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Premade groups are ruining battlegrounds...

  • bakermir
    bakermir
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    No
    wheem_ESO wrote: »
    bakermir wrote: »
    Seraphayel wrote: »
    ... do they? I think so. It's no fun to deal with one or even two premade groups in battlegrounds.

    Why is there no option to prevent this? 1 and 2 players should count as "single" and 3 and 4 player groups should count as group and be treated as such when it comes to matchmaking.

    And no, it is no solution to counter premade groups with the argument "go look for a group yourself".

    This just sounds like people saying "faction lock is good for AvA!!1"

    People like you complaining about other players teaming up in a MMO game is ruining this game.

    Getting owned by premade groups? Make your own one then.

    We all walk the same path.

    I switched from WoW few months ago after 10 years of playing it because of players like you turning the game into single player grind fiesta.

    I hope ZOS reverts faction lock too.
    Could I put together a premade group? Yes. Do I want to run in a premade group that will frequently be facing off against solo queued players who may not even get a full team? Absolutely not.

    I'll group queue when there are other premades running, but even then sometimes you'll get into different games than they do. Being on either end of a "pug stomp" is boring, and I honestly don't understand how some people just don't get that.

    We already have faction lock now and you guys want battleground lock added to it.

    Yeah, lets remove all the builds and gears while are at it. Why not? Just make everyone clone of each other because being competitive is "boring" to you people.
    EU PC SOTHA SIL/BAHLOKDAAN
    • DC * imperial stamdk/emperor magdk * twitch-bakermir
    • DC * breton magsorc * twitch bakermir
    • DC * orcerer * Tyro Tyro Tyro Tyro
    • DC * altmer bomblade * Brings-you-democracy

    <REMOVE FACTION LOCK>
  • jcm2606
    jcm2606
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    Yes
    The solution isn't even solo queue, the solution is just to move group matching off of MMR onto its own variable. The entire reason why solo queues are matching against premades is because Zenimax, in their infinite wisdom, decided it was a brilliant idea to inflate the performance ranking metric based on group size.


    The only thing separating premades from solo queues is, assuming everyone is at the same performance level, the premade has higher MMR due to inflation. That's it. If the solo queue is better than all the premade players combined, their MMR is naturally higher than the premade's, so they can match against the premade. If the solo queue has been sitting in the queue for eons, the queue is so relaxed when it comes to matching via MMR, that they can match against the premade.

    Remove MMR inflation from groups, create a new ranking metric based on group size that works alongside MMR to determine optimal matching, and watch as solo queues suddenly only match against the occasional duo, and maybe rarely a 3-man, depending on how the new ranking metric works.
    @jcm2606 | PC NA | CP 1000+ | Stormproof | Boethia's Scythe
  • MaxJrFTW
    MaxJrFTW
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    Yes
    My 1st game of the day. Not even with my main, this is with an alt that has a total of 78 bgs played. Competitive ESO ya'll.

    yFp4TAM.jpg
    Edited by MaxJrFTW on July 14, 2019 9:03PM
    "I don't know you, and I don't care to know you."
    ―Ulrich Leland, 3E 433
  • karekiz
    karekiz
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    Yes
    MaxJrFTW wrote: »
    My 1st game of the day. Not even with my main, this is with an alt that has a total of 78 bgs played. Competitive ESO ya'll.

    I agree with you. Its a tad silly.


    By "Competitive" most mean pug stomp to feelz good, then turn around and say the other team should have got gud and had 4 perfectly OP breaking synergy setups premade into their group.

    Thats why Arena mode needs to be made and Battlegrounds should be made for casual play.

    Ohh wait I guess people are hesitant to just say the truth. If an Arena mode would exist it would have like 20 players max and essentially be dead in a month or two.
    Edited by karekiz on July 15, 2019 3:24PM
  • ChunkyCat
    ChunkyCat
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    Yes
    MaxJrFTW wrote: »
    My 1st game of the day. Not even with my main, this is with an alt that has a total of 78 bgs played. Competitive ESO ya'll.

    yFp4TAM.jpg

    Should’ve got gud and Learnt 2P.
  • MaxJrFTW
    MaxJrFTW
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    Yes
    CoMpEtITiVe pVp!

    dCXD9uk.jpg
    "I don't know you, and I don't care to know you."
    ―Ulrich Leland, 3E 433
  • Thogard
    Thogard
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    No
    MaxJrFTW wrote: »
    CoMpEtITiVe pVp!

    dCXD9uk.jpg

    Red team is just a duo
    PC NA - Thogard / Sir Thogalot / Thoggy Boi jr / Thogaine / El Thogardo

    twitch.tv/ThogardPvP
  • nejcn001
    nejcn001
    Groups of 4 should always be queued with other group of 4...no?
  • Thogard
    Thogard
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    No
    Thogard wrote: »
    MaxJrFTW wrote: »
    CoMpEtITiVe pVp!

    dCXD9uk.jpg

    Red team is just a duo

    “Just a duo” is still broken in teams of 4. Two players with synchronized builds working together, especially players who a practiced at working together, creates a huge advantage in a battleground full of solos.

