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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668104/
• PC/Mac: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – November 1, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC)
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668104/
Shameful Metoer cheats from a top EP guild NA Trueflame
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Mako1132✭✭✭✭✭KisoValley wrote: »KisoValley wrote: »KisoValley wrote: »
Exactly. ZOS have known about this all along, and because they've done nothing about it this is what has happened. Don't blame the players for exploiting it, ZOS are basically saying it's fine to do it seeing as they've done nothing about it for so long.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDML4qKekGY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znZvXiU6f0E
Ban these idiots and FIX THIS PROBLEM. This is GAME BREAKING.
So tell me. Without these "idiots", who are blatantly and doing this openly (perhaps to prove a point?) how else would anyone know??
I mean I haven't seen you (and many now vocal others) campaigning against the very prevalent speed hacks....
Just sayin'.
On the other hand for the sake of the game ofc this needs to be fixed asap. Literally, ASAP.
Everyone doing this should be perma banned no questions asked.
ZOS is aware, and the people you're calling out have made them aware in the past. It's just not good form to publish hacks and exploits (and against the TOS). However, I believe there's a point where if something becomes as widespread as it seemingly is right now that it's ok to be vocal about it.
This happened precisely because of players spreading the knowledge and encouraging it. ZOS never said it was ok, or that you wouldn't be banned for it. You don't know what actions ZOS has taken regarding hackers/exploiters because they don't tell you about it. The only thing ZOS is guilty of is preventing use of the program for so long, but again that's not to say they haven't done anything. It's entirely on the players. Every one of us has the option to do what you know is the right thing to do.
It's been around forever. They literally have 0 protection against this and it's been going on for just as long, just people actually cared and made sure they didn't make it obvious when they were exploiting (apart from speed hacks, pretty difficult to hide that). I mean Jagex (who are a terrible company btw) run a terrible MMO called Runescape and even they have protection against Cheat Engine with far less money, resources and staff.
Blame the players all you want... ZOS brought it upon themselves.
I don't have a way of stopping someone from shooting me. That doesn't mean if I get shot, I brought it upon myself. The person with the gun is at fault. ZOS should be preventing this because they are capable of doing it (hopefully), but that doesn't mean they're at fault for the actions of certain players or that they somehow deserved it. Get real man.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Hi Jessica,
What are the chances of seeing some sort of reply after the investigation with a report of action taken (not name and shamed just an idea of whether its something which is actually enforced). Things like this seriously discredit the game and generally the lack of information furthers the problem. Thanks.
We'll see what we can do. It's not an unreasonable request, especially considering the circumstances.
Awesome
Actually, if you shoot them first, you've stopped them shooting you. Also if you don't *** their sister or whatever you did to *** them off to the point they'll shoot you that'll also stop them shooting you.
As for ZOS should hopefully be preventing this? They have no tools or people in place who can or know how to track who is using it. The only people who will get banned are those who just don't give a *** or don't take ZOS serious enough and let themselves be vidded exploiting.
Please, it wouldn't play out like some 1800's western duel. Now you're straying from the topic and proving you don't know what you're talking about.
As for the second part, other companies don't either and they get along just fine. The difference is, like I originally was saying to you, the players have actual morals in those games and don't hack the game for whatever god awful reason they could have. It's entirely up to the players how they act.
How ZOS responds will be the most important factor, not whether they can completely prevent it. I do hope they can find a way to prevent it though, and unlike most people I have at least some faith it will happen.5 -
God_flakes✭✭✭✭✭
✭God_flakes wrote: »
You know, I was going to agree with that post, but then you had to go and sayGod_flakes wrote: »We cancelled raid tonight because of this. I solo'd on my v2 just to have some fun, and after not encountering any of this and a few guildies wanting to join, we started a small group. Ended up running with friends and getting a large group going, and I'll say this, not one of the enemy groups we fought did this BS, so THANK YOU. Regardless of whether we dislike each other or not, regardless of group size and the usual petty crap, we had only one instance of a single person spamming meteor early on in the night and it was during a fight that would have been a wipe for us even without that.
I was pretty disheartened watching this thread all day long, but to the few guilds on TF left playing, thanks for restoring at least a little faith in the pvp community.
