Maintenance for the week of November 25:
• [COMPLETE] PC/Mac: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – November 25, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 7:00AM EST (12:00 UTC)
• Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – November 27, 6:00AM EST (11:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EST (14:00 UTC)
• PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – November 27, 6:00AM EST (11:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EST (14:00 UTC)
• [COMPLETE] PC/Mac: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – November 25, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 7:00AM EST (12:00 UTC)
• Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – November 27, 6:00AM EST (11:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EST (14:00 UTC)
• PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – November 27, 6:00AM EST (11:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EST (14:00 UTC)
What do you think of Crown Store Random boxes/Lottery box?
-
newtinmpls✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.verenkutoja wrote: »
I actually quit about a week after the 12 month senche mount were released for a little over a year and only recently came back, I quit mostly because of the fact that Zenimax have outright lied on a number of different occasions and displayed an absolute unwillingness to listen to their player base virtually at all. That just does not rub me the right way, I mean.. I supported this game from its beta and for myself and others like me who were loyal to be shoved aside and basically put in a corner and treated as if we do not matter? Yeah, no.
First, I'm sorry you were upset enough to leave, and I'm glad you came back and I hope you are having a good time both in forum and in game.
Second, I think that ZoS thought that PvP and AvA was going to be the main draw, the main activity, the main moneymaker.
I think that RP, ES-fanatics and slower players are a MUCH bigger 1-part of the playerbase and 2-spend much more relative to PvPers than was ever expected or anticipated and I think that ZoS is still adjusting to that.
For me I think it's about 80% PvE and 20% PvP.
I'm also doing a LOT more undaunted than I ever expected (and I would like to see more stories/story extensions with that - but that's another thread).
As for "random" stuff - there have already been random crates available for various in-game currencies (gold, telvar stones) and I agree that making any random item available for actual cash is a bad idea.
That way lies addiction, madness, angry parents and potential legal issues. Not good.Tenesi Faryon of Telvanni - Dunmer Sorceress who deliberately sought sacrifice into Cold Harbor to rescue her beloved.
Hisa Ni Caemaire - Altmer Sorceress, member of the Order Draconis and Adept of the House of Dibella.
Broken Branch Toothmaul - goblin (for my goblin characters, I use either orsimer or bosmer templates) Templar, member of the Order Draconis and persistently unskilled pickpocket
Mol gro Durga - Orsimer Socerer/Battlemage who died the first time when the Nibenay Valley chapterhouse of the Order Draconis was destroyed, then went back to Cold Harbor to rescue his second/partner who was still captive. He overestimated his resistance to the hopelessness of Oblivion, about to give up, and looked up to see the golden glow of atherius surrounding a beautiful young woman who extended her hand to him and said "I can help you". He carried Fianna Kingsley out of Cold Harbor on his shoulder. He carried Alvard Stower under one arm. He also irritated the Prophet who had intended the portal for only Mol and Lyris.***Order Draconis - well c'mon there has to be some explanation for all those dragon tattoos.
House of Dibella - If you have ever seen or read "Memoirs of a Geisha" that's just the beginning...
Nibenay Valley Chapterhouse - Where now stands only desolate ground and a dolmen there once was a thriving community supporting one of the major chapterhouses of the Order Draconis2 -
Dromede✭✭✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsnewtinmpls wrote: »verenkutoja wrote: »
I actually quit about a week after the 12 month senche mount were released for a little over a year and only recently came back, I quit mostly because of the fact that Zenimax have outright lied on a number of different occasions and displayed an absolute unwillingness to listen to their player base virtually at all. That just does not rub me the right way, I mean.. I supported this game from its beta and for myself and others like me who were loyal to be shoved aside and basically put in a corner and treated as if we do not matter? Yeah, no.
First, I'm sorry you were upset enough to leave, and I'm glad you came back and I hope you are having a good time both in forum and in game.
Second, I think that ZoS thought that PvP and AvA was going to be the main draw, the main activity, the main moneymaker.
I think that RP, ES-fanatics and slower players are a MUCH bigger 1-part of the playerbase and 2-spend much more relative to PvPers than was ever expected or anticipated and I think that ZoS is still adjusting to that.
For me I think it's about 80% PvE and 20% PvP.
I'm also doing a LOT more undaunted than I ever expected (and I would like to see more stories/story extensions with that - but that's another thread).
As for "random" stuff - there have already been random crates available for various in-game currencies (gold, telvar stones) and I agree that making any random item available for actual cash is a bad idea.
That way lies addiction, madness, angry parents and potential legal issues. Not good.
Well, the game is officially rated M for mature (17+), but even some developers admitted that their children are playing it ( must have been during one of eso Live episodes, the son was 13 years).Skye Cloude - Sorc DPS, Master Crafter. Main, the bestest
Lae Lenne - Templar Healer Trial grade.
Dromede - Stamina Nightblade, she's a newb and doesn't know what she's doing
V'oghatta - Stamplar pretending to be a tank
Ulville Thonvella - aspiring Fire Mage, be careful around her fire sticks!
Dromedaris - lost and not found. Named after a shoe, what else can you expect from her? A proper tank in her wildest dreams
Swims-Naked - too pretty to grind, too silly to quest.
Sun Flair - Dunmer Templar that can't spell for life. To bad she's too broke to afford a name change... Well, at least she's pretty...0 -
Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭arasysb14_ESO wrote: »At this point a lot of players are probably weighing how ZOS' overall decision making is going to impact their entertainment to see if they want to continue playing or not. MMOs require commitment, but if the game doesn't offer a good near future potential, people initially start lurking on the forums more often, then realize forums became more entertaining than the game; and finally either quit or take a break.
Yep that's exactly what I'm doing right now. Exactly. I logged in tonight just to collect my daily hireling and train my horses, and that was the first time I've logged in in days. I've been playing other games and lurking here for over a week.
I'm seriously questioning whether I want to continue playing this game with these stupid gambling boxes and all the things they're changing.6 -
snakester320✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.
Of course they will. Our only hope of getting rid of them is they don't sell. Unfortunately, they probably will sell. It's kinda sad they don't listen to their players, but they made it very clear they aren't listening to our arguments.The majority of players over all forms of social media, these forums and in game do not want this, yet I am betting they will still put them in. GG
Yes and no while i dont claim to be a expert on marketing !! logic would say the only reason there putting these boxes out is to make more money clearly there struggling for revenue ( prob because of loss of subs and not the popularity of the items sold in crown store) agreed? there going to sell there boxes cause sheep will be sheep bark at them and they will follow one another.. heres where if fu.ks ZOS if theres not a majority of players buying them they wont meet a quota required so there stuck trying to *** them off watch the crown discount sales start poping up then if that doesnt work they will try somthing else to tear money off customers when there not making money they will get more and more greedy losing customers faster and faster till the day comes they will just not make enough money to keep the servers up and the game will be dead!! FOOD FOR THOUGHT.. they must of lost customers hand over fist with there bugs and glitches that only just got fixed after well over a month otherwise why the big cash grab now .. there losing on all fronts they cant fix issues quickly ( losing players ) then to rake in more cash they want us to gamble at on there RNG boxes pissing more players off !! there just nailing there own coffin themselves!!2 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.So at least the 2 dresses here are actually being released to the store in the usual way and and not being crammed in the RNG boxes.
