ZOS! 1 billion+ GOLD LAUNDERING !! - (it was, now 1.25 billion+) please prioritize it.

Sanguinor2

Goregrinder wrote: »

By itself, it is just evidence of someone trying to sell items for millions of gold, which is not against any rules.

Actually it Shows that items have been sold for millions of Gold not listed.
But what made it go beyond the Status of only showing that something has been sold for that much? People having suspicions? Or was it Zos saying that they investigated this? Because that would place us at quite the conondrum.

Goregrinder

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

By itself, it is just evidence of someone trying to sell items for millions of gold, which is not against any rules.

Actually it Shows that items have been sold for millions of Gold not listed.
But what made it go beyond the Status of only showing that something has been sold for that much? People having suspicions? Or was it Zos saying that they investigated this? Because that would place us at quite the conondrum.

So what would cause an item to be sold, but not be listed?

Sanguinor2

Goregrinder wrote: »

So what would cause an item to be sold, but not be listed?

An item being sold on a Guild store trading history means it was listed per se, but it merely being listed doesnt mean its sold, quite a difference between These two Im afraid. Or in other words, an item sold through a Guild store cannot be not listed but a listed item in a Guild store must not necessarily be sold through it.
An item like a Grape just being listed for 10mil is weird enough in itself but seeing it and a lot of other worthless items being sold for a same or higher amount is a much bigger indicator of something being wrong, thus me pointing out your mistake.

Goregrinder

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

So what would cause an item to be sold, but not be listed?

An item being sold on a Guild store trading history means it was listed per se, but it merely being listed doesnt mean its sold, quite a difference between These two Im afraid. Or in other words, an item sold through a Guild store cannot be not listed but a listed item in a Guild store must not necessarily be sold through it.
An item like a Grape just being listed for 10mil is weird enough in itself but seeing it and a lot of other worthless items being sold for a same or higher amount is a much bigger indicator of something being wrong, thus me pointing out your mistake.

Yes, people can list something like a grape for 10 million. They can list all of their grapes for that much. That's how a free market works. Whether other people buy it or not, is another story. You're saying it is against ZOS's TOS to list any item they want for any price they want?

Sanguinor2

Goregrinder wrote: »

Yes, people can list something like a grape for 10 million. They can list all of their grapes for that much. That's how a free market works. Whether other people buy it or not, is another story. You're saying it is against ZOS's TOS to list any item they want for any price they want?

That is exactly NOT what I am saying. Do they not teach reading comprehension anymore? I say it is weird, not that it is a reportable offense.

VaranisArano

Just a reminder that ZOS does not require players to furnish physical proof or server side evidence of wrongdoing when making a report, though detailed reports with screenshots and video are appreciated.

You can read it in their own words here:

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys,

We know that cheating players and botters takes away from your experience in the game, and also affects important aspects such as the economy or scoring. We do take this very seriously, and appreciate everyone who brings these to our attention. For the record, we are aware of the sites called out from the OP. While we can’t discuss specifics, we do our best to combat sites and programs that encourage breaking our Terms of Service.

As far as what you can do to help, telling us is the first step. If you run across someone you believe is cheating (whether it’s botting or exploiting), please report them. You can do so in-game or simply by messaging a staff member on the forums (it can be me, Jess, or any of the moderators). Keep in mind our TOS team suspends and bans botting accounts daily, and investigations are prioritized based on the number of reports received.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4563086#Comment_4563086

Comment by ZOS_JesC: "Greetings, if you'd like to submit a report, we highly encourage you to submit a support ticket here: help.elderscrollsonline.com/app and provide as much information as possible. Screenshots and videos are always helpful."
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6475949#Comment_6475949


In short, extra evidence like video and screenshots are helpful, but in no way does ZOS require them. Obviously, ZOS does NOT require players to furnish server-side data or physical proof before making a report.

In ESO, it's ZOS' standards that matter. I'm going to follow the guidelines the Devs describe when I report players demonstrating suspicious behavior. (And so did the OP of this thread.)

idk

Goregrinder wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

And, i have yet to see anything legitimate sell for more than 2 or 3 million. And those are a few certain rare items. It would not take much to stop these stupid high sales. Or ban people based on these sales until they make their case they are a legitimate player.

