The Death of the Dragonknight- updated 3/15/16

Yonkit

Ghostbane wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

Ghostbane wrote: »

Gave up on stam. There is more to life than spamming WB/tornado and rapids. Working on a magicka build as a passionate middle finger to our makers.

Your fault for using Two-Handed! The damage you can get off with a full rotation of Heavy Attack/Puncture/Bash for me is about 7k, that's just barely under the maximum damage you can get with Wrecking Blow, and the plus-side is with enough CP you can block while doing this, and with even more CP you'll be able to surpass the Wrecking Blow damage thanks to the Heavy Attack CP passive, I should fool around with Molten and my build... Though... Having to use a fully charged Heavy Attack is a pain in the ass... I only really do it after I've stunned someone from a Take Flight when they have no stamina.

One hand and Shield was my first line of enquiry, with Pierce Armor seemingly a good fit, at times. But the combo of having Rally with 2H and Tornado on the other seemed more viable. 2H has a bad rep with the WB nonsense, but it really a decent tree. Excellent gap closer, brilliant execute, and a damage-buff heal. Makes me wonder who the hell came up with the Destructive Staff tree.

The same guy who designed the rest of the horrendous combat system. Cough. Cough. Cough.

Teargrants

My magicka DK brethren I beseech thee, Trust in the Heart of the Cards and your hopes shall come true. Have faith, that ZOS may return DK to it's former glory!

Xsorus

I finally got my Regen setup on my DK created...(bloody engine guardian helm was being a pain to get)

Its fairly decent..at least in 1v1's....Anything past that and the damage is lacking in killing stuff fast enough (Its heavy dot based)

Wish I had a viable Class Execute like my Nightblade....

Ishammael

Ghostbane wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

Ghostbane wrote: »

Gave up on stam. There is more to life than spamming WB/tornado and rapids. Working on a magicka build as a passionate middle finger to our makers.

Your fault for using Two-Handed! The damage you can get off with a full rotation of Heavy Attack/Puncture/Bash for me is about 7k, that's just barely under the maximum damage you can get with Wrecking Blow, and the plus-side is with enough CP you can block while doing this, and with even more CP you'll be able to surpass the Wrecking Blow damage thanks to the Heavy Attack CP passive, I should fool around with Molten and my build... Though... Having to use a fully charged Heavy Attack is a pain in the ass... I only really do it after I've stunned someone from a Take Flight when they have no stamina.

One hand and Shield was my first line of enquiry, with Pierce Armor seemingly a good fit, at times. But the combo of having Rally with 2H and Tornado on the other seemed more viable. 2H has a bad rep with the WB nonsense, but it really a decent tree. Excellent gap closer, brilliant execute, and a damage-buff heal. Makes me wonder who the hell came up with the Destructive Staff tree.

Let's compare, shall we?

Destro staff skill tree:
- Destructive reach/clench: would be nice, except its bugged.
- Wall of Elements: would be good.... except we can't spam it anymore. Now its terrible.
- Crushing Shock: still one of the best skills in the game.
- Weakness to Elements: good for... ??? .
- Impulse: Solid, but can't really compare to Steel Tornado.
- The passives are still solid, although they have been nerfed. (Does the penetration passive apply to class skills?)

Weapon Skill trees:

The Sw/sh weapon line has: great spam ability and taunt (ransack/pierce), great utility (reflect), soft CC (heroic/low slash), monster heal debuff, and a hard CC gap closer. Excellent passives. Missing: execute.

The 2H line has: excellent gap closer, high damage skill with hard cc (WB), solid AoE skill for PvE (brawler), excellent execute (hehe), and a great heal+buff. Excellent passives. Missing: utility.

The DW line has: excellent spam skills for PvE, best AoE in the game, nice utility with blade cloak. All skills are executes (passive). Missing: gap closer.

These three weapon lines are really well balanced compared to each other. Destro staff is just bad in comparison.

