill points (i would totally take all my tank toons for quick rushed story mode for skill points ez, and thats already a huge reason against it)

shifting to spending dev time on a story mode would take away somewhere else.

Do you think it is really a lot more than sth. Like:

If player count = 1
Then mobstrength factor = 0.2

?

Story mode sounds so big, but in fact.. Just being easier with weaker enemies would be already ok. As there is already a deep scaling mechanic in place I doubt much dev time was lost.
And gaining a 60% more happy player base (according to the polls) should be worth it anyway. And how can sth. Optional offend anyone is beyond me.

Same could be said about an instance for vet mode overland.

So you'd be cool with a vet overworld with no rewards? Because almost everyone who wants a vet overworld wants additional rewards while almost no one is asking for any type of reward for story mode dungeons, including that funky skill point you keep holding on to lol.

Anyone who has seen your posts knows the real reason why you are opposed to a story mode dungeon and in both instances you are in the minority. As you so nicely told another, if a challenging overworld is what you desire, ESO is not the game for you. It's a storybased MMO first and foremost.

Let that sink in.

No, if you put more effort in you get more rewards, as is the case in vet dungeons. More effort - more reward, less effort - less reward.

Exactly what I thought, you have zero interest in challenging content you just want extra rewards.

Let's be real here, for hardcore players,
the ones banging on about this challenging content is challenging the 1st time, maybe the 2nd as well. By the 3rd time you know what to expect and how to overcome it.

With that out of the way, you are now free to reap the additional rewards from "challenging" content that is no longer a challenge for you.

I found Maelstrom Arena extremely challenging the 1st few times, now it's a cakewalk.

I found Demon Souls challenging the 1st few times. No longer. Are they supposed to constantly redo overworld every update to keep up?

Nope, thereby leaving you what you really want, access to easy rewards because the content is no longer challenging.

Yes,go ahead and tell me what I think, clearly you know better than I do, that's hilarious.

I'm not. I'm simply telling you what I would do. As I said, if they were to introduce vet zones with increased rewards for free I'd be all over them. Why? Because I'm part of the tiny percentage of players that can complete hardcore content like Maelstrom and would take advantage of the system.

It wouldn't be long before I was mowing down this new content and start farming the daylights out of it for maximum profit. Hell I'd group up with other players who couldn't handle hardcore content but wanted access to the new shinys and sell carrys.

I'd make a killing off the mats alone since these zones would be barren like Craglorn. Just off the top of my head I can think of 3 or 4 ways to exploit these new challenges that are no longer challenging.

But I'm sure none of that even crossed your mind.*Rolls eyes*

Keep telling me what I think, tell me how things work. You clearly know better what I think than myself.

Well at least we agree I do know better and know how things work!

Yep, clearly you know better than I do what I think. You should call the CIA, they need people who are psychic.

snoozy wrote: »

BejaProphet wrote: »

I have become genuinely curious whether this is just a couple players making lots of noise or if this is something the community wants. So let’s get some numbers. Feel free to say why but please refrain from criticizing others or invalidating their view. There are several other threads where you have had that chance. Let’s let the numbers speak for themselves here.

669 votes as of right now, 78% in favour of story mode.

is this about the size of the regularly active forum population? i assume most people who saw this thread already voted by now...

can we get this to 1000 votes?

You can get all the yes man votes you want, until you send out an email to all players or isn't even nearly representative of the actual population.

I actually think that it represents the community quite well, probably biased towards the anti side more than you think (actual community vote would probably pass the 80% ez)

HappyLittleTree

YES. We want a story mode.

Yes but without gear rewards.

snoozy

YES. We want a story mode.

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

curtisnewton wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

If you wanted a single player game, eso was never the game for you. ever. They cater to everyone, and you are not the crowd they are catering to when it comes to dungeons. And yes, demon dogs should be able to kill you quickly.

Tbh the game being mmo shouldn't affect the content available. Especially since the game has such a big casual community from TeS games. Now i agree that skill points should not be given on story mode (even though they are tied to the quest, so if it is implemented they will probably put it in anyway) because it will lower the initiative to go multiplayer for dungeon skill points (i would totally take all my tank toons for quick rushed story mode for skill points ez, and thats already a huge reason against it)

shifting to spending dev time on a story mode would take away somewhere else.

