The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Maintenance for the week of April 29:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 29
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 29
The Impenetrable Trait & Item Sets
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Darlon✭✭✭✭✭Not including veteran dungeons at CP160 (esppecially WGT, ICP,Ruins of Mazzatun and Cradle of Shadows) is unacceptable... Nobody wants those dungeon sets in Training and Prosperous...1 -
phreatophile✭✭✭✭✭
✭Baby step in the right direction.
We'll still have to wade through heaps of trash drops for everything but trials.
Remove decon trash traits from CP160 loot tables entirely and while you're at it fix the 99% underleveled junk drops in Scaled DLC zones.0 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Seems like changing the loot tables should be pretty easy.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
ZOS_JessicaFolsomCommunity ManagerI hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We need to check with the Itemization & PVP teams about this – we’ll let you know next week.UltimaJoe777 wrote: »When is Nirnhoned joining the fray? Also when will Nirncrux be more widespread? Seriously why do we still HAVE Nirnhoned?!
Also why isn't Impenetrable in those tables?
We're working on some things for One Tamriel and Update 12 that will make Nirnhoned and Nirncrux more readily available than it is now. We'll share specifics after we put out the official Update 12 announcement.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.Is there any word on possibly adding a token system to deal with particularly bad luck denying us certain sets in our preferred traits?
Not at this time, but the ability to trade bind-on-pickup items with group members that is coming out with Update 11 should help ease streaks of bad luck with item drops.0 -
d8rmir✭✭✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Is there any word on possibly adding a token system to deal with particularly bad luck denying us certain sets in our preferred traits?
Not at this time, but the ability to trade bind-on-pickup items with group members that is coming out with Update 11 should help ease streaks of bad luck with item drops.
I don't really see how this is going to help players getting the maelstrom weapons they need....4 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
Currently warhorn, a PvP skill, is the most critical thing in the game for competitive PvE. If this justification is a real thing, maybe you should remove warhorn and vigor from the alliance war section. That way PvErs are not forced to PvP to be competitive. This is not a very smart approach to balancing the loot tables, but if this is your approach, it needs to go both ways.
Edited by timidobserver on July 26, 2016 2:43PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)11 -
OdinForge✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Sir it seems the overwhelming majority of the community wants impen back in the loot tables, what do we do?
I think that means we shouldn't add impen back to the loot table. - ZOS 2016The Age of Wrobel.3 -
Preyfar✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭UltimaJoe777 wrote: »Also why isn't Impenetrable in those tables?
My issue with this is that, as a PVPer, most PVP folk are forced to do it anyway. Most of the really competitive sets are trials and dungeon related (including Maelstrom weapons) so it already forces the PVP community into that content to be really competitive.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.Edited by Preyfar on July 26, 2016 2:43PM4 -
Divinius✭✭✭✭✭
✭
This. I loathe PvP, but I'm forced to do it to be able unlock the skills in the two alliance war trees.timidobserver wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
Currently warhorn, a PvP skill, is the most critical thing in the game for competitive PvE. If this justification is a real thing, maybe you should remove warhorn and vigor from the alliance war section. That way PvErs are not forced to PvP to be competitive. This is not a very smart approach to balancing the loot tables, but if this is your approach, it needs to go both ways.
1 -
Transairion✭✭✭✭✭Sir it seems the overwhelming majority of the community wants impen back in the loot tables, what do we do?
I think that means we shouldn't add impen back to the loot table. - ZOS 2016
What community, the PvPers? Unless you PvP so much you want a full PvP set of gear, you'll never want an Impen drop.
They also outright said they're re-adding Impen to everything but Trials, the hardest PvE group content.Items drops in the overland and in dungeons will have a chance of dropping with all available Traits, including Impenetrable
I'm sorry but what's so hard to understand that top-tier PvErs probably want to get Impen gear as much as they want Training gear? Not every Trial piece set is a must-have for PvP (a lot of them have VS bosses effects or 5-peices that only activate on synergy use).
Yet having Impen added to literally everything outside Trials isn't good enough...?
