[Class Rep] Templar Feedback Thread

Elsterchen

Trenia wrote: »

The change to javelin knock back takes away what was a fun and unique skill. Also, no one is going to slot the new restoring focus in pve, as it is a waste of a skill slot. In pvp, it was a good magic dump for stamplar. Reducing the damage on backlash, and allowing it to crit would have been much better. Other changes are okay.

First of, if you like to fun troll in PVP use the other javelline skill ... which will solve your second problem of missing a mag dump (as this morph of javeline costs magica).

btw: My stamplar slots the new restoring focus, bc its cheap adds survivability and stam regen ... both are quite usefull in PVE, too (imho).

Trenia

Elsterchen wrote: »

Trenia wrote: »

The change to javelin knock back takes away what was a fun and unique skill. Also, no one is going to slot the new restoring focus in pve, as it is a waste of a skill slot. In pvp, it was a good magic dump for stamplar. Reducing the damage on backlash, and allowing it to crit would have been much better. Other changes are okay.

First of, if you like to fun troll in PVP use the other javelline skill ... which will solve your second problem of missing a mag dump (as this morph of javeline costs magica).

btw: My stamplar slots the new restoring focus, bc its cheap adds survivability and stam regen ... both are quite usefull in PVE, too (imho).

The stam morph had a longer knockback. I don't want a magic dump on a damage ability. It's not useful in PVE. It's a waste of a slot.

Elsterchen

Trenia wrote: »

Elsterchen wrote: »

Trenia wrote: »

The change to javelin knock back takes away what was a fun and unique skill. Also, no one is going to slot the new restoring focus in pve, as it is a waste of a skill slot. In pvp, it was a good magic dump for stamplar. Reducing the damage on backlash, and allowing it to crit would have been much better. Other changes are okay.

First of, if you like to fun troll in PVP use the other javelline skill ... which will solve your second problem of missing a mag dump (as this morph of javeline costs magica).

btw: My stamplar slots the new restoring focus, bc its cheap adds survivability and stam regen ... both are quite usefull in PVE, too (imho).

The stam morph had a longer knockback. I don't want a magic dump on a damage ability. It's not useful in PVE. It's a waste of a slot.

Well, then rejoice you can add another a totaly brand new buff or debuff to your list.
As said, stamina costs for restoring focus are neglegtable -> you get more stam from regeneration and using the skill will give you even more stam regen.

Jabbs_Giggity

Vajrak wrote: »

Templar
-Radiant Destruction: Decreased the channel time for this ability and its morphs to 1.8 seconds from 2.8 seconds; the damage done has been decreased by approximately 15% and cost by approximately 35%. The total damage per second and cost per second should remain relatively unchanged.
Developer Comment:
This change allows the Templar more opportunities to integrate damage over time effects into their rotation during the execute phase, while retaining the powerful level of Radiant Destruction.
[
---Proof right here that they don't check their own damn effects. Templar can start execute phase at 45% hp with just keeping up DoTs and Radiant, it's actually very easy to do and will inflate your dps by 7-10k doing so. Now it's getting moved back down again to fit the shorter channel, requiring twice as many casts....I'll have to test if this is a nerf, but it sure reads like it.

Just to recap and clarify, Radiant was buffed to a nasty 480% from 330% for Wolfhunter DLC. After various setups in PVP I can still say that 9/10 players will STILL SURVIVE this "execute" under 25% health (In PVP Campaign).
Radiant Oppression (Not factoring in the 20% based on Magicka proportion):
Just for S&G's, sets are LA Julianos, Willpower, Kena, Domihaus with Seducer Destro Staff. Apprentice Mundus All Magicka glyphs/Spell DMG glyphs for all below...Very basic for numbers only:
Current Cost is 3,764 Magicka with LA passives
Current Base DMG is 18,684 Tooltip with ONLY Major Sorcery buff active
480% bonus gives (Including base) 89,683 magic damage over 2.8 seconds
With Burning Light comes out to 33,649 DAMAGE PER SECOND!

Compare to Sorc's Wrath with Implosion (Same setup) 32,362 Damage (Not including Concussed) for only 1,969 Magicka!

And now, Radiant will be nerfed to 1.8 second channel with a 15% reduction to damage and 35% increase to cost...
Now the numbers look roughly like this:
Cost is almost 5K Magicka!
Base Damage is roughly 15,881 and 76,230 with the 480% which will translate to 42,350 damage per second (roughly) at at insane 5K Magicka cost...
You can literally cast Wrath 3 times for the same cost before a Templar completes one channel of Radiant, while still going through your rotation.

