Lets get some facts out of the way. They are not gambling.

Yzalirk

For those saying that Loot Crates help fund the servers or whatever, why is it that some F2P games, like Warframe, function just fine without them? Does it have to do with honest deals where you know exactly what you are paying for? Or maybe there is a misconception of game funding. Think about it.

jedtb16_ESO

CurlyQTip wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no you are not. it is a blind box sale. you are paying money to get something, either 4 or 5 items.

If all games in a casino had a 100% chance to give you chips any time, but it could be less than or more than the amount you put in, would no longer be gambling?

I can argue you are paying money to get chips, the monetary value of those chips is merely relative.

And yes, I'd consider stuff like potions, poisons, food, etc a 'monetary loss'' when it comes to crates. Crown store loot is worse than loot you can get cheap in game. Anyone using tristat potions from the crown store are losing out on vastly superior ingame potions.

the value of the items is irrelevant. the difference between gambling and a blind box sale is that if you gamble and lose you get nothing. the blind box always gives something.

CurlyQTip

Yzalirk wrote: »

For those saying that Loot Crates help fund the servers or whatever, why is it that some F2P games, like Warframe, function just fine without them? Does it have to do with honest deals where you know exactly what you are paying for? Or maybe there is a misconception of game funding. Think about it.

It's funny how a game that people can play for free doesn't cause the company to go instantly out of business without lootboxes

makes you really think

It's almost as if

what

lootboxes aren't needed to fund servers?

that's crazy, how could that be possible

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

CurlyQTip wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no you are not. it is a blind box sale. you are paying money to get something, either 4 or 5 items.

If all games in a casino had a 100% chance to give you chips any time, but it could be less than or more than the amount you put in, would no longer be gambling?

I can argue you are paying money to get chips, the monetary value of those chips is merely relative.

And yes, I'd consider stuff like potions, poisons, food, etc a 'monetary loss'' when it comes to crates. Crown store loot is worse than loot you can get cheap in game. Anyone using tristat potions from the crown store are losing out on vastly superior ingame potions.

the value of the items is irrelevant. the difference between gambling and a blind box sale is that if you gamble and lose you get nothing. the blind box always gives something.

You're not answering my question though. Would there be gambling in a casino that always pays out? If value is irrelevant, than a guaranteed payout even with loss wouldn't be gambling, right?

TelvanniWizard

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

TamrielSaviour215 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no you are not. it is a blind box sale. you are paying money to get something, either 4 or 5 items.

Are you paying real money?___Yes
Are you hoping to open a crate to find something you deem 'valuable'?___Yes
Do you have any idea what any of those 4/5 items will be?___No

So you are paying money, for something you put value into although you have no idea what this item will be? That sounds like you are taking a risk to reap the rewards you are HOPING for. Therefore, thats a gamble. You put your money in hoping for a desired outcome not knowing if you will get it. That. Is. A. Gamble. lol

no.... zos publish what is in the crates. if you have even an inkling of common sense you will realise that the 'rare' items will be just that. rare.

so what are you going to get?

the junk. that is how blind sales/mystery boxes work.

oh, one more thing.... your 'hopes' have no bearing on how the universe functions.

also the universe is not obliged to meet your expectations.

finally.....

most countries have strict limits on the age at which people are permitted to gamble. blind boxes/mystery boxes are marketed to children, and their parents, throughout the western (and parts of the eastern) world.

the crown crates are blind/mystery boxes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKZJdaiJF84

Still paying for a chance on the wanted item, still gambling. Sorry for my stuborness, but that´s how I see it. RNG is gambling. Yeah, sure, you have a base covered by four items, but not knowing what will it be at the end is still pure chance, it RNG, it´s random. Paying money to get random things is gambling, like those guys who buy abandoned storage units. Sure, they take a look inside and see it is not empty. In that moment security ends. It´s gambling. You don´t know what will you recieve. Same with scam crates. RNG=gamble=scam crates="blind boxes"

TamrielSaviour215

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no.... zos publish what is in the crates. if you have even an inkling of common sense you will realise that the 'rare' items will be just that. rare.

so what are you going to get?

the junk. that is how blind sales/mystery boxes work.

oh, one more thing.... your 'hopes' have no bearing on how the universe functions.

also the universe is not obliged to meet your expectations.

finally.....

most countries have strict limits on the age at which people are permitted to gamble. blind boxes/mystery boxes are marketed to children, and their parents, throughout the western (and parts of the eastern) world.

the crown crates are blind/mystery boxes.