I guess that's comforting.
But I have to wonder why we STILL don't have THIS gown, which has been on PTS since Thieves Guild.
PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!1 -
EQBallzz✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, don't ever add these into the game.jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?6 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticssnakester320 wrote: »
Of course they will. Our only hope of getting rid of them is they don't sell. Unfortunately, they probably will sell. It's kinda sad they don't listen to their players, but they made it very clear they aren't listening to our arguments.The majority of players over all forms of social media, these forums and in game do not want this, yet I am betting they will still put them in. GG
Yes and no while i dont claim to be a expert on marketing !! logic would say the only reason there putting these boxes out is to make more money clearly there struggling for revenue ( prob because of loss of subs and not the popularity of the items sold in crown store) agreed?
It is hard to say what ZOS financials look like, but most people think of ZOS like a stand-alone studio doing their first and only game. This way of thinking can be deceptive. They are part of ZeniMax Media, a company that has built an empire out of sales of $60 boxes and a few followup DLC. ZOS shows all the signs of this manner of thinking.
ZeniMax Media has a ton of money from Fallout 4, Dishonored, Doom 4, and other games. ZOS has to balance the books, but ZeniMax is not going to let ZOS fail. It is still years before Elder Scrolls 6 comes out. They will supplement to cover any shortfalls to keep ESO afloat. (EDIT: If the internal perception is that ESO is strong, there will be another game between Fallout 4 and Elder Scrolls 6. If the internal perception is that ESO is sinking, Elder Scrolls 6 will be the next game out of Bethesda Game Studios. I think that Elder Scrolls 6 has been postponed to allow BGS to work on something new.)
Crown Crates are a way to even out cyclical revenue and help to balance the books. After Gold+DLC Pack+One Tamriel, there will be no new boxes to sell until at least 2018, if they continue to follow that model.
As far as gamble boxes go, you will have to search to find a more mild implementation anywhere else, especially if they keep their word about convenience and customization only. All ZOS has to do is stick by their word. It will be hard for them, with little demons pulling at them every day to do more, in addition to the people inside the Studio and at ZeniMax and Bethesda. People will want them to get closer to the line, or move the line (as they did with RNG boxes). It all depends on Firor and how much he wants to stick by those statements, which some will feel to be a pretty bleak outlook.
Although, that said, I think that One Tamriel is a big gamble for them. It is the way to go, but to succeed, the vision and implementation have to be spot on. It has to give the open world play that Elder Scrolls is known for while preserving RPG and MMO longevity. It has to keep people playing without turning it into Goldilocks Online by holding our hand and making sure our porridge is just right. ZOS is good with vision, but they tend to fall short in implementation. If One Tamriel sinks ESO, no gamble box on the planet will save it.Edited by Elsonso on August 31, 2016 1:40PM3 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsjedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?0 -
EQBallzz✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, don't ever add these into the game.There's 90 pages going on here, so this may already be said (and honestly I don't expect this to be read), but...
Quoting from http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/feature/11112/Elder-Scrolls-Online-All-About-the-Crown-Crates-Coming-in-One-Tamriel.html
Matt Firor: "So, in a nutshell: you purchase a crate of consumables, and you get the chance for cool gear that was once on the store but was discontinued – and a really rare chance of unique customization and convenience items."
Huh. So Matt Firor is either incredibly disconnected from the player base -- consumables is not likely a driving market factor -- and/or completely oblivious to the way peoples' buying habits actually function -- players will be focusing on the rarities, not the consumables -- OR Matt is completely and utterly aware of everything and is banking on exploiting those players who are willing to throw tons of money at the gambles for rare/unobtainables.
Gotta catch those freaking whales, I guess.
My faith, meanwhile, diminishes... I thought this place was sanctuary. It breaks my heart to find it about to be violated by this scheme.
Let it harm none... let it exploit none... but alas, this creed and this voice goes unheard.
Some of us have been feeling like that ever since they revealed the lie about the sub model, cash shop and "tracking XP" debacle. There is no shame and apparently no bar is too low.2 -
EQBallzz✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, don't ever add these into the game.nimander99 wrote: ».There's 90 pages going on here, so this may already be said (and honestly I don't expect this to be read), but...
Quoting from http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/feature/11112/Elder-Scrolls-Online-All-About-the-Crown-Crates-Coming-in-One-Tamriel.html
Matt Firor: "So, in a nutshell: you purchase a crate of consumables, and you get the chance for cool gear that was once on the store but was discontinued – and a really rare chance of unique customization and convenience items."
Huh. So Matt Firor is either incredibly disconnected from the player base -- consumables is not likely a driving market factor -- and/or completely oblivious to the way peoples' buying habits actually function -- players will be focusing on the rarities, not the consumables -- OR Matt is completely and utterly aware of everything and is banking on exploiting those players who are willing to throw tons of money at the gambles for rare/unobtainables.
Gotta catch those freaking whales, I guess. My faith, meanwhile, diminishes... I thought this place was sanctuary. It breaks my heart to find it about to be violated by this scheme.
Let it harm none... let it exploit none... but alas, this creed and this voice goes unheard.
This is about what it is to me - they [Snip] it up ... again - well, I should have stayed with my first opinion about this company when they announced the imperial edition and any race in any faction at launch and added a horse to it, which was otherwise hard to achieve in the game - a lot of people on youtube were shocked by this, because it broke the whole concept of the alliance war in the first place and it showed greed in a way, which was just disgusting - Angry Joe had a parody in his review about this, which was straight to the point - it is a greedy company which has no scruples at all to scam the crap out of it's customers.
I am pretty much done with this game - I thought I could have some more fun from time to time - but it does not seem like it. I am just too "heartbroken" to be able to - you put it in the right way, I feel so disgusted by them and despise them deeply.
This is pretty much my feeling at this point... I was super jazzed for OT and the Seattle event coming up (I live in Seattle), now I'm just watching the sub days tick down and planning my escape route. But eff me if it isn't almost physically painful to have been so friggin wrong this whole time. All my defenses of various systems and changes made to the game haven't all just led to this inevitable outcome.
I'll tell you what though, fool me one shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.
So shame on me.