Guard ran a small group last night (seemed most people didn't want to pvp) after we played in the sewers all day. I also didn't see any groups running anything suspicious but Barra and I did witness an EP running Go Go Gadget legs north of bleakers. They were running faster than any person I've ever seen in the game. I message them and of course called them out on it and their response was "I'm an Orc with maxed speed". <eyeroll>
I then had to sit there and wonder about all those times I saw someone with infinite health and infinite stamina and running so fast nobody could catch them and super fast WB's and people I've seen inside keeps that shouldn't have been able to get in there. I always knew something suspicious was going on but I guess I am naive to stuff like this. I had no idea there was some easily accessible program out there. Ixty has threatened to G-kick anyone using this program but I know he's the exception not the rule. I've witnessed how dishonorable EP as a faction can be when they stack 40 players against 5. I don't believe for a minute those same players wouldn't totally take advantage of something like this to give them an edge. And it's so disheartening because there are so many of us who love this game and devote so much time to our characters and doing things RIGHT. Zos is actually punishing us at this point by not doing anything about this and for letting this go on as long as it has.
I mean, c'mon. Are you really going to suggest that a) EP as a faction are unique in 40v5, and b) because people would steamtrain zerg that those people would also be into hacking the game client? That's complete and utter garbage.I've witnessed how dishonorable EP as a faction can be when they stack 40 players against 5. I don't believe for a minute those same players wouldn't totally take advantage of something like this to give them an edge.
Fine. And I will say this this...I find this all very coincidental just a mere few days after the infamous PM thread/video where PM can be heard to be accusing certain people of cheating. Those people came here with their righteous indignation and demanded apologies. Now some in this community are left to wonder, is it true? Was PM right? Have their experience with certain people led them to suspect an "edge"? 3, 2, 1 to when those people come here and blast me and *insist* on an apology from me, as well. There are people who are "good" and then there are people who seem strangely good. And I do believe a hyper competitive personality often is driven to cheat to sustain their ego. All I am saying is I wouldn't be knocked over by a feather if it came out that many people are cheating with this very easy to obtain program...many more than we think and many the community has had naive respect for.
Well sure, you can say that, because that still isn't making the broad leap of 'faction zerged 40v5' -> 'faction must use programs to cheat'. You've been around long enough to know that all factions will blob quite happily when the time is right. Just as someone who's played EP predominantly since launch, I refuse to be painted with the same brush as those that are cheating, and I suspect many of my fellow EP would be in a similar boat.
Why am I surprised you glossed over my nod to PM (whom I detest because of their dishonorable pvp behavior, and I'm not just talking stacking 40 on 5, there are many things EP has done the past 2 months that demo their overall anticompetitive behavior and all have been hashed over here again and again) and rather got hung up on one issue? I am trying to redeem PM and validate their claims in that video and at least give them the benefit of the doubt (because I'm sure PM has lots of players who aren't cheating) that their run-ins with certain top tier players may have been what has caused their accusations and suspicions. I admit I have had the same run-ins and suspicions.
And LOL@ someone saying "quick to cry exploits scrubs". Really???? Here we sit one day after this whole thing has been blown open sky high (by a top streamer) and STILL we have liars and deniars trying to shame those of us who *dare* try to bring about real and legit changes to the current corrupted and blackened condition of Cyrodiil *because* of the element of cheating! Which we all see is as easy as d/l and run!3 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well now we've also learned that the 3 hit combo in 1 second is not good animation canceling but in fact a byproduct of the cheat engine speed up dynamic . Great . So now anytime someone gets killed instantly by a 3 hit combo expect to get reported as well with the cheat engine as the culprit . I always wondered why I couldn't duplicate it , now I know .4 -
KisoValley✭✭✭✭✭KisoValley wrote: »KisoValley wrote: »KisoValley wrote: »
Exactly. ZOS have known about this all along, and because they've done nothing about it this is what has happened. Don't blame the players for exploiting it, ZOS are basically saying it's fine to do it seeing as they've done nothing about it for so long.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDML4qKekGYhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znZvXiU6f0E
Ban these idiots and FIX THIS PROBLEM. This is GAME BREAKING.
So tell me. Without these "idiots", who are blatantly and doing this openly (perhaps to prove a point?) how else would anyone know??
I mean I haven't seen you (and many now vocal others) campaigning against the very prevalent speed hacks....
Just sayin'.
On the other hand for the sake of the game ofc this needs to be fixed asap. Literally, ASAP.
Everyone doing this should be perma banned no questions asked.
ZOS is aware, and the people you're calling out have made them aware in the past. It's just not good form to publish hacks and exploits (and against the TOS). However, I believe there's a point where if something becomes as widespread as it seemingly is right now that it's ok to be vocal about it.
This happened precisely because of players spreading the knowledge and encouraging it. ZOS never said it was ok, or that you wouldn't be banned for it. You don't know what actions ZOS has taken regarding hackers/exploiters because they don't tell you about it. The only thing ZOS is guilty of is preventing use of the program for so long, but again that's not to say they haven't done anything. It's entirely on the players. Every one of us has the option to do what you know is the right thing to do.
It's been around forever. They literally have 0 protection against this and it's been going on for just as long, just people actually cared and made sure they didn't make it obvious when they were exploiting (apart from speed hacks, pretty difficult to hide that). I mean Jagex (who are a terrible company btw) run a terrible MMO called Runescape and even they have protection against Cheat Engine with far less money, resources and staff.
Blame the players all you want... ZOS brought it upon themselves.
I don't have a way of stopping someone from shooting me. That doesn't mean if I get shot, I brought it upon myself. The person with the gun is at fault. ZOS should be preventing this because they are capable of doing it (hopefully), but that doesn't mean they're at fault for the actions of certain players or that they somehow deserved it. Get real man.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Hi Jessica,
What are the chances of seeing some sort of reply after the investigation with a report of action taken (not name and shamed just an idea of whether its something which is actually enforced). Things like this seriously discredit the game and generally the lack of information furthers the problem. Thanks.
We'll see what we can do. It's not an unreasonable request, especially considering the circumstances.
Awesome
Actually, if you shoot them first, you've stopped them shooting you. Also if you don't *** their sister or whatever you did to *** them off to the point they'll shoot you that'll also stop them shooting you.
As for ZOS should hopefully be preventing this? They have no tools or people in place who can or know how to track who is using it. The only people who will get banned are those who just don't give a *** or don't take ZOS serious enough and let themselves be vidded exploiting.
Please, it wouldn't play out like some 1800's western duel. Now you're straying from the topic and proving you don't know what you're talking about.
As for the second part, other companies don't either and they get along just fine. The difference is, like I originally was saying to you, the players have actual morals in those games and don't hack the game for whatever god awful reason they could have. It's entirely up to the players how they act.
How ZOS responds will be the most important factor, not whether they can completely prevent it. I do hope they can find a way to prevent it though, and unlike most people I have at least some faith it will happen.
1. I was joking around because I thought you were comparing being shot to ZOS bringing it on themselves, but if you want to think that I don't know what I'm talking about go ahead lol.
2. Wrong unfortunately. The example I've used over the past few days and even before in this conversation is Runescape. Jagex have a very very *** budget, very very *** resources and a very very *** amount of staff working on both servers. Funnily enough though, they were able to stop people running Cheat Engine and even tracked people using it before they had the tools to get rid of it completely from their game because they hired the right people.
You have more faith than me. Everyone in my guild who have been playing MMOs since before Cheat Engine first came out, and everyone who has played MMOs that have been severely effected (affected? never have understood which to use) by Cheat Engine are very shocked that ZOS has no protection from it because it is such an old tool that it is basically irrelevant to all other top MMOs. I mean people have been using it since beta, how have ZOS not realised? Or have they realised and just not cared until Zazeer did what he did.
I agree that how ZOS responds is the most important factor. However unlike most it seems, I'm more bothered about fixing the game before banning all the people using it though.1 -
Lisbette✭✭✭This makes me sick, an EP kid who was already permabanned for hacking/exploiting and bought the game again did this to me 2 months ago. I should have reported him then.
-TAMERLIN
Knowing nothing about that fight and how many bodies were involved, that certainly could be a legit death recap if the shooting star hit enough people/got enough KBs to generate enough ult for a dawnbreaker immediately after. A lot of people do this, and it's not an exploit.
