So, You have no reason to buy Imperial City if you dont like PVP. Period.

Ysne58

I'm not the only person who thinks this should have been part of the base game.

markt84

KerinKor wrote: »

markt84 wrote: »

I love the PvP, I've been forced to PvE once I hit vet 1. It took me 10x longer to get to vet 1 than if I decided to quest instead, but I enjoyed PvP. So once I lost all my buffs I was forced to PvE for better gear and to level faster. There wasn't enough for the people that love PvP. So zos makes PvP content because it was lacking it. Now PvEers are all upset because this dlc is for the people that enjoy PvP. The stones were added to make PvP more intense

If that were true there was no need to RAISE THE LEVEL CAP, was there?

This is as much PVE content as PVP but with the added twist that in order to level up PVEers are going to have to endure PVP gankers.

If you are a PvEer what do you need go up to level 16 anyways. The only v16 content will be found in IC. So you don't need a level bump because the PvE content outside of IC will not be changed.

Atlaz

I got to V1 pretty fast from just grinding but getting to V14 seems rather... very tedious. Either way I've membership still so it does provide access either way, I think.

I_killed_Vivec

GaldorP wrote: »

Hm, I'm trying to think of a card or board game now where you can steal your enemy's possessions. There must be hundreds of examples

My children have a Harry Potter board game which has a card that allows the holder to take one item from another player.

It is the single most guaranteed cause of fights and tears that I know.

I suspect "stone ganking" might have a similar effect

AhPook_Is_Here

Joy_Division wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Is it so hard to just let PvP players enjoy the only piece of new content they will probably ever see?

So unless you can gank newbs and steal their stuff you cant enjoy IC? Is that what you are saying?

Yes, killing people and taking their stones is indeed a very important part of the Imperial City DLC. A lot of PvP players have been wanting an actual penalty to dying and this seems to provide just that.

Deal with it.

No I wont deal with it as many many other players will not. As you see by this thread even other pvp centered players hate this idea. I guarantee it will be changed or I guarantee you wont have anyone to gank and steal their stuff. The place will be deserted and you and your gank buddies will have to start killing each other.

I mean how sad is it you cannot enjoy yourself without abusing other people.

If you don't want to deal with, then don't play this DLC. It's been stated over and over that this is PvP content. I don't want to deal with braindead repetitve dungeons and ridiculous questlines, so I don't. I also don't go to the forums demanding more PvP in my PvE.

Deal with it.

Story driven quest lines is what elder scrolls is all about. If you want a hardcore pvp game go find one. Also I am going to mark this so I can come back and say "I told ya so" when they remove the whole looting of stones thing.

This is The Elder Scrolls Online and the PvP has been heavily featured in all the marketing material and ZOS has even stated it considers the PvP 'end-game'.

The fact that your personal views on what constitutes an Elder Scrolls game are different does not change anything about it. You can always go play Skyrim with its focus on 'story driven quest lines' that all involve going somewhere, pressing a button and killing 50 Draugr.

You can have pvp without looting other players.

But I don't want to, ZOS doesn't want to and it seems a lot of PvP players don't want to. The fact that PvE players want it to be this way is just not that important, since this content is not meant for them.

One day you will learn its not all about you.

Instead, you'd rather the IC DLC be all about you.

For over a year, PvPers have been "forced" to do PvE content - the dungeons, craglorn, trials, for the top gear. I agree with Lava. And not that you ever listen or ever consider anything that isn't catered to your gaming preferences, but many PvPers do not want this DLC to be about ganking PvE "carebears." They just want good fights that have consequence and a risk / reward factor.

Honestly from someone who plays both sides of the game I'm not sure I agree. I don't use any trials gear in PVP and for my build I don't think any of it is best in slot, and trust me I have like 2 or 3 full sets of every trials set, dungeon helmets and shoulders. Some of the dungeon stuff is nice in PVP for some builds, for my build I don't use any of them either.

Trials gear is actually rather buggy in PVP, the vicious ophidian set doesn't trigger properly on player kills, and the eternal yokuda stuff has it's own set of interesting bugs when fighting cyrodiil npcs.

From someone who enjoys both sides of the game I don't think PVPers were ever "forced" to PVE, and PVP is more cost effective than PVE with no repair costs and reduced enchantment use. I also don't think this expansion will force PVEers to PVP, they have their 2 dungeons where they can get their gear materials.

