The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Maintenance for the week of April 29:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 29
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 29
We will be performing maintenance for patch 10.0.2 on the PTS on Monday at 8:00AM EDT (12:00 UTC).
PTS Update 24 - Feedback Thread for Necromancer
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Additional ways to generate corpses would be a start, because there are never enough corpses.
The main reason I love the 8 second duration mender pet is I can recast it every 4 seconds to generate a corpse, I actually prefer the functionality of the other morph... but I use the short duration one so I can reliably generate a corpse to force a cleanse using Renewing Undeath...1 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭etelmocub18_ESO wrote: »Additional ways to generate corpses would be a start, because there are never enough corpses.
The main reason I love the 8 second duration mender pet is I can recast it every 4 seconds to generate a corpse, I actually prefer the functionality of the other morph... but I use the short duration one so I can reliably generate a corpse to force a cleanse using Renewing Undeath...
I do the same - 4 second corpse means 50% uptime of major protection with Deaden Pain at a minimum. The heals are massive when it actually bothers to cast them, so I find more value giving up the 10% damage mitigation of the other pet.
The archer pet won't be worth even putting skill points into next patch. It is pretty bad, when not spending skill points provides more value than a class skill.
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The heals are massive when it actually bothers to cast them, so I find more value giving up the 10% damage mitigation of the other pet.
I find that the heals are so big it's more often than not wasted in overheal... so the smaller heal amount doesn't bother me at all and the 10% damage reduction should be the clear winner...
But the main reason to slot the skill is because it provides a corpse to let me actually use my other abilities.
If skeletal mage was changed to summon an already dead skeletal mage corpse at your feet it would instantly find a place on my back bar, it's pretty useless even on the rare occasions when it actually attacks the right target... but a reliable source of corpses? sign me the *** up.0 -
ketsparrowhawk✭✭✭✭✭I primarily do PVP. MagCro is excellent as a support, but they are firmly stuck there. The pet and dot nerfs will keep them there. Even on live, I opt to not slot the skeletal mage/archer because the damage, while good, is unreliable unless I'm strictly in a 1v1. So I just put a dot in its place and get much better, more consistent results. Take pets off the dot standard (maybe just rethink this whole standardization business altogether..)
Blastbones needs to summon next to the target, not the caster. It would also be nice if we could re-cast blastbones to un-sommon/re-summon a new one if we choose, like the other two minions. These two changes would alleviate a lot of the frustrations with this skill, imo.
Flaming Skull - make the special 3rd cast of this ability do A LOT more damage. If sorcs can have Curse AND Frags (AND Mage's Wrath AND Streak..), Necros can have another burst attack too. This would help compensate for the unreliability of the minions, and give the Necro at least one reliable source of decent burst. With that change, and the planets in the right alignment, a necro just might be able to occasionally pull off a combo that does 2/3 the damage of what a sorc can do ez every 4 seconds.
Ghostly embrace should either A) stay on the ground for 8+ seconds, or
cost way less so that it can be spammed more. Right now I have a difficult time justifying slotting this over Blockade of Frost, which has a lot of the same functionality (especially with an infused weakening glyph), for less cost and much longer duration.. plus damage!
Boneyard - for the corpse consumption, it'd be cool if it summoned a weak skeleton for x seconds for each corpse consumed, rather than just +50% damage. Would fit the theme of the skill much better and honestly make it seem less.. silly.3 -
echo2omega✭✭✭Colossus.
The first smash should inflict the major vulnerability.
Blastbones
Needs to consistently detonate on target.
Needs to consistently detonate on a standard time. (like after 3 seconds).
Skill is far far far too unreliable in its current form.
Skeletal archer/arcanist
about the only real purpose is to drop corpses for other skills.
Siphon
Really cool skill idea. Execution needs major work.
Dependant on a corpse to activate.
-Corpses are (at times) too difficult to drop for use.
-Corpses are too difficult to position for use.
-Corpses decay far far far far too rapidly.
-Corpses are extremely difficult to target for use. ( major z axis issues. If the corpse is either a pixel too high or low the corpse can be targeted by the skill. Major line of sight issues with targeting corpses)
-Skill is broken by line of sight.
