I miss magsorc

PhoenixGrey

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Eh, I'm not buying the sorc-OP-mantra. At very quick glance, we seem to be slightly better off this patch than Nerfmire. But the core problems, they are still there.

- sustained damage is still rather low, which leads to problems against targets you can't kill with one burst.
- skills are very telegraphed and easy to counter. Especially our execute is just hilariously useless now.
- following the telegraph, many skills are easily mitigated by wings, slabs, cloak, dodge and purge
- our toolkit doesn't work symbiotically: still no burst ult, Meteor doesn't combo with Rune Cage, we are ranged but get punished for opening gaps, we're supposed to use pets but they are stupid and demand two slots.
- burst, while potentially the highest in the game, is backloaded, which is far inferior to a frontloaded burst like shalks-dawnbreaker-spin2win
- sustain is low and our sustain tool demanding and dangerous, not to mention it breaks combat mechanics with that annoying delay after the cast
- bound to a Master staff, both hard to get and wasting two set boni
- Harness, although not sorc-specific, is OP against magicka users - but pathetic against stamina

And all that while certain heavy armor sets are blatantly OP, Stamblade damage output is sickening, DW reigns supreme and Dawnbreaker is just overloaded. Yeah, you can do work on a sorc with a lot of investment and opponent evaluation. But a skilled opponent can easily exploit our weaknesses. And a skilled sorc would probably multiply his performance on the meta classes.
Sorc needs a rather thorough overhaul. Not bandaids. By nerfing just about everything, ZOS brought this piece of work upon themselves. They have already hinted at such a rework and I hope they don't need another year for that.

I think this on point. Mag sorc is still just a potato farmer. Especially the non pet mag sorc is not competitive at all in the current meta.

1vx ' ing a bunch of potatoes or winning some dueling tournament is certainly never an indication on how a class performs.

NinchiTV

Its just *** compared to everything. Frag gets blocked and dodge

Checkmath wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

I miss dw sorc

I miss the days, were sorc qq actually was valid....oh wait.

Magsorc is considered the strongest magicka pvp class right now for duels and open world.
Battlegrounds get dominated by zoos, open world magsorcs have the best toolkit amongst magclasses to kite and lure out enemies till you can burst down one by one. In duels the spam of clench and weaving in the frags and curses deals extremely high damage with the amplitude passive. I am really not sure, why some people did not realize how strong magicka sorcerers are right now.

>strongest mag pvp class for duels/pvp
That goes to magplar, magden, magnb. plars cleanse and heal out burst EZ. den has its own shields that eat all projectiles along with decent dot and burst and nb does everything a sorc does but better. The only thing sorc has going for its self is curse and even then its not like its giving major fracture.

> best toolkit amongst magclasses to kite and lure out enemies till you can burst down one by one
Right, and when a group is thirsty and want to chase your 5 star ass down that doesnt matter because we can streak 3 times which cost 9k mag, any more that that and your mag gets depleted and what happens when somebody has a gap closer? all that streaking doesnt matter, and now youre snared, and you certainly cant face tank and you cant dodge or block sooo...

> In duels the spam of clench and weaving in the frags and curses deals extremely high damage with the amplitude passive.
Oh you mean the giant flame that anybody with a decent reaction time can block and dodge? And cast 3k per use which is easily counterplayed along with that slow moving rock? oh ya dude lot of damage there if youre lazy sitting on a keep way and doing that.

Ending point; make frag as fast as javelin, reduce cost of streak per use to 10%. And wouldnt it be nice to have to slot a pet on 1 bar only? now that is more welcoming to use a pet. Even if it becomes temporary (which is rumored on how necro pets will be)

Gilvoth

and i miss the incredible and fast sneak speeds we used to have to made us able to sneak as fast as horses.
it wasnt harming anyone and made the game fun.
let us have our fast sneak speeds back and you can have your old mag sorc back.
win - win

Priyasekarssk

Checkmath wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

I miss dw sorc

I miss the days, were sorc qq actually was valid....oh wait.

Magsorc is considered the strongest magicka pvp class right now for duels and open world.
Battlegrounds get dominated by zoos, open world magsorcs have the best toolkit amongst magclasses to kite and lure out enemies till you can burst down one by one. In duels the spam of clench and weaving in the frags and curses deals extremely high damage with the amplitude passive. I am really not sure, why some people did not realize how strong magicka sorcerers are right now.