Edited by Transairion on July 26, 2016 2:49PM1 -
Preyfar✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
On that same note, Purge is a PVP Support skill, and it's seriously useful (and almost required) in vSO to work with the Magicka bomb mechanics. You can use other skills, but Purge's costs are such that it's too good NOT to have as a dump. A lot of people use Siege Shield as an alternate just to stay alive.
This. I loathe PvP, but I'm forced to do it to be able unlock the skills in the two alliance war trees.timidobserver wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
Currently warhorn, a PvP skill, is the most critical thing in the game for competitive PvE. If this justification is a real thing, maybe you should remove warhorn and vigor from the alliance war section. That way PvErs are not forced to PvP to be competitive. This is not a very smart approach to balancing the loot tables, but if this is your approach, it needs to go both ways.1 -
rhapsodious✭✭✭✭✭
✭timidobserver wrote: »If this justification is a real thing, maybe you should remove warhorn and vigor from the alliance war section. That way PvErs are not forced to PvP to be competitive. This is not a very smart approach to balancing the loot tables, but if this is your approach, it needs to go both ways.
+1. Vigor is the Stamina heal. If you're stamina and need a self-heal, you're probably going to be using Vigor. It's just a fact. Add into that that Warhorn is all but required on trials healers and/or tanks (correct me if I'm wrong, I think it's appreciated on tanks but mandatory on healers) and you have a contingent of your PVE community "forced" to PVP. Caltrops, Barrier, Purge and Proxy Det notwithstanding, as those are certainly good skills but aren't mandatory on a build.
If you put out a poll, I'm almost certain that a large portion of PVPers really wouldn't mind running normal modes of trials (nSO is a joke compared to vSO, and nMaw is still plenty doable provided you follow directions, the tank and off-tank know what they're doing, and you have two people who are good at running) to get Impenetrable gear. I really think that this decision should be revisited.
Also, @ZOS_JessicaFolsom , is there a reason why Prosperous and Training were chosen to not be removed from the DLC dungeons? I mean ICP, WGT, and the two new dungeons for next week. These set items involve a lot of RNG anyway and my Training SPC belt makes me twitch whenever I look at it. I'm wondering if this was a deliberate decision or an oversight.Edited by rhapsodious on July 26, 2016 2:53PM0 -
Grumble_and_Grunt✭✭✭✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We need to check with the Itemization & PVP teams about this – we’ll let you know next week.UltimaJoe777 wrote: »When is Nirnhoned joining the fray? Also when will Nirncrux be more widespread? Seriously why do we still HAVE Nirnhoned?!
Also why isn't Impenetrable in those tables?
We're working on some things for One Tamriel and Update 12 that will make Nirnhoned and Nirncrux more readily available than it is now. We'll share specifics after we put out the official Update 12 announcement.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.Is there any word on possibly adding a token system to deal with particularly bad luck denying us certain sets in our preferred traits?
Not at this time, but the ability to trade bind-on-pickup items with group members that is coming out with Update 11 should help ease streaks of bad luck with item drops.
@ZOS_JessicaFolsom Please forward what I say to whomever made this decision upon themselves on behalf of the PvP community. You DO NOT have to force PvP players to PvE if you make the item sets BoE for most part as is already the case in SO with Skirmisher, Viper, Dreugh King etc and as the sets in HRC and AA were beforehand.
Also what about the people who actively PvP and PvE aka play the game for full who are now also neglected in creating fun optimal builds. ALL this does is segregate the PvP community from content...Impenetrable is too much a staple trait in PvP as Divines is for PvE how about remove Divines from all the PvP sets and see how the PvE players of the game react to that? Time and time again PvP players are neglected and justified with false validations. You do not want to make PvP players run trials even though could make the item sets BoE as many useful ones will be, instead the genius solution is to just exclude the sets from the PvP community and then say about remaining competitive in Cyrodiill and Imperial City?? Well we can no longer use the sets if impenetrable is excluded from the loot table and remain competitive the irony of it all! BAH HUMBUGPC EU
Fix Powerful Assault
#3Qbiken3 -
DRXHarbinger✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We need to check with the Itemization & PVP teams about this – we’ll let you know next week.UltimaJoe777 wrote: »When is Nirnhoned joining the fray? Also when will Nirncrux be more widespread? Seriously why do we still HAVE Nirnhoned?!
Also why isn't Impenetrable in those tables?
