[Class Rep] Nightblade Feedback Thread

martinhpb16_ESO

What's going on Zos?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0NiIiT0oA8

Results
Stam Warden 48.4k
Stam Necro 48.3k
Stam DK 46.3k
Stam Sorc 42.6k
Stam Temp 42.4k
Stam NB 42.3k

Deathlord92

martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »

What's going on Zos?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0NiIiT0oA8

Results
Stam Warden 48.4k
Stam Necro 48.3k
Stam DK 46.3k
Stam Sorc 42.6k
Stam Temp 42.4k
Stam NB 42.3k

Here I thought nb suppose to be king of dps lol what a joke why play a nb when you can play stamcro 100% uptime on major defile better healing better damage and more tanky 🤣🤣🤣

OWLTHEMAD

Class is losing its hallmarks to everybody else. We had fear, then necro had fear, then everybody had fear.

We had self healing by attacking. Now everybody (except maybe sorc?) Has self healing built in to attacks.

We had an ulit that increased our damage. Templar got a better one, then later necros got an Aoe ulti that increased EVERYBODY'S damage even more.

We have very little group utility and certainly nothing unique and unreplaceable. We dont fit as an invaluable part of a team under any niche. We dont do the most damage, we dont do the most healing, we dont make the best tanks (tbf were doing pretty okay in that department right now situationally, but far from best) we dont excel in pvp, hell it can be argued that you can build other classes to be equally good gankers if not better for pure damage. Hell a sorc could lie in wait in stealth, burst you down then streak away before anyone catches you and hide again. In fact, that exact scenario happened during my last imp city excursion, WHILE i was in stealth. Feels bad man

Ive barely been playing lately because its just not rewarding to play my MAIN character anymore.

In pve we have really high 'potential' dps, but its so difficult to get there most players will realistically never get those numbers and most groups will take a minor dps loss in exchange for the group utility provided by any other class. Like its easier to hit hard on any other class. Ive played templar and the rotation is so easy, and is almost completely cyclical.

I dont get it and hope they fix it in next chapter, because its getting old and really killing this game for me.

Langeston

OWLTHEMAD wrote: »

Class is losing its hallmarks to everybody else. We had fear, then necro had fear, then everybody had fear.

We had self healing by attacking. Now everybody (except maybe sorc?) Has self healing built in to attacks.

We had an ulit that increased our damage. Templar got a better one, then later necros got an Aoe ulti that increased EVERYBODY'S damage even more.

We have very little group utility and certainly nothing unique and unreplaceable. We dont fit as an invaluable part of a team under any niche. We dont do the most damage, we dont do the most healing, we dont make the best tanks (tbf were doing pretty okay in that department right now situationally, but far from best) we dont excel in pvp, hell it can be argued that you can build other classes to be equally good gankers if not better for pure damage. Hell a sorc could lie in wait in stealth, burst you down then streak away before anyone catches you and hide again. In fact, that exact scenario happened during my last imp city excursion, WHILE i was in stealth. Feels bad man

Ive barely been playing lately because its just not rewarding to play my MAIN character anymore.

In pve we have really high 'potential' dps, but its so difficult to get there most players will realistically never get those numbers and most groups will take a minor dps loss in exchange for the group utility provided by any other class. Like its easier to hit hard on any other class. Ive played templar and the rotation is so easy, and is almost completely cyclical.

I dont get it and hope they fix it in next chapter, because its getting old and really killing this game for me.

Yeah, Sorcs get heals from attacks too — all of them. Critical Surge heals for 3300 every time they crit. So if they have 25% crit & are spamming LA/Force Pulse, statistically they should be healing for 3.3k every second. (For reference, Swallow Soul heals for less than half of that unless you crit.)

The balance in this game is a [snip] joke when it comes to every other class vs NBs. I'm done spending any money on it (not buying Greymoor & cancelling ESO+ as soon as it's up) and if ZOS doesn't fix NB in the next patch I'm pretty sure I'm done. It's a pity too, I really like the game.

[edited for profanity bypass]

deepseamk20b14_ESO

Langeston wrote: »

OWLTHEMAD wrote: »

Class is losing its hallmarks to everybody else. We had fear, then necro had fear, then everybody had fear.

We had self healing by attacking. Now everybody (except maybe sorc?) Has self healing built in to attacks.