Edit: Not sayin I'm quittin... cause who ever really quits an mmo? Just saying I don't plan on blindly supporting this game via my wallet anymore. Just straight up ambivalence.
Why not? I did months ago. I have actually gone back to EQ on the P99 emulation server for a classic EQ experience before all the BS was added and it's proving to me that even in it's ancient state..EQ is still the best MMO out there (probably not any of the Daybreak iterations however as those have been infiltrated by modern BS). Having much more fun playing a 16 year old MMO with a soul than I have had in any modern MMO in recent memory. These cash shops and new "innovations" have completely ruined MMOs. Hopefullly, Pantheon can set a new (old) path for the genre once again when it releases.2 -
Sevalaricgirl✭✭✭✭✭No I dislike the random crown store boxes, to much of a gambleI support it as a revenue stream for ZOS. I do so as long as they are cosmetic or gives potions/scrolls. I do not mind exclusives items either. I won't buy boxes but have no problem with other people doing so even if it contains cosmetic items only available through those boxes.
I believe that players supporting the boxes and not supporting exclusive items are naive. If they implement boxes they will sooner rather than later put exclusive items in it. Even though they might have states otherwise to begin with.
The problem starts when the exclusives are only available in boxes and the store becomes nothing. That is what happened in SWTOR. The store had nothing new that didn't come in boxes and frankly, it ruined the game.6 -
EQBallzz✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, don't ever add these into the game.jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?
Are you purposely being obtuse? It's not the RNG that is different. It's the process. All RPG's use RNG...even tabletop games use dice which was the original RNG but that RNG has *nothing* whatsoever to do with casino boxes.
Based on your logic..because casino boxes also use RNG we should no longer even have fighting between characters and NPCs or other characters (whose outcomes are determined by a series of RNG rolls) but instead just click one button to determine the outcome. No more gameplay just click your slot machine button to determine the outcome of everything. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it? Process makes all the difference and the process of getting items through RNG boxes is *not* the same as game-play.5 -
Mx13✭✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsnimander99 wrote: »This is pretty much my feeling at this point... I was super jazzed for OT and the Seattle event coming up (I live in Seattle), now I'm just watching the sub days tick down and planning my escape route. But eff me if it isn't almost physically painful to have been so friggin wrong this whole time. All my defenses of various systems and changes made to the game haven't all just led to this inevitable outcome.
I'll tell you what though, fool me one shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.
So shame on me.
Edit: Not sayin I'm quittin... cause who ever really quits an mmo? Just saying I don't plan on blindly supporting this game via my wallet anymore. Just straight up ambivalence.
Why not? I did months ago. I have actually gone back to EQ on the P99 emulation server for a classic EQ experience before all the BS was added and it's proving to me that even in it's ancient state..EQ is still the best MMO out there (probably not any of the Daybreak iterations however as those have been infiltrated by modern BS). Having much more fun playing a 16 year old MMO with a soul than I have had in any modern MMO in recent memory. These cash shops and new "innovations" have completely ruined MMOs. Hopefullly, Pantheon can set a new (old) path for the genre once again when it releases.
You're still posting on the forums so...
1 -
EQBallzz✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, don't ever add these into the game.nimander99 wrote: »This is pretty much my feeling at this point... I was super jazzed for OT and the Seattle event coming up (I live in Seattle), now I'm just watching the sub days tick down and planning my escape route. But eff me if it isn't almost physically painful to have been so friggin wrong this whole time. All my defenses of various systems and changes made to the game haven't all just led to this inevitable outcome.
I'll tell you what though, fool me one shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.
So shame on me.
Edit: Not sayin I'm quittin... cause who ever really quits an mmo? Just saying I don't plan on blindly supporting this game via my wallet anymore. Just straight up ambivalence.
Why not? I did months ago. I have actually gone back to EQ on the P99 emulation server for a classic EQ experience before all the BS was added and it's proving to me that even in it's ancient state..EQ is still the best MMO out there (probably not any of the Daybreak iterations however as those have been infiltrated by modern BS). Having much more fun playing a 16 year old MMO with a soul than I have had in any modern MMO in recent memory. These cash shops and new "innovations" have completely ruined MMOs. Hopefullly, Pantheon can set a new (old) path for the genre once again when it releases.
You're still posting on the forums so...
It's slow at work. I also post on the P99 forums so your point is mostly irrelevant. That being said, if modern MMOs didn't fall into this crappy "cash-grab" category now I might be focused more on them than posting here but sadly..this is the way the MMO genre is now. It's more engaging to post on the forums of modern MMOs than it is to play them. Maybe they will come up with a new random complaint box for forum goers..only 400 crowns!1 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsjedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?
Are you purposely being obtuse? It's not the RNG that is different. It's the process. All RPG's use RNG...even tabletop games use dice which was the original RNG but that RNG has *nothing* whatsoever to do with casino boxes.
Based on your logic..because casino boxes also use RNG we should no longer even have fighting between characters and NPCs or other characters (whose outcomes are determined by a series of RNG rolls) but instead just click one button to determine the outcome. No more gameplay just click your slot machine button to determine the outcome of everything. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it? Process makes all the difference and the process of getting items through RNG boxes is *not* the same as game-play.
no that is your logic.... and no matter how hard you try you will fail to put words in my mouth.
my point.... if i can remember (it was a few days ago) was simply that the process that governs drops and loot boxes is the same, perhaps with a different drop table, but still essentially the same.... perhaps it is a little too subtle for you.0 -
EQBallzz✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, don't ever add these into the game.jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?
Are you purposely being obtuse? It's not the RNG that is different. It's the process. All RPG's use RNG...even tabletop games use dice which was the original RNG but that RNG has *nothing* whatsoever to do with casino boxes.
Based on your logic..because casino boxes also use RNG we should no longer even have fighting between characters and NPCs or other characters (whose outcomes are determined by a series of RNG rolls) but instead just click one button to determine the outcome. No more gameplay just click your slot machine button to determine the outcome of everything. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it? Process makes all the difference and the process of getting items through RNG boxes is *not* the same as game-play.
no that is your logic.... and no matter how hard you try you will fail to put words in my mouth.
my point.... if i can remember (it was a few days ago) was simply that the process that governs drops and loot boxes is the same, perhaps with a different drop table, but still essentially the same.... perhaps it is a little too subtle for you.
Again, you ignore the process around the RNG as if that makes no difference. Ignore it if you want but it's still there whether you recognize it or not. Lots of things use RNG but that doesn't make them all the same. If you really believe opening an RNG box is essentially the same as getting a random drop from killing a boss in a dungeon..the MMO genre is possibly in even worse shape than I imagined.3 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsjedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?
