PTS Update 23 - Feedback Thread for Item Sets & General Itemization

Cinbri

There is disparity in sets granting major evasion after 5.1.1:
1. Gossamer allow to have 100% uptime of major evasion on caster and all allies. Templar drop cleansing ritual - tick every 2sec to reapply evasion that last 2sec = 100% uptime
2. Spectre Eye grant major evasion only on caster with 50% uptime.
3. Gloom grant major evasion with 33% uptime only on caster and additional bonus.
What the point of using Spectre or Gloom with new Gossamer?
Address last Spectre and Gloom because
A. in compare to gossamer they are useless.
B. Even without gossamer those last 2 are too weak. They should brought to high uptime atleast and Spectre get additional bonus at least, unless you want just nerf gossamer to proc only on direct heals.

Lord_Eomer

Cinbri wrote: »

There is disparity in sets granting major evasion after 5.1.1:
1. Gossamer allow to have 100% uptime of major evasion on caster and all allies. Templar drop cleansing ritual - tick every 2sec to reapply evasion that last 2sec = 100% uptime
2. Spectre Eye grant major evasion only on caster with 50% uptime.
3. Gloom grant major evasion with 33% uptime only on caster and additional bonus.
What the point of using Spectre or Gloom with new Gossamer?
Address last Spectre and Gloom because
A. in compare to gossamer they are useless.
B. Even without gossamer those last 2 are too weak. They should brought to high uptime atleast and Spectre get additional bonus at least, unless you want just nerf gossamer to proc only on direct heals.

You missed Hist Bark set,

Gossamer set change is very good and will help this set start using by Healers.

Strider__Roshin

satanio wrote: »

Blackrose Bow hasn’t been adjusted to new Scatter Shot, it accidentally got shadow nerfed because of max range that got changed from 28m to 22m. Now, max duration dot is obtainable only if you are 20m - 22m.

Valid point. Truthfully the Blackrose bow wasn't worth using before the nerf, and now it's even more useless.

Toc de Malsvi

satanio wrote: »

Blackrose Bow hasn’t been adjusted to new Scatter Shot, it accidentally got shadow nerfed because of max range that got changed from 28m to 22m. Now, max duration dot is obtainable only if you are 20m - 22m.

Its worse than that. Bleeds got buffed cause they are now mitigated by resistance, but the BlackroseBow bleed was not changed. And the Bleed from this bow is based on damage done from Scatter Shot which was itself nerfed in damage done. So all in all this bow which wasn't good to begin with got triple nerfed into oblivion.

TankHealz2015

PvE DK Craglorn group areas = normal solo play and experimenting

Dragon's Defilement: I like it.

(2 Items) 1096 Maximum Stamina
(3 Items) 1096 Maximum Stamina
(4 Items) 1206 Maximum Health
(5 Items) When you take damage from a melee attack, gain a corrupting aura for 5 seconds that applies Minor Fracture and Minor Breach to all enemies near you, lowering their Physical and Spell Resistance by 1320. This effect can occur every 5 seconds.

The proc effect looks cool. A large glowy-smoky blue-ish/purple-ish ring. It proc'ed frequently. The effect is subtle, but just enough to visually know that yeah it proc'ed. great balance on the visual effect and sounds.

I think minor fracture/breach together as a large AoE is either unique or quite rare.
Anybody can confirm?

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/437928/looking-for-table-that-shows-all-major-minor-buffs-each-class-has-access-to

Cool set.
This will be fun to experiment with different combinations for tanking mid-level dungeon content/not score trials guild.

Lord Warden (+AoE resist) + Dragon's Defilement (+ AoE fracture/breach) + Knightmare (+AoE minor maim)

Lord_Eomer

TankHealz2015 wrote: »

PvE DK Craglorn group areas = normal solo play and experimenting

Dragon's Defilement: I like it.

(2 Items) 1096 Maximum Stamina
(3 Items) 1096 Maximum Stamina
(4 Items) 1206 Maximum Health
(5 Items) When you take damage from a melee attack, gain a corrupting aura for 5 seconds that applies Minor Fracture and Minor Breach to all enemies near you, lowering their Physical and Spell Resistance by 1320. This effect can occur every 5 seconds.