@Zheg some context to the fight. A vid plus this death recap really would tell the story better, but I wasn't recording. This was an insta death for me, 1 sec maybe less. As someone who's been playing since beta I know how long it takes to die from 1-2 people in PvP. FWIW I also considered that it might have been the ult gen from Shooting Star but there were only two other people near me (so that'd be 36 ult ) and even if there were 30 people around me the ult gen from Shooting Star isn't instant (or definitely not fast enough to get 85 Ult back in less than a second). I concluded that he was using Shooting Star to use the ult gen excuse when in reality it was hacks. The multi dawnbreaker was just the DoT, seen that plenty of times on a recap. Just have never seen two different ults from the same player within 1 sec of gameplay time. Anyone else I'd give the benefit of the doubt but again considering his past I stand by my assessment.
-Tam BamEdited by Lisbette on May 30, 2016 4:38PM3 -
KisoValley✭✭✭✭✭
Subtle things like slightly increased speed and dodge roll may not be easier to see, but the ultimate spamming is. Even Tava's won't let somebody spam meteors consecutively. But I get what you mean. Those who are smart about it are going to be hard to see, and may be too subtle to notice.KisoValley wrote: »ZOS should have GMs in game monitoring Cyrodiil on major fights. These exploits are REALLY easy to see live, and have killed PVP for me. And I say this as a former emp and someone who has put a ton of time into Cyrodiil. It makes me not want to go back.
Not all exploits are easy to see. Examples are: Infinite regen, or if someone is clever when using the infinite ult exploit. All it takes is someone to wear a costume, claim they're using BS/Tava's etc. and be smart about when they use ult. You're not going to calculate exactly when they have ult when fighting them but because they're wearing a costume you have no proof they're exploiting. Meanwhile they're in full DPS gear, with infinite regen/ult.
Some of course are easier to see.
I started getting upset a month ago with the shuffle stacking, and everyone told me it was just skill. I've been PVPing since launch, and what I was seeing then wasn't skill. When I watch 10+ people attack one guy who's dodging every single attack, ignoring caltrops, meteors and more, even radiants... that's NOT normal. But everyone said it was just skill. After what I saw last night... eugh. I dunno.
I am just severely discouraged.
Although I've never understood how people have shuffle stacked (sort of glad I haven't understood either) I 100% agree that when you see what is happening and you know of people who are cheating and going unnoticed, it is discouraging.2 -
Lisbette✭✭✭This makes me sick, an EP kid who was already permabanned for hacking/exploiting and bought the game again did this to me 2 months ago. I should have reported him then.
-TAMERLIN
Knowing nothing about that fight and how many bodies were involved, that certainly could be a legit death recap if the shooting star hit enough people/got enough KBs to generate enough ult for a dawnbreaker immediately after. A lot of people do this, and it's not an exploit.
@Zheg some context to the fight. A vid plus this death recap really would tell the story better, but I wasn't recording. This was an insta death for me, 1 sec maybe less. As someone who's been playing since beta I know how long it takes to die from 1-2 people in PvP. FWIW I also considered that it might have been the ult gen from Shooting Star but there were only two other people near me (so that'd be a whopping 18 ult ) and even if there were 30 people around me the ult gen from Shooting Star isn't instant (or definitely not fast enough to get 85 Ult back in less than a second). I concluded that he was using Shooting Star to use the ult gen excuse when in reality it was hacks. Anyone else I'd give the benefit of the doubt but again considering his past I stand by my assessment.
-Tam BamThis makes me sick, an EP kid who was already permabanned for hacking/exploiting and bought the game again did this to me 2 months ago. I should have reported him then.
-TAMERLIN
Everyone knows he wasn't permabanned for hacking OR exploiting. It was a silly reason and everyone remembers. Who are you trying to fool?
Jules really? You believe what he tells you, just go from there mmkay? Goodnight.
I've seen the emails.
Did they have the have official ZoS watermark lol. How hard would it be for someone to write on official sounding email "from Zos?"1 -
CyrusArya✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭God_flakes wrote: »
And LOL@ someone saying "quick to cry exploits scrubs". Really???? Here we sit one day after this whole thing has been blown open sky high (by a top streamer) and STILL we have liars and deniars trying to shame those of us who *dare* try to bring about real and legit changes to the current corrupted and blackened condition of Cyrodiil *because* of the element of cheating! Which we all see is as easy as d/l and run!