Joy_Division

Ishammael wrote: »

Ghostbane wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

Ghostbane wrote: »

Gave up on stam. There is more to life than spamming WB/tornado and rapids. Working on a magicka build as a passionate middle finger to our makers.

Your fault for using Two-Handed! The damage you can get off with a full rotation of Heavy Attack/Puncture/Bash for me is about 7k, that's just barely under the maximum damage you can get with Wrecking Blow, and the plus-side is with enough CP you can block while doing this, and with even more CP you'll be able to surpass the Wrecking Blow damage thanks to the Heavy Attack CP passive, I should fool around with Molten and my build... Though... Having to use a fully charged Heavy Attack is a pain in the ass... I only really do it after I've stunned someone from a Take Flight when they have no stamina.

One hand and Shield was my first line of enquiry, with Pierce Armor seemingly a good fit, at times. But the combo of having Rally with 2H and Tornado on the other seemed more viable. 2H has a bad rep with the WB nonsense, but it really a decent tree. Excellent gap closer, brilliant execute, and a damage-buff heal. Makes me wonder who the hell came up with the Destructive Staff tree.

Let's compare, shall we?

Destro staff skill tree:
- Destructive reach/clench: would be nice, except its bugged.
- Wall of Elements: would be good.... except we can't spam it anymore. Now its terrible.
- Crushing Shock: still one of the best skills in the game.
- Weakness to Elements: good for... ??? .
- Impulse: Solid, but can't really compare to Steel Tornado.
- The passives are still solid, although they have been nerfed. (Does the penetration passive apply to class skills?)

You are giving the destro staff too much credit

- Destructive clench is inefficient DPS even with a Master's Staff and knockback is a terrible CC condition
- My health regen is higher than the damage from wall of elements. Spamming it would not be much help
- Crushing shock is meh. It is trumped by whip, surprise attack, and funnel health.
- Weakness to elements is actually very good for PvE, which allows for unlimited resources.
- Impulse 6 m range is terrible.
- Passives are not very useful. Stuff modifies heavy attacks, the penetration passive does not apply to class skills, magicka return not as useful since 1.6 than damage (which you get from other weapons)

Minno

Ishammael wrote: »

Let's compare, shall we?

Destro staff skill tree:
- Destructive reach/clench: would be nice, except its bugged.
- Wall of Elements: would be good.... except we can't spam it anymore. Now its terrible.
- Crushing Shock: still one of the best skills in the game.
- Weakness to Elements: good for... ??? .
- Impulse: Solid, but can't really compare to Steel Tornado.
- The passives are still solid, although they have been nerfed. (Does the penetration passive apply to class skills?)

This can be fixed easily:

1) fix its bugged against shields, otherwise good skill.
2) make wall of elements an execute ability. Balance it using dmg and/or range. Or maybe set it to only initiate execute only if the target is on fire, chilled or concussed?
3) no change.
4) weakness is the debuff reapply right? If so maybe it gives users added spell dmg? Open ended.
5) slight buff to match ST?
6) return penetration passive being apply to class skills if it was removed on this patch.

I would like to see more item sets that increase dmg to ice and shock. Fire dmg is still the preferred bias. Would open up the class tree a bit to allow more flexibility with how we deal dmg as magicka users (force stam users to use up item enchants for ice and shock dmg mitigation to balance the lack of CP trees?)

Ishammael

Joy_Division wrote: »

Ishammael wrote: »

Ghostbane wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

Ghostbane wrote: »

Gave up on stam. There is more to life than spamming WB/tornado and rapids. Working on a magicka build as a passionate middle finger to our makers.

Your fault for using Two-Handed! The damage you can get off with a full rotation of Heavy Attack/Puncture/Bash for me is about 7k, that's just barely under the maximum damage you can get with Wrecking Blow, and the plus-side is with enough CP you can block while doing this, and with even more CP you'll be able to surpass the Wrecking Blow damage thanks to the Heavy Attack CP passive, I should fool around with Molten and my build... Though... Having to use a fully charged Heavy Attack is a pain in the ass... I only really do it after I've stunned someone from a Take Flight when they have no stamina.

