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Twilight Matriarch is overperforming
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Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭now kids be like nooo you cant have a pet or a healing ward, JUST DIEEE SORCs DIEEEEEE!
They should reduce the proc time on Healing Ward to 3 seconds or something. 6 seconds is way too long.
They should also make it so damage shields are LIFO (last in, first out) instead of FIFO (first in, first out). This would make it much easier to "protect" the Healing Ward until it procs.
Edited by Emma_Overload on July 5, 2019 12:47PM#CAREBEARMASTERRACE0 -
CambionDaemon✭✭✭Seraphayel wrote: »
PetSorc's can complete with stamina, NonPet cannot. And MagSorc's are not the best PvP class at all.0 -
master_vanargand✭✭✭✭✭
✭CambionDaemon wrote: »Seraphayel wrote: »
PetSorc's can complete with stamina, NonPet cannot. And MagSorc's are not the best PvP class at all.
PetSorc is the best PvP class.Edited by master_vanargand on July 5, 2019 2:04PM3 -
Alienoutlaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭another "i'm getting stomped by x-class so it needs nerfing because it cant be that a player is just better than me" post.
Sorcs have been the most heavily "balanced" class's in the game1 -
Suddwrath✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Alienoutlaw wrote: »another "i'm getting stomped by x-class so it needs nerfing because it cant be that a player is just better than me" post.
Sorcs have been the most heavily "balanced" class's in the game
If you would read the last paragraph in the post you would see that your statement is simply incorrect.1 -
Seraphayel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭CambionDaemon wrote: »Seraphayel wrote: »
PetSorc's can complete with stamina, NonPet cannot. And MagSorc's are not the best PvP class at all.
Best Magicka PvP class? Yes, they absolutely are.
Best PvP class overall? Well, at least Top 3 but MagSorc is still at / near the top.
And I don’t really see the PetSorc argument as an argument. It’s a viable build, other classes don’t have this advantage and all of their (Magicka) builds suck.Edited by Seraphayel on July 5, 2019 3:22PMPS5EUAldmeri Dominion- Khajiit Arcanist -2 -
CambionDaemon✭✭✭Magplar is better for PvP than a non pet sorc. And that is part of the problem, PetSorc and NonPet are completely different playstyles, they have pushed pets because they do not want/cannot change the Daedric skill line.
And the top three PvP classes are all stamina, Necro/StamSorc/Stamblade. the only reason that MagSorc can compete with stamina at the moment is because of pets, so if you start changing/nerfing pets then just remove magicka because no magicka will be able to compete.2 -
Mitaka211✭✭✭✭CambionDaemon wrote: »Magplar is better for PvP than a non pet sorc. And that is part of the problem, PetSorc and NonPet are completely different playstyles, they have pushed pets because they do not want/cannot change the Daedric skill line.
And the top three PvP classes are all stamina, Necro/StamSorc/Stamblade. the only reason that MagSorc can compete with stamina at the moment is because of pets, so if you start changing/nerfing pets then just remove magicka because no magicka will be able to compete.CambionDaemon wrote: »Magplar is better for PvP than a non pet sorc. And that is part of the problem, PetSorc and NonPet are completely different playstyles, they have pushed pets because they do not want/cannot change the Daedric skill line.
And the top three PvP classes are all stamina, Necro/StamSorc/Stamblade. the only reason that MagSorc can compete with stamina at the moment is because of pets, so if you start changing/nerfing pets then just remove magicka because no magicka will be able to compete.
Non pet magsorcs are actually really fun to fight and they don't feel op in any way to me. The only problem people have with sorcs are pet sorcs , in most cases people just don't specify when they talk about magsorcs. Hey if i noticed something , it's that most pet sorcs don't even want to be a pet sorc lol0 -
Priyasekarssk✭✭✭✭✭CambionDaemon wrote: »Magplar is better for PvP than a non pet sorc. And that is part of the problem, PetSorc and NonPet are completely different playstyles, they have pushed pets because they do not want/cannot change the Daedric skill line.
And the top three PvP classes are all stamina, Necro/StamSorc/Stamblade. the only reason that MagSorc can compete with stamina at the moment is because of pets, so if you start changing/nerfing pets then just remove magicka because no magicka will be able to compete.CambionDaemon wrote: »Magplar is better for PvP than a non pet sorc. And that is part of the problem, PetSorc and NonPet are completely different playstyles, they have pushed pets because they do not want/cannot change the Daedric skill line.