As a capitalist and a good Samaritan I will gladly sit in those PVE dungeons allowing people to travel to me for a very reasonable fee in line with their absurd aversion to fighting other players, likely just a few thousand gold, so they can bypass even entering cryodiil. It's the least I can do to give back to the RP community for all those paid SO runs for ophidian jade and scaled court brown.

OrangeTheCat

Phinix1 wrote: »

marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO wrote: »

I also think that ZOS is working on what is the most successful thing in ESO and that is the PVP hence the DLC

If that is what the devs believe then they have once again shown themselves completely out of touch with reality.

Perhaps they should consider a career move to politics.

Look, last content update it was all for PVErs. PVP players just had to sit on the sidelines and, just like all of you now, complain about why we (the PVPers) were not getting anything for us. Well, now it is the PVErs turn. Apparently, this is how ZOS does things: instead of releasing content for both PVErs and PVPers in the same release, they divide the two types of content into two separate releases.

Jimbob6

sparafucilsarwb17_ESO wrote: »

Then why even put pve quests and dungeons in pvp and why then raise the level to vr16? These devs should be fired.

Umm. Because some of us who like PvP like to do PvE at the same time?

bosmern_ESO

Honestly, this is the first patch PvP had, everything before was all PvE.

PvErs got spoiled now they think every major patch has to be for them...

Jimbob6

JMadFour wrote: »

there is no need to change the DLC's content to suit your PVE playstyle. No need to reduce the amount of stones lost when you die to a PVPers. It's not your DLC. so don't buy it. don't play it. Play the PVE content you have. play another game. wait for Orsinium. Don't waste your money on content you arent going to enjoy, and that was not designed for you to enjoy.

.

I don't think you understand how precious little snowflakes think. They assume that EVERYTHING is designed for them and will cry a river until it is.

F7sus4

JMadFour wrote: »

oh look, he only read the thread title and decided to comment based solely on that.

(...) to comment a quote of his choice.

JMadFour wrote: »

Good Job!

Obviously.

Lenikus

Considering most gankers murder people en route to a fight, or from another, i don't think there will be any changes to how often people will gank you.. if anything, they will try even harder because now they'll profit from it.
You only go gank PvE spots if you want to test dps or something like that

Also, PvE people will also buy it, because content, or maybe they just have the ESO+ and they will chill around there, for dungeons achievements and etc.

Joy_Division

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Is it so hard to just let PvP players enjoy the only piece of new content they will probably ever see?

So unless you can gank newbs and steal their stuff you cant enjoy IC? Is that what you are saying?

Yes, killing people and taking their stones is indeed a very important part of the Imperial City DLC. A lot of PvP players have been wanting an actual penalty to dying and this seems to provide just that.

Deal with it.

No I wont deal with it as many many other players will not. As you see by this thread even other pvp centered players hate this idea. I guarantee it will be changed or I guarantee you wont have anyone to gank and steal their stuff. The place will be deserted and you and your gank buddies will have to start killing each other.

I mean how sad is it you cannot enjoy yourself without abusing other people.

If you don't want to deal with, then don't play this DLC. It's been stated over and over that this is PvP content. I don't want to deal with braindead repetitve dungeons and ridiculous questlines, so I don't. I also don't go to the forums demanding more PvP in my PvE.

Deal with it.

Story driven quest lines is what elder scrolls is all about. If you want a hardcore pvp game go find one. Also I am going to mark this so I can come back and say "I told ya so" when they remove the whole looting of stones thing.

This is The Elder Scrolls Online and the PvP has been heavily featured in all the marketing material and ZOS has even stated it considers the PvP 'end-game'.

The fact that your personal views on what constitutes an Elder Scrolls game are different does not change anything about it. You can always go play Skyrim with its focus on 'story driven quest lines' that all involve going somewhere, pressing a button and killing 50 Draugr.

You can have pvp without looting other players.

But I don't want to, ZOS doesn't want to and it seems a lot of PvP players don't want to. The fact that PvE players want it to be this way is just not that important, since this content is not meant for them.

One day you will learn its not all about you.

Instead, you'd rather the IC DLC be all about you.

For over a year, PvPers have been "forced" to do PvE content - the dungeons, craglorn, trials, for the top gear. I agree with Lava. And not that you ever listen or ever consider anything that isn't catered to your gaming preferences, but many PvPers do not want this DLC to be about ganking PvE "carebears." They just want good fights that have consequence and a risk / reward factor.