The thing is, I could care less if people open crowns. they can stay for all I care and people can spend $100,000,000,000 a piece opening them. That is completely up to them if they want to. Ive mentioned this numerous times in this thread. I play poker 3 nights a week in a casino. I have ZERO problems with gambling. But people trying to say that it is not gambling are trying to defend the crates with a weak argument. If you dont see this as a gamble then its because you don't want accept it. People don't want it to be considered 'gambling' because it would change the landscape of the way games are created. Again, I dont care.

With that said, this has been a trend in games for the last 5-10 years. FIFA does it with pack openings, MLB THE SHOW does it with 'stubbs', PUBG does it with BP points. This is all ways for them to get revenue and to disguise it for what it really is. which is gambling.

jedtb16_ESO

TamrielSaviour215 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no.... zos publish what is in the crates. if you have even an inkling of common sense you will realise that the 'rare' items will be just that. rare.

so what are you going to get?

the junk. that is how blind sales/mystery boxes work.

oh, one more thing.... your 'hopes' have no bearing on how the universe functions.

also the universe is not obliged to meet your expectations.

finally.....

most countries have strict limits on the age at which people are permitted to gamble. blind boxes/mystery boxes are marketed to children, and their parents, throughout the western (and parts of the eastern) world.

the crown crates are blind/mystery boxes.

The thing is, I could care less if people open crowns. they can stay for all I care and people can spend $100,000,000,000 a piece opening them. That is completely up to them if they want to. Ive mentioned this numerous times in this thread. I play poker 3 nights a week in a casino. I have ZERO problems with gambling. But people trying to say that it is not gambling are trying to defend the crates with a weak argument. If you dont see this as a gamble then its because you don't want accept it. People don't want it to be considered 'gambling' because it would change the landscape of the way games are created. Again, I dont care.

With that said, this has been a trend in games for the last 5-10 years. FIFA does it with pack openings, MLB THE SHOW does it with 'stubbs', PUBG does it with BP points. This is all ways for them to get revenue and to disguise it for what it really is. which is gambling.

if blind boxes are gambling how is it that they are openly on sale to children in most of the developed world?

CurlyQTip

If people at least argued that they aren't harmful I'd respect the argument more, but 'they aren't gambling' sounds like a massive diversion cop out, it's just lame semantics at that point in order to justify companies cutting games up into monetary gains.

Only issue is that you would then, have to make a case for gambling being allowed in a game people under the gambling age limit, and there's no way you're arguing that.

TelvanniWizard

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

TamrielSaviour215 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no.... zos publish what is in the crates. if you have even an inkling of common sense you will realise that the 'rare' items will be just that. rare.

so what are you going to get?

the junk. that is how blind sales/mystery boxes work.

oh, one more thing.... your 'hopes' have no bearing on how the universe functions.

also the universe is not obliged to meet your expectations.

finally.....

most countries have strict limits on the age at which people are permitted to gamble. blind boxes/mystery boxes are marketed to children, and their parents, throughout the western (and parts of the eastern) world.

the crown crates are blind/mystery boxes.

The thing is, I could care less if people open crowns. they can stay for all I care and people can spend $100,000,000,000 a piece opening them. That is completely up to them if they want to. Ive mentioned this numerous times in this thread. I play poker 3 nights a week in a casino. I have ZERO problems with gambling. But people trying to say that it is not gambling are trying to defend the crates with a weak argument. If you dont see this as a gamble then its because you don't want accept it. People don't want it to be considered 'gambling' because it would change the landscape of the way games are created. Again, I dont care.