And the top three PvP classes are all stamina, Necro/StamSorc/Stamblade. the only reason that MagSorc can compete with stamina at the moment is because of pets, so if you start changing/nerfing pets then just remove magicka because no magicka will be able to compete.
Non pet magsorcs are actually really fun to fight and they don't feel op in any way to me. The only problem people have with sorcs are pet sorcs , in most cases people just don't specify when they talk about magsorcs. Hey if i noticed something , it's that most pet sorcs don't even want to be a pet sorc lolCambionDaemon wrote: »Magplar is better for PvP than a non pet sorc. And that is part of the problem, PetSorc and NonPet are completely different playstyles, they have pushed pets because they do not want/cannot change the Daedric skill line.
And the top three PvP classes are all stamina, Necro/StamSorc/Stamblade. the only reason that MagSorc can compete with stamina at the moment is because of pets, so if you start changing/nerfing pets then just remove magicka because no magicka will be able to compete.
Already these noobs begged, begged and begged for lack of skill. AD is almost out of all alliance wars by scoring only one-third of the lowest leading alliance. High elf mage sorcs are extinct in cyrodil. Permanent emperors are common nowadays.
Even with the horrible lopsided racial balance to appease streamers, for their lack of skill, these noobs never learned to get good. Alliance wars are the joke of all time with perma emperors and leading DC or EP alliance win by a margin of 3 times the score.
15K AI NPC pet is overpowered for them
. If you die to a NPC with 15K health without a strong debuff, it's not a problem with the game. You are not fit to play any competitive game. Period. The problem is L2P. These garbage noobs always want more cheese. They don't want any competitive gameplay. All they want is only mud crabs to fight with. Now, these noobs want Perma gating and only NPCs in the opponent alliance.
Good luck noobs in destroying the game. This game is going in right direction to abolute garbage PVP. What next buff stamsorc and ORc and other DC races ?Edited by Priyasekarssk on July 6, 2019 3:07PM1 -
mcagatayg✭✭✭✭Tormentor is too weak. No reason to choose it. Weak ass dps increase over a utility.1 -
universal_wrath✭✭✭✭✭Twighlit matraich should do HOT on friendly/or self what ever lower as a passive instead of dmg, and burst heal as active, tormentor morph should have something like 25-30% dmg increase justify its use. Now player has to choose between heal or dmg, both have different passive and active.4 -
Priyasekarssk✭✭✭✭✭universal_wrath wrote: »Twighlit matraich should do HOT on friendly/or self what ever lower as a passive instead of dmg, and burst heal as active, tormentor morph should have something like 25-30% dmg increase justify its use. Now player has to choose between heal or dmg, both have different passive and active.
Just remove the Pet. Give burst heal with snare removal.0 -
Saril_Durzam✭✭✭✭universal_wrath wrote: »Twighlit matraich should do HOT on friendly/or self what ever lower as a passive instead of dmg, and burst heal as active, tormentor morph should have something like 25-30% dmg increase justify its use. Now player has to choose between heal or dmg, both have different passive and active.
Do you think anyone would waste two slots on that, except maybe on a (rare) Sorc healer build?
It´s ok to lose defences if offence is put on par with stamina builds, which still have better defences than magicka characters (Vigor, multiple dodge-break defence, higher resistances, etc...). Just a DPS augment on tormentor wouldn´t get that, so it would mean a flat nerf to a class which, despite what you say, it´s not overperforming.
If we have to do game changes, in my humble opinion, let´s improve weaker classes and don´t buff stronger ones. If you want aswell, give stamina morphs to classes with bad stamina builds. Improve magicka skills of classes with weak magicka builds. That is all.
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shaielzafine✭✭✭✭✭Asking for twilight matriarch to be dumbed down rather than tormentor to be buffed and do more? This game is already too much nerf roulette and you want more??? And that nerf is not a buff to sorcerer healers, healers in good groups output as much DPS as possible while keeping buffs up. Overhealing doesn't help anybody. These nerf sorc threads never end1
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Seraphayel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭shaielzafine wrote: »Asking for twilight matriarch to be dumbed down rather than tormentor to be buffed and do more? This game is already too much nerf roulette and you want more??? And that nerf is not a buff to sorcerer healers, healers in good groups output as much DPS as possible while keeping buffs up. Overhealing doesn't help anybody. These nerf sorc threads never end
Okay, you see the controversy here?
Healers in good groups output
as much DPS as possible
while keeping buffs up
So instead of actually healing healers are degraded to deal damage and buff others - there you have the problem.
By the way Matriarch will be an amazing skill for Sorc healers after the changes to Healing Springs, a skill other classes like NB and DK lack at the moment.PS5EUAldmeri Dominion- Khajiit Arcanist -0 -
zvavi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭What? They gutted the matriach damage to non-existent. Even the tormentor was nerfed. If you include the previous curse nerf, tormentor is now even weaker before he was buffed. No one used him then.Edited by zvavi on July 7, 2019 1:10PM1 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭What? They gutted the matriach damage to non-existent. Even the tormentor was nerfed. If you include the previous curse nerf, tormentor is now even weaker before he was buffed. No one used him then.
Exaclty, finally someone hwo say it.
When matriarch got buffed by CPs applying to their light attacks, both morphs took around 30-35% damage buff.
ZoS first nerfed pets damage from deadric prey by 15%.
Now ZoS is nerfing healing matriarch by 69%.
And tormentor by 35%.
Healing matriach is now useless and far worst than before when no one used it pre buff. The morph is now bad for anything related to not being a healer.
Tourment also deal less damage than prebuff.
People claiming "it was deserved" has no idea of what balance is about.2 -
Seraphayel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Balance is about not having a pet that has crazy healing and damage capabilities all of that doing without much attention required from the Sorcerer. Not to talk about the massive LoS issues pets cause in PvP.
Matriarch nerf is totally fine. Tormentor nerf... wasn’t necessary. Tormentor should be the DPS and Matriarch the healing (and just healing, nothing else) pet.Edited by Seraphayel on July 7, 2019 4:01PMPS5EUAldmeri Dominion- Khajiit Arcanist -0 -
norrisnick✭✭✭Seraphayel wrote: »Balance is about not having a pet that has crazy healing and damage capabilities all of that doing without much attention required from the Sorcerer. Not to talk about the massive LoS issues pets cause in PvP.
Matriarch nerf is totally fine. Tormentor nerf... wasn’t necessary. Tormentor should be the DPS and Matriarch the healing (and just healing, nothing else) pet.
Sure. If you make them single-bar. Neither one is worth double-slotting with the proposed changes.Edited by norrisnick on July 7, 2019 4:22PM2 -
Seraphayel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭norrisnick wrote: »Seraphayel wrote: »Balance is about not having a pet that has crazy healing and damage capabilities all of that doing without much attention required from the Sorcerer. Not to talk about the massive LoS issues pets cause in PvP.
Matriarch nerf is totally fine. Tormentor nerf... wasn’t necessary. Tormentor should be the DPS and Matriarch the healing (and just healing, nothing else) pet.
Sure. If you make them single-bar. Neither one is worth double-slotting with the proposed changes.
They’re both still pets providing automatic attacks (or heals in the case of my proposed Matriarch change) and giving you the passive bonuses by just spotting them. Matriarch will be a great healer tool and the other one good for DPS. Single-bar permanent pets won’t be a thing.PS5EUAldmeri Dominion- Khajiit Arcanist -0 -
coletas✭✭✭✭Petsorc will be overpowered even with the 69% nerf. Problem is with the horrible targeting of this game and the horrible IA plus teleports, not with the damage or healing it provides to the caster with just one button.0
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Even with the nerfs pet sorc will honestly be fine since they've been able to match the users stats they moved into the golden age.1 -
Saril_Durzam✭✭✭✭Well, the Sorc nerf was expected: even perfoming worse than stamina DPS, looks like ZOS wants Stamina to be the only ones to reign in the DPS spot. With Matriarch DPS nerf, it´s just taking DPS out a class that was under DPSing compared with other DPS classes (stamina, that is).
Id agree on that nerf if other DPS areas of the Sorc would be buffed. It´s not happening so it´s a plain nerf. Again: sustain issues, lack of self protection (now), and less DPS? They didn´t have a regular spot on trials, now Sorcs will be supar also on dungeons.
Too good my main is a Templar, but ofc i will play much less my Sorc than my Warden or specially my stamNecro due this constant nerfing.