    Yeah I agree. I just wanted to point out that it’s a duo not a 4 man.
    PC NA - Thogard / Sir Thogalot / Thoggy Boi jr / Thogaine / El Thogardo

    twitch.tv/ThogardPvP
  • Iskiab
    Iskiab
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    No
    Did three games today with premades in all three. Won one, second in another, last in the third.

    Stick with it. People premade for the same reasons they do in pve, to avoid new players. I see very little coordinated class/spec premades and they’re mostly just people playing together who’re experienced.

    It can be rough solo queuing and getting an extremely weak team but there are good solo queuers too. Focus more on your own skills instead of trying to get the game to cater to how you like to play.

    People can’t control how you play, people are free to do what they want, they need to be able to control who they play with.
    Edited by Iskiab on July 19, 2019 1:25AM
    Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
    Havoc Warhammer - Alair
    LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
    Condemned and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
    Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten
  • Weesacs
    Weesacs
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    Yes
    Iskiab wrote: »
    People can’t control how you play, people are free to do what they want, they need to be able to control who they play with.

    I'm pretty sure no one is asking for premades to be removed from BGs. People are asking for a fairer system with separate queues and a much more improved MMR system.
    Argonian Templar Healer
    PS4 - EU - DC
    Over 31,000 Achievements!
  • ChunkyCat
    ChunkyCat
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    Yes
    Test

    Edit: I passed.
    Edited by ChunkyCat on July 20, 2019 2:31AM
  • MaxJrFTW
    MaxJrFTW
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    Yes
    exeeter702 wrote: »
    I find it hilarious that "make your own premade" is used as some kind of rebuttal, implying that high level premade BG endeavors are in any way tactical or indicative of some kind of advanced execution or demonstration of skill. Placing eso pvp Under the microscope of small scale instanced no cp focus, without the convenience of large scale random nonsesne equalizers of cyrodil, clearly demonstrates the core fundamental problems with the pvp structure in this game.

    The sweatiest of premades are not losing to randomly formed teams, anyone who says otherwise is blowing smoke or not experienced in the catagory enough to offer an opinion worth listening to. But organized 4v4v4 premade bgs are an absolute *** show in their own right, full stop.

    Separating premade from solo queues is a bandaid patch to what is otherwise the bullet wound that is small scale instanced pvp in eso.

    Such eloquence.
    "I don't know you, and I don't care to know you."
    ―Ulrich Leland, 3E 433
  • Iskiab
    Iskiab
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    No
    MaxJrFTW wrote: »
    exeeter702 wrote: »
    I find it hilarious that "make your own premade" is used as some kind of rebuttal, implying that high level premade BG endeavors are in any way tactical or indicative of some kind of advanced execution or demonstration of skill. Placing eso pvp Under the microscope of small scale instanced no cp focus, without the convenience of large scale random nonsesne equalizers of cyrodil, clearly demonstrates the core fundamental problems with the pvp structure in this game.

    The sweatiest of premades are not losing to randomly formed teams, anyone who says otherwise is blowing smoke or not experienced in the catagory enough to offer an opinion worth listening to. But organized 4v4v4 premade bgs are an absolute *** show in their own right, full stop.

    Separating premade from solo queues is a bandaid patch to what is otherwise the bullet wound that is small scale instanced pvp in eso.

    Such eloquence.

    I’m still not sure what he means though. Something about small scale, ESO pvp uses bandaids, and he doesn’t like premades I think.
    Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
    Havoc Warhammer - Alair
    LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
    Condemned and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
    Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten
  • ChunkyCat
    ChunkyCat
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    Yes
    I always run my builds with a handkerchief, specifically to counter the sweatiness.

    Never leave home without it.
  • Iskiab
    Iskiab
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    No
    Aurielle wrote: »
    Iskiab wrote: »
    MaxJrFTW wrote: »
    exeeter702 wrote: »
    I find it hilarious that "make your own premade" is used as some kind of rebuttal, implying that high level premade BG endeavors are in any way tactical or indicative of some kind of advanced execution or demonstration of skill. Placing eso pvp Under the microscope of small scale instanced no cp focus, without the convenience of large scale random nonsesne equalizers of cyrodil, clearly demonstrates the core fundamental problems with the pvp structure in this game.

