Earthgore.... is it heading for nerfdom?

Vicarra

jcm2606 wrote: »

In my opinion, the OP part of this set is how the cooldown can be bypassed by having multiple people wearing it. A single person wearing it, saving an entire group for doing basically nothing, is annoying, but it's manageable. Once it procs, you have a 35 second window to take down whoever's wearing it, then continue slaying everybody else. A single person wearing it isn't OP.

What's OP is when multiple people wear it, effectively bypassing the cooldown. You could have one Earthgore go off, dump everything you've got into killing everybody, only for a second Earthgore to proc and reset the fight in their favour. Maybe a third, or a fourth, while we're at it.

What should happen, IMO, is the cooldown should be moved from the proc itself, to the recipients. Have Earthgore apply a cooldown on any player it heals, so that when a player receives healing from Earthgore, they cannot receive it again until the cooldown is over. To prevent Earthgore constantly proccing, add a short cooldown to the proc itself. This fixes the issue of Earthgore stacking, while still keeping it as a viable AOE healing set. A single person running the set is unaffected, only multiple people running the set get nerfed.

This would actually be a very neat and elegant solution. The stacking of Earthgore in ball groups is the biggest problem, and simply preventing it stacking in the first place would be the best way to "nerf" the set.

People who are STILL claiming that the set "carries" "bad" healers need to get over themselves already. You can't just run the set, sit twiddling your thumbs, and insta-heal people every 35 seconds. You have to actually be healing people in order for it to proc in the first place, and it often doesn't proc where you want it to. It doesn't remove the need to heal at all, and pretending otherwise doesn't make you look smart.

Joy_Division

Juhasow wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

eso_lags wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Many people in this thread are not interpreting the rumors about this set correctly.

rumor wrote:

healing the lowest Health ally in the area for 31200 Health over 6 seconds

does not mean restricted to one target during the duration it's active..

Those who still think the rumored change is useless in PvE or PvP either do not understand how the rumored change would work or are just complaining for complaining's sake.

Why would people interpret it any other way?

(1 item) Adds 4% Healing Done
(2 items) When you heal yourself or an ally under 50% health, you conjure a pool of quenching blood underneath them, immediately removing all previous enemy placed effects, and healing the lowest Health ally in the area for 31200 Health over 6 seconds. This effect can occur once every 35 seconds.

From this it looks like it would have an aoe that removes negative effects from people who stand in it and then heal one person for 31k health.. If this is correct its worded kind of bad.

Either way the set should be nerfed. Zos needs to stop making it easy for people to be bots in this game. Brainless gameplay mechanics encourage people to be bad and never get better. I see it everyday. But if my interpretation of the change is correct then it seems like a decent change.

You are adding in the word "one." The rumor does not impose such a restriction. It says "lowest health ally". That could be one person in one second and another the next.

It kinda suggest that one ally will be healed for 30k hp in 6 seconds

I guess we'll find out next week.

Joy_Division

double

Jhalin

Vicarra wrote: »

jcm2606 wrote: »

In my opinion, the OP part of this set is how the cooldown can be bypassed by having multiple people wearing it. A single person wearing it, saving an entire group for doing basically nothing, is annoying, but it's manageable. Once it procs, you have a 35 second window to take down whoever's wearing it, then continue slaying everybody else. A single person wearing it isn't OP.

What's OP is when multiple people wear it, effectively bypassing the cooldown. You could have one Earthgore go off, dump everything you've got into killing everybody, only for a second Earthgore to proc and reset the fight in their favour. Maybe a third, or a fourth, while we're at it.

What should happen, IMO, is the cooldown should be moved from the proc itself, to the recipients. Have Earthgore apply a cooldown on any player it heals, so that when a player receives healing from Earthgore, they cannot receive it again until the cooldown is over. To prevent Earthgore constantly proccing, add a short cooldown to the proc itself. This fixes the issue of Earthgore stacking, while still keeping it as a viable AOE healing set. A single person running the set is unaffected, only multiple people running the set get nerfed.

This would actually be a very neat and elegant solution. The stacking of Earthgore in ball groups is the biggest problem, and simply preventing it stacking in the first place would be the best way to "nerf" the set.

People who are STILL claiming that the set "carries" "bad" healers need to get over themselves already. You can't just run the set, sit twiddling your thumbs, and insta-heal people every 35 seconds. You have to actually be healing people in order for it to proc in the first place, and it often doesn't proc where you want it to. It doesn't remove the need to heal at all, and pretending otherwise doesn't make you look smart.

It procs off any heal at all, so yes it does actually reduce the need for active healing.

It does reduce the need for positional awareness among the entire group.

It does surpass what any ultimate in the game can do, on a comparable cooldown with more people affected and more utility on top of that. Panacea is 125 ult before reductions, targets 4 people max at random, and even if you consider the entire total healing across every effected person, it still doesn’t match the healing of Earthgore.

You could compare it to Practiced Incantation which does 42k over 6s, but that one locks you out of movement and all other abilities, requires you notice a group mate falling low, does not remove ground effects, requires being nearby the low health group member, and has a similar cooldown to Earthgore via limited ultigen top of all those drawbacks.

Sure you may not be twiddling your thumbs, but you sure don’t have to pay near as much attention when every cast-and-forget HoT is a potential heal bigger than most ults can accomplish

p00tx

It would be really easy for me to just blame the complainers for getting this set nerfed, but there is a whole train of people to blame lined up ahead of them.

First, blame Zos for being foolish enough to drop a set like this in the Golden where any braindead zerglet with 300k AP could pick up the helm without having the skill to run the dungeon. Terrible decision and never should have happened. This set was already borderline overpowered with the small handful of PvPers who had access to it, but now it's everywhere and it is genuinely ruining PvP. DLC monster helms should either never drop in the golden, or should be WAY more expensive and locked behind a higher Cyrodil rank to purchase it.

Second, blame the weaker players crutching on it and running in giant blobs with 15-20 people running it (do not sneer and try to dismissively tell me it doesn't hit these levels of concentration. I spend a LOT of time in Cyrodil and see this stuff first hand).

Third, blame the hoards of Earthgore wearing PvE healers and tanks who send their toons through Vivec at the end of the campaign to zerg to tier 1 for transmute crystals.

EVERYONE overused the set, and as a result, it got too much attention and is [logically] getting a nerf. I advocated for saving it at the beginning, but even I can't defend it in Cyrodil now. It's absolutely disgusting in there anymore and I've actually stopped enjoying PvP. Yes, you can still kill weaker players through it, but why bother? If I wanted to fight nothing more than rng, I'd go PvE more often.

Glory

p00tx wrote: »

It's absolutely disgusting in there anymore and I've actually stopped enjoying PvP.

This is really important. It's a set in the game that doesn't make the user feel better about themselves, it makes their enemies feel worse. And content like that is not the right content.

Destyran

Everything good on the game is ruined by bowtards coz they can’t get their health desync gank off. I have 1vX people and you just kill them after the cool down. It’s a big cool down.

AnonomissX

Dude.

I am a Templar healer, and run the set. And..after a friend who FORCED me to run vet Bloodroot Forge to get my helmet, and then used my well-earned keys to get the shoulder, I say hey - the damn thing procs when it wants, I have no control over it. It goes off over someone else, and I have no control over it. It rarely goes off over ME when playing in PvP.

Meanwhile, I am busy with my PvP guild taking keeps and Scrolls in Vivec - Placing Forward Camps, spamming Breath of Life, putting up Siege Shield bubbles, hitting Purge, deciding when to put out Barrier or the "Oh ***" Remembrance ulti heal, knocking enemy players and NPC's back with my Piercing Javelin, laying down Ritual of Retribution and switching between my Resto and Lightning staves to power up my ultis. Oh, and running between keeps, I am putting out the Rapid Maneuvers.

So tell me when I get to be lazy again?

