Summerset architecture.

Korah_Eaglecry

TheNuminous1 wrote: »

ok ok so just to state what rich said. lore comes from lots of ingame accounts of stuff.

do you think when the author of the ingame book describing summerset and alinor wrote his book that he thought people would be interested in hearing about stone buildings?

probably not. we have not had anything to go on but his words. so why not exaggerate something so his readers are more entertained? its not like anyone can prove him wrong! people were not allowed there so his word was accepted at face value.

so all this hype behind insect wing buildings and glass and crystal. none of it was anything more then the account of an imperial writing a book. Not Concrete Information.

so please being that this is the first time we have seen the isle since arena can we just be happy to get something so beautiful and unique. Stop defending and standing bulwark to some npc's writings.

Its also a question of when the book was written as well as when the author laid eyes on the city. If the book was written in the 3rd or 4th eras. Its possible that the city saw major changes to its appearance and general architecture between now and then.

Personally I like the idea of things being overly exaggerated due to the fact that the author would know, before even putting ink to paper, that the vast majority of readers would never have a chance to see the things described. Making it easy for the writer to exaggerate or straight up fabricate details. You see a bit of evidence of this in the way the two Scholars(Lady Cinnabar and Phrastus) popular in this games era bicker about the facts and details revolving around subjects they write about. Both challenge the veracity of each others publications accusing the other of exaggerating or misunderstanding the subject entirely.

James-Wayne

I'm loving the Summerset style so far... Much more then Morrowind!

psychotrip

Faulgor wrote: »

Okiir wrote: »

What's sad is that on the early zone concept it seems like they were actually going for a glass/crystal Alinor. A concept that apparently got scrapped sometime during development.

They put up a complete version of this map on twitter, and guess what.
Crystal-Like-Law looks like a crystal.

psychotrip wrote: »

Pragmatic just doesn't feel altmer to me though. I never saw them as this bland or low-tech.

I know it's silly, but one moment that really stood out to me in the trailer was an Altmer carrying a barrel.
That really didn't make sense to me. You have Goblin and Daedra slaves for that kind of labor, or just use a spell Phynaster damn it!
Even the windmill stood out to me as out of place for the Altmer. Everything just seems like a medieval peasant society with long-eared people, that's it.

psychotrip wrote: »

I guess I'm just realizing I don't like The Elder Scrolls anymore.

Maybe we were never TES fans, just Morrowind fans. I mean, by now this blandness defines most of the TES releases, and every single time we try to defend the boring aspects with unreliable narrator excuses.
By now, I can't think of anything that sets TES apart from other fantasy universes in the public eye.
TES is just generic fantasy with cat people.

Man, I already said goodbye to Star Trek this year, I'm not ready for this.

Yeah, I think I agree with your last point especially. At this point, this is just the standard for ES, not the exception. The series is what it is now, and it’s not all that interesting to me.

Sicardus

psychotrip wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

Okiir wrote: »

What's sad is that on the early zone concept it seems like they were actually going for a glass/crystal Alinor. A concept that apparently got scrapped sometime during development.

They put up a complete version of this map on twitter, and guess what.
Crystal-Like-Law looks like a crystal.

psychotrip wrote: »

Pragmatic just doesn't feel altmer to me though. I never saw them as this bland or low-tech.

I know it's silly, but one moment that really stood out to me in the trailer was an Altmer carrying a barrel.
That really didn't make sense to me. You have Goblin and Daedra slaves for that kind of labor, or just use a spell Phynaster damn it!
Even the windmill stood out to me as out of place for the Altmer. Everything just seems like a medieval peasant society with long-eared people, that's it.

psychotrip wrote: »

I guess I'm just realizing I don't like The Elder Scrolls anymore.

Maybe we were never TES fans, just Morrowind fans. I mean, by now this blandness defines most of the TES releases, and every single time we try to defend the boring aspects with unreliable narrator excuses.
By now, I can't think of anything that sets TES apart from other fantasy universes in the public eye.
TES is just generic fantasy with cat people.