LOL do you hear yourself? In civilized societies, the burden of proof is on the accusers. Why should some random player have to prove their innocence? What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

This is exactly the kind of behaviour I've seen in this thread, and I'm right to condemn it. Now the mob is coming after me:

It is appropriate for a player to bring these concerned to Zos. It is up to Zos to look into it and see if they can find any wrong doing that is actionable. Petty bickering about it in the forums is meaningless as it serves no purpose. Well, none except to keep this thread active.

I feel like if ZOS investigates, finds no wrong doing, than the accuser should be punished for false accusations. A 1-year ban should be good for first time offenders.

I feel like now when ZoS investigated and it was confirmed there was in fact wrong doing people who wanted 1 year ban for someone who reported it should be punished for disencouraging people from doing right thing which is basically helping cheaters to cheat. A 1 year ban should be good. Dont You think @Goregrinder ?

I don't think you understand. If you rightfully accuse someone, and they get convicted, you should not be punished. But in order to rightfully accuse someone, you need evidence. Like when you go to the police and hand them security footage, phone GPS records, and they collect the suspects DNA at the scene of the crime, etc. Your accusation is then based on a mountain of physical evidence. That is what it takes to rightfully accuse someone.

But if you just see someone listing a 10 year old PC for 20,000 on ebay or criagslist, and you just "don't like it", you should be punished for falsely accusing them if the local police do an investigation and found out that the dude you accused is simply a hustler trying to make a buck or two. Otherwise, why not just accuse everyone we see, you know...."just in case".....everyone is guilty unless they can 100% prove they are innocent right?

I do not think you understand. It is pretty simple. When we report someone we are not saying they in fact did something and should be reported. We are very literally suggesting the actions appear fishy and warrant a review even if sometimes we get a little excited about it.

Your Ebay example is just a hypothetical and your argument is based on a false report. OP provided real information. Your view point here lacks the logic required for it to stand. That is a fact.

idk

VaranisArano wrote: »

Just a reminder that ZOS does not require players to furnish physical proof or server side evidence of wrongdoing when making a report, though detailed reports with screenshots and video are appreciated.

You can read it in their own words here:

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys,

We know that cheating players and botters takes away from your experience in the game, and also affects important aspects such as the economy or scoring. We do take this very seriously, and appreciate everyone who brings these to our attention. For the record, we are aware of the sites called out from the OP. While we can’t discuss specifics, we do our best to combat sites and programs that encourage breaking our Terms of Service.

As far as what you can do to help, telling us is the first step. If you run across someone you believe is cheating (whether it’s botting or exploiting), please report them. You can do so in-game or simply by messaging a staff member on the forums (it can be me, Jess, or any of the moderators). Keep in mind our TOS team suspends and bans botting accounts daily, and investigations are prioritized based on the number of reports received.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4563086#Comment_4563086

Comment by ZOS_JesC: "Greetings, if you'd like to submit a report, we highly encourage you to submit a support ticket here: help.elderscrollsonline.com/app and provide as much information as possible. Screenshots and videos are always helpful."
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6475949#Comment_6475949


In short, extra evidence like video and screenshots are helpful, but in no way does ZOS require them. Obviously, ZOS does NOT require players to furnish server-side data or physical proof before making a report.

In ESO, it's ZOS' standards that matter. I'm going to follow the guidelines the Devs describe when I report players demonstrating suspicious behavior. (And so did the OP of this thread.)

Thanks for posting this information. What Zos says on the matter is all that counts. Anyone can have their own opinion on the mater but these are the facts on how it is to be handled so case closed.

Goregrinder

VaranisArano wrote: »

Just a reminder that ZOS does not require players to furnish physical proof or server side evidence of wrongdoing when making a report, though detailed reports with screenshots and video are appreciated.

You can read it in their own words here:

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys,

We know that cheating players and botters takes away from your experience in the game, and also affects important aspects such as the economy or scoring. We do take this very seriously, and appreciate everyone who brings these to our attention. For the record, we are aware of the sites called out from the OP. While we can’t discuss specifics, we do our best to combat sites and programs that encourage breaking our Terms of Service.

As far as what you can do to help, telling us is the first step. If you run across someone you believe is cheating (whether it’s botting or exploiting), please report them. You can do so in-game or simply by messaging a staff member on the forums (it can be me, Jess, or any of the moderators). Keep in mind our TOS team suspends and bans botting accounts daily, and investigations are prioritized based on the number of reports received.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4563086#Comment_4563086

Comment by ZOS_JesC: "Greetings, if you'd like to submit a report, we highly encourage you to submit a support ticket here: help.elderscrollsonline.com/app and provide as much information as possible. Screenshots and videos are always helpful."
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6475949#Comment_6475949


In short, extra evidence like video and screenshots are helpful, but in no way does ZOS require them. Obviously, ZOS does NOT require players to furnish server-side data or physical proof before making a report.

