Do you want group damage to return?

Acrolas

A few responses from the inspect player armor threads...

"Well because that's their business. If they're friendly, ask them"
"Invasion of privacy?"
"i dont want people inspecting me, especially for a group to go into trials or pvp or something where i will need to have THIER idea of what constitutes good build or good armor."
"If you think it's ok to do a gear check why don't you go in public and start checking random people. There needs to be some privacy."
"even if there could be a valid, situational reason for you to know about another player's gear and/or its quality, it would just be plain rude to exclude them from any activity for this reason alone."
"my equipment is none of your business"
"I'd like to have and retain control about who can get my character's information. An anonymous inspection feature would violate my privacy."


You can't have selective privacy. The argument against inspect player directly applies to anything that telegraphs information you may not consent to. And that includes GroupDamage. A lot of people express themselves to highly value in-game privacy, so GroupDamage had to go.

NTclaymore

I dont want it. I was in a group once doing gold where i saw my fellow DPS member was using no form of Debuffs nor interrupted healing adds. I was like, Fine. Ill slot Elemental drain and crushing shock for that reason. Then he doesnt have to. He was leader. said my DPS on the boss sucked and kicked me.
??? DPS isnt everything. I dont wanna fuel those that use misleading numbers to ban people that are just trying to conpenstate for those that cares for a number insterd of actual preformance.

Miszou

This is your Group Damage Addon without accompanying stats showing damage taken, healing recieved etc:

Shadesofkin

Only chose no because there is a distinct lack of an "I don't give a daedrats tail"

Jaeysa

Miszou wrote: »

This is your Group Damage Addon without accompanying stats showing damage taken, healing recieved etc:

So would you prefer that it be expanded to include those? Because I would. And getting rid of it now means it will never grow to that.

Hope499

As a Tank, I dont want to look bad.

Also, as a Tank, i want to make others unhappy since we are a dying breed. from non stop nerfs....no one wants a tank these days.

timidobserver

Gif represents ZOS reaction to Group Damage threads.

Jaeysa

timidobserver wrote: »

Gif represents ZOS reaction to Group Damage threads.

Lol, that's pretty accurate.

J2JMC

I don't understand the "elitist groups are going to kick people" argument. Why would you want to group with people like that anyway? On the other hand, if they are unsure if they want to play with your character, why should they be forced to?

Miszou

Jaeysa wrote: »

Miszou wrote: »

This is your Group Damage Addon without accompanying stats showing damage taken, healing recieved etc:

So would you prefer that it be expanded to include those? Because I would. And getting rid of it now means it will never grow to that.

I'm saying that without all those other stats, everything boils down to "moar dps!", regardless of the effect your heroics are having on the healer or tank, who are unlikely to make it past 3" on your ruler...

If you can consistently pull a million DPS, but the healer is going balls out to keep your dumb ass alive, then that's not what I call good game play or working in a team. But without showing how much damage/healing you are generating, all that matters is the size of your DPS.

Showing half the story (DPS only) is arguably worse than showing nothing at all.

Just sayin'.

Shunravi

Miszou wrote: »

Jaeysa wrote: »

Miszou wrote: »

This is your Group Damage Addon without accompanying stats showing damage taken, healing recieved etc:

So would you prefer that it be expanded to include those? Because I would. And getting rid of it now means it will never grow to that.

I'm saying that without all those other stats, everything boils down to "moar dps!", regardless of the effect your heroics are having on the healer or tank, who are unlikely to make it past 3" on your ruler...

If you can consistently pull a million DPS, but the healer is going balls out to keep your dumb ass alive, then that's not what I call good game play or working in a team. But without showing how much damage/healing you are generating, all that matters is the size of your DPS.

Showing half the story (DPS only) is arguably worse than showing nothing at all.

Just sayin'.

Ya ya, run your own and all that... but currently we only see half the story without GD, seeing the mechanics and the groups damage together shows the whole picture.

Just sayin'

Jimmy562

Meters are a good idea in theory but they are abused way too much. It turns into do X amount of DPS or get kicked and that X is usually far above what you would actually need. Even when you aren't fully geared some players rage at you.

Good idea but flawed by humans being humans.

NBrookus

Miszou wrote: »

I'm saying that without all those other stats, everything boils down to "moar dps!", regardless of the effect your heroics are having on the healer or tank, who are unlikely to make it past 3" on your ruler...

