Jewelry Crafting is now simply Pay To Win and extremely anti-consuming

wolfie1.0.

I understand what you're saying, but I still agree to ZOS decision (Please share your reasons below).

When you look at it from a new player point of view this is really no different than any other DLC. One could make the same argument that ESO+ is a crafting pay wall because you can't tell me that a craft bag is not a huge advantage for crafters. A new player joining has no friends, no house, no research, no guilds. So naturally they don't have access to any attuned stations unless they find someone that does.

From a vets perspective though the new player has some advantages. They pay less than us vets for the same content: I dont know if you noticed but you can't buy the base game from ESO's website anymore, and if you buy it elsewhere its super cheap. Also Morrowind is heavily discounted. AND if you buy summerset you get all 3. add ESO+ to that and hell you have spent way less than I did.

TBH the only people that are probably gonna find this hard are not the new people, no its going to be the returning player that is going to be at a disadvantage in my opinion.

Ashtaris

Royaji wrote: »

Ashtaris wrote: »

OK, let’s try to get this P2W argument settled for jewelry crafting once and for all. @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom, will Rolis Hlaalu or his new associate have Jewelry Crafting stations purchasable with writ vouchers?

It's kinda irrelevant, here is a quote directly from the article

Note that the Summerset Chapter is required to use the new Crafting Stations.

Even if you can get them for writ vouchers you will not be able to use them without Summerset. Still not p2w though...

Really, I take that to mean that the Summerset Chapter is required to use the new crafting stations located in Summerset, not necessarily overall if they do offer them from the writ merchant. I guess we will know soon enough when it comes out on the PTS.

majulook

Nope, just nope.

The PC base ESO game with Morrowind cost 16.99 on amazon.
The PC base game with Morrwind & Summerset cost 39.99 from ESO.
The PC digital upgrade for Morrwind & Summerset costs 29.99 from ESO.
I know if you already have Morrowind the cost for Summerst is the same, so just wait a year the next chapter will probably include all previous chapters for a similarly low price.

IMHO this is quite reasonable costs as compared to other games.

Each Chapter should have something unique to make the purchase of it worth more than the regular DLC's.

If you cannot afford to purchase the "Chapter" maybe you should not be playing a game, but bettering yourself to increase your earning potential.

rustic_potato

I understand what you're saying, but I still agree to ZOS decision (Please share your reasons below).

Pr0Skygon wrote: »

rustic_potato wrote: »

No. A new chapter needs to bring something to the table which would make players buy it. If jewel crafting is made available to base game why buy the chapter?

The new zone, the new story, the new guild, the new trial, the new sets? There's a lot of other thing "expansion" can add in.

Lol. The last chapter gave a new class in addition to all the ones mentioned. Wanting more free stuff to the base game is kinds selfish. Honestly ZOS should offer more to the chapters and DLCs. That way they get more revenue and the servers stay up longer.

Stopnaggin

I think you're heading into the wrong direction here (Please tell me why).

So how does one lock jewelry crafting behind Summerset? It say you can craft at stations throughout Tamriel, not throughout Summerset.

Throughout Tamriel, you can find new Jewelry Crafting Stations (including set stations)

I would assume new stations would simply be added to each craftable set location. Or has this been discussed elsewhere and I've missed it? And even if that is the case I'm sure there will be an attunables station at some point.

Anyway, p2w its not. No more than Maelstrom, Asylum or any other set locked behind dlc or chapters. People can still farm drop set jewles. They aren't having to pay, and there isn't a competitive advantage to crafting, because there isn't anything op in crafting vs drop sets.

This is another example of pay for convience, not pay to win.

WrathOfInnos

I'm mixed about this.

It does feel like it should be a base game feature. If all the crafted sets are getting jewelry crafting stations that means there will be objects all over Tamriel that cannot be interacted with by players that do not own the Expansion.

As for pay to win, I don't see this as any worse than the Julianos crafting station requiring Wrothgar or Mechanical Acuity requiring Clockwork City. Not to mention the exclusive Maelstrom and Asylum weapons, behind a paywall, which are likely much more powerful than upgrading jewelry quality or changing traits.

The alternative would be worse in my opinion: all new DLC features underperforming compared to the previous meta. There would just be no incentive to bother doing new content.

wenchmore420b14_ESO

Nope, just nope.

Ok, I will admit that I skipped a few pages, but as far as OP,
the way I read the announcement is that it will be like Transmute from CWC and will be available to all who do the research.

Throughout Tamriel, you can find new Jewelry Crafting Stations (including set stations)

So, I myself will wait till PTS/Beta and wait and see before I scream P2W.
My 2 drakes...
Huzzah!

Feric51

Stopnaggin wrote: »

Throughout Tamriel, you can find new Jewelry Crafting Stations (including set stations)

I would assume new stations would simply be added to each craftable set location. Or has this been discussed elsewhere and I've missed it? And even if that is the case I'm sure there will be an attunables station at some point.

This is correct, however.......

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

Ok, I will admit that I skipped a few pages, but as far as OP,
the way I read the announcement is that it will be like Transmute from CWC and will be available to all who do the research.

Not so much...

You guys missed the line at the end of the paragraph, "Throughout Tamriel, you can find new Jewelry Crafting Stations (including set stations) that allow you to create custom jewelry for the current crafted item sets, and you will be able to complete Writs and Master Writs like any other crafting Skill Line. Note that the Summerset Chapter is required to use the new Crafting Stations."

So, yes, the jewelry stations will be all throughout the base game and probably purchasable with writ vouchers and/or achievement furnisher, but, no, it is not like Transmute where you only need to access one to use it. You HAVE to have purchased Summerset to be able to interact with any of the stations. Think thieves troves. Every player can see them, but if you don't own the Thieves Guild DLC you cannot open them.

Juju_beans

Folks that only play base game don't have access to Maelstrom weapons.
Folks that only play base game don't have access to Shadowy supplier.
Folks that only play base game don't have access to daily quests that reward motifs in the DLC's.

I'm sure there's even more that those that only play base game don't have access to.

And you get to play the base game for FREE.

$30 for the digital upgrade and you have 2 months to save for it.

Colecovision

Others (Share your thought below)

There is a paywall for sure. I don’t understand the extreme denial. There is a p2w component here. I’ll have gold dungeon gear fairly quickly and it will be from normal dungeons. The bigger issue is the inability to transmute bound gear. But it’s just not that bad. If someone else can make you mechanical acuity, hundings or any of the best crafted sets, you should be fine.

For eso + people who are mad, just quit for 2 months. I’m an on again off again cheapskate and it totally works. You can quit for 4 weeks easy, then a month sub, then repeat. I promise it’s not that bad. There’s your $30.

If you skipped morrowind, you’re just being stubborn. This is a great gaming deal. I’m that guy that played 1 year behind the rest of the gamers for 20+ years to save money. I always got double the games for my money. It worked here for you. Morrowind + summerset for less than the original morrowind price. Just buy it.

If you really really can’t do come up with $30, you’ll have to get by with the good crafted sets if you want the new traits. I’ll be researching right away and if you’re on pc/na reach out to me. Get your mats and I’ll make it for you. No tip. My guild should have all the stations by the time I can do hundings. Seducers should be very quick if that’s what you want.

Kreshja

I think you're heading into the wrong direction here (Please tell me why).

I will agree with you that jewelry crafting should be part of the base game, if you send a $100k check to Zenimax, period (thats actually very little). I want the maker of good game to make money so they keep the game good and keep the game going so I/we can enjoy it. As a film/tv industry person I appreciate good content and wouldnt mind the ones making it get richer, even if they are rich already, cuz hey they make good stuff. If you think jewelry crafting breaks balance, then any and all expansions or DLCs (such as VMA) with new sets and new available skill points break balance too. Why would the new sets dropped only in Summerset not break balance but jewelry craft does, according to your logic? And if you think that players that pay should not benefit more than free players, then it sounds to me you are the kind that wants free stuff without working or making any kind of sacrifice/effort for it. I totally support paying for good stuff, and even if you dont get warden or cant craft jewelry yourself, you can still win by using the original 4 classes and dropped sets or buy things from others. So your p2w theory doesnt stand. If its anything, its pay to get new features. Pardon my typos or bad puctuation cuz typing on phone.