With that said, this has been a trend in games for the last 5-10 years. FIFA does it with pack openings, MLB THE SHOW does it with 'stubbs', PUBG does it with BP points. This is all ways for them to get revenue and to disguise it for what it really is. which is gambling.

if blind boxes are gambling how is it that they are openly on sale to children in most of the developed world?

Because there is legal vacuum, wich luckily is starting to be adressed right now with all the EA lootboxes controversy. Easy as pie.

Mic1007

I only have one problem with Crown Crates: the devs seem to be focusing less and less on the game and more on the Crown Store, and specifically the Crown Crates. Summerset - which looks to be the size of two base-game zones on the Tamriel - actually has the same amount of content that Wrothgar did. There's not even a full Trial like in Morrowind. Even Morrowind felt more complete and content-packed than Summerset, and the Red Mountain took up a huge portion of the map!

I wouldn't mind the Crates in the slightest if they still put the same effort they used into game content. But it's evident that their focus is on those Crates, especially considering the survey they sent out recently.

Some people here have said that the Crates are funding the devs, but all I see it actually funding is the development of more Crown Store and Crate items.

TamrielSaviour215

TelvanniWizard wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

TamrielSaviour215 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no.... zos publish what is in the crates. if you have even an inkling of common sense you will realise that the 'rare' items will be just that. rare.

so what are you going to get?

the junk. that is how blind sales/mystery boxes work.

oh, one more thing.... your 'hopes' have no bearing on how the universe functions.

also the universe is not obliged to meet your expectations.

finally.....

most countries have strict limits on the age at which people are permitted to gamble. blind boxes/mystery boxes are marketed to children, and their parents, throughout the western (and parts of the eastern) world.

the crown crates are blind/mystery boxes.

The thing is, I could care less if people open crowns. they can stay for all I care and people can spend $100,000,000,000 a piece opening them. That is completely up to them if they want to. Ive mentioned this numerous times in this thread. I play poker 3 nights a week in a casino. I have ZERO problems with gambling. But people trying to say that it is not gambling are trying to defend the crates with a weak argument. If you dont see this as a gamble then its because you don't want accept it. People don't want it to be considered 'gambling' because it would change the landscape of the way games are created. Again, I dont care.

With that said, this has been a trend in games for the last 5-10 years. FIFA does it with pack openings, MLB THE SHOW does it with 'stubbs', PUBG does it with BP points. This is all ways for them to get revenue and to disguise it for what it really is. which is gambling.

if blind boxes are gambling how is it that they are openly on sale to children in most of the developed world?

Because there is legal vacuum, wich luckily is starting to be adressed right now with all the EA lootboxes controversy. Easy as pie.

EXACTLY. This has just really come to light about what they are and what they are designed to do. Parents dont understand this stuff. The kids have to explain it. People have been complaining about this stuff for a few years now but BF really dropped the ball hard prior to launch. I think that making such a big splash, it shed light on other games. When people start to understand the mechanics and odds (which might deter some people) then laws will be made to protect consumers. And if you need crates to keep your game going, you have a terrible product.

DieAlteHexe

......

TelvanniWizard wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

TamrielSaviour215 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no.... zos publish what is in the crates. if you have even an inkling of common sense you will realise that the 'rare' items will be just that. rare.

so what are you going to get?

the junk. that is how blind sales/mystery boxes work.

oh, one more thing.... your 'hopes' have no bearing on how the universe functions.

also the universe is not obliged to meet your expectations.

finally.....

most countries have strict limits on the age at which people are permitted to gamble. blind boxes/mystery boxes are marketed to children, and their parents, throughout the western (and parts of the eastern) world.

the crown crates are blind/mystery boxes.

The thing is, I could care less if people open crowns. they can stay for all I care and people can spend $100,000,000,000 a piece opening them. That is completely up to them if they want to. Ive mentioned this numerous times in this thread. I play poker 3 nights a week in a casino. I have ZERO problems with gambling. But people trying to say that it is not gambling are trying to defend the crates with a weak argument. If you dont see this as a gamble then its because you don't want accept it. People don't want it to be considered 'gambling' because it would change the landscape of the way games are created. Again, I dont care.