Are you purposely being obtuse? It's not the RNG that is different. It's the process. All RPG's use RNG...even tabletop games use dice which was the original RNG but that RNG has *nothing* whatsoever to do with casino boxes.
Based on your logic..because casino boxes also use RNG we should no longer even have fighting between characters and NPCs or other characters (whose outcomes are determined by a series of RNG rolls) but instead just click one button to determine the outcome. No more gameplay just click your slot machine button to determine the outcome of everything. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it? Process makes all the difference and the process of getting items through RNG boxes is *not* the same as game-play.
no that is your logic.... and no matter how hard you try you will fail to put words in my mouth.
my point.... if i can remember (it was a few days ago) was simply that the process that governs drops and loot boxes is the same, perhaps with a different drop table, but still essentially the same.... perhaps it is a little too subtle for you.
Again, you ignore the process around the RNG as if that makes no difference. Ignore it if you want but it's still there whether you recognize it or not. Lots of things use RNG but that doesn't make them all the same. If you really believe opening an RNG box is essentially the same as getting a random drop from killing a boss in a dungeon..the MMO genre is possibly in even worse shape than I imagined.
it seems the point is too subtle for you....
the drop - drop table, rng to pick item.
loot box - drop table, rng to pick item.
you seriously can't see the similarity there?
the parameters passed to the rng may well be different.... but the process - and that is all i was referring to in that post, is essentially the same.Edited by jedtb16_ESO on August 31, 2016 4:23PM0 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsThese cash shops and new "innovations" have completely ruined MMOs. Hopefullly, Pantheon can set a new (old) path for the genre once again when it releases.
I see nothing that says that studio will not innovate the best darned P2W MMO that they can. Honestly.
It is getting to the point where I want to know more about the philosophy of the game design company, and how well they track to that, than I am about the game itself. At least, when looking for a new game and trimming down the potentials.
Ultimately, what I think I am looking for is something like ESO, done by someone other than ZOS. I want a company that can design an MMO, with group and individual play, that has a serious consistent and compelling game world. I want that company to be innovative in how it builds and markets the game, rather than reading "MMO Cash Shops for Dummies" and depending on the cash shop. I am more interested in the GAME than I am in the CASH SHOP, and I want the game studio to feel the same way. This is why I have traditionally done subscription games. They have to build a decent GAME to keep subscribers. Anyone can build a cash shop.
Maybe it cannot be done in the current gaming market, but I will keep looking.Sevalaricgirl wrote: »The problem starts when the exclusives are only available in boxes and the store becomes nothing. That is what happened in SWTOR. The store had nothing new that didn't come in boxes and frankly, it ruined the game.
The real problem is what the company does to address sagging cash shop revenue. If all they can do is Cash Store, because their game development is so sub-par that they can't make a decent game, then they think up ways to make the Cash Shop work better. Anyone can do that. No skills required. Makes for a great cash store, but a really poor game.
Edited by Elsonso on August 31, 2016 4:29PM3 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsnimander99 wrote: ».There's 90 pages going on here, so this may already be said (and honestly I don't expect this to be read), but...
Quoting from http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/feature/11112/Elder-Scrolls-Online-All-About-the-Crown-Crates-Coming-in-One-Tamriel.html
Matt Firor: "So, in a nutshell: you purchase a crate of consumables, and you get the chance for cool gear that was once on the store but was discontinued – and a really rare chance of unique customization and convenience items."
Huh. So Matt Firor is either incredibly disconnected from the player base -- consumables is not likely a driving market factor -- and/or completely oblivious to the way peoples' buying habits actually function -- players will be focusing on the rarities, not the consumables -- OR Matt is completely and utterly aware of everything and is banking on exploiting those players who are willing to throw tons of money at the gambles for rare/unobtainables.
Gotta catch those freaking whales, I guess. My faith, meanwhile, diminishes... I thought this place was sanctuary. It breaks my heart to find it about to be violated by this scheme.
Let it harm none... let it exploit none... but alas, this creed and this voice goes unheard.
This is about what it is to me - they [Snip] it up ... again - well, I should have stayed with my first opinion about this company when they announced the imperial edition and any race in any faction at launch and added a horse to it, which was otherwise hard to achieve in the game - a lot of people on youtube were shocked by this, because it broke the whole concept of the alliance war in the first place and it showed greed in a way, which was just disgusting - Angry Joe had a parody in his review about this, which was straight to the point - it is a greedy company which has no scruples at all to scam the crap out of it's customers.
I am pretty much done with this game - I thought I could have some more fun from time to time - but it does not seem like it. I am just too "heartbroken" to be able to - you put it in the right way, I feel so disgusted by them and despise them deeply.
This is pretty much my feeling at this point... I was super jazzed for OT and the Seattle event coming up (I live in Seattle), now I'm just watching the sub days tick down and planning my escape route. But eff me if it isn't almost physically painful to have been so friggin wrong this whole time. All my defenses of various systems and changes made to the game haven't all just led to this inevitable outcome.
I'll tell you what though, fool me one shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.
So shame on me.
Edit: Not sayin I'm quittin... cause who ever really quits an mmo? Just saying I don't plan on blindly supporting this game via my wallet anymore. Just straight up ambivalence.
Why not? I did months ago. I have actually gone back to EQ on the P99 emulation server for a classic EQ experience before all the BS was added and it's proving to me that even in it's ancient state..EQ is still the best MMO out there (probably not any of the Daybreak iterations however as those have been infiltrated by modern BS). Having much more fun playing a 16 year old MMO with a soul than I have had in any modern MMO in recent memory. These cash shops and new "innovations" have completely ruined MMOs. Hopefullly, Pantheon can set a new (old) path for the genre once again when it releases.
cash shops and loot boxes are hardly new innovations.... unless we are talking on a geological timescale.
though i agree that pantheon does look interesting.... but expensive.0 -
EQBallzz✭✭✭✭✭
✭No, don't ever add these into the game.jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?
Are you purposely being obtuse? It's not the RNG that is different. It's the process. All RPG's use RNG...even tabletop games use dice which was the original RNG but that RNG has *nothing* whatsoever to do with casino boxes.
Based on your logic..because casino boxes also use RNG we should no longer even have fighting between characters and NPCs or other characters (whose outcomes are determined by a series of RNG rolls) but instead just click one button to determine the outcome. No more gameplay just click your slot machine button to determine the outcome of everything. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it? Process makes all the difference and the process of getting items through RNG boxes is *not* the same as game-play.
no that is your logic.... and no matter how hard you try you will fail to put words in my mouth.
my point.... if i can remember (it was a few days ago) was simply that the process that governs drops and loot boxes is the same, perhaps with a different drop table, but still essentially the same.... perhaps it is a little too subtle for you.