One hand and Shield was my first line of enquiry, with Pierce Armor seemingly a good fit, at times. But the combo of having Rally with 2H and Tornado on the other seemed more viable. 2H has a bad rep with the WB nonsense, but it really a decent tree. Excellent gap closer, brilliant execute, and a damage-buff heal. Makes me wonder who the hell came up with the Destructive Staff tree.

Let's compare, shall we?

Destro staff skill tree:
- Destructive reach/clench: would be nice, except its bugged.
- Wall of Elements: would be good.... except we can't spam it anymore. Now its terrible.
- Crushing Shock: still one of the best skills in the game.
- Weakness to Elements: good for... ??? .
- Impulse: Solid, but can't really compare to Steel Tornado.
- The passives are still solid, although they have been nerfed. (Does the penetration passive apply to class skills?)

You are giving the destro staff too much credit

- Destructive clench is inefficient DPS even with a Master's Staff and knockback is a terrible CC condition
- My health regen is higher than the damage from wall of elements. Spamming it would not be much help
- Crushing shock is meh. It is trumped by whip, surprise attack, and funnel health.
- Weakness to elements is actually very good for PvE, which allows for unlimited resources.
- Impulse 6 m range is terrible.
- Passives are not very useful. Stuff modifies heavy attacks, the penetration passive does not apply to class skills, magicka return not as useful since 1.6 than damage (which you get from other weapons)

haha, fair enough. I was trying not to be too hyperbolic.

Some changes I would really like:
1. Replace clench w/ an execute DoT or something. Its redundant w/ crushing shock.
2. Since I can't spam ground effects anymore, make WoE an actual A2AD skill: triple or quadruple its damage (>2k/tick). People should see it on the ground an say to each other, "GET THE *** OUT." Keep duration around 3-4s.
3. Weakness to elements morph that is a self-buff (OMG WANT FIRE BOOTZ FOR SPEED) -- leave the magicka return one as is for PvE.
4. Impulse back to 8m, unblockable.

Replace heavy attack passive with cost redux.
Keep penetration passive
Revert the 1.7 changes to proc bonus effects.

Joy_Division

Ishammael wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Ishammael wrote: »

Ghostbane wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

Ghostbane wrote: »

Gave up on stam. There is more to life than spamming WB/tornado and rapids. Working on a magicka build as a passionate middle finger to our makers.

Your fault for using Two-Handed! The damage you can get off with a full rotation of Heavy Attack/Puncture/Bash for me is about 7k, that's just barely under the maximum damage you can get with Wrecking Blow, and the plus-side is with enough CP you can block while doing this, and with even more CP you'll be able to surpass the Wrecking Blow damage thanks to the Heavy Attack CP passive, I should fool around with Molten and my build... Though... Having to use a fully charged Heavy Attack is a pain in the ass... I only really do it after I've stunned someone from a Take Flight when they have no stamina.

One hand and Shield was my first line of enquiry, with Pierce Armor seemingly a good fit, at times. But the combo of having Rally with 2H and Tornado on the other seemed more viable. 2H has a bad rep with the WB nonsense, but it really a decent tree. Excellent gap closer, brilliant execute, and a damage-buff heal. Makes me wonder who the hell came up with the Destructive Staff tree.

Let's compare, shall we?

Destro staff skill tree:
- Destructive reach/clench: would be nice, except its bugged.
- Wall of Elements: would be good.... except we can't spam it anymore. Now its terrible.
- Crushing Shock: still one of the best skills in the game.
- Weakness to Elements: good for... ??? .
- Impulse: Solid, but can't really compare to Steel Tornado.
- The passives are still solid, although they have been nerfed. (Does the penetration passive apply to class skills?)