In ESO, it's ZOS' standards that matter. I'm going to follow the guidelines the Devs describe when I report players demonstrating suspicious behavior. (And so did the OP of this thread.)

That is good news then, means there are no requirements to report anyone I see of anything that appears suspect.

Goregrinder

idk wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

And, i have yet to see anything legitimate sell for more than 2 or 3 million. And those are a few certain rare items. It would not take much to stop these stupid high sales. Or ban people based on these sales until they make their case they are a legitimate player.

LOL do you hear yourself? In civilized societies, the burden of proof is on the accusers. Why should some random player have to prove their innocence? What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

This is exactly the kind of behaviour I've seen in this thread, and I'm right to condemn it. Now the mob is coming after me:

It is appropriate for a player to bring these concerned to Zos. It is up to Zos to look into it and see if they can find any wrong doing that is actionable. Petty bickering about it in the forums is meaningless as it serves no purpose. Well, none except to keep this thread active.

I feel like if ZOS investigates, finds no wrong doing, than the accuser should be punished for false accusations. A 1-year ban should be good for first time offenders.

I feel like now when ZoS investigated and it was confirmed there was in fact wrong doing people who wanted 1 year ban for someone who reported it should be punished for disencouraging people from doing right thing which is basically helping cheaters to cheat. A 1 year ban should be good. Dont You think @Goregrinder ?

I don't think you understand. If you rightfully accuse someone, and they get convicted, you should not be punished. But in order to rightfully accuse someone, you need evidence. Like when you go to the police and hand them security footage, phone GPS records, and they collect the suspects DNA at the scene of the crime, etc. Your accusation is then based on a mountain of physical evidence. That is what it takes to rightfully accuse someone.

But if you just see someone listing a 10 year old PC for 20,000 on ebay or criagslist, and you just "don't like it", you should be punished for falsely accusing them if the local police do an investigation and found out that the dude you accused is simply a hustler trying to make a buck or two. Otherwise, why not just accuse everyone we see, you know...."just in case".....everyone is guilty unless they can 100% prove they are innocent right?

I do not think you understand. It is pretty simple. When we report someone we are not saying they in fact did something and should be reported. We are very literally suggesting the actions appear fishy and warrant a review even if sometimes we get a little excited about it.

Your Ebay example is just a hypothetical and your argument is based on a false report. OP provided real information. Your view point here lacks the logic required for it to stand. That is a fact.

His Screenshot shows someone listing items for XX amount of gold....yeah...people sell stuff for whatever amount they want, it's not my business if someone has a billion gold and I don't, or wants to sell a grape for 10 billion gold. If they find a buyer, that's not my business, it's not my gold either way.

idk

Goregrinder wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

And, i have yet to see anything legitimate sell for more than 2 or 3 million. And those are a few certain rare items. It would not take much to stop these stupid high sales. Or ban people based on these sales until they make their case they are a legitimate player.

LOL do you hear yourself? In civilized societies, the burden of proof is on the accusers. Why should some random player have to prove their innocence? What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

This is exactly the kind of behaviour I've seen in this thread, and I'm right to condemn it. Now the mob is coming after me:

It is appropriate for a player to bring these concerned to Zos. It is up to Zos to look into it and see if they can find any wrong doing that is actionable. Petty bickering about it in the forums is meaningless as it serves no purpose. Well, none except to keep this thread active.

I feel like if ZOS investigates, finds no wrong doing, than the accuser should be punished for false accusations. A 1-year ban should be good for first time offenders.

I feel like now when ZoS investigated and it was confirmed there was in fact wrong doing people who wanted 1 year ban for someone who reported it should be punished for disencouraging people from doing right thing which is basically helping cheaters to cheat. A 1 year ban should be good. Dont You think @Goregrinder ?

I don't think you understand. If you rightfully accuse someone, and they get convicted, you should not be punished. But in order to rightfully accuse someone, you need evidence. Like when you go to the police and hand them security footage, phone GPS records, and they collect the suspects DNA at the scene of the crime, etc. Your accusation is then based on a mountain of physical evidence. That is what it takes to rightfully accuse someone.

