Patch Notes Rapid Feedback

DJfriede

(Copied from another thread.)

Rapids is one of those quality of life skills that makes large scale fights actually remotely enjoyable. You will still get stunned and snared all the time, but at least you have SOME breathing room.

Without the snare removal those fights will be no fun and simply annoying because every single solo player will just spam caltrops, time stop and whatever (like they already do now).

I want to fight and not be concerned with how I can make my character move again.

MasterSpatula

Cyrodiil is a complete cesspool of CC spam. Being able to counter the miserable experience of being out of control of your character is outside the vision of what PVP in ESO is supposed to be, I guess.

ecru

Diundriel wrote: »

you basically rip pvp raid playstyle and make lots of guilds quit the game as raiding is the only Thing why they are actually still playing eso

lol

your gigantic group should not be able to purge off literally all cc over and over again by having one person using a single ability. the absurdity of such a powerful ability affecting such a large amount of players went on for way, way too long.

MasterSpatula wrote: »

Cyrodiil is a complete cesspool of CC spam. Being able to counter the miserable experience of being out of control of your character is outside the vision of what PVP in ESO is supposed to be, I guess.

one person being able to counter cc repeatedly for 24 people by hitting a single button is what zos considers "outside the vision of what pvp in eso is supposed to be, i guess".

bardx86

DJfriede wrote: »

(Copied from another thread.)

Rapids is one of those quality of life skills that makes large scale fights actually remotely enjoyable. You will still get stunned and snared all the time, but at least you have SOME breathing room.

Without the snare removal those fights will be no fun and simply annoying because every single solo player will just spam caltrops, time stop and whatever (like they already do now).

I want to fight and not be concerned with how I can make my character move again.

I have never PVP'ed with rapids. Not once since beta. Not sure why anyone would miss it.

Joy_Division

Anything that promotes playing in virtual molasses is a bad change IMO.

I understand the bitterness in ungrouped players being screwed and thus feeling like it's about time that ball groups get their comeuppance. However, the better approach to the playing in permasnare molasses crummy meta was to reform the Rapid skill (and movement skill more generally) such that they would be useful to everyone rather than useless to everyone.

technohic

So just by becoming organized with dedicated Rapids and purge spammers while spamming roots, snares and stunts on random individuals rather than just PUGing is the difference that makes it not zerging? Good to know

Well I guess if those PUGs are so crappy, and organized groups are so much better, you should not have a problem dealing with the same, no?

Diundriel

cause you probably never raided
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0rhqje4qUk how raiding looks

usmcjdking

All players now have to worry about roots/snares.

I don't see the problem with this.

Xsorus

Rofl, oh no... zergball group members will have to equip a skill to remove immobilized and snares like everyone else Instead of relying on a dude spamming rapids in the group, oh the tragedy.

DJfriede

bardx86 wrote: »

DJfriede wrote: »

(Copied from another thread.)

Rapids is one of those quality of life skills that makes large scale fights actually remotely enjoyable. You will still get stunned and snared all the time, but at least you have SOME breathing room.

Without the snare removal those fights will be no fun and simply annoying because every single solo player will just spam caltrops, time stop and whatever (like they already do now).

I want to fight and not be concerned with how I can make my character move again.

I have never PVP'ed with rapids. Not once since beta. Not sure why anyone would miss it.

When I play solo, I don't use Rapids either (well, when mounted, yeah). But in a group it is essential.

ATomiX96

well played ZOS now that you officially killed ball groups its time to go for the solo and smallscalers and make cyrodiil just LFG v LFG v LFG instead of AvAvA

go 24 man or go home is the obvious theme for this change

how about lower maximal group size down to 12 instead of making such stupid, unnessecary changes.

anyone defending this change, go back to zone chat, spam lfg until you get an invite and leech keep ticks, you have nothing lost in this forum.

last part of my rant-spree: adding additional situational buffs wont make the calculations any easier for the server

technohic

Joy_Division wrote: »

Anything that promotes playing in virtual molasses is a bad change IMO.

I understand the bitterness in ungrouped players being screwed and thus feeling like it's about time that ball groups get their comeuppance. However, the better approach to the playing in permasnare molasses crummy meta was to reform the Rapid skill (and movement skill more generally) such that they would be useful to everyone rather than useless to everyone.

Nah. I mean, I kind of supported the playstyle when there are others with similar groups for them to crash into each other, but seeing Vivec this past 10 days when these groups had a hard time getting formed with a little better performance, all while seeing them just chasing smaller numbers in the low pop temp campaigns? All for whatever makes them go into a meltdown.