You are giving the destro staff too much credit

- Destructive clench is inefficient DPS even with a Master's Staff and knockback is a terrible CC condition
- My health regen is higher than the damage from wall of elements. Spamming it would not be much help
- Crushing shock is meh. It is trumped by whip, surprise attack, and funnel health.
- Weakness to elements is actually very good for PvE, which allows for unlimited resources.
- Impulse 6 m range is terrible.
- Passives are not very useful. Stuff modifies heavy attacks, the penetration passive does not apply to class skills, magicka return not as useful since 1.6 than damage (which you get from other weapons)

haha, fair enough. I was trying not to be too hyperbolic.

Some changes I would really like:
1. Replace clench w/ an execute DoT or something. Its redundant w/ crushing shock.
2. Since I can't spam ground effects anymore, make WoE an actual A2AD skill: triple or quadruple its damage (>2k/tick). People should see it on the ground an say to each other, "GET THE *** OUT." Keep duration around 3-4s.
3. Weakness to elements morph that is a self-buff (OMG WANT FIRE BOOTZ FOR SPEED) -- leave the magicka return one as is for PvE.
4. Impulse back to 8m, unblockable.

Replace heavy attack passive with cost redux.
Keep penetration passive
Revert the 1.7 changes to proc bonus effects.

Signed and agreed!

Mumyo

Firerock2 wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Firerock2 wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

spenc_cathb16_ESO wrote: »

Fruitdog wrote: »

Lol, you could reroll a different class and level it all the way to alliance rank 24 in 3 months time. Well maybe not all the way to 24 considering how dead Cyrodiil is lately.

@Takllin Time to bust out the ole Ring of Mara beb, I need another Templar.

Unfortunately my schedule is way too ridiculous or I'd take you up. I already cancelled on Jules to leveling together

Firerock2 wrote: »

spenc_cathb16_ESO wrote: »

Fruitdog wrote: »

Lol, you could reroll a different class and level it all the way to alliance rank 24 in 3 months time. Well maybe not all the way to 24 considering how dead Cyrodiil is lately.

@Takllin Time to bust out the ole Ring of Mara beb, I need another Templar.

Just as bad and maybe even worse on the stamina side of things, roll a Sorc and get an 11k shield that costs less than 3k magicka

Uhh wut? Absolutely false. Stamplar and Magicka Templar is in a great spot currently.

What exactly can a Stamplar do that a Stamina DK cannot? I'll tell you what they can't do, exchange Magicka for stamina.

Magicka Templars are pretty much in the same spot as Magicka DKs, their shields have the same *** scale off of health mechanic, they both have trouble with resource management, they can't burst damage, they are both tank classes that lack mobility so the stamina nerf to block greatly affects them. The only real difference between Temps and DKs ATM is that Temps can still use their Magicka heals (those are crappier too now though) however a reliable self heal isn't going to fix DKs or Temps. I could go on about how Magicka DKs get reflective scales while the Templars reflect works off of CC immunity and is single target, or I could compare the passives but that isn't the point. Both classes have been continually nerfed to the point where there is a noticeable difference between them and the "high burst high mobility" classes

Erm have you played either? I've played both for a long time, good friends with people that have as well. They are in a much better spot right now. Stamplar has insane DPS from Biting Jabs. Apparently you've never heard of Repentance, that scales off Stamina/Weapon Damage now as well...

Radiant Ward is still somewhat useful, and people need to stop trying to use Igneous Shield what it was not designed for. Templars absolutely do not have resource management issues, thanks to all of their channeled abilities which lend themselves much better to having high regen, plus repentance with the 10% regen boost.

Templars are much better off this update, I'm sorry that you can't see that.

A magicka Templar isn't in the same light as a Sorcerer or Nightblade, but they aren't in the spot that Magicka DK is.

*sigh*
I really wanted to keep on track with the DK buffs and all but I have to reply.