Pr0Skygon

I think you're correct and jewelry crafting should not be locked behind paywall.

Panomania wrote: »

Ok, lets try this for people with functioning glia. Again, since so many seem to have a hard time grasping the concepts.

ZOS doesnt have a mommy or daddy that can just give them the money they need to pay their bills, eat, pay for property, etc. Companies form at their core for ONE function: profit. If this isnt the core concern of a company, that company will fail. Period.

Now failure for a company doesnt mean that mommy or daddy hug them, tell them they are special and to use their words to express their feelings about failure. It means that the company is gone (or should, ridiculous "too big to fail" arguments aside). It means their employees are out of jobs, their families perhaps dont eat, pay bills, etc. Directly as a result for you, it means you dont get to play ESO anymore.

As someone stated, production costs, always. Beyond that keeping the lights on costs money. The substantial costs in terms of liability insurance (necessary for any game like this, and a HUGE cost many dont consider) not to mention standard legal fees for this type company are substantial (the monthly costs typically surpass what most people make annually). Long story short, games like this cost one hell of a lot more to maintain than many seem to think.

Now, because so many of today's alleged gamers wont support pay to play anymore (see I wants what I wants! statement above) ESO has embraced free to play, with real cash purchases for optional content. Again, read OPTIONAL CONTENT! THIS IS NOT PAY TO WIN. You can easily play this game and NEVER pay a dime past the pittance you pay for the core software, and many do, which is the problem. Many people do not, and even more pay next to nothing in a year. ZOS has to find new and creative ways to make money, or they shut down (google "mmo's that have shut down" for several lists of closed games).

Now, if you're thinking "Man, ZOS seems to be doing everything they can to encourage me to spend more money on their game!" you'd be right...and thats exactly what they should be doing.

1. ZOS has a "mom and dad", it's called "publisher", Zenimax Media.

2. If ESO fails (which will not likely to any time soon), ZOS staff can get another opportunity with other publisher, if they're deemed worthy enough. If not, there's a thing called crowdfunding now.

3. "OPTIONAL CONTENT" is a dead horse now, please let it dies. You can call MTX in Battlefront 2 of EA an "OPTIONAL CONTENT", because it lets player choose between 40 hours of intense grinding to get randomized lootboxex, or pay up 40$ for those exact lootboxes. Is that the type of "OPTIONAL CONTENT" you want? Cause if it does, please don't ever come to any gaming forum, ever again, please.

4. You're pretending like jewelry crafting has no effect on gameplay or player's performance in group. It's like you've never seen, or even wanted yourself a gold quality dungeon set jewelry with a trait that is not just base stat boost. IT AFFECTS THE PLAYER'S POWER, big or small, doesn't matter, because we've not seen it yet. But you better be prepared for the storm, and not just wait till the storm comes to you then decide what to do next.

5. "ZOS has to find new and creative ways to make money". Don't you mean "Copying EA by selling people wishes and desire in an overloaded package"?

6. I don't mind giving ZOS money, because I've already did with a lot of DLCs and other stuffs. But that money is well deserved, because they earned it with quality content that is truly OPTIONAL CONTENT, such as stories, zones, item sets. I do not, however, support ZOS wanting my money for something that is critically tied into the core game mechanic, which is crafting and loot's power. I've paid for Summerset for being an ESO fan and I want to support ZOS with their good work on the OPTIONAL CONTENT, but not this bs.

TheMystid

I think you're correct and jewelry crafting should not be locked behind paywall.

zakeehamacab16_ESO wrote: »

Supporting the game through getting an expansion is hardly pay to win in any sense of the word
Most other MMOs almost "demand" that you have expansions to be able to do anything from that point on (In that level caps are often increased, and you need the expansion to keep leveling, for example).