With that said, this has been a trend in games for the last 5-10 years. FIFA does it with pack openings, MLB THE SHOW does it with 'stubbs', PUBG does it with BP points. This is all ways for them to get revenue and to disguise it for what it really is. which is gambling.

if blind boxes are gambling how is it that they are openly on sale to children in most of the developed world?

Because there is legal vacuum, wich luckily is starting to be adressed right now with all the EA lootboxes controversy. Easy as pie.

I surely don't want to be around if the powers that be try to assert that Kinder Eggs are "gambling". There would be an uprising of really torq'd kids and not-so-young folk.

I buy them and collect stuff from them. The odds aren't terribly good and there is far less info on what they might contain than there is for what the crates contain. Suffice it to say, I probably pitch about 60-70% of them.

From what I've read (which frankly isn't a lot) they are only considered "gambling" by a small, very, group of folk and a couple of politicians hoping to find a bandwagon they can gain from. Everyone else sees them as a bit of fun wrapped in chocolate (well they claim it's chocolate, I'm not convinced).

Tzayad

Feanor wrote: »

reiverx wrote: »

One day gambling laws will catch up. At the moment, it's not really obvious how destructive these practices are.

I strongly disagree. A paternalistic approach is always the wrong way. What you call destructive is freedom to me. In essence, being a human being means both the right and the capability of ordering the own life, and to decide yourself what you want to do with it and within. Of course there need to be limits on business practices, e.g. fraud. The boxes don’t cross these limits. I’d like to keep my decision to decide whether I want that option of a box or not.

Only a sith deals in absolutes.

On a serious note though. I don't know if many people are saying they want crates gone, just that they want odds explicitly available, and perhaps a reigning back of what is locked to crates only.

idrankyourbeer

its just a matter of time before one of these developers tries to push things too far and it becomes a big enough issue where someone has to put their foot down.

the ea battlefront fiasco was a bit of an eye opener but developers wont stop at the idea of locking character progression behind loot boxes. they are always trying to find more greedy ways to milk gamers for the most they can get with the least amount of work, and they really dont care how much it aggrevates the gamers unless its going to damage their bottom dollar . sure thats business, but its pretty slimy

Merlin13KAGL

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

CurlyQTip wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no you are not. it is a blind box sale. you are paying money to get something, either 4 or 5 items.

If all games in a casino had a 100% chance to give you chips any time, but it could be less than or more than the amount you put in, would no longer be gambling?

I can argue you are paying money to get chips, the monetary value of those chips is merely relative.

And yes, I'd consider stuff like potions, poisons, food, etc a 'monetary loss'' when it comes to crates. Crown store loot is worse than loot you can get cheap in game. Anyone using tristat potions from the crown store are losing out on vastly superior ingame potions.

the value of the items is irrelevant. the difference between gambling and a blind box sale is that if you gamble and lose you get nothing. the blind box always gives something.

So, let's go with this asinine argument.

So if you bought $1000 worth of crown crates and they netted you $1000 worth of upgrades in Minecraft, you'd be good with it, right?

I mean, you were after $1000 worth of radiant Apex mounts, but, by your definition you didn't technically lose money?

Or IRL version, you can spend $1000 and get

• $1000 worth of groceries.
• $1000 worth of gravel
• $1000 worth of coupons for items you're never going to use.

Technically all still 'worth' $1000, but is the value really the same?

You're paying for a chance at an improved item. Getting *** 'in-kind' valued items that you would not otherwise purchase is what makes it different.

I'm sure whoever gets $1000 worth of seige repair kits is surely just as happy as the one that got mounts, motifs, and other things of actual value (at least to that person).

If you cannot specify with certainty (roughly translated as "chance") the cost of item X from a Crown crate, it's still f'ing gambling.

Your premise that you lose nothing is ***. If you were to pay for a car, and instead they gave you the $ equivalent in grass seed, you wouldn't consider that not a loss.

Or how about your paycheck. Cool if the boss pays you in party hats or dog sweaters? You're not losing money, after all.

