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Shields are getting changed to be critted

  • Septimus_Magna
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    jpalm1995 wrote: »
    I love all the QQ from sorcerers. If you don't want your shields to be critable then you shouldn't want your frags to crit for 17k

    My shields dont crit when I cast them, damage and heals can crit so why cant shields crit? My 45-50% is completely ignored while I have to defend myself, except for the healing ward heal.

    Dont forget that all magicka builds use harness magicka and/or healing ward. So all magicka builds get nerfed in comparison to stam builds, especially stam NBs which have a ton of crit and burst damage.

    The problem with crits on shields is that shield dont have any mitigation, unmitigated crit damage will very high so the shield value have to be increased accordingly. This will punish builds with low crit and benefit builds with high crit. So tanky builds will have more trouble killing magicka builds and stam burst builds (ie gankers) will have an easier time killing magicka builds. This is the exact opposite of what is needed atm.


    Edited by Septimus_Magna on August 2, 2015 7:18AM
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  • trimsic_ESO
    trimsic_ESO
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    @Mawgusta If you don't see many DK using chain as a gap closer, there should be a good reason for that ;)
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  • Mawgusta
    Mawgusta
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    Darnathian wrote: »
    You people are ridiculous.

    Dude. Just stop. You call us the tankier class yet all sorc's and nb's complained about us blocking all your damn damage all the time but failing to kill you. But now we can be tanks because it suits your argument.

    Let's fast forward one month from now. Half the posts will be gone. It will only be nb's and sorc's calling for nerfs on each other. Because all us dk's and Templars will be gone from this game. Enjoy

    Are you even testing this game? DKs and Templars are for sure the new meta. Sure you have problems with sorcerers. This is not PvP. I've taken an entirely different approach to my thought process today. This is PvP with 4-5 mobs hitting you. This is not build for you awesome 1v1. This is build like PvE to kill the 3 mobs and 2 players that are on you.. Templar jabs, and more than enough Dk ability builds deal with multiple targets without really having to consider flame wall and pulsar. NBs are burnt to gank. Sorc can be decent...

    Today I took a different approach. Getting ganked with mobs on me and my wife, by groups of 3-4 unconscionable group crews that love 5 on 2s because they're group elite and proving their virginity.. if it wasn't that it was infinitely dismall mob fights because I'm building for PvP. So I started running AoE builds with resto staffs calling out to my wife when to drop healing springs, rapid regen etc.. We're sitting in 4 mobs with 4 players on us and the players are disappearing. Healing crunks all. AoE crunks all. I'm watching uncoordinated players get the F out ofour deal. Good coordinated groups come in on us, but they usually have heal/tank dps dps.. So..

    best at doing this.. is Dk and Templar. Stop thinking pvp.. think PvE with wacko PvE bosses running amuck making you think about what youre doing and you'll start whipping people out.

    Edit: lmao at NBs and sorcs trying to gank our double healing springs, rapid regen, combat prayer, ward resto staff builds between our AoE dps. On top of that my wife is so not a gamer. If she new what she was doing I would be chasing your groups down.

    Double edit.. The game is broken. If youre magica load your first bar with AoEs and your second bar as resto with everything.. 5 restso magicka builds with destro staff (class) Aoes = win.. Start building to drop springs and rapid regens.. With 50% less damage.. healing is win. Stop building your super sustain builds with your second bar loaded for your survival. Its about healing people who are dying, because the dps isn't enough and thus, your keeping them the target instead of yourself. It's hard to explain. BUT the more people doing this the bigger the real problem gets exasperated. Healing>all

    So if youre completely PvP built for your own survival and someone else is being attacked while your free to stay on DPS bar while they struggle to survive youre second survival bar is being wasted. You could be dropping healing springs on them, rapid gens, whatever then changing back to your dps.. When it comes to PvP by changing your sole survivor to group hero you essentially built yourself a better dps char. By helping them survive you can get back into your dps bar and not be the focus target. Where as your PvP build of sole survivor wastes the second bar watching friendlies die and you become the next target sooner. trust me, magickas load your dps bar with AoEa and your survival bar with resto healing.. You'll win all day.

    Edited by Mawgusta on August 2, 2015 8:01AM
  • trimsic_ESO
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    @Mawgusta IMHO healing should be superior to all.

