Look at how many people hate the appearance of vampirism!!!

Storymaster

Still waiting for:

Storymaster

(Argh. Double post.)

MLGProPlayer

Slick_007 wrote: »

so people want to be a vampire but not look like a vampire? that seems very illogical
and to those claiming 'i dont want it, but i need...' - you want to be a vampire because you want the perks.

as someone said, dont want to be a vamp, dont be a vamp. you shouldnt be able to have it both ways.

But again, the perks are gameplay-related, and pretty much mandatory for serious endgame content. You don't really have a choice in becoming a vampire. If you want the strongest character possible, you need to be a vampire.

That's a problem. The drawback for a required gameplay buff is looking ugly, In an MMO, where maintaining your appearance is half the appeal of the game...

Gameplay perks should come with gameplay drawbacks. RP perks should come with RP drawbacks. The two need to be kept separate.

Vizikul

Just out of curiosity, does the decreased incoming dmg passive also apply to incoming fire dmg?

MLGProPlayer

Storymaster wrote: »

Still waiting for:

That's a dunmer.

Cadbury

Storymaster wrote: »

(Argh. Double post.)

Is that the Nosferatu from V:TM?

MLGProPlayer

Vizikul wrote: »

Just out of curiosity, does the decreased incoming dmg passive also apply to incoming fire dmg?

CP passives that reduce elemental damage largely negate the increased fire damage debuff of vampirism (not that it was ever particularly debilitating).

Storymaster

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

That's a dunmer.

You're a dunmer.

Vizikul

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Vizikul wrote: »

Just out of curiosity, does the decreased incoming dmg passive also apply to incoming fire dmg?

CP passives that reduce elemental damage largely negate the increased fire damage debuff of vampirism (not that it was ever particularly debilitating).

ok but what about the undead passive of the vampire skill line itself?

Aliyavana

Slick_007 wrote: »

so people want to be a vampire but not look like a vampire? that seems very illogical
and to those claiming 'i dont want it, but i need...' - you want to be a vampire because you want the perks.

as someone said, dont want to be a vamp, dont be a vamp. you shouldnt be able to have it both ways.

Lore makes it pretty logical

Doctordarkspawn

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Don't want to look like a corpse?

Don't become a Vampire!

Simples!

All The Best

"All the best" sod off with your faux polite ending there.

We have a basis for lore, we have had glitches that can do it, it's not that it's not possible, and aside from entitled jerkwads like you who dont want people to have nice things because you need to feel good about yourself, there's no reason to give us an option.

All the best.

bloodthirstyvampire

Cadbury wrote: »

bloodthirstyvampire wrote: »

BrightOblivion wrote: »

bloodthirstyvampire wrote: »

Hey maybe I like lookin like a monster am a vampire a blood sucking monster

And literally nothing I'd suggest or support would negatively impact you or those who like the look. It'd just also give those who don't a means to be content as well.

Thus "optional skin," not "complete appearance overhaul."

Sure if the trash in rivenspire can do it we should too

Hey, Verandis was cool. Better than those other two yahoos from Shornhelm.

Its Lamae bal and those who serve her everything else is trash

TheShadowScout

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Look at how many people hate the appearance of vampirism!!!

...then they should not have gone "sucker" and stayed alive and rosy-cheeked!

I mean, yeah, I get it, there's tons of people who think they should be able to have it all, the vampire boni, and the pleasing mortal appereance. People who think they should not have to choose.

Personally, I think ZOS should make the choices -mean- more.

Sure, I would like to see some way for player vampires to "masquerade" as mortals. Count Ravenwatch does it the first time we meet him, so it ought to be possible to keep the lore consistent.
But seeing he stops doing it when things get iffy, I also think there should be some drawbacks. Like, it being a skill that you need to give up a skill slot for. Like, it only lowering your appearance level by one, so it would only get "mortal looks" when used at stage one. Best both of the above, to show why most vampires in the game just don't bother.