We're working on some things for One Tamriel and Update 12 that will make Nirnhoned and Nirncrux more readily available than it is now. We'll share specifics after we put out the official Update 12 announcement.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.Is there any word on possibly adding a token system to deal with particularly bad luck denying us certain sets in our preferred traits?
Not at this time, but the ability to trade bind-on-pickup items with group members that is coming out with Update 11 should help ease streaks of bad luck with item drops.
@ZOS_JessicaFolsom we do need some impen quite soon though. Currently most of us have no way of researching impen atm. It's also being taken advantage of and people are jacking up impen prices in guild stores knowing they are so hard to come by. The only impen helmet I've found for sale in the past week cost me 200k ap. Guess what that was. Yes I researched a warden helm lol.
Forget trials with it, dungeons are perfectly fine to have impen if training etc comes out.PC Master Race
1001CP
8 Flawless Toons, all Classes.
Master Angler
Dro-M'artha Destroyer (at last)
Tamriel Hero
Grand Overlord
Every Skyshard
Down With BOP!0 -
ManDraKE✭✭✭✭✭
✭timidobserver wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
Currently warhorn, a PvP skill, is the most critical thing in the game for competitive PvE. If this justification is a real thing, maybe you should remove warhorn and vigor from the alliance war section. That way PvErs are not forced to PvP to be competitive. This is not a very smart approach to balancing the loot tables, but if this is your approach, it needs to go both ways.
warhorn don't take more than a few hours of PvP to unlock, there is no grind or RNG involved, even if you are the worst pvp player of the world you can get warhorn in less than a day. In order hand a PvP player will have to join a PvE Guild, make a PvE build for endgame trials, learn the mechanics and farm them for a very long time in order to get the sets on impen. Don't complain about things that are not an issue, and don't compare things that are not comparable.4 -
rhapsodious✭✭✭✭✭
✭timidobserver wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
Currently warhorn, a PvP skill, is the most critical thing in the game for competitive PvE. If this justification is a real thing, maybe you should remove warhorn and vigor from the alliance war section. That way PvErs are not forced to PvP to be competitive. This is not a very smart approach to balancing the loot tables, but if this is your approach, it needs to go both ways.
warhorn don't take more than a few hours of PvP to unlock, there is no grind or RNG involved, even if you are the worst pvp player of the world you can get warhorn in less than a day. In order hand a PvP player will have to join a PvE Guild, make a PvE build for endgame trials, learn the mechanics and farm them for a very long time in order to get the sets on impen. Don't complain about things that are not an issue, and don't compare things that are not comparable.
A PVP player doesn't have to do any of that. nSO is really a joke. Like, you can ignore most of the mechanics and stack and burn your way through it. If nAA and nHR are at most the same difficulty as they are now on Live, they can also be stacked and burned. The hardest part of getting trials gear will be getting 12 people. And with the bind on pickup trading, you can just tag along with a mostly-PVE guild and I'm sure they would love to trade their Impen VO pieces to you for a piece of gear you got/some gold! Takes about half an hour per run if you're guiding people through it, 15-20 if you're just blasting your way through it.
The point was that Jessica said they don't want to force PVP players to run PVE content. But as-is, they're requiring more than a few PVE players to run PVP content.1 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
Currently warhorn, a PvP skill, is the most critical thing in the game for competitive PvE. If this justification is a real thing, maybe you should remove warhorn and vigor from the alliance war section. That way PvErs are not forced to PvP to be competitive. This is not a very smart approach to balancing the loot tables, but if this is your approach, it needs to go both ways.
warhorn don't take more than a few hours of PvP to unlock, there is no grind or RNG involved, even if you are the worst pvp player of the world you can get warhorn in less than a day. In order hand a PvP player will have to join a PvE Guild, make a PvE build for endgame trials, learn the mechanics and farm them for a very long time in order to get the sets on impen. Don't complain about things that are not an issue, and don't compare things that are not comparable.