If you can consistently pull a million DPS, but the healer is going balls out to keep your dumb ass alive, then that's not what I call good game play or working in a team. But without showing how much damage/healing you are generating, all that matters is the size of your DPS.

I don't disagree that the addon promoted poor teamwork among certain types of players for the sake of making their own numbers higher. I'm not sure those particular players were necessarily good team members anyway.

That said, the addon did also measure Group Heals. Funny how I didn't hear any dungeon healers bragging about their numbers.

Cuyler

Miszou wrote: »

If you can consistently pull a million DPS, but the healer is going balls out to keep your dumb ass alive, then that's not what I call good game play or working in a team. But without showing how much damage/healing you are generating, all that matters is the size of your DPS.

Showing half the story (DPS only) is arguably worse than showing nothing at all.

Just sayin'.

GD showed healing too for your reference.

KallistaBlackheart

bring it back and allow for expanded capabilities. let ti show overall damage taken and other stats for a better look at group and individual performance.
i do not see a need for gear inspection as the end performance is what matters, but i am not apposed to gear inspection.

Danksta

Anhedonie wrote: »

actosh wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno ,
Pls get the addon and make it a build in part of the Ui that those who wanr it can activate it, those who dont like it can turn it off. Thx.

So u can serve your players. Thx

This is not gonna work.
"Turn it on before we start or GTFO".

But wouldn't you rather have those players kick you at the beginning than after finding out "you're not good enough to run with them"? Seems to me they would just waste more of your time without being to see your DPS.

abuniffpreub18_ESO

They already have group damage it's called Zenimax.

tangy.citrus

In lfg, nobody cares about your dps as long as its not complete trash (like light attacking the whole dungeon) and you can pass through the dungeon.

Groups that try and do vicp or vwgt in a pug are still going to fail and someone will get kicked regardless of having groupdamager or not.

Group damager is constructive and not destructive. It lets you see who is doing the most dps or at least who is doing more dps than you. If you're in a pug group and you're dpsing less than a healer, then you can ask someone for advice of what you're doing wrong afterwards or even during. Its not supposed to be 'this guy sucks, /kick' its more of '[snip], how can i improve so i can be #1 or #2 in the group/trial group?'

Maybe scrubs just dont care about improving their gaming experience and actually completing dungeons/trials and just want to ban anything that isnt some stupid roleplay crap that 5% of the playerbase cares about.

Vote yes if you simply want a better gaming experience where you can constantly improve and have a good time, or vote no if you just want to get kicked from groups for no reason LIKE IT ALWAYS WAS BEFORE.

idiots /out

FYI: groupdamager was almost always wrong. It started when the tank started the attack, which isnt always when you start. My ftc dps meter was typically anywhere between 5-10k off from what group damage actually suggested. Players that actually used this add on know that this is true, though the values may be slightly different.

Zos and all of you players are just upset because nobody trusts each other. Groupdamager can be and IS MEANT to be used CONSTRUCTIVELY. To have healthy competition in guilds and raids to do the most/best deeps. (tanks, healers, and all vital raid roles will always be excluded from the group damager meter). It can be used to go into a pug group, and see how much another player is doing for damage. YOU CAN GIVE THAT PLAYER TIPS if you want, you can be RESPECTFUL and courteous and offer to help them improve, if that player has group damager THEY CAN ASK FOR TIPS and have a better gaming experience in ESO. You are all missing the point. It is to build up everyone so that you dont have to be so selective with groups for dungeons such as vwgt or vicp. Its all constructive and its all healthy competition.


[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

FeaR Turbo

Well I wouldn't care for a DPS meter, I care for Real time Data. If someone in a trash pull spikes top damage but falls off. Why did this happen? was he in bad positioning ? Did he get stunned? rezzing someone? Lag? What can we do to fix or replicate this event.

Real time data, helps with strats, progression.

Why did he spike so hard in the first place?

Questions and theories, can be explained or realized by conclusions made from data.

But Data can also induce questions.


I find the lack of data disturbing. (Star wars pun OP)

Power to the players.

Iove

I was healing some dungeons and loving it until I joined one group. They were already almost at the last boss as it seems their previous healer left. They made a pull when I got there, I tried my best but literally after about 10 min in a mini boss fight which spawns adds, we got overrun by adds and the mini boss wasn't even close to dead.
I got healing aggro and had too any adds on me so I died. The damage dealers then proceed to blame the tank and healer.

Need I say more.

Miszou

tangy.citrus wrote: »

If you're in a pug group and you're dpsing less than a healer, then you can ask someone for advice of what you're doing wrong afterwards or even during. Its not supposed to be 'this guy sucks, /kick' its more of '[snip], how can i improve so i can be #1 or #2 in the group/trial group?'

This is a noble and perhaps worthy goal, but in reality I think we both know it won't work that way.

What options does your "scrub" have for changing up in the middle of a run? We can assume he doesn't have another set of better gear otherwise he would be wearing it. He may not have any skill points remaining to allow him to use your preferred rotation. And he probably can't respec in the middle of a dungeon either.

So you're still left with 2 realistic options: Kick him anyway or suffer through to the end.

Yes, he might listen to your advice, but realistically that isn't going to do you much good *right now*.

In this scenario, the Group Damage meter is going to repeatedly and continuously notify everyone that he sucks and there's nothing he can do about it, other than leave or suck it up - possibly having been turned off from public dungeons for good.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Jura23

I never used this addon. Can somebody tell me why group mates can't just tell each other their numbers if they want?

Jaeysa

Jura23 wrote: »

I never used this addon. Can somebody tell me why group mates can't just tell each other their numbers if they want?

Because they won't always be honest.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Jura23 wrote: »

I never used this addon. Can somebody tell me why group mates can't just tell each other their numbers if they want?

Because people in favour of GroupDamage, while claiming that all people are nice, good and helpful, also claim that people all lie. Dr House syndrom I guess.

.

Jura23

Jaeysa wrote: »

Jura23 wrote: »

I never used this addon. Can somebody tell me why group mates can't just tell each other their numbers if they want?

Because they won't always be honest.

I get it, but there are ppl saying things like "me and my friends have group and we need this". I suppose friends or guildmates are honest with each other.

LadyNalcarya

Anhedonie wrote: »

actosh wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno ,
Pls get the addon and make it a build in part of the Ui that those who wanr it can activate it, those who dont like it can turn it off. Thx.

So u can serve your players. Thx

This is not gonna work.
"Turn it on before we start or GTFO".

Well, in competitive groups you'll have to post your numbers anyway. If you dont, they assume your dps was bad.
But there's a simple solution - dont join these groups.

Miszou wrote: »

Jaeysa wrote: »

Miszou wrote: »

This is your Group Damage Addon without accompanying stats showing damage taken, healing recieved etc:

So would you prefer that it be expanded to include those? Because I would. And getting rid of it now means it will never grow to that.

I'm saying that without all those other stats, everything boils down to "moar dps!", regardless of the effect your heroics are having on the healer or tank, who are unlikely to make it past 3" on your ruler...

If you can consistently pull a million DPS, but the healer is going balls out to keep your dumb ass alive, then that's not what I call good game play or working in a team. But without showing how much damage/healing you are generating, all that matters is the size of your DPS.

Showing half the story (DPS only) is arguably worse than showing nothing at all.

Just sayin'.

Yesterday I did a few farming runs of WGT with good dds and without healers at all (since everyone was offline). Runs were really quick and smooth. So probably your "elite dds" werent that elite.
Just sayin'

Enodoc

As it was? No.

With something in place that will avoid the negative connotations associated with it, while still providing the benefits (ie, the exact things that ZOS are looking into) ? Then yes, that could be very useful.

altemriel

yes, bring it back, make it optional to not participate in it.

I do not care about the dps of others, I just used it to see if I am comparable, or better/worse than the rest of the group

Vildebill

If you want to share your DPS you share your DPS yourself. Just be polite ask the person you are wondering about to link their DPS, and if they want to share it they most likely will. The manners people have on internet is horrifying...

Rune_Relic

Xjcon wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Xjcon wrote: »

What's to inspect? There is very few choices in top tier gear. And the Elite create threads on known sites explaining exactly how to build the best setup.

Another reason for avoiding the "almighty-DPS-race", because it will lead to everyone forced into wearing the same stuff and doing the same rotation. I let the pressure force me to use the same cookie cutter build as everyone else on my magicka sorc because I wanted to run high level content with her, but on my templar alt I'll try to be more creative and try plenty of other stuff and rotations. And if I cannot complete some content with him, so be it. But even the most "special snowflake crazy" build will let you do the 8-12K DPS required by nearly all vet dungeons.

.

I like to compete. Many others do aswell. No one forces players to join runs to compete for top DPS.

So don't use the LFG tool then.