IMPORTANT UPDATE! ZOS PLEASE reconsider your decision to no longer make FEMALE Light armor!

Uriel_Nocturne · April 2016

ElderBugOffline wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We started following this thread a couple days ago, and digging into why some of the light armor sets look the way they do on female character models. We can confirm that the way certain light armor sets - like the Trinimac's Valor set - look on female character models is not desired or intended. We're still investigating this issue, but we are working on it and will make it better.

sorry, i cannot resist

That made me spit out my coffee...

Well done. lol

ElderBugOffline · April 2016

community do not wand bugged chests as i can see
instead, we want this

babylon · April 2016

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Let us know if you encounter any others! (And please be sure to /bug them in-game, too.)

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom

The Crown Store costumes also, like all the harem pants, Riding Outfit, and all the dresses - wedding dress, evening dress, that ball gown, dress with collar - all those have the thickened waist and bubble chest effect making the female characters look like linebackers...actually even the blue dress is distorted (this one has the bubble chest, but makes waist too skinny, very odd that one).

Really obvious on High Elves.

_____________________

Enemy-of-Coldharbour · April 2016

babylon wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Let us know if you encounter any others! (And please be sure to /bug them in-game, too.)

The Crown Store costumes also, like all the harem pants and all the dresses - wedding dress, evening dress, that ball gown - all those have the thickened waist and bubble chest effect making the female characters look like linebackers...actually even the blue dress is distorted (this one has the bubble chest, but makes waist too skinny, very odd that one).

Agreed. All the Crown store female costumes look horrible on my Khajiit but look fine on my other female characters.

Inarre · April 2016

I promised pictures so here are some I took of my character and my husband's character:

Female:

Worms Raiment - No Clothes - Transmutation Set

Worms Raiment - Transmutation
Not as bad as some of the sets, but the chest does lack of definition, is a bit bloated and has an odd smooshed look. Also, the belt seems a bit out of place. Was this the intended design?

Male:

Xyvkin Style - No Clothes - Fury and Fasalla's Guile Sets
Very bloated looking in the new sets

A side note @ZOS_JessicaFolsom since you are so kindly looking into the gear for us, are you able to add the Outlaw motif to your list? Unfortunately both the Light Jerkin and Light Robe are both Light Jerkins. Not sure if this is intended as well (Perhaps this style does not have a robe?)

Thanks again for your help!

babylon · April 2016

Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »

babylon wrote: »

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Let us know if you encounter any others! (And please be sure to /bug them in-game, too.)

The Crown Store costumes also, like all the harem pants and all the dresses - wedding dress, evening dress, that ball gown - all those have the thickened waist and bubble chest effect making the female characters look like linebackers...actually even the blue dress is distorted (this one has the bubble chest, but makes waist too skinny, very odd that one).

Agreed. All the Crown store female costumes look horrible on my Khajiit but look fine on my other female characters.

I won't even buy those outfits, pretty sure this is cutting into their profits, we're probably not the only ones who won't buy them but otherwise would if they actually made our characters look as they should.

bellatrixed · April 2016

I'm glad this is being looked into!

As a few others have, I'd like to draw attention to crown store costumes as well. The Corseted Riding Outfit in particular is very disappointing to me, because what is otherwise a beautiful outfit makes my character's body formless. Here's a comparison of Khajiit light and the Corseted Riding Outfit.

MornaBaine · April 2016

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Thank you for all the feedback and screenshot examples. There are a couple different types of issues we're looking at right now. One is the issue that this thread was created for - the way some armor sets look on certain character models, particularly the female chest area, but not limited to just that.