We had an ulit that increased our damage. Templar got a better one, then later necros got an Aoe ulti that increased EVERYBODY'S damage even more.

We have very little group utility and certainly nothing unique and unreplaceable. We dont fit as an invaluable part of a team under any niche. We dont do the most damage, we dont do the most healing, we dont make the best tanks (tbf were doing pretty okay in that department right now situationally, but far from best) we dont excel in pvp, hell it can be argued that you can build other classes to be equally good gankers if not better for pure damage. Hell a sorc could lie in wait in stealth, burst you down then streak away before anyone catches you and hide again. In fact, that exact scenario happened during my last imp city excursion, WHILE i was in stealth. Feels bad man

Ive barely been playing lately because its just not rewarding to play my MAIN character anymore.

In pve we have really high 'potential' dps, but its so difficult to get there most players will realistically never get those numbers and most groups will take a minor dps loss in exchange for the group utility provided by any other class. Like its easier to hit hard on any other class. Ive played templar and the rotation is so easy, and is almost completely cyclical.

I dont get it and hope they fix it in next chapter, because its getting old and really killing this game for me.

Yeah, Sorcs get heals from attacks too — all of them. Critical Surge heals for 3300 every time they crit. So if they have 25% crit & are spamming LA/Force Pulse, statistically they should be healing for 3.3k every second. (For reference, Swallow Soul heals for less than half of that unless you crit.)

The balance in this game is a [snip] joke when it comes to every other class vs NBs. I'm done spending any money on it (not buying Greymoor & cancelling ESO+ as soon as it's up) and if ZOS doesn't fix NB in the next patch I'm pretty sure I'm done. It's a pity too, I really like the game.

You can still effectively do all content. Even if, like in the video posted, Stam blade is last for DPS, its not like you can't finish content like that. Not to mention dummy parses aren't be all end all compared to actual dungeons.

In PvP NB is still decent. Do other classes have it easier? I believe so. I can make more mistakes on my sort and DK and be fine. NB isn't trash like everyone makes it out to be though.

I'd love Major fracture back and I personally like my mark Idea I posted here, but we got what we got. If it bugs you that much its very easy to level another character. I'd suggest stam sorc. Very fast and easy rotation in PvE. At least something to do in the meantime right?

[edited to remove quote]

martinhpb16_ESO

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

If it bugs you that much its very easy to level another character. I'd suggest stam sorc. Very fast and easy rotation in PvE. At least something to do in the meantime right?

That's an idea but only by us whining will we get back the buffs you mention. If we go play stamsorc and keep quiet nothing will change.

Czekoludek

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

OWLTHEMAD wrote: »

Class is losing its hallmarks to everybody else. We had fear, then necro had fear, then everybody had fear.

We had self healing by attacking. Now everybody (except maybe sorc?) Has self healing built in to attacks.

We had an ulit that increased our damage. Templar got a better one, then later necros got an Aoe ulti that increased EVERYBODY'S damage even more.

We have very little group utility and certainly nothing unique and unreplaceable. We dont fit as an invaluable part of a team under any niche. We dont do the most damage, we dont do the most healing, we dont make the best tanks (tbf were doing pretty okay in that department right now situationally, but far from best) we dont excel in pvp, hell it can be argued that you can build other classes to be equally good gankers if not better for pure damage. Hell a sorc could lie in wait in stealth, burst you down then streak away before anyone catches you and hide again. In fact, that exact scenario happened during my last imp city excursion, WHILE i was in stealth. Feels bad man

Ive barely been playing lately because its just not rewarding to play my MAIN character anymore.

In pve we have really high 'potential' dps, but its so difficult to get there most players will realistically never get those numbers and most groups will take a minor dps loss in exchange for the group utility provided by any other class. Like its easier to hit hard on any other class. Ive played templar and the rotation is so easy, and is almost completely cyclical.

I dont get it and hope they fix it in next chapter, because its getting old and really killing this game for me.

Yeah, Sorcs get heals from attacks too — all of them. Critical Surge heals for 3300 every time they crit. So if they have 25% crit & are spamming LA/Force Pulse, statistically they should be healing for 3.3k every second. (For reference, Swallow Soul heals for less than half of that unless you crit.)

The balance in this game is a ******* joke when it comes to every other class vs NBs. I'm done spending any money on it (not buying Greymoor & cancelling ESO+ as soon as it's up) and if ZOS doesn't fix NB in the next patch I'm pretty sure I'm done. It's a pity too, I really like the game.