Do you think it is really a lot more than sth. Like:

If player count = 1
Then mobstrength factor = 0.2

?

Story mode sounds so big, but in fact.. Just being easier with weaker enemies would be already ok. As there is already a deep scaling mechanic in place I doubt much dev time was lost.
And gaining a 60% more happy player base (according to the polls) should be worth it anyway. And how can sth. Optional offend anyone is beyond me.

Same could be said about an instance for vet mode overland.

So you'd be cool with a vet overworld with no rewards? Because almost everyone who wants a vet overworld wants additional rewards while almost no one is asking for any type of reward for story mode dungeons, including that funky skill point you keep holding on to lol.

Anyone who has seen your posts knows the real reason why you are opposed to a story mode dungeon and in both instances you are in the minority. As you so nicely told another, if a challenging overworld is what you desire, ESO is not the game for you. It's a storybased MMO first and foremost.

Let that sink in.

No, if you put more effort in you get more rewards, as is the case in vet dungeons. More effort - more reward, less effort - less reward.

Exactly what I thought, you have zero interest in challenging content you just want extra rewards.

Let's be real here, for hardcore players,
the ones banging on about this challenging content is challenging the 1st time, maybe the 2nd as well. By the 3rd time you know what to expect and how to overcome it.

With that out of the way, you are now free to reap the additional rewards from "challenging" content that is no longer a challenge for you.

I found Maelstrom Arena extremely challenging the 1st few times, now it's a cakewalk.

I found Demon Souls challenging the 1st few times. No longer. Are they supposed to constantly redo overworld every update to keep up?

Nope, thereby leaving you what you really want, access to easy rewards because the content is no longer challenging.

Yes,go ahead and tell me what I think, clearly you know better than I do, that's hilarious.

I'm not. I'm simply telling you what I would do. As I said, if they were to introduce vet zones with increased rewards for free I'd be all over them. Why? Because I'm part of the tiny percentage of players that can complete hardcore content like Maelstrom and would take advantage of the system.

It wouldn't be long before I was mowing down this new content and start farming the daylights out of it for maximum profit. Hell I'd group up with other players who couldn't handle hardcore content but wanted access to the new shinys and sell carrys.

I'd make a killing off the mats alone since these zones would be barren like Craglorn. Just off the top of my head I can think of 3 or 4 ways to exploit these new challenges that are no longer challenging.

But I'm sure none of that even crossed your mind.*Rolls eyes*

Keep telling me what I think, tell me how things work. You clearly know better what I think than myself.

Well at least we agree I do know better and know how things work!

Yep, clearly you know better than I do what I think. You should call the CIA, they need people who are psychic.

snoozy wrote: »

BejaProphet wrote: »

I have become genuinely curious whether this is just a couple players making lots of noise or if this is something the community wants. So let’s get some numbers. Feel free to say why but please refrain from criticizing others or invalidating their view. There are several other threads where you have had that chance. Let’s let the numbers speak for themselves here.

669 votes as of right now, 78% in favour of story mode.

is this about the size of the regularly active forum population? i assume most people who saw this thread already voted by now...

can we get this to 1000 votes?

You can get all the yes man votes you want, until you send out an email to all players or isn't even nearly representative of the actual population.

I actually think that it represents the community quite well, probably biased towards the anti side more than you think (actual community vote would probably pass the 80% ez)

i agree. especially with greymoor that even more skyrim fans are gonna get into the game.

it would be interesting to get an actual representative survey, but i assume the majority of the playerbase could be considered "casuals" (not meant in a condescending way)

TheFM

NO. Do not add a story mode.

snoozy wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

Sevn wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

curtisnewton wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

zvavi wrote: »

TheFM wrote: »

If you wanted a single player game, eso was never the game for you. ever. They cater to everyone, and you are not the crowd they are catering to when it comes to dungeons. And yes, demon dogs should be able to kill you quickly.