Honestly from someone who plays both sides of the game I'm not sure I agree. I don't use any trials gear in PVP and for my build I don't think any of it is best in slot, and trust me I have like 2 or 3 full sets of every trials set, dungeon helmets and shoulders. Some of the dungeon stuff is nice in PVP for some builds, for my build I don't use any of them either.

Trials gear is actually rather buggy in PVP, the vicious ophidian set doesn't trigger properly on player kills, and the eternal yokuda stuff has it's own set of interesting bugs when fighting cyrodiil npcs.

From someone who enjoys both sides of the game I don't think PVPers were ever "forced" to PVE, and PVP is more cost effective than PVE with no repair costs and reduced enchantment use. I also don't think this expansion will force PVEers to PVP, they have their 2 dungeons where they can get their gear materials.

As a capitalist and a good Samaritan I will gladly sit in those PVE dungeons allowing people to travel to me for a very reasonable fee in line with their absurd aversion to fighting other players, likely just a few thousand gold, so they can bypass even entering cryodiil. It's the least I can do to give back to the RP community for all those paid SO runs for ophidian jade and scaled court brown.

Your subtlety is not found in the many posts from PvE oriented players who decry the DLC about being "forced" to PvP.

Before 1.6, at least for magicka builds, the best gear was PvE oriented. With nirn running amok and the nerf to trials gear, I do think it is possible to make a good non PvE gear set. Yet with so many dwemer automatons running around, it's obvious that many a PvPer feels that were "forced" to PvE. And this doesn't even get into the undaunted passives. PvE oriented players seemed to have no problem with that as they will have no problem when Wrothgar and Murkmire comes out (probably with VR increases again!) with zero PvP content.

Grunim

MaximusDargus wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

JMadFour wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

There you have it, from the Horse's mouth.

If you don't do PVP, then you have no reason to buy Imperial City. It's not for you. period.

there is no point in continuing to complain about the Tel Var Stones. It's not designed for you, so you have no reason to bother with it. Just save your money for Orsinium, and let the PVPers have their expansion.

I feel sorry for the Ganker tryhards who thought they were going to get some easy Carebear prey, but this Expansion is for PVPers, and no PVE Carebear should spend money on it, per ZOS. time to git gud scrubs. have fun getting stomped by real PVPers.

The fact something was supposed to be designed to be meant only for PVP players doesnt mean execution of such plan is faulty and lacks sense.

Imperial city meant for PVP player? Why PVE content then? Why IC only VR16 gear?
If all that PVP players love to do is killing other players why IC have PVE content:
- dungeons
- crafting stations
- mobs

Why does ZOS LURE PVE players into the supposed to be "IC meant for PVP players" zone with PVE content and then declare "IC is for PVP players, you no like it you wait for other DLC"?

That makes no sense. Unless the whole reason for that is to lure PVE players into IC, shut their mouth from ANY SINGLE Complain about broken mechanics of harassment and griefing (stealing TV stones, camping spots and preveinting access to paid content) by simply stating "IC is for pvp player" and all of that just to provide a cannon fodder to so called PVP players who seek challenge and in fact want to leech on other work.

I have about 65 active players in my guild. I was on TS yesterday not even one of them plans on buying IC. Even the people who enjoy pvp are turned off by the player loot mechanic. The place will be deserted in less than a month I bet.

That just means more stones for the people who do enter the Imperial City.

Nope that means you will be sitting there with your gank squad and have noone to kill and unless you start doing PVE no stones.

But why would PVPers bother with doing PVE if all they want is to kill players?
If PVPers will decide to start doing PVE then it seems that ZOS_RichLambert is simply contradicting himself stating that "IC is meant for PVP players"

Many players fit under multiple categories. I was addicted to the PvEvP action I got from doing Dredgion on Aion. I never knew if I'd be mainly doing PvE or PvP or a good mix of both.

I'm even one of those people (who some posters claim don't exist) that will do some of the Cyro PvE quests and I'm not unhappy if someone attacks me.

I'm looking forward to Imperial City

Pallmor

JMadFour wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

There you have it, from the Horse's mouth.

If you don't do PVP, then you have no reason to buy Imperial City. It's not for you. period.

there is no point in continuing to complain about the Tel Var Stones. It's not designed for you, so you have no reason to bother with it. Just save your money for Orsinium, and let the PVPers have their expansion.