Mage sorc is no where near stamden, stamplars , Nbs or DKs. Reason is simple . Magic sorc have hard counters with no debuffs , no snares, No snare removal, CCs with highly telegraphed burst ( Garbage and only good at killing potatoes). If you killed by mage sorc in PVP then there is something you need to L2P. Period. On 1VX you will be eaten alive vs good group. No way you can escape. I have every counter you have whatever you can throw. If you streak I will gap close or pull chain. Your streak explode in costs.

No matter how hard NB & DK class representatives crying hard shamelessly . Mage sorc is complete bottom tier in PVP.

On the other side, Mage sorc seen some improvement in PVE. It cannot compete with NB or Stamden still, but gap is somewhat closer than before in PVE. PVP its gone a lot lot worse than before.

Please start lying with some potato videos. Cry NBs, wardens and DKs are weak in PVP. So much afraid of competitive gameplay and balanced game always needs more cheese as existing cheese is not sufficient ? I cannot blame people who lie and cry for cheese. Its ZOs fault still classes are unbalanced.

" Magsorc is considered the strongest magicka pvp class right now for duels and open world." This is such a shameless lie. Anyway good joke.
Please duel my DK or any top DKs with your mage sorc and win atleast 1 in 100 matches.

CyrusArya

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Well, you're not luring with pets, they're too stupid. And without them, you're not as powerful in those 1v1 encounters, as you admitted they are the strength. Proves my point, no synergy. Bad design.

Really? Cus I’m sure myself and others such as Iryllia have won dueling tournaments without a single pet....last patch. Sorc w/o pets is a top dueling spec rn if you know how to play it. And with them it is one of if not the strongest spec in the game all around. And in fact matriarch builds were last patch too.

If you’re struggling on Sorc in Wrathstone, I hate to break it to you, but it’s not the class that’s the issue.

bardx86

Priyasekarssk wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

I miss dw sorc

I miss the days, were sorc qq actually was valid....oh wait.

Magsorc is considered the strongest magicka pvp class right now for duels and open world.
Battlegrounds get dominated by zoos, open world magsorcs have the best toolkit amongst magclasses to kite and lure out enemies till you can burst down one by one. In duels the spam of clench and weaving in the frags and curses deals extremely high damage with the amplitude passive. I am really not sure, why some people did not realize how strong magicka sorcerers are right now.

Mage sorc is no where near stamden, stamplars , Nbs or DKs. Reason is simple . Magic sorc have hard counters with no debuffs , no snares, No snare removal, CCs with highly telegraphed burst ( Garbage and only good at killing potatoes). If you killed by mage sorc in PVP then there is something you need to L2P. Period. On 1VX you will be eaten alive vs good group. No way you can escape. I have every counter you have whatever you can throw. If you streak I will gap close or pull chain. Your streak explode in costs.

No matter how hard NB & DK class representatives crying hard shamelessly . Mage sorc is complete bottom tier in PVP.

On the other side, Mage sorc seen some improvement in PVE. It cannot compete with NB or Stamden still, but gap is somewhat closer than before in PVE. PVP its gone a lot lot worse than before.

Please start lying with some potato videos. Cry NBs, wardens and DKs are weak in PVP. So much afraid of competitive gameplay and balanced game always needs more cheese as existing cheese is not sufficient ? I cannot blame people who lie and cry for cheese. Its ZOs fault still classes are balanced.

" Magsorc is considered the strongest magicka pvp class right now for duels and open world." This is such a shameless lie. Anyway good joke.
Please duel my DK or any top DKs with your mage sorc and win atleast 1 in 100 matches.

I'd like to add to this. I can't believe a class rep is saying this and it makes me reevaluate if the class reps know what they are talking about. Sustain sucks! Mages wrath in addition to being able to be dodged twice is flat out broken, if the target moves too fast after the initial cast it will not land, this is being exploited to no end. Streak cost to dam much for how slow it is 80% of the time you get knocked down before the skills animation finishes, why doesn't this work as fast as cloak? Frags misses twice as much as it land and its to dam slow as well, I'm not talking about it being dodged either it just will miss. Over all the Sorc skills are to unreliable.

I'm not saying you can't be successful on a Sorc but its a very frustrating play style as the feel of the skills are off. To call them top tier is a flat out lie.

brandonv516

lol @ Magsorc being in a worst spot for PvP than Magblade...

And another lol because I'm not done yet.

Noctus

U DONT HAVE ANY RIGHT TO COMPLAIN UNTILL WE MAGBLADES ARE BUFFED

Lord-Otto

CyrusArya wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Well, you're not luring with pets, they're too stupid. And without them, you're not as powerful in those 1v1 encounters, as you admitted they are the strength. Proves my point, no synergy. Bad design.

Really? Cus I’m sure myself and others such as Iryllia have won dueling tournaments without a single pet....last patch. Sorc w/o pets is a top dueling spec rn if you know how to play it. And with them it is one of if not the strongest spec in the game all around. And in fact matriarch builds were last patch too.

If you’re struggling on Sorc in Wrathstone, I hate to break it to you, but it’s not the class that’s the issue.

No, it's not.
It's the lag, the atrocious targeting system. The clunkiness of skills. Also my enemies actually knowing what they're doing.
I have little respect for your cute dueling friendship clubs where you set some arbitrary rules to forbid all the stuff you can't deal with. It sure is a good test of player skill, but says very little about actual balancing. Hate to break it to you, but your sandbox doesn't mean #$/^& for this discussion.

PhoenixGrey

From a pure solo player's perspective I would consider anything top tier only if it performs consistently inside a competitive environment

High MMR BG's is the closest we have got to a competitive environment and when you put in the top tier BG players in the same BG , that's when you notice the real clunkiness of the class.

Your frags will be dodged / reflected due to its million years travel time. Your trash execute will be dodged
You will have DK's with 100% uptime on wings
You will have multiple sload dots on you
You will be playing in ice fields
You will be perma snared
You will be chain pulled when you try to escape
You will have multiple bleeds ticking on you
You can even expect a bunch of nightblades wearing shieldbreaker !

All those hardcounters haven't been addressed but that's how the real meta looks like. The only thing that does help is the invaluable martiach heal but it only migitates the problem. Its not in a controlled duel environment or a potato farming expedition with a small scale group or a 1vX where I admit that sorc excels right now !

The sorcs in this forum and class reps here already know this but still sorc is top tier right ? I pretty sure a mega sorc nerf is coming but the class reps really need to think about it !

CyrusArya

Lord-Otto wrote: »

No, it's not.
It's the lag, the atrocious targeting system. The clunkiness of skills. Also my enemies actually knowing what they're doing.
I have little respect for your cute dueling friendship clubs where you set some arbitrary rules to forbid all the stuff you can't deal with. It sure is a good test of player skill, but says very little about actual balancing. Hate to break it to you, but your sandbox doesn't mean #$/^& for this discussion.

The reason rule sets exist is to ban elements of ESO that are blatantly op 1v1 (e.g Meridia’s, Troll King, Sloads, Sorc Pets etc) or to prevent stalemates. Incidentally, those rules cripple Sorc the most of any class! Pet Sorc is by far the single strongest duel spec in the entire game. Yet even without pets, Sorc is a winning class. It is the only case where my open world build is in fact stronger 1v1 than my dueling spec, but I remove my Matriarch and Atronach out of respect and decency.

I wonder if the irony of your post is lost on you, given that Sorc is actually even stronger outside these rules than within them.

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

The sorcs in this forum and class reps here already know this but still sorc is top tier right ? I pretty sure a mega sorc nerf is coming but the class reps really need to think about it !

Idk that sorc needs a mega nerf but Sorc absolutely is top tier in PvP, including BGs. If you were to assemble the most high end pre made comp possible for Team Deathmatch, one of those 4 spots would be reserved for a Sorc every single time.

Urvoth

I think for sorc right now, it's more of a question about class synergy and kit composition rather than if you can get kills or not. You can still do perfectly fine on a sorc, but that doesn't mean the class kit isn't outdated and doesn't need a rework. The class is in dire need of a rework(not nerf or buff) to bring it in line with other classes in terms of build and playstyle flexibility.

PhoenixGrey

CyrusArya wrote: »

Idk that sorc needs a mega nerf but Sorc absolutely is top tier in PvP, including BGs. If you were to assemble the most high end pre made comp possible for Team Deathmatch, one of those 4 spots would be reserved for a Sorc every single time.

Going by the way sorcs self proclaim they are OP, I will not rule out the mega nerf possibility. The general chatter from sorcs themselves (not you) gives me an impression everyone is a god tier solo PVP'er and 1vx'ing and zerg wiping everyone they come across in vivec. (IDK if vivec is ever playable though)

I remember the last time this happened a certain skill was butchered 8 times in a row after which sorc was almost unplayable in Wolfhunter. Don't tell me sorc was an excellent spot in Wolfhunter. If it was i will stfu as I have a L2P issue

Of course I absolutely agree with the team composition and a good enough sorc will most definitely decide the match for you.