Man, I already said goodbye to Star Trek this year, I'm not ready for this.

Yeah, I think I agree with your last point especially. At this point, this is just the standard for ES, not the exception. The series is what it is now, and it’s not all that interesting to me.

As a big fan of Argonians, you must now know what I felt when the game first launched and I landed in Bal Foyen. Mud huts?!! Not even pencil shaped wooden walls?!! I was very disappointed. Yes I know they were supposed to be somewhat on the primitive side, but the mud houses shaped like bee hives and potatoes, although alien, were ugly. Simple as that. As I reached Stormhold I was pleased to see how they utilized the Ayleid architecture. The Dunmer influence was a huge let down, as originally I mistook the newly created Indoril Dunmer houses for an Argonian variant way before launch. The Aztec ruin temples made me happier than ever when exploring Shadowfen, but obviously I might've liked some variety in color and assets (of course this was only base game Argonia, and most assets were copied in every part of the game). Then came the images of Murkmire, and the wooden architecture made me scream internally with joy. That's simply all I wanted, a nicer version of "primitive" architecture. The Xanmeers become more detailed with Murkmire as I noticed the footage. Obelisks of the trademark Argonian statue, perhaps an ancient king. I came to the conclusion that it was the Mer, particularly the Grape Mer (Dunmer) who caused some of the devolution in Argonian architecture as far as Shadowfen goes and their own lands. Yes, I know the Argonians also decided to go with this idea that life has impermanence, so their buildings should follow. I was just happy they added something additional to the mud huts. When Mazzatun dropped, I was pleased with a REAL Argonian city free from a majority of foreign influence (the Bosmer and Breton blemishes were pretty nice though). We finally got to see the Murkmire assets for Xanmeers in action. In a sense the Mud huts for me eventually were simply another diverse architecture of the lizardfolk. They added to the variety of building styles that they possess. Currently I enjoy Mazzartun, Hissmir, any Xanmeer really, and my Grand Topal Hideaway house. I'm just waiting for Murkmire to actually drop, but there's a 0% chance of that happening this year. We will probably get a Mephala's realm drop and another dungeon pack. That's why I'm hopeful for Chapter III being Argonian themed, but not just set in Murkmire, the capital of Helstrom must make an appearance. I do feel your pain in a sense, but much less intensely. I want an El Dorado from a future Argonian expansion, with the biggest of Hist trees, but I'm not so hopeful in getting that. I hope you, however, give Summerset a chance. I know it doesn't look like much to the descriptions, but it definitely looks clean and organized.

red_emu

What I find really weird is that the architecture lacks imagination. As it's been said before in this thread, even Ayelid architecture looks more...elven and alien and pretty. Romantic, neo-gothic style is just too close to home!

And it's not like they can't come up with something original, not seen in any other game, movie or in real life. Just look at the architecture of Bosmer, Morrowind or orsinium or the Ayelid. Even the real world inspired architecture of the Breton, Khajiit and nords seems more inspired the way it has been implemented.

I always imagined high elven architecture as very fluid, lacking sharp edges, very vertical with spires and ramps high in the sky. They could have even taken inspiration from Peter Jackson's vision of Rivendell.

It's not what I was expecting but let me stress I will still enjoy it! As non fitting for the Altmer it is, there has been a lot of work put in it and cities still look beautiful with the white stone everywhere. I just wish even if they wanted to stick with the style, that it had more flair. More of something that would have been impossible from an engineering perspective of other races. Stone carvings that look like liquid glass, impossibly tall spires, entire streets glowing with magica.

I hope before release they will add a few things and effects here and there to make the place seem more outlandish than anything we have seen before.

exiars10

zadrotscrolls wrote: »

Nice Slavic? settlement.

red_emu

exiars10 wrote: »

zadrotscrolls wrote: »

Nice Slavic? settlement.

I actually wouldn't mind if for once some fantasy culture was inspired by Slavs. Witcher was the only one to do it but it was based on a Polish book. Something different than your bog standard French gothic, feudal Japan, Arabic influences.