    It's even the basis of a good PVP design. Because then, this is where crowd control effects are so important: to down the healers first. And this requires to have a good teamplay.

    Unfortunately in ESO the crowd control mechanics needs some review. It lacks diminishing returns, and the self-purge is too powerful.
    Edited by trimsic_ESO on August 2, 2015 8:51AM
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  • Mawgusta
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    My opinion is that if 6 players meet 6 players and group A has 1 healer and group B has 2. group B is winning. But my further opinion is that if the player base gets smart and realize the meta.. 6 AoE dps casters with group resto healing skills on their 2nd bars, instead of the usual sole survivor skills that they usually have, they will be Gods compared to either group A or B.
    Edited by Mawgusta on August 2, 2015 8:22AM
  • Zsymon
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    @Mawgusta IMHO healing should be superior to all.

    It's even the basis of a good PVP design. Because then, this is were crowd control effects are so important: to down the healers first. And this requires to have a good teamplay.

    Unfortunately in ESO the crowd control mechanics needs some review. It lacks diminishing returns, and the self-purge is too powerful.

    Imo a 5 second immunity to CC is fine, make it any worse and CC will become useless. It will become pointless to slot any CC abilities. The self purge is fine as well, it eats a lot of stamina for most builds, and does not instantly free you up to continue fighting.

    The CC system is one of the few systems in ESO that functions perfectly. Apart of course from bugs where you can't purge a CC, but I'm talking about balance.
    Edited by Zsymon on August 2, 2015 8:28AM
  • Baragorath
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    Dracane wrote: »
    I assume, Nightblade will eat us and 1vx is no longer possible

    No more comments.

    Sorceror hypocrisy in the purest form.........
    Edited by Baragorath on August 2, 2015 9:22AM
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  • Docmandu
    Docmandu
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    Farorin wrote: »
    KingKush wrote: »
    Everyone crying about Sorcs are gonna be the same people crying about Magicka NB a month from now.

    Revealing flare makes NBs useless.

    But it also makes the one equipping it useless, since it takes up a slot and it pretty useless overall.. better equip caltrops, at least that has some uses.
  • Docmandu
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    Xsorus wrote: »
    Xsorus wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    Darnathian wrote: »
    Darnathian wrote: »
    k2blader wrote: »
    k2blader wrote: »
    k2blader wrote: »
    This makes my re-roll of night blade and templar justified.

    With this change light armor is dead for any class, its simply not viable at all unless you want to die.

    You can't be a caster in light armor, heaven forbid you have a damage shield and dont die in one hit.

    Without a damage shield all light armor users are naked in spell resist or physical resist against anyone with a sharpened weapon and even more so with a few point in spell erosion or piercing.

    Your damage shields already have no armor or spell resist and now the can be crit? Pointless lol

    The worst part is this screws templar more then anyone and they are already being miffed. Pathetic.

    So many people who are good (?) at PvP don't get this it's amazing.

    Ask them, how is a sorc supposed to survive?, I'm curious what they'd say.

    How does any light armored class survive? Be thankful that you have an extra shield at your disposal. Also if you're concerned about survival, try throwing a couple of pieces of heavy armor on, our craft a defensive item set.

    Uh, I am thankful. With no class heal and nerfed mobility, it helps, yes. Note you can roll a sorc too if you want the sorc shield.

    2 pieces of heavy does essentially nothing on live. Have they changed things to make it much more effective for light armored classes? Have they added CPs to give equivalent mitigation against physical damage as there is currently against magical damage?

    Oh, and recommend a "defensive item set"?

    Also you don't need a class heal when you're a magicka user. They have restoration staffs for those.

    Ok, so you've demonstrated you know nothing about playing a sorc effectively.

    Re. no class heal I was trying to get you to understand (a bit) why sorcs have a good class shield. You know other magicka using classes have class heals right? Any class, let alone sorcs, who have to (or opt to) equip a resto staff for heals deserve that much more survivability IMO.