Deaden Pain.
in certain condition can be a major source of Major Protection (a grossly overpowered buff)
-depending on conditions the uptime can be 100%
Grave Grasp
-"travel" speed on the skill activation is very slooooooooooooow. My grandmother can move out of the way of the skill in PVP.
Restoring teather
Really cool skill idea. Execution needs major work.
Dependant on a corpse to activate.
-Corpses are (at times) too difficult to drop for use.
-Corpses are too difficult to position for use.
-Corpses decay far far far far too rapidly.
-Corpses are extremely difficult to target for use. ( major z axis issues. If the corpse is either a pixel too high or low the corpse can be targeted by the skill. Major line of sight issues with targeting corpses)
-Skill is broken by line of sight.
Look familiar?
Overall the class has awesome utility.
Stam DPS kit is very good. Great damage output. Can run an actual stam DPS ranged build. Great group value with colossus.
Mag DPS kit is terrible. Bottom the the barrel DPS. No reason to every take. Too dependant on corpses for damage.
Healing kit is top tier. All those utility skills really find a home.
Suggestions:
Boneyard should generate corpses. This would provide an initial and reliable (on demand) source of corpses for skill activations/bonus damage.
Bone Totem and Grave Grasp could also generate corpses.5 -
pharlex✭These are just some ideas I've had and some I saw in this thread hopefully we can see something much more interesting with this class since it's a fun class to play but feels like it should be able to use all of it's abilities more effectively without having to rely on the summons to generate it's corpses.
The class is all about using corpses to boost their abilities but as of right now it just feels like there are so many that don't use corpses to become stronger but instead generate a corpse after a certain amount of time as past.
I had given the idea of bone totem and or grave grasp as ways to generate corpses in a previous post. Didn't think of boneyard for generating corpses, as someone above suggested and I think that's a pretty good idea as well, have it spawn a corpse every 1-2 seconds remove the boosts damage on taking a corpse and boost it's damage closer to what it's maximum was and add effects to other abilities.
Maybe even increase the duration and total damage(to match it's damage over time with the new duration) of the boneyard ability to match it's new purpose as a corpse generating ability.
Corpses should remain on the field longer so you can utilize them better.
Abilities that used to generate corpses could be changed to consume corpses instead like skeletal arcanist/archer, spirit mender and bone armor.
Maybe arcanist/archer could apply major sorcery/brutality (I've seen this idea around on the forums) or increase damage done by x% if it consumes a corpse within however many meters of the player or something like that. Same with the ghost mender could add something like increase healing done by x% if it consumes a corpse within however many meters.
Bone armor could consume a nearby corpse to increase something like healing received by x% or some other buff that would help with support roles.
Expunge could consume a corpse instead of taking health as a cost or apply some kind of buff to the caster.
Death scythe could boost it's healing, apply a dot or some kind of debuff if it consumes a corpse. (just small suggestions not sure what exactly could be applied to this ability to make it a bit stronger via corpse consumption).
Tethers already use corpses to even work but what if they had the ability to consume a second corpse to double their passive bonuses or something like that.
As for maybe some concern of too much ultimate generation via bitter harvest with the more corpses, you could add some kind of timer of x corpses to however many seconds to be able to gain ultimate but the heal from the ability won't be affected by the timer.
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BigBragg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭5.2.2 still no love for necromancers. Are they so forbidden in Tamriel that they should be all but useless in game?1 -
Lazarus_Rising✭✭✭✭✭The patch was about DK, templar and warden... let's wait for the next patches and see then.also known as Overlich.0 -
RavenRoxie✭✭✭✭StrandedMonkey wrote: »
HAHA! Soon(tm)Phantogram DC | Wood Elf | Magicka Nightblade/ | DPS | 856cp
False Paradox | AD | Wood Elf | Non Combative Nightblade | Crafter | 856cp
@RoxieParadoxx | Twitch | Twitter1 -
Ankael07✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Lazarus_Rising wrote: »The patch was about DK, templar and warden... let's wait for the next patches and see then.