I feel sorry for the Ganker tryhards who thought they were going to get some easy Carebear prey, but this Expansion is for PVPers, and no PVE Carebear should spend money on it, per ZOS. time to git gud scrubs. have fun getting stomped by real PVPers.

As I said in another thread, kudos to them for at least being honest. Never expected them to openly tell PvEers not to buy the expansion, but it's pretty cool that they did.

Pallmor

JMadFour wrote: »

The point is that, the only feasible suggestion for the PVE-only player in regards to Imperial City, is simply for them not to buy it.

The content is not made for you, it is made for PVPers. So you, as a PVE-only player, should not spend the money to purchase it.

ZOS has acknowledged this, and they are seemingly fine with you not purchasing this content. So don't. Leave the Imperial City DLC to the PVPers.

I'm definitely taking ZOS's advice on this one and waiting for Orsinium instead.

AhPook_Is_Here

Joy_Division wrote: »

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Is it so hard to just let PvP players enjoy the only piece of new content they will probably ever see?

So unless you can gank newbs and steal their stuff you cant enjoy IC? Is that what you are saying?

Yes, killing people and taking their stones is indeed a very important part of the Imperial City DLC. A lot of PvP players have been wanting an actual penalty to dying and this seems to provide just that.

Deal with it.

No I wont deal with it as many many other players will not. As you see by this thread even other pvp centered players hate this idea. I guarantee it will be changed or I guarantee you wont have anyone to gank and steal their stuff. The place will be deserted and you and your gank buddies will have to start killing each other.

I mean how sad is it you cannot enjoy yourself without abusing other people.

If you don't want to deal with, then don't play this DLC. It's been stated over and over that this is PvP content. I don't want to deal with braindead repetitve dungeons and ridiculous questlines, so I don't. I also don't go to the forums demanding more PvP in my PvE.

Deal with it.

Story driven quest lines is what elder scrolls is all about. If you want a hardcore pvp game go find one. Also I am going to mark this so I can come back and say "I told ya so" when they remove the whole looting of stones thing.

This is The Elder Scrolls Online and the PvP has been heavily featured in all the marketing material and ZOS has even stated it considers the PvP 'end-game'.

The fact that your personal views on what constitutes an Elder Scrolls game are different does not change anything about it. You can always go play Skyrim with its focus on 'story driven quest lines' that all involve going somewhere, pressing a button and killing 50 Draugr.

You can have pvp without looting other players.

But I don't want to, ZOS doesn't want to and it seems a lot of PvP players don't want to. The fact that PvE players want it to be this way is just not that important, since this content is not meant for them.

One day you will learn its not all about you.

Instead, you'd rather the IC DLC be all about you.

For over a year, PvPers have been "forced" to do PvE content - the dungeons, craglorn, trials, for the top gear. I agree with Lava. And not that you ever listen or ever consider anything that isn't catered to your gaming preferences, but many PvPers do not want this DLC to be about ganking PvE "carebears." They just want good fights that have consequence and a risk / reward factor.

Honestly from someone who plays both sides of the game I'm not sure I agree. I don't use any trials gear in PVP and for my build I don't think any of it is best in slot, and trust me I have like 2 or 3 full sets of every trials set, dungeon helmets and shoulders. Some of the dungeon stuff is nice in PVP for some builds, for my build I don't use any of them either.

Trials gear is actually rather buggy in PVP, the vicious ophidian set doesn't trigger properly on player kills, and the eternal yokuda stuff has it's own set of interesting bugs when fighting cyrodiil npcs.

From someone who enjoys both sides of the game I don't think PVPers were ever "forced" to PVE, and PVP is more cost effective than PVE with no repair costs and reduced enchantment use. I also don't think this expansion will force PVEers to PVP, they have their 2 dungeons where they can get their gear materials.

As a capitalist and a good Samaritan I will gladly sit in those PVE dungeons allowing people to travel to me for a very reasonable fee in line with their absurd aversion to fighting other players, likely just a few thousand gold, so they can bypass even entering cryodiil. It's the least I can do to give back to the RP community for all those paid SO runs for ophidian jade and scaled court brown.

Your subtlety is not found in the many posts from PvE oriented players who decry the DLC about being "forced" to PvP.

Before 1.6, at least for magicka builds, the best gear was PvE oriented. With nirn running amok and the nerf to trials gear, I do think it is possible to make a good non PvE gear set. Yet with so many dwemer automatons running around, it's obvious that many a PvPer feels that were "forced" to PvE. And this doