Dat Destro Ulti ....

SanTii.92

Joy_Division wrote: »

thankyourat wrote: »

Why does my destro ultimate not work like this lol

Those very few who actually predicted this ultimate would be very strong - and let's not kid ourselves as a community: the vast majority told Wrobel it was underwhelming even after it got buff and people still got the nerve to blame him - have yourself a cookie. But I will point out that I and numerous other people would have *much* preferred a less expensive ultimate that would help burst a target down, which would have created an incentive to use a destruction staff, but less apt to be abused by raids running it.

Thanks Joy

SanTii.92 wrote: »

Rykmaar wrote: »

Thanks Gina,

Nothing this week on ultimates, eh? *sadface.jpg*

Guess we're stuck with that destro ult that no one will use, as well as Shield Wall that everyone will use. Is the dev team happy with them as they are now?

I'm gonna use it, it actually hits really hard.
And eventually meta will catch up to me ^.^

Satiar

The ulti is overtuned but it's hard to care when compared to Stam. Magic builds have one thing right now, without destro ult the balance gets even worse.

Jules

Chuga_Rei wrote: »

Blockade has ignored doors and steep drops forever, as soon as I saw the spell description I figured I would end up reporting it for clipping.

And Anyone who views this as a way for magicka to "get even" with stamina you are doing it wrong. You might as well go respec right now with that attitude to the viper and vele you whine about.

We play magicka for a reason, we enjoy it. Don't drag our collective image through the dirt for the sake of being petty. The stamina chumps running those builds are the ones missing out.

here are my "constructive thoughts"

1: if it's not negatable, it needs to be, period.

2. Instead of immediately casting maybe give it a brief build up(1-1.25 secs) for people to be able to bail if they are quick On their feet.

3. You could even make eye a channeled so it could be bashed like the old remembrance.

I really would rather it stay very hard hitting, but have effective counters.

No one wants an ult you can just sit in and shrug off. Think of the catostrophic damage a single dawnbreaker or bats can cause if people end up stuck in it. It needs to reflect a more expensive version of that, but also not be something so over the top even Stam players could get kills with it.

I could agree with any of these viable counters to the ulti.

ManDraKE

Satiar wrote: »

The ulti is overtuned but it's hard to care when compared to Stam. Magic builds have one thing right now, without destro ult the balance gets even worse.

Adding more broken stuff doesn't help the balance. This game is not Stam vs Magika, you will have to fight both of them, and the OP *** of both of them will rekt you.

SanTii.92

Jules wrote: »

Chuga_Rei wrote: »

Blockade has ignored doors and steep drops forever, as soon as I saw the spell description I figured I would end up reporting it for clipping.

And Anyone who views this as a way for magicka to "get even" with stamina you are doing it wrong. You might as well go respec right now with that attitude to the viper and vele you whine about.

We play magicka for a reason, we enjoy it. Don't drag our collective image through the dirt for the sake of being petty. The stamina chumps running those builds are the ones missing out.

here are my "constructive thoughts"

1: if it's not negatable, it needs to be, period.

2. Instead of immediately casting maybe give it a brief build up(1-1.25 secs) for people to be able to bail if they are quick On their feet.

3. You could even make eye a channeled so it could be bashed like the old remembrance.

I really would rather it stay very hard hitting, but have effective counters.

No one wants an ult you can just sit in and shrug off. Think of the catostrophic damage a single dawnbreaker or bats can cause if people end up stuck in it. It needs to reflect a more expensive version of that, but also not be something so over the top even Stam players could get kills with it.

I could agree with any of these viable counters to the ulti.

counter is the high cost and a deffensive stance while on it.

SanTii.92

ManDraKE wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

The ulti is overtuned but it's hard to care when compared to Stam. Magic builds have one thing right now, without destro ult the balance gets even worse.

Adding more broken stuff don't helps the balance. This game is not Stam vs Magika, you will have to fight both of them, and the OP *** of both of them will rekt you.

If everything is OP then nothing is?

Minalan

There's already a 2 second cast on it, the problem is that the circle needs to be a more obvious and darker red. The AOE circle is so large that it sometimes gets missed.

The morph of the ultimate that travels with you should probably do a little less damage per tick than the one that sits still. Area denial should be a thing, like 'stay off the flag or my flank until the ultimate is done'. Allow some strategy in PVP instead of 5-6 player healer ball groups rolling into zergs with eye of the storm up.