Did you even read the rest of my comment? If so did you comprehend what I'm saying? No one is denying cheating and exploiting happens, that would be pretty dumb in light of recent developments. My point is, just because cheating is possible doesn't mean every skilled player is cheating or exploiting. But that won't stop people like you from accusing honest players of being cheaters just because you lack the depth of perspective to understand what's going on. You will do so more adamantly now than ever before.
I'm not trying to shame you. Im just commenting on how tragic it is that legitimate players will be thrown under the bus for the actions of a pathetic minority of cheaters. It just makes me sad that the competitive aspect of this game is on life support right now. Because anyone can be cheating, the competitive integrity is ruined for all of us.
Edited by CyrusArya on May 30, 2016 4:59PM2 -
diskiukas✭✭✭Roehamad_Ali wrote: »Well now we've also learned that the 3 hit combo in 1 second is not good animation canceling but in fact a byproduct of the cheat engine speed up dynamic . Great . So now anytime someone gets killed instantly by a 3 hit combo expect to get reported as well with the cheat engine as the culprit . I always wondered why I couldn't duplicate it , now I know .
Funny thing is that after you post about this , so many would come and say blame lag for this or death recap etc. Been playing since release and believe me you know when you are killed by better player, because he is just that, better than you. His reaction is better, awareness, combos, quicker hands and mind etc, but so many times you were lying dead and thinking wtf just happened, open your death recap and see all kinds of things.Edited by diskiukas on May 30, 2016 4:52PM3 -
Lisbette✭✭✭I'm not trying to shame you. Im just commenting on how tragic it is that legitimate players will be thrown under the bus for the actions of a pathetic minority of cheaters. It just makes me sad that the competitive aspect of this game is on life support right now. Because anyone can be cheating, the competitive integrity is ruined for all of us.
qft2 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.Edited by timidobserver on May 30, 2016 5:12PMV16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)9 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill(Go watch the Matrix if you don't get it.....)
The game masters just shoved that red pill right up his
5 -
Ghostbane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
I find it funny, where everyone is retorting different scenarios of how Zaz should have informed ZoS. Despite ZoS knowing about this for how long already? They where shown, in person, what can be done with this last year, and jack zippity zip has been done/prepped on it.
In the history of ESO, something gets fixed out of necessity, not demand.{★★★★★ · ★★★★★ · ★★ · ★★★★★}350m+ AP PC - EUAddons
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6 -
Lord-Stien✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
A wrong is still a wrong... no matter how pure the intentions were.Sometimes the real enemy are the one who moderate it.
BannHammer
PVP Officer
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When in doubt, frag out
Heart of Daggerfall-=Iron Legion=- Founding Member
The one and only LordSteindeath3 -
_Chaos✭✭✭✭✭
✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
I agree with him as well, but a precedent needs to be set and all those that used third party programs be permabanned.
I'm 100% for drastic action when all other options have been exhausted, unfortunately the timing sucked with DB release on the horizon and people wanting solid game-play on a long weekend.
What a way to get the corrective action ball rolling though!'Chaos4 -
OtarTheMad✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I do not agree with what Zaz did and honestly I have been sour on Zaz and his tactics for quite some time now. My guild was on the receiving end of his GoS zerg way back on Goldbrand because "he was sour Scourge got deleted" so he'd roll up to keeps with 60+ EP and just do whatever they could to roll the map (exploits included). I wasn't surprised at all when he let Blinxey into his guild.. at all... just further cemented my thoughts on him.
I have no sympathy, I suspect he did it for selfishness and not to "expose" the truth of this cheat engine. He could have done it in a million safer ways that didn't completely endanger the game and it's future. Any of the ideas other players posted on that now closed thread on how to show ZoS this cheat engine would have been smarter and better than what Zaz did.
Good riddance to all who do this exploit or any for that matter. Many guilds have folded trying to fight these exploiters and even if it's hard for me to say I praise Rylana for being in a non-exploit and cheat type of guild. We need more of those.Edited by OtarTheMad on May 30, 2016 5:20PM6 -
Turelus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
There are many ways he could have done this, he chose the most destructive path possible for the games community and reputation. I won't agree he's a saint and a savour because he felt he was doing the right thing.@Turelus - EU PC Megaserver
"Don't count on others for help. In the end each of us is in this alone. The survivors are those who know how to look out for themselves."7 -
Lord-Stien✭✭✭Is it just me , or is this a PC, NA problem atm ?
input from EU atm isn't wantedSometimes the real enemy are the one who moderate it.