Cut the crap.

jedtb16_ESO

TelvanniWizard wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

TamrielSaviour215 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no.... zos publish what is in the crates. if you have even an inkling of common sense you will realise that the 'rare' items will be just that. rare.

so what are you going to get?

the junk. that is how blind sales/mystery boxes work.

oh, one more thing.... your 'hopes' have no bearing on how the universe functions.

also the universe is not obliged to meet your expectations.

finally.....

most countries have strict limits on the age at which people are permitted to gamble. blind boxes/mystery boxes are marketed to children, and their parents, throughout the western (and parts of the eastern) world.

the crown crates are blind/mystery boxes.

The thing is, I could care less if people open crowns. they can stay for all I care and people can spend $100,000,000,000 a piece opening them. That is completely up to them if they want to. Ive mentioned this numerous times in this thread. I play poker 3 nights a week in a casino. I have ZERO problems with gambling. But people trying to say that it is not gambling are trying to defend the crates with a weak argument. If you dont see this as a gamble then its because you don't want accept it. People don't want it to be considered 'gambling' because it would change the landscape of the way games are created. Again, I dont care.

With that said, this has been a trend in games for the last 5-10 years. FIFA does it with pack openings, MLB THE SHOW does it with 'stubbs', PUBG does it with BP points. This is all ways for them to get revenue and to disguise it for what it really is. which is gambling.

if blind boxes are gambling how is it that they are openly on sale to children in most of the developed world?

Because there is legal vacuum, wich luckily is starting to be adressed right now with all the EA lootboxes controversy. Easy as pie.

legal vacuum?

it's been going on for years.

Sting864

Feanor wrote: »

They are gambling in the sense that you have a cost where the return isn’t clear

Isn't that true of every form of investment though?? When you buy wheat on the commodities' market you have a cost where the return isn't clear....

Madhojo

Paying for a chance at something is gambling; hence, loot boxes are gambling.

They are a non legislated form of gambling, which is why they are allowed to function/exist as is.

Personally I don't mind the way ESO does it overly much, especially since you can trade in your items for gems and then buy whatever item you want, which is better than some.

AjiBuster499

Sting864 wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

They are gambling in the sense that you have a cost where the return isn’t clear

Isn't that true of every form of investment though?? When you buy wheat on the commodities' market you have a cost where the return isn't clear....

To add, there's a form of investment (at least in America) called Venture Capitalism. In a nutshell, venture capitalism is basically a bunch of broke guys going up to some rich person with a business plan and saying "please fund us" and the rich person puts in a chunk of capital (typically money) in return for some of the profits.

Some of those upstarts have become very big (for example I believe Apple was initially funded by a venture capitalist) and the people get their money back and then some. Most, however, simply flop and the money is wasted.

This is technically gambling, isn't it? You're paying money to get something in return, but it's unclear if you'll get something in return (in this case your money back and profits).

There are many things that can be considered "gambling". MOST are bad and should be banned but if we prohibit all gambling based on the definition of "putting something in without a clear return" then we wouldn't have Apple products (while the lack of the classic Android v Apple debate would be nice, Apple has helped push the limits of technology by providing a competitor to leading computer companies like Microsoft and phone companies such as those that run Android).

tl;dr there are several types of gambling. Most suck but some are useful to society.

TelvanniWizard

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

TelvanniWizard wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

TamrielSaviour215 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

no.... zos publish what is in the crates. if you have even an inkling of common sense you will realise that the 'rare' items will be just that. rare.

so what are you going to get?

the junk. that is how blind sales/mystery boxes work.

oh, one more thing.... your 'hopes' have no bearing on how the universe functions.

also the universe is not obliged to meet your expectations.

finally.....

most countries have strict limits on the age at which people are permitted to gamble. blind boxes/mystery boxes are marketed to children, and their parents, throughout the western (and parts of the eastern) world.

the crown crates are blind/mystery boxes.

The thing is, I could care less if people open crowns. they can stay for all I care and people can spend $100,000,000,000 a piece opening them. That is completely up to them if they want to. Ive mentioned this numerous times in this thread. I play poker 3 nights a week in a casino. I have ZERO problems with gambling. But people trying to say that it is not gambling are trying to defend the crates with a weak argument. If you dont see this as a gamble then its because you don't want accept it. People don't want it to be considered 'gambling' because it would change the landscape of the way games are created. Again, I dont care.