    But that's theproblem. It's too good. You all defended it when people were asking it to be scaled off health like every other shield. So this is what you get

    To say that is okay for sorc's to spam 25k+ shields is okay is laughable. Class heals? Lol. I will trade you that. Those shields add up to way more than most people have in hp's. And on top of that it makes you stronger offensively too

    Good change. I personally was hoping for the. To remove stacking but this is decent

    Looks like you can't just put on light armor and nothing but shields and nukes on your bars now

    On live my hardened ward is 15k in Cyrodiil. 5k less than my DK's igneous shield. You know what the difference is? My DK has a lot more ways to survive, has a reflect, a self heal that's boosted by my shield, and ultimates that restore my stats. So I gladly trade a mere 5k shield for that. And, guess what, I can shield stack on my DK too! Omg!

    Please stop with this 25k+ shield crap. Sorcerers commonly use Harness + Hardened. But, remember, Harness only absorbs spell damage based attacks and is available to everyone. And seeing as many stamina based attacks and even a few magicka based attacks hit almost for 15k, I find it hilarious that people have such an issue with hardened ward. As for shields on PTS, I think the crit change is going to solve the issues people are having. So let's wait that out before sobbing for more nerfs.

    Misinformation doesn't help anyone.

    You dodged. Dry carefully what i said in the first paragraph. Let's try this again

    Does that OP shield on you DK make him stronger offensively? No it does not. That's what should have changed. It should scale off health like every else. Sorc's defended that to the death. Then this is where we are now. Should have took the fair change

    Yes yes and now stop being blind. Everyone knows, DK has the best DPS. Have you ever faced a dual wield DK spamming whip and his other things in Cyrodiil ? They tear you up within seconds. No shield spam or block will help you against that.

    A friend of mine gets accused of being a cheater, because his damage is THAT nasty. Dragonknights destroy things in Cyrodiil. problem is, most DKs play as tanks. So you can't expect that from them

    I can safely say I've never faced a dual wield flame lash spamming dk simply because it's one of the worst setups in the game, you lack a charge and if you choose to have a ranged magicka weapon you will not have a charge, if ya choose a charge you'll have no range to speak of.

    The reason dual wield works good on classes like nb, sorc, and Templar is they have mobility plus range

    What Templar mobility are you talking about? Like, what? Seriously, more and more you show how much you DON'T know about any class.

    When i'm talking about Mobility, i'm talking about a Class based Charge, like Toppling Charge in this regards.

    DK's don't have anything like that..so its hard to run a DW based melee class if you can't get close to the target.

    If you want to spat with me more we can...you will not like it.

    Doesn't DK have chains... it either pulls target to you or you to target.. so there is your gap closer when you go DW... (and Leap, but that's an ultimate, so it doesn't count)
  • Maulkin
    Maulkin
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    Baragorath wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    I assume, Nightblade will eat us and 1vx is no longer possible

    No more comments.

    Sorceror hypocrisy in the purest form.........

    ??
    EU | PC | AD
  • Laggus
    Laggus
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    Xsorus wrote: »
    Real issue is certain shields scaling off magicka vs health.

    This is one of those Blanket changes that will probably hurt most shields...then again since most shields are crap anyway it might not really matter

    This.

    The fact that certain shields scale off magicka instead of health is one of the major sources of imbalance in this game, because when a shield scales off magicka, it grants the player the ability to be extremely tanky and the ability to deal a lot of spell damage since the damage caused by the spells also scales off magicka.

    Hence the need to reduce the effectiveness of the shields in PVP, as a workaround.

    But the shields are also too powerful in PVE. There are plenty of videos showing sorcs pulling 15-20 mobs in PVE and chain killing them easily. I mean it's also OP in PVE. So why does ZOS implement this workaround instead of solving the problem at the root ?

    You want to be tanky? Then increase your health pool and you have strong shields, but then you won't be a pure damage dealer. You want to be a pure damage dealer? Then increase your magicka pool, but then you won't be tanky. This is how it should work, always. But in ESO it's possible for some classes to be a pure damage dealer and be tanky at the time. Why?

    Because ZoS do not implement enough changes during the beta testing on PTS. There are lots of really good players which provide genuine feedback even if it means making their main class less OP.