The proc effect looks cool. A large glowy-smoky blue-ish/purple-ish ring. It proc'ed frequently. The effect is subtle, but just enough to visually know that yeah it proc'ed. great balance on the visual effect and sounds.

I think minor fracture/breach together as a large AoE is either unique or quite rare.
Anybody can confirm?

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/437928/looking-for-table-that-shows-all-major-minor-buffs-each-class-has-access-to

Cool set.
This will be fun to experiment with different combinations for tanking mid-level dungeon content/not score trials guild.

Lord Warden (+AoE resist) + Dragon's Defilement (+ AoE fracture/breach) + Knightmare (+AoE minor maim)

If ZOS care to add Max stam/Max health or Max Magicka bonus as 5th piece along with current bonus.

This set will then surely have some place as under current state 5th piece bonus alone does not sound cool.

Davadin

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

TankHealz2015 wrote: »

PvE DK Craglorn group areas = normal solo play and experimenting

Dragon's Defilement: I like it.

(2 Items) 1096 Maximum Stamina
(3 Items) 1096 Maximum Stamina
(4 Items) 1206 Maximum Health
(5 Items) When you take damage from a melee attack, gain a corrupting aura for 5 seconds that applies Minor Fracture and Minor Breach to all enemies near you, lowering their Physical and Spell Resistance by 1320. This effect can occur every 5 seconds.

The proc effect looks cool. A large glowy-smoky blue-ish/purple-ish ring. It proc'ed frequently. The effect is subtle, but just enough to visually know that yeah it proc'ed. great balance on the visual effect and sounds.

I think minor fracture/breach together as a large AoE is either unique or quite rare.
Anybody can confirm?

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/437928/looking-for-table-that-shows-all-major-minor-buffs-each-class-has-access-to

Cool set.
This will be fun to experiment with different combinations for tanking mid-level dungeon content/not score trials guild.

Lord Warden (+AoE resist) + Dragon's Defilement (+ AoE fracture/breach) + Knightmare (+AoE minor maim)

If ZOS care to add Max stam/Max health or Max Magicka bonus as 5th piece along with current bonus.

This set will then surely have some place as under current state 5th piece bonus alone does not sound cool.

or take fracture out and make breach a Major... then it's a solid set.

i'd swap my Nox breath with green claw right away.

THAT'll make it worthy swapping out 7th, or Spriggan, or Deadly Strike, etc...

Ashamray

maelstrom and master's restoration staves are strongly outdated with recent changes to rapid regeneration \ mutagen and healing springs \ illustrous.
Please, update those weapons to match the skills they are supposed to buff.

SeaUnicorn

Not sure if anyone mentioned, but Maarselok monster helm will be meta for stam DPS this patch, so please make proc condition something other than bash, because as stam dps you already have bunch of clunky animations in the rotation, having to bash weave would make it even more frustrating. Not to mention effect on sustain.

WrathOfInnos

slofwnd wrote: »

Not sure if anyone mentioned, but Maarselok monster helm will be meta for stam DPS this patch, so please make proc condition something other than bash, because as stam dps you already have bunch of clunky animations in the rotation, having to bash weave would make it even more frustrating. Not to mention effect on sustain.

Light attack as a trigger seems to work well on other sets. It allows you to make sure it hits the target you are focusing (unlike sets that proc on AoE DoT ticks) while still being fluid in a rotation. Maybe restrict it to melee Light Attacks if you don’t want it used by bow builds.

I’m sure that not everyone would like the set to rely on Light Attack weaving, but I’m guessing that same crowd would be more displeased with having to weave bash to be effective.

Lord_Eomer

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

slofwnd wrote: »

Not sure if anyone mentioned, but Maarselok monster helm will be meta for stam DPS this patch, so please make proc condition something other than bash, because as stam dps you already have bunch of clunky animations in the rotation, having to bash weave would make it even more frustrating. Not to mention effect on sustain.

Light attack as a trigger seems to work well on other sets. It allows you to make sure it hits the target you are focusing (unlike sets that proc on AoE DoT ticks) while still being fluid in a rotation. Maybe restrict it to melee Light Attacks if you don’t want it used by bow builds.

I’m sure that not everyone would like the set to rely on Light Attack weaving, but I’m guessing that same crowd would be more displeased with having to weave bash to be effective.

