Why I hate PUGs

vamp_emily

This reminds me of a DC PvP Pug.

zone: ASH UA, need help!

DC Pug player

January1171

I don't use the loot addons, but don't mind it. IMO it's not intrusive to see all drops from content you are running as a group. It's group content.

To an extent, it's group drops. There's a reason the items aren't bound for another 2 hours or so. Yes, if you get an item and don't want to trade it that's 100% fine. But otherwise, it's gear you earned as a group. Also why I don't charge people when I do trade with them- it's gear we earned together as a group.

Because it dropped for me, I get first claim of it and whether I want to research/use/store/etc, but then my group members get secondary claim.

ETA You could also argue for the loot addons, particularly for tradeable items, because for a period of time there are multiple player's names tied to that item. People might want to know what their name is being attached to.

SidraWillowsky

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

Why should the person who asks at the beginning get it instead of the person who waits for people to offer things up? There is nothing wrong with what they did. There was nothing inconsiderate. Why should they even pay attention to gear requests at the start of the trial? Ask at the end when people are swapping.

A large percentage of these complaints are people just considering not getting things the way they themselves want with a lack of effort in trying to understand why others did what they did. People love to jump to calling people names. It sucks when you feel like you were so close to getting the ring but you didn't. So many people jump to hating on other people when that happens instead of learning that sometimes things just don't fall your way.

Wat.

Look, I am trying to be sympathetic to the people who don't like the whisper-ers here. But like... what even IS this? People shouldn't mention that they need something at the start of a run? If someone mentions that they need something at the start and I get it, I usually whisper them myself to let them know and will trade them on the spot so that I don't forget later and give to someone else. In OP's case with the Olo ring, the person likely didn't pay attention at the start of the run (also OK, you are not REQUIRED to bend to the will of people in group chat) and it sucks that they didn't get it. But there's nothing wrong with asking at the start of a run. I guess people should ONLY ask at the end of a run when the final boss is down???

Varana

That is how some groups do it, yes.
Like DaveMoeDee said - there are differing views on what is proper etiquette.
Especially in a trial that drops new gear that everyone wants - no one will rmemeber the details of 12 people posting their resp. wishes at the start anyway (player X wanted dagger from set A, player Y wanted all armour except gloves from set B and a lightning staff in Infused from set C, and so on...), so some leaders just requested that everyone trade gear at the end.

Zephard

So, I haven't started (and may never start) running trails or pugging trials. So 11 other people is a lot more than 3 other people from dungeon experience.


OP, yes jerk move that guy taking the shield, sounds like the intended target said the dude asked at the beginning. But still really bad social way of handling that.

So about the PC "add-on" that lets you "see all group drops". My first experience with someone having it was early in my ESO game play. Me and my wife had been playing for 3 months, had about 4 addons total, and didn't know about this. We are in a group, playing in a public dungeon, when the other members stop (which I now know, we were the only ones not on a voice chat), and ask in group chat for am item my wife received from the boss drop. My wife did not know what she got, but she freaked out others knew what she had. She wasn't opposed to giving the item, just she is a really private person, and so it freaked her out, cause she didn't know such an add-on existed.

Fast forward a year. We still aren't using such an add-on. She still feels it an invasion of privacy. I don't. now my other views:

Sheezabeast wrote: »

What are you hiding in your loot that you are so secretive about? Come on, your loot is rng and from the same pool as everyone else. It’s normal for kids to trade cards they don’t need like Pokémon or MTG or Yugioh. You’re simply personalizing something that isn’t personal. Your saddle comfy on that high horse?

It's normal for kids and adults to trade the cards they don't want. What is not normal for most people is for someone to ask for a card before you have opened the pack of cards. If you don't know what you got, and someone else already does, that is "freaky". That is the "freaky" part for some people, and once they are "freaked", their social skills drop, maybe even to the point of logging off. If they have some social disorders, they just can't handle their relaxation being so "freaked".

Runefang wrote: »

I’m personally glad the add on exists. I forget to link gear I don’t want sometimes so if somebody asks for it I’ll happily give it away.

I know this attitude exist, so for me knowing that people who run lots of group activities rely on the add on to tell people what to ask for so you don't have to keep up with everyone else. Which I think is cool.