And I would want more effects around the whole vampire thijng in general. Once there is a "masquerade" option, incentive for vamps to use it, by giving the justice guards a chance to spot the "bloodsucking fiend" in their mids and go all "van helsing" on any revealed vamp... say, 20% at stage 1, 40% at stage 2, 80% at stage 3 and automatic at stage four...

Then, give all vampires a chance to loose control, go "feral" and auto-attack innocents at stage 4 from unbearable bloodthirst...

Oh, and while we're at it, reduce vampire swimming speed to 20% of the usual, give them a good reason to avoid "running water" to make the vampire story enthusiasts smile... (personally I would also add a stun chance if attacked by bow skills, since arrors and stakes do have some things in common...)

Heck, I even would like to see a general buff to vampire abilities at nighttime, but a grave weakening of them during daytime. For the classic "creature of the night" feel. Wouldn't go so far as todemand daylight damage (since the classic dracula was quite undamaged by daylight as I recall, he just lost his supernatural powers or something - only with vampire movies came the "deus ex machine/solar" to let the heroes snatch victory from the jaws of defeat at the end of the movie...)

Oh, and while I am rambling about vamps - give them the bloodfiend teleport to atack range skill as well. Just for lore reasons.
And possibly... some skill that lets them "charm" villagers and feed from them without alering the law (as long as noone else sees it).
And maybe a passive that makes other bloodfiends neutral to them... never sat all that right with me when these attacked player vampires as if they were mortals anyhow...

And perhaps add a "vampire only" location (refit the sanctum from the initiation quest for everyday use?) where vampires can gather, find willing blood dolls, buy vampire specific gear sets from a special vampire vendor, interact with fellow vampire players and NPCs without fear of vampire hunters or need to masquerade, etc.

But hey, that's just my thoughts and ramblings...

Banana

Nerf vampires

Cadbury

Banana wrote: »

Nerf bananas

FTFY

Banana

Looking like *** is the only downside.

gepe87

I use Amberplasm skin on vamps...Never again being worried about how vamp looks.

Korah_Eaglecry

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Don't want to look like a corpse?

Don't become a Vampire!

Simples!

All The Best

The problem is that ZOS attached insanely powerful endgame buffs to being a vampire.

So?

If you want those buffs put up with looking like a corpse.

I can't stand looking like a corpse so my end-game MagPlar is not a Vampire.

Simples.

All The Best

But this is an MMO.

MMOs are about min-maxing for endgame and looking good. You shouldn't have to decide between the two. That's bad MMO game design.

Gameplay benefits should only have gameplay drawbacks. Right now, you are punished, pretty severely, for caring how you character looks, in an MMO.

MMOs has never been about min-maxing and looking good. They have notoriously been the opposite. Min-maxing and looking like garbage because its more about best in slot than what looks good with each other. The only thing to help balance that out has been dyes. But its always been more about BiS than looking pretty.

At the end of the day, if you want to look pretty. You drop Vampirism. If you want to Min-Max than you accept looking ugly. These threads are nothing more than players wanting their cake and to eat it too.

Tonturri

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Don't want to look like a corpse?

Don't become a Vampire!

Simples!

All The Best

The problem is that ZOS attached insanely powerful endgame buffs to being a vampire.

So?

If you want those buffs put up with looking like a corpse.

I can't stand looking like a corpse so my end-game MagPlar is not a Vampire.

Simples.

All The Best

But this is an MMO.

MMOs are about min-maxing for endgame and looking good. You shouldn't have to decide between the two. That's bad MMO game design.

Gameplay benefits should only have gameplay drawbacks. Right now, you are punished, pretty severely, for caring how you character looks, in an MMO.

MMOs has never been about min-maxing and looking good. They have notoriously been the opposite. Min-maxing and looking like garbage because its more about best in slot than what looks good with each other. The only thing to help balance that out has been dyes. But its always been more about BiS than looking pretty.