The moment I made that post I knew that someone was going to miss the point and puff out their chest before boasting about how long it takes them to get warhorn.Edited by timidobserver on July 26, 2016 3:25PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)5 -
daemonios✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
I understand you're just the messenger, but IMHO that is a seriously misguided position for ZOS to take.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
Firstly, this wouldn't force anyone to do any sort of content. If people want the sets, they run the dungeons/trials. As others have already said, PvP players have to do vMA to get maelstrom weapons, while PvE players have to PvP in order to get Magicka Detonation, Warhorn, Vigor or Purge.
Secondly, by forcing a hard separation between what is meant for PvP and what is meant for PvE you're deepening the divide between these communities. I've already said I don't PvP much myself, but it saddens me that the player base have dug themselves into these trenches and each blame the other for all problems in the game, and rather than trying to fix this ZOS is actually enabling it.
That doesn't work for vMA. It also depends on the kindness of your group members. There are already add-ons that spill the beans regarding what your mates got from loot, expect to see their use explode and people picking fights over whether someone did or didn't get a given piece of gear, and whether they can or cannot trade it. Also expect people to try to extort exorbitant prices for their lucky drops.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »
Not at this time, but the ability to trade bind-on-pickup items with group members that is coming out with Update 11 should help ease streaks of bad luck with item drops.Is there any word on possibly adding a token system to deal with particularly bad luck denying us certain sets in our preferred traits?1 -
zerosingularity✭✭✭✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We need to check with the Itemization & PVP teams about this – we’ll let you know next week.UltimaJoe777 wrote: »When is Nirnhoned joining the fray? Also when will Nirncrux be more widespread? Seriously why do we still HAVE Nirnhoned?!
Also why isn't Impenetrable in those tables?
We're working on some things for One Tamriel and Update 12 that will make Nirnhoned and Nirncrux more readily available than it is now. We'll share specifics after we put out the official Update 12 announcement.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.Is there any word on possibly adding a token system to deal with particularly bad luck denying us certain sets in our preferred traits?
Not at this time, but the ability to trade bind-on-pickup items with group members that is coming out with Update 11 should help ease streaks of bad luck with item drops.
Sounds fair, I think. Some of the good sets found in trials are sell-able via guild traders, so PvPers would not have to run content to get the items. They would need gold sure, but I still think impenetrable would be OK on trial/dungeon loot that is Bind on Equip.
Important question though, what about removing Charged from Maelstrom/Master weapons, since it is a 100% dead trait? (Even Decisive/Powered I see uses for on all the weapons.)NA-PC
Kaineth - Stamina Nightblade (Weakest Player Ever!)
Elena Stormwood - Magicka Sorcerer (vMA no Death 12/21/15 Score 401148)
Sheila Feyrondas - Magicka Dragonknight Tank (Frost staves are gonna be fun!)
*Disclaimer* I fail at emotional communication, so assume what I say is NOT meant to be offensive.0 -
code65536✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert You should make the BoE trial sets (Dreugh King Slayer, Silks of the Sun, Ebon, etc.) drop in Impenetrable.- You can get these drops in normal mode trials (and in fact, the easiest way to get them is in normal mode, since vet mode's loot table skews towards the BoP sets), which are very easy, arguably even easier than vet dungeons. Mechanics? What mechanics? In fact, when Dark Brotherhood released, I joined in a series of PUG farming runs of nSO that were comprised almost entirely of PvPers who were looking for Skirmisher and Dreugh King Slayer, with me being one of the few PvEers in the group.
- This division between PvEers and PvPers really doesn't make sense. A lot of players do both, and players should be encouraged to do both. It's not healthy to segregate the two communities like this. And, again, normal mode trials are very accessible and easily within the grasp of casual groups.
- Since these sets are BoE, any PvPer who absolutely refuses to step foot into PvE could just buy or trade for it. This is good for the in-game economy.
Edited by code65536 on July 26, 2016 3:49PMNightfighters ― PC/NA and PC/EU
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Extended Journal Add-Ons: Item Set Browser ― Loot Log ― Character Knowledge ― Event Collectibles ― RaidificatorOther Add-Ons: Combat Alerts ― Deconstruction Junk Marker ― Purge Tracker ― vHoF Status Panel ― Asylum Status Panel ― Smart Looter ― Improved Companion Rapport Information2 -
majulook✭✭✭✭✭
✭Can you make it so items you get from drops can have (1 time only) any trait you know applied to them at a crafting area?