    They have set the release date for the update on live at the same time they announced the update on PTS. This points to just fix whatever we can that's not completely game breaking and sure we can fix everything else the week after live launches. It never works out that way though. Bugs/balancing issues reported in PTS will go on and on and they never will get around to fixing some of them. There is a lot to test and they have a huge job with updates like this. There's no denying that, but one month of beta testing with a large amount of bugs reported already does not even allow for bugs fixes that are introduced which cause other bugs to be fixed.
  • Xsorus
    Xsorus
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    Docmandu wrote: »
    Xsorus wrote: »
    Xsorus wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    Darnathian wrote: »
    Darnathian wrote: »
    k2blader wrote: »
    k2blader wrote: »
    k2blader wrote: »
    This makes my re-roll of night blade and templar justified.

    With this change light armor is dead for any class, its simply not viable at all unless you want to die.

    You can't be a caster in light armor, heaven forbid you have a damage shield and dont die in one hit.

    Without a damage shield all light armor users are naked in spell resist or physical resist against anyone with a sharpened weapon and even more so with a few point in spell erosion or piercing.

    Your damage shields already have no armor or spell resist and now the can be crit? Pointless lol

    The worst part is this screws templar more then anyone and they are already being miffed. Pathetic.

    So many people who are good (?) at PvP don't get this it's amazing.

    Ask them, how is a sorc supposed to survive?, I'm curious what they'd say.

    How does any light armored class survive? Be thankful that you have an extra shield at your disposal. Also if you're concerned about survival, try throwing a couple of pieces of heavy armor on, our craft a defensive item set.

    Uh, I am thankful. With no class heal and nerfed mobility, it helps, yes. Note you can roll a sorc too if you want the sorc shield.

    2 pieces of heavy does essentially nothing on live. Have they changed things to make it much more effective for light armored classes? Have they added CPs to give equivalent mitigation against physical damage as there is currently against magical damage?

    Oh, and recommend a "defensive item set"?

    Also you don't need a class heal when you're a magicka user. They have restoration staffs for those.

    Ok, so you've demonstrated you know nothing about playing a sorc effectively.

    Re. no class heal I was trying to get you to understand (a bit) why sorcs have a good class shield. You know other magicka using classes have class heals right? Any class, let alone sorcs, who have to (or opt to) equip a resto staff for heals deserve that much more survivability IMO.

    But that's theproblem. It's too good. You all defended it when people were asking it to be scaled off health like every other shield. So this is what you get

    To say that is okay for sorc's to spam 25k+ shields is okay is laughable. Class heals? Lol. I will trade you that. Those shields add up to way more than most people have in hp's. And on top of that it makes you stronger offensively too

    Good change. I personally was hoping for the. To remove stacking but this is decent

    Looks like you can't just put on light armor and nothing but shields and nukes on your bars now

    On live my hardened ward is 15k in Cyrodiil. 5k less than my DK's igneous shield. You know what the difference is? My DK has a lot more ways to survive, has a reflect, a self heal that's boosted by my shield, and ultimates that restore my stats. So I gladly trade a mere 5k shield for that. And, guess what, I can shield stack on my DK too! Omg!

    Please stop with this 25k+ shield crap. Sorcerers commonly use Harness + Hardened. But, remember, Harness only absorbs spell damage based attacks and is available to everyone. And seeing as many stamina based attacks and even a few magicka based attacks hit almost for 15k, I find it hilarious that people have such an issue with hardened ward. As for shields on PTS, I think the crit change is going to solve the issues people are having. So let's wait that out before sobbing for more nerfs.

    Misinformation doesn't help anyone.

    You dodged. Dry carefully what i said in the first paragraph. Let's try this again

    Does that OP shield on you DK make him stronger offensively? No it does not. That's what should have changed. It should scale off health like every else. Sorc's defended that to the death. Then this is where we are now. Should have took the fair change

    Yes yes and now stop being blind. Everyone knows, DK has the best DPS. Have you ever faced a dual wield DK spamming whip and his other things in Cyrodiil ? They tear you up within seconds. No shield spam or block will help you against that.

    A friend of mine gets accused of being a cheater, because his damage is THAT nasty. Dragonknights destroy things in Cyrodiil. problem is, most DKs play as tanks. So you can't expect that from them

    I can safely say I've never faced a dual wield flame lash spamming dk simply because it's one of the worst setups in the game, you lack a charge and if you choose to have a ranged magicka weapon you will not have a charge, if ya choose a charge you'll have no range to speak of.

    The reason dual wield works good on classes like nb, sorc, and Templar is they have mobility plus range

    What Templar mobility are you talking about? Like, what? Seriously, more and more you show how much you DON'T know about any class.

    When i'm talking about Mobility, i'm talking about a Class based Charge, like Toppling Charge in this regards.

    DK's don't have anything like that..so its hard to run a DW based melee class if you can't get close to the target.

    If you want to spat with me more we can...you will not like it.

    Doesn't DK have chains... it either pulls target to you or you to target.. so there is your gap closer when you go DW... (and Leap, but that's an ultimate, so it doesn't count)

    Completely unreliable, trust me I tried to make use of it.

    It'll either pull the target to me, and half the time if i'm chasing pull him behind me.

    Or i'll get pulled to him and he'll get keep moving because it doesn't have a Knockdown or Snare.

    Its great in PvE for pulling stationary mobs...in PvP though its god awful half the time.

  • Kupoking
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    Why dont we just stop talking about it until its tested?

    I think this change will be for the best interest of both part as it will balance bubble and prevent further nerfing of dmg shield hurting the magika templar even more because of sorcs Hardened ward.

    Plus reducing to zero crit rating is stupid, especially if zos want ppl to use crit surge.
  • Dracane
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    I'm so tired of this qqing about Hardened Ward scaling of Magicka. That's the very idea of it and is good as it is.
    Seriously, are you people not able to understand ? Or can't you understand ?

    Sorcerer is meant to be a magicka based class. Each class offers different playstyles. Hardened Ward is meant for a Magicka playstyle, but there are Sorcerer builds without Hardened Ward.
    A Templars shield is meant for tanks, who have high health and HIGHLY benefit from their health based shield (same goes for DK) And blazing shield also increases the damage based on its strenght. So dont tell me, Templars dont benefit from being tanky and having damage either.

    But if you play a Templar Healer, you aren't even supposed to have this strong shield, because you have insane burst heals. Having both, strong heals AND a strong shield is OP and shouldn't be possible. A Dragonknight could have might shields, when he uses healing ward, Harness and his class shield, combined with a strong self heal that gets boosted by his shield. And a DK, can reach muuuuch higher damage output than a Sorcerer. Get creative and come out of your bubble

    And now finally come to recognize this and get the very idea of classes, until you start talking about this nonsense. And thanks for qqing, so that any diversity in this game gets destroyed, thanks to you not willing to learn and adapt. Thank you
    Edited by Dracane on August 2, 2015 11:12AM
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  • Tankqull
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    @Mawgusta IMHO healing should be superior to all.

    It's even the basis of a good PVP design. Because then, this is where crowd control effects are so important: to down the healers first. And this requires to have a good teamplay.

    Unfortunately in ESO the crowd control mechanics needs some review. It lacks diminishing returns, and the self-purge is too powerful.

    i do agree but it must be a dedicated job wich isnt the case in this game, some onechosing the path of beeing a healer should have no dmg but strong heals and cc.
    in this game though any magica user is everything without any (significant) drawbacks(with 1.7 the same happens to stamina builds with the vigor changes). wich leads to the blobing (10+player) where you are (if done correctly) invincable unless you are facing a significant larger force. the mainproblem at this point from my PoV is healing ward wich offers way to much protection and healing U82TiGU.jpg this is indicating a shield of around 30k value wich is impossible to be broken if spammed (especially from multiple sources as it stack by multiple players) while having multiple hots and insta heals spammed blindly thx to "smarthealing" ...
    other games [DAoC being one of the best examples] atleast required skill and perception of a healer to be worthwhile as he has to coordinate target pics, different casting times of heals and especially predicting targetswitches of enemy assist trains start healing even before they have arrived at their new target. al this has eliminated by the way this game sets up fights.

    back to shields as the pic i´ve posted here clearly shows the main culprit aint hardend ward it is actually healing ward wich makes it impossible to kill anyone as it provides way to much shielding and healing.
    to bring that ability down to some kinde of equal footing with other shields it should be caped after its value calculation at 66% max health of the recieving char, and unstackable if casted by multiple players its just laughable that you have a player down to <5% just to face a 240k shield value because he recived 6-7 healing wards :P [have no pic as i died miserably just a second later]
    Baragorath wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    I assume, Nightblade will eat us and 1vx is no longer possible

    No more comments.

