I run these kind of setups on my magplar and magden, e.g. defensive monster set + 2x damage sets + vMA resto + Protective jewelry. Duelled a magplar recently. Their damage is just high. Sweeps, Birds and Shalks hit harder than Swallow Soul with similar specs, I think. I could be wrong. I know Sweeps is clunky and has a cast time, but it also has a 12K+ tooltip and activates Burning Light. Everyone likes to complain about Incap / Soul Harvest, but I think NB is actually quite dependent on that ulti to get the 20% damage bonus.Have you guys tried running a high recovery build? I'm playing around with it and it's very versatile. With high health recovery with hots, just making a bit of space is enough to get to full health.
The sustained damage is also nice because of torug's + infused. I'm not sure yet what the best enchant for damage is. Oblivion or shock maybe? Oblivion has a 3k tooltip while shock has a 6.4k tooltip.
Having very high health recovery is nice since it's always active, and you get a free slot. I'm able to run tripots and still have major prophecy and sorcery.
Check it out here:
Khajit: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=126726
Dunmer: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=126732
I think health recovery is great to complement survivability on magblade because of the class recovery boosts. I wouldn't specifically build for it though, maybe run citrus filet/bear haunch, potentially steed or one setbonus.
Thinking of doing a high crit torugs setup for BGs, maybe with shadow mundus, but thats just getting carried by sets really.
Why wont it be worth building in to? It works great with cloak and I still have good damage because I'm able to run damage sets on light armor. The high stam recovery is also nice for getting those rolls in. I find Healing Ward to be okay as an "oh ***" button with all the hots and health recovery.
No question using Troll King plus a shield, be it Dampen or Healing Ward, is nice. I love Troll King + Forward Momentum, but I felt I had to drop it in my build, because I wasn't doing enough damage. The thing about Torug's Pact, as well, is that in order to take full advantage you have to do partial heavies and get that 1.4 second timing right. That's a barrier for me personally at least. I loathe heavy attacks. I think just running Infused is good value already and prefer different damage sets.
Have you guys tried running a high recovery build? I'm playing around with it and it's very versatile. With high health recovery with hots, just making a bit of space is enough to get to full health.
The sustained damage is also nice because of torug's + infused. I'm not sure yet what the best enchant for damage is. Oblivion or shock maybe? Oblivion has a 3k tooltip while shock has a 6.4k tooltip.
Having very high health recovery is nice since it's always active, and you get a free slot. I'm able to run tripots and still have major prophecy and sorcery.
Check it out here:
Khajit: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=126726
Dunmer: https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=126732
I think health recovery is great to complement survivability on magblade because of the class recovery boosts. I wouldn't specifically build for it though, maybe run citrus filet/bear haunch, potentially steed or one setbonus.
Thinking of doing a high crit torugs setup for BGs, maybe with shadow mundus, but thats just getting carried by sets really.
Why wont it be worth building in to? It works great with cloak and I still have good damage because I'm able to run damage sets on light armor. The high stam recovery is also nice for getting those rolls in. I find Healing Ward to be okay as an "oh ***" button with all the hots and health recovery.
Because in order to invest into HP recovery you give up on vital sustain/damage. TKs once piece is utter garbage and even with high stats magblade struggels to bring people down, so a proc set/ real tank set is likely the better alternative. not saying TK is bad, its a good choice, but I dont think its optimal one for magblades.
You got to wonder whether these polls have any basis in reality. They do in terms of what is popular, that's for sure, but look at magden for example. The class hasn't fundamentally changed since release, it's just taken people this long to figure out what to do with them. Has the game changed so much that they're more valuable, now, with all the speed nerfs? I don't know. I do not play a FOTM ice warden. All I can tell you is that people from my own faction were taken aback by my damage as well as the defensive capabilities of shields + Living Trellis, over a year ago. They never gave the class any credit. I watched a recent video of Kristofer ESO's, who I respect, and he said as much. Magden was always strong, just no one played it.Yep we're dead last on the latest poll. At this point we have nowhere to go but up on the next patches so there's that. Here's to hoping we get buffed but not lose our class identity
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/463092/strongest-pvp-class/p1
You got to wonder whether these polls have any basis in reality. They do in terms of what is popular, that's for sure, but look at magden for example. The class hasn't fundamentally changed since release, it's just taken people this long to figure out what to do with them. Has the game changed so much that they're more valuable, now, with all the speed nerfs? I don't know. I do not play a FOTM ice warden. All I can tell you is that people from my own faction were taken aback by my damage as well as the defensive capabilities of shields + Living Trellis, over a year ago. They never gave the class any credit. I watched a recent video of Kristofer ESO's, who I respect, and he said as much. Magden was always strong, just no one played it.Yep we're dead last on the latest poll. At this point we have nowhere to go but up on the next patches so there's that. Here's to hoping we get buffed but not lose our class identity
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/463092/strongest-pvp-class/p1
Magsorcs being so downrated seems a knee-jerk reaction to me. I still see magsorcs who are strong 1vXers and seem to have no trouble staying at 100% health, as it's always been. Reality is, the shield changes were mainly targeted at sorcs and they were also the class most able to deal with that. You can correct me, if I'm wrong. I don't play magsorc, but my friend does and it's his most highly rated character for solo play.
I think a lot depends on how you learnt the game. Which class did you play first, how did you evolve your playstyle, what are you comfortable with? Taking a build directly from YouTube rarely works well, at least not for me. My friend has a tanking background. He used to troll people, several good players or up to 15 potatoes at a time. That's not that easy. He knows how to manage his resources and it's made him very comfortable with a shielding sorc. The other character he tells me performs well for him is his stam DK. He gradually learnt how to do damage with his builds and balance them away from being pure tanks. These days he's as dangerous to duel as others in our guild.
In my case, I figured out in One Tamriel that speed and flapping wings was a good defense on my stam DK. It's not a class I find competitive anymore, but I was never into the heavy armor blocking DK, which is where I suspect the class truly shines. As I still don't play all the classes nor all playstyles, I find it very hard to judge where the game balance truly is. Nothing gives you as much insight as seeing a class from the inside and the outside, playing it and playing against it. All I know for sure is that classes are perceived a certain way by the public at large.
In practice, of course, you are right. ZOS work as much on perception as everyone else. Magblade can only go up, I guess.
WM is not a great set. It seems it is good but really doesn't help much. It doesn't increases your healing, doesn't help your crits and doesn't protect you. If you play as a melee NB you MUST use a mitigation set and Shack is too good to drop it.
You got to wonder whether these polls have any basis in reality. They do in terms of what is popular, that's for sure, but look at magden for example. The class hasn't fundamentally changed since release, it's just taken people this long to figure out what to do with them. Has the game changed so much that they're more valuable, now, with all the speed nerfs? I don't know. I do not play a FOTM ice warden. All I can tell you is that people from my own faction were taken aback by my damage as well as the defensive capabilities of shields + Living Trellis, over a year ago. They never gave the class any credit. I watched a recent video of Kristofer ESO's, who I respect, and he said as much. Magden was always strong, just no one played it.Yep we're dead last on the latest poll. At this point we have nowhere to go but up on the next patches so there's that. Here's to hoping we get buffed but not lose our class identity
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/463092/strongest-pvp-class/p1
Magsorcs being so downrated seems a knee-jerk reaction to me. I still see magsorcs who are strong 1vXers and seem to have no trouble staying at 100% health, as it's always been. Reality is, the shield changes were mainly targeted at sorcs and they were also the class most able to deal with that. You can correct me, if I'm wrong. I don't play magsorc, but my friend does and it's his most highly rated character for solo play.
I think a lot depends on how you learnt the game. Which class did you play first, how did you evolve your playstyle, what are you comfortable with? Taking a build directly from YouTube rarely works well, at least not for me. My friend has a tanking background. He used to troll people, several good players or up to 15 potatoes at a time. That's not that easy. He knows how to manage his resources and it's made him very comfortable with a shielding sorc. The other character he tells me performs well for him is his stam DK. He gradually learnt how to do damage with his builds and balance them away from being pure tanks. These days he's as dangerous to duel as others in our guild.