BannHammer
PVP Officer
Alliance Cord
When in doubt, frag out
Heart of Daggerfall-=Iron Legion=- Founding Member
The one and only LordSteindeath1 -
Zheg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
Absolutely not. Solid video proof on Live in the middle of some field with just a friend to demonstrate on would have sufficed and generated enough of a frenzy that ZOS would have been forced to react. There was ZERO need to explain to people how it's done and ZERO need to help point them in the direction of what program to use. He did that out of ego and a need for attention. If this is something that ZOS can't fix right away (and probably isn't given how old it is) now we have to deal with all the yahoos trying it out.
Just because he fancies himself an Anonymous or Snowden does NOT mean he was in any way right in how he went about this. He chose the scorched earth tactic and deserves no praise, nor access to his account ever again.
People chose the 'blue pill' because there was never solid video proof; that's all that was needed. Anything in excess of that was done out of spite.Edited by Zheg on May 30, 2016 5:35PM26 -
manny254✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
My biggest fear is that they will not fix this issue, or they won't fix it for a long time. Meanwhile we will be left with a witch hunt for anyone who has ever been successful. With the logic essentially being we lost, cheats exist, and therefore you are cheating. Anyone who has ever taken advantage of this program needs to be perma banned, but a witch hunt will only divide the already dying pvp community. This needs to be fixed now, and I really can't believe they have no way of detecting it.- Mojican8 -
nudel✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
Yeah thanks Zazeer...thanks for killing any desire I had to play this game and likely the game itself. Thanks for being a complete tool and then trying to justify your actions. Thanks for nothing.
Seriously no respect for you. I hope you are permabanned from every game you ever play. Good riddance.10 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
Absolutely not. Solid video proof on Live in the middle of some field with just a friend to demonstrate on would have sufficed and generated enough of a frenzy that ZOS would have been forced to react. There was ZERO need to explain to people how it's done and ZERO need to help point them in the direction of what program to use. He did that out of ego and a need for attention. If this is something that ZOS can't fix right away (and probably isn't given how old it is) now we have to deal with all the yahoos trying it out.
Just because he fancies himself an Anonymous or Snowden does NOT mean he was in any way right in how he went about this. He chose the scorched earth tactic and deserves no praise, nor access to his account ever again.
People chose the 'blue pill' because there was never solid video proof; that's all that was needed. Anything in excess of that was done out of spite.
Best post on the subject 10/10
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timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
Absolutely not. Solid video proof on Live in the middle of some field with just a friend to demonstrate on would have sufficed and generated enough of a frenzy that ZOS would have been forced to react. There was ZERO need to explain to people how it's done and ZERO need to help point them in the direction of what program to use. He did that out of ego and a need for attention. If this is something that ZOS can't fix right away (and probably isn't given how old it is) now we have to deal with all the yahoos trying it out.
Just because he fancies himself an Anonymous or snowden does NOT mean he was in any way right in how he went about this. He chose the scorched earth tactic and deserves no praise, nor access to account ever again.
If it were just some exploitable bug in a skill I would agree because it doesn't take a lot of resources to fix a skill. However, as I understand it, fixing this issue could be costly, which is why it hasn't been fixed despite all of the evidence that has purportedly been given to ZOS in the past. For that reason, a major incident needed to occur for it be given more priority. Now, assuming that they don't have to rebuild the entire game to fix it, it will probably be fixed sooner than later.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
Rylana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭timidobserver wrote: »https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/268389/a-message-from-zazeer-hacking#latest
After reading this thread from Zazeer, I have to say that I agree with him. To the point that I think he should be unbanned and any gkicks rescinded. Given a choice between a dude running around spamming ultimates and a bunch of L2P screaming batmans running around being subtly faster, with subtly better stats, with subtly better resource sustain, with subtly better animation cancelling, and taking sutbly less damage, I am going to go with the dude spamming ultimates. It demonstrates the problem and gives the issue enough exposure that ignoring it is not a valid response.
Since everybody has been choosing the blue pill on this, Zaz decided to force feed everybody the red pill.