Tbh the game being mmo shouldn't affect the content available. Especially since the game has such a big casual community from TeS games. Now i agree that skill points should not be given on story mode (even though they are tied to the quest, so if it is implemented they will probably put it in anyway) because it will lower the initiative to go multiplayer for dungeon skill points (i would totally take all my tank toons for quick rushed story mode for skill points ez, and thats already a huge reason against it)

shifting to spending dev time on a story mode would take away somewhere else.

Do you think it is really a lot more than sth. Like:

If player count = 1
Then mobstrength factor = 0.2

?

Story mode sounds so big, but in fact.. Just being easier with weaker enemies would be already ok. As there is already a deep scaling mechanic in place I doubt much dev time was lost.
And gaining a 60% more happy player base (according to the polls) should be worth it anyway. And how can sth. Optional offend anyone is beyond me.

Same could be said about an instance for vet mode overland.

So you'd be cool with a vet overworld with no rewards? Because almost everyone who wants a vet overworld wants additional rewards while almost no one is asking for any type of reward for story mode dungeons, including that funky skill point you keep holding on to lol.

Anyone who has seen your posts knows the real reason why you are opposed to a story mode dungeon and in both instances you are in the minority. As you so nicely told another, if a challenging overworld is what you desire, ESO is not the game for you. It's a storybased MMO first and foremost.

Let that sink in.

No, if you put more effort in you get more rewards, as is the case in vet dungeons. More effort - more reward, less effort - less reward.

Exactly what I thought, you have zero interest in challenging content you just want extra rewards.

Let's be real here, for hardcore players,
the ones banging on about this challenging content is challenging the 1st time, maybe the 2nd as well. By the 3rd time you know what to expect and how to overcome it.

With that out of the way, you are now free to reap the additional rewards from "challenging" content that is no longer a challenge for you.

I found Maelstrom Arena extremely challenging the 1st few times, now it's a cakewalk.

I found Demon Souls challenging the 1st few times. No longer. Are they supposed to constantly redo overworld every update to keep up?

Nope, thereby leaving you what you really want, access to easy rewards because the content is no longer challenging.

Yes,go ahead and tell me what I think, clearly you know better than I do, that's hilarious.

I'm not. I'm simply telling you what I would do. As I said, if they were to introduce vet zones with increased rewards for free I'd be all over them. Why? Because I'm part of the tiny percentage of players that can complete hardcore content like Maelstrom and would take advantage of the system.

It wouldn't be long before I was mowing down this new content and start farming the daylights out of it for maximum profit. Hell I'd group up with other players who couldn't handle hardcore content but wanted access to the new shinys and sell carrys.

I'd make a killing off the mats alone since these zones would be barren like Craglorn. Just off the top of my head I can think of 3 or 4 ways to exploit these new challenges that are no longer challenging.

But I'm sure none of that even crossed your mind.*Rolls eyes*

Keep telling me what I think, tell me how things work. You clearly know better what I think than myself.

Well at least we agree I do know better and know how things work!

Yep, clearly you know better than I do what I think. You should call the CIA, they need people who are psychic.

snoozy wrote: »

BejaProphet wrote: »

I have become genuinely curious whether this is just a couple players making lots of noise or if this is something the community wants. So let’s get some numbers. Feel free to say why but please refrain from criticizing others or invalidating their view. There are several other threads where you have had that chance. Let’s let the numbers speak for themselves here.

669 votes as of right now, 78% in favour of story mode.

is this about the size of the regularly active forum population? i assume most people who saw this thread already voted by now...

can we get this to 1000 votes?

You can get all the yes man votes you want, until you send out an email to all players or isn't even nearly representative of the actual population.

I actually think that it represents the community quite well, probably biased towards the anti side more than you think (actual community vote would probably pass the 80% ez)

i agree. especially with greymoor that even more skyrim fans are gonna get into the game.

it would be interesting to get an actual representative survey, but i assume the majority of the playerbase could be considered "casuals" (not meant in a condescending way)

So if solo players flood the game for one month out of the year, we should change the entire five year design to suit them? No.

A solo mode without any meaningful rewards is the only option. Ironically we had a poll asking for harder overland and it also got majority yes votes. Which clearly demonstrates bias toward voters.