ZO$ you killed the whale !

DieAlteHexe

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Kalgert wrote: »

Dude, don't be supporting the idea of whales.

What you're essentially confirming, is that there are people who are not seen as people, but sea mammals due to the size of their wallet and their spending habit.

Stop calling one's self a whale, and get some god-damn dignity back.

We are not sea mammals. We are human beings.

Don't call yourself a tank when you go into a dungeon. You're a human, not an armored vehicle. You're not an object, get some dignity back.



(another thing humans use is language, simile, metaphor, etc)

Actually made me laugh out loud.

Needed that this afternoon, thanks.

jmgrant44ub17_ESO

The crown store and the bad RNG is not the problem. I play other games (not going to mention any names) with RNG that make you want to pull your hair out and cash shop pay to win items. The problem is lack of new content and innovation in the game. The game dlc's and chapters are nothing more than a copy and paste and it is getting worst. Chapters are so small I don't know how Rich Lambert can look at the camera and tell us how big this next one is when anyone with eyes can see the land mass doesn't match the world map.

I believe they are setting the stage for their free to play model. Summerset is so lackluster it will be hard to keep the player base playing much longer. A lot of the people in my guilds that still play are playing less. People that use to log on everyday now take days and weeks off. F2P is all they have left to carry the game for one more year.

Charliff1966

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Eyro wrote: »

--snip--
Don’t get me wrong, I understand they launched in different times. And WoW has a massive sub base. So different approaches had to be made. And maybe different decisions were made for different reasons. Who knows. But it still makes me frown. Seeing how much things have changed in just my life time. It will probably only be a matter of time before the consoles start launching with a credit card reader on the front so we can swipe to play for an hour.

That is essentially how it used to be back in the 80s and early 90s. Credit card on file, charged by the hour and oh boy oh boy could you rack up some nasty bills.

Not that I actually did anything like that.

Gosh, brings back memories of seeing my phonebills and me trying to explain why it was that high. Logging out because someone needed to use the phone. Good old times.

Cpt_Teemo

Phage wrote: »

Lol, you made a chart.

I agree with your points though. The aggressive monetization of this game is going too far. They really would do more with less.

Alot more in game rewards rather than irl $ transactions would fix alot of stuff tbh.

Riptide

The term whale as applied to people has existed a whole lot longer than MMOs. At the casino, whales are targets with more money than sense. They’ll get comped rooms and such, because over the long term they can’t figure out how to play both tight and aggressive. They are either loose aggressive (wild, erratic), loose passive (call way too much), drink too much, can’t calculate odds, etc etc.

But they are profitable - because they are suckers. And a bunch of them make pie charts and excel sheets to justify how smart they are to themselves, look at arbitrary windows to convince themselves they make money, etc.

And when the whale from time to time looks about they blame the sea for the presence of sharks.

When all along they lack someone to say - its you who have a problem.

Calling yourself a “collector” doesn’t erase what you know to be true - you can only wear one skin at a time, ride one mount at a time. Calling it “collecting” doesn’t make it less obsessive.

Solve the problem yourself. Back away from the table. Stop.

DieAlteHexe

Charliff1966 wrote: »

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Eyro wrote: »

--snip--
Don’t get me wrong, I understand they launched in different times. And WoW has a massive sub base. So different approaches had to be made. And maybe different decisions were made for different reasons. Who knows. But it still makes me frown. Seeing how much things have changed in just my life time. It will probably only be a matter of time before the consoles start launching with a credit card reader on the front so we can swipe to play for an hour.

That is essentially how it used to be back in the 80s and early 90s. Credit card on file, charged by the hour and oh boy oh boy could you rack up some nasty bills.

Not that I actually did anything like that.

Gosh, brings back memories of seeing my phonebills and me trying to explain why it was that high. Logging out because someone needed to use the phone. Good old times.

Or someone just picking up the extension. LOL

Maybe that's why I am as mellow as I am. I remember when this was all so very rudimentary and I can still be amazed at what can be done with, essentially, ones and zeroes.

Cpt_Teemo

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Charliff1966 wrote: »

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Eyro wrote: »

--snip--
Don’t get me wrong, I understand they launched in different times. And WoW has a massive sub base. So different approaches had to be made. And maybe different decisions were made for different reasons. Who knows. But it still makes me frown. Seeing how much things have changed in just my life time. It will probably only be a matter of time before the consoles start launching with a credit card reader on the front so we can swipe to play for an hour.

That is essentially how it used to be back in the 80s and early 90s. Credit card on file, charged by the hour and oh boy oh boy could you rack up some nasty bills.