Hats off to Drac and a couple others who i see and actually think are good at being really tight and organized but the vast majority of them are just riding the mechanics and if you sit back and watch as more copycats show up; ZOS really needs to ask if that's the way they want their game to look. Giving everyone Rapids wont break that up. Having AOE roots and snares make some separation will.

Xsorus

They should cap groups at 12... and keep this change

technohic

ATomiX96 wrote: »

well played ZOS now that you officially killed ball groups its time to go for the solo and smallscalers and make cyrodiil just LFG v LFG v LFG instead of AvAvA

go 24 man or go home is the obvious theme for this change

how about lower maximal group size down to 12 instead of making such stupid, unnessecary changes.

I'd support this as well. Matches the new buff cap.

Diundriel

An organized Group that specializes on roles and Plays a lot together on an high endgame lvl should Always outplay a same sized Group of random Players. Otherwise you basically say you dont want any Group endgame pvp in the game.
I think you dont know the difference between a zerg and an organized Guild grp (ofc some Guilds say they would be organized, but only Thing they can do is just zerging).
For me eso looked like a Group Gameplay mmo and not a single Player pvp game, would be said to loose that.
Btw. if you die all the time to Groups you probably are zerging, think About that. @ecru

Xsorus wrote: »

Rofl, oh no... zergball group members will have to equip a skill to remove immobilized and snares like everyone else Instead of relying on a dude spamming rapids in the group, oh the tragedy.

if you ever played in a raid you Maybe know that not everyone is even close to being able to Sustain Forward Momentum etc.

chris211

Joy_Division wrote: »

Anything that promotes playing in virtual molasses is a bad change IMO.

I understand the bitterness in ungrouped players being screwed and thus feeling like it's about time that ball groups get their comeuppance. However, the better approach to the playing in permasnare molasses crummy meta was to reform the Rapid skill (and movement skill more generally) such that they would be useful to everyone rather than useless to everyone.

give the skill snare reduction if they dont want immunity

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO

Xsorus wrote: »

Rofl, oh no... zergball group members will have to equip a skill to remove immobilized and snares like everyone else Instead of relying on a dude spamming rapids in the group, oh the tragedy.

Do you believe that everyone in trials should be dps with self healing and survival skills and no tanks or healers too?

Personally I think having seperate roles for players allows the game to be played in multiple ways. Players can choose to be jack of all trades or focus into a dedicated role for the good of their team.

Removing one of the tools of a support style role isn't something imo to celebrate as it narrows the diversity in PVP and encourages players to gravitate towards the same play styles not varied styles.

Also as for the prognosis on group pvp, I think its a little early to be gnashing teeth or celebrating the death of any playstyles ^^

Xsorus

Diundriel wrote: »

An organized Group that specializes on roles and Plays a lot together on an high endgame lvl should Always outplay a same sized Group of random Players. Otherwise you basically say you dont want any Group endgame pvp in the game.
I think you dont know the difference between a zerg and an organized Guild grp (ofc some Guilds say they would be organized, but only Thing they can do is just zerging).
For me eso looked like a Group Gameplay mmo and not a single Player pvp game, would be said to loose that.
Btw. if you die all the time to Groups you probably are zerging, think About that. @ecru

Xsorus wrote: »

Rofl, oh no... zergball group members will have to equip a skill to remove immobilized and snares like everyone else Instead of relying on a dude spamming rapids in the group, oh the tragedy.

if you ever played in a raid you Maybe know that not everyone is even close to being able to Sustain Forward Momentum etc.

Oh man, you mean those people will have to change their builds to have more sustain like everyone else in the game that deals with roots... oh the tragedy of having to rework their build and not rely on someone else... oh the humanity...

You guys realize you’re whining that you have to make builds that everyone else has had to do for a while now right?

If I don’t build for sustain that allows me to pop forward or whatever snare or root immunity I’m using guess what happens... I get snared and rooted.

Diundriel

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

Rofl, oh no... zergball group members will have to equip a skill to remove immobilized and snares like everyone else Instead of relying on a dude spamming rapids in the group, oh the tragedy.

Do you believe that everyone in trials should be dps with self healing and survival skills and no tanks or healers too?

Personally I think having seperate roles for players allows the game to be played in multiple ways. Players can choose to be jack of all trades or focus into a dedicated role for the good of their team.

Removing one of the tools of a support style role isn't something imo to celebrate as it narrows the diversity in PVP and encourages players to gravitate towards the same play styles not varied styles.