I still fail to see how such a high tool-tip execute will only successfully execute under 2% health...And now to have to spam 2-3 times to actually execute an enemy player will cost you roughly 15K Magicka, with no option to block incoming damage or heal through. Sorry, but I am not thrilled about this change as the skill still under performs even with the beefy buff for current patch.

Only thing I am excited for is the 8% buff to Puncturing Strikes and what ZOS is stating a more accurate hitbox and the improvement of Minor Sorcery buff that we'll get from our illuminate passive. That is really what I take away from this upcoming patch for Magplar. Keep running heavy armor and swift jewelry and don't solo...

carlos424

I thought cost of radiant was being reduced 35%

Solinur

carlos424 wrote: »

I thought cost of radiant was being reduced 35%

Exactly.

DId some streamer menion it wrong? Seen this mistake on some places now. Especially the Dev comment makes that so clear, how can ppl get this wrong?

carlos424

Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »

Vajrak wrote: »

Templar

And now, Radiant will be nerfed to 1.8 second channel with a 15% reduction to damage and 35% increase to cost...
Now the numbers look roughly like this:
Cost is almost 5K Magicka!
Base Damage is roughly 15,881 and 76,230 with the 480% which will translate to 42,350 damage per second (roughly) at at insane 5K Magicka cost...
You can literally cast Wrath 3 times for the same cost before a Templar completes one channel of Radiant, while still going through your rotation.

I still fail to see how such a high tool-tip execute will only successfully execute under 2% health...And now to have to spam 2-3 times to actually execute an enemy player will cost you roughly 15K Magicka, with no option to block incoming damage or heal through.

Ya this was mentioned a few posts ago. I’m not sure how I like the radiant “nerf.” Just getting used to the 3k dps increase from last patch. But it is a 35% cost reduction, not increase. Only losing 15% of damage, with basically 35% less channeling time, might be an over all buff .... i think. Of course that extra second will be needed to ward up. Lol

Drdeath20

Trenia wrote: »

The change to javelin knock back takes away what was a fun and unique skill. Also, no one is going to slot the new restoring focus in pve, as it is a waste of a skill slot. In pvp, it was a good magic dump for stamplar. Reducing the damage on backlash, and allowing it to crit would have been much better. Other changes are okay.

Theres a spear morph that still knocks back. Yes its magicka but the damage was secondary to the effect. Soo im not following ya here.

Also restoring focus making templars be able to gain stamina while blocking. Yeah it will be used. Soo again im not following ya.

Drdeath20

Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »

Vajrak wrote: »

Templar
-Radiant Destruction: Decreased the channel time for this ability and its morphs to 1.8 seconds from 2.8 seconds; the damage done has been decreased by approximately 15% and cost by approximately 35%. The total damage per second and cost per second should remain relatively unchanged.
Developer Comment:
This change allows the Templar more opportunities to integrate damage over time effects into their rotation during the execute phase, while retaining the powerful level of Radiant Destruction.
[
---Proof right here that they don't check their own damn effects. Templar can start execute phase at 45% hp with just keeping up DoTs and Radiant, it's actually very easy to do and will inflate your dps by 7-10k doing so. Now it's getting moved back down again to fit the shorter channel, requiring twice as many casts....I'll have to test if this is a nerf, but it sure reads like it.

Just to recap and clarify, Radiant was buffed to a nasty 480% from 330% for Wolfhunter DLC. After various setups in PVP I can still say that 9/10 players will STILL SURVIVE this "execute" under 25% health (In PVP Campaign).
Radiant Oppression (Not factoring in the 20% based on Magicka proportion):
Just for S&G's, sets are LA Julianos, Willpower, Kena, Domihaus with Seducer Destro Staff. Apprentice Mundus All Magicka glyphs/Spell DMG glyphs for all below...Very basic for numbers only:
Current Cost is 3,764 Magicka with LA passives
Current Base DMG is 18,684 Tooltip with ONLY Major Sorcery buff active
480% bonus gives (Including base) 89,683 magic damage over 2.8 seconds
With Burning Light comes out to 33,649 DAMAGE PER SECOND!

Compare to Sorc's Wrath with Implosion (Same setup) 32,362 Damage (Not including Concussed) for only 1,969 Magicka!