Oh wait, i forgot. AOE skills damage nerfed. Lightning splash damage nerfed. Shields got nerfed aswell, much costier and less size. Its just not Matriach...
Too much for one patch. As i said, im glad it´s not my main...
Edited by Saril_Durzam on July 8, 2019 10:08AM0 -
Saril_Durzam✭✭✭✭Petsorc will be overpowered even with the 69% nerf. Problem is with the horrible targeting of this game and the horrible IA plus teleports, not with the damage or healing it provides to the caster with just one button.
Check the entire notes. It´s just not the nerf (which is easily a 3k DPS nerf, btw). It´s the shield nerf: will cost 600 more magicka and will protect less. It´s the Lightning Splash nerf: 37% dmg less. It´s the AOE dot nerf (most every skill in pet sorc arsenal).
Too many ones for a class that, again, it´s not topping on DPS charts. One could argue that pet healing would make up for having less DPS. Now the DPS gap is even closer and if Sorcs want to not use Matriarch for not losing that much DPS, then it´s basically defenceless (Shields too expensive to use on a class with lots of sustain problems, not other heal but Power Surge which is expensive and a hot that needs to keep criting to work, or Dark Exchange which has a channel which hurts DPS alot), less resistances due armor type, etc...0 -
coletas✭✭✭✭Saril_Durzam wrote: »Petsorc will be overpowered even with the 69% nerf. Problem is with the horrible targeting of this game and the horrible IA plus teleports, not with the damage or healing it provides to the caster with just one button.
Check the entire notes. It´s just not the nerf (which is easily a 3k DPS nerf, btw). It´s the shield nerf: will cost 600 more magicka and will protect less. It´s the Lightning Splash nerf: 37% dmg less. It´s the AOE dot nerf (most every skill in pet sorc arsenal).
Too many ones for a class that, again, it´s not topping on DPS charts. One could argue that pet healing would make up for having less DPS. Now the DPS gap is even closer and if Sorcs want to not use Matriarch for not losing that much DPS, then it´s basically defenceless (Shields too expensive to use on a class with lots of sustain problems, not other heal but Power Surge which is expensive and a hot that needs to keep criting to work, or Dark Exchange which has a channel which hurts DPS alot), less resistances due armor type, etc...
And that's why PvP and pve should be 2 worlds apart in terms of skills. Sustain problems, do like every orher class, heavy attacks. Dont know why sorcers can walk in PvP with ridiculous resistances all sets for dps and sustain while everybody else has to stack a pile of resistances etc. In pve , for me, i dont mind since this game is too easy. I have done vMA with PvP sets and templar except last Boss that i had to use all dps sets. Petsorcs in PvP were (and still are) really op. Even really non-skilled player are able to kill or at least leave a fight with very skilled players. And well, 2-3 petsorcs are a nightmare even in open field0 -
Perashim✭✭✭Not a huge fan of the pet hammer nerfs, but at least it gives me a solid reason to use the Twilight Tormentor over the Matriarch(since I vastly prefer the Clannfear over the scamp from my oblivion days).
I'd still wish they would implement a feature that makes it unsummon itself when going inside crafting areas and then resummon when leaving.Edited by Perashim on July 8, 2019 2:15PM"...and storms shall sunder the skies, and war will tear the world apart, and the dead shall rule the lands."0 -
Saril_Durzam✭✭✭✭Seraphayel wrote: »
So instead of actually healing healers are degraded to deal damage and buff others - there you have the problem.
By the way Matriarch will be an amazing skill for Sorc healers after the changes to Healing Springs, a skill other classes like NB and DK lack at the moment.
Are you kidding? Check logs. Noone serious plays a healer except Templar and Warden. Even more with Orbs and new healing nerfs. Nor Sorcs nor DKs or NBs will have the tools to effectively heal on vet DLC dungeons or trials.
Again: Sorcerers atm are a pure DPS class, both on mag and stam. Taking DPS away from them or tools to use while DPSing is a total waste.0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think several sorcs (sadly mostly the better ones) would trade the twilight for a burst heal (or a bursty on demand hot) and an actual dot ability. It´s just not available.
Hey - it´s like my prayers were answered. Good riddance purple carry chicken <Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Saril_Durzam✭✭✭✭
Or a skill like NB that heals you while DPSing so you dont waste GDCs. That would be even better.0