Not that I actually did anything like that.

Gosh, brings back memories of seeing my phonebills and me trying to explain why it was that high. Logging out because someone needed to use the phone. Good old times.

Or someone just picking up the extension. LOL

Maybe that's why I am as mellow as I am. I remember when this was all so very rudimentary and I can still be amazed at what can be done with, essentially, ones and zeroes.

Good old AoL, dang you phone liner connection

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsNaR6FRuO0

Ragnarock41

Take my advice, and start collecting games instead.

Just spend a lot on sales, and after a year you will have more games than you can possibly want to play in a lifetime.

(especially play some quality rpg games like mass effect, deus ex, witcher series etc. You won't be able to enjoy badly made rpgs ever again.)

That being said, people like you are the reason gaming industry is like this. Stop rewarding companies for scamming you and this won't happen.

DieAlteHexe

Cpt_Teemo wrote: »

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Charliff1966 wrote: »

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Eyro wrote: »

--snip--
Don’t get me wrong, I understand they launched in different times. And WoW has a massive sub base. So different approaches had to be made. And maybe different decisions were made for different reasons. Who knows. But it still makes me frown. Seeing how much things have changed in just my life time. It will probably only be a matter of time before the consoles start launching with a credit card reader on the front so we can swipe to play for an hour.

That is essentially how it used to be back in the 80s and early 90s. Credit card on file, charged by the hour and oh boy oh boy could you rack up some nasty bills.

Not that I actually did anything like that.

Gosh, brings back memories of seeing my phonebills and me trying to explain why it was that high. Logging out because someone needed to use the phone. Good old times.

Or someone just picking up the extension. LOL

Maybe that's why I am as mellow as I am. I remember when this was all so very rudimentary and I can still be amazed at what can be done with, essentially, ones and zeroes.

Good old AoL, dang you phone liner connection

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsNaR6FRuO0

LOL! Yeah...you have no idea how often I had to listen to those tones when I did Tech Support. 300baud! And then, eventually, a blazing 9600!

ssorgatem

Asardes wrote: »

During my almost 3 years of playing ESO I dished out ~330 EUR. Do I qualify for "whale" status?

Not even a porpoise.

Eyro

ssorgatem wrote: »

Asardes wrote: »

During my almost 3 years of playing ESO I dished out ~330 EUR. Do I qualify for "whale" status?

Not even a porpoise.

Throw him back!

Cpt_Teemo

ssorgatem wrote: »

Asardes wrote: »

During my almost 3 years of playing ESO I dished out ~330 EUR. Do I qualify for "whale" status?

Not even a porpoise.

I think you would have had to spend nearly 1,000$ to be considered a baby whale

Pinesy

I'm the same way. I've been back playing for a year (played in beta), and i've spent over $2,000. I highly doubt i'll spend any more. The amount of crates I have bought (I have a penchant for getting addicted to lootboxes in MMOs, like the ones in Rift and LOTRO as well), and i've never received one of the drop-only mounts. Insanity.

It just sucks for me because I only play 1 MMO at a time, and i'm still on ESO. I have also spent too much money on Rift and LOTRO. I learned too late on those games, I won't make the same mistake with ESO.

Cpt_Teemo

Pinesy wrote: »

I'm the same way. I've been back playing for a year (played in beta), and i've spent over $2,000. I highly doubt i'll spend any more. The amount of crates I have bought, and i've never received one of the drop-only mounts. Insanity.

And yet they give the best drops to the people that barely even buy crates at all, from the free ones

Korah_Eaglecry

Definitely fall within the whale category as well. Probably not as much as others but enough that would make peoples heads spin if they knew how much. But Im in the same boat as the OP. The monetization is entirely too much with too little to gain from participating in it. Not all whales are bottomless pits of potential profit. I wouldnt be surprised if most whales have an upper limit of a few hundred dollars they feel comfortable spending.

I think a lot of people think of whales as mindlessly spending money and will continue to enter their credit card numbers as long as theres something there for them to collect. But Im willing to bet a large portion of whales are actually rather smart about their money and while theyll spend a good bit of cash on things they want. Being willing to spend more than others doesnt mean they dont have a limit. At some point the spend vs gratification ratio starts to shift too much in favor of spending and it gets to be too much. Even for a whale. Thats where ZOS is right now.

A company that counts on the purchases of whales to make a large profit is not being very smart when they start to shake off whales that would otherwise still be happy to spend money on the game.

josiahva

Beardimus wrote: »

€4k on a game,damn!!

Thats nothing compared to what people spend on mobile games.