Whatever we do, let's not ruin the PVE utility and fun of this ult. I'm actually enjoying using it in dungeons and pledges.

Minno

Chuga_Rei wrote: »

Blockade has ignored doors and steep drops forever, as soon as I saw the spell description I figured I would end up reporting it for clipping.

And Anyone who views this as a way for magicka to "get even" with stamina you are doing it wrong. You might as well go respec right now with that attitude to the viper and vele you whine about.

We play magicka for a reason, we enjoy it. Don't drag our collective image through the dirt for the sake of being petty. The stamina chumps running those builds are the ones missing out.

And since the ice queen himself complained about complainers here are my "constructive thoughts"

1: if it's not negatable, it needs to be, period.

2. Instead of immediately casting maybe give it a brief build up(1-1.25 secs) for people to be able to bail if they are quick On their feet.

3. You could even make eye a channeled so it could be bashed like the old remembrance.

I really would rather it stay very hard hitting, but have effective counters.

No one wants an ult you can just sit in and shrug off. Think of the catostrophic damage a single dawnbreaker or bats can cause if people end up stuck in it. It needs to reflect a more expensive version of that, but also not be something so over the top even Stam players could get kills with it.

1) I'm now told negate removes the ground spell and the PBAOE just stops working when used by a negate.

2) the timer would have to benefit Magicka classes at non sprint speed. Stam classes would obviously benefit due to sprint passives in their weapon/armor lines.

3)bashing requires you to be in close range and doesn't solve the ground ability.

I agree it should stay hard hitting. But we need more negates being used in cyro before determining additional balance. Currently I know of only 2 DC toons that used negate heavily in the past week. So if the counter was intended to be this, the player base hasn't adjusted yet.

Need to give the patch a little extra time to adjust.

Koolio

I've been real tired of Stam being able to just stand in my face as a magic class with absolutely no reason to back away. On my sorc I at least have mines. On my nightblade I can fear but then viper/veli takes my health down to nearly nothing then I have to try and recoup just for another proc in 4-9 seconds. Destruction staffs are meant to be better damage at range then others but not when there's no reason for stam classes to back away. This makes jumping on a staff user a Very dangerous decision. Finally. I hope they don't change a thing about this ultimate. 2 Dawnbreakers (same cost) will give just about the same damage. Love this ultimate even though I use the other morph. And an ice staff. Will try this morph now and enjoy the much deserved payback to the stam sorc class in particular. Sorry if my reasons are selfish and not balanced but this at least makes my magic classes strong again. Thank you ZOS

Derra

The_Outsider wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

The_Outsider wrote: »

Lololololol @ all the forum heroes whining about this skill pre-1T...

It´s still a *** skill concept wise. They just buffed it´s dmg to a level to outperform meteor. Just dealing dmg on an ultimate at this stage of the game is stupid bc the amount of dmg it has to deal to be worth considering is too high.

I just can't stop laughing, honestly. Did you read through this thread? Cause I just did, and not 1 month ago half of these people were making threads about how this ult was going to be pointless, and weaker than meteor, and weaker than stamina weapon Ults...
It's just a perfect example of forum heroes who talk really loudly and probably should just spend more time in game. I can't say that I've seen the 2H Ult in my recap a single time.

I just don't want the beautiful, hilarious irony of players calling for nerfs to Eye of the Storm to be lost on the forums.

I made the exact same comments when it was on pts before it got buffed the second time.

I have not seen many ppl complain about it´s dmg potential after it got buffed the second time on pts. However the flawed concept is still unchanged.

Ishammael

Banner down!





Oh wait... Wrong ultimate. Wrong patch.

FloppyTouch

Pvp players are bad at moving out of stupid try running dungeons with them

Akinos

The damage the fire staff version of the destro ult isn't the issue here, imo.
Here's what needs to happen:
It needs to be able to be negated.
It needs to be able to be blocked.
I can't confirm this one but If it can go through walls and doors then that also needs a fix.