And now, Radiant will be nerfed to 1.8 second channel with a 15% reduction to damage and 35% increase to cost...
Now the numbers look roughly like this:
Cost is almost 5K Magicka!
Base Damage is roughly 15,881 and 76,230 with the 480% which will translate to 42,350 damage per second (roughly) at at insane 5K Magicka cost...
You can literally cast Wrath 3 times for the same cost before a Templar completes one channel of Radiant, while still going through your rotation.

I still fail to see how such a high tool-tip execute will only successfully execute under 2% health...And now to have to spam 2-3 times to actually execute an enemy player will cost you roughly 15K Magicka, with no option to block incoming damage or heal through. Sorry, but I am not thrilled about this change as the skill still under performs even with the beefy buff for current patch.

Only thing I am excited for is the 8% buff to Puncturing Strikes and what ZOS is stating a more accurate hitbox and the improvement of Minor Sorcery buff that we'll get from our illuminate passive. That is really what I take away from this upcoming patch for Magplar. Keep running heavy armor and swift jewelry and don't solo...

The cost was reduced by 35%

Drdeath20

Trenia wrote: »

Elsterchen wrote: »

Trenia wrote: »

The change to javelin knock back takes away what was a fun and unique skill. Also, no one is going to slot the new restoring focus in pve, as it is a waste of a skill slot. In pvp, it was a good magic dump for stamplar. Reducing the damage on backlash, and allowing it to crit would have been much better. Other changes are okay.

First of, if you like to fun troll in PVP use the other javelline skill ... which will solve your second problem of missing a mag dump (as this morph of javeline costs magica).

btw: My stamplar slots the new restoring focus, bc its cheap adds survivability and stam regen ... both are quite usefull in PVE, too (imho).

The stam morph had a longer knockback. I don't want a magic dump on a damage ability. It's not useful in PVE. It's a waste of a slot.

Not trying to be argumentative but are you serious? If so please explain.

The restoring focus change is huge for both pvp and pve. The only people upset are the blockcasting trollplars.

Also if your looking for a knockback well templars still have access to it. For a stamplar it just becomes a mag dump.

hedna123b14_ESO

I LOVE all the changes (speaking strictly for PvE).
A few possible improvements to adress:
1. Backlash:
Fix the bug associated with the copied damage not proccing.
2. Vamp Bane
Decrease the initial hit damage, buff DoT damage, so you have to cast it on cooldown, instead of every 8 seconds. Ideally the DoT should run 12 seconds, so you could dynamically cast it throughout a rotation. As it stands now, the magplar rotation is static.

XZS2JHub17_ESO

1. Needs more stamina skill moprhs
2. Needs better sustain.

xgoldelf

I believe Templars have a great chance to be good tanks but it is common that everyone only chooses dks as tanks. I advise either adding a new taunt ability/morph for templars making them great tanks along with healers or improve their class as well to include tanking somehow. They are great classes all around but I feel that it would make a huge difference and adding more Templar tanks to the playing field.

tuxon

For me the pain point is sustain of course.

Drdeath20

I really dont see sustain as being too terrible now.

Keeping good uptime on Channeled focus alone has kept my magplar with enough magicka to barely have to heavy attack. If I were to invest even a little bit more into sustain im sure i could go an entire fight without heavy attacking for resources.

Stamina got repentance just about back and a restoring focus that is on par with channeled focus. It will take some getting use to but thats a fair amount of sustain right there.

** Pain points i see is radiant aura. Still not cost effective. Clearly meant as a group sustain buff for mobs but most mobs die too soon to even gain magicka back and its secondary effect (10% regen) is fairly small and lost on a bar swap. Id really like for this skill to have either have somethin that makes it worth the high cost or have its cost brought down so its more cost effective.

**healing ritual is another pain point. It cost way too much to have a short radius instant heal. As a healer healing springs is a much better option. It has range, can be stacked, strong heals over a short time, gives magicka back and is fairly cheap. For templars it would be nice to have a sticky HoT. Most our other Hot's come with some sort of condition. I have to stand in a puddle, my opponent has to attack me while debuffed, i have to sweep my opponent etc..etc. I believe that changing this to a magicka form of vigor is a fair adjustment. Healers will still prefer healing springs and BoL for the big instant heal. Just more a QoL change. Especially with the changes to shields. Shields are still superior to short HoTs but with this change templars will have options.