At the end of the day, if you want to look pretty. You drop Vampirism. If you want to Min-Max than you accept looking ugly. These threads are nothing more than players wanting their cake and to eat it too.

....Why? It is very, very far from an unreasonable request.

"It's always been this way." Is not a valid argument. Things change. And so on and so forth, you can google this fallacy.

Nor is stating how things currently are like it's some sort of fact that serves as the evidence to support reasoning on why it should continue to exist in that manner.

Why do min-maxing and looking good have to be mutually exclusive? O.o

Korah_Eaglecry

Tonturri wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Don't want to look like a corpse?

Don't become a Vampire!

Simples!

All The Best

The problem is that ZOS attached insanely powerful endgame buffs to being a vampire.

So?

If you want those buffs put up with looking like a corpse.

I can't stand looking like a corpse so my end-game MagPlar is not a Vampire.

Simples.

All The Best

But this is an MMO.

MMOs are about min-maxing for endgame and looking good. You shouldn't have to decide between the two. That's bad MMO game design.

Gameplay benefits should only have gameplay drawbacks. Right now, you are punished, pretty severely, for caring how you character looks, in an MMO.

MMOs has never been about min-maxing and looking good. They have notoriously been the opposite. Min-maxing and looking like garbage because its more about best in slot than what looks good with each other. The only thing to help balance that out has been dyes. But its always been more about BiS than looking pretty.

At the end of the day, if you want to look pretty. You drop Vampirism. If you want to Min-Max than you accept looking ugly. These threads are nothing more than players wanting their cake and to eat it too.

....Why? It is very, very far from an unreasonable request.

"It's always been this way." Is not a valid argument. Things change. And so on and so forth, you can google this fallacy.

Nor is stating how things currently are like it's some sort of fact that serves as the evidence to support reasoning on why it should continue to exist in that manner.

Why do min-maxing and looking good have to be mutually exclusive? O.o

You dont get to decide what is and isnt a valid argument. Things do change, but they havent changed in regards to this. You have your means to look normal, by feeding. Again, this boils down to wanting your cake and eating it too. You entered into the deal that was vampirism knowing full well the consequences in exchange for its benefits. You accepted the appearance changes. And now you want them taken away so you can continue to enjoy the benefits while running around places like Cyrodiil and not giving away what you are.

ArcaneBlue

I wonder.
why do many people keep bringing up "looking ugly" IS the drawback/consequence/tradeoff of being a vampire?
I thought the drawbacks were being susceptible to fire and health regen debuff, not the ugliness. (I am aware there are people who enjoy the look of stage 3-4 though)
vampire characters live with those actual gameplay debuffs_ and looking pasty with blue/purple veins is just aesthetics, do vampires really have to give up on looking the way they want to look like, when they already accepted they have to be susceptible to fire and have less health regen?

and my attempt at countering "but you shouldn't be able to run around not looking like a vampire in cyrodiil while still enjoying the benefits"_ I put a full face mask (hollowjack) and the thieves guild costume on one of my characters, no way to tell if the character is a vampire or not by just having a quick look at him. people can wear 7 pieces of light armour and put a lion guard costume on. or 7 pieces of heavy armour and high rock pioneer outfit. there already are many ways to "fool" or trick your eyes.

my 2 cents.

CromulentForumID

Sotha_Sil wrote: »

Skoomah wrote: »

There has to be consequences for being vampire scum.

what about the debuffs? how many times do we have to say it?

Let's be a bit honest on this one, though. Everybody and their brother would not be running around as a vamp if the drawbacks were in the same ballpark as the benefits. You wouldn't hear about this issue over and over and over and over and over if The benefits weren't far superior to the little bit you need to give up.

ZOS makes plenty of concessions for appearance, so I'm not about to argue against hiding vampirism. I can run around with the benefits of full armor while wearing a towel, so we're well past the point of realism.

However, let's also not pretend that you're giving up the same amount you're getting here. That's just disingenuous.

If it were up to me, vampires and werewolves would not be a thing we could be at all in this game - unless you wanted to deal with the same drawbacks the single player games imposed. That would be a real cost-benefit decision.

Aliyavana

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Don't want to look like a corpse?

Don't become a Vampire!

Simples!

All The Best

The problem is that ZOS attached insanely powerful endgame buffs to being a vampire.

So?

If you want those buffs put up with looking like a corpse.

I can't stand looking like a corpse so my end-game MagPlar is not a Vampire.

Simples.

All The Best

But this is an MMO.

MMOs are about min-maxing for endgame and looking good. You shouldn't have to decide between the two. That's bad MMO game design.

Gameplay benefits should only have gameplay drawbacks. Right now, you are punished, pretty severely, for caring how you character looks, in an MMO.

MMOs has never been about min-maxing and looking good. They have notoriously been the opposite. Min-maxing and looking like garbage because its more about best in slot than what looks good with each other. The only thing to help balance that out has been dyes. But its always been more about BiS than looking pretty.

At the end of the day, if you want to look pretty. You drop Vampirism. If you want to Min-Max than you accept looking ugly. These threads are nothing more than players wanting their cake and to eat it too.

Wow introduced transmog so ppl didn't look the same in bis gear

Tonturri

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Tonturri wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Don't want to look like a corpse?

Don't become a Vampire!

Simples!

All The Best

The problem is that ZOS attached insanely powerful endgame buffs to being a vampire.

So?

If you want those buffs put up with looking like a corpse.

I can't stand looking like a corpse so my end-game MagPlar is not a Vampire.

Simples.

All The Best

But this is an MMO.

MMOs are about min-maxing for endgame and looking good. You shouldn't have to decide between the two. That's bad MMO game design.

Gameplay benefits should only have gameplay drawbacks. Right now, you are punished, pretty severely, for caring how you character looks, in an MMO.

MMOs has never been about min-maxing and looking good. They have notoriously been the opposite. Min-maxing and looking like garbage because its more about best in slot than what looks good with each other. The only thing to help balance that out has been dyes. But its always been more about BiS than looking pretty.

At the end of the day, if you want to look pretty. You drop Vampirism. If you want to Min-Max than you accept looking ugly. These threads are nothing more than players wanting their cake and to eat it too.

....Why? It is very, very far from an unreasonable request.

"It's always been this way." Is not a valid argument. Things change. And so on and so forth, you can google this fallacy.

Nor is stating how things currently are like it's some sort of fact that serves as the evidence to support reasoning on why it should continue to exist in that manner.

Why do min-maxing and looking good have to be mutually exclusive? O.o

You dont get to decide what is and isnt a valid argument. Things do change, but they havent changed in regards to this. You have your means to look normal, by feeding. Again, this boils down to wanting your cake and eating it too. You entered into the deal that was vampirism knowing full well the consequences in exchange for its benefits. You accepted the appearance changes. And now you want them taken away so you can continue to enjoy the benefits while running around places like Cyrodiil and not giving away what you are.

Things do change, but they havent changed in regards to this

Just because something is currently the way it is does not mean it cannot change. Or may I assume that you're just restating how vampirism is currently implemented into the game because you think I'm unaware? I assure you, I'm well aware of what acquiring vamp does.

Are you really against vamps looking mortal, or am I just wasting my time arguing with someone on my side? o.o Would you have any complaint at all if stage 1 = full mortal look was implemented tomorrow?

You have your means to look normal, by feeding

This is incorrect. Stage 1 vamp still looks vamps/does not look completely, heck even somewhat close to the 'mortal' appearance. However, I'd be fine if this was the case.

Again, this boils down to wanting your cake and eating it too.