Why not proc on crit with reasonable cooldown so will be best for PVE and may do descent in PVP

Currently its proc condition is worst for PVE and may have some use in PVP

WrathOfInnos

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

slofwnd wrote: »

Not sure if anyone mentioned, but Maarselok monster helm will be meta for stam DPS this patch, so please make proc condition something other than bash, because as stam dps you already have bunch of clunky animations in the rotation, having to bash weave would make it even more frustrating. Not to mention effect on sustain.

Light attack as a trigger seems to work well on other sets. It allows you to make sure it hits the target you are focusing (unlike sets that proc on AoE DoT ticks) while still being fluid in a rotation. Maybe restrict it to melee Light Attacks if you don’t want it used by bow builds.

I’m sure that not everyone would like the set to rely on Light Attack weaving, but I’m guessing that same crowd would be more displeased with having to weave bash to be effective.

Why not proc on crit with reasonable cooldown so will be best for PVE and may do descent in PVP

Currently its proc condition is worst for PVE and may have some use in PVP

You still wouldn’t be able to control which target it hit. With AoE DoTs anything nearby is taking damage and getting hit by crits. It’s frustrating to waste a large, single target damage proc with a cooldown, on something like a Firepot spider in vAS or a Flame Atronach in vSS.

Ragnarock41

Please try again with the veiled heritance, its horrible in its new form and completely unviable.

Nerhesi

Oblivions foe currently still obsolete. Please consider something that would actually make the set useful - which would mean a significant increase to the DPS and utility. Example:

5 - piece set bonus - increase soul magic damage by 20% AND

gain 500 magicka/stamina/health recovery while channeling soul assault
OR
Remove 3 negative effects from you when you cast a soul magic spell (5 second cooldown)
OR
target of soul magic abilities is affected by minor maim 10 seconds (10 second cool down)
OR
Affect the target with major breach and magicka (or life) steal

Even with the above changes, it would still be subpar as the 5-set bonus would only affect a single dot, and a now-expensive-ult.

Thanks

Excelsus

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

slofwnd wrote: »

Not sure if anyone mentioned, but Maarselok monster helm will be meta for stam DPS this patch, so please make proc condition something other than bash, because as stam dps you already have bunch of clunky animations in the rotation, having to bash weave would make it even more frustrating. Not to mention effect on sustain.

Light attack as a trigger seems to work well on other sets. It allows you to make sure it hits the target you are focusing (unlike sets that proc on AoE DoT ticks) while still being fluid in a rotation. Maybe restrict it to melee Light Attacks if you don’t want it used by bow builds.

I’m sure that not everyone would like the set to rely on Light Attack weaving, but I’m guessing that same crowd would be more displeased with having to weave bash to be effective.

Why not proc on crit with reasonable cooldown so will be best for PVE and may do descent in PVP

Currently its proc condition is worst for PVE and may have some use in PVP

The bash proc makes it the most precise proc dps has, it goes off exactly when and where you want it to. Also it means you have to actually do something to get that bonus damage. Its not merely firing off on cooldown for free damage, you have to work for it in a sense and make it part of your rotation.

SeaUnicorn

Excelsus wrote: »

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

slofwnd wrote: »

Not sure if anyone mentioned, but Maarselok monster helm will be meta for stam DPS this patch, so please make proc condition something other than bash, because as stam dps you already have bunch of clunky animations in the rotation, having to bash weave would make it even more frustrating. Not to mention effect on sustain.

Light attack as a trigger seems to work well on other sets. It allows you to make sure it hits the target you are focusing (unlike sets that proc on AoE DoT ticks) while still being fluid in a rotation. Maybe restrict it to melee Light Attacks if you don’t want it used by bow builds.

I’m sure that not everyone would like the set to rely on Light Attack weaving, but I’m guessing that same crowd would be more displeased with having to weave bash to be effective.

Why not proc on crit with reasonable cooldown so will be best for PVE and may do descent in PVP

Currently its proc condition is worst for PVE and may have some use in PVP

The bash proc makes it the most precise proc dps has, it goes off exactly when and where you want it to. Also it means you have to actually do something to get that bonus damage. Its not merely firing off on cooldown for free damage, you have to work for it in a sense and make it part of your rotation.