Biting jabs is a very good stamina morph. This is something that Stamplars have over any other Stamina class, however its damage is divided into 4 strikes that can be easily dodged. This alone makes it only situationally better than Wrecking Blow which puts all of its damage on 1 hit. If you land every Biting Jab then you will have insane DPS but you won't land all your hits unless you use it while your opponent is CC'd. If your opponent hasn't broken out of a CC to avoid what's coming next then it's probably better to just spam Wrecking Blow again and keep them CC locked. Try to remember that Biting Jabs also gives out free CC immunity so it would break any CC you have on your opponent and it would prevent you from using anymore. Overall its not much of a DPS increase due to its partitioning of damage and CC immunity.

I've heard of and used repentance. It's a skill that absorbs the remaining life force of dead bodies (ironic) and gives back free Stam and health. This skill can be incredibly useful but at the same!e time incredibly useless. If there are no dead bodies around this skill will give back no Stam or health and in small scale battles this tends to be the case. Bring this down to the smallest scale (1v1) and there pretty much is no point in slotting repentance at all. It does give a nice increase to regen (10%) but that is at the cost of a skill slot which doesn't seem worth it. Overall, this skill falls behind any other Stam return in small scale PvP because its not a reliable way to return Stam when you need it the most.

Radiant Ward is fairly similar to Igneous shields in terms of strength. Let's say a Templar has 25000 health. That equates to a base shield of 4k. If you are surrounded by 6 people then the ward will scale to 5200. An increase of 1.2k is supposed to protect you from 6 people? Granted you can shield stack but so can DKs, they would just have a shield 1.2k less than that of a Templar. If you think a shield that is 1.2k greater than a DKs shield only when surrounded by 6 people is truly a great advantage that Templars have then I really don't see how I can get through to you.

I don't see how you can put Igneous shields below Radiant Ward. Yes Igneous shields has the potential to be slightly less than Radiant Ward but Igneous Shields grants a 30% to all healing done by you. This means for Stamina DKs this skill will buff Vigor and Rally. Meanwhile the Templar's 30% increase from Cleansing Ritual only scales for the Restoring Light tree. This means that Stamina DKs get a 30% increase to Stamina heals while Stamina Templar's do not. On top of this Igneous Shields returns 5% Stamina back with each cast and depending on your build you can get 15-25% of your Stamina back if you spam this ability. While this may be slightly less than the Stamina return from Repentance, it is far more reliable and doesn't lose its viability as you go into smaller and smaller fights.

I really have to ask you how somebody uses Igneous shields for something that it wasn't designed for? I mean if the skill says it has some sort of property and it shows that property once activated then I think that's what the devs designed it to do, or do you just know better?

As far as I can see people use Igneous Shields for 3 things, protection, Stam return, and increased healing. Two out of three things that Igneous shield can do requires Templar's to slot two skills while DKs only have to slot 1 and that 30% increased healing for Stam heals? Templar's don't get it. It's funny that Templar's are actually worse healers when it comes to Stamina since their class is supposed to be the "support". As of now Stamina DKs are fairing better than Stamina Templar's due to their utility and better synergies within the class. Stam Templar's aren't unplayable but don't kid yourself, they aren't on the same level as Stam DKs.

Finally, Green Dragons Blood represents a problem for Stamina DKs. Right now, due to the health scaling feature of this skill it can also be utilized by Stamina DKs. I know GDB on its own isn't any good but combining it with Vigor gives a great initial burst and then a strong HoT. This is again something Stamina Templar's lack, their heal scales off of Magicka and is utter rubbish for a Stam build. This puts Stamina Templars behind in healing even further and if GDB is buffes while maintaining the health scaling feature this may lead to a serious imbalancw between classes.

How was it that you came to the conclusion that Stam Temps are better than Stam DK's?

Flip side
Magicka Temps are above Magicka DKs due to the lack of a viable self heal for DKs but they aren't that much better.

BoL heals for a base of 1.1k (without the Battle Spirit) and scales up with Magicka and Spell Damage.