With that said, this has been a trend in games for the last 5-10 years. FIFA does it with pack openings, MLB THE SHOW does it with 'stubbs', PUBG does it with BP points. This is all ways for them to get revenue and to disguise it for what it really is. which is gambling.

if blind boxes are gambling how is it that they are openly on sale to children in most of the developed world?

Because there is legal vacuum, wich luckily is starting to be adressed right now with all the EA lootboxes controversy. Easy as pie.

legal vacuum?

it's been going on for years.

Same as the legal vacuum.

TamrielSaviour215

AjiBuster499 wrote: »

Sting864 wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

They are gambling in the sense that you have a cost where the return isn’t clear

Isn't that true of every form of investment though?? When you buy wheat on the commodities' market you have a cost where the return isn't clear....

To add, there's a form of investment (at least in America) called Venture Capitalism. In a nutshell, venture capitalism is basically a bunch of broke guys going up to some rich person with a business plan and saying "please fund us" and the rich person puts in a chunk of capital (typically money) in return for some of the profits.

Some of those upstarts have become very big (for example I believe Apple was initially funded by a venture capitalist) and the people get their money back and then some. Most, however, simply flop and the money is wasted.

This is technically gambling, isn't it? You're paying money to get something in return, but it's unclear if you'll get something in return (in this case your money back and profits).

There are many things that can be considered "gambling". MOST are bad and should be banned but if we prohibit all gambling based on the definition of "putting something in without a clear return" then we wouldn't have Apple products (while the lack of the classic Android v Apple debate would be nice, Apple has helped push the limits of technology by providing a competitor to leading computer companies like Microsoft and phone companies such as those that run Android).

tl;dr there are several types of gambling. Most suck but some are useful to society.

You are correct. The stock market is def a gamble. I think that is made very clear to people. But in the right forms, its usually considered a safe 'investment'. An investment is something that will hopefully appreciate in value though (a venture capitalist's investment in a company will hopeful gain ground and make money where a stock should increase over time). But when you are talking about crates in video game there is no comparing that to an investment. You will not sell this thing you get for a profit later. You are simply spending money on a desired goal that you have a minute chance of receiving. I see your comparison but crown crates are completely unrelated to investing.

TamrielSaviour215

@AjiBuster499

Also note that investments are usually based on research and picking the right path. There is no research to be done in a crate. There is no choosing what you want to do with that money. You put it up and hope you get what you want. That actually shows that it is more of a gamble when you make that comparison.

Anotherone773

This entire subject comes down to this:

* If the items in the chance crates are valuable enough to you to pay for a CHANCE to obtain them by spending real money, buy the crates.
* If the the items in the chance crates are not valuable enough to you to pay for a CHANCE to obtain them by spending real money, then dont buy the crates.

See how simple that is. Every single other argument is invalid...

* Cant afford them = A lot of things in life are unobtainable do you fuss about that?
* They are gambling= So is driving on the freeway....except there its with your life.
* The items in the crates should be available to buy outright= No they shouldnt. Regardless of what you may think, the seller dictates the conditions in which you obtain items. You either agree to those conditions or you dont. Either you agree that you pay for a chance at an exclusive item, or you dont agree. They arent "for sale" items, they are chance items. Stop making them into something they arent.
* It leads to addiction = everything leads to addiction, some people just have addictive personalities. So that argument is pointless. I knew a guy that was addicted to sunflower seeds once.
* ZOS doesnt need to sell the crates to stay afloat= That may or may not be true, but they still sell them. Sort of like you dont need the items in those crate but you demand ZOS make them available in a way you approve of. Which one is being cheeky? The company trying to fulfill its primary function of making a profit or the one demanding they get something in way/for an amount they approve of?
* Its a shady sales gimmick to make people think that they might get one of the top tier items = I want to answer this one while i sit on top of my Radiant Apex Mount.The problem here is people have unrealistic expectations and then are disappointed. You get free crown crates. Those free crates tell you exactly what to expect from your average crown crate. If you put 2 and 2 together and keep coming up with 22 instead of 4 thats not ZOS's problem, that's yours. ZOS makes no claims about your chances to win an item you desire. You might win what you want on the 2nd card, the 2nd crate, the 200th crate, or the 2000th crate. What they do is give you crates to try...and this is the important part.... so you can see if what is in the crate, on average, is worth the price of the crate to you.
Everything misleading about RNG crates is fabricated in players heads because they have unrealistic expectations even when the companies give free example of what to expect if they buy one. "Oh i got all pots and an xp scroll....i should buy 100 so i win that mount"...." I didnt win the mount i wanted and i spent my whole paycheck! ZOS is a scam artist!" No, you just have unrealistic expectations.