You can still effectively do all content. Even if, like in the video posted, Stam blade is last for DPS, its not like you can't finish content like that. Not to mention dummy parses aren't be all end all compared to actual dungeons.

In PvP NB is still decent. Do other classes have it easier? I believe so. I can make more mistakes on my sort and DK and be fine. NB isn't trash like everyone makes it out to be though.

I'd love Major fracture back and I personally like my mark Idea I posted here, but we got what we got. If it bugs you that much its very easy to level another character. I'd suggest stam sorc. Very fast and easy rotation in PvE. At least something to do in the meantime right?

If the weakest class in the game (at least for PvP, but even in PvE it's mediocre at best) shouldn't be called trash, how we should call it? Handicap, liability for the group, best at being worst?

Langeston

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

OWLTHEMAD wrote: »

Class is losing its hallmarks to everybody else. We had fear, then necro had fear, then everybody had fear.

We had self healing by attacking. Now everybody (except maybe sorc?) Has self healing built in to attacks.

We had an ulit that increased our damage. Templar got a better one, then later necros got an Aoe ulti that increased EVERYBODY'S damage even more.

We have very little group utility and certainly nothing unique and unreplaceable. We dont fit as an invaluable part of a team under any niche. We dont do the most damage, we dont do the most healing, we dont make the best tanks (tbf were doing pretty okay in that department right now situationally, but far from best) we dont excel in pvp, hell it can be argued that you can build other classes to be equally good gankers if not better for pure damage. Hell a sorc could lie in wait in stealth, burst you down then streak away before anyone catches you and hide again. In fact, that exact scenario happened during my last imp city excursion, WHILE i was in stealth. Feels bad man

Ive barely been playing lately because its just not rewarding to play my MAIN character anymore.

In pve we have really high 'potential' dps, but its so difficult to get there most players will realistically never get those numbers and most groups will take a minor dps loss in exchange for the group utility provided by any other class. Like its easier to hit hard on any other class. Ive played templar and the rotation is so easy, and is almost completely cyclical.

I dont get it and hope they fix it in next chapter, because its getting old and really killing this game for me.

Yeah, Sorcs get heals from attacks too — all of them. Critical Surge heals for 3300 every time they crit. So if they have 25% crit & are spamming LA/Force Pulse, statistically they should be healing for 3.3k every second. (For reference, Swallow Soul heals for less than half of that unless you crit.)

The balance in this game is a ******* joke when it comes to every other class vs NBs. I'm done spending any money on it (not buying Greymoor & cancelling ESO+ as soon as it's up) and if ZOS doesn't fix NB in the next patch I'm pretty sure I'm done. It's a pity too, I really like the game.

You can still effectively do all content. Even if, like in the video posted, Stam blade is last for DPS, its not like you can't finish content like that. Not to mention dummy parses aren't be all end all compared to actual dungeons.

In PvP NB is still decent. Do other classes have it easier? I believe so. I can make more mistakes on my sort and DK and be fine. NB isn't trash like everyone makes it out to be though.

I'd love Major fracture back and I personally like my mark Idea I posted here, but we got what we got. If it bugs you that much its very easy to level another character. I'd suggest stam sorc. Very fast and easy rotation in PvE. At least something to do in the meantime right?

In PVE they're fine, but I rarely play PVE anymore — I play PVP pretty much exclusively. Once you get out of the lower MMR BGs, magblades are basically complete garbage. I can't heal myself effectively, I can't outdamage other classes' heals, and I can't build as tanky as other classes or else I won't do any damage at all — so if I make the slightest mistake I get curb stomped. I can literally put any random blue/purple sets on my magsorc & it'll still do more damage without even trying. It's a complete joke.

I can tell how weak the class is just based on how much easier certain players are to kill depending on what class they're playing. There are some people that I just can't beat when they're on their DK/Warden/Templar/Sorc — but when they're on their Nightblade I completely destroy them.

Stamblades are a bit stronger, but I don't like the playstyle as much anymore.

Iskiab

Langeston wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

OWLTHEMAD wrote: »

Class is losing its hallmarks to everybody else. We had fear, then necro had fear, then everybody had fear.

We had self healing by attacking. Now everybody (except maybe sorc?) Has self healing built in to attacks.