I gave a solo queue's perspective in a high MMR bg and its because I wanted to put across the multiple hard counters and general clunkiness which still have not been addressed. These are often deciding factors in solo PVP at a competitive level (not the small scale or 1vX potato level). But I think you already know this so why not talk about the real issues rather than talking up the class.

Here's how the usual current day sorc thinks: Its ok to have a frag taking a million years to hit and an execute to get dodged repeatedly or use a masters destro and flame clench yourself multiple times. Its ok that I died to a few nightblades wearing shield breaker and sloads. Its ok that my streak doesn't go off on an incline or I am stuck with the shield bug
You know why that's ok, its because i can find the next braindead zerg and wipe them on my sorc and watch the zerglings burn while they dont even move my health pool. Then I can upload the video and come to the forums and claim that I am OP and sorc is not dead. There are multiple such forum posts, you can check

The latest I heard yesterday from a known sorc in on our server and the dueling guild but I will not name
After his team did not so well what I heard was "I have 17k frag so why do i need a buff and I am going to call out bird sorcs who use BOL, pet heal and restro utl coz I can't one shot them and his whole team in a BG with my frag". He missed out the fact that his so called 17k frag or whatever tooltip he wishes to have often not hit decent players in a competitive environment.

NinchiTV

bardx86 wrote: »

I'd like to add to this. I can't believe a class rep is saying this and it makes me reevaluate if the class reps know what they are talking about. Sustain sucks! Mages wrath in addition to being able to be dodged twice is flat out broken, if the target moves too fast after the initial cast it will not land, this is being exploited to no end. Streak cost to dam much for how slow it is 80% of the time you get knocked down before the skills animation finishes, why doesn't this work as fast as cloak? Frags misses twice as much as it land and its to dam slow as well, I'm not talking about it being dodged either it just will miss. Over all the Sorc skills are to unreliable.

I'm not saying you can't be successful on a Sorc but its a very frustrating play style as the feel of the skills are off. To call them top tier is a flat out lie.

Yaaa i wasnt going to say anything but i really really hope this guy is a minority among the reps when they talk about sorc.

Checkmath

Bumi Rockafella wrote: »

bardx86 wrote: »

I'd like to add to this. I can't believe a class rep is saying this and it makes me reevaluate if the class reps know what they are talking about. Sustain sucks! Mages wrath in addition to being able to be dodged twice is flat out broken, if the target moves too fast after the initial cast it will not land, this is being exploited to no end. Streak cost to dam much for how slow it is 80% of the time you get knocked down before the skills animation finishes, why doesn't this work as fast as cloak? Frags misses twice as much as it land and its to dam slow as well, I'm not talking about it being dodged either it just will miss. Over all the Sorc skills are to unreliable.

I'm not saying you can't be successful on a Sorc but its a very frustrating play style as the feel of the skills are off. To call them top tier is a flat out lie.

Yaaa i wasnt going to say anything but i really really hope this guy is a minority among the reps when they talk about sorc.

Well I guess either a few people on the forum or the entire class rep team, some of the best open world pvper and dueler and a the whole sorc class discord is wrong then....

You can choose

Galarthor

WuffyCerulei wrote: »

I still have a lot of fun on my sorc, idk what you’re talkin about.

Me too ... decorating my Psijic Villa.

Lord-Otto

@CyrusArya
Your duel build? With what you prove sorc supremacy by slotting three destro skills? Which is so adapted to Cyrodiil with its 1100 mag regen that you can streak a whole lot of twice per minute? *sigh*
You know what? Be so kind and give me a link or something to videos of the tournaments you mentioned. I'll take a mostly objective look and see how much my sorc concerns apply to that environment.

@Checkmath
Pat yourself a bit more on the back. I can't hear it anyway over the sound of my stamina regen on my High Elf. Yeah, I haven't forgotten. Not taking you serious with a blunder like that. Despite the good work you reps are doing. Sorry.

Priyasekarssk

Checkmath wrote: »

Bumi Rockafella wrote: »

bardx86 wrote: »

I'd like to add to this. I can't believe a class rep is saying this and it makes me reevaluate if the class reps know what they are talking about. Sustain sucks! Mages wrath in addition to being able to be dodged twice is flat out broken, if the target moves too fast after the initial cast it will not land, this is being exploited to no end. Streak cost to dam much for how slow it is 80% of the time you get knocked down before the skills animation finishes, why doesn't this work as fast as cloak? Frags misses twice as much as it land and its to dam slow as well, I'm not talking about it being dodged either it just will miss. Over all the Sorc skills are to unreliable.