We went through this thread and pulled all the examples of that specific issue. Here's what we have so far (in no specific order):
Trinimac's Valor set

Alliance Armor sets

Malacath Armor

Ancient Elf

Ancient Orc

Phoenix set

Meritorious Service set

Marksman's Crest set

Vicious Death set

Warrior's Fury set

Bahraha's Curse set

Syvarra's Scales set

We're also looking at your reports of armor pieces that have issues with clipping or floating, or can't be dyed. These specific items or armor sets were called out for having clipping issues, floating pieces, and/or undyeable pieces:
Soul Shriven Belt (undyeable)

Malacath Heavy helmet (removing hair)

Malacath Shield (undyeable)

Malacath Light Chest (hole in torso that looks like texture is missing)

Trinimac's Valor Light Shoulders (undyeable unless helmet is hidden, then they appear normal)

Abah's Watch Medium Armor (clipping when mixed with any other style; shoulder protection is floating on character model)

Certain armor chest pieces with tabards (Trinimac's Valor heavy, Abah's Watch heavy, Alliance Armor sets, Mercenary)

Let us know if you encounter any others! (And please be sure to /bug them in-game, too.)

Please add Daedric to the list of armors that have large swaths of undyeable areas. This has been the case since launch and I had made a thread about it here back then. Essentially, ANYTHING that looks like "brown leather" on the light or medium (I have not tested the heavy) refuses to dye and look like anything but brown leather. The Daedric Legs/Skirt, if you try to dye it a LIGHT color retains a "dirty brown" underlayer that shows through and really ruins the look. Thank you.

And also THANK YOU SO MUCH so responding to this in such a great way. I know you had to endure a LOT of snark in this thread, not least of all my own! So, since you did, I really want you to know that this right here has gone leaps and bounds towards restoring my faith in you guys.

Daraugh · April 2016

So I took a bunch of screenshots this morning using my Breton Gisèle, rather than one of my Khajiit as it's easier without the tail. It feels weird without tail and fur, but this is for the community

Here's a shot with nothing on to see what her basic body type is. Curvy, short, broader shoulders and slimmer hips.

The pvp armor was consistently the problem when it came to bloaty, overstuffed couch styling.

The light robe version is a little better, but still too poofy to look normal compared to the current aesthetic.

Crafted is fine, it conforms to the characters actual body type.

In the crown store, the corseted styles give the body an odd tube shape instead of an hourglass, which is the usual goal of a corset.

This shot gives you an idea of both the bloaty and the floaty... Robe of Bahraha's Curse

The trial armor is awesome and fits great. Khajiit for the win

The issue of the bloaty armor is worst on the dropped pvp armor sets, but it's still there on the dropped pve sets. I didn't get a closeup shot of it, but there was some missing texture on the Marksman's medium belt. A small bright blue dot right in the center on the bottom of the buckle.

Edit: spelling, or rather to stop spelling Bahrarrhaahara... umm, curse set.

maboleth · April 2016

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Altmer cotton female robe and jerkin have collision problems too. I haven't tested better materials (from cotton onwards), but if they share the same design, there's a possibility that they too have collision problems.

When standing, both look torn:

Hope499 · April 2016

helediron wrote: »

Daggerfall light jerkin on female is same kind of balloon as other alliance styles:

Holy ***, that looks really terrible.

Inarre · April 2016

bellatrixed wrote: »

I'm glad this is being looked into!

As a few others have, I'd like to draw attention to crown store costumes as well. The Corseted Riding Outfit in particular is very disappointing to me, because what is otherwise a beautiful outfit makes my character's body formless. Here's a comparison of Khajiit light and the Corseted Riding Outfit.

i have the same problem... i look top heavy in it

Paulington · April 2016

I posted this during the TG PTS time and will post it again here, basically every single Undaunted shoulder but especially Molag Kena. In this picture "live" means Orsinium patch (2.2.x).

Also, Thieves' Guild shoulders:

MornaBaine · April 2016

Inarre wrote: »

A side note @ZOS_JessicaFolsom since you are so kindly looking into the gear for us, are you able to add the Outlaw motif to your list? Unfortunately both the Light Jerkin and Light Robe are both Light Jerkins. Not sure if this is intended as well (Perhaps this style does not have a robe?)

Thanks again for your help!

Yes I was disappointed to find no difference between the jerkin and the robe on this style.

KonradK77 · April 2016

It's very strange that the crown store costumes were released like this, they are losing tons of money because people hate the way they look and are not buying them.

WalkingLegacy · April 2016

Now the big question remains: How long to fix and implement live?

babylon · April 2016

KonradK77 wrote: »

It's very strange that the crown store costumes were released like this, they are losing tons of money because people hate the way they look and are not buying them.