TequilaFire

Just let all your buds get below 50% health so it procs! /s

Universe

May the Earth swallow the Earthgore

eso_lags

Vicarra wrote: »

jcm2606 wrote: »

In my opinion, the OP part of this set is how the cooldown can be bypassed by having multiple people wearing it. A single person wearing it, saving an entire group for doing basically nothing, is annoying, but it's manageable. Once it procs, you have a 35 second window to take down whoever's wearing it, then continue slaying everybody else. A single person wearing it isn't OP.

What's OP is when multiple people wear it, effectively bypassing the cooldown. You could have one Earthgore go off, dump everything you've got into killing everybody, only for a second Earthgore to proc and reset the fight in their favour. Maybe a third, or a fourth, while we're at it.

What should happen, IMO, is the cooldown should be moved from the proc itself, to the recipients. Have Earthgore apply a cooldown on any player it heals, so that when a player receives healing from Earthgore, they cannot receive it again until the cooldown is over. To prevent Earthgore constantly proccing, add a short cooldown to the proc itself. This fixes the issue of Earthgore stacking, while still keeping it as a viable AOE healing set. A single person running the set is unaffected, only multiple people running the set get nerfed.

This would actually be a very neat and elegant solution. The stacking of Earthgore in ball groups is the biggest problem, and simply preventing it stacking in the first place would be the best way to "nerf" the set.

People who are STILL claiming that the set "carries" "bad" healers need to get over themselves already. You can't just run the set, sit twiddling your thumbs, and insta-heal people every 35 seconds. You have to actually be healing people in order for it to proc in the first place, and it often doesn't proc where you want it to. It doesn't remove the need to heal at all, and pretending otherwise doesn't make you look smart.

Actually the set does carry bad healers and is one of a few different things that encourage lazy gameplay and cause bad players to never improve. You can 100% sit there twiddling your thumbs and heal multiple people, i see it countless times every single day.

People dont even bother CC breaking anymore. Sure you have to throw out a heal every now and again, or keep a HoT going, but that doesnt mean people are doing a good job. Again, I fight countless people every day that are just bots and dont know how to play and are saved by that set.. That does not mean I wont end up killing them, it just means the fights are longer and they are saved by a single set when they dont deserve it. Plus everyone seems to be a tank this update so that makes fights longer too.

The set is just bad design. A lot of people need their best combo to burst tankier targets. Most of the time that will include an ultimate. An ultimate is usually up every 20-60 seconds depending on the build and ulti. So basically earthgore makes that combo irreverent, unless you get them low enough to have it proc and then go for your ulti during the cooldown. But thats not always possible these days because of sets like earthgore and since everyone wants to be a low damage dealing tank or healer.

drkfrontiers

One thing I despise about ESO is how 1% of the population can repeated #&#* it up for the rest of the players.

Jhalin

drkfrontiers wrote: »

One thing I despise about ESO is how 1% of the population can repeated #&#* it up for the rest of the players.

Except in this case it’s the 99% crutching on the set that’s getting it nerfed

TequilaFire

Lol the same 5 people posting the same hoopla a week later.

BoraxFlux

Healing in a PUG Cyro PvP is like hearding cats. The beauty of Earthgore is that I throw Rapid regeneration ( HoT) and Earthgore will proc on those as soon as one of the partymembers gets below 50%, even if he/she runs up the stairs in a keep and I'm still dishing out my repertoire at the first flag below. Or he / she is hold up by an enemy dd at the main gate and it will buy time for others to respond.

Once in 35 secs it is there where it is needed. Next to all my other tools, It is an emergency set for the unseen, it enhances the chances to give the enemy hell. Like prolonged boosted heal around a far corner when someone is in trouble. Yes I love it, and I could still use the set after the changes as it still has that emergency heal.

For the same reason I like Spell Power Cure set, throwing a HoT like Rapid Generation, and where ever players fan out, they will have a recurring chance for 10 secs of a Weapon or Spell Damage buff. That and Earthgore proccing on the HoT's.
To kill two birds with one stone.

If you want to be a lazy healer you got to be efficient.
My ultimate goal would therefore be to do /sitchair and /drink while PUGging a keep. Still far from reaching that alas.