In my case, I figured out in One Tamriel that speed and flapping wings was a good defense on my stam DK. It's not a class I find competitive anymore, but I was never into the heavy armor blocking DK, which is where I suspect the class truly shines. As I still don't play all the classes nor all playstyles, I find it very hard to judge where the game balance truly is. Nothing gives you as much insight as seeing a class from the inside and the outside, playing it and playing against it. All I know for sure is that classes are perceived a certain way by the public at large.
In practice, of course, you are right. ZOS work as much on perception as everyone else. Magblade can only go up, I guess.
melee magblade with elemental weapon/light attack/concealed weapon open.
And still, I do potato damage to wings spamming DKs.
ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »
melee magblade with elemental weapon/light attack/concealed weapon open.
Like your approach. I'm running very similar except slim crawl because I'm too lazy to keep minor berserk up. Also use War Maiden instead but have sharpened on my fire staff.
I really want to use Elemental Weapon. Even when it is on my front bar though, I have problems getting it to trigger with a concealed and the ani cancel light attack. If it was only 3 or 4 seconds in duration. I really wish ZOS would make it more useful for a melee magblade.
And still, I do potato damage to wings spamming DKs.
when I was running a build similar to yours, I swapped in a lightning staff in bgs with a lot of DKs. It made an enormous difference, but it isn't a solution 1v1 and it neuters our damage against everything else.ScruffyWhiskers wrote: »
melee magblade with elemental weapon/light attack/concealed weapon open.
Like your approach. I'm running very similar except slim crawl because I'm too lazy to keep minor berserk up. Also use War Maiden instead but have sharpened on my fire staff.
I really want to use Elemental Weapon. Even when it is on my front bar though, I have problems getting it to trigger with a concealed and the ani cancel light attack. If it was only 3 or 4 seconds in duration. I really wish ZOS would make it more useful for a melee magblade.
I hate elemental weapon, but I wish I didn't. Mursie is very good at triggering it... I am not. It needs a longer timer to really be viable for melee magblade, outside of timed openers...
elemetal weapon is a very interesting skill for nightblades, both stam and mag, as its precastable in cloak and allows insanely high burst potentials with several combos.
The duration is that short so you can not activate another ability afterwards and chain both 3 GCDs in one combo - and thats a good thing.
elemetal weapon is a very interesting skill for nightblades, both stam and mag, as its precastable in cloak and allows insanely high burst potentials with several combos.
The duration is that short so you can not activate another ability afterwards and chain both 3 GCDs in one combo - and thats a good thing.
There would be other ways to avoid that effect while making it more useful. In its current state, it frequently drops off in combat situations that are not set up with cloak because of the short duration. In its current state, you can already chain it after another attack when setting it up precisely, and an extra second wouldn't allow for two skills to be used before the LA (why you would hold a LA weave anyway I don't know) while making it significantly more useful in an environment with lag and a lot of movement.
That said, I haven't tried it since I went over to a destro staff for my magblade, where I imagine it would be enormously easier to land it, heh.
brandonv516 wrote: »So is DW mNB finally dead with the enchant changes now? Or did the extra damage for using swords balance it?
brandonv516 wrote: »So is DW mNB finally dead with the enchant changes now? Or did the extra damage for using swords balance it?
If you're going Magblade melee, you wanna do two hander just to have forward momentum.
brandonv516 wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »So is DW mNB finally dead with the enchant changes now? Or did the extra damage for using swords balance it?
If you're going Magblade melee, you wanna do two hander just to have forward momentum.
I've made DW work without a snare removal.
FM is weak at 4 seconds and I need the bar space more.
Heavy attacks are smoother with DW also.
brandonv516 wrote: »brandonv516 wrote: »So is DW mNB finally dead with the enchant changes now? Or did the extra damage for using swords balance it?
If you're going Magblade melee, you wanna do two hander just to have forward momentum.
I've made DW work without a snare removal.
FM is weak at 4 seconds and I need the bar space more.
Heavy attacks are smoother with DW also.
wouldn't using a flame staff still be better than dual wield when doing a melee magblade at this point? You dont need to slot a destro skill, and you can still use concealed, with the added benefit of having useful light and heavy attacks.
I'm not a fan of warmaiden either I feel you're better off replacing it with IA if you're war maiden you're all class skills anyway so you benefit from IA the same just different 2,3,4 stats
Of course this is all just preference
Flame_of_Hades wrote: »The only problem i have on my magblade, is running into a dk and going "great, now im going to loss this fight, not because he is better, but because i can't even hit him.."
At least when fighting the warden shield, i don't nuke my own health bar trying to remove it...
also, why is cripple reflected?! why is that a thing?
I mained mag dk for a year. Wings needs a nerf 1v1. bad. on the other hand, it needs a buff in an outnumbered situation, but thats for a different thread..
Knootewoot wrote: »Flame_of_Hades wrote: »The only problem i have on my magblade, is running into a dk and going "great, now im going to loss this fight, not because he is better, but because i can't even hit him.."
At least when fighting the warden shield, i don't nuke my own health bar trying to remove it...
also, why is cripple reflected?! why is that a thing?
I mained mag dk for a year. Wings needs a nerf 1v1. bad. on the other hand, it needs a buff in an outnumbered situation, but thats for a different thread..
Dk's can't reflect concealed weapon or the fire-staff skill.
That said, going into melee range of a DK as a melee vampireblade is suicide, and I prefer swallow since I use DW. So I leave Dk's alone.
I also have trouble getting through shield spamming sorcs, heal and spear spamming Templars, dodge roll vigor spamming stamblades, heal bug shield dawnbreaker spamming wardens. I just target other magblades or afk people.
Or maybe I should drop melee magblade and go ranged.
I created a stamDK for fun and he is lvl29 in blue no set gear. Even he survives more easily and has not been successfully ganked once. Can't wait to reach lvl 50 and wear my sets.
Knootewoot wrote: »Flame_of_Hades wrote: »The only problem i have on my magblade, is running into a dk and going "great, now im going to loss this fight, not because he is better, but because i can't even hit him.."
At least when fighting the warden shield, i don't nuke my own health bar trying to remove it...
also, why is cripple reflected?! why is that a thing?
I mained mag dk for a year. Wings needs a nerf 1v1. bad. on the other hand, it needs a buff in an outnumbered situation, but thats for a different thread..
Dk's can't reflect concealed weapon or the fire-staff skill.
That said, going into melee range of a DK as a melee vampireblade is suicide, and I prefer swallow since I use DW. So I leave Dk's alone.
I also have trouble getting through shield spamming sorcs, heal and spear spamming Templars, dodge roll vigor spamming stamblades, heal bug shield dawnbreaker spamming wardens. I just target other magblades or afk people.
Or maybe I should drop melee magblade and go ranged.
I created a stamDK for fun and he is lvl29 in blue no set gear. Even he survives more easily and has not been successfully ganked once. Can't wait to reach lvl 50 and wear my sets.
I don't get this comment. Low mobility? Certainly not magblade. You mean the DK? I fight DKs. It's one of the main reasons I play melee.I don't really see the benefit of the melee magblade playstyle since you lose healing and you have to fight up close on a class with very low mobility.
Hmm. I am by no means brilliant, but my melee magblade remains the character with which I get the most kills. (I don't really play my stamblade much. Not used to it.)
I wish I could give up Forward Momentum, but I can't. You use it for a consistent heal to activate Troll King, when wearing that set. You use it, if you get taloned or snared. It's cheaper than a dodge roll and you need the immunity. The fact that it's down to 4 seconds doesn't matter that much, since you only use it reactively to get back up to speed and into cloak.
I actually use Swallow Soul on the resto bar in addition to Concealed on the 2H bar. It is quite ineffective as a damage dealing skill in my build, but it is a heal and my preferred spammable for IC bosses. It also helps to have a ranged option in those unfocused before prime time fights, where everyone is just strewn around a keep. I love those and I don't like builds that are entirely melee.I don't get this comment. Low mobility? Certainly not magblade. You mean the DK? I fight DKs. It's one of the main reasons I play melee.I don't really see the benefit of the melee magblade playstyle since you lose healing and you have to fight up close on a class with very low mobility.
That's bound to change. DW made sense from an enchants point of view, especially if you were running Torug's Pact. Makes no sense now.Hmm. I am by no means brilliant, but my melee magblade remains the character with which I get the most kills. (I don't really play my stamblade much. Not used to it.)
I wish I could give up Forward Momentum, but I can't. You use it for a consistent heal to activate Troll King, when wearing that set. You use it, if you get taloned or snared. It's cheaper than a dodge roll and you need the immunity. The fact that it's down to 4 seconds doesn't matter that much, since you only use it reactively to get back up to speed and into cloak.
I actually use Swallow Soul on the resto bar in addition to Concealed on the 2H bar. It is quite ineffective as a damage dealing skill in my build, but it is a heal and my preferred spammable for IC bosses. It also helps to have a ranged option in those unfocused before prime time fights, where everyone is just strewn around a keep. I love those and I don't like builds that are entirely melee.I don't get this comment. Low mobility? Certainly not magblade. You mean the DK? I fight DKs. It's one of the main reasons I play melee.I don't really see the benefit of the melee magblade playstyle since you lose healing and you have to fight up close on a class with very low mobility.
I was talking about dual wield melee magblades. If you run 2h then you get mobility from forward momentum but for some reason almost all of the melee magblades I see are running dual wield. I haven't see many players using forward momentum on magblade since they decreased the duration.
Hmm. I am by no means brilliant, but my melee magblade remains the character with which I get the most kills. (I don't really play my stamblade much. Not used to it.)
I wish I could give up Forward Momentum, but I can't. You use it for a consistent heal to activate Troll King, when wearing that set. You use it, if you get taloned or snared. It's cheaper than a dodge roll and you need the immunity. The fact that it's down to 4 seconds doesn't matter that much, since you only use it reactively to get back up to speed and into cloak.
I actually use Swallow Soul on the resto bar in addition to Concealed on the 2H bar. It is quite ineffective as a damage dealing skill in my build, but it is a heal and my preferred spammable for IC bosses. It also helps to have a ranged option in those unfocused before prime time fights, where everyone is just strewn around a keep. I love those and I don't like builds that are entirely melee.I don't get this comment. Low mobility? Certainly not magblade. You mean the DK? I fight DKs. It's one of the main reasons I play melee.I don't really see the benefit of the melee magblade playstyle since you lose healing and you have to fight up close on a class with very low mobility.
Well, for what it's worth:Hmm. I am by no means brilliant, but my melee magblade remains the character with which I get the most kills. (I don't really play my stamblade much. Not used to it.)
I wish I could give up Forward Momentum, but I can't. You use it for a consistent heal to activate Troll King, when wearing that set. You use it, if you get taloned or snared. It's cheaper than a dodge roll and you need the immunity. The fact that it's down to 4 seconds doesn't matter that much, since you only use it reactively to get back up to speed and into cloak.
I actually use Swallow Soul on the resto bar in addition to Concealed on the 2H bar. It is quite ineffective as a damage dealing skill in my build, but it is a heal and my preferred spammable for IC bosses. It also helps to have a ranged option in those unfocused before prime time fights, where everyone is just strewn around a keep. I love those and I don't like builds that are entirely melee.I don't get this comment. Low mobility? Certainly not magblade. You mean the DK? I fight DKs. It's one of the main reasons I play melee.I don't really see the benefit of the melee magblade playstyle since you lose healing and you have to fight up close on a class with very low mobility.
What’s your spec? I might try it. I don’t think I’ve beaten a magDK in a duel... ever.
Btw, it’s not just DKs who can reflect. It’s DKs, Wardens, and anyone who uses S&B.
I agree about magblade maneuverability too. That’s what makes it fun even if it’s not effective.