Faulgor

Time for a little quiz! Can you guys pick the odd one out?

TheNuminous1

Faulgor wrote: »

Time for a little quiz! Can you guys pick the odd one out?

the one with gryphons and horses.

psychotrip

Faulgor wrote: »

Time for a little quiz! Can you guys pick the odd one out?

Jeez. This really sinks in how uninspired the art style is. At least Anor Londo felt like a sprawling metropolis. And even though it was abandoned, it looked better maintained.

Dracane

TheNuminous1 wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

Time for a little quiz! Can you guys pick the odd one out?

the one with gryphons and horses.

Saddening, Alinor is just ripped off. And I always thought, the creation team was creative, but Alinor is a huge slap in the face.

The_4O4

Enslaved wrote: »

So, crystal tower is actually made of rock. What else will be off, I wonder.

Is the White Gold Tower made of white gold?

supaskrub

After reading just about every post in this thread I conclude that very many folks think that "Lore" is a factual account, that's just not how Lore evolves through the ages, one mans original account is his own interpretation and description of what he sees and feels, it is not fact and does not make it fact. As years progress Lore becomes exaggerated much like Chinese Whispers.

Walls are not made of poetry or crystal but one would be quite in order to use those words if it was stunning, if the walls were made of the stone of a similar material to Quartz or a polished Marble then it would indeed look poetic and could be described as being built of poetry as describing something as "poetry" does not just apply to a written verse but can also apply to something being visually wonderful or skilled.

exiars10

red_emu wrote: »

exiars10 wrote: »

zadrotscrolls wrote: »

Nice Slavic? settlement.

I actually wouldn't mind if for once some fantasy culture was inspired by Slavs. Witcher was the only one to do it but it was based on a Polish book. Something different than your bog standard French gothic, feudal Japan, Arabic influences.

Well, The Kingdom of Kislev (Warhammer) is clearly not Polish-Russian inspired .

Casowen

psychotrip wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

Time for a little quiz! Can you guys pick the odd one out?

Jeez. This really sinks in how uninspired the art style is. At least Anor Londo felt like a sprawling metropolis. And even though it was abandoned, it looked better maintained.

Its funny since this is really actually german and scandinavian architecture, and guess what nord-esque thing we already have in game for the elder scrolls. You guessed it, SKYRIM! Same with the all to obvious gothic armor with is germanic in origin. Are ESO high elves just more evolved nords? Or is this skyrim the prequal?

IMO the Dunmer and wood elven get more the style correct of what more or less Summerset is or was, just in a different version, but the dunmer and wood elves retains the more organic styling and symmetry such as things like pyramids, clothing, armor, and weapons, but just in a different variation that emphasises more brown and yellow color tones(almost egyptian and middle eastern) The wood elves have more the more organic symmetry in architecture and cleaner color tones, though just in a more woodsman fashion, and both them and the dunmer have the psychology with it. I like how vivec city as water flowing through the pyramids, as the great pyramid, and I think a few others actually had flowing water basins under them just as a point of interest.

Summerset imo did an almost similar organic styling, but uses more full spectrum colors, along with an emphasis on blue, gold, and white.

I love the Summerset choice of clothing and armor and weapons however. Of course I am in love with most all of this games aesthetics.

Is there a secret Elven/Nordic connection we are not aware of

Sotha_Sil

The_4O4 wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

So, crystal tower is actually made of rock. What else will be off, I wonder.

Is the White Gold Tower made of white gold?

It is shiny and white ^^

Hallothiel

Actually quite glad as the idea of buildings of crystal and insect wings sounded appallingly tacky.

Would hate to actually work on this game as some of us lot are such precious & demanding drama queens, especially if it doesn't fit the 'vision'. Whatever that is.

WhiteCoatSyndrome

@psychotrip The sad part is the Disney buildings actually look nicer. The ESO buildings' roofs are kind of squatty in comparison...

psychotrip

supaskrub wrote: »

After reading just about every post in this thread I conclude that very many folks think that "Lore" is a factual account, that's just not how Lore evolves through the ages, one mans original account is his own interpretation and description of what he sees and feels, it is not fact and does not make it fact. As years progress Lore becomes exaggerated much like Chinese Whispers.