I'm not saying you can't be successful on a Sorc but its a very frustrating play style as the feel of the skills are off. To call them top tier is a flat out lie.

Yaaa i wasnt going to say anything but i really really hope this guy is a minority among the reps when they talk about sorc.

Well I guess either a few people on the forum or the entire class rep team, some of the best open world pvper and dueler and a the whole sorc class discord is wrong then....

You can choose

Yes its wrong and shameless lie. No explanation required. When 4 Dks or warden coordinated group jump on you with CCs not to mention fossilize or permafrost you're instant death in BGs. No matter you are god of Pvp .
When 4 mage sorc jump on me I just do 1 roll dodge and escape as nothing happened. No matter you are god of PVP. This is just one example.
Just put a video for above scenario . We can talk about many dishonest lies later.
All noobs want status quo to be maintained for noob streamers. That's is the result of class representative program. All trial groups are still loading only nbs. Orc became super meta. No one want a balanced gameplay just use the opportunity to get more and more cheese.

Even when Zos try to balance based on numbers all noob streamers cry and whines in forums like cry babies. Alcast is the only person who gives some unbiased opinion.

I sincerely ask zos to disband class representative program. It only self serving, not doing anything for the game. Its very bad for any game to do balance like this. Money makes many people to lie shamelessly. Balance based on real data and numbers. It's moral responsibility for ZOs to balance the game being eso is their only successful game in recent times.

Checkmath

Lord-Otto wrote: »

@CyrusArya
Your duel build? With what you prove sorc supremacy by slotting three destro skills? Which is so adapted to Cyrodiil with its 1100 mag regen that you can streak a whole lot of twice per minute? *sigh*
You know what? Be so kind and give me a link or something to videos of the tournaments you mentioned. I'll take a mostly objective look and see how much my sorc concerns apply to that environment.

@Checkmath
Pat yourself a bit more on the back. I can't hear it anyway over the sound of my stamina regen on my High Elf. Yeah, I haven't forgotten. Not taking you serious with a blunder like that. Despite the good work you reps are doing. Sorry.

Just because you feel not able to adapt or or to improve or whatever does not give you the right to ignore feedback from many many players. This thread is just about the feeling and opinion of a few guys and even other people already stated in here how strong magsorc currently is. You just deny what others already wrote before I even commented in the thread and you deny a lot more people giving feedback to the class in other threads and discords. Just because you have another opinion. Please go ask around the people, who really put a lot of time in the class and play it on a competitive level like Malcolm, Derra, Irylia, Arya and so on. They will all tell you, that magicka sorcerer is very strong for PvP.

Also I have no idea why a PvPer should complain about the stamina regen of altmers, because its a very valuable passive for that content. If you complain about it, then either you do not have much experience of PvP or you are a PvEer and therefore naturally benefit less from it.

Lord-Otto

Checkmath wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

@CyrusArya
Your duel build? With what you prove sorc supremacy by slotting three destro skills? Which is so adapted to Cyrodiil with its 1100 mag regen that you can streak a whole lot of twice per minute? *sigh*
You know what? Be so kind and give me a link or something to videos of the tournaments you mentioned. I'll take a mostly objective look and see how much my sorc concerns apply to that environment.

@Checkmath
Pat yourself a bit more on the back. I can't hear it anyway over the sound of my stamina regen on my High Elf. Yeah, I haven't forgotten. Not taking you serious with a blunder like that. Despite the good work you reps are doing. Sorry.

Just because you feel not able to adapt or or to improve or whatever does not give you the right to ignore feedback from many many players. This thread is just about the feeling and opinion of a few guys and even other people already stated in here how strong magsorc currently is. You just deny what others already wrote before I even commented in the thread and you deny a lot more people giving feedback to the class in other threads and discords. Just because you have another opinion. Please go ask around the people, who really put a lot of time in the class and play it on a competitive level like Malcolm, Derra, Irylia, Arya and so on. They will all tell you, that magicka sorcerer is very strong for PvP.

Also I have no idea why a PvPer should complain about the stamina regen of altmers, because its a very valuable passive for that content. If you complain about it, then either you do not have much experience of PvP or you are a PvEer and therefore naturally benefit less from it.

I did ask Arya for video footage, didn't I? And I'm definitely not easily convinced because MLGxDuelxG0dx1337 tells me how strong sorcs are in his dueling environment. Takes a bit more than that, especially after years of "mag sorc OPOPOP!" crying, no matter the circumstances. But I am willing to admit when I'm wrong. And you better hope I'm NOT, because I will hold YOU responsible for future sorc nerfs now, just when we got to the point where the class is ->supposedly<- in a good spot.