Yeah it is, I'm starting to wonder if ZOs even realised just how bad the costumes were. You'd think making money in the long term would be higher on their priority list than avoiding paying some mesh artist a few extra hours worth of work to get female body/armour meshes working.

This is stuff people in large numbers won't buy every day...we all open the Crown Store up and again not buy a costume we otherwise would buy if only they actually looked like they were made for the female body rather than a guy's body. Quite nuts really.

They need to go through each new armour model and costume model and get it right.

__________________________

Abeille · April 2016

KonradK77 wrote: »

It's very strange that the crown store costumes were released like this, they are losing tons of money because people hate the way they look and are not buying them.

Yep, I'm one of the players that really wanted them, but didn't buy because they deform my characters' bodies.

WalkingLegacy · April 2016

babylon wrote: »

KonradK77 wrote: »

It's very strange that the crown store costumes were released like this, they are losing tons of money because people hate the way they look and are not buying them.

Yeah it is, I'm starting to wonder if ZOs even realised just how bad the costumes were. You'd think making money in the long term would be higher on their priority list than avoiding paying some mesh artist a few extra hours worth of work to get female body/armour meshes working.

This is stuff people in large numbers won't buy every day...we all open the Crow Store up and again not buy a costume we otherwise would buy if only they actually looked like they were made for the female body rather than a guy's body. Quite nuts really.

I'm wondering if they even play their own game. It's hard to believe they're just this clueless.

svartorn · April 2016

Cously wrote: »

America,

- Play dirty get away clean.
- Mass Murder Achievement!
- Kill innocent NPCs at will!

But GOD FORBID someone shows a teat. ***. Boob. Melon. Breast. Etc.

Get over yourselves, puritans.

Nailed it.

babylon · April 2016

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

babylon wrote: »

KonradK77 wrote: »

It's very strange that the crown store costumes were released like this, they are losing tons of money because people hate the way they look and are not buying them.

Yeah it is, I'm starting to wonder if ZOs even realised just how bad the costumes were. You'd think making money in the long term would be higher on their priority list than avoiding paying some mesh artist a few extra hours worth of work to get female body/armour meshes working.

This is stuff people in large numbers won't buy every day...we all open the Crow Store up and again not buy a costume we otherwise would buy if only they actually looked like they were made for the female body rather than a guy's body. Quite nuts really.

I'm wondering if they even play their own game. It's hard to believe they're just this clueless.

It's quite clear nobody from ZOS does play the game, or they'd know how crap the recent armour and costume models look on female characters. That they only asked about armour and not the costumes in the Crown Store which also suffer from the same issue suggests they have literally zero idea what their "art" team is up to now.

The Crown Store costumes being broken is money lost after all.

__________________________

babylon · April 2016

svartorn wrote: »

Cously wrote: »

America,

- Play dirty get away clean.
- Mass Murder Achievement!
- Kill innocent NPCs at will!

But GOD FORBID someone shows a teat. ***. Boob. Melon. Breast. Etc.

Get over yourselves, puritans.

Nailed it.

Well no, that's not what this is about at all, the issue is the costumes and armour models have been made on a male body and not made for a female body. Nobody is asking for "more revealing outfits" at all. We just want the outfits to be made to fit the female body like they used to.

MornaBaine · April 2016

Abeille wrote: »

KonradK77 wrote: »

It's very strange that the crown store costumes were released like this, they are losing tons of money because people hate the way they look and are not buying them.

Yep, I'm one of the players that really wanted them, but didn't buy because they deform my characters' bodies.

I've bought a couple but been largely unhappy with how they look. So won't buy more until they address the issues with them as well. And come out with more that actually fit the aesthetics of this game and not some cheesy bodice ripper romance novel cover.

Thevampirenight · April 2016

Atreidus wrote: »

Would an Troll Warrior do? Sure !
No. Serious. The female models for light armour are just normal. No female would wear a sack.Or?

/edit: if you think thats to much then dont step in the cellar at orsinium. There are 2 Womans in Bikinis!
And Even if: its setted at the middle age.

I want that dress in game =(

Praeficere · April 2016

phreatophile wrote: »

Apologies if I wasn't clear, it's was light shoulders crafted with Trinimac motif that were white with helmet unhidden, it may or may not be true with dropped pieces. It wasn't the entire piece either, it was the fins sticking up from behind that turned white not just undyeable, the mantle across the shoulders and chest dyed normally. I'm not able to check in game ATM.

It happens with the dropped set too

Dissentinel · April 2016

Xerosus wrote: »

Most of the complaints have nothing to do with "sex appeal". When i make female characters, the point is to look like one as well. People might as well have no female characters if the armor looks the same on both genders.

Right... So according to you being female is defined by whether or not you are visibly feminine? I mean, the armors aren't making your character look so masculine they appear to be male, it's just not displaying the female anatomy quite as openly as it was before.

MornaBaine wrote: »

Way to not read the OP. These newer armors do not JUST not fit the female form, they hideously distort it. Which we have now been told is not intended and will be fixed. If PLATE armor remains "smooth" without breast shaping I will be fine with that. But leather and cloth armors SHOULD conform to the figure.

Leather armor shouldn't conform to the body, it's still a rigid material. Many of the new light armors have metal, leather, or sort of padded cloth components it seems, though. I agree that it should conform if the armor is entirely made of cloth, but this is often not the case - including at least the Ebonheart and Daggerfall style jerkins in the OP.

I don't think the armors are a hideous distortion of the female form, it's just less feminine (but more functional, as I said before that having armor "fit" the feminine form better inadvertently exposes actually vital places on the torso. I can talk more about this is if anyone's interested.) I actually like the look for my character better that way. Hopefully, future armor styles with appear in a variety of different ways to suit our contradicting desires.

babylon · April 2016

Dissentinel wrote: »

I don't think the armors are a hideous distortion of the female form, it's just less feminine.

Have you even looked at the pictures? The bodies are distorted in this gear. In games we like to show off our achievements...there are leaderboards, people dye their armour.

If you make gear that makes our characters look hideous it goes against everything people usually like to do in MMO games (look good in various ways).

Your "I don't think" shows you haven't tried to read a thing we've been saying, or looked at the pictures we've provided. Even ZOS is saying they've screwed up.

We're now about getting it fixed, so provide names and images of terrible armour and Crown Store costumes or step aside.

MornaBaine · April 2016

Thevampirenight wrote: »

Atreidus wrote: »

Would an Troll Warrior do? Sure !
No. Serious. The female models for light armour are just normal. No female would wear a sack.Or?

/edit: if you think thats to much then dont step in the cellar at orsinium. There are 2 Womans in Bikinis!
And Even if: its setted at the middle age.

I want that dress in game =(

YES PLEASE! In marvelous Khajiit fabrics!

Abeille · April 2016

MornaBaine wrote: »

Thevampirenight wrote: »

Atreidus wrote: »

Would an Troll Warrior do? Sure !
No. Serious. The female models for light armour are just normal. No female would wear a sack.Or?

/edit: if you think thats to much then dont step in the cellar at orsinium. There are 2 Womans in Bikinis!
And Even if: its setted at the middle age.

I want that dress in game =(

YES PLEASE! In marvelous Khajiit fabrics!

Khajiiti fabrics are the prettiest of all, with the moon patterns. I hope they add their cultural clothes eventually, I bet they would look absolutely amazing (after the barrel-chest outfit bug is solved).

Abeille · April 2016

This is my Orc, Durza Gra-Maghul. She is a little bigger than most people make their characters be, and the deformation looks even more obvious than on my thinner characters. This is how her town clothes, which do not change her body, and two different outfits look on her.

First, her town clothes. Second, the Noble Dress, that has a "corseted" effect. And finally, the Off-The-Shoulders Evening Dress, that DOES NOT have a "corseted" effect despite having a corset (quite the opposite).

Sorry for the quality. I hope you guys can see the problem anyway.
Although I would be happy with no deformation whatsoever, I would be even happier if all the corseted outfits actually had a "corseted effect" like the Noble Dress does.