That is so simple.. Buy the crates or dont buy the crates, whatever. But DONT expect people to give you stuff( under the conditions you dictate) just because you dont want to do or pay what is necessary to obtain it. Thats not how life works.

Mannox

This is troll bait. Crates are 100% gambling. Only an ignoramus would argue otherwise.

Tholian1

Whether they are gambling or not is really up to the lawmakers to decide. But imagine how frustrating, and expensive life would be if you couldn’t go to any store and just buy what you wanted to buy. Imagine having to buy RNG crates for only a chance to get the item you were shopping for. It would be an awful experience.

CurlyQTip

Tholian1 wrote: »

Whether they are gambling or not is really up to the lawmakers to decide. But imagine how frustrating, and expensive life would be if you couldn’t go to any store and just buy what you wanted to buy. Imagine having to buy RNG crates for only a chance to get the item you were shopping for. It would be an awful experience.

Yeah it kind of actually is up to lawmakers, because if it's gambling, and it's not being touched by gambling laws, lawmakers have to deal with... the law

DieAlteHexe

,,,,,,,

draekab14_ESO wrote: »

This is troll bait. Crates are 100% gambling. Only an ignoramus would argue otherwise.

Tsk. There have been some very nicely debated posts (both "sides").

Tholian1 wrote: »

Whether they are gambling or not is really up to the lawmakers to decide. But imagine how frustrating, and expensive life would be if you couldn’t go to any store and just buy what you wanted to buy. Imagine having to buy RNG crates for only a chance to get the item you were shopping for. It would be an awful experience.

It sure would but this store has two types of offering. If I'm of a mind I can go with the mystery box (after having had a look at the preview of course) or I can buy from all the rest of the offerings.

Two ways to shop. Of course the filet mignon is probably going to be tucked away in the mystery box.

Aebaradath

This is still going?

TamrielSaviour215

the greatest part about this thread is that I am pretty sure the majority of people who are saying that Crown Crates are definitely gambling (myself included) are ok with keeping them in the game. We are just trying to show those that are defending the crates that it absolutely is a gamble. Keep em. We don't care. Spend your money on chance. We don't care. Just don't pretend that it isn't a gamble. We all know that it is. That's the only point I am trying to make.

Yzalirk

To put it bluntly, those who think Crown Crates are the greatest thing since sliced bread simply cannot be reasoned with.

CurlyQTip

TamrielSaviour215 wrote: »

the greatest part about this thread is that I am pretty sure the majority of people who are saying that Crown Crates are definitely gambling (myself included) are ok with keeping them in the game. We are just trying to show those that are defending the crates that it absolutely is a gamble. Keep em. We don't care. Spend your money on chance. We don't care. Just don't pretend that it isn't a gamble. We all know that it is. That's the only point I am trying to make.

personally I want them to be vetted by gambling laws, keeping them in is one thing, uncontrolled gambling mechanics is another

and the reason i want this is because no sane gaming company is going to risk an adult rating and possible consequences of warnings just to keep their stupid boxes, it'll hopefully kill the lootbox industry

another reason for this, is because I want all odds to be publically available for everyone to see. Companies manipulate the odds to cheat people out of money. I don't want a single company to be allowed to have the only stuff worth having have a 0.01% chance while everything else is junk, without people knowing that is.

Odds being secret is my biggest point of annoyance. The adult only rating to me isn't even about protecting kids or anything, it's about the company not wanting to lose money to that market.