As I already mentioned it adds unnecessary clunk for PVE rotations. There's plenty things to worry about as a stam DPS in end game content besides having to bash every 7s.
Between stupid animations of volley and caltrops, where LA won't fire unless you cast them right after bar-swap, universally acknowledged skill issues of necros, such as corpse targeting, blast-bones being dumb, overall complex dynamic rotations for majority of classes due to mis-match of skill durations, fight for synergies that you now also need to take on a front bar (cuz lokkestiz set), staying out of negative effects and in general survival. We definitely don't need more mechanical challenges in a form of bash set procking.
Not to mention you have no visual confirmation of when it's up and ready unless you are using addon (which doesn't even exist yet). And guess what, console players don't get to use addons.

SodanTok

slofwnd wrote: »

Excelsus wrote: »

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

slofwnd wrote: »

Not sure if anyone mentioned, but Maarselok monster helm will be meta for stam DPS this patch, so please make proc condition something other than bash, because as stam dps you already have bunch of clunky animations in the rotation, having to bash weave would make it even more frustrating. Not to mention effect on sustain.

Light attack as a trigger seems to work well on other sets. It allows you to make sure it hits the target you are focusing (unlike sets that proc on AoE DoT ticks) while still being fluid in a rotation. Maybe restrict it to melee Light Attacks if you don’t want it used by bow builds.

I’m sure that not everyone would like the set to rely on Light Attack weaving, but I’m guessing that same crowd would be more displeased with having to weave bash to be effective.

Why not proc on crit with reasonable cooldown so will be best for PVE and may do descent in PVP

Currently its proc condition is worst for PVE and may have some use in PVP

The bash proc makes it the most precise proc dps has, it goes off exactly when and where you want it to. Also it means you have to actually do something to get that bonus damage. Its not merely firing off on cooldown for free damage, you have to work for it in a sense and make it part of your rotation.

As I already mentioned it adds unnecessary clunk for PVE rotations. There's plenty things to worry about as a stam DPS in end game content besides having to bash every 7s.
Between stupid animations of volley and caltrops, where LA won't fire unless you cast them right after bar-swap, universally acknowledged skill issues of necros, such as corpse targeting, blast-bones being dumb, overall complex dynamic rotations for majority of classes due to mis-match of skill durations, fight for synergies that you now also need to take on a front bar (cuz lokkestiz set), staying out of negative effects and in general survival. We definitely don't need more mechanical challenges in a form of bash set procking.
Not to mention you have no visual confirmation of when it's up and ready unless you are using addon (which doesn't even exist yet). And guess what, console players don't get to use addons.

Try not using it?

WrathOfInnos

I’m imagining trying to kill the statues in Nahviintaas HM after every stam DPS is forced to train themselves to bash cancel in rotation. Like the current level of accidental bashing isn’t bad enough...

Lord_Eomer

Excelsus wrote: »

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

slofwnd wrote: »

Not sure if anyone mentioned, but Maarselok monster helm will be meta for stam DPS this patch, so please make proc condition something other than bash, because as stam dps you already have bunch of clunky animations in the rotation, having to bash weave would make it even more frustrating. Not to mention effect on sustain.

Light attack as a trigger seems to work well on other sets. It allows you to make sure it hits the target you are focusing (unlike sets that proc on AoE DoT ticks) while still being fluid in a rotation. Maybe restrict it to melee Light Attacks if you don’t want it used by bow builds.

I’m sure that not everyone would like the set to rely on Light Attack weaving, but I’m guessing that same crowd would be more displeased with having to weave bash to be effective.

Why not proc on crit with reasonable cooldown so will be best for PVE and may do descent in PVP

Currently its proc condition is worst for PVE and may have some use in PVP

The bash proc makes it the most precise proc dps has, it goes off exactly when and where you want it to. Also it means you have to actually do something to get that bonus damage. Its not merely firing off on cooldown for free damage, you have to work for it in a sense and make it part of your rotation.

Bash will cost more stam in Dual Wield/2H, its not suitable for PVE rotation.

ZOS will probably ruin good set if staying to proc on bash.

Many would love it and use this if proc condition to be changed.