Yeah 4 months between each patch wasnt enough to form an idea about whats wrong with Magcro so they need those extra few weeksIf you want me to reply to your comment type @Ankael07 in it.0 -
Lazarus_Rising✭✭✭✭✭Lazarus_Rising wrote: »The patch was about DK, templar and warden... let's wait for the next patches and see then.
Yeah 4 months between each patch wasnt enough to form an idea about whats wrong with Magcro so they need those extra few weeks
they did talk about the problems in the patch notes before. Man i'm equaly frustrated about the problems of Magnecro in particular but pls stick with constructive feedback.
Since there is no reliable stun for necro, which wakes it really hard to play in pvp without vampirism (which is a must have imo for magnecro in pvp) we could make the skull similar to the stonefist - the third skull stuns for couple of seconds. There we could plan our burst time better.also known as Overlich.0 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Lazarus_Rising wrote: »Lazarus_Rising wrote: »The patch was about DK, templar and warden... let's wait for the next patches and see then.
Yeah 4 months between each patch wasnt enough to form an idea about whats wrong with Magcro so they need those extra few weeks
they did talk about the problems in the patch notes before. Man i'm equaly frustrated about the problems of Magnecro in particular but pls stick with constructive feedback.
Since there is no reliable stun for necro, which wakes it really hard to play in pvp without vampirism (which is a must have imo for magnecro in pvp) we could make the skull similar to the stonefist - the third skull stuns for couple of seconds. There we could plan our burst time better.
While Totem is indeed unreliable for coordinating burst, I feel it’s superior to Drain overall. That’s been my experience from BGs anyway.
Its ability to stun a whole opponent team during a push, as well as offering Minor Protection to yours during the defensive phase, is invaluable. I just wish that the “melee” totem offered an instant stun like Turn Undead, instead of the synergy which is a bit useless.EU | PC | AD3 -
Stibbons✭✭✭✭✭Necromancer main problem is undead pets and dead bodies. In pve corpses vaporise in thin air in seconds and pvp even faster. Players who die at take spawnpoint should still leave a corpse for what 10 seconds? Undead pets use most of their time in moving to place to place or changing targets. They should be free to cast because they are so broken now.2 -
Nerhesi✭✭✭✭Perhaps the passive on necro for DOT damage increase (and decrease of incoming DOTS) so that it is back to pre-nerf levels?
This would allow the necro an opportunity to be a pure dot class. Especially the Magcro which is non-existant in terms of pvp competition now.0 -
Nerhesi✭✭✭✭Basically - I think there is a lot of good potential, thematically and from a balance perspective to make Necro (at least magcro) the premier DoT class...
Since the game direction/devs dont seem to want DoTs to be viable universally, perhaps there is a niche build available to a single class then... (Similar to how warden or magden has strong aoe potential etc)
Edited by Nerhesi on October 5, 2019 1:05PM0 -
Daemonai✭✭✭✭1. On Skeletal Mage and its morphs:
This ability is extremely costly for what it is; a single-target dot with no notable secondary effects (compare to Swarm, Searing Strikes, Sun Fire, ect.).
The Skeletal Arcanist morph turns this ability into a pseudo-AoE DOT that will only hit another target if they are stacked on top of each other and it is worse than the base ability as its damage is reduced by Major Evasion. This does not justify the ability cost. Consider that Sun Fire's morph, Reflective Light, turns that ability from a single-target DOT into a multiple-target DOT, which also snares the targets it hits in addition to granting Major Prophecy to the Templar. And it cost less while doing comparable, more consistent damage.
As you can see, the Skeletal Mage fails in almost all aspects.
I've seen suggestions to add Major Sorcery and Major Brutality to the magicka and stamina morphs, respectively, which would be a great addition to justify the cost of this ability and its morphs, though the cost might still be too high.
Part of me thinks the cost of this ability is being balanced around the Reusable Parts passive which can reduce the cost of summoning abilities, however, this should not be the case otherwise other classes would have to be balanced the same way, for example, Sorcerer's ultimates would have to cost more to account for the Power Stone passive that reduces ultimate cost.
ALSO, this ability should prioritize player targets. The efficiency of the Skeletal Mage is already greatly damaged by the inability to choose who it targets. That drops even lower when it wastes its attacks targeting players summoned creatures.