We had an ulit that increased our damage. Templar got a better one, then later necros got an Aoe ulti that increased EVERYBODY'S damage even more.

We have very little group utility and certainly nothing unique and unreplaceable. We dont fit as an invaluable part of a team under any niche. We dont do the most damage, we dont do the most healing, we dont make the best tanks (tbf were doing pretty okay in that department right now situationally, but far from best) we dont excel in pvp, hell it can be argued that you can build other classes to be equally good gankers if not better for pure damage. Hell a sorc could lie in wait in stealth, burst you down then streak away before anyone catches you and hide again. In fact, that exact scenario happened during my last imp city excursion, WHILE i was in stealth. Feels bad man

Ive barely been playing lately because its just not rewarding to play my MAIN character anymore.

In pve we have really high 'potential' dps, but its so difficult to get there most players will realistically never get those numbers and most groups will take a minor dps loss in exchange for the group utility provided by any other class. Like its easier to hit hard on any other class. Ive played templar and the rotation is so easy, and is almost completely cyclical.

I dont get it and hope they fix it in next chapter, because its getting old and really killing this game for me.

Yeah, Sorcs get heals from attacks too — all of them. Critical Surge heals for 3300 every time they crit. So if they have 25% crit & are spamming LA/Force Pulse, statistically they should be healing for 3.3k every second. (For reference, Swallow Soul heals for less than half of that unless you crit.)

The balance in this game is a ******* joke when it comes to every other class vs NBs. I'm done spending any money on it (not buying Greymoor & cancelling ESO+ as soon as it's up) and if ZOS doesn't fix NB in the next patch I'm pretty sure I'm done. It's a pity too, I really like the game.

You can still effectively do all content. Even if, like in the video posted, Stam blade is last for DPS, its not like you can't finish content like that. Not to mention dummy parses aren't be all end all compared to actual dungeons.

In PvP NB is still decent. Do other classes have it easier? I believe so. I can make more mistakes on my sort and DK and be fine. NB isn't trash like everyone makes it out to be though.

I'd love Major fracture back and I personally like my mark Idea I posted here, but we got what we got. If it bugs you that much its very easy to level another character. I'd suggest stam sorc. Very fast and easy rotation in PvE. At least something to do in the meantime right?

In PVE they're fine, but I rarely play PVE anymore — I play PVP pretty much exclusively. Once you get out of the lower MMR BGs, magblades are basically complete garbage. I can't heal myself effectively, I can't outdamage other classes' heals, and I can't build as tanky as other classes or else I won't do any damage at all — so if I make the slightest mistake I get curb stomped. I can literally put any random blue/purple sets on my magsorc & it'll still do more damage without even trying. It's a complete joke.

I can tell how weak the class is just based on how much easier certain players are to kill depending on what class they're playing. There are some people that I just can't beat when they're on their DK/Warden/Templar/Sorc — but when they're on their Nightblade I completely destroy them.

Stamblades are a bit stronger, but I don't like the playstyle as much anymore.

Try playing some other classes more, it’ll help.

For me I’ve been cycling through some other classes and yea, magblades are weak and very unforgiving. Thing is they are still fun.

After shelving my magblade since last patch I’ve started using it again this patch sometimes. I see it like playing with a handicap and just one mistake and you’re toast, adds some spice to pvp. It’s definitely harder to win a BG with a magblade on the team, but it’s only a game and you play it to have fun anyways.

It’s also true that because NB is unforgiving it makes you a better player, it’s good practice.

Deathlord92

Czekoludek wrote: »

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

OWLTHEMAD wrote: »

Class is losing its hallmarks to everybody else. We had fear, then necro had fear, then everybody had fear.

We had self healing by attacking. Now everybody (except maybe sorc?) Has self healing built in to attacks.

We had an ulit that increased our damage. Templar got a better one, then later necros got an Aoe ulti that increased EVERYBODY'S damage even more.

We have very little group utility and certainly nothing unique and unreplaceable. We dont fit as an invaluable part of a team under any niche. We dont do the most damage, we dont do the most healing, we dont make the best tanks (tbf were doing pretty okay in that department right now situationally, but far from best) we dont excel in pvp, hell it can be argued that you can build other classes to be equally good gankers if not better for pure damage. Hell a sorc could lie in wait in stealth, burst you down then streak away before anyone catches you and hide again. In fact, that exact scenario happened during my last imp city excursion, WHILE i was in stealth. Feels bad man

Ive barely been playing lately because its just not rewarding to play my MAIN character anymore.