I sub, and I buy the chapters...and thats it, I may or may not use my sub crowns depending on if there is anything actually useful in the crown store or if there is some cosmetic I feel is worth it...I certainly do NOT buy crown crates or the majority of the garbage in the store(especially harstyles and dies and the like....I mean, seriously, wtf?)

Cpt_Teemo

josiahva wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

€4k on a game,damn!!

Thats nothing compared to what people spend on mobile games.

I sub, and I buy the chapters...and thats it, I may or may not use my sub crowns depending on if there is anything actually useful in the crown store or if there is some cosmetic I feel is worth it...I certainly do NOT buy crown crates or the majority of the garbage in the store(especially harstyles and dies and the like....I mean, seriously, wtf?)

https://www.pcgamer.com/meet-a-fan-who-has-spent-30000-on-star-citizen-ships/

That was also back in 2015, the games been in alpha for 7 years lol ^

Nestor

I posted this in another thread, it applies to this one too:

Nestor wrote: »

I understand limited time things and creating some exclusivity with price.

However, if the Marketing People would just stop chasing the Whales, and sold most things at a reasonable price, more people would buy them. They sell a mount for 400 Crowns and it will fly out the door. Heck, maybe even 1200 Crowns and it will still fly. But at 3000 or 4000 Crowns? I know they get some sales, but it can't add up to more than a reasonably priced mount would.

Kuramas9tails

Jerkling wrote: »

Arundo wrote: »

I have to admit I’m a whale when it comes to cash shops in games. In most MMO’s I play I spend good amounts of euro’s to get those nice cosmetics. Furthermore I’m a collector and due to that whenever I see something I need to get it. [...]

you are the problem, not ZOS!


stop blaming a company for trying to make money or the way they do it (unless it's actually hurting people or the environment). if you are dumb enuf to throw money at them for pets, mounts, houses, cosmetics and all that useless and utterly pointless crap you deserve to be taken advantage of.
it's people like you why mmo's are this way today and developers seem to spend more time and resources on bunny ears for the ingame shop instead of real content, so you get to have that 9,99,-EUR thrill that last for 5 minutes.

@Jerkling I am on a marketing team for a billion dollar company and I can tell you, seeing statistics of marketing strategies are VERY useful. Although this post is just one example they have presented to ZOS, there are many more out there. Finding trends that actually hinder a buyer is ZOS's problem, not the buyer. As you can see, the buyer is willing to spend a large amount of money and presenting their discomfort as to why a strategy they changed is actually causing them to spend less. I also float that boat and since the Radiant Apex mounts were introduced, I have spent less on crown crates.

It's not so much blaming ZOS's for them spending money. It's more or less one statistic from one buyer and what has caused them to spend less and why.

This should be a simple understanding even for someone who is not on a marketing team.

DieAlteHexe

Nestor wrote: »

I posted this in another thread, it applies to this one too:

Nestor wrote: »

I understand limited time things and creating some exclusivity with price.

However, if the Marketing People would just stop chasing the Whales, and sold most things at a reasonable price, more people would buy them. They sell a mount for 400 Crowns and it will fly out the door. Heck, maybe even 1200 Crowns and it will still fly. But at 3000 or 4000 Crowns? I know they get some sales, but it can't add up to more than a reasonably priced mount would.

I think the issue there is it would remove the "überness". Some folk really place a lot of importance in having something perceived as rare.

I do, however, think you are right with respect to pricing but it would irk those for whom having the rares is important. Not sure which would result in more income but I suspect the lower price would.

Rohamad_Ali

CompM4s

Cant hate on people considered whales. Obviously they are financially successful enough to afford it. Wish they added apex mounts for gems. They should get that much.

Ragged_Claw

Interesting chart. This kind of confirms something that I've been wondering, namely that even people who can afford to drop large amounts of cash on a game will eventually stop if they can't get what they want. Given that ZoS always said EVERYTHING in crates would be purchasable with gems, it must have been a kick in the sac when they introduced the Apex Mounts. (It didn't matter to me since I don't buy crates). I'm hoping more people will vote with their wallets and stop buying crates, it's the only way ZoS will ever make them fairer, they will have to in order to win back big spenders like the OP.

FireCowCommando

You get drunk one time and let ZoS "butt stuff" you with the crown store and now every time your in bed its all ZoS wants....

heaven13

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

I posted this in another thread, it applies to this one too:

Nestor wrote: »

I understand limited time things and creating some exclusivity with price.