    Sorceror hypocrisy in the purest form.........

    i am allready destroying 80% of the sorc players on my NB - the left over 20% are eiuther cheaters abusing every bug sorcs and the game offers running around with 35-50k+ magica as non emps or simply player who are better than me where i do have no problem with admitting it.
    with critable shields sorcs are facing rouhghly 30-35k physical dmg so no annulment within the first second
    (ambush+soul harvest+ 2 surprise attacks+ 1 light attack + 3-4 bashes) they have no chance surviving this as shields and light armor are not providing any mitigation.
    Edited by Tankqull on August 2, 2015 11:25AM
    spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused

    Sallington wrote: »
    Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"


  • smacx250
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    With respect to some earlier discussion in this thread on bugged shields on PTS, which is causing some shields to be too large, see the following:

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/203023/bug-hardened-ward-healing-ward-partially-not-affected-by-battle-spirit

    TL;DR - Testing appears to show that the healing ward low-health shield is up to 67% too large, and that the hardened ward morph is 25% too large
  • Dracane
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    Because the base value of hardened ward is debuffed and not the final value after the 33% increase.
    I think thats fine
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  • Tankqull
    Tankqull
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    Dracane wrote: »
    Because the base value of hardened ward is debuffed and not the final value after the 33% increase.
    I think thats fine

    actually it should not make any difference if ZOS would be able to do math :P
    1*1.33*0.5

    but what they are doing is over complicating the math behind their calculations by trying to apply % based modifications through addition and substaractiopn which thx to multiplying before adding (teached at second grade) requires a proper formula setup wich they fail every time at :/
    spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused

    Sallington wrote: »
    Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"


  • Dracane
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    Tankqull wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    Because the base value of hardened ward is debuffed and not the final value after the 33% increase.
    I think thats fine

    actually it should not make any difference if ZOS would be able to do math :P
    1*1.33*0.5

    but what they are doing is over complicating the math behind their calculations by trying to apply % based modifications through addition and substaractiopn which thx to multiplying before adding (teached at second grade) requires a proper formula setup wich they fail every time at :/

    :O what if they remove the 33% strenght from hardened ward and make the morph uncritable instead ? QQ
    *Shut up Dracane, Shut up, Dont tell them*
    Edited by Dracane on August 2, 2015 11:53AM
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  • Tankqull
    Tankqull
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    Dracane wrote: »
    Tankqull wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    Because the base value of hardened ward is debuffed and not the final value after the 33% increase.
    I think thats fine

    actually it should not make any difference if ZOS would be able to do math :P
    1*1.33*0.5

    but what they are doing is over complicating the math behind their calculations by trying to apply % based modifications through addition and substaractiopn which thx to multiplying before adding (teached at second grade) requires a proper formula setup wich they fail every time at :/

    :O what if they remove the 33% strenght from hardened ward and make the morph uncritable instead ? QQ
    *Shut up Dracane, Shut up, Dont tell them*

    that would help sorcs but all other lightarmor wearer would still recieve a gigiantic pole from behind ...
    spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused

    Sallington wrote: »
    Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"


  • Derra
    Derra
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    Tankqull wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    Tankqull wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    Because the base value of hardened ward is debuffed and not the final value after the 33% increase.
    I think thats fine

    actually it should not make any difference if ZOS would be able to do math :P
    1*1.33*0.5

    but what they are doing is over complicating the math behind their calculations by trying to apply % based modifications through addition and substaractiopn which thx to multiplying before adding (teached at second grade) requires a proper formula setup wich they fail every time at :/

    :O what if they remove the 33% strenght from hardened ward and make the morph uncritable instead ? QQ
    *Shut up Dracane, Shut up, Dont tell them*

    that would help sorcs but all other lightarmor wearer would still recieve a gigiantic pole from behind ...

    Some ppl are into that kind of things - maybe? :wink:
    <Noricum>
    I live. I die. I live again.