Walls are not made of poetry or crystal but one would be quite in order to use those words if it was stunning, if the walls were made of the stone of a similar material to Quartz or a polished Marble then it would indeed look poetic and could be described as being built of poetry as describing something as "poetry" does not just apply to a written verse but can also apply to something being visually wonderful or skilled.

Read my sig. And as many of us have said in previous posts, this goes beyond just the architecture. There are so many interesting aspects of Altmer lore, technology, and society that just seem like they've been thrown in the garbage.

Hallothiel

Faulgor wrote: »

Time for a little quiz! Can you guys pick the odd one out?

2) Is the only real 'castle' although was built by a mad king heavily under the influence of Wagnerian myths & romantic medievalism. Was the inspiration for 4) the Disney one. And also has influenced quite a lot a fantasy about castles. Most castles that are really medieval are rarely that picturesque, usually having big walls for defence and not so much of the decorative spindly towers.

Still trying to work out what a building made out of 'insect wings' would look like without cringing or being slighty icked out.:)

(The phrase just makes me imagine its made of actual dead insect wings, gleefully pulled off live butterflies, dragonflies and such like by psychotic altmer architects and their minions. :0)

XomRhoK

There is no chance that 3D models of the building will be redone, but ZOS can change some textures. For example they can make roof tiles made of glass, that used in armor.
It can be only on major buildings:

Or at all buildings:

I think it's pretty easy to do, and it will add uniqueness to the Summerset towns and will fit lore: "made from glass or insect wings" and "a hypnotic swirl of ramparts and impossibly high towers, designed to catch the light of the sun and break it to its component colors, which lies draped across its stones until you are thankful for nightfall".

Ostacia

^ Pretty! I hope they take your advice! Maybe even add in a rainbow or three.

Bansidhe1965

XomRhoK wrote: »

There is no chance that 3D models of the building will be redone, but ZOS can change some textures. For example they can make roof tiles made of glass, that used in armor.
It can be only on major buildings:

Or at all buildings:

I think it's pretty easy to do, and it will add uniqueness to the Summerset towns and will fit lore: "made from glass or insect wings" and "a hypnotic swirl of ramparts and impossibly high towers, designed to catch the light of the sun and break it to its component colors, which lies draped across its stones until you are thankful for nightfall".

Looks better,love it in fact !

psychotrip

Hallothiel wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

Time for a little quiz! Can you guys pick the odd one out?

2) Is the only real 'castle' although was built by a mad king heavily under the influence of Wagnerian myths & romantic medievalism. Was the inspiration for 4) the Disney one. And also has influenced quite a lot a fantasy about castles. Most castles that are really medieval are rarely that picturesque, usually having big walls for defence and not so much of the decorative spindly towers.

Still trying to work out what a building made out of 'insect wings' would look like without cringing or being slighty icked out.:)

(The phrase just makes me imagine its made of actual dead insect wings, gleefully pulled off live butterflies, dragonflies and such like by psychotic altmer architects and their minions. :0)

You're focusing way too much on the insect wing part. I always imagined that as a layman trying to explain flowing, organic-looking, stained glass. Or maybe there's a lot of diaphanous, colorful wing-like structures in place of windows. ANYTHING would be more creative and "elven" than this.

We're not saying EVERYTHING needs to be 100% literal. This is just so far in the opposite direction it's laughable.

temjiu

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

why would an imperial lie about how amazing high elves are though?

Probably because even imperials like to sell their books or articles. embellishment has been a cornerstone of publishing since people have been publishing. real life is kinda boring, so they dress it up a bit.

Though I suppose if you want to really implement a lore element from the Imperial perspective, you could embellish on the elvish culture from a negative viewpoint..."They think they're all high and might with this amazing design and yada yada..who do the high elves think they are?!?"