But if you just see someone listing a 10 year old PC for 20,000 on ebay or criagslist, and you just "don't like it", you should be punished for falsely accusing them if the local police do an investigation and found out that the dude you accused is simply a hustler trying to make a buck or two. Otherwise, why not just accuse everyone we see, you know...."just in case".....everyone is guilty unless they can 100% prove they are innocent right?

I do not think you understand. It is pretty simple. When we report someone we are not saying they in fact did something and should be reported. We are very literally suggesting the actions appear fishy and warrant a review even if sometimes we get a little excited about it.

Your Ebay example is just a hypothetical and your argument is based on a false report. OP provided real information. Your view point here lacks the logic required for it to stand. That is a fact.

His Screenshot shows someone listing items for XX amount of gold....yeah...people sell stuff for whatever amount they want, it's not my business if someone has a billion gold and I don't, or wants to sell a grape for 10 billion gold. If they find a buyer, that's not my business, it's not my gold either way.

Of course the screen shots show items selling for huge amounts of gold. That is not in question.

A reasonable mind could easily find those transactions look a little fishy and Zos clearly agreed and investigated.

What is great about this is we are encouraged to report this behavior and even better those who run the bots and sell gold are pissed. I think it is funny the pathetic gold sellers are fuming. They likely lost few customers and more.

Juhasow

Goregrinder wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

And, i have yet to see anything legitimate sell for more than 2 or 3 million. And those are a few certain rare items. It would not take much to stop these stupid high sales. Or ban people based on these sales until they make their case they are a legitimate player.

LOL do you hear yourself? In civilized societies, the burden of proof is on the accusers. Why should some random player have to prove their innocence? What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

This is exactly the kind of behaviour I've seen in this thread, and I'm right to condemn it. Now the mob is coming after me:

It is appropriate for a player to bring these concerned to Zos. It is up to Zos to look into it and see if they can find any wrong doing that is actionable. Petty bickering about it in the forums is meaningless as it serves no purpose. Well, none except to keep this thread active.

I feel like if ZOS investigates, finds no wrong doing, than the accuser should be punished for false accusations. A 1-year ban should be good for first time offenders.

I feel like now when ZoS investigated and it was confirmed there was in fact wrong doing people who wanted 1 year ban for someone who reported it should be punished for disencouraging people from doing right thing which is basically helping cheaters to cheat. A 1 year ban should be good. Dont You think @Goregrinder ?

I don't think you understand. If you rightfully accuse someone, and they get convicted, you should not be punished. But in order to rightfully accuse someone, you need evidence. Like when you go to the police and hand them security footage, phone GPS records, and they collect the suspects DNA at the scene of the crime, etc. Your accusation is then based on a mountain of physical evidence. That is what it takes to rightfully accuse someone.

But if you just see someone listing a 10 year old PC for 20,000 on ebay or criagslist, and you just "don't like it", you should be punished for falsely accusing them if the local police do an investigation and found out that the dude you accused is simply a hustler trying to make a buck or two. Otherwise, why not just accuse everyone we see, you know...."just in case".....everyone is guilty unless they can 100% prove they are innocent right?

Oh boy. It's like reading a post made by an alien that landed on earth and now tries to blend in. I dont think You understand. I dont even think You understand what "rightfull accusation" means. For the record it's not You who'll get security footage and GPS records of someone who You're accusing of something. You think You can just walk into security agency and tell them to hand over their recordings ? You think You can just ask GPS provider to give You their recordings ? I dont think so. You know who can get those recordings for You ? Police. You know when they'll get them ? When You'll report a crime or violation. And it'll be up to police and later on up to court wheter or not Your accusation was rightfull. Same goes for ESO. We as a players have no acces to data that will give us physical evidence that certain violation was commited. All we have are speculations. Only ZoS have acces to data that will prove beyond any doubt that something happened so if we have any doubts about certain behavious of people in game we're encouraged to report those doubts. And if at the end it turns out those people were not rightfully accused nothing happens because ZoS have the data that will prove their innocence and we couldnt know for sure until we've informed ZoS.

And let me quote You once again Terms of Service :

You agree not to access, receive, play or use any Service to:...