Similar as to how you can improve items.Si vis pacem, para bellum0 -
Footfalls✭✭✭
Good. Don't you guys see the reasoning behind this? This reduces grind for PvP players and means that they don't have to grind endgame PvE trials for top tier PvP gear. I hate grinding, anything to reduce this is fine by me.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We have an update for you. We will be making the following changes to Trait attainability with the launch of Update 12:- Prosperous and Training will be removed as a valid Trait for all items that drop in Trials
- Valid Traits for Trials and Leaderboard rewards are as follows:
- Weapons – Infused, Powered, Precise, Defending, Sharpened, Charged, Decisive
- Armor – Infused, Divines, Well-Fitted, Reinforced, Sturdy
- Items drops in the overland and in dungeons will have a chance of dropping with all available Traits, including Impenetrable
Thank you all for sharing your thoughts with us on this subject. We appreciate how constructive this discussion has been, and the ideas shared.
And to those saying that the time taken for grinding to vigor/caltrops is the same as for grinding trials for gear? Really...
And what trials gear is going to be used for PvP anyway? Vicious Ophidian is so bad, all those wasted +crit and +minor slayer set bonuses, all in exchange for major expedition when you kill someone. Seems sub par.Edited by Footfalls on July 26, 2016 4:41PM0 -
daemonios✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Good. Don't you guys see the reasoning behind this? This reduces grind for PvP players and means that they don't have to grind endgame PvE trials for top tier PvP gear.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We have an update for you. We will be making the following changes to Trait attainability with the launch of Update 12:- Prosperous and Training will be removed as a valid Trait for all items that drop in Trials
- Valid Traits for Trials and Leaderboard rewards are as follows:
- Weapons – Infused, Powered, Precise, Defending, Sharpened, Charged, Decisive
- Armor – Infused, Divines, Well-Fitted, Reinforced, Sturdy
- Items drops in the overland and in dungeons will have a chance of dropping with all available Traits, including Impenetrable
Thank you all for sharing your thoughts with us on this subject. We appreciate how constructive this discussion has been, and the ideas shared.
And to those saying that the time taken for grinding to vigor/caltrops is the same as for grinding trials for gear? Really...
Good that ZOS is making that choice for every single one of them, right? Also, we know everyone who PvPs only ever PvPs, there's no chance they might actually appreciate doing trials and wish they could use the sets in PvP.
This reasoning is just idiotic.0 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Good. Don't you guys see the reasoning behind this? This reduces grind for PvP players and means that they don't have to grind endgame PvE trials for top tier PvP gear.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We have an update for you. We will be making the following changes to Trait attainability with the launch of Update 12:- Prosperous and Training will be removed as a valid Trait for all items that drop in Trials
- Valid Traits for Trials and Leaderboard rewards are as follows:
- Weapons – Infused, Powered, Precise, Defending, Sharpened, Charged, Decisive
- Armor – Infused, Divines, Well-Fitted, Reinforced, Sturdy
- Items drops in the overland and in dungeons will have a chance of dropping with all available Traits, including Impenetrable
Thank you all for sharing your thoughts with us on this subject. We appreciate how constructive this discussion has been, and the ideas shared.
And to those saying that the time taken for grinding to vigor/caltrops is the same as for grinding trials for gear? Really...
Good that ZOS is making that choice for every single one of them, right? Also, we know everyone who PvPs only ever PvPs, there's no chance they might actually appreciate doing trials and wish they could use the sets in PvP.
This reasoning is just idiotic.
Not really a lot of people want to use certain sets in pvp, but because of them not coming in impen they aren't viable.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...0 -
daemonios✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »
Good. Don't you guys see the reasoning behind this? This reduces grind for PvP players and means that they don't have to grind endgame PvE trials for top tier PvP gear.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We have an update for you. We will be making the following changes to Trait attainability with the launch of Update 12:- Prosperous and Training will be removed as a valid Trait for all items that drop in Trials
- Valid Traits for Trials and Leaderboard rewards are as follows:
- Weapons – Infused, Powered, Precise, Defending, Sharpened, Charged, Decisive
- Armor – Infused, Divines, Well-Fitted, Reinforced, Sturdy
- Items drops in the overland and in dungeons will have a chance of dropping with all available Traits, including Impenetrable
Thank you all for sharing your thoughts with us on this subject. We appreciate how constructive this discussion has been, and the ideas shared.
And to those saying that the time taken for grinding to vigor/caltrops is the same as for grinding trials for gear? Really...
Good that ZOS is making that choice for every single one of them, right? Also, we know everyone who PvPs only ever PvPs, there's no chance they might actually appreciate doing trials and wish they could use the sets in PvP.
This reasoning is just idiotic.
Not really a lot of people want to use certain sets in pvp, but because of them not coming in impen they aren't viable.
Sorry if I wasn't clear, I was being sarcastic. It's obvious to me that every set should come in every *useful* trait so that people can use them regardless of being "PvPers" or "PvEers". By denying the impenetrable trait in trials, ZOS has made it impossible to effectively use those sets in PvP for many builds, and now they justify it as not wanting them to *force* them to grind PvE content, as if anyone was forcing anyone else to do it. So basically, in order not to *force* some abstract PvPer, no PvPer gets to use those sets. If that isn't a deranged argument, I don't know what is.0 -
Footfalls✭✭✭
No, I can just as easily flip the reasoning around. Once you add impen to trials sets, and one of them turns out to be godlike in PvP, that forces every PvP player who wants to be competitive to grind trials for them whether they want to or not.
Good. Don't you guys see the reasoning behind this? This reduces grind for PvP players and means that they don't have to grind endgame PvE trials for top tier PvP gear.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We have an update for you. We will be making the following changes to Trait attainability with the launch of Update 12:- Prosperous and Training will be removed as a valid Trait for all items that drop in Trials
- Valid Traits for Trials and Leaderboard rewards are as follows:
- Weapons – Infused, Powered, Precise, Defending, Sharpened, Charged, Decisive
- Armor – Infused, Divines, Well-Fitted, Reinforced, Sturdy
- Items drops in the overland and in dungeons will have a chance of dropping with all available Traits, including Impenetrable
Thank you all for sharing your thoughts with us on this subject. We appreciate how constructive this discussion has been, and the ideas shared.
And to those saying that the time taken for grinding to vigor/caltrops is the same as for grinding trials for gear? Really...
Good that ZOS is making that choice for every single one of them, right? Also, we know everyone who PvPs only ever PvPs, there's no chance they might actually appreciate doing trials and wish they could use the sets in PvP.
This reasoning is just idiotic.
Not to mention I can't think of a trials set that would be good for PvP. Every crit and minor slayer bonus is just wasted.0 -
daemonios✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
No, I can just as easily flip the reasoning around. Once you add impen to trials sets, and one of them turns out to be godlike in PvP, that forces every PvP player who wants to be competitive to grind trials for them whether they want to or not.
Good. Don't you guys see the reasoning behind this? This reduces grind for PvP players and means that they don't have to grind endgame PvE trials for top tier PvP gear.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We have an update for you. We will be making the following changes to Trait attainability with the launch of Update 12:- Prosperous and Training will be removed as a valid Trait for all items that drop in Trials
- Valid Traits for Trials and Leaderboard rewards are as follows:
- Weapons – Infused, Powered, Precise, Defending, Sharpened, Charged, Decisive
- Armor – Infused, Divines, Well-Fitted, Reinforced, Sturdy
- Items drops in the overland and in dungeons will have a chance of dropping with all available Traits, including Impenetrable
Thank you all for sharing your thoughts with us on this subject. We appreciate how constructive this discussion has been, and the ideas shared.
And to those saying that the time taken for grinding to vigor/caltrops is the same as for grinding trials for gear? Really...
Good that ZOS is making that choice for every single one of them, right? Also, we know everyone who PvPs only ever PvPs, there's no chance they might actually appreciate doing trials and wish they could use the sets in PvP.
This reasoning is just idiotic.
Not to mention I can't think of a trials set that would be good for PvP. Every crit and minor slayer bonus is just wasted.
Remember when many stamina PvE builds used Ravager? That's a PvP set, and tradeable. By your logic, it should never have come in divines or infused, lest some PvE scrub might pick it up and make a decent build.