My biggest fear is that they will not fix this issue, or they won't fix it for a long time. Meanwhile we will be left with a witch hunt for anyone who has ever been successful. With the logic essentially being we lost, cheats exist, and therefore you are cheating. Anyone who has ever taken advantage of this program needs to be perma banned, but a witch hunt will only divide the already dying pvp community. This needs to be fixed now, and I really can't believe they have no way of detecting it.
That is exactly why I am so angry at Zaz. Even if I totally get his logic (as skewed at it sounds), I genuinely believe he was trying to help, albeit in a terrible, way off base kind of way.
The damage may well be permanent now that every tom *** and harry knows how to do this. This is the core reason, right here, why when I talk about exploits or players cheating I never ever get into details (and get ridiculed and discredited for not providing proof to the masses). Because at the end of the day, the masses just want to cheat too, a lot of them anyway, and ill be damned if I am their vehicle to that end. I want things FIXED, not spread.Edited by Rylana on May 30, 2016 5:47PM@rylanadionysis == Closed Beta Tester October 2013 == Retired October 2016 == Uninstalled @ One Tamriel Release == Inactive Indefinitely
Ebonheart Pact: Lyzara Dionysis - Sorc - AR 37 (Former Empress of Blackwater Blade and Haderus) == Shondra Dionysis - Temp - AR 23 == Arrianaya Dionysis - DK - AR 17
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RoxyPhoenix✭✭✭✭the cat is out of the bag, having said that makes me wonder how many ppl whom I previously respected and admired for their skills are actually dirty cheaters.6
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Lord-Stien✭✭✭RoxyPhoenix wrote: »the cat is out of the bag, having said that makes me wonder how many ppl whom I previously respected and admired for their skills are actually dirty cheaters.
one of my biggest fears...
Who can we trust?
and how can we prove that we dont cheat..Sometimes the real enemy are the one who moderate it.
BannHammer
PVP Officer
Alliance Cord
When in doubt, frag out
Heart of Daggerfall-=Iron Legion=- Founding Member
The one and only LordSteindeath5 -
Mako1132✭✭✭✭✭KisoValley wrote: »KisoValley wrote: »KisoValley wrote: »KisoValley wrote: »
Exactly. ZOS have known about this all along, and because they've done nothing about it this is what has happened. Don't blame the players for exploiting it, ZOS are basically saying it's fine to do it seeing as they've done nothing about it for so long.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDML4qKekGYhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znZvXiU6f0E
Ban these idiots and FIX THIS PROBLEM. This is GAME BREAKING.
So tell me. Without these "idiots", who are blatantly and doing this openly (perhaps to prove a point?) how else would anyone know??
I mean I haven't seen you (and many now vocal others) campaigning against the very prevalent speed hacks....
Just sayin'.
On the other hand for the sake of the game ofc this needs to be fixed asap. Literally, ASAP.
Everyone doing this should be perma banned no questions asked.
ZOS is aware, and the people you're calling out have made them aware in the past. It's just not good form to publish hacks and exploits (and against the TOS). However, I believe there's a point where if something becomes as widespread as it seemingly is right now that it's ok to be vocal about it.
This happened precisely because of players spreading the knowledge and encouraging it. ZOS never said it was ok, or that you wouldn't be banned for it. You don't know what actions ZOS has taken regarding hackers/exploiters because they don't tell you about it. The only thing ZOS is guilty of is preventing use of the program for so long, but again that's not to say they haven't done anything. It's entirely on the players. Every one of us has the option to do what you know is the right thing to do.
It's been around forever. They literally have 0 protection against this and it's been going on for just as long, just people actually cared and made sure they didn't make it obvious when they were exploiting (apart from speed hacks, pretty difficult to hide that). I mean Jagex (who are a terrible company btw) run a terrible MMO called Runescape and even they have protection against Cheat Engine with far less money, resources and staff.
Blame the players all you want... ZOS brought it upon themselves.
I don't have a way of stopping someone from shooting me. That doesn't mean if I get shot, I brought it upon myself. The person with the gun is at fault. ZOS should be preventing this because they are capable of doing it (hopefully), but that doesn't mean they're at fault for the actions of certain players or that they somehow deserved it. Get real man.ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »Hi Jessica,
What are the chances of seeing some sort of reply after the investigation with a report of action taken (not name and shamed just an idea of whether its something which is actually enforced). Things like this seriously discredit the game and generally the lack of information furthers the problem. Thanks.