Again, you ignore the process around the RNG as if that makes no difference. Ignore it if you want but it's still there whether you recognize it or not. Lots of things use RNG but that doesn't make them all the same. If you really believe opening an RNG box is essentially the same as getting a random drop from killing a boss in a dungeon..the MMO genre is possibly in even worse shape than I imagined.
it seems the point is too subtle for you....
the drop - drop table, rng to pick item.
loot box - drop table, rng to pick item.
you seriously can't see the similarity there?
the parameters passed to the rng may well be different.... but the process - and that is all i was referring to in that post, is essentially the same.
Trying to insinuate that you have some super smart subtlety that I'm too dumb to pick up doesn't help your argument. What you are describing isn't even correct. The mechanics are the same (both use RNG) but the process surrounding the mechanic is completely different. One uses a process of playing the game to get to the point of acquiring a random item and the other uses a process that has you purchases a box that you click on and gets you a random item. Not even remotely the same.5 -
snakester320✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.
RNG is RNG difference is paying for the RNG with crowns in stupid boxes is BULLSH.T and RNG from trial dungeon runs is free as such .. just thought id explain this to you !! as you seem confused unless you know diff and we pay 400 crowns every time we do a dungeon run or trial!! please try grabbing better straws when you justify your fondness to throw money at ZOS for bullsh.t reasons!!jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?
2 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsjedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?
Are you purposely being obtuse? It's not the RNG that is different. It's the process. All RPG's use RNG...even tabletop games use dice which was the original RNG but that RNG has *nothing* whatsoever to do with casino boxes.
Based on your logic..because casino boxes also use RNG we should no longer even have fighting between characters and NPCs or other characters (whose outcomes are determined by a series of RNG rolls) but instead just click one button to determine the outcome. No more gameplay just click your slot machine button to determine the outcome of everything. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it? Process makes all the difference and the process of getting items through RNG boxes is *not* the same as game-play.
no that is your logic.... and no matter how hard you try you will fail to put words in my mouth.
my point.... if i can remember (it was a few days ago) was simply that the process that governs drops and loot boxes is the same, perhaps with a different drop table, but still essentially the same.... perhaps it is a little too subtle for you.
Again, you ignore the process around the RNG as if that makes no difference. Ignore it if you want but it's still there whether you recognize it or not. Lots of things use RNG but that doesn't make them all the same. If you really believe opening an RNG box is essentially the same as getting a random drop from killing a boss in a dungeon..the MMO genre is possibly in even worse shape than I imagined.
rofl... still you miss it. i saidjedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?
Are you purposely being obtuse? It's not the RNG that is different. It's the process. All RPG's use RNG...even tabletop games use dice which was the original RNG but that RNG has *nothing* whatsoever to do with casino boxes.
Based on your logic..because casino boxes also use RNG we should no longer even have fighting between characters and NPCs or other characters (whose outcomes are determined by a series of RNG rolls) but instead just click one button to determine the outcome. No more gameplay just click your slot machine button to determine the outcome of everything. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it? Process makes all the difference and the process of getting items through RNG boxes is *not* the same as game-play.
no that is your logic.... and no matter how hard you try you will fail to put words in my mouth.
my point.... if i can remember (it was a few days ago) was simply that the process that governs drops and loot boxes is the same, perhaps with a different drop table, but still essentially the same.... perhaps it is a little too subtle for you.
Again, you ignore the process around the RNG as if that makes no difference. Ignore it if you want but it's still there whether you recognize it or not. Lots of things use RNG but that doesn't make them all the same. If you really believe opening an RNG box is essentially the same as getting a random drop from killing a boss in a dungeon..the MMO genre is possibly in even worse shape than I imagined.
it seems the point is too subtle for you....
the drop - drop table, rng to pick item.
loot box - drop table, rng to pick item.
you seriously can't see the similarity there?
the parameters passed to the rng may well be different.... but the process - and that is all i was referring to in that post, is essentially the same.
Trying to insinuate that you have some super smart subtlety that I'm too dumb to pick up doesn't help your argument. What you are describing isn't even correct. The mechanics are the same (both use RNG) but the process surrounding the mechanic is completely different. One uses a process of playing the game to get to the point of acquiring a random item and the other uses a process that has you purchases a box that you click on and gets you a random item. Not even remotely the same.
still you miss it..... at no point did i refer to the process around it.... not at all. and i did say ' but the process - and that is all i was referring to in that post, is essentially the same' that is the rng and the drop table that is all i was talking about.
you don't like the idea? meh, whatever...
hmmm quoting gone a bit weird there.... not like it's important.Edited by jedtb16_ESO on August 31, 2016 5:12PM0 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticssnakester320 wrote: »
RNG is RNG difference is paying for the RNG with crowns in stupid boxes is BULLSH.T and RNG from trial dungeon runs is free as such .. just thought id explain this to you !! as you seem confused unless you know diff and we pay 400 crowns every time we do a dungeon run or trial!! please try grabbing better straws when you justify your fondness to throw money at ZOS for bullsh.t reasons!!jedtb16_ESO wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: »Hilarious!
Yes please! If I begin to purchase Crown Crates and drive myself to bankruptcy and ruin...
I am blaming ZOS for implementing this feature.
I am blaming you posters for not protecting me.
I am free of all blame and responsibility
NEWSFLASH!! - If I had a gambling addiction, I'd be gambling. Not playing MMO's. Sure go ahead, I bet there is that one story where a man lost his job and family to MMO gambling addiction. Out of multi-millions of players.
Heck, I'm sure MMO addiction is more prevalent than MMO Gambling. Seems to be a lot of MMO addiction going on here.
Many gamers (not all) have never really gambled and probably never would... Cause they like video games not slot machines or cards w/e. The point is that the game they play is now exposing paying customers to gambling when they bought a video game to play a video game and not gamble.
MMO addiction is separate from this issue and not really a part of this discussion, although valid in its own right.
every gamer who has played a game in which a random number generator has been used to determine loot or drops or whatever has gambled..... to pretend otherwise is disingenuous at best.
Are you seriously trying to equate the RNG that is a component of actual gameplay to the RNG of a cash purchased casino box? If you truly believe they are the same why even have gameplay at all? Just let everyone log in and click the same button over and over to get everything?
are you seriously suggesting they would use a different rng for each process?
ah, more hysteria..... just what this thread needs0 -
snakester320✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: ».There's 90 pages going on here, so this may already be said (and honestly I don't expect this to be read), but...
Quoting from http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/feature/11112/Elder-Scrolls-Online-All-About-the-Crown-Crates-Coming-in-One-Tamriel.html
Matt Firor: "So, in a nutshell: you purchase a crate of consumables, and you get the chance for cool gear that was once on the store but was discontinued – and a really rare chance of unique customization and convenience items."
Huh. So Matt Firor is either incredibly disconnected from the player base -- consumables is not likely a driving market factor -- and/or completely oblivious to the way peoples' buying habits actually function -- players will be focusing on the rarities, not the consumables -- OR Matt is completely and utterly aware of everything and is banking on exploiting those players who are willing to throw tons of money at the gambles for rare/unobtainables.
Gotta catch those freaking whales, I guess. My faith, meanwhile, diminishes... I thought this place was sanctuary. It breaks my heart to find it about to be violated by this scheme.
Let it harm none... let it exploit none... but alas, this creed and this voice goes unheard.
This is about what it is to me - they [Snip] it up ... again - well, I should have stayed with my first opinion about this company when they announced the imperial edition and any race in any faction at launch and added a horse to it, which was otherwise hard to achieve in the game - a lot of people on youtube were shocked by this, because it broke the whole concept of the alliance war in the first place and it showed greed in a way, which was just disgusting - Angry Joe had a parody in his review about this, which was straight to the point - it is a greedy company which has no scruples at all to scam the crap out of it's customers.
I am pretty much done with this game - I thought I could have some more fun from time to time - but it does not seem like it. I am just too "heartbroken" to be able to - you put it in the right way, I feel so disgusted by them and despise them deeply.
This is pretty much my feeling at this point... I was super jazzed for OT and the Seattle event coming up (I live in Seattle), now I'm just watching the sub days tick down and planning my escape route. But eff me if it isn't almost physically painful to have been so friggin wrong this whole time. All my defenses of various systems and changes made to the game haven't all just led to this inevitable outcome.
I'll tell you what though, fool me one shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.
So shame on me.
Edit: Not sayin I'm quittin... cause who ever really quits an mmo? Just saying I don't plan on blindly supporting this game via my wallet anymore. Just straight up ambivalence.
Why not? I did months ago. I have actually gone back to EQ on the P99 emulation server for a classic EQ experience before all the BS was added and it's proving to me that even in it's ancient state..EQ is still the best MMO out there (probably not any of the Daybreak iterations however as those have been infiltrated by modern BS). Having much more fun playing a 16 year old MMO with a soul than I have had in any modern MMO in recent memory. These cash shops and new "innovations" have completely ruined MMOs. Hopefullly, Pantheon can set a new (old) path for the genre once again when it releases.
cash shops and loot boxes are hardly new innovations.... unless we are talking on a geological timescale.
though i agree that pantheon does look interesting.... but expensive.
while no there not new but take alot of games spiting out theses type of boxes usually everything else is free and some time the game is as well .. here they have the means to put these things in the crown store at a one off cost instead there blocking content behind gambling and i can assure you at RNG (THAT FAVORS THEM) forcing ppl that want to collect these items will be forced to throw hundreds of dollars trying to get rare items or stuff they dont want!! ZOS are crossing the boundry between making money and just out right GREED .. i sure hope it blows up in there face!!0 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticssnakester320 wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »nimander99 wrote: ».There's 90 pages going on here, so this may already be said (and honestly I don't expect this to be read), but...
Quoting from http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/feature/11112/Elder-Scrolls-Online-All-About-the-Crown-Crates-Coming-in-One-Tamriel.html
Matt Firor: "So, in a nutshell: you purchase a crate of consumables, and you get the chance for cool gear that was once on the store but was discontinued – and a really rare chance of unique customization and convenience items."
Huh. So Matt Firor is either incredibly disconnected from the player base -- consumables is not likely a driving market factor -- and/or completely oblivious to the way peoples' buying habits actually function -- players will be focusing on the rarities, not the consumables -- OR Matt is completely and utterly aware of everything and is banking on exploiting those players who are willing to throw tons of money at the gambles for rare/unobtainables.
Gotta catch those freaking whales, I guess. My faith, meanwhile, diminishes... I thought this place was sanctuary. It breaks my heart to find it about to be violated by this scheme.
Let it harm none... let it exploit none... but alas, this creed and this voice goes unheard.
This is about what it is to me - they [Snip] it up ... again - well, I should have stayed with my first opinion about this company when they announced the imperial edition and any race in any faction at launch and added a horse to it, which was otherwise hard to achieve in the game - a lot of people on youtube were shocked by this, because it broke the whole concept of the alliance war in the first place and it showed greed in a way, which was just disgusting - Angry Joe had a parody in his review about this, which was straight to the point - it is a greedy company which has no scruples at all to scam the crap out of it's customers.
I am pretty much done with this game - I thought I could have some more fun from time to time - but it does not seem like it. I am just too "heartbroken" to be able to - you put it in the right way, I feel so disgusted by them and despise them deeply.
This is pretty much my feeling at this point... I was super jazzed for OT and the Seattle event coming up (I live in Seattle), now I'm just watching the sub days tick down and planning my escape route. But eff me if it isn't almost physically painful to have been so friggin wrong this whole time. All my defenses of various systems and changes made to the game haven't all just led to this inevitable outcome.
I'll tell you what though, fool me one shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.
So shame on me.
Edit: Not sayin I'm quittin... cause who ever really quits an mmo? Just saying I don't plan on blindly supporting this game via my wallet anymore. Just straight up ambivalence.
Why not? I did months ago. I have actually gone back to EQ on the P99 emulation server for a classic EQ experience before all the BS was added and it's proving to me that even in it's ancient state..EQ is still the best MMO out there (probably not any of the Daybreak iterations however as those have been infiltrated by modern BS). Having much more fun playing a 16 year old MMO with a soul than I have had in any modern MMO in recent memory. These cash shops and new "innovations" have completely ruined MMOs. Hopefullly, Pantheon can set a new (old) path for the genre once again when it releases.
cash shops and loot boxes are hardly new innovations.... unless we are talking on a geological timescale.
though i agree that pantheon does look interesting.... but expensive.
while no there not new but take alot of games spiting out theses type of boxes usually everything else is free and some time the game is as well .. here they have the means to put these things in the crown store at a one off cost instead there blocking content behind gambling and i can assure you at RNG (THAT FAVORS THEM) forcing ppl that want to collect these items will be forced to throw hundreds of dollars trying to get rare items or stuff they dont want!! ZOS are crossing the boundry between making money and just out right GREED .. i sure hope it blows up in there face!!
annnnd....... a bit more hysteria
oh and if you are referring to someone it is their not there.... kinda makes you look silly.
remember its....
there = in that place
their = belonging to them... those peopleEdited by jedtb16_ESO on August 31, 2016 7:02PM1 -
Lysette✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No, don't ever add these into the game.lordrichter wrote: »snakester320 wrote: »
Of course they will. Our only hope of getting rid of them is they don't sell. Unfortunately, they probably will sell. It's kinda sad they don't listen to their players, but they made it very clear they aren't listening to our arguments.The majority of players over all forms of social media, these forums and in game do not want this, yet I am betting they will still put them in. GG
Yes and no while i dont claim to be a expert on marketing !! logic would say the only reason there putting these boxes out is to make more money clearly there struggling for revenue ( prob because of loss of subs and not the popularity of the items sold in crown store) agreed?