    The sweatiest of premades are not losing to randomly formed teams, anyone who says otherwise is blowing smoke or not experienced in the catagory enough to offer an opinion worth listening to. But organized 4v4v4 premade bgs are an absolute *** show in their own right, full stop.

    Separating premade from solo queues is a bandaid patch to what is otherwise the bullet wound that is small scale instanced pvp in eso.

    Such eloquence.

    I’m still not sure what he means though. Something about small scale, ESO pvp uses bandaids, and he doesn’t like premades I think.

    The post is very clear. ESO’s PVP was designed around the concept of large scale battles, not small scale. Small scale PVP in this game is completely broken, thanks to sets that were designed with mindless zerging in mind and poor balance decisions. When you have well-optimized, evenly-matched small groups facing one another and running cheese, the result is typically a drawn-out stalemate. “Sweaty” premades (i.e. those stacking the cheesiest sets, who run BGs all day long to get their jollies from pug stomping) aren’t losing to randoms. When you beat a premade group with random players whose builds do not complement each other, it’s not a measure of your own skill; it means you’re playing against a bad premade, not a sweaty premade that’s using cheese and complementary sets/builds.

    No offense, but posts like this just scream ‘I can’t do it so it can’t be done’. I’m a solo queuer with over a 50% win rate in high MMR.
    Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
    Havoc Warhammer - Alair
    LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
    Condemned and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
    Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten
  • Iskiab
    Iskiab
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    No
    I usually play on off-peak hours. When I do play during peak hours I’ll get team mates who’re pure BGers.

    I’m at 1k BGs played+.

    Being a healer, granted that helps.
    Edited by Iskiab on July 25, 2019 1:21PM
    Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
    Havoc Warhammer - Alair
    LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
    Condemned and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
    Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten
  • Aurielle
    Aurielle
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    Yes
    Iskiab wrote: »
    I usually play on off-peak hours. When I do play during peak hours I’ll get team mates who’re pure BGers.

    I’m at 1k BGs played+.

    Being a healer, granted that helps.

    On April 12, you posted this:
    Iskiab wrote: »
    BRODY wrote: »
    How i can know my MMR?

    You can’t know, most people are guessing I think.

    I was trying to figure mine out but it’s hard. I’ve been playing 9 months now and have done the daily almost every day, sometimes that’s it and other days I’ll spam BGs. I have no idea how many games I’ve played, maybe 400-1k?

    My wait times are less than 5 minutes. I think most of the MMR complaints are actually about premade queue times but it’s hard to tell. I queue at different times of the day and the wait isn’t too long, apparently when the hidden MMR value gets too high it limits your matches to other players in high MMR so the wait times are long.

    In three months, you’ve gone from not being at all certain if you’ve played 400 or 1000 matches (and that’s quite the wide possible range), to stating definitively now that you’ve played 1k+ matches. Which is it?
  • ChunkyCat
    ChunkyCat
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    Yes
    Am I at the beach?

    I can smell the saltiness in the air.
  • MaxJrFTW
    MaxJrFTW
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    Yes
    Aurielle wrote: »
    Iskiab wrote: »
    I usually play on off-peak hours. When I do play during peak hours I’ll get team mates who’re pure BGers.

    I’m at 1k BGs played+.

    Being a healer, granted that helps.

    On April 12, you posted this:
    Iskiab wrote: »
    BRODY wrote: »
    How i can know my MMR?

    You can’t know, most people are guessing I think.

    I was trying to figure mine out but it’s hard. I’ve been playing 9 months now and have done the daily almost every day, sometimes that’s it and other days I’ll spam BGs. I have no idea how many games I’ve played, maybe 400-1k?

    My wait times are less than 5 minutes. I think most of the MMR complaints are actually about premade queue times but it’s hard to tell. I queue at different times of the day and the wait isn’t too long, apparently when the hidden MMR value gets too high it limits your matches to other players in high MMR so the wait times are long.

    In three months, you’ve gone from not being at all certain if you’ve played 400 or 1000 matches (and that’s quite the wide possible range), to stating definitively now that you’ve played 1k+ matches. Which is it?

    When i started doing bgs i was doing 10+ every day because queues were instant. In fact, my queues were pretty much instant until i started approaching 1k games. My point is you can very easily play over 500 bgs in 3 months if that's your main activity within the game.
    "I don't know you, and I don't care to know you."
    ―Ulrich Leland, 3E 433
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