Promote, upload, transmit, encourage or take part in any activity involving hacking, cracking, phishing, taking advantage of exploits or cheats and/or distribution of counterfeit software and/or Virtual Currency or virtual items. In an effort to continuously improve the Services, You and other players discovering exploits, cheats, cracks or other inconsistencies are required to report them to ZeniMax;

You know what inconsistency means ? It means something is inconsistent. Dont You think that if certain item price was always under 1k and then suddenly it's being sold for 10M there is some inconsistency there ? And for the record OP was not accusing anyone by the name. He just brought up certain inconsistencies and he linked a screenshot but without revealing any names so there was no naming and shaming involved. He did perfect job. Something that cannot be told about You. You are trying to tell us that we need to collect physical evidence of some ToS violation before we're even able to report it. Nothing like that is needed and it's not You who are making the law here.

Goregrinder

idk wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

And, i have yet to see anything legitimate sell for more than 2 or 3 million. And those are a few certain rare items. It would not take much to stop these stupid high sales. Or ban people based on these sales until they make their case they are a legitimate player.

LOL do you hear yourself? In civilized societies, the burden of proof is on the accusers. Why should some random player have to prove their innocence? What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

This is exactly the kind of behaviour I've seen in this thread, and I'm right to condemn it. Now the mob is coming after me:

It is appropriate for a player to bring these concerned to Zos. It is up to Zos to look into it and see if they can find any wrong doing that is actionable. Petty bickering about it in the forums is meaningless as it serves no purpose. Well, none except to keep this thread active.

I feel like if ZOS investigates, finds no wrong doing, than the accuser should be punished for false accusations. A 1-year ban should be good for first time offenders.

I feel like now when ZoS investigated and it was confirmed there was in fact wrong doing people who wanted 1 year ban for someone who reported it should be punished for disencouraging people from doing right thing which is basically helping cheaters to cheat. A 1 year ban should be good. Dont You think @Goregrinder ?

I don't think you understand. If you rightfully accuse someone, and they get convicted, you should not be punished. But in order to rightfully accuse someone, you need evidence. Like when you go to the police and hand them security footage, phone GPS records, and they collect the suspects DNA at the scene of the crime, etc. Your accusation is then based on a mountain of physical evidence. That is what it takes to rightfully accuse someone.

But if you just see someone listing a 10 year old PC for 20,000 on ebay or criagslist, and you just "don't like it", you should be punished for falsely accusing them if the local police do an investigation and found out that the dude you accused is simply a hustler trying to make a buck or two. Otherwise, why not just accuse everyone we see, you know...."just in case".....everyone is guilty unless they can 100% prove they are innocent right?

I do not think you understand. It is pretty simple. When we report someone we are not saying they in fact did something and should be reported. We are very literally suggesting the actions appear fishy and warrant a review even if sometimes we get a little excited about it.

Your Ebay example is just a hypothetical and your argument is based on a false report. OP provided real information. Your view point here lacks the logic required for it to stand. That is a fact.

His Screenshot shows someone listing items for XX amount of gold....yeah...people sell stuff for whatever amount they want, it's not my business if someone has a billion gold and I don't, or wants to sell a grape for 10 billion gold. If they find a buyer, that's not my business, it's not my gold either way.

Of course the screen shots show items selling for huge amounts of gold. That is not in question.

A reasonable mind could easily find those transactions look a little fishy and Zos clearly agreed and investigated.

What is great about this is we are encouraged to report this behavior and even better those who run the bots and sell gold are pissed. I think it is funny the pathetic gold sellers are fuming. They likely lost few customers and more.

So any player listing items for more than what you personally think they should sell it for is "suspicious"?

VaranisArano

Goregrinder wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Just a reminder that ZOS does not require players to furnish physical proof or server side evidence of wrongdoing when making a report, though detailed reports with screenshots and video are appreciated.

You can read it in their own words here:

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys,

We know that cheating players and botters takes away from your experience in the game, and also affects important aspects such as the economy or scoring. We do take this very seriously, and appreciate everyone who brings these to our attention. For the record, we are aware of the sites called out from the OP. While we can’t discuss specifics, we do our best to combat sites and programs that encourage breaking our Terms of Service.

As far as what you can do to help, telling us is the first step. If you run across someone you believe is cheating (whether it’s botting or exploiting), please report them. You can do so in-game or simply by messaging a staff member on the forums (it can be me, Jess, or any of the moderators). Keep in mind our TOS team suspends and bans botting accounts daily, and investigations are prioritized based on the number of reports received.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4563086#Comment_4563086

Comment by ZOS_JesC: "Greetings, if you'd like to submit a report, we highly encourage you to submit a support ticket here: help.elderscrollsonline.com/app and provide as much information as possible. Screenshots and videos are always helpful."
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6475949#Comment_6475949


In short, extra evidence like video and screenshots are helpful, but in no way does ZOS require them. Obviously, ZOS does NOT require players to furnish server-side data or physical proof before making a report.

In ESO, it's ZOS' standards that matter. I'm going to follow the guidelines the Devs describe when I report players demonstrating suspicious behavior. (And so did the OP of this thread.)

That is good news then, means there are no requirements to report anyone I see of anything that appears suspect.

That's correct, so long as you also remember the requirement of the Code,of Conduct that you aren't intentionally giving ZOS misleading info or abusing the help system.

I'd think that should go without saying, but given your earlier threats to report random players in zone or reporting specific posters for suspicious activities, I feel the need to be extra clear here. Deliberately lying in reports is bad, m'kay?

ZOS requires you to report exploits, bugs, etc. They would like as much accurate info as you can give because its helpful. They don't want you to lie. All that you can read in their own words and the Code of Conduct.

Goregrinder

VaranisArano wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Just a reminder that ZOS does not require players to furnish physical proof or server side evidence of wrongdoing when making a report, though detailed reports with screenshots and video are appreciated.

You can read it in their own words here:

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys,

We know that cheating players and botters takes away from your experience in the game, and also affects important aspects such as the economy or scoring. We do take this very seriously, and appreciate everyone who brings these to our attention. For the record, we are aware of the sites called out from the OP. While we can’t discuss specifics, we do our best to combat sites and programs that encourage breaking our Terms of Service.

As far as what you can do to help, telling us is the first step. If you run across someone you believe is cheating (whether it’s botting or exploiting), please report them. You can do so in-game or simply by messaging a staff member on the forums (it can be me, Jess, or any of the moderators). Keep in mind our TOS team suspends and bans botting accounts daily, and investigations are prioritized based on the number of reports received.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4563086#Comment_4563086

Comment by ZOS_JesC: "Greetings, if you'd like to submit a report, we highly encourage you to submit a support ticket here: help.elderscrollsonline.com/app and provide as much information as possible. Screenshots and videos are always helpful."
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6475949#Comment_6475949


In short, extra evidence like video and screenshots are helpful, but in no way does ZOS require them. Obviously, ZOS does NOT require players to furnish server-side data or physical proof before making a report.

In ESO, it's ZOS' standards that matter. I'm going to follow the guidelines the Devs describe when I report players demonstrating suspicious behavior. (And so did the OP of this thread.)

That is good news then, means there are no requirements to report anyone I see of anything that appears suspect.

That's correct, so long as you also remember the requirement of the Code,of Conduct that you aren't intentionally giving ZOS misleading info or abusing the help system.

I'd think that should go without saying, but given your earlier threats to report random players in zone or reporting specific posters for suspicious activities, I feel the need to be extra clear here. Deliberately lying in reports is bad, m'kay?

ZOS requires you to report exploits, bugs, etc. They would like as much accurate info as you can give because its helpful. They don't want you to lie. All that you can read in their own words and the Code of Conduct.

Well considering ZOS wouldn't be able to tell what my intentions are, as long as I informed them that I witnessed suspicious activity, they'd have no choice but to take my word for it.

VaranisArano

Goregrinder wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Just a reminder that ZOS does not require players to furnish physical proof or server side evidence of wrongdoing when making a report, though detailed reports with screenshots and video are appreciated.

You can read it in their own words here:

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey guys,

We know that cheating players and botters takes away from your experience in the game, and also affects important aspects such as the economy or scoring. We do take this very seriously, and appreciate everyone who brings these to our attention. For the record, we are aware of the sites called out from the OP. While we can’t discuss specifics, we do our best to combat sites and programs that encourage breaking our Terms of Service.

As far as what you can do to help, telling us is the first step. If you run across someone you believe is cheating (whether it’s botting or exploiting), please report them. You can do so in-game or simply by messaging a staff member on the forums (it can be me, Jess, or any of the moderators). Keep in mind our TOS team suspends and bans botting accounts daily, and investigations are prioritized based on the number of reports received.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/4563086#Comment_4563086

Comment by ZOS_JesC: "Greetings, if you'd like to submit a report, we highly encourage you to submit a support ticket here: help.elderscrollsonline.com/app and provide as much information as possible. Screenshots and videos are always helpful."
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6475949#Comment_6475949


In short, extra evidence like video and screenshots are helpful, but in no way does ZOS require them. Obviously, ZOS does NOT require players to furnish server-side data or physical proof before making a report.

In ESO, it's ZOS' standards that matter. I'm going to follow the guidelines the Devs describe when I report players demonstrating suspicious behavior. (And so did the OP of this thread.)

That is good news then, means there are no requirements to report anyone I see of anything that appears suspect.

That's correct, so long as you also remember the requirement of the Code,of Conduct that you aren't intentionally giving ZOS misleading info or abusing the help system.

I'd think that should go without saying, but given your earlier threats to report random players in zone or reporting specific posters for suspicious activities, I feel the need to be extra clear here. Deliberately lying in reports is bad, m'kay?

ZOS requires you to report exploits, bugs, etc. They would like as much accurate info as you can give because its helpful. They don't want you to lie. All that you can read in their own words and the Code of Conduct.

Well considering ZOS wouldn't be able to tell what my intentions are, as long as I informed them that I witnessed suspicious activity, they'd have no choice but to take my word for it.

Your report does not actually constitute evidence or proof Of TOS-breaking behavior, merely the suspicion of it. ZOS investigates those reports with the server side data that only they have access to and takes the appropriate action, if any.

They also keep track of the reports we make, so a player who's frivolously reporting or lying will be found out by ZOS, especially if they make a habit of it.

But really, the whole "don't lie" thing ought to be self-explanatory. So please, quit trying to act like you have a license to lie about other players when reporting just because ZOS doesn't require your high standards of proof when making reports. Its disingenous.

Sanguinor2

Goregrinder wrote: »

So any player listing items for more than what you personally think they should sell it for is "suspicious"?

No but someone selling an item for more than 100000 times its commonly agreed upon market Price is suspicious, wouldnt you agree? Especially so if someone buys those items not once or twice but over 20 times? Or do you find it normal to buy bubble gum for 100000 Dollars?

Goregrinder

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

So any player listing items for more than what you personally think they should sell it for is "suspicious"?

No but someone selling an item for more than 100000 times its commonly agreed upon market Price is suspicious, wouldnt you agree? Especially so if someone buys those items not once or twice but over 20 times? Or do you find it normal to buy bubble gum for 100000 Dollars?

I definitely don't agree. I believe it's not my business what other people list their items for in or out of ESO, and I frankly don't care what other people are trying to sell their items for. It could be for max value that the traders will literally them them list it for, and it could be for a single white dropped level 3, leather belt. I don't focus on things like that in RL, or in ESO. It's their business.

idk

Goregrinder wrote: »

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

So any player listing items for more than what you personally think they should sell it for is "suspicious"?

No but someone selling an item for more than 100000 times its commonly agreed upon market Price is suspicious, wouldnt you agree? Especially so if someone buys those items not once or twice but over 20 times? Or do you find it normal to buy bubble gum for 100000 Dollars?

I definitely don't agree. I believe it's not my business what other people list their items for in or out of ESO, and I frankly don't care what other people are trying to sell their items for. It could be for max value that the traders will literally them them list it for, and it could be for a single white dropped level 3, leather belt. I don't focus on things like that in RL, or in ESO. It's their business.

That is fine and is your choice. However, irl people noticing odds things and reporting it have brought down real life criminals. It is people who pay attention and notice odd transactions that catch those who are embezeling from companies and other organizations.

That is real life.

chess1ukb16_ESO

Not sure why people are arguing over this.

This was a very clear scenario of highly suspicious goings-on that warranted reporting so the developers were notified.

A number of GM's were discussing it for a period of time and tickets were raised by several or more before the forum post was even created. This was a case of highly informed players noticing something strange and reporting it followed by a forum post to accelerate the attention it deserved. Good player stewardship.

Clearly ZoS acted very fast on this information coming to light as they dealt with the accounts and rolled out a fix through the weekly maintenance on Wednesday which would have taken time to develop, incorporate into the week's usual release and test. Only after this happened did they acknowledge it.

I am guessing it was duping or some other game-breaking mechanic in play as a fix was involved and the fact the Zos team acted so swiftly is a pretty good indication it presented a clear threat to the game.

Numerikuu

I wouldn't be surprised if it was an exploit related to the mail-refund bidding system that was rolled in months ago with guild multi-bidding. I mean... look what happened to EU. Did ZoS ever fix that mess?

Either way, something tells me we'll see this again. There's so many damn holes in this boat that I'm surprised it's still floating at all.

MajBludd

If you have not been tied up in this you wouldn't argue the validity of the reports suspicion.