It is hard to say what ZOS financials look like, but most people think of ZOS like a stand-alone studio doing their first and only game. This way of thinking can be deceptive. They are part of ZeniMax Media, a company that has built an empire out of sales of $60 boxes and a few followup DLC. ZOS shows all the signs of this manner of thinking.
ZeniMax Media has a ton of money from Fallout 4, Dishonored, Doom 4, and other games. ZOS has to balance the books, but ZeniMax is not going to let ZOS fail. It is still years before Elder Scrolls 6 comes out. They will supplement to cover any shortfalls to keep ESO afloat. (EDIT: If the internal perception is that ESO is strong, there will be another game between Fallout 4 and Elder Scrolls 6. If the internal perception is that ESO is sinking, Elder Scrolls 6 will be the next game out of Bethesda Game Studios. I think that Elder Scrolls 6 has been postponed to allow BGS to work on something new.)
Crown Crates are a way to even out cyclical revenue and help to balance the books. After Gold+DLC Pack+One Tamriel, there will be no new boxes to sell until at least 2018, if they continue to follow that model.
As far as gamble boxes go, you will have to search to find a more mild implementation anywhere else, especially if they keep their word about convenience and customization only. All ZOS has to do is stick by their word. It will be hard for them, with little demons pulling at them every day to do more, in addition to the people inside the Studio and at ZeniMax and Bethesda. People will want them to get closer to the line, or move the line (as they did with RNG boxes). It all depends on Firor and how much he wants to stick by those statements, which some will feel to be a pretty bleak outlook.
Although, that said, I think that One Tamriel is a big gamble for them. It is the way to go, but to succeed, the vision and implementation have to be spot on. It has to give the open world play that Elder Scrolls is known for while preserving RPG and MMO longevity. It has to keep people playing without turning it into Goldilocks Online by holding our hand and making sure our porridge is just right. ZOS is good with vision, but they tend to fall short in implementation. If One Tamriel sinks ESO, no gamble box on the planet will save it.
One Tamriel would not be a problem at all, if they would follow the suggestion to implement an individual difficulty slider - this would not be a problem in a PvE only area. What I have heard from people so far is, that many are afraid of that One Tamriel will turn out to be either too less of a challenge or too much of it - and no one really wants an average middle-ground, where no one would be happy with it - THIS is the problem with One Tamriel IMO - a difficulty slider would solve this problem.Edited by Lysette on August 31, 2016 7:06PM0 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticslordrichter wrote: »snakester320 wrote: »
Of course they will. Our only hope of getting rid of them is they don't sell. Unfortunately, they probably will sell. It's kinda sad they don't listen to their players, but they made it very clear they aren't listening to our arguments.The majority of players over all forms of social media, these forums and in game do not want this, yet I am betting they will still put them in. GG
Yes and no while i dont claim to be a expert on marketing !! logic would say the only reason there putting these boxes out is to make more money clearly there struggling for revenue ( prob because of loss of subs and not the popularity of the items sold in crown store) agreed?
It is hard to say what ZOS financials look like, but most people think of ZOS like a stand-alone studio doing their first and only game. This way of thinking can be deceptive. They are part of ZeniMax Media, a company that has built an empire out of sales of $60 boxes and a few followup DLC. ZOS shows all the signs of this manner of thinking.
ZeniMax Media has a ton of money from Fallout 4, Dishonored, Doom 4, and other games. ZOS has to balance the books, but ZeniMax is not going to let ZOS fail. It is still years before Elder Scrolls 6 comes out. They will supplement to cover any shortfalls to keep ESO afloat. (EDIT: If the internal perception is that ESO is strong, there will be another game between Fallout 4 and Elder Scrolls 6. If the internal perception is that ESO is sinking, Elder Scrolls 6 will be the next game out of Bethesda Game Studios. I think that Elder Scrolls 6 has been postponed to allow BGS to work on something new.)
Crown Crates are a way to even out cyclical revenue and help to balance the books. After Gold+DLC Pack+One Tamriel, there will be no new boxes to sell until at least 2018, if they continue to follow that model.
As far as gamble boxes go, you will have to search to find a more mild implementation anywhere else, especially if they keep their word about convenience and customization only. All ZOS has to do is stick by their word. It will be hard for them, with little demons pulling at them every day to do more, in addition to the people inside the Studio and at ZeniMax and Bethesda. People will want them to get closer to the line, or move the line (as they did with RNG boxes). It all depends on Firor and how much he wants to stick by those statements, which some will feel to be a pretty bleak outlook.
Although, that said, I think that One Tamriel is a big gamble for them. It is the way to go, but to succeed, the vision and implementation have to be spot on. It has to give the open world play that Elder Scrolls is known for while preserving RPG and MMO longevity. It has to keep people playing without turning it into Goldilocks Online by holding our hand and making sure our porridge is just right. ZOS is good with vision, but they tend to fall short in implementation. If One Tamriel sinks ESO, no gamble box on the planet will save it.
One Tamriel would not be a problem at all, if they would follow the suggestion to implement an individual difficulty slider - this would not be a problem in a PvE only area. What I have heard from people so far is, that many are afraid of that One Tamriel will turn out to be either too less of a challenge or too much of it - and no one really wants an average middle-ground, where no one would be happy with it - THIS is the problem with One Tamriel IMO - a difficulty slider would solve this problem.
ever been on a cruise?
you know the deal.... boat, a load of cabins. go look at.....sea. whales, icebergs or glaciers maybe. tropical islands that kind of stuff.
who should make the decisions there?
the captain and crew who, we hope, are at least qualified to sail the boat.
or the passengers who, at best, are a bunch of dilettantes?2 -
Elsonso✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticsjedtb16_ESO wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »snakester320 wrote: »
Of course they will. Our only hope of getting rid of them is they don't sell. Unfortunately, they probably will sell. It's kinda sad they don't listen to their players, but they made it very clear they aren't listening to our arguments.The majority of players over all forms of social media, these forums and in game do not want this, yet I am betting they will still put them in. GG
Yes and no while i dont claim to be a expert on marketing !! logic would say the only reason there putting these boxes out is to make more money clearly there struggling for revenue ( prob because of loss of subs and not the popularity of the items sold in crown store) agreed?