In Cyrodiil with 32k max Magicka and 2400 Spell Damage buffed my base heal is about 4.5k. If I Stand in a circle of protection (30% increase of heals) then it reaches about 5.8k. Now BoL can crit and it does this especially at low health. My BoL crits for around 8.3kk and with v16 gear I'm sure it could crit for 10k. This is the current strength of the Magicka Templar's. Unfortunately I am unable to do any testing with GDB so all I can say is what everyone else has said, it sucks but I imagine some people manage to use it.

Other than a self heal there is really nothing that Temps have that DKs do not. DKs have a better reflect, a better armour buff skill that doesn't require you to stay in a circle, superior crowd control, and arguably better ultimates.

Magicka Templar's do have Radiant Destruction but that skill is roll dodge able now which kind of makes it pointless against an experienced player.

Channeled focus is a great Magicka restore skill I'll give you that but it's armour buff is lackluster since you can't move around.

Please tell me besides the self heal what do Templar's have that make them so much superior to Magicka DKs?
These classes are similar in design and therefore experience some of the same problems. Buffing GDB isn't going to put magicka DKs on par with Sorcs or Nightblades. These classes needs skills that give out miss chances and they need their shields to scale back to 30% of max health in Cyrodiil.

So far in this update I see Stamina DKs being ahead of Stamina Templars and Magicka Templar's being ahead of Magicka DKs. Both are still at the bottom of the pile though and balancing for both classes is needed.

If you have any other skills you want to suggest and compare please do, although I'd appreciate a less disdainful tone. Thanks.

Sorry for any typos or syntax errors, I'm on a phone and its really hard to keep track of it all.

Dude, thats amazing!!!
finally someone that put it as simple as it can be! thx!! But one think there still might be to say about jabs, u cant skip them and if u put it in comparison to s&b bash+light attack+attack , i see many disadvantages and u are without any protection.
Also u cant jab when someone talons u and simpl walks behind u, u wont hit him at all.

i was one of the stamplar pioneers and i am without hope... i think ill head for a dk since i know its damn awesome!

Xsorus

Jabs was powerful before the patch, now with the nerf to Blocking/Dodging its extremely nasty as you can't do either very long against someone spamming Jabs....

CitraBenzoet_ESO

Oooooo fire boots sound exciting.
We need more fire buffs. I cant even seem to set a grass fire with engulfing flames. Or whatever its called

Rylana

Teargrants wrote: »

My magicka DK brethren I beseech thee, Trust in the Heart of the Cards and your hopes shall come true. Have faith, that ZOS may return DK to it's former glory!

LOL, that be @Vortexman11 depicted there I reckon

OtarTheMad

Either remove Wall of Elements from the Destruction staff skill line and replace it or make it useful again. It's a joke of an ability and honestly a wet sponge might hit an enemy harder.

Damage overall should be increased to balance out with other weapon abilities. Replace Ancient Knowledge with a passive that puts spell damage in line of Dual Wield. No way should DW give you more spell damage, this needs to be fixed. And also completely agree, bring back the range on Impulse.

AhPook_Is_Here

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Either remove Wall of Elements from the Destruction staff skill line and replace it or make it useful again. It's a joke of an ability and honestly a wet sponge might hit an enemy harder.

Damage overall should be increased to balance out with other weapon abilities. Replace Ancient Knowledge with a passive that puts spell damage in line of Dual Wield. No way should DW give you more spell damage, this needs to be fixed. And also completely agree, bring back the range on Impulse.

Well if you wring the wet sponge out over the server rack it might hit those enemies really hard. Don't underestimate the power of a wet sponge.

Nafirian

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks to everyone for providing your feedback, and to @Jules for a well-written list of concerns and proposed solutions; we’ve passed this thread along to the Dev team to review. In general, we will be focusing on fixing outstanding ability bugs in the next major update, in addition to supporting some new systems. Larger balance and ability improvements for Dragonknights and the other classes are planned for early next year.

inb4 september next year

Nafirian

Derra wrote: »

Oh wow. Hey DK friends look forward to get buffs as soon as early next year! Maybe check out our new dlc and level a nightblade for that one...