**templar ultimates. Radial sweep still needs to be adjusted soo i wont comment on it.

-I believe 1 of the morphs of rite of passage should be more useful to stamplars. As it stands right now they both pretty much do the same thing but 1 for a few seconds shorter and neither help stamplars. Id prefer remembrance to be adjusted. Just seems less appealing to slot a healing skill that does less healing. A suggestion would be that it no longer heals allies but applies some buffs on only the caster for a few seconds. Kinda like a mini warhorn. Its cheap the buffs only last 6 seconds and its useful to all builds. Everyone is happy and its not gamebreaking.

-solar disturbance is another ultimate that needs to be adjusted. Everyone has access to a much more powerful destruction staff ultimate for dps and templars have solar prison which has better defensive and group usage. Solar disturbance is less useful in groups as the other 2 and has weak solo useage. I believe ZoS needs to dedicate solar disturbance more to a synergyless solo ultimate.

There are a few other things i believe templars need to have looked at but all in all i am pleased with the changes we have recieves the last 2 patches. Great job everyone.

Datolite

Drdeath20 wrote: »

-solar disturbance is another ultimate that needs to be adjusted. Everyone has access to a much more powerful destructiion staff ultimate for dps and templars have solar prison which has better defensive and group usage. Solar disturbance is less useful in groups as the other 2 and has weak solo useage. I believe ZoS needs to dedicate solar disturbance more to a synergyless solo ultimate.

Four words: Eye of the Supernova

Lose the synergy, keep the snare and damage. Goes with the melee templar aoe theme perfectly.

I would weep hot joyful tears.

Drdeath20

datoliteb16_ESO wrote: »

Drdeath20 wrote: »

-solar disturbance is another ultimate that needs to be adjusted. Everyone has access to a much more powerful destructiion staff ultimate for dps and templars have solar prison which has better defensive and group usage. Solar disturbance is less useful in groups as the other 2 and has weak solo useage. I believe ZoS needs to dedicate solar disturbance more to a synergyless solo ultimate.

Four words: Eye of the Supernova

Lose the synergy, keep the snare and damage. Goes with the melee templar aoe theme perfectly.

I would weep hot joyful tears.

Why not! Its not like it would be anymore powerful than the destro ultimate. the snare would atleast be fun to watch people try to crawl out of.

Vajrak

Drdeath20 wrote: »

I really dont see sustain as being too terrible now.


**healing ritual is another pain point. It cost way too much to have a short radius instant heal. As a healer healing springs is a much better option. It has range, can be stacked, strong heals over a short time, gives magicka back and is fairly cheap. For templars it would be nice to have a sticky HoT. Most our other Hot's come with some sort of condition. I have to stand in a puddle, my opponent has to attack me while debuffed, i have to sweep my opponent etc..etc. I believe that changing this to a magicka form of vigor is a fair adjustment. Healers will still prefer healing springs and BoL for the big instant heal. Just more a QoL change. Especially with the changes to shields. Shields are still superior to short HoTs but with this change templars will have options.

Healing Ritual used to be absolutely amazing --- but most people were too dumb to use it. First off, it is not a "Short Radius" by any means. It covers nearly the same area as Ritual of Ret/Purifying...that's a pretty large area for a PBAoE. The short channel time on it, and the original that had a repeat heal for 1/2 value 3s later used to allow almost 500k hps output with nothing else used, and had a low enough cost to spam cast 50-60 times in a row without touching a pot.

People complained, so it got turned into AoE Breath...and is now crap...so people complain and ask for a revision to what it was, they just didn't understand that is what it was.

And people wonder why the dev's ignore the community.

Drdeath20

Vajrak wrote: »

Drdeath20 wrote: »

I really dont see sustain as being too terrible now.


**healing ritual is another pain point. It cost way too much to have a short radius instant heal. As a healer healing springs is a much better option. It has range, can be stacked, strong heals over a short time, gives magicka back and is fairly cheap. For templars it would be nice to have a sticky HoT. Most our other Hot's come with some sort of condition. I have to stand in a puddle, my opponent has to attack me while debuffed, i have to sweep my opponent etc..etc. I believe that changing this to a magicka form of vigor is a fair adjustment. Healers will still prefer healing springs and BoL for the big instant heal. Just more a QoL change. Especially with the changes to shields. Shields are still superior to short HoTs but with this change templars will have options.

Healing Ritual used to be absolutely amazing --- but most people were too dumb to use it. First off, it is not a "Short Radius" by any means. It covers nearly the same area as Ritual of Ret/Purifying...that's a pretty large area for a PBAoE. The short channel time on it, and the original that had a repeat heal for 1/2 value 3s later used to allow almost 500k hps output with nothing else used, and had a low enough cost to spam cast 50-60 times in a row without touching a pot.

People complained, so it got turned into AoE Breath...and is now crap...so people complain and ask for a revision to what it was, they just didn't understand that is what it was.

And people wonder why the dev's ignore the community.

Not to be that guy but 12meter radius is actually much larger than 10meter radius. It doesnt seem like much but it is.

There is zero evidence to back up the statement that peoples complaints had any cause for healing rituals initial change.

It just wasnt used by people outside of pvdoor farming stack on crown groups. Before its change everyone had near unlimited sustain and most the content was a quick burn through. BoL had 360 degree radius and healed a few allies for a good amount. Healing ritual was changed and then ZoS altered CP tree, sustain skills and BoL. Now we have this super expensive impractical skill that i think we all can agree needs to be changed

Minno

Drdeath20 wrote: »

Vajrak wrote: »

Drdeath20 wrote: »

I really dont see sustain as being too terrible now.


**healing ritual is another pain point. It cost way too much to have a short radius instant heal. As a healer healing springs is a much better option. It has range, can be stacked, strong heals over a short time, gives magicka back and is fairly cheap. For templars it would be nice to have a sticky HoT. Most our other Hot's come with some sort of condition. I have to stand in a puddle, my opponent has to attack me while debuffed, i have to sweep my opponent etc..etc. I believe that changing this to a magicka form of vigor is a fair adjustment. Healers will still prefer healing springs and BoL for the big instant heal. Just more a QoL change. Especially with the changes to shields. Shields are still superior to short HoTs but with this change templars will have options.

Healing Ritual used to be absolutely amazing --- but most people were too dumb to use it. First off, it is not a "Short Radius" by any means. It covers nearly the same area as Ritual of Ret/Purifying...that's a pretty large area for a PBAoE. The short channel time on it, and the original that had a repeat heal for 1/2 value 3s later used to allow almost 500k hps output with nothing else used, and had a low enough cost to spam cast 50-60 times in a row without touching a pot.

People complained, so it got turned into AoE Breath...and is now crap...so people complain and ask for a revision to what it was, they just didn't understand that is what it was.

And people wonder why the dev's ignore the community.

Not to be that guy but 12meter radius is actually much larger than 10meter radius. It doesnt seem like much but it is.

There is zero evidence to back up the statement that peoples complaints had any cause for healing rituals initial change.

It just wasnt used by people outside of pvdoor farming stack on crown groups. Before its change everyone had near unlimited sustain and most the content was a quick burn through. BoL had 360 degree radius and healed a few allies for a good amount. Healing ritual was changed and then ZoS altered CP tree, sustain skills and BoL. Now we have this super expensive impractical skill that i think we all can agree needs to be changed

the complaints were old healing ritual was overshadowed by healing springs because it was a cast time and basically the same thing as BOL but with a cast time.

Now it's still overshadowed by healing springs and still basically an AOE BOL, but instant cast.

It was the wrong fix; it should have been a PBAOE heal but over time like vigor. Then offer a mag/stam morph of it.

turlisley

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

Update 20 / Murkmire update PTS changes: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/435633/pts-patch-notes-v4-2-0

Templar

Other feedback:
-Still no change to Dark Flare's long cast-time, long projectile travel-time/delay, and overall low/lackluster damage. (In comparison, Snipe is superior in all of these categories.)
-Still no change to the (un)Balanced Warrior passive: +6% Weapon Damage and +2640 Spell Resistance. Where is the +6% Spell Damage and +2640 Physical Resistance? This is a super-simple easy fix/buff. Make the Balanced Warrior passive, ya'know, balanced...
-Still no change in moving the Master Ritualist passive to the Alliance War Support tree and giving Templar's Restoring Light tree something more useful and worthwhile.
-Still no change in the syngery-activation/range for Nova/Solar Disturbance/Solar Prison.
-Still no change in the healing-speed animation for Rite of Passage/Remembrance/Practiced Incantation channeled effect. (e.g. Templars frequently die while channeling this ultimate in PvP.)