Amusing how the most vocal people in this community seem to be the "I bought the base game 4 years ago and shouldn't have to spend anything beyond that!" people...
If no-one is paying for anything, the game would not be updated ever again

Getting a feature from an expansion (Or chapter - Whatever; Same thing, different name) is not paying to win -.-

This is a completely bugged way of reasoning. Not only because there are games completely free, with way less bugs and lag than ESO and that are updated every month, but because you are confusing a content expansion - new dungeons, sets and basic DLC stuff - with a potential game-changing feature.
Transmute station are available to all, and so jewel crafting should be. I'm afraid who voted "nope" is just a spoiled kid with no idea of what money are for.


Edit to uderline a sad truth

xaraan

I think you're heading into the wrong direction here (Please tell me why).

No.

ZoS should be able to offer to features to customers when selling new expansions. Nothing wrong with it.

And frankly, every time I see P2W used to complain about something, it has the most liberal application of "winning" in existence.

You don't give them money and instantly get to win anything with the game b/c of this feature. It doesn't make you super powered compared to others - at most making a build slightly weaker in end-game/equally skilled playing scenerios with the exact same builds and the ability for only one player to change a trait or upgrade a jewelry to gold instead of purple.

P2W would be there not being MA weapons and instead having them crown store only items where you can get a considerably more powerful option no other way than buying it.

Stop wanting something for nothing and pay for the new content added to the game.

wenchmore420b14_ESO

Nope, just nope.

Feric51 wrote: »

Stopnaggin wrote: »

Throughout Tamriel, you can find new Jewelry Crafting Stations (including set stations)

I would assume new stations would simply be added to each craftable set location. Or has this been discussed elsewhere and I've missed it? And even if that is the case I'm sure there will be an attunables station at some point.

This is correct, however.......

wenchmore420b14_ESO wrote: »

Ok, I will admit that I skipped a few pages, but as far as OP,
the way I read the announcement is that it will be like Transmute from CWC and will be available to all who do the research.

Not so much...

You guys missed the line at the end of the paragraph, "Throughout Tamriel, you can find new Jewelry Crafting Stations (including set stations) that allow you to create custom jewelry for the current crafted item sets, and you will be able to complete Writs and Master Writs like any other crafting Skill Line. Note that the Summerset Chapter is required to use the new Crafting Stations."

So, yes, the jewelry stations will be all throughout the base game and probably purchasable with writ vouchers and/or achievement furnisher, but, no, it is not like Transmute where you only need to access one to use it. You HAVE to have purchased Summerset to be able to interact with any of the stations. Think thieves troves. Every player can see them, but if you don't own the Thieves Guild DLC you cannot open them.

Thank you for that clarification. Yup I missed that and that's not right imo.
Make Jewelry Crafting base game ZoS!!!!!!!!!!!

Tai-Chi

Nope, just nope.

All the RPGs & MMOs I have ever played, charge for new expansions. It is immaterial whether the game is delivered electronically, or whether it is loaded manually from a disc. Technology has moved forward over the years.

Summerset is a new Chapter (expansion) bringing in new features.

• Jewellery crafting is a new feature to the game.
• The Psijic Order Guild and Skill Line are new features.
• Summerset is a never before explored area - to the best of my knowledge.
• There is a new Story Quest Line to follow.
  

In my opinion, these are features over-and-above what one would expect from an ordinary 'enhancement' to the base game. As such, it is quite reasonable for ZOS to charge for it.

If one wanted to go on holiday in the Sims - one had to pay for it.
If you wanted to play Dawnguard - one had to pay for it.
To explore new areas in LOTRO, even the privileged, life-time VIPs have to pay for it.

Summerset is no different to the above.

DiteHart

I'm mixed about this.

I actually like that ESO has some DLC additions to core features/aspects, and I personally feel like for a Chapter to be worth it, it almost has to include them.

It's kinda one of those weird things for me--I don't like how Chapters can't be bought with crowns, and hate it even more that they still lock it to your account (which I feel is a bit of a middle finger to consoles, but I could get totally off-topic on that), but since they are locked to one account for straight money, they need to be more than just a bigger story and bigger map--it needs bigger features. And with Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood adding niche skill lines, and Clockwork City adding transmutation, Chapters need more involved changes.