I have written essays about the stamina racial. Good to know you don't know them. Basically, when I pick a melee class in any RPG, I don't expect maining a bow.

Priyasekarssk

CyrusArya wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

No, it's not.
It's the lag, the atrocious targeting system. The clunkiness of skills. Also my enemies actually knowing what they're doing.
I have little respect for your cute dueling friendship clubs where you set some arbitrary rules to forbid all the stuff you can't deal with. It sure is a good test of player skill, but says very little about actual balancing. Hate to break it to you, but your sandbox doesn't mean #$/^& for this discussion.

The reason rule sets exist is to ban elements of ESO that are blatantly op 1v1 (e.g Meridia’s, Troll King, Sloads, Sorc Pets etc) or to prevent stalemates. Incidentally, those rules cripple Sorc the most of any class! Pet Sorc is by far the single strongest duel spec in the entire game. Yet even without pets, Sorc is a winning class. It is the only case where my open world build is in fact stronger 1v1 than my dueling spec, but I remove my Matriarch and Atronach out of respect and decency.

I wonder if the irony of your post is lost on you, given that Sorc is actually even stronger outside these rules than within them.

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

The sorcs in this forum and class reps here already know this but still sorc is top tier right ? I pretty sure a mega sorc nerf is coming but the class reps really need to think about it !

Idk that sorc needs a mega nerf but Sorc absolutely is top tier in PvP, including BGs. If you were to assemble the most high end pre made comp possible for Team Deathmatch, one of those 4 spots would be reserved for a Sorc every single time.

A person never played magic sorc telling its op then strong then ok . Rofl. Have you ever played magic sorc before to comment in forums?
Please Come with 4 mage sorc. We come with 4 Dks or warden or nb. We stream roll in all games. Not 1 or 2 . 100 games.Try to win at least one.

ezio45

Minalan wrote: »

Sorcs are fine in PVP, you just need to learn how to build and play in the new meta.

The class just isn't "carry me" broken anymore, you need to build like EVERY other class. You need to invest in crit resist, surprise, just like everyone. You need to invest in armor, hell you can use a monster set, boundless storm, or protective jewelry and be fine in light armor. There are defensive sets like armor master and impreg if you're really having problems, or slot the psijic ult with minor protection. You need to add a little health with some tri-stat glyphs. When you do, shields are actually stronger than they were before, and you're not one hit squish under that shield stack.

Damage is still really good, just build for it. ZOS just added sets like spell strat that give you about 1000 spell damage single target. Spinner is still a solid damage set. Stacking penetration works on everyone and scales great with our damage.

Pets are a significant percentage of our class toolkit, you leave a lot on the table by not using one. Three skills, and at least as many passives. Devs made them worth using now this patch, probably getting ready for Necromancer. I hate pets too, but you leave a lot on the table by not using one.

We are in a really good place, and I haven't felt this way about the sorc class in a long time. I'll be really surprised TBH if we don't see a nerf next patch. Why? Because ZOS can't leave a good thing alone.

This is bs imo

We have to invest more than everyone else

Shackle over a dmg set
A sustain set over a damage set
We need to invest in all 3 stat pools, stam gets to use 2 and at the very least the other classes have something to help with health boost

dont get to use divs anymore, has to be impen
dont get to use jewelry trait anymore, has to be protective
requires another damn set so your loosing your sustain set you already needed
no monster set because we have to use a defensive one

at this rate were losing out by not going heavy, but oh wait sorcs sustain is ***

Haashhtaag

I hate being pigeon hold into like 2-3 specs of magsorc these days. Too bad frag doesn’t have CC anymore or we’d truly be able to see build diversity

Checkmath

Priyasekarssk wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Bumi Rockafella wrote: »

bardx86 wrote: »

I'd like to add to this. I can't believe a class rep is saying this and it makes me reevaluate if the class reps know what they are talking about. Sustain sucks! Mages wrath in addition to being able to be dodged twice is flat out broken, if the target moves too fast after the initial cast it will not land, this is being exploited to no end. Streak cost to dam much for how slow it is 80% of the time you get knocked down before the skills animation finishes, why doesn't this work as fast as cloak? Frags misses twice as much as it land and its to dam slow as well, I'm not talking about it being dodged either it just will miss. Over all the Sorc skills are to unreliable.

I'm not saying you can't be successful on a Sorc but its a very frustrating play style as the feel of the skills are off. To call them top tier is a flat out lie.

Yaaa i wasnt going to say anything but i really really hope this guy is a minority among the reps when they talk about sorc.

Well I guess either a few people on the forum or the entire class rep team, some of the best open world pvper and dueler and a the whole sorc class discord is wrong then....

You can choose

Yes its wrong and shameless lie. No explanation required. When 4 Dks or warden coordinated group jump on you with CCs not to mention fossilize or permafrost you're instant death in BGs. No matter you are god of Pvp .
When 4 mage sorc jump on me I just do 1 roll dodge and escape as nothing happened. No matter you are god of PVP. This is just one example.
Just put a video for above scenario . We can talk about many dishonest lies later.
All noobs want status quo to be maintained for noob streamers. That's is the result of class representative program. All trial groups are still loading only nbs. Orc became super meta. No one want a balanced gameplay just use the opportunity to get more and more cheese.

Even when Zos try to balance based on numbers all noob streamers cry and whines in forums like cry babies. Alcast is the only person who gives some unbiased opinion.

I sincerely ask zos to disband class representative program. It only self serving, not doing anything for the game. Its very bad for any game to do balance like this. Money makes many people to lie shamelessly. Balance based on real data and numbers. It's moral responsibility for ZOs to balance the game being eso is their only successful game in recent times.

Sry but your post made me laugh.

I dont know about noobs and status quo, neither about noob streamers....
The rep program since day one brings up everyday, that the status quo of pve damage dealers is not good for the game, also called the nb meta. Since day one this topic is brought up again and again.

The rep program is self serving? Money makes people to lie? The class reps are not paid, so I do not see your point there. All reps volunteered to do free work in that sense. Balance only based on numbers would make the game dull and gray, would result all classes be the exact same with minimal variance. Because as soon as you give one class something unique, others should get uniqueness too. And guess what, some skills and tooltips will not be comparable anymore just by numbers when you start doing those things

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Lord-Otto wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

@CyrusArya
Your duel build? With what you prove sorc supremacy by slotting three destro skills? Which is so adapted to Cyrodiil with its 1100 mag regen that you can streak a whole lot of twice per minute? *sigh*
You know what? Be so kind and give me a link or something to videos of the tournaments you mentioned. I'll take a mostly objective look and see how much my sorc concerns apply to that environment.

@Checkmath
Pat yourself a bit more on the back. I can't hear it anyway over the sound of my stamina regen on my High Elf. Yeah, I haven't forgotten. Not taking you serious with a blunder like that. Despite the good work you reps are doing. Sorry.

Just because you feel not able to adapt or or to improve or whatever does not give you the right to ignore feedback from many many players. This thread is just about the feeling and opinion of a few guys and even other people already stated in here how strong magsorc currently is. You just deny what others already wrote before I even commented in the thread and you deny a lot more people giving feedback to the class in other threads and discords. Just because you have another opinion. Please go ask around the people, who really put a lot of time in the class and play it on a competitive level like Malcolm, Derra, Irylia, Arya and so on. They will all tell you, that magicka sorcerer is very strong for PvP.

Also I have no idea why a PvPer should complain about the stamina regen of altmers, because its a very valuable passive for that content. If you complain about it, then either you do not have much experience of PvP or you are a PvEer and therefore naturally benefit less from it.

I did ask Arya for video footage, didn't I? And I'm definitely not easily convinced because MLGxDuelxG0dx1337 tells me how strong sorcs are in his dueling environment. Takes a bit more than that, especially after years of "mag sorc OPOPOP!" crying, no matter the circumstances. But I am willing to admit when I'm wrong. And you better hope I'm NOT, because I will hold YOU responsible for future sorc nerfs now, just when we got to the point where the class is ->supposedly<- in a good spot.

I have written essays about the stamina racial. Good to know you don't know them. Basically, when I pick a melee class in any RPG, I don't expect maining a bow.

Good luck getting some video material. All I can say is that Arya plays magsorc competitively, so I guess Priyasekarssk's last comment is pretty much invalid.

I did some small survey for you guys inside the biggest duelling and PvP guild on PC EU with more than 200 competitive PvP players about the state of magsorcs. Naturally not all 200 replied, but 80% of those people stated magsorc being a strong class for PvP in general and only 20% said, that it is in a bad state (in general means all various playstyles of magsorcs, with and without pets).

ezio45

Minalan wrote: »

oxygen_thief wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Digiman wrote: »

Are you talking CP or non-CP Minalan?