Now let's take a look at the facts of the screenshot and damage in question. The OP is a vampire, vampires take 25% more fire damage. 25% more damage from a skill that has a 8k-11k tooltip is huge. The best way to avoid suffering so much damage as a vampire is not attempting to heal through it, but to just mist away from it. 50k damage in 7 seconds is quite a bit. Let's say that the fire morph of meteor wasn't blockable, a vampire would take the same amount of damage, if not more if they were to remain in the in the aoe for it's full duration after the initial unblockable cast of meteor.

I don't think it's the fault of the skill for doing the damage that it does, but the counters to it that are already in game need to actually work how they are supposed to. Seems like ZOS rushed the skill into the game without testing it properly first.

FloppyTouch

ManDraKE wrote: »

"the destro ulti dmg is fine". #1vXingWithoutSkill

https://youtube.com/watch?v=chOOMK8JQhI

That's not 1vxing

Wollust

SanTii.92 wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

The ulti is overtuned but it's hard to care when compared to Stam. Magic builds have one thing right now, without destro ult the balance gets even worse.

Adding more broken stuff don't helps the balance. This game is not Stam vs Magika, you will have to fight both of them, and the OP *** of both of them will rekt you.

If everything is OP then nothing is?

That's not how it works. If everything is OP we end up with 1 or 2 shots left and right and that's not healthy PvP in an MMO.

Akinos

Wollust wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

The ulti is overtuned but it's hard to care when compared to Stam. Magic builds have one thing right now, without destro ult the balance gets even worse.

Adding more broken stuff don't helps the balance. This game is not Stam vs Magika, you will have to fight both of them, and the OP *** of both of them will rekt you.

If everything is OP then nothing is?

That's not how it works. If everything is OP we end up with 1 or 2 shots left and right and that's not healthy PvP in an MMO.

True that, it would be like BDO where the first person to get CC'd in a fight will lose 99.99% of the time. There would be no counterplay. *shudders*

Lucky28

50K? wow. highest i ever took was 16K total

Akinos wrote: »

The damage the fire staff version of the destro ult isn't the issue here, imo.
Here's what needs to happen:
It needs to be able to be negated.
It needs to be able to be blocked.
I can't confirm this one but If it can go through walls and doors then that also needs a fix.

Now let's take a look at the facts of the screenshot and damage in question. The OP is a vampire, vampires take 25% more fire damage. 25% more damage from a skill that has a 8k-11k tooltip is huge. The best way to avoid suffering so much damage as a vampire is not attempting to heal through it, but to just mist away from it. 50k damage in 7 seconds is quite a bit. Let's say that the fire morph of meteor wasn't blockable, a vampire would take the same amount of damage, if not more if they were to remain in the in the aoe for it's full duration after the initial unblockable cast of meteor.

I don't think it's the fault of the skill for doing the damage that it does, but the counters to it that are out there need to actually work how they are supposed to. Seems like ZOS rushed the skill into the game without testing it properly first.

no it doesn't need to be negated. there are already so many ults i don't use because of negate. the destro ult doesn't need to be one of them.

really i think the only problem with the skill is it can sometimes be pretty hard to see. make the ring more pronounced and i think it's good.

Kilandros

For 250 ultimate you shouldn't be able to heal/tank through it tbh. At that cost, you need to move out or accept that you're gonna die.

Akinos

Lucky28 wrote: »

50K? wow. highest i ever took was 16K total

Akinos wrote: »

The damage the fire staff version of the destro ult isn't the issue here, imo.
Here's what needs to happen:
It needs to be able to be negated.
It needs to be able to be blocked.
I can't confirm this one but If it can go through walls and doors then that also needs a fix.

Now let's take a look at the facts of the screenshot and damage in question. The OP is a vampire, vampires take 25% more fire damage. 25% more damage from a skill that has a 8k-11k tooltip is huge. The best way to avoid suffering so much damage as a vampire is not attempting to heal through it, but to just mist away from it. 50k damage in 7 seconds is quite a bit. Let's say that the fire morph of meteor wasn't blockable, a vampire would take the same amount of damage, if not more if they were to remain in the in the aoe for it's full duration after the initial unblockable cast of meteor.

I don't think it's the fault of the skill for doing the damage that it does, but the counters to it that are out there need to actually work how they are supposed to. Seems like ZOS rushed the skill into the game without testing it properly first.

no it doesn't need to be negated. there are already so many ults i don't use because of negate. the destro ult doesn't need to be one of them.

really i think the only problem with the skill is it can sometimes be pretty hard to see. make the ring more pronounced and i think it's good.

I know negate already stops you from casting skills if you are in it, but does negate also stop the damage of an already active ultimate/skill?

Kilandros

Akinos wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

50K? wow. highest i ever took was 16K total

Akinos wrote: »

The damage the fire staff version of the destro ult isn't the issue here, imo.
Here's what needs to happen:
It needs to be able to be negated.
It needs to be able to be blocked.
I can't confirm this one but If it can go through walls and doors then that also needs a fix.

Now let's take a look at the facts of the screenshot and damage in question. The OP is a vampire, vampires take 25% more fire damage. 25% more damage from a skill that has a 8k-11k tooltip is huge. The best way to avoid suffering so much damage as a vampire is not attempting to heal through it, but to just mist away from it. 50k damage in 7 seconds is quite a bit. Let's say that the fire morph of meteor wasn't blockable, a vampire would take the same amount of damage, if not more if they were to remain in the in the aoe for it's full duration after the initial unblockable cast of meteor.

I don't think it's the fault of the skill for doing the damage that it does, but the counters to it that are out there need to actually work how they are supposed to. Seems like ZOS rushed the skill into the game without testing it properly first.

no it doesn't need to be negated. there are already so many ults i don't use because of negate. the destro ult doesn't need to be one of them.

really i think the only problem with the skill is it can sometimes be pretty hard to see. make the ring more pronounced and i think it's good.

I know negate already stops you from casting skills if you are in it, but does negate also stop the damage of an already active ultimate/skill?

Eye of the Storm works like bats and can't be negated once cast. The other morph that is ground targetted can be negated just as every other ground-targetted ultimate, I believe.

I agree with Lucky. Neither the damage nor the cast-on-self components are the issue. The problem is that it's sometimes very difficult to see until it's too late--particularly in lag-heavy fights in tight places.

Akinos

Kilandros wrote: »

Akinos wrote: »

Lucky28 wrote: »

50K? wow. highest i ever took was 16K total

Akinos wrote: »

The damage the fire staff version of the destro ult isn't the issue here, imo.
Here's what needs to happen:
It needs to be able to be negated.
It needs to be able to be blocked.
I can't confirm this one but If it can go through walls and doors then that also needs a fix.

Now let's take a look at the facts of the screenshot and damage in question. The OP is a vampire, vampires take 25% more fire damage. 25% more damage from a skill that has a 8k-11k tooltip is huge. The best way to avoid suffering so much damage as a vampire is not attempting to heal through it, but to just mist away from it. 50k damage in 7 seconds is quite a bit. Let's say that the fire morph of meteor wasn't blockable, a vampire would take the same amount of damage, if not more if they were to remain in the in the aoe for it's full duration after the initial unblockable cast of meteor.

I don't think it's the fault of the skill for doing the damage that it does, but the counters to it that are out there need to actually work how they are supposed to. Seems like ZOS rushed the skill into the game without testing it properly first.

no it doesn't need to be negated. there are already so many ults i don't use because of negate. the destro ult doesn't need to be one of them.

really i think the only problem with the skill is it can sometimes be pretty hard to see. make the ring more pronounced and i think it's good.

I know negate already stops you from casting skills if you are in it, but does negate also stop the damage of an already active ultimate/skill?

Eye of the Storm works like bats and can't be negated once cast. The other morph that is ground targetted can be negated just as every other ground-targetted ultimate, I believe.

I agree with Lucky. Neither the damage nor the cast-on-self components are the issue. The problem is that it's sometimes very difficult to see until it's too late--particularly in lag-heavy fights in tight places.

I suppose it is a bit difficult to see in a group setting, especially when the server is being a laggy POS. I imagine it being even harder to see for those that play with their settings turned down, like the Max Particle Systems setting.

stealthyevil

Chuga_Rei wrote: »

1: if it's not negatable, it needs to be, period.

2. Instead of immediately casting maybe give it a brief build up(1-1.25 secs) for people to be able to bail if they are quick On their feet.

3. You could even make eye a channeled so it could be bashed like the old remembrance.

IMO it needs a proper tell, almost like what proxy bombs became, if you see 5 people glowing purple coming at you, get the *** out.