I feel like what made Morrowind acceptable as a Chapter for me was the new class (Warden) and new PVP feature (Battlegrounds). It added to a core aspect (classes) and gave a new separate PVP experience (with modes/games and arenas and such).

For Summerset, I'm expecting it to be a new crafting line (Jewelry Crafting) and a new more active skill line (Psijic Order). These ought to be bigger than DLC. Jewelry Crafting is a new crafting skill line, while Transmutation was just a new feature that relied on previous skill lines (the Blacksmithing/Clothing/Woodworking research). The DB and TG had passive skill trees while the Psijic Order will have it all like the base-game guild lines.

I think making Jewelry Crafting a part of the Chapter is a good move as far as "what to add in the Chapter". I understand that you think that jewelry crafting is a "base game feature" (I think you later started using the term "core feature"), but it's not an actual part of the base game and I don't feel like the game had this huge hole by not having it. For me, "Crafting" is the core feature/base game feature, and "Jewelry Crafting" is an addition to it, that would have been great to have in the base game (like housing), but makes sense as a Chapter feature to me.


That said, I can definitely see how it's unfair for base game players to be completely blocked from important skill lines if it affects their personal gameplay (as far as playing independently of other players).
I don't care so much about "that person bought the chapter, and upgraded a green ring to gold, while I had to farm for a purple ring". As people said, upgrading to gold probably isn't necessary in PVE and I could be totally wrong on this, but I feel like there won't be many times where jewelry quality is going to be the difference between you winning and losing in PVP.

My concern would be "my base-game stuff is harder because they released this chapter, and I didn't buy it."
We still need to get the details before really worrying, but I do feel like there's a good chance that farming jewelry would get harder for base-game players, since the 6 new traits will probably be part of Update 18 (and not just the Chapter) and may change the way jewelry drops.
IIRC, most set jewelry came in a specific type based on the set's armor weight (mainly overland gear, possibly dungeon gear) where light armor sets gave you arcane, medium sets had robust and heavy sets always dropped in healthy.
I don't know if it's been stated whether that will be out the window, or if there will be 3 traits "favored by" each armor type.
If it does become a free-for-all like other gear, then it's not completely fair that because of the expansion (as I'm pretty sure we're only getting extra jewelry traits because of 6-trait to 9-trait crafted set requirements), a base-game player has a harder time getting the jewelry they wanted than before.


Ultimately, I think instead of stopping complete access to it, they should make it "experience/inspiration-locked". Only people with the chapter can earn inspiration in the skill line, but base-game players can still use it. So, assuming the skills look like the Blacksmithing/Clothing/Woodworking lines:
- They'll only be able to create bottom-tier jewelry, so they'll still need to purchase CP160 crafted set jewelry.
- They can only complete level 1 writs.
- They won't be able to get any "keen eye" passives (which may or may not be helpful)
- They won't be able to get any hirelings.
- They'll still get stuff for deconstruction, but cannot get the improved chances for materials (inc upgrade mats)
- They can research (allowing them to transmute) traits, but will be limited to one item at the maximum time (excl. ESO+ bonuses)
- They can improve jewelry, but only with the base chances. (So, instead of 8 mats for a guaranteed gold, it'll take 20 mats.)
Since deconstructing is an everlasting source of inspiration, it shouldn't truly mess anything up. If they decide to get the chapter after researching all the traits, they'll still be able to reach level 50 in the skill line.

That way, you have to own the chapter to truly delve into it and be a true jewelry crafter, but the base-game player has enough functionality (although usually at higher costs) to counter any unintended "punishments" (for lack of a better word at the moment) in Update 18.

Smokewood

Others (Share your thought below)

Anyone who is serious about the game will be buying the expansion, it's a non-issue.

LilyReaper

I understand what you're saying, but I still agree to ZOS decision (Please share your reasons below).

I understand where you are coming from, but I agree with what they have decided. It's pretty much like ESO +, if you want the craft bag and such you need to haul out and pay. Which I feel is totally fair. If you want more exclusive features in a game then you should be willing to pay for them. Especially if those are features that are not necessary to the game it self.