Experimental feedback/suggestion:
-Remove the base-damage of Backlash/PurifyingLight/PowerOfTheLight and add that damage value to the damage-copied value instead. This would increase overall damage-done/burst-potential of this ability, and this would enable Backlash (+morphs) to be cast upon enemies without breaking stealth, and it would also allow PvE enemies to not agro you right away immediately upon casting the ability.
This is similar to how Nightblade's Reaper's Mark ability already functions -- it does not break stealth and it does not agro enemies -- until you begin your burst combo/rotation. The same situation/encounter occurs for Destruction Staff's WeaknessToElements/ElementalSusceptibility/ElementalDrain -- it does not break stealth and it does not agro enemies -- please make Backlash/PurifyingLight/PowerOfTheLight function like this.)

These additions would be great changes to what was already done on the PTS.

Also, why are Backlash (+morphs) non-crit-able?
Please pass along this feedback to the Devs in the next Class Rep meeting.

@Checkmath @Joy_Division

Neoauspex

turlisley wrote: »

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

Update 20 / Murkmire update PTS changes: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/435633/pts-patch-notes-v4-2-0

Templar

Other feedback:
-Still no change to Dark Flare's long cast-time, long projectile travel-time/delay, and overall low/lackluster damage. (In comparison, Snipe is superior in all of these categories.)
-Still no change to the (un)Balanced Warrior passive: +6% Weapon Damage and +2640 Spell Resistance. Where is the +6% Spell Damage and +2640 Physical Resistance? This is a super-simple easy fix/buff. Make the Balanced Warrior passive, ya'know, balanced...
-Still no change in moving the Master Ritualist passive to the Alliance War Support tree and giving Templar's Restoring Light tree something more useful and worthwhile.
-Still no change in the syngery-activation/range for Nova/Solar Disturbance/Solar Prison.
-Still no change in the healing-speed animation for Rite of Passage/Remembrance/Practiced Incantation channeled effect. (e.g. Templars frequently die while channeling this ultimate in PvP.)

Experimental feedback/suggestion:
-Remove the base-damage of Backlash/PurifyingLight/PowerOfTheLight and add that damage value to the damage-copied value instead. This would increase overall damage-done/burst-potential of this ability, and this would enable Backlash (+morphs) to be cast upon enemies without breaking stealth, and it would also allow PvE enemies to not agro you right away immediately upon casting the ability.
This is similar to how Nightblade's Reaper's Mark ability already functions -- it does not break stealth and it does not agro enemies -- until you begin your burst combo/rotation. The same situation/encounter occurs for Destruction Staff's WeaknessToElements/ElementalSusceptibility/ElementalDrain -- it does not break stealth and it does not agro enemies -- please make Backlash/PurifyingLight/PowerOfTheLight function like this.)

These additions would be great changes to what was already done on the PTS.

Also, why are Backlash (+morphs) non-crit-able?
Please pass along this feedback to the Devs in the next Class Rep meeting.

@Checkmath @Joy_Division

Because critting on separate attacks adds to the damage it stacks.

carlos424

[/quote]

Because critting on separate attacks adds to the damage it stacks.[/quote]

Ya, but there is a limit to the damage. If youre in a raid you shouldnt even need crits to reach damage limit. Might be different in small group or hitting a target dummy.

Vajrak

Drdeath20 wrote: »

Not to be that guy but 12meter radius is actually much larger than 10meter radius. It doesnt seem like much but it is.

There is zero evidence to back up the statement that peoples complaints had any cause for healing rituals initial change.

It just wasnt used by people outside of pvdoor farming stack on crown groups. Before its change everyone had near unlimited sustain and most the content was a quick burn through. BoL had 360 degree radius and healed a few allies for a good amount. Healing ritual was changed and then ZoS altered CP tree, sustain skills and BoL. Now we have this super expensive impractical skill that i think we all can agree needs to be changed [/quote]

It is a pretty big difference, but on live play it came out to a rather reasonable area on both, easy to get into the zone for it or reposition yourself to hit the tank and the DD's unless they were crap at positioning anyway.

PvP it was usable for healing a large group on a cast time, PvE it was easy to sustain forever, even after the sustain nerfs --- the 50-60 casts before pots was recent, as in live play before the most recent changes to it.