Dunning_Kruger

Praise be!

Dunning_Kruger

AnonomissX wrote: »

Dude.

I am a Templar healer, and run the set. And..after a friend who FORCED me to run vet Bloodroot Forge to get my helmet, and then used my well-earned keys to get the shoulder, I say hey - the damn thing procs when it wants, I have no control over it. It goes off over someone else, and I have no control over it. It rarely goes off over ME when playing in PvP.

Meanwhile, I am busy with my PvP guild taking keeps and Scrolls in Vivec - Placing Forward Camps, spamming Breath of Life, putting up Siege Shield bubbles, hitting Purge, deciding when to put out Barrier or the "Oh ***" Remembrance ulti heal, knocking enemy players and NPC's back with my Piercing Javelin, laying down Ritual of Retribution and switching between my Resto and Lightning staves to power up my ultis. Oh, and running between keeps, I am putting out the Rapid Maneuvers.

So tell me when I get to be lazy again?

When you get caught with your pants down and a real small scale THICC boi hits you with a fatty coordinated ult and you and your large scale group get a free pass because you decided to wear a 2 piece. The set allows you to make mistakes and not be as harshly punished. It’s not a debate. It’s the truth.

Lab3360

eso_lags wrote: »

Vicarra wrote: »

jcm2606 wrote: »

In my opinion, the OP part of this set is how the cooldown can be bypassed by having multiple people wearing it. A single person wearing it, saving an entire group for doing basically nothing, is annoying, but it's manageable. Once it procs, you have a 35 second window to take down whoever's wearing it, then continue slaying everybody else. A single person wearing it isn't OP.

What's OP is when multiple people wear it, effectively bypassing the cooldown. You could have one Earthgore go off, dump everything you've got into killing everybody, only for a second Earthgore to proc and reset the fight in their favour. Maybe a third, or a fourth, while we're at it.

What should happen, IMO, is the cooldown should be moved from the proc itself, to the recipients. Have Earthgore apply a cooldown on any player it heals, so that when a player receives healing from Earthgore, they cannot receive it again until the cooldown is over. To prevent Earthgore constantly proccing, add a short cooldown to the proc itself. This fixes the issue of Earthgore stacking, while still keeping it as a viable AOE healing set. A single person running the set is unaffected, only multiple people running the set get nerfed.

This would actually be a very neat and elegant solution. The stacking of Earthgore in ball groups is the biggest problem, and simply preventing it stacking in the first place would be the best way to "nerf" the set.

People who are STILL claiming that the set "carries" "bad" healers need to get over themselves already. You can't just run the set, sit twiddling your thumbs, and insta-heal people every 35 seconds. You have to actually be healing people in order for it to proc in the first place, and it often doesn't proc where you want it to. It doesn't remove the need to heal at all, and pretending otherwise doesn't make you look smart.

Actually the set does carry bad healers and is one of a few different things that encourage lazy gameplay and cause bad players to never improve. You can 100% sit there twiddling your thumbs and heal multiple people, i see it countless times every single day.

People dont even bother CC breaking anymore. Sure you have to throw out a heal every now and again, or keep a HoT going, but that doesnt mean people are doing a good job. Again, I fight countless people every day that are just bots and dont know how to play and are saved by that set.. That does not mean I wont end up killing them, it just means the fights are longer and they are saved by a single set when they dont deserve it. Plus everyone seems to be a tank this update so that makes fights longer too.

The set is just bad design. A lot of people need their best combo to burst tankier targets. Most of the time that will include an ultimate. An ultimate is usually up every 20-60 seconds depending on the build and ulti. So basically earthgore makes that combo irreverent, unless you get them low enough to have it proc and then go for your ulti during the cooldown. But thats not always possible these days because of sets like earthgore and since everyone wants to be a low damage dealing tank or healer.

Most of us dont care about pvp.
I honestly don't know how you guys garner sooo much attention when the community is comprised mostly of pve players.

You guys constently ruin the game for us.

Banana

How many nerfs can one set take.