You all have my warmest condolences

Plz derra we all knwo ti will be in September and it will be a "Increased the cost of GBD and improved healing"

TBF is zos listen to their community and im astounded they have or have at leaat read what we are talking about gives me a glimmer of hope not just for dks but the game in general

Nafirian

vortexman11 wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks to everyone for providing your feedback, and to @Jules for a well-written list of concerns and proposed solutions; we’ve passed this thread along to the Dev team to review. In general, we will be focusing on fixing outstanding ability bugs in the next major update, in addition to supporting some new systems.Larger balance and ability improvements for Dragonknights and the other classes are planned for early next year.

So....does this mean we've got 4 months to "enjoy" 1.7 then you're going to completely rebalance the game again forcing everyone to redo all their builds and ruining it in another completely different and unexpected way? Great! Thank you for the confirmation that I shouldn't spend any gold on gear because it will be completely overhauled....again.

Can you not just make small balance changes in each incremental patch? Why must you guys rebalance EVERYTHING then wait another 4-5 months and rebalance EVERYTHING again. 1.6 would of been great if you fixed bugs, but instead you chose to rebalance EVERYTHING all over again. 1.5 would of been great if you tweaked the way a few skills and passives worked, but instead you decided to rebalance it again. Each time you guys do one of your beautiful rebalances more and more PvPers leave this game. Look, I know you guys care very little about your PvP community, but stop with the large scale rebalancing and start tweaking the game until it reaches the perfection it could of reached months ago.

So....does this mean we've got 4 months to "enjoy" 1.7 then you're going to completely rebalance the game again forcing everyone to redo all their builds and ruining it in another completely different and unexpected way? Great! Thank you for the confirmation that I shouldn't spend any gold on gear because it will be completely overhauled....again.

I agree when ZOS bring out a new patch they change far too much and far too much unneeded things they reinvent the wheel far to often all they need to do is adjustments changed and minor re balances then game is great ;_;

Nafirian

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

To be clear, we don't have plans to completely rebalance and rework classes like we did back in Update 6. The next update will contain mainly bug fixes, and the update after that will have adjustments and tweaks to the classes.

I will hold you to this but hey just do small changes buff dks (inb4 i get flame for that) and SMALL Changes you guys can do a great job just listen to us and we will make you the monney we know you want from us

Nafirian

Lamiai wrote: »

well that response from zos is beyond disappointing, straight up saying DK are done for next few months..

CP5

Nafirian wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

To be clear, we don't have plans to completely rebalance and rework classes like we did back in Update 6. The next update will contain mainly bug fixes, and the update after that will have adjustments and tweaks to the classes.

I will hold you to this but hey just do small changes buff dks (inb4 i get flame for that) and SMALL Changes you guys can do a great job just listen to us and we will make you the monney we know you want from us

I hope they get around to this, Gina has done her part an it falls to the combat team to follow through with it. Unfortunately they don't have my confidence after the hubla that happened earlier in the year right before they took their several months silence for console launch.

Nafirian

CP5 wrote: »

Nafirian wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

To be clear, we don't have plans to completely rebalance and rework classes like we did back in Update 6. The next update will contain mainly bug fixes, and the update after that will have adjustments and tweaks to the classes.

I will hold you to this but hey just do small changes buff dks (inb4 i get flame for that) and SMALL Changes you guys can do a great job just listen to us and we will make you the monney we know you want from us

I hope they get around to this, Gina has done her part an it falls to the combat team to follow through with it. Unfortunately they don't have my confidence after the hubla that happened earlier in the year right before they took their several months silence for console launch.