    Derra - DC - Sorc - Grand Overlord - Spotless Dro-m'Athra Destroyer pre one Tamriel
    Derrah - EP - Sorc - Grand Overlord
    ... - DC - NB

  • Dracane
    Dracane
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    ✭✭✭✭
    Derra wrote: »
    Tankqull wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    Tankqull wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    Because the base value of hardened ward is debuffed and not the final value after the 33% increase.
    I think thats fine

    actually it should not make any difference if ZOS would be able to do math :P
    1*1.33*0.5

    but what they are doing is over complicating the math behind their calculations by trying to apply % based modifications through addition and substaractiopn which thx to multiplying before adding (teached at second grade) requires a proper formula setup wich they fail every time at :/

    :O what if they remove the 33% strenght from hardened ward and make the morph uncritable instead ? QQ
    *Shut up Dracane, Shut up, Dont tell them*

    that would help sorcs but all other lightarmor wearer would still recieve a gigiantic pole from behind ...

    Some ppl are into that kind of things - maybe? :wink:

    The thing with the uncritable morph was only a joke :) and I hope, this doesn't happen and it wont.
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  • iTzStevey
    iTzStevey
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    So you can crit on shields now? That's sorcs pretty much removed from the game. They're already nerfing shields by 50% in pvp, and nerfing BOL into the ground. Yes we'll have more health but so will everyone else. I haven't heard of snipe being nerfed either which is sorely needed. Basically everyone respec to nightblade and sit in stealth 90% of the time spamming snipe and cloak with your 500 champ points, thats what end game is going to be. Boring.
  • Dracane
    Dracane
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    Hm yea I assume, many many people will reroll Nightblade.
    With all the QQ, I thought they would turn down Nightblade a bit. But the opposite happened.
    I can't wait for them to bring this next patch on the pts so that we can see what's going on.
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  • Saturn
    Saturn
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    All the shield-stacking sorcerers are complaining now since they won't be impossible to kill in a 1v1 anymore, lol.
    "Madness is a bitter mercy, perhaps, but a mercy nonetheless."

    Fire and Ice
  • Laggus
    Laggus
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    Dracane wrote: »
    I'm so tired of this qqing about Hardened Ward scaling of Magicka. That's the very idea of it and is good as it is.
    Seriously, are you people not able to understand ? Or can't you understand ?

    Sorcerer is meant to be a magicka based class. Each class offers different playstyles. Hardened Ward is meant for a Magicka playstyle, but there are Sorcerer builds without Hardened Ward.
    A Templars shield is meant for tanks, who have high health and HIGHLY benefit from their health based shield (same goes for DK) And blazing shield also increases the damage based on its strenght. So dont tell me, Templars dont benefit from being tanky and having damage either.

    But if you play a Templar Healer, you aren't even supposed to have this strong shield, because you have insane burst heals. Having both, strong heals AND a strong shield is OP and shouldn't be possible. A Dragonknight could have might shields, when he uses healing ward, Harness and his class shield, combined with a strong self heal that gets boosted by his shield. And a DK, can reach muuuuch higher damage output than a Sorcerer. Get creative and come out of your bubble

    And now finally come to recognize this and get the very idea of classes, until you start talking about this nonsense. And thanks for qqing, so that any diversity in this game gets destroyed, thanks to you not willing to learn and adapt. Thank you

    Theres an argument in there somewhere if DKs and Templars shields would not be critted but they will be, the same as Sorcs. Fact remains Sorcs will still have the best shields, can still spam them and still have their escape skill, albeit used less often in a row now. Comparing classes in this way is nonsense. How many DKs do you see using Healing Ward AND Harness AND their class shield. Yes they could have them but they would not be able to kill much.

    Lets see what PTS is like when the change is implemented.
  • Ace_SiN
    Ace_SiN
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    I was for shields being crit-able, since it currently feels like shields were buffed. However, since finding out Healing Ward and Hardened are not properly nerfed when inside Cyrodiil, then ZOS should fix that first.
    King of Beasts

  • Tankqull
    Tankqull
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    Laggus wrote: »
    Dracane wrote: »
    I'm so tired of this qqing about Hardened Ward scaling of Magicka. That's the very idea of it and is good as it is.
    Seriously, are you people not able to understand ? Or can't you understand ?

    Sorcerer is meant to be a magicka based class. Each class offers different playstyles. Hardened Ward is meant for a Magicka playstyle, but there are Sorcerer builds without Hardened Ward.
    A Templars shield is meant for tanks, who have high health and HIGHLY benefit from their health based shield (same goes for DK) And blazing shield also increases the damage based on its strenght. So dont tell me, Templars dont benefit from being tanky and having damage either.