In pve we have really high 'potential' dps, but its so difficult to get there most players will realistically never get those numbers and most groups will take a minor dps loss in exchange for the group utility provided by any other class. Like its easier to hit hard on any other class. Ive played templar and the rotation is so easy, and is almost completely cyclical.

I dont get it and hope they fix it in next chapter, because its getting old and really killing this game for me.

Yeah, Sorcs get heals from attacks too — all of them. Critical Surge heals for 3300 every time they crit. So if they have 25% crit & are spamming LA/Force Pulse, statistically they should be healing for 3.3k every second. (For reference, Swallow Soul heals for less than half of that unless you crit.)

The balance in this game is a ******* joke when it comes to every other class vs NBs. I'm done spending any money on it (not buying Greymoor & cancelling ESO+ as soon as it's up) and if ZOS doesn't fix NB in the next patch I'm pretty sure I'm done. It's a pity too, I really like the game.

You can still effectively do all content. Even if, like in the video posted, Stam blade is last for DPS, its not like you can't finish content like that. Not to mention dummy parses aren't be all end all compared to actual dungeons.

In PvP NB is still decent. Do other classes have it easier? I believe so. I can make more mistakes on my sort and DK and be fine. NB isn't trash like everyone makes it out to be though.

I'd love Major fracture back and I personally like my mark Idea I posted here, but we got what we got. If it bugs you that much its very easy to level another character. I'd suggest stam sorc. Very fast and easy rotation in PvE. At least something to do in the meantime right?

If the weakest class in the game (at least for PvP, but even in PvE it's mediocre at best) shouldn't be called trash, how we should call it? Handicap, liability for the group, best at being worst?

I love my stamblade a lot but it’s definitely a trash class compared to the other classes and stamcro like a god class compared to the others it’s on a whole new lv of op lol 😂

Vyvrhel

Iskiab wrote: »

It’s also true that because NB is unforgiving it makes you a better player, it’s good practice.

Makes a lot of sense, but it also means, that people will hardly ever play them. A beginner will likely stick to a class he started with, and he is familiar with, and a hard to play class is not beginner friendly (my first pvp attempts were on my old stam NB main and I almost gave up).
The tricky class should also mean that your bigger effort will return in bigger effect. So if a NB is hard to play class, it should also outperform the easy classes, when played properly.

MudcrabAttack

I levelled up a sorc, warden, necro and DK to try out the whole better experience ZOS is pushing us towards. Everything about the DPS discrepancy is true. After cobbling together a half-assed rotation and practicing them a couple times they're hitting 5, 10, 20% more DPS than the Nightblade. I haven't even gotten the jabs spam together yet, but I don't want to jab things.

Not long after putting all the other classes together I learned that they aren't as interesting to me, I would much rather play the NB I wanted to play at the start.

martinhpb16_ESO

Deathlord92 wrote: »

I love my stamblade a lot but it’s definitely a trash class compared to the other classes and stamcro like a god class compared to the others it’s on a whole new lv of op lol 😂

The constant tea bagging is a total pain as well. I mainly get it from DKs tbh as if they expect everyone to be upfront melee, when they have no clue the challenges involved in a NB taking down even a middling DK, especially when they are grouped and we are solo.

Zos really needs to do something about NBs and soon.

Ragnaroek93

With Cloak being buggy now (literally breaks from everything) while Nb was already one of the weak classes last patch it's about time that we get a statement from the combat devs. First you absolutely cripple our whole offense and right afterwards you break our defense as well, how can you even talk about balance and class identity at this point? The game HAD class identity and you took it away from the class, now I have 0 synergie with CC's because of the cast time on Incap/min travel time on Grim Focus (= no burst because you can't hit it), no pressure because no good dots (even PI was overnerfed for no reason LOL) and no defile, no snare, no defense either and not enough bar space to create complete templates because I'd need to slot skills which do nothing except one thing (Fear is a CC now and does NOTHING else, Mark Target gives Fracture and the secondary effect is so niche that it's close to useless too, just compare it to Ele Drain if you want to laugh, SA doesn't offer anything unique too, it actually deals less dmg than Power Bash which nobody is using because Dizzy and Jabs are better). Your rebalancing was a complete failure and you can't even be consistent while doing so (how come that Temps don't have a cast time on their ult and why is their class spammable actually good, good class spammables are obviously not allowed in this game).