We'll see what we can do. It's not an unreasonable request, especially considering the circumstances.
Awesome
Actually, if you shoot them first, you've stopped them shooting you. Also if you don't *** their sister or whatever you did to *** them off to the point they'll shoot you that'll also stop them shooting you.
As for ZOS should hopefully be preventing this? They have no tools or people in place who can or know how to track who is using it. The only people who will get banned are those who just don't give a *** or don't take ZOS serious enough and let themselves be vidded exploiting.
Please, it wouldn't play out like some 1800's western duel. Now you're straying from the topic and proving you don't know what you're talking about.
As for the second part, other companies don't either and they get along just fine. The difference is, like I originally was saying to you, the players have actual morals in those games and don't hack the game for whatever god awful reason they could have. It's entirely up to the players how they act.
How ZOS responds will be the most important factor, not whether they can completely prevent it. I do hope they can find a way to prevent it though, and unlike most people I have at least some faith it will happen.
1. I was joking around because I thought you were comparing being shot to ZOS bringing it on themselves, but if you want to think that I don't know what I'm talking about go ahead lol.
2. Wrong unfortunately. The example I've used over the past few days and even before in this conversation is Runescape. Jagex have a very very *** budget, very very *** resources and a very very *** amount of staff working on both servers. Funnily enough though, they were able to stop people running Cheat Engine and even tracked people using it before they had the tools to get rid of it completely from their game because they hired the right people.
You have more faith than me. Everyone in my guild who have been playing MMOs since before Cheat Engine first came out, and everyone who has played MMOs that have been severely effected (affected? never have understood which to use) by Cheat Engine are very shocked that ZOS has no protection from it because it is such an old tool that it is basically irrelevant to all other top MMOs. I mean people have been using it since beta, how have ZOS not realised? Or have they realised and just not cared until Zazeer did what he did.
I agree that how ZOS responds is the most important factor. However unlike most it seems, I'm more bothered about fixing the game before banning all the people using it though.
1 - Fair enough. I understand how hard it is to convey stuff like that at times via text.
2 - I currently play another mmo that's having the same problem as this, though I'm not sure what program is being used. It definitely affects other mmo's.
However that game had a strong response to the situation and it's mostly not a thing anymore aside from the occasional player who's rage quitting. Ultimately though having pride as a player and simply deciding not to do it is the easiest and best solution. That's why I put the blame entirely on the players who decided to use the program. There is and was no point to prove regarding hacking in the game. I know from personal experience regarding bug exploitation that, even the things the community doesn't talk about, ZOS is at least aware of what goes on in their game. This is known through talks with them, not actually ever being actioned against.0 -
bikerangelo✭✭✭✭✭
✭It's going to be a few weeks before ZOS can manage anything close to a fix for this, which means the first few weeks of DB are already ruined. During that time, ZOS is going to have to work through the thousands of hacking reports and try to manage patching a live server just to maintain the new DLC. Does anyone really think they have the resources for that?
Great timing, guys. Really excellent.
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Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭At this point there's nothing left for me to do but ride out the storm and wait . Which is difficult because I get passionate about things I love and this game is one of them . I'm going to stay positive and only focus on the things I have control over . Right now the game masters are the only ones with the power to do anything , so I'm putting my positive thoughts out in their direction . I'll look out for updates and suggestions from them . All the best ZOS in tackling this once and for all .
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Preyfar✭✭✭✭✭
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Because we've all been here, on these forums, since launch going "This doesn't seem right." We've all been told to shut up, that it's just skill, that it's just animation cancelling and client side lag and that we don't know what we're talking about. Even those players who have been solid have been shut down.People chose the 'blue pill' because there was never solid video proof; that's all that was needed. Anything in excess of that was done out of spite.
For a long time a lot of us have wanted to make a declaration of shenanigans... but were told by the community that we didn't know what we were talking about. I'm not the kind of person to call people cheaters except when I see exploits first hand. I don't agree with how this was delivered... but it's been a wake-up call for a lot of people.
The sad thing is even if/when it's fixed there's always going to be a lingering doubt in the back of player's minds.7
This discussion has been closed.