If everyone is making it work except for you, the problem isn't the class.

what is working here? where are dks wings, wardens shields, nbs incaps, bleeds and other nasty staff? where are groups with dedicated healers and stan on kd. you can shoot like this with every build but serious guys will eat you alive

We can still do really well against all of the above with a good build and a whole lot of L2P.

Sorcs have a pair of strong, heavily armored shields and a burst heal. We don't go down easy on the defense either. Imagine how they feel against US?

we have a weak shield that is pathetic and can kill things or we have a giant shield and no damage or sustain.

by burst heal
if you mean twilight it requires 2 bar slots, can be killed and is less than bol
if you mean exchange, its on a delay and still does less than bol

not to mention shields take up 3 bar slots, are on gcd so if of falls off while your trying to fight and not spam shields and have to wait a full second before casting another.

how do they feel against us? pretty damn good with there wings, and bol's and cloak and heavy stam dmg sets that are up 24/7 requiring no bar slots decent, heals

ezio45

Alfie2072 wrote: »

never understood people like op, clearly doesnt play magsorc much, they are stronger than they were
pretty much just complaining because you cant run full damage sets and enchantments

we couldnt do that before nerfmire

ya need shackle and lich

now that we lost divs, wtf is our damage coming from

TheBonesXXX

Minalan wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

Sorcs are fine in PVP, you just need to learn how to build and play in the new meta.

The class just isn't "carry me" broken anymore, you need to build like EVERY other class. You need to invest in crit resist, surprise, just like everyone. You need to invest in armor, hell you can use a monster set, boundless storm, or protective jewelry and be fine in light armor. There are defensive sets like armor master and invuln if you're really having problems, or slot the psijic ult with minor protection. You need to add a little health with some tri-stat glyphs. When you do, shields are actually stronger than they were before, and you're not one hit squish under that shield stack.

Damage is still really good, just build for it. ZOS just added sets like spell strat that give you about 1000 spell damage single target. Spinner is still a solid damage set. Stacking penetration works on everyone and scales great with our damage.

Pets are a significant percentage of our class toolkit, you leave a lot on the table by not using one. Three skills, and at least as many passives. Devs made them worth using now this patch, probably getting ready for Necromancer. I hate pets too, but you leave a lot on the table by not using one.

We are in a really good place, and I haven't felt this way about the sorc class in a long time. I'll be really surprised TBH if we don't see a nerf next patch. Why? Because ZOS can't leave a good thing alone.

I wouldn’t say overpowered, just in a really good spot.

You don't need to be overpowered to get a nerf in this game... You just need to send enough potatoes to respawn on these forums. They cry salty, bitter tears that always find themselves in the game design. Then skills like shade stop working for nightblades, and healing ward becomes borderline useless.

Hey! Some of them aren't just taters, they're delicious yams.

I love sweet taters.

ezio45

Checkmath wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

I miss dw sorc

I miss the days, were sorc qq actually was valid....oh wait.

Magsorc is considered the strongest magicka pvp class right now for duels and open world.
Battlegrounds get dominated by zoos, open world magsorcs have the best toolkit amongst magclasses to kite and lure out enemies till you can burst down one by one. In duels the spam of clench and weaving in the frags and curses deals extremely high damage with the amplitude passive. I am really not sure, why some people did not realize how strong magicka sorcerers are right now.

i would disagree

Pet is strong, overly strong infact.

Non pet is trash with either damage and sustain or survuvability

Emma_Overload

Checkmath wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

I miss dw sorc

I miss the days, were sorc qq actually was valid....oh wait.

Magsorc is considered the strongest magicka pvp class right now for duels and open world.
Battlegrounds get dominated by zoos, open world magsorcs have the best toolkit amongst magclasses to kite and lure out enemies till you can burst down one by one. In duels the spam of clench and weaving in the frags and curses deals extremely high damage with the amplitude passive. I am really not sure, why some people did not realize how strong magicka sorcerers are right now.

Because my Frags crit for 7K on the Nightblade who just killed me with a 16K Assassin's Will?

I don't know what's going on on EU server, but Sorcs feel very underpowered on NA PC.

ezio45

brandonv516 wrote: »

lol @ Magsorc being in a worst spot for PvP than Magblade...

And another lol because I'm not done yet.

ya mnb is pretty bad too.

Noctus wrote: »

U DONT HAVE ANY RIGHT TO COMPLAIN UNTILL WE MAGBLADES ARE BUFFED

why do i have to pick?

i play both, both are a pile of trash rn