Think about it, this game has gone 4 years without Jewelry crafting, so yes, implementing it now, makes it exclusive, an extra.
And these people have to also somehow make money to bring us more features and keep the servers going. SO, that makes me happy to pay for my ESO+ and chapters (with the features that they bring). In my view, they want to make it worth our while to purchase it.

DaveMoeDee

I think you're heading into the wrong direction here (Please tell me why).

This is the revenue model. People need to buy expansions annually to keep up.

drake88131

Others (Share your thought below)

Pr0Skygon wrote: »

So I've seen a lot of fuss about this topic lately, so I think I'll also drop my thought on this as well.
Before I get into this, I just want to make a quick reminder: These reasons are best suited for new players. If you're a vet players that would pay up for Summerset Isle either way (I've already pre-ordered the chapter), it's best to read these as a someone who has just decided to buy ESO for the first time.

1. This is a base game feature. Why do I claim this? Just imagine buying the new Monster Hunter World game, where crafting is a key feature, and now suddenly you realized that you can only craft 1 type of weapon only, and if you want to widen your weapon crafting ability, you must buy a *** 10% addon. If you're a Monster Hunter fans, this is a kick to the stomach.

2. "But you can have someone do it for you". Yes, but only with craftable sets. Remember that we can now transmute items, and now you realized that only paid Summerset Isle players can transmute their account bound jewelries. Not to mention we'll get 6 new jewelry traits, if 1 of them become the new meta, then RIP base game owner. Not to mention improving purple jewelries to legendary jewelry. Sure, the change isn't much, but a change non the less. Also, you doesn't want a legendary jewelry? It's so shiny

3. Base game owner will be constantly reminded how handicapped they are when they see jewelry crafting station everywhere in the world, but can't use them, and the only way they can do it is to buy a 40$ DLC, with a story they don't care, a zone they don't care, a guild that looks cool but still don't care, and they might not even care about the new trial or sets. They'll basically paying 40$ for jewelry crafting, that is anti-consumer at its best.

But hey, that's just my thought, love to hear yours below. Don't worry, I always try to read and reply them all

I honestly just really really wanted this. Not going to lie, I also paid good $$$ for some stupid games in my time that I regret (I'm looking at you Friday the 13th on NES...good god was that stupid) so this $30 for something I want I'm actually ok with, but I also hear you as I'm not a huge fan of nickel and diming players to death, but, still, I wanted it so I bought it. Mixed feelings abound.

Jayne_Doe

I'm not against Jewelry Crafting being locked behind Summerset, but I do understand the frustration of those who either don't want to purchase Summerset, don't have the funds to purchase Summerset, or just disagree in principle with it being behind a paywall.

Here are a few things to consider. These are my thoughts/opinions, obviously.

1. Crafted jewelry will not be bound and can be freely traded - thus, those who don't purchase Summerset will have access to crafted jewelry.

2. Jewelry crafting nodes will be available to all, so those without Summerset can still gather mats to give to a crafter or charge out the nose for at guild traders, thus making some gold.

3. It appears that one of the trait mats, Infused, will only be available from activities on Summerset, but others will be available from other activities - Cyrodiil dailies, e.g. ETA: Those trait stones will still be tradable, however.

4. There are already other things in-game that aren't available to those without the DLC/Chapter - thieves troves are everywhere, but you can't access them without the DLC and a message will pop up saying you need that DLC. Also, people who don't have that DLC also can't access another player's fence assistant (also, those with the DLC can't access anyone else's unless they've unlocked her themselves). Of course, any dungeon/trial gear is also unavailable to anyone without the corresponding content. The Warden class is also behind a paywall.

5. Just because crafting as a system is in the base game doesn't mean that Jewelry crafting HAS to be. Classes are a base-game system, but the Warden is behind a paywall. Gear sets is a base-game system, but many are locked behind paywalls. Heck, skills are a base game system, but the Psijic Order skill line, not to mention the TG and DB skill lines, are locked behind paywalls. We already have examples of base-game system additions being locked behind paywalls.