I've played the class since beta and have more than five years of PvP and dueling experience on it and the class has never been in such a bad state in which it is right now. You totally ruined it, it's not fun anymore and it's not competitive either (and no, 1vX isn't a competitive environment for me - BGs, group vs group and high end duels are all far better metrics). I'm doing better on literally any other class now.

Saubon

martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »

What's going on Zos?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0NiIiT0oA8

Results
Stam Warden 48.4k
Stam Necro 48.3k
Stam DK 46.3k
Stam Sorc 42.6k
Stam Temp 42.4k
Stam NB 42.3k

It's a bit biased because all parses are self buffed. On trial dummy are stam templars one of the best dps with braindead rotation, while stam NB stays at the bottom.

Tommy_The_Gun

Well, I did not exactly know where to post it... this seems to be best place for it.
So I know that pretty much all NBs (stam in particular) are using Turn Evil skill, instead of their own class skill - Mass Hysteria. Just by looking at the tooltips in the wiki I could see why. But recently I levelled this skill up (Turn Evil) and started using it in practise... and saw how huge difference is...

Mass Hysteria (Instant):
- Summon a dark spirit to terrify up to 6 enemies, causing them to cower in fear for 3 seconds.
- 3% more health for slotting it (Dark Vigor passive),

Turn Evil (Instant):
- You and your allies in the area gain Minor Protection - reducing your damage taken by 8%.
- You and your allies in the area gain Minor Endurance - increasing your Stamina Recovery by 10%.
- AOE on the ground lasts for 20 seconds.
- Upon activation, enemies in the area are feared for 5 seconds.
- 3% more weapon damage for slotting it (Slayer passive).

So, if compare to NB class, skill, fighters guild skill has:
- 3% more weapon damage, which is way, way more useful & powerful than 3% more health (it makes all your stamina skills stronger).
- Two quite strong minor buffs on top of fear.
- Fear is 2 seconds longer on Turn Evil (3 seconds vs 5 seconds).
- Buffs also affect allies, which means that this skill has group utility, (that NB skill does not have).
- It stays on the ground for 20 seconds, while NB skill is just a small 0.1 second "temporary" poof.
- It fears ALL enemies in the AOE, meaning that it does not have target cap, while NB has a target cap of 6 - making it probably either the only AOE that still has target cap or one of the few left, as I can't recall any other AOE with target cap.
- The 2 minor buffs also do not seem to have target cap. You can cast it and ALL players in the area get the buff...
- Cost of this skill is comparable. - There may be some error in the wiki, as on live, Mass Hysteria costs 3,7K magicka while Turn Evil costs 3,8K stamina (I have 1 pcs light & 1pcs medium on my build so the cost reduction may come from this).

Idk about you, but Mass Hysteria fells kinda "bare", like it was missing something. It is simply underperforming. It literally has one effect - small AOE fear cc around you with target cap of 6. It should have... something. Idk, either reduce cost by half or add something to it.

Also, I think ZOS said some time ago (new combat team) that they want class skills to be stronger, but the weapon / world / guild skill to be weaker, but act like a "supplement" - so you could use then if your toolkit is missing something. Mass Hysteria vs Turn Evil is the opposite of that...

OWLTHEMAD

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Well, I did not exactly know where to post it... this seems to be best place for it.
So I know that pretty much all NBs (stam in particular) are using Turn Evil skill, instead of their own class skill - Mass Hysteria. Just by looking at the tooltips in the wiki I could see why. But recently I levelled this skill up (Turn Evil) and started using it in practise... and by saw how huge difference is...

Mass Hysteria (Instant):
- Summon a dark spirit to terrify up to 6 enemies, causing them to cower in fear for 3 seconds.
- 3% more health for slotting it (Dark Vigor passive),

Turn Evil (Instant):
- You and your allies in the area gain Minor Protection - reducing your damage taken by 8%.
- You and your allies in the area gain Minor Endurance - increasing your Stamina Recovery by 10%.
- AOE on the ground lasts for 20 seconds.
- Upon activation, enemies in the area are feared for 5 seconds.
- 3% more weapon damage for slotting it (Slayer passive).

So, if compare to NB class, skill, fighters guild skill has:
- 3% more weapon damage, which is way, way more useful & powerful than 3% more health (it makes all your stamina skills stronger).
- Two quite strong minor buffs on top of fear.
- Fear is 2 seconds longer on Turn Evil (3 seconds vs 5 seconds).
- Buffs also affect allies, which means that this skill has group utility, (that NB skill does not have).
- It stays on the ground for 20 seconds, while NB skill is just a small 0.1 second "temporary" poof.
- It fears ALL enemies in the AOE, meaning that it does not have target cap, while NB has a target cap of 6 - making it probably either the only AOE that still has target cap or one of the few left, as I can't recall any other AOE with target cap.
- The 2 minor buffs also do not seem to have target cap. You can cast it and ALL players in the area get the buff...
- Cost of this skill is comparable. - There may be some error in the wiki, as on live, Mass Hysteria costs 3,7K magicka while Turn Evil costs 3,8K stamina (I have 1 pcs light & 1pcs medium on my build so the cost reduction may come from this).

Idk about you, but Mass Hysteria fells kinda "bare", like it was missing something. It is simply underperforming. It literally has one effect - small AOE fear cc around you with target cap of 6. It should have... something. Idk, either reduce cost by half or add something to it.

Also, I think ZOS said some time ago (new combat team) that they want class skills to be stronger, but the weapon / world / guild skill to be weaker, but act like a "supplement" - so you could use then if your toolkit is missing something. Mass Hysteria vs Turn Evil is the opposite of that...

Mass hysteria became kind of lame when they changed the fear stun to keep people still and made it easier to break free. Then they created and buffed the living c r a p out of turn evil.

It was at this point i realisedthestaff does not like nightblades. My play time dropped a lot after that

John_Falstaff

Saubon wrote: »

It's a bit biased because all parses are self buffed. On trial dummy are stam templars one of the best dps with braindead rotation, while stam NB stays at the bottom.

Granted, there are cases when such benchmark is relevant. Say, when you run portals on Nahviintaas HM, there are only three people downstairs, not much space for group buffs, and you have to have the minimum of around ~42k personal dps while surviving to avoid the wipe.

Classes really should have potential for being self-sufficient. Nightblades are very poor on buffs they have in own kit, and they don't even bring synergies.

Ragnaroek93

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Well, I did not exactly know where to post it... this seems to be best place for it.
So I know that pretty much all NBs (stam in particular) are using Turn Evil skill, instead of their own class skill - Mass Hysteria. Just by looking at the tooltips in the wiki I could see why. But recently I levelled this skill up (Turn Evil) and started using it in practise... and saw how huge difference is...

Mass Hysteria (Instant):
- Summon a dark spirit to terrify up to 6 enemies, causing them to cower in fear for 3 seconds.
- 3% more health for slotting it (Dark Vigor passive),

Turn Evil (Instant):
- You and your allies in the area gain Minor Protection - reducing your damage taken by 8%.
- You and your allies in the area gain Minor Endurance - increasing your Stamina Recovery by 10%.
- AOE on the ground lasts for 20 seconds.
- Upon activation, enemies in the area are feared for 5 seconds.
- 3% more weapon damage for slotting it (Slayer passive).

So, if compare to NB class, skill, fighters guild skill has:
- 3% more weapon damage, which is way, way more useful & powerful than 3% more health (it makes all your stamina skills stronger).
- Two quite strong minor buffs on top of fear.
- Fear is 2 seconds longer on Turn Evil (3 seconds vs 5 seconds).
- Buffs also affect allies, which means that this skill has group utility, (that NB skill does not have).
- It stays on the ground for 20 seconds, while NB skill is just a small 0.1 second "temporary" poof.
- It fears ALL enemies in the AOE, meaning that it does not have target cap, while NB has a target cap of 6 - making it probably either the only AOE that still has target cap or one of the few left, as I can't recall any other AOE with target cap.
- The 2 minor buffs also do not seem to have target cap. You can cast it and ALL players in the area get the buff...
- Cost of this skill is comparable. - There may be some error in the wiki, as on live, Mass Hysteria costs 3,7K magicka while Turn Evil costs 3,8K stamina (I have 1 pcs light & 1pcs medium on my build so the cost reduction may come from this).

Idk about you, but Mass Hysteria fells kinda "bare", like it was missing something. It is simply underperforming. It literally has one effect - small AOE fear cc around you with target cap of 6. It should have... something. Idk, either reduce cost by half or add something to it.