Take the heal value, make it into an instant with 33% value on 3 procs (2/2/2) and that'd be an improvement --- and reduce the damn cost to make it feasible to actually use it -.-.

technohic

I'd say the class rep system has helped templar quite a bit. I'd say my major concern now would be how much jabs gets mitigated.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

carlos424 wrote: »

Because critting on separate attacks adds to the damage it stacks.

Ya, but there is a limit to the damage. If youre in a raid you shouldnt even need crits to reach damage limit. Might be different in small group or hitting a target dummy.

You understand that means it would double crit right? Read why zos does not want backlash to crit here- https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/3765307#Comment_3765307

. Changing Backlash’s final damage so it no longer critically strikes prevents the Templar from reaching the damage cap too easily with a high Critical Strike rating.

Checkmath

Hey guys. I am very busy atm, so I am a bit late with reading and commenting in here. Thank you for your awesome feedback. I will try to bring up some points you mentioned at the next meeting. Keep it up and lets make this class even better

Darkmage1337

Checkmath wrote: »

Hey guys. I am very busy atm, so I am a bit late with reading and commenting in here. Thank you for your awesome feedback. I will try to bring up some points you mentioned at the next meeting. Keep it up and lets make this class even better

Sooo, how'd the meeting go?

Drdeath20

Vajrak wrote: »

Drdeath20 wrote: »

Not to be that guy but 12meter radius is actually much larger than 10meter radius. It doesnt seem like much but it is.

There is zero evidence to back up the statement that peoples complaints had any cause for healing rituals initial change.

It just wasnt used by people outside of pvdoor farming stack on crown groups. Before its change everyone had near unlimited sustain and most the content was a quick burn through. BoL had 360 degree radius and healed a few allies for a good amount. Healing ritual was changed and then ZoS altered CP tree, sustain skills and BoL. Now we have this super expensive impractical skill that i think we all can agree needs to be changed

It is a pretty big difference, but on live play it came out to a rather reasonable area on both, easy to get into the zone for it or reposition yourself to hit the tank and the DD's unless they were crap at positioning anyway.

PvP it was usable for healing a large group on a cast time, PvE it was easy to sustain forever, even after the sustain nerfs --- the 50-60 casts before pots was recent, as in live play before the most recent changes to it.

Take the heal value, make it into an instant with 33% value on 3 procs (2/2/2) and that'd be an improvement --- and reduce the damn cost to make it feasible to actually use it -.-.
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Id like to have this change. Useable for all magicka.

Minno

Darkmage1337 wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Hey guys. I am very busy atm, so I am a bit late with reading and commenting in here. Thank you for your awesome feedback. I will try to bring up some points you mentioned at the next meeting. Keep it up and lets make this class even better

Sooo, how'd the meeting go?

This is what joy sent zos:

"Community Feedback for Templars

The first thing I would mention is that this was the one part of the class section of the PTS notes that players were genuinely excited to read. Magplars are pleased with their single target DPS. It’s a model for how to approach changes in the future. So, whatever is listed here are just things to make a good set of changes better and should not be seen as representative of Templar frustration.

Puncturing Strikes:
This is the number one concern templars have. In order of importance:
There is widespread belief that something (the champion system in the most likely culprit) is mitigating the damage by too much. See Cinbri’s post and notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/396641/puncturing-strikes-and-red-cp-in-u17/p1 and here https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/5468303/#Comment_5468303. See my comparison of damage here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/5461318/#Comment_5461318 (note how my Burning Light damage is similar but my Sweeps damage is so much lower).
All templars are worried that Evasion will basically be up on every stamina character as well as magicka NBs, which means our spammable will be mitigated by 25% against the majority of opponents. My personal suggestion if to make it so the “closest target” which received the damage boost does not get mitigated by Evasion.
The targeting reform was helpful and appreciated, but it’s still hard to hit skillful agile players. Speed disparity is definitely an issue so what was said at the meeting ought to help. Giving Templars some more class control would also help.

Crescent Sweep:
Swapping the morphs did give all Templars more options.
The main concern Templars have with Radial Sweep (i.e. both morphs) is that it just misses sometimes, even targets standing right next to the Templar.
The radius/range of this ultimate is too short
It’s difficult to test just how effective Crescent Sweep is because penetration values are not scaling correctly on the PTS. There is some concern Dawnbreaker/Meteor/Soul Assault still might be better options.
The change made to the pulse ought to help #3. Aside from increasing the range, another option might be to model it after Incapacitating Strike, and have the ultimate stun at 120 ultimate (and thus making the templar ultimate always the go to choice for “magplars” rather than Dawnbreaker).