It is hard to say what ZOS financials look like, but most people think of ZOS like a stand-alone studio doing their first and only game. This way of thinking can be deceptive. They are part of ZeniMax Media, a company that has built an empire out of sales of $60 boxes and a few followup DLC. ZOS shows all the signs of this manner of thinking.
ZeniMax Media has a ton of money from Fallout 4, Dishonored, Doom 4, and other games. ZOS has to balance the books, but ZeniMax is not going to let ZOS fail. It is still years before Elder Scrolls 6 comes out. They will supplement to cover any shortfalls to keep ESO afloat. (EDIT: If the internal perception is that ESO is strong, there will be another game between Fallout 4 and Elder Scrolls 6. If the internal perception is that ESO is sinking, Elder Scrolls 6 will be the next game out of Bethesda Game Studios. I think that Elder Scrolls 6 has been postponed to allow BGS to work on something new.)
Crown Crates are a way to even out cyclical revenue and help to balance the books. After Gold+DLC Pack+One Tamriel, there will be no new boxes to sell until at least 2018, if they continue to follow that model.
As far as gamble boxes go, you will have to search to find a more mild implementation anywhere else, especially if they keep their word about convenience and customization only. All ZOS has to do is stick by their word. It will be hard for them, with little demons pulling at them every day to do more, in addition to the people inside the Studio and at ZeniMax and Bethesda. People will want them to get closer to the line, or move the line (as they did with RNG boxes). It all depends on Firor and how much he wants to stick by those statements, which some will feel to be a pretty bleak outlook.
Although, that said, I think that One Tamriel is a big gamble for them. It is the way to go, but to succeed, the vision and implementation have to be spot on. It has to give the open world play that Elder Scrolls is known for while preserving RPG and MMO longevity. It has to keep people playing without turning it into Goldilocks Online by holding our hand and making sure our porridge is just right. ZOS is good with vision, but they tend to fall short in implementation. If One Tamriel sinks ESO, no gamble box on the planet will save it.
One Tamriel would not be a problem at all, if they would follow the suggestion to implement an individual difficulty slider - this would not be a problem in a PvE only area. What I have heard from people so far is, that many are afraid of that One Tamriel will turn out to be either too less of a challenge or too much of it - and no one really wants an average middle-ground, where no one would be happy with it - THIS is the problem with One Tamriel IMO - a difficulty slider would solve this problem.
ever been on a cruise?
you know the deal.... boat, a load of cabins. go look at.....sea. whales, icebergs or glaciers maybe. tropical islands that kind of stuff.
who should make the decisions there?
the captain and crew who, we hope, are at least qualified to sail the boat.
or the passengers who, at best, are a bunch of dilettantes?
Well, yeah, but if I sign up for a tropical cruise, I'd better not be seeing icebergs. That is the risk with One Tamriel.
And, if I get out in the tropics and end up at an island that looks like it never recovered from the last hurricane because the cruise line was too cheap to go to better places? What do I do? Spend time in the ship gift shop?2 -
jedtb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes I like the random boxes idea so Long as they only have cosmeticslordrichter wrote: »jedtb16_ESO wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »snakester320 wrote: »
Of course they will. Our only hope of getting rid of them is they don't sell. Unfortunately, they probably will sell. It's kinda sad they don't listen to their players, but they made it very clear they aren't listening to our arguments.The majority of players over all forms of social media, these forums and in game do not want this, yet I am betting they will still put them in. GG
Yes and no while i dont claim to be a expert on marketing !! logic would say the only reason there putting these boxes out is to make more money clearly there struggling for revenue ( prob because of loss of subs and not the popularity of the items sold in crown store) agreed?
It is hard to say what ZOS financials look like, but most people think of ZOS like a stand-alone studio doing their first and only game. This way of thinking can be deceptive. They are part of ZeniMax Media, a company that has built an empire out of sales of $60 boxes and a few followup DLC. ZOS shows all the signs of this manner of thinking.
ZeniMax Media has a ton of money from Fallout 4, Dishonored, Doom 4, and other games. ZOS has to balance the books, but ZeniMax is not going to let ZOS fail. It is still years before Elder Scrolls 6 comes out. They will supplement to cover any shortfalls to keep ESO afloat. (EDIT: If the internal perception is that ESO is strong, there will be another game between Fallout 4 and Elder Scrolls 6. If the internal perception is that ESO is sinking, Elder Scrolls 6 will be the next game out of Bethesda Game Studios. I think that Elder Scrolls 6 has been postponed to allow BGS to work on something new.)
Crown Crates are a way to even out cyclical revenue and help to balance the books. After Gold+DLC Pack+One Tamriel, there will be no new boxes to sell until at least 2018, if they continue to follow that model.
As far as gamble boxes go, you will have to search to find a more mild implementation anywhere else, especially if they keep their word about convenience and customization only. All ZOS has to do is stick by their word. It will be hard for them, with little demons pulling at them every day to do more, in addition to the people inside the Studio and at ZeniMax and Bethesda. People will want them to get closer to the line, or move the line (as they did with RNG boxes). It all depends on Firor and how much he wants to stick by those statements, which some will feel to be a pretty bleak outlook.
Although, that said, I think that One Tamriel is a big gamble for them. It is the way to go, but to succeed, the vision and implementation have to be spot on. It has to give the open world play that Elder Scrolls is known for while preserving RPG and MMO longevity. It has to keep people playing without turning it into Goldilocks Online by holding our hand and making sure our porridge is just right. ZOS is good with vision, but they tend to fall short in implementation. If One Tamriel sinks ESO, no gamble box on the planet will save it.
One Tamriel would not be a problem at all, if they would follow the suggestion to implement an individual difficulty slider - this would not be a problem in a PvE only area. What I have heard from people so far is, that many are afraid of that One Tamriel will turn out to be either too less of a challenge or too much of it - and no one really wants an average middle-ground, where no one would be happy with it - THIS is the problem with One Tamriel IMO - a difficulty slider would solve this problem.
ever been on a cruise?
you know the deal.... boat, a load of cabins. go look at.....sea. whales, icebergs or glaciers maybe. tropical islands that kind of stuff.
who should make the decisions there?
the captain and crew who, we hope, are at least qualified to sail the boat.
or the passengers who, at best, are a bunch of dilettantes?
Well, yeah, but if I sign up for a tropical cruise, I'd better not be seeing icebergs. That is the risk with One Tamriel.
And, if I get out in the tropics and end up at an island that looks like it never recovered from the last hurricane because the cruise line was too cheap to go to better places? What do I do? Spend time in the ship gift shop?
you make fair points....
but icebergs in the tropics are possible and the hurricane could have struck after you set sail....
it could be a disaster. but, so far i am enjoying what zos has served up.
is it perfect? no.
is there a perfect mmo?
will there ever be an mmo that satisfies all our dilettante wants?
0
This discussion has been closed.