2. On Spirit Mender and its morphs:
This ability suffers from many of the same problems as the Skeletal Mage.
This is a single-target HOT in the form of a summon. However, its cost seems to be more in line with what one should expect for an AoE healing ability, like Ritual of Retribution, which is an AoE HOT in addition to an AoE DOT and it purges status effects.
My personal suggestion is giving the base Spirit Mender the ability to grant a few seconds(3?) of Major Fortitude to anyone affected by its heal. This would synergize well with the health builds the Necromancers kit promotes, add another buff to the Necromancers kit (which it is sorely lacking), and give a bit more value to the ability without overloading it.
3. On ability cost in general:
In order to get the most out of the Necromancer class, you are going to want to maintain its four corpse-spawning abilities (Blastbones, Skeletal Mage, Spirit Mender, Bone Armor) all the time to ensure you have a steady stream of corpses to empower your corpse-consuming abilities.
If the cost of maintaining the corpse-spawning abilities becomes too high—which it feels like currently—it undermines the entire class, as you won't have very much magicka left to do anything else other than casting the four skills you have to have active all the time just to make the class function at its maximum potential.
This is why I believe the cost of these abilities should be lower than the established cost standard of abilities based on the necessity of maintaining these abilities to make the Necromancer class function as intended.
4. On Major Vulnerability:
It has to go. Major Vulnerability is creating the illusion that the Necromancer is in a viable state and it is not. So, we should rip the bandaid off and start fixing this class.10 -
Very nice post above thanks for your thoughts.
Now on the topic, since now Colossus will only use Major Vulnerability on the last hit, you can reduce the cost of this ability, for example by 25. Because not all builds use Bitter Harvest and its morphs. This will stimulate players to choose the ultimate necromancer ability. Necromancer has too expensive ultimate abilities in all three branches.Edited by OrderoftheDarkness on October 7, 2019 11:35AM1 -
Artorias24✭✭✭✭✭
✭I really dont know how ZOS can be happy with the current shape of Necro, especially magicka necro.
I only talk about PvP perspective. I nearly never See a magicka Necro and that has many many reasons that havent been fixed yet.
Blastbones:
Barely hit. So unreliable to even slot them while they should be one of the hardest hitting skills from necro. They dont find their target, get confused and stand still for ages and you cant reuse them and you are locked out of your burst skill. Or they just have a talk with their target until they are fine and blastbones decide to not kill them and just despawn. Guess they are friends now.
Chasing someone with blastbones is a meme. Magnecro wants to stay ranged and blastbones gets confused if it needs to Run more then 1 Meter. They need to leap faster and also have increased movement speed. And ofc better pathfinding and targeting.
Spammable:
Skull is awkward to weave and the scythe is kinda meh with the damage Part. Would be nice to have increased damage for the main target and lower damage on the enemies around. Kinda like jabs.
Btw, a bright glowing scythe doesnt really fit a darke themed class called Necromancer. Scythe should have dark visuals with a mist around or behind its path. Dark and purple. Morr fitting for the necro theme.
Colossus:
Maj vol on the last hit makes 0 sense. Most ppl already moved out of the aoe so they never get the debuff. Only way is to CC them inside even tho most of them break free and dodge out before the last hit. Stun from colossus is useless if you need to stun your target anyway before you drop your ult. The damage is dodgeable even tho, its aoe..... Making it even more unreliable.
Tether:
Hard to target, should just consume the nearest corpse instead of clunky aim. The beam breaks on a LOS. The healing from the beam is useless anyway cause PvP is very mobile. Just make an aura around the corpse and you that dont break from Los. When used on a player corpse and He respawns your tether also gets cancelled. It should stay otherwise its even more unreliable.
Summoner Armor:
This cost reduction on Mender, Blastbones and Mage is really underperforming compared to other secondary effect from other classes. Those 3 skills already get a 25% cost reduction from passive and dont need more reduction cause they are also not even a spammable. Armor could give you more resist if you consume a corpse upon cast. Something like that. But current bonus is just Trash.
No source of Major Brutality/Sorcery.