6. It is unfortunate that while a player without Summerset can obtain crafted jewelry from other players, and indeed, can participate in the market of the materials, they won't be able to transmute any of their dropped jewelry pieces nor be able to improve them. But, anyone who needs BiS dropped jewelry in the best traits and golded out will undoubtedly already have purchased access to the content that provides that BiS jewelry in the first place - some of that is locked behind a paywall.

Bottom line is that the decision has already been made, and players will have to come to terms with it. If you want Jewelry Crafting, you'll have to purchase Summerset. Moving forward, players will have to deal with the fact that future systems/additions - things players have been asking for - may be locked behind a new chapter or monetized in some way. I'm not always happy with that, either - the outfit system is a good example of that, and while it is still free, to really take advantage of it, you have to spend real money. I also wasn't happy that a free base game addition, house storage, was not actually free for everyone.

I've had to come to terms with this and realize that unless the game goes back to a sub model, we are going to have to pay for some of the new things we get. Heck, even in sub-based games, players still have to pay for expansions, which contain new systems, levels, what have you that aren't available to players without that new expansion.

Wreuntzylla

I don't agree to all of your saying, but I still think lock jewelry crafting is dumb.

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Xuhora wrote: »

are we sure yet that jewelry crafting isnt implemented into the basegame? I mean sure we can freak out now, and then realize later that all the fuss was about nothing, because its in the base game.

... Everyone can afford the price tag. It's just a question of how cheap/entitled someone is.

Online game players used to be exclusively the wealthy. Then online gaming became accessible by the well off. Then, the middle class. Now even poverty line people can play. You can buy a computer that meets the ESO minimum system requirements for less than $150, and free internet is becoming ubiquitous, in some cases even to your home.

Some of the poverty line players are the most interesting people I know. Everything from crippled war veterans to poor citizens of third world countries. On the other hand, most first-world players with their boring, wrong use of the term "entitled" and self-centered world view - not interesting at all.

mike_skleinub17_ESO

I just re-upped my sub after probably at least two years away. Let me tell you..that craft bag ALONE make it worth it. Its stupid how much easier crafting and gathering is now. Add in the double bank space and its a no brainer. I'd pay (maybe) $50 to have just those two things without a sub.

DLCs are included here in the sub, as they are in many other MMOs. Well, for sure DC Universe which other than Neverwinter was the only other one I played. This is fairly standard practice.

Chapters are not included in the sub and its very questionable whether they shouldn't be. I'd argue that Orsimium should have been an xpac and the chapters we've gotten so far should be DLC. Two of them barely equal the size of Orsinium. When you consider that Chapters are usually on the short-ish side (using a book analogy) then it makes a little more sense.

I'm not sure I agree yet that Jewelry should be behind the pay wall, certainly at least behind the sub wall. I do know that whining about it will accomplish very little. Unless ZOS changes their mind before launch, it will stay that way for a LONG time otherwise they'll tick off the people who actually bought the chapter.

RyanBlocks2

I think you're heading into the wrong direction here (Please tell me why).

No. Jewelry crafting is pay to play which is very different from pay to win.

Kodrac

Nope, just nope.

Biased poll is biased. I don't think you're correct, it's not P2W, but it shouldn't be expansion exclusive. It should be part of the base game just like all the crafts are.

Jayne_Doe

This is all moot now, though, since a year from now, Summerset will become part of ESO Plus and jewelry crafting will be base game, like BGs will be when Summerset hits. Well, I guess they could make it an account upgrade like the Warden.

Lumsdenml

I think you're heading into the wrong direction here (Please tell me why).

It would be one thing if the only way to get jewelry was to pay, however, that is not the case. The idea of "pay to win" would be that paying would give you a serious, unfair advantage. With all of the jewelry options already available (none if which are being taken away), you can more than compete with someone who does pay.

Integral1900

Good greif, just buy the crafted jewelry from someone who has the expansion... why is that so hard to grasp?

Banana

Nope, just nope.

Have mummy pay for it for you if your that cheap.