Rune Focus:
“Stamplars” are happy to get a source of resource management here. This change alone has made some excited to play the next patch. Some things to consider though:
A number of Templars (I can’t say what %, it’s a fair number) have suggested to keep the cost of the skill magicka. Magicka “dumps” are generally preferred by stamina-oriented characters.
While the stamina sustain in nice, it’s coming at a pretty hefty price: the complete loss of minor vitality and easy 100% uptime on major protection (more on that below).

Loss of Minor Vitality
There is concern for PvP that the rune focus changes are just going to push “Stamplars” to heavy armor to recoup the “tankiness” they lost from the old Rune Focus. Also, “stamplars” and even “magplars” get limited use out of the Mending passive as it only effects Restoring Light heals as that means Vigors, Rallies, Mutagens, Purifying Lights, Puncturing Strikes, etc., are all unaffected.
Perhaps make is so Mending effects all healing
Perhaps put back Minor Vitality in the Templar kit, maybe to the lackluster Ritualist passive upon activation of a Restoring Light skill.

Change to Aedric Spear:
While the passive is more versatile, it might not be better. One of the frustrating aspects of this change is that a unique 15% block mitigation is being taken away from the Templar kit to be replaced by a generic buff that can be acquired elsewhere and by other classes. This may be a goal of ZOS’s in that this is an established pattern for the past three years, but it represents the further homogenization and loss of distinctiveness of the classes and it’s not just templars that dislike this sort of change. Getting down to brass tacks:
A blocking templar will always be worse off after update 20. Potentially noticeably worse off because they can’t block-cast Puncturing Strikes and thus might not be able to maintain the short uptime of minor protection (Sun Shield is still undesirable to all except *very* high health tank builds.)
A non-tank oriented Templar can very easily have the 15% reduction from the old Spear Wall and 100% uptime on the 8% Minor Protection from Restoring Focus. This is now not possible, and another reason for the attraction of heavy armor.
In a PvP environment, at present I do not want to use *any* Aedric Spear abilities (Sweeps: see damage bug above and it’s too hard to hit players, Javelin messes up my Eclipse, Toppling Charge is lackluster and too slow to hit anyone, Spear Shards no longer stuns and is easily avoided, Sun Shield is not good except on high health troll builds). So I’m pretty much never going to gain the benefits of that passive whereas on Live I will always gain the benefit of Spear Wall while I need it (i.e. blocking, I slot Sweeps for the passive critical damage, not because I want to use the skill).
In short, the situations in which this passive is better are narrow and it’s coming at the cost of something that is unique to the Templar kit. At a minimum the duration ought to be extended (to perhaps 6 seconds) and even then, every one of the Aedric Spear abilities (except perhaps the new Radial Sweep, we still need to see how that actually plays) is in need of reform to ensure these skills are used and that passive is activated.
The removal of class unique features is something that should not be encouraged at all.

Radiant Destruction:
I haven’t tested the damage to see if it indeed is the same. But I do know the empty channel in the beginning of skill is still there and it should be removed just like the empty channel was removed from Soul Assault. I can get bashed before the spell even activates and does damage. Also, with the frantic pace of combat and burst shields/heals, a target can get super quick get out of execute range, which defeats the whole point of slotting the ability in the first place.

Other “Pain Points” for consideration in future update
Solar Flare (both morphs) are not popular. The 40% reduction to the Solar Barrage morph was too much and Corrupting Pollen outshines what Dark Flare is supposed to so
Restoring Aura (and the magicka morph Radiant Aura) provides a generic buff that is not cost effective at all.
Light Weaver (just bad), Master Ritualist (overshadowed by gear, soul gems are not exciting), Balanced Warrior (not very balanced considering Sorcerer Expert Mage grants bonus to weapon damage), Burning Light (should not be blockable) are all passives that should be reformed
Focused Charge (both morphs) are outdated. Cast-times are rare because most people dislike them so off balance feature never comes into play. This aside from the frustrating range limitation, it’s slow speed, lackluster damage, and inability to control opponents (spell is too slow to hit people with Toppling morph, Explosive may hit dodge-roller, but they soon leave Templar in the dust).
Various Aedric spear abilities (see above)
Restoring Aura passive should be reverted to what it was in Beta.
"