Would be nice if necro would get also this buff in their class Kit. And dont need to slot a mages guild skill when lore wise mages guild hates necromancy. Maybe build in Summoners armor. That you get this major buff when you have a summon active.
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jecks33✭✭✭✭✭
✭i'm new to the pve stamina necro and I noticed a very bad self healing with class abilities (i come from years of stamina sorcerer and his awesome critical surge).
There is vigor, i know, but necro have an entire skilline dedicated to healing and I was wondering if there was anything effective for stamina toons
It's me or the stamina healing is weak?
PC-EU0 -
Alidel✭✭✭✭i'm new to the pve stamina necro and I noticed a very bad self healing with class abilities (i come from years of stamina sorcerer and his awesome critical surge).
There is vigor, i know, but necro have an entire skilline dedicated to healing and I was wondering if there was anything effective for stamina toons
It's me or the stamina healing is weak?
After stamsorc with it's awesome surge you'll find any class lacking selfheals. I've been there, it just requires some getting used to press buttons for selfheals instead of always having it on and reapplying every 30 secs one buff.0 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭i'm new to the pve stamina necro and I noticed a very bad self healing with class abilities (i come from years of stamina sorcerer and his awesome critical surge).
There is vigor, i know, but necro have an entire skilline dedicated to healing and I was wondering if there was anything effective for stamina toons
It's me or the stamina healing is weak?
There's only one good heal in that whole tree and that is Render Flesh which is magicka only (cost prohibitive for stamina players). The only reason some people slot the Mender is for the 10% damage mitigation and the corpse, the heal is very unreliable it some times doesn't even work (Mender just stares at you doing nothing). The less said about the other skills the better, not even the healers use them.
Edited by Maulkin on October 7, 2019 2:48PMEU | PC | AD4 -
katorga✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭i'm new to the pve stamina necro and I noticed a very bad self healing with class abilities (i come from years of stamina sorcerer and his awesome critical surge).
There is vigor, i know, but necro have an entire skilline dedicated to healing and I was wondering if there was anything effective for stamina toons
It's me or the stamina healing is weak?
There's only one good heal in that whole tree and that is Render Flesh which is magicka only (cost prohibitive for stamina players). The only reason some people slot the Mender is for the 10% damage mitigation and the corpse, the heal is very unreliable it some times doesn't even work (Mender just stares at you doing nothing). The less said about the other skills the better, not even the healers use them.
Mortal coil is an ok HOT with stam return. Zero cost. That is about it.0 -
wild_kmacdb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭The mage pet got the same buff as most of the other dots in the latest PTS patch, but i think it’s a mistake to treat it the same as a standard dot, when it is worse in several capacities.
- You can’t choose what it targets
- You can’t apply it to more than one opponent unlike proper dots
- It draws mobs in PVE and gives away your position in PVP
- Enemies can just move away from it and the damage stops unlike other DOTs
These little guys need something...Edited by wild_kmacdb16_ESO on October 7, 2019 7:36PM7 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Well v5.2.3 is here...
First off, all around buffs which the class sorely needed so kudos to ZOS. I especially love the passive buffs; more DoT outgoing damage, less DoT incoming damage, cheaper pets.
Secondly, gracias for reverting the nerf and even buffing Colossus. I'm not gonna lie, I'm a bit worried 8" might be a bit too strong for PvP and it might prevent the class from getting buffs or fixes elsewhere where they're needed. Perhaps 5-6 seconds would have been enough without being ott?
Still hoping for:- Skeletal Mage granting a buff or target debuff. It's a random target, single opponent, non-sticky DOT that requires LOS. I mean seriously; in PvP soultrap and entropy comfortably outperform in damage what should be an iconic class skill.
- Blastbones reliability fixes (not buffs). Expires too often and gets stuck in ground cc. Gets out-sprinted by medium build runners. Stares at opponent instead of exploding. Need to be made snare immune at the very least or make it jump to the opponent when within 18 meters with a far more generous Y axis.
- Mender fixes and buffs. Still doesn't count towards BG heals and completely fails to heal very frequently. Those need fixing. Would be great if it always healed the caster and one low health ally. Necro has no reliable sticky HoT
Onwards and upwards. This is a good patch...
EU | PC | AD5