Varkal2112 wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

The whispering them about their gear is what feels intrusive. Feeling intrusive is a subjective experience.

If you don't like receiving whispers, set it to offline. You aren't doing the trial alone, you are playing with 11 other people.

Does offline only affect your whispers? And of course it affects all Whispers, even from you friends. But it would tell me why some of my friends are in Offline when they are in trails. Thanks for that insight.

Kuwhar wrote: »

I haven't run across people whispering me for drops yet, but many times people ask at the start and end of the run "looking for x set" in group chat.

I'm much more inclined to offer my drops to someone politely asking in public as opposed to whispering me.

This kind of strikes me as the difference between people who respect others boundaries inherently or don't.

Ask in group chat? Clear respect of boundaries.

Whisper someone because you know they got the drop without them saying so? Not really a clear respect for boundaries.

It's just one of those things that I would never use/do myself because i'd feel like i'd be crossing the other persons boundaries in doing so.

In pugging dungeons, lots of people leave group as soon as final boss drops. So we normally request gear at the beginning just for that reason. And then post what we got at the end, or if we are not being pushed to speed through, we might say good drops as we get them...

I don't use the add-on cause I don't want to know if someone is lying to me. Example time: Running vFG1 (yeap, that easy of easy dungeon) for the monster helm. Me, my wife, and our friend. Just needed one more dps. Ran it looking for Heavy, infused. I didn't have the transmute stones, and haven't gotten into pvp yet to realize be faster to get them and transmute than run the RNG. Friend didn't mind running with us, as he enjoyed our company and newness to the game. We state what we were looking for at the beginning, and at the end of the run. One random player, said "sure" at the beginning, get to end, and I ask again, he states "he didn't get it". I take him at his word, and he leaves group. As soon as he leaves our friend informs us the guy had gotten it. Now if the guy had wanted it, that is fine with me, if he told us at the beginning that he wanted it, then I would just said that makes two of us. Good luck. But I understand that maybe he thought if had not said sure he would have been kicked as me and my wife have same last names on our characters. I wished our friend wouldn't have told us, we hadn't know he was running the addon, and he has never brought it up again.


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

TL;DR - I wish the game posted in group chat all the groups content specific drops, so everyone in group could see, in stead of it being addon only some use. So that way, everyone would know, and the people who feel it's in an invasion, and no "secret whispers before others even knew it the item had dropped".

tinythinker

*bursts into song*

I'm too sexy for my PUG,
Too sexy for my PUG
and Orcs named gro-Grub...

zvavi

You just finished fighting through life and death situation with your companions, you see the rogue beside you picking up a treasure piece your have wanted for a while now, is it rude to come up to him and ask if he needs it?

Any adventurers that have magical device that assists with appraising items i find and making transactions more simple are always welcome in my party!

LoneStar2911

zvavi wrote: »

You just finished fighting through life and death situation with your companions, you see the rogue beside you picking up a treasure piece your have wanted for a while now, is it rude to come up to him and ask if he needs it?

No. What is this? 1st grade? Finders-keepers? rofl.

January1171 wrote: »

IMO it's not intrusive to see all drops from content you are running as a group. It's group content.

To an extent, it's group drops. There's a reason the items aren't bound for another 2 hours or so. Yes, if you get an item and don't want to trade it that's 100% fine. But otherwise, it's gear you earned as a group. Also why I don't charge people when I do trade with them- it's gear we earned together as a group.

Because it dropped for me, I get first claim of it and whether I want to research/use/store/etc, but then my group members get secondary claim.

ETA You could also argue for the loot addons, particularly for tradeable items, because for a period of time there are multiple player's names tied to that item. People might want to know what their name is being attached to.

@January1171 makes a MAGNIFICENTLY WONDERFUL point. Well said.
If it can be traded to a group member, it's group drops.
Stop being haughty, selfish, greedy people that are too weak and scared to say "no" to a polite question.
Happy holidays, you Scrooges.

zvavi

Amber322 wrote: »

No. What is this? 1st grade? Finders-keepers? rofl.

Dear friend, never did i say the rogue has to give me the item, if he has his own idea of what to do with that amazing item, i would gladly leave the matter when he declines.
maybe if i really want it i will ask okce more if he is still willing to part with it...for a price. But if i am ignored while talking to the person, even if he didn't hear me, i will feel sad

LoneStar2911

zvavi wrote: »

Amber322 wrote: »

No. What is this? 1st grade? Finders-keepers? rofl.

Dear friend, never did i say the rogue has to give me the item, if he has his own idea of what to do with that amazing item, i would gladly leave the matter when he declines.
maybe if i really want it i will ask okce more if he is still willing to part with it...for a price. But if i am ignored while talking to the person, even if he didn't hear me, i will feel sad

Yeah. I was agreeing with you. That it wouldn't be rude to politely ask the other player for what they found. Anyone who plays with others and thinks whispers (or addons) about anything is "intrusive" is living in their own little bizarre-o land and should go find a single-player game to play. Or simply learn how to use the word "no".

Imza

Ramber wrote: »

...

seriously? annoyed because, for the very reason you are in the trial, someone asks to trade you for some gear? stunning lol... again THAT'S WHY YOU ARE ALL THERE ... WOW....

no - it's not the only reason we are there!

Imza

One thing I don't see mentioned here is the fact of more drops.....


What if you ask for an item - and the person gives it to you and then the next drop is exactly what you wanted?

This is why most people say "Wait til the end of the trial/dungeon/whatever before asking"

zvavi

Imza wrote: »

One thing I don't see mentioned here is the fact of more drops.....


What if you ask for an item - and the person gives it to you and then the next drop is exactly what you wanted?

This is why most people say "Wait til the end of the trial/dungeon/whatever before asking"

What if you, in vSS, and one of your guilds is flooding with rp, and the loot for first boss is already long gone, but you dont remember who had it?

Imza

zvavi wrote: »

Imza wrote: »

One thing I don't see mentioned here is the fact of more drops.....


What if you ask for an item - and the person gives it to you and then the next drop is exactly what you wanted?

This is why most people say "Wait til the end of the trial/dungeon/whatever before asking"

What if you, in vSS, and one of your guilds is flooding with rp, and the loot for first boss is already long gone, but you dont remember who had it?

ask ?!?

Sgtmeg

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

A large percentage of these complaints are people just considering not getting things the way they themselves want with a lack of effort in trying to understand why others did what they did. People love to jump to calling people names. It sucks when you feel like you were so close to getting the ring but you didn't. So many people jump to hating on other people when that happens instead of learning that sometimes things just don't fall your way.

Not really sure where the preaching about jumping to conclusions is coming from given that you're jumping to the conclusion that the people snagging gear they know other people need, that they never asked for, are just sad, misunderstood puppies but w/e. This is a thread about someone stealing a piece of gear they did not ask for, and knew full well without question wasn't for them. I was in the group, I was the one the shield was meant to go to and I can assure you we made it very clear that it was not for the person in question. Don't lean on toxic positivity to try and make a point. It's one thing to keep a drop you got yourself that you didn't plan on asking for, it's another to take a drop that someone else wanted when you yourself never mentioned it. Politeness goes both ways.

seira_san

SidraWillowsky wrote: »

seira_san wrote: »

Had an experience with that creepy loot snooping add-on. Some guy said in the grp chat before we started that he's looking for a chest or leg piece of a set. We all said sure ok and I kept his request in mind.

Then halfway through the dungeon, he suddenly linked the drops that other ppl and I got in the group chat and asking if he can have those. The other dude and I got legit creeped out and he asked "wth how did you know what I got??". I was initially willing to give my drops to him, but that snooping behavior is just so stalker-ish it completely pissed me off and I almost didn't give my drops to him.

I did give it to him in the end tho. I wish that add-on is banned... So creepy!

Did he ask in the same way for each one? Ie,"<username>, may I please have <item>?" Some guildies and I had a dude doing this in a trial and it seemed like he was using an add-on to click what you wanted from the group loot "snooper" and it would autofill the name of the user who got it and the item.

If that exists then THAT is weird. That's the only time we've said no because if you're going to ask, at least don't use some weird bot mod or whatever.

Or else they just had it down to a science. Either way, idk...making it THAT impersonal makes it kinda weird.

tbh I don't exactly remember, but I don't think he's asking it in the same way for each one. But I remember him being so persistent about it which pissed me and the other guy off even more lol. Like... what the hell? We've noted your request please stop being so creepy and desperate about it.

Aurielle

Quoted post has been removed.

The fact that ESO’s UI DOESN’T clutter the chat box with other player’s loot drops is a blessing. I’ve played many MMOs in the past, and people in pugs begging for gear after every drop was a huge annoyance in those MMOs that had tradable/unbound raid gear. The common etiquette in those games, as with this game, was to wait until the END of the raid to ask for gear. Most MMOs also have a need/greed/pass system, so a lot of people ended up turning off other players’ loot in chat, or only left it on to say “grats!” whenever anyone got a rare drop.

The addon is intrusive in ESO not because “mah privacy!” but because people in pugs get bombarded with whispers after every drop — which slows everyone else down during the whisper exchange. Just play the damn trial and wait until the end to ask for gear. Also, don’t feel entitled to gear or responses from other people.

Aurielle

Quoted post has been removed.

On console, people don’t message after each drop, because no add-ons. It’s great — allows you to focus fully on the run, rather than dealing with multiple whispers after each boss fight. Yes, people can use the add-on, but the point is to have the common courtesy to wait until the end before asking people for gear. Most criticisms of the add-on seem to come from people who don’t like being pestered for drops throughout a trial or dungeon.

ZOS_GregoryV

Greetings all,

After removing a few posts for Baiting and Flaming, we would like to remind everyone that all posts should be kept withing the guidelines that we have in place. Baiting and Flaming other members of the community are both violations of the rules and as such we would ask that all posts be kept civil and constructive. If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here.

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Kahnak

It's pretty common knowledge that it's appropriate to:

1) Name the gear you are looking for at the beginning of the trial.
2) Ask for the gear you are looking for at the end of the trial.

Any requests that I receive in between those times are being ignored, if for no other reason than it slows down the trial, but mostly on principle. With very few exceptions, people don't use the Loot Snooper addon for any other reason than to supplement their own gear with other people's drops - let's just be real. If you see that I've gotten a drop that you are looking for, have some common courtesy ask me at the end of the trial. It's exhausting getting "DO U NEED THAT RING" from 4 different people on a normal coffer run every time I get a Lok ring.

MorganaLaVey

Kahnak wrote: »

It's pretty common knowledge that it's appropriate to:

1) Name the gear you are looking for at the beginning of the trial.
2) Ask for the gear you are looking for at the end of the trial.

Any requests that I receive in between those times are being ignored, if for no other reason than it slows down the trial, but mostly on principle. With very few exceptions, people don't use the Loot Snooper addon for any other reason than to supplement their own gear with other people's drops - let's just be real. If you see that I've gotten a drop that you are looking for, have some common courtesy ask me at the end of the trial. It's exhausting getting "DO U NEED THAT RING" from 4 different people on a normal coffer run every time I get a Lok ring.

It's pretty common knowledge that it's appropriate to:

Make sure that you get what you want by your self and dont bother others and let them:
1) remember what you said at the Start you want.
2) link the Stuff they dont need to make sure you get your Loot.

With very few exceptions, people don't use the Loot addon for any other reason than to safe a lot of Time for everyone involved and make the Loot exchange more easy and convinient- let's just be real.
No realy im not a Convenience-Store, if you want something from me its your responsibility to take action, not mine.
If you see that I've gotten a drop that you are looking for, have some common courtesy ask me per wisp and dont expect me to link my Stuff for you at the end of the trial. It's exhausting every time to read all the 30 Things the 11 different ppl from my Raid want and check if some of them are in my Inventory when they can use an Loot Addon and check it them self. LOL. Its way easyer to awnser to 4 Whisps than to read all this S*** and check im Inventory.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

There is no (0/ Zero) Problem with Players not liking Loot Addons. There is a Problem with Players who rather deconstruct an Item than giving it to some nice Player, because he uses an Addon they dont like. Thats an 100% A**h*** Move.
Its as A**h***isch as Players not giving Stuff to someone because he asked at the Start and they see it as Spam.

Different People have different Views & Opinions.
If you treat someone worse than others because you dont like his View or Opinions than you are simply an A**h***.
Sure ***&co. might be an Exeption but People who use this Addon dont mean any Harm to anyone. Addons are a Tool which can be used for Good (easyer Loot exchange) or Bad (Harassment). If you get harasst by People than thats a Problem with the People not with the Tool.