Or we have people who are too dumb to admit when they are wrong and continue to push their flawed arguement.

ku5h

Goregrinder wrote: »

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

So any player listing items for more than what you personally think they should sell it for is "suspicious"?

No but someone selling an item for more than 100000 times its commonly agreed upon market Price is suspicious, wouldnt you agree? Especially so if someone buys those items not once or twice but over 20 times? Or do you find it normal to buy bubble gum for 100000 Dollars?

I definitely don't agree. I believe it's not my business what other people list their items for in or out of ESO, and I frankly don't care what other people are trying to sell their items for. It could be for max value that the traders will literally them them list it for, and it could be for a single white dropped level 3, leather belt. I don't focus on things like that in RL, or in ESO. It's their business.

If you're not invested in the game that much to care about stuff like that is all fine. It might impact your gameplay in a way that some stuff would cost you more, but your fine and who cares.
But, IRL allowing stuff like that to happen and act like it's none of your business, damn...good thing not many ppl have this mindset.
Also, why you keep saying "trying to sell" and "listing", it's buying of that is the problem.

JKorr

Goregrinder wrote: »

January1171 wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Reminder to anyone making or dealing with random threats of reporting that the Code of Conduct says:

2.8 Improper use the in game support or complaint buttons or making false reports to ZeniMax staff members is forbidden. You may not intentionally submit misinformation or abuse the help system in any ZeniMax Service.

Boom.

A false report is when someone files a report knowing 100% it's not correct- not reporting a suspicion that you think is true, but turns out it's not after the proper investigation.

Which would involve physical evidence to prove whether the report was false, or valid.

Which you do not have to provide. Normally neighbor type people investigating drug sales to get physical evidence so they can report the drug deal to the police turn into murder investigations, and the neighbor doing the investigation actually *is* the evidence, if anyone ever finds the body. Oh, sorry. That shouldn't be reported either, since there are all kinds of reasons a body could be laying around. No evidence there was a murder or anything.

At this point, you're just trolling. People can report strange/suspicious activity, and ZOS will deal with the investigation for evidence. If the person doing the reporting is making a false report, ZOS will handle that too, because they will have the evidence.

cyclonus11

The troll is really grinding my gores!

MajBludd

So, who got banned, if anybody?

JKorr

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

Goregrinder wrote: »

Yes, people can list something like a grape for 10 million. They can list all of their grapes for that much. That's how a free market works. Whether other people buy it or not, is another story. You're saying it is against ZOS's TOS to list any item they want for any price they want?

That is exactly NOT what I am saying. Do they not teach reading comprehension anymore? I say it is weird, not that it is a reportable offense.

He isn't going to try to comprehend anything. Whether intentionally being dense, or attempting to bait/troll, he *knows* he's right, and the rest of the world is obviously wrong, and no one should report anything unless they have three different sources of a full week of a log of the chat and at LEAST 48 hours of video captured and stored somewhere only the law enforcement officials can access it.

MajBludd wrote: »

So, who got banned, if anybody?

ZOS won't disclose the results of any disciplinary action they take. Unless you see someone crying on reddit they were totally totally innocent and the evil money-grubbing ZOS banned them for no reason at all, nothing will be heard about it.

erliesc

This game is being TRASHED by people pricing things out of a reasonable range!

Quick fix...put some Bollinger Bands on a price chart...any price/trade out of range won't go through. You simply STOP the poor pricing...problem fixed...no damage to reasonable traders.

If the people running his game won't fix it...they will lose players...FAST!

Wouldn't be surprised if it isn't intentional malicious behavior in an attempt to ruin the game...

Ackwalan

erliesc wrote: »

This game is being TRASHED by people pricing things out of a reasonable range!

Quick fix...put some Bollinger Bands on a price chart...any price/trade out of range won't go through. You simply STOP the poor pricing...problem fixed...no damage to reasonable traders.

If the people running his game won't fix it...they will lose players...FAST!

Wouldn't be surprised if it isn't intentional malicious behavior in an attempt to ruin the game...

That won't work. If you try and put a price control on items, they all just become the max price.

erliesc

WRONG! If the prices are limited to some extent...the bigger advantages of price manipulation go away.

Yes maybe prices may trend up...but by at a much slower rate so that those selling at lower or reasonable prices will probably keep the avg stable.

When the malicious players lose their advantage...they are out of business.

If something isn't done...this game is over....

There seem to be a lot of newer players changing prices...sometimes lower...but at least this is at a reasonable rate.