Bash will only make it super set for PVP and soon we will see a big nerf hammer

jypcy

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

I’m imagining trying to kill the statues in Nahviintaas HM after every stam DPS is forced to train themselves to bash cancel in rotation. Like the current level of accidental bashing isn’t bad enough...

You’re not wrong, but it looks like the current highest stam parses are using arena weapons both front and back, meaning nobody (who I’ve seen) is using this set for top tier dps anyway. If you have an example of a build using it, though, I’d definitely be interested to see how it’s used and how it performs.

I also generally think it’s good if the most powerful sets require extra effort. That doesn’t mean it has to be bashing in this case, but it’d be disappointing to see a monster set as powerful as Maarselok looks to be made as easy to use as “when you light attack an enemy every 7 seconds.”

Edit: and for transparency, with how powerful ST dots are expected to be, I’d be happy to see vma dw slightly nerfed as well for the amount of damage they add for relatively little effort.

Gray_Raven

Ravager not proccing/showing up in character sheet while parsing on Iron Atronach Dummy. All other dummies proc as intended: 5 secs on 1-3 stack, and 10 secs on 4th stack. Tested stam-DK using Noxious breath/Caltrops to fracture.

master_vanargand

Over 80% of Crafted Sets are trash.
Buff them all.

JRsoFly_123

Solariken wrote: »

Veiled Heritance got obliterated. We all know it needed minor adjustment but you guys tossed it right in the garbage.

Why not something like this:

When you bash an enemy, gain 100 weapon damage for 5 seconds, stacking up to 5 times.

I do like you working in the realm of what the dev's originally planned which was bashing, but I think it's still just kind of a weird thing. I do want sets with fun and interesting dynamic that can be useful but I don't want to bash anymore than I need to like just for interrupting. Though your suggestion really is still op lol..you'd just have to change your rotation a bit and it could work with the new monster set coming out.

However, I think this set should be changed into what it was mostly used for (besides stam dps) is solo builds. Like builds for trying to solo dungeons and soloing world bosses + maelstrom. So maybe

Increased damage if minor maim/major maim is active on a target or something. This way it opens up for solo build uses and stam dps.

JRsoFly_123

My problem with many of the set changes which can be beneficial or hurtful to playstyles is the guarantee proc sets. I think as for as gameplay-wise ZOS needs to be careful on how these procs are implemented to not exclude or hurt build diversity. Keeping it general but specific like the seventh legion changes about buffing armor every 10 seconds will give these bonuses.

There are many abilities that buff armor so it still keeps those bonuses. Though it would be nice to have a minor resolve and minor ward more available again somewhere in the game. Although, big PLUS for having minor protection for tanks in puncture morph.

SeaUnicorn

Still no word on skill altering weapons that got negatively affected by the changes to underlying skills, such as Master resto, Master Destro, Maelstrom bow.

master_vanargand

I want add bonus status to MA weapons & DSA weapons & Old trial sets.
These should get the same bonus as the perfect sets.

Rehdaun

from pts 5.1.2: Many item sets introduced or reworked in this update will receive additional balance tweaks in a future PTS patch.

Armor of the Veiled Heritance change from pts 5.1.0 still utterly useless! Hope this gets changed to be at least remotely useful in at least a few situations instead of being the turd it is now.

Joosef_Kivikilpi

rumple9 wrote: »

VMA lightning staffs need looking at as they are useless now with the changes to lightning damage

What changes are you talking about?

Cinbri

Renald’s Resolve need some serious improvement of its effects. Its full stack is equal to minor vitality + armor buff, so literally same like Indomitable Fury or Naga Shaman - both sets that even with capability of having 2 minor buffs with 100% uptime still proved to be garbage because of how weak it still is. Renald at current state will just follow them into being useless.
Slimecraw - follow same sets from above but don't evn have 2 minor buffs, only 1. That making set not what monster set power supposed to be. Just give it another super strong minor defensive buff, so set will have 1 offensive/1defensive at least.

JazzyNova

Don't know if this change was intentional or not, but I noticed a difference in the Infallible Aether/Mage set, particularly with lightning staves. Now the heavy attack has to be completed in order for the debuff to be applied, like inferno and ice staves. It was applied almost immediately with a medium lighting staff attack, which healers rely on. Hopefully this change isn't permanent.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8J7Ppy9Cdc