I even googled this to make sure I had it down - you need to explain why the two have to be/are mutually exclusive. Just saying this over and over doesn't really do much. I -can- look fab and still min-max. I am doing it in other areas of the game and in other games. Why not vamp?

You entered into the deal that was vampirism knowing full well the consequences in exchange for its benefits. You accepted the appearance changes. And now you want them taken away so you can continue to enjoy the benefits while running around places like Cyrodiil and not giving away what you are.

Please stop with the 'you'. I can't tell if it's intentional, but there's a significant difference between 'you' and 'there is'. I barely log onto the game anymore. I 'accepted' nothing (I'm not sure why you're phrasing it this way - using vamp on the rare day I log in does not mean I am somehow unable to say I find flaw with it). Furthermore, logging into the game - or going anywhere, doing anything - doesn't mean I am not allowed to point out what I think are flaws with whatever it is that's there.

And now you want them taken away so you can continue to enjoy the benefits while running around places like Cyrodiil and not giving away what you are

Addons, costumes, widely varied armor motifs, flashy visual effects, and armor that can cover you from head to toe make this one a no go. There are far, far more efficient ways to identify a vamp than by appearance. In short, the appearance is just a cosmetic result of TES lore (and there's lore to support looking mortal as a vamp, too).

MLGProPlayer

Just had the best idea:

You only look like a vampire or werewolf when you slot active skills. Otherwise, you look normal, but can still take advantage of the vampire/werewolf passive abilities.

MLGProPlayer

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Don't want to look like a corpse?

Don't become a Vampire!

Simples!

All The Best

The problem is that ZOS attached insanely powerful endgame buffs to being a vampire.

So?

If you want those buffs put up with looking like a corpse.

I can't stand looking like a corpse so my end-game MagPlar is not a Vampire.

Simples.

All The Best

But this is an MMO.

MMOs are about min-maxing for endgame and looking good. You shouldn't have to decide between the two. That's bad MMO game design.

Gameplay benefits should only have gameplay drawbacks. Right now, you are punished, pretty severely, for caring how you character looks, in an MMO.

MMOs has never been about min-maxing and looking good. They have notoriously been the opposite. Min-maxing and looking like garbage because its more about best in slot than what looks good with each other. The only thing to help balance that out has been dyes. But its always been more about BiS than looking pretty.

At the end of the day, if you want to look pretty. You drop Vampirism. If you want to Min-Max than you accept looking ugly. These threads are nothing more than players wanting their cake and to eat it too.

Nonsense. All MMOs (minus this one) have transmogrification systems (and this one is getting it soon too). Looking good is a primary motivation for playing MMOs and has been for over a decade. Developers wouldn't sell costumes and other cosmetics if it didn't matter.

MLGProPlayer

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

You accepted the appearance changes. And now you want them taken away so you can continue to enjoy the benefits while running around places like Cyrodiil and not giving away what you are.

Invalid argument as you can already hide it with costumes and disguises.

Korah_Eaglecry

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

You accepted the appearance changes. And now you want them taken away so you can continue to enjoy the benefits while running around places like Cyrodiil and not giving away what you are.

Invalid argument as you can already hide it with costumes and disguises.

Invalid argument as you just proved theres no need to remove the appearance. Thanks. Have a good night.

Aliyavana

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

You accepted the appearance changes. And now you want them taken away so you can continue to enjoy the benefits while running around places like Cyrodiil and not giving away what you are.

Invalid argument as you can already hide it with costumes and disguises.

Invalid argument as you just proved theres no need to remove the appearance. Thanks. Have a good night.

He pretty much is saying you can already hide it, so why not go further and make it so you can wear any armor you like and not look like one without screwing up tats, etc

Beardimus

The problem is vampire should be a choice around RP and theme. Not pretty much compulsory for the stats. When people are vamp who don't want to be, problems start.

That's the root cause here. You should want to be a vamp for the playstyle, the skills, the RP, the look.

Either way Vamps should look like vamps in my book.