The point is that ZOS are carving a moat between PvP and PvE, and it's not making the game any better, in fact it's doing the opposite.0 -
Paraflex✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »I hope this means Tel Var sets will come in sturdy now also?
If that is true, then this is wonderful news indeed.
We are not adding Impenetrable to the Trait loot tables at this time. We don't want to make our PVP community feel forced to run Trials – our most difficult PVE content – in order to remain competitive in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
Currently warhorn, a PvP skill, is the most critical thing in the game for competitive PvE. If this justification is a real thing, maybe you should remove warhorn and vigor from the alliance war section. That way PvErs are not forced to PvP to be competitive. This is not a very smart approach to balancing the loot tables, but if this is your approach, it needs to go both ways.
It's not like its super hard to get those skills lol.Hollykills CP 630 Templar Healer - Ad PS4 Warlord Rank
Max Stam/Mag Dk
Max Stam Sorc
Max Stam/Mag NB
Don't care to dps much so I heal.0 -
Footfalls✭✭✭
No, I can just as easily flip the reasoning around. Once you add impen to trials sets, and one of them turns out to be godlike in PvP, that forces every PvP player who wants to be competitive to grind trials for them whether they want to or not.
Good. Don't you guys see the reasoning behind this? This reduces grind for PvP players and means that they don't have to grind endgame PvE trials for top tier PvP gear.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We have an update for you. We will be making the following changes to Trait attainability with the launch of Update 12:- Prosperous and Training will be removed as a valid Trait for all items that drop in Trials
- Valid Traits for Trials and Leaderboard rewards are as follows:
- Weapons – Infused, Powered, Precise, Defending, Sharpened, Charged, Decisive
- Armor – Infused, Divines, Well-Fitted, Reinforced, Sturdy
- Items drops in the overland and in dungeons will have a chance of dropping with all available Traits, including Impenetrable
Thank you all for sharing your thoughts with us on this subject. We appreciate how constructive this discussion has been, and the ideas shared.
And to those saying that the time taken for grinding to vigor/caltrops is the same as for grinding trials for gear? Really...
Good that ZOS is making that choice for every single one of them, right? Also, we know everyone who PvPs only ever PvPs, there's no chance they might actually appreciate doing trials and wish they could use the sets in PvP.
This reasoning is just idiotic.
Not to mention I can't think of a trials set that would be good for PvP. Every crit and minor slayer bonus is just wasted.
Remember when many stamina PvE builds used Ravager? That's a PvP set, and tradeable. By your logic, it should never have come in divines or infused, lest some PvE scrub might pick it up and make a decent build.
The point is that ZOS are carving a moat between PvP and PvE, and it's not making the game any better, in fact it's doing the opposite.
Wait, are any PvP sets being used in PvE now? No, because it was a smart design decision to not force PvE players to grind PvP for sets. Hell if ZOS removed every trait other than impen from PvP sets and divines for PvE sets I'd be fine too, but of course they want to leave *** traits in order to keep people grinding for the perfect traits. Removing prosperous and training from endgame trials is a step in the right direction.
And don't talk about forcing PvE players to play PvP to get vigor/caltrops, it's like one day of grinding tops (24 hrs PvPing) and you still have people complaining about that. It's not at all comparable to grinding trials until you get the gear you want.Edited by Footfalls on July 26, 2016 5:06PM0 -
Transairion✭✭✭✭✭Not really a lot of people want to use certain sets in pvp, but because of them not coming in impen they aren't viable.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: if we've gotten to the point where any item that doesn't come in Impen (crit damage reduction) is not viable for PvP at all, then Impen should be removed entirely and it's effect should be baseline in PvP.
I believe all the non-Impen users in PvP are considered "cannonfodder", aka easy AP.
It's all well and good for PvPers to have a chance at it, sure, but you have to realise PvErs WILL get Bound sets in Impen as well under that system... so what, just too bad for them I guess? It's top-tier PvE content, getting a PvP trait may as well be getting nothing for a PvEr and that's not really fair. The content isn't designed for PvPers to farm PvP loot...
Imagine you're one of, what, the dozen people who can clear Vet Maw of Lorkjaw now at final boss and after hours of work you get Impen on a PvE set... there's a very good reason ZOS doesn't want to slap Impen into Trials at a whim.1