Also, I think ZOS said some time ago (new combat team) that they want class skills to be stronger, but the weapon / world / guild skill to be weaker, but act like a "supplement" - so you could use then if your toolkit is missing something. Mass Hysteria vs Turn Evil is the opposite of that...

It's more than just mass hysteria (honestly I don't run a CC at all anymore because it doesn't allow me to hit a follow up Incap/Grim Focus anyways). I'd trade Incap for Leap/temp ult and it's kinda on par with Onslaught (weapon skill), Killers Blade is worse than Executioner (at least for PvP), Surprise Attack is on par with Power Bash and weaker than Jabs/Dizzy and Mark Target is the little brother of Ele Drain...

The combat team needs to do a better job because otherwise I won't buy the xpac. [Snip].

[Edited for bashing]

Xarc

Mass hysteria stays a fear for magicka builds.

But I think it should be stronger than Turn Evil for stamina builds.

kaithuzar

Problem: other classes have too much damage so they are able to build tanky

Idk how many times this needs to be said, I’m going to start copy pasting..

Iskiab

kaithuzar wrote: »

Problem: other classes have too much damage so they are able to build tanky

Idk how many times this needs to be said, I’m going to start copy pasting..

Yea, damage or better defense or sustain. You can have two of those things as a NB but can’t have 3.

Morgen270

Hello everyone!
I've just come back to the game after more than a year of not playing, and I don't really understand what's going on with DPS now. My main character has always been a stamblade and during summerset-murkmire period I felt pretty ok with my ~50k DPS, but now it is obviously lost.
I've got myself some of new skills and gear to test, particulary now I try to run Releq+NMA sets with Velidreth and Master's bow, but I absolutely can't get past 35k DPS even having 700+ CP and kinda trained rotation with weaving and all that stuff.
At the same time I found a few not old videos of stamblades doing over 70k and got my understanding completely ruined, but here now I see that DPS cap for stamblade is actually about 40k now? Which of these results is the REAL truth?
I would also be grateful to talk or have some advices from experienced stamnbs, definitely smth that I need now.

John_Falstaff

Morgen270 wrote: »

Hello everyone!
I've just come back to the game after more than a year of not playing, and I don't really understand what's going on with DPS now. My main character has always been a stamblade and during summerset-murkmire period I felt pretty ok with my ~50k DPS, but now it is obviously lost.
I've got myself some of new skills and gear to test, particulary now I try to run Releq+NMA sets with Velidreth and Master's bow, but I absolutely can't get past 35k DPS even having 700+ CP and kinda trained rotation with weaving and all that stuff.
At the same time I found a few not old videos of stamblades doing over 70k and got my understanding completely ruined, but here now I see that DPS cap for stamblade is actually about 40k now? Which of these results is the REAL truth?
I would also be grateful to talk or have some advices from experienced stamnbs, definitely smth that I need now.

AoEs were nerfed. Nightblade toolkit was nerfed, with such things as Fracture or Minor Berserk gone from skills. So, you'll find out that when parsing self-buffed, your damage will plummet by a lot compared to what you've used to hit. Recent videos of 70k+ you see are made on iron atro, trial-buffed dummy, it's a completely different kind of measurement - raid dummy gives most group buffs/debuffs you'd expect in a trial, and even throws you templar shards for sustain.

technohic

I like my NB but its a lot more effort than my other classes to play it how I like. I can gank if I really want to, but I generally play it like I would any brawler and use cloak as a defense as much as an escape. I run steed and 2 swift and bow backbar for roll into major expedition but trying to hit a target moving away from your is rough. Feels like surprise attack and killers blade reach is short (dizzy is 7m these 2 are 5m Would like a least 6m but I feel like the way the game is and has been even before update 25, 7 would be a good standard)and ambush has a delay before and after.

Tommy_The_Gun

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDXATjYJXhg

This is a scrrenshot from Alcast's video:

Well, I guess this is the end of any trace of identity & uniqueness NB once had.

WTB Class change token.

SshadowSscale

At least nightblades are still the best gankers..... (gets ganked by invis sorc and goes to the corner and cries)..... gg zos gg

Tommy_The_Gun

"[Class Rep] Craftblade Feedback Thread"

Czekoludek

At this point NB desperately needs rework. Class is basically dead

blkjag

Rip nightbalde.