Channel might be a good idea, that way you need to ensure you use it at the right time.

What about the actual radius of the skill ? I know if it gets smaller it won't affect the "Eye of the Storm" morph because you can gap close, but in general I feel like if it were a bit smaller it would give you the 1 second you need to roll the *** out

Koolio

stealthyevil wrote: »

Chuga_Rei wrote: »

1: if it's not negatable, it needs to be, period.

2. Instead of immediately casting maybe give it a brief build up(1-1.25 secs) for people to be able to bail if they are quick On their feet.

3. You could even make eye a channeled so it could be bashed like the old remembrance.

IMO it needs a proper tell, almost like what proxy bombs became, if you see 5 people glowing purple coming at you, get the *** out.

Channel might be a good idea, that way you need to ensure you use it at the right time.

What about the actual radius of the skill ? I know if it gets smaller it won't affect the "Eye of the Storm" morph because you can gap close, but in general I feel like if it were a bit smaller it would give you the 1 second you need to roll the *** out

Does Dawnbreaker give you 1 second to roll out?

zyk

ManDraKE wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

The ulti is overtuned but it's hard to care when compared to Stam. Magic builds have one thing right now, without destro ult the balance gets even worse.

Adding more broken stuff doesn't help the balance. This game is not Stam vs Magika, you will have to fight both of them, and the OP *** of both of them will rekt you.

No one is asking for more unbalanced items. However, it's in the game already like everything else that is already OP.

I think what people are asking is why is there more urgency to balance the destro ult than other OP items?

Jules has been known to cherry pick her examples when making a case. She already called her opponent a friend. I don't disagree that the destro ult is OP, but it's not the-sky-is-falling OP. Not everyone is insta-melting and using this ult does not guarantee easy kills. On the contrary, it provides some Magicka/Stamina balance.

IMO, it is far less an issue than easy to build and play cookie cutter high damage/mit/recovery stam builds. These builds do provide melty, easy kills.

The game does need to be balanced, but holistically. I don't like the destro ult, but I don't dislike it anymore than dozens of other cheesy facets of ESO introduced since the start of 2.3.

SanTii.92

Wollust wrote: »

SanTii.92 wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Satiar wrote: »

The ulti is overtuned but it's hard to care when compared to Stam. Magic builds have one thing right now, without destro ult the balance gets even worse.

Adding more broken stuff don't helps the balance. This game is not Stam vs Magika, you will have to fight both of them, and the OP *** of both of them will rekt you.

If everything is OP then nothing is?

That's not how it works. If everything is OP we end up with 1 or 2 shots left and right and that's not healthy PvP in an MMO.

Not true when tanks and heavy armor are also op

stealthyevil

Koolio wrote: »

stealthyevil wrote: »

Chuga_Rei wrote: »

1: if it's not negatable, it needs to be, period.

2. Instead of immediately casting maybe give it a brief build up(1-1.25 secs) for people to be able to bail if they are quick On their feet.

3. You could even make eye a channeled so it could be bashed like the old remembrance.

IMO it needs a proper tell, almost like what proxy bombs became, if you see 5 people glowing purple coming at you, get the *** out.

Channel might be a good idea, that way you need to ensure you use it at the right time.

What about the actual radius of the skill ? I know if it gets smaller it won't affect the "Eye of the Storm" morph because you can gap close, but in general I feel like if it were a bit smaller it would give you the 1 second you need to roll the *** out

Does Dawnbreaker give you 1 second to roll out?

Technically yes, because of the animation, but its cancellable

DemonDruaga

well.. 26k spell resist and 85 points in elemental defender -> 2 ticks and a light attack i was gone.
walking out proves difficult with the morph that centers around a lotusfan spaming nb or streaking sorcs ^^
7/7 impen and some points into cp crit resist.
but well, i guess it should stay like this. since it does come with a really high cost, wish my dk banner would do half the damage of that ult.. since the costs are the same :P take a hint zos

Glamdring

I will enlighten you. Its hard to see since its an exploit out there that makes it invisible.

Lexxypwns

Minno wrote: »

I'll ask again, anyone test if negate removes either of these morphs?

not the pbaoe one

Minno

Lexxypwns wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

I'll ask again, anyone test if negate removes either of these morphs?

not the pbaoe one

Thanks!