However, if the Marketing People would just stop chasing the Whales, and sold most things at a reasonable price, more people would buy them. They sell a mount for 400 Crowns and it will fly out the door. Heck, maybe even 1200 Crowns and it will still fly. But at 3000 or 4000 Crowns? I know they get some sales, but it can't add up to more than a reasonably priced mount would.

I think the issue there is it would remove the "überness". Some folk really place a lot of importance in having something perceived as rare.

I do, however, think you are right with respect to pricing but it would irk those for whom having the rares is important. Not sure which would result in more income but I suspect the lower price would.

I guess I don't get this mindset or what DuskMarine posted:

DuskMarine wrote: »

i have no problem with anything zos has done and im a major whale in this game. they have only done right by us in many ways. but one thing you have to understand a mega rare mount shouldnt be buyable with the gems. thats like going to the casino and hitting the jackpot its meant to feel like an accomplishment. but i have the ability to whale out on 3 games not just eso, starcraft 2, and also monster hunter but i whale out extensively on the games cause i enjoy their direction. the monetization of this game isnt even remotely predatory which is nice imho but after playing anything owned by ea you tend to feel that way with a game like eso.

Congratulations, you have mad...wallet skills? How is having a large disposable income and getting an uber rare mount based on luck any kind of achievement?

I honestly would rather the "uber rare" stuff locked as skill-based rewards. You want a sense of achievement? Earn it. Or, at the very least, make it available through earning in game or purchasing for those that have the money (or don't want to spend the time because I get that's a valid point).

These days TOO MUCH is locked strictly behind massive paywalls that then, most often, also require RNG to be on your side.

The Pyandonean motif is, at least, a small step in the right direction. I hope it signals a decent turnaround in the crate/store > game trend, but I'm not holding my breath.

SickDuck

They got to a point where I feel the only money worth spending is the ESO+ sub. Although if they stick ti the current content release structure it may not be for long either.

Nestor

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

I posted this in another thread, it applies to this one too:

Nestor wrote: »

I understand limited time things and creating some exclusivity with price.

However, if the Marketing People would just stop chasing the Whales, and sold most things at a reasonable price, more people would buy them. They sell a mount for 400 Crowns and it will fly out the door. Heck, maybe even 1200 Crowns and it will still fly. But at 3000 or 4000 Crowns? I know they get some sales, but it can't add up to more than a reasonably priced mount would.

I think the issue there is it would remove the "überness". Some folk really place a lot of importance in having something perceived as rare.

I do, however, think you are right with respect to pricing but it would irk those for whom having the rares is important. Not sure which would result in more income but I suspect the lower price would.

Sure, some things can be Exclusive, never said otherwise. However, it seems that anything that comes out for the Crown Store is both Over Priced, and/or Exclusive Time Limited.

DieAlteHexe

heaven13 wrote: »

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

I posted this in another thread, it applies to this one too:

Nestor wrote: »

I understand limited time things and creating some exclusivity with price.

However, if the Marketing People would just stop chasing the Whales, and sold most things at a reasonable price, more people would buy them. They sell a mount for 400 Crowns and it will fly out the door. Heck, maybe even 1200 Crowns and it will still fly. But at 3000 or 4000 Crowns? I know they get some sales, but it can't add up to more than a reasonably priced mount would.

I think the issue there is it would remove the "überness". Some folk really place a lot of importance in having something perceived as rare.

I do, however, think you are right with respect to pricing but it would irk those for whom having the rares is important. Not sure which would result in more income but I suspect the lower price would.

I guess I don't get this mindset or what DuskMarine posted:

Me either but I've seen it frequently in games. Very frequently.

I'll leave DuskMarine to respond to his bit.

Cpt_Teemo

Nestor wrote: »

DieAlteHexe wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

I posted this in another thread, it applies to this one too:

Nestor wrote: »

I understand limited time things and creating some exclusivity with price.

However, if the Marketing People would just stop chasing the Whales, and sold most things at a reasonable price, more people would buy them. They sell a mount for 400 Crowns and it will fly out the door. Heck, maybe even 1200 Crowns and it will still fly. But at 3000 or 4000 Crowns? I know they get some sales, but it can't add up to more than a reasonably priced mount would.

I think the issue there is it would remove the "überness". Some folk really place a lot of importance in having something perceived as rare.

I do, however, think you are right with respect to pricing but it would irk those for whom having the rares is important. Not sure which would result in more income but I suspect the lower price would.

Sure, some things can be Exclusive, never said otherwise. However, it seems that anything that comes out for the Crown Store is both Over Priced, and/or Exclusive Time Limited.

Anything period now a days is only crown store

Kodrac

I'm surprised they haven't moved this to the section where threads go to die yet.