Also as for the prognosis on group pvp, I think its a little early to be gnashing teeth or celebrating the death of any playstyles ^^

I 100% agree

ScruffyWhiskers

Organized groups are great for pvp. They actually help spread out the fighting by going deep to capture outposts and scroll keeps. Get a couple of them working together and you can do amazing things. But a ball group that is just running around trying to farm AP by running over inexperienced and some stubborn experienced solo players is bad for the game. And c'mon its not like ball groups were fragile and this is going to ruin everything. You will just have a stealth runner hanging around to pop a camp more often than you would normally have to. And you will lose the odd straggler here and there and go back for a rez.

Seriously, are you really claiming that ball groups are really a struggle right now? Look at as a bigger challenge I guess.

MipMip

Sandman929 wrote: »

And here we go again, people thinking they've got a silver bullet to help disorganized versus organized.

Indeed, organized groups will always come out on top

Still, it's a very disappointing change. For players who like organized group play an important part of what makes the game interesting is to design a group composition where players' abilities are complementary to each other, and this change would remove one such option.

Diundriel

you hurt the good engame pvers with this Change. not the bad ones.
the bad ones are actually the ones that zerg you most time...

Xsorus wrote: »

They should cap groups at 12... and keep this change

i also agree on that Change, lower max Group size so Player skill in your ball Group matters more.

Universe

Aliyavana wrote: »

good change to an unhealthy ball group skill, hope it stays

Indeed
This is the Ball groups bane!

A step in the right direction, well done ZOS

Chufu

Live with it or die in Cyrodiil

The orc doesn't like balls in Cyrodiil as well, so we'll see how these changes will work then. But I think most of us will like that.

Move out of the ball-comfort-zone!

Numil

Well, i canot imagine really u can do that with manover. That just too many bad for the game atm. Balls group are gameplay also for this game and if you do that that gona break the game more and more. Or it also a new way to remove all magicka in group cause stamina got momentum to prevent spam root.

you should really focus to make cyro playable, if eveybody think balls group is the reasons of lags atm that just really big mistake. Without them you will got like 50 mans zergs movings spaming skill and make figth in keep under infinite fights.

you can already imagine what gona happen for example Nikel / ash will be premanent under zerg move and not only there. That not good change for game that remove all interest to play in organized group and make this game less fun for a large number of player still in this game since beta.

Skwor

Sooo let me get this right, you nerfed a skill that promoted group play in an MMORPG.. LMAO seriously?

Please tell me what is the purpose of an MMORPG that actively discourages the MM part?

At least change you game classification to SSORPG (SS small single) I just do not see these types of changes going well. Changing this game to favor single player defeats the whole purpose.

BTW PVP already has to much CC and until you fix the seriously broken perma CC consistently failing CC immunity maybe removing even more options to counter CC is a bad idea?

Xsorus

Skwor wrote: »

Sooo let me get this right, you nerfed a skill that promoted group play in an MMORPG.. LMAO seriously?

Please tell me what is the purpose of an MMORPG that actively discourages the MM part?

They nerfed a skill that gave one specific type of group play an advantage over everyone else; that also already has multiple advantages over everyone else.

Diundriel

i also backbar Speed on stamsorc in smallscale for grp to move fast if i Play with slow classes (magplar, mag dk etc) if you want to Escape from zerg or just Position your small Group new.

But why NERF PVP Raiding in a MMO?

Skwor

Xsorus wrote: »

Skwor wrote: »

Sooo let me get this right, you nerfed a skill that promoted group play in an MMORPG.. LMAO seriously?

Please tell me what is the purpose of an MMORPG that actively discourages the MM part?

They nerfed a skill that gave one specific type of group play an advantage over everyone else; that also already has multiple advantages over everyone else.

How is it an advantage over everyone else when everyone had acces to it>

I also noticed you are not even trying to address the completely broken CC immunity, perma CC spam that is so prevalent in the game, THAT is a much more serious issue!

Numil

Xsorus wrote: »

Skwor wrote: »

Sooo let me get this right, you nerfed a skill that promoted group play in an MMORPG.. LMAO seriously?

Please tell me what is the purpose of an MMORPG that actively discourages the MM part?

They nerfed a skill that gave one specific type of group play an advantage over everyone else; that also already has multiple advantages over everyone else.

That not give advantage, we got some member in the group dedicaced for it cause we already need to deal with root /sner spam by a tons players. Remove it gona justt make cyrodill more lagy more unplayable in prime time and absolutly not fun to play. Imagine some keep in fight for 4H or 5H cause big zergs inside no chance to got tic defense or tic attack cause too many long time spend there.

That just stupid change or otherwise give a way to group to got a way to play without manover. But make sure it work cause otherwise that just gona make the pvp more zergy with no goals.