But either way, There's no reason why an Imperial wouldn't want to make a name for himself as a writer or historian, and addressing one of the biggest cultural impacts in the ES worlds history would be a solid way to do that.

psychotrip

temjiu wrote: »

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

why would an imperial lie about how amazing high elves are though?

Probably because even imperials like to sell their books or articles. embellishment has been a cornerstone of publishing since people have been publishing. real life is kinda boring, so they dress it up a bit.

Though I suppose if you want to really implement a lore element from the Imperial perspective, you could embellish on the elvish culture from a negative viewpoint..."They think they're all high and might with this amazing design and yada yada..who do the high elves think they are?!?"

But either way, There's no reason why an Imperial wouldn't want to make a name for himself as a writer or historian, and addressing one of the biggest cultural impacts in the ES worlds history would be a solid way to do that.

What you've described is still the most boring scenario possible. Zenimax CHOSE to make all the more bizarre aspects of the altmer nothing but "exaggerations". Now they're closer to pointy eared humans than anything else. Now, it makes no sense that this culture was somehow so advanced that only a giant robot god could conquer it. Now, Summerset is just another medieval-ish european landscape, because we certainly don't have enough of those in Tamriel.

Bansidhe1965

I must say I was a bit dissapointed,in a new fantasy game I always check out the lore a bit of any "Elven" race,here it sounded good as you can read above Weird,a touch scary and fabulous cities and fashion

Thank goodness I thought and made my first char. Altmer/mag/sorc looking forward to all those goodies to come,I won't change her as I get attached to my chars but I end up with an Elf wearing carrot cruncher clothes,( I am so going for glass on that),living in a Norman,narrow windowed,touch of minimal gothic house.

Also,could they not do some high elf themed mounts,Elks,intricatly tacked horses etc,rather than a cat with it's legs on fire and a semi visible horse ?

Like I say I'm sticking with Altmer as the lore is good,the visuals could do with a bit more artsyness and style and i'll be doing that with a glass wardrobe,choice of mount and the furnishings in my High Elf Manor once it arrives

Heres to hoping for amazing houses ....I want stained glass!

psychotrip

Bansidhe1965 wrote: »

I must say I was a bit dissapointed,in a new fantasy game I always check out the lore a bit of any "Elven" race,here it sounded good as you can read above Weird,a touch scary and fabulous cities and fashion

Thank goodness I thought and made my first char. Altmer/mag/sorc looking forward to all those goodies to come,I won't change her as I get attached to my chars but I end up with an Elf wearing carrot cruncher clothes,( I am so going for glass on that),living in a Norman,narrow windowed,touch of minimal gothic house.

Also,could they not do some high elf themed mounts,Elks,intricatly tacked horses etc,rather than a cat with it's legs on fire and a semi visible horse ?

Like I say I'm sticking with Altmer as the lore is good,the visuals could do with a bit more artsyness and style and i'll be doing that with a glass wardrobe,choice of mount and the furnishings in my High Elf Manor once it arrives

Heres to hoping for amazing houses ....I want stained glass!

Well, since none of that lore seems to be canon anywhere (just exaggerations), I think you're out of luck bud. I'm the same way though. One of the first things I do when getting into a new fantasy race is examine the way they treat elves. One of the big reasons I got into ES in the first place.

MLGProPlayer

Faulgor wrote: »

Time for a little quiz! Can you guys pick the odd one out?

And all those places are *** magical.

MLGProPlayer

Casowen wrote: »

psychotrip wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

Time for a little quiz! Can you guys pick the odd one out?

Jeez. This really sinks in how uninspired the art style is. At least Anor Londo felt like a sprawling metropolis. And even though it was abandoned, it looked better maintained.

Its funny since this is really actually german and scandinavian architecture, and guess what nord-esque thing we already have in game for the elder scrolls. You guessed it, SKYRIM! Same with the all to obvious gothic armor with is germanic in origin. Are ESO high elves just more evolved nords? Or is this skyrim the prequal?

The Nords are modeled after 10th century vikings.

The high elves seem to be modeled after 18th century Germany/France.

Yes, technically these are all "Germanic" cultures, but their architecture isn't even remotely similar.