    But if you play a Templar Healer, you aren't even supposed to have this strong shield, because you have insane burst heals. Having both, strong heals AND a strong shield is OP and shouldn't be possible. A Dragonknight could have might shields, when he uses healing ward, Harness and his class shield, combined with a strong self heal that gets boosted by his shield. And a DK, can reach muuuuch higher damage output than a Sorcerer. Get creative and come out of your bubble

    And now finally come to recognize this and get the very idea of classes, until you start talking about this nonsense. And thanks for qqing, so that any diversity in this game gets destroyed, thanks to you not willing to learn and adapt. Thank you

    Theres an argument in there somewhere if DKs and Templars shields would not be critted but they will be, the same as Sorcs. Fact remains Sorcs will still have the best shields, can still spam them and still have their escape skill, albeit used less often in a row now. Comparing classes in this way is nonsense. How many DKs do you see using Healing Ward AND Harness AND their class shield. Yes they could have them but they would not be able to kill much.

    Lets see what PTS is like when the change is implemented.

    so magica dks who have less dmg abilities slotted than sorcs valuing their own utility tools more valuable than shields complain that sorcs shieldstack while they refuse to the same - do i get your statement right?
    spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused

    Sallington wrote: »
    Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"


  • iTzStevey
    iTzStevey
    ✭✭✭
    Darnathian wrote: »
    k2blader wrote: »
    k2blader wrote: »
    k2blader wrote: »
    This makes my re-roll of night blade and templar justified.

    With this change light armor is dead for any class, its simply not viable at all unless you want to die.

    You can't be a caster in light armor, heaven forbid you have a damage shield and dont die in one hit.

    Without a damage shield all light armor users are naked in spell resist or physical resist against anyone with a sharpened weapon and even more so with a few point in spell erosion or piercing.

    Your damage shields already have no armor or spell resist and now the can be crit? Pointless lol

    The worst part is this screws templar more then anyone and they are already being miffed. Pathetic.

    So many people who are good (?) at PvP don't get this it's amazing.

    Ask them, how is a sorc supposed to survive?, I'm curious what they'd say.

    How does any light armored class survive? Be thankful that you have an extra shield at your disposal. Also if you're concerned about survival, try throwing a couple of pieces of heavy armor on, our craft a defensive item set.

    Uh, I am thankful. With no class heal and nerfed mobility, it helps, yes. Note you can roll a sorc too if you want the sorc shield.

    2 pieces of heavy does essentially nothing on live. Have they changed things to make it much more effective for light armored classes? Have they added CPs to give equivalent mitigation against physical damage as there is currently against magical damage?

    Oh, and recommend a "defensive item set"?

    Also you don't need a class heal when you're a magicka user. They have restoration staffs for those.

    Ok, so you've demonstrated you know nothing about playing a sorc effectively.

    Re. no class heal I was trying to get you to understand (a bit) why sorcs have a good class shield. You know other magicka using classes have class heals right? Any class, let alone sorcs, who have to (or opt to) equip a resto staff for heals deserve that much more survivability IMO.

    But that's theproblem. It's too good. You all defended it when people were asking it to be scaled off health like every other shield. So this is what you get

    To say that is okay for sorc's to spam 25k+ shields is okay is laughable. Class heals? Lol. I will trade you that. Those shields add up to way more than most people have in hp's. And on top of that it makes you stronger offensively too

    Good change. I personally was hoping for the. To remove stacking but this is decent

    Looks like you can't just put on light armor and nothing but shields and nukes on your bars now

    Sorcs with 25k+ damage shields? What game are you playing? XD the most ive seen hardened ward get to is 15k, now theres a 50% nerf to all shields in pvp, so 7.5k shield. Thats nothing in pvp when people can hit 2k on light attacks, 10k snipes,12k radiant destruction,10k concealed weapon ect. I dont think the problems we're facing is with the classes. But the CHAMPION SYSTEM. the ONLY people that can get anywhere near 25k in shields is someoneone with TONNES of CP. And those are the people that get complained about when people scurry over to the forums to cry for nerfs.

    Don't even talk about annulment, it's available to everyone and only protects you from spells.

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