#BelieveinZOS

krim

how do you like your DK lmao.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ks8_KGHqmO4

RadioheadSh0t

PhatGrimReaper wrote: »

Oh gum'on gents..... let's not turn this into one of those threads where everyone boasts about the incredible size of their ..... ego.

Joy_Division wrote: »

RadioheadSh0t wrote: »

Lord_Hev wrote: »

.

RadioheadSh0t wrote: »

Man, the DK QQ is a bit much...

They tell you they appreciate your points and give you a reasonable timeline, and you STILL QQ?

DK is not nearly as faceroll weak as it was faceroll strong... If you have to deal with a few months as a marginally worse class, it's a small price to pay for a class that was faceroll strong for quite a while.

Good to see you are enjoying your VR 16 NB. Go circle-jerk with the rest of the NB rerolls and quit trying to undermine the concerns of this thread.

ABCDEF... Guy...

So since I have more than one class I can't state my opinion? Actually, I'd think someone who has more experience with more classes has a more credible opinion.

So even though the first class I played in BETA was a nightblade, I'm just jumping on that bandwagon, right? I actually joked about why I wouldn't level my NB, because it'd be all if want to play, and guess what, it is. NB fits my playstyle, I'm not a NB just because it's strong (and new flash: it isn't as strong as you think it is).

IF you're trying to use the fact that I have 3/4 classes leveled against me, bravo, buddy...

You always begin reasonable discussions by referring to the other participants as QQers?

I leveled all four classes. By your own admission I have a more credible opinion than you.

You are wrong.

If by 'reasonable discussion' you mean telling me to go circle jerk, that's pretty funny. I wasn't discrediting your opinion, that's what YOU were doing by trying to invalidate my points just because I have a NB as well. So stop being a hypocrit, and stop pretending like I don't agree that DKs could use a buff, my point has been about putting their current state in a relative picture and calling out the hyperbolic QQers, of which there are many.

I call people QQers when they are QQers, and I was mostly referring to the reaction of Gina's response. "We're getting fixed, but not soon enough.... Wah wah."

I've said DK could use a buff, I agree with most of the points people are making.

What I don't agree with is the *wah wah DKs aren't faceroll anymore* attitude I see far too often. DKs weren't as terrible in 1.6 as people pretend they are, and while they're worse in 1.7 they're still not as relatively weak as they were relatively strong for the first year after launch.

RadioheadSh0t

Edit: double post

Teargrants

krim wrote: »

how do you like your DK lmao.

You sir are a brave soul to repost that. I believe you deserve a medal.

Here you go.

Ishammael

krim wrote: »

how do you like your DK lmao.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ks8_KGHqmO4

Even after watching this probably ten times...

It's still funny.

ThyIronFist

Ishammael wrote: »

krim wrote: »

how do you like your DK lmao.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ks8_KGHqmO4

Even after watching this probably ten times...

It's still funny.

You've only watched it 10 times? I watch it every time I wake up, and every time before I go to bed, and then cry myself to sleep.

RoamingRiverElk

What really gets me that they either don't seem to realize how the general changes are affecting and have affected different classes, or that they just don't care - like with magicka DKs.

And then when this is brought up, we're given 4+ months to just hang in there. Four months is a very, very long time when it comes to a game like this. So for 120+ days when one would like to play on a dk, one gets to... enjoy... the current state of it.

Some classes didn't and don't need to block a lot because they have other methods of mitigating / avoiding damage, or escaping. And then there are classes that do need to be able to block. How is the straight-to-0% stamina regen change contributing to build variety? It got rid of certain builds totally. They didn't even make it 50%, they made it 0%. And not buffing Dragon Blood within the next two weeks? Really... That could be a pure change of a numerical value, from what I imagine - and then making that value only apply in Cyrodiil, is it really that difficult?

Armitas

I made a Video showcasing ZOS's development on the DK since release. You should be able to easily identify every update all the way up to 1.7.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-pywxSjT7I

DUTCH_REAPER

My pvp magic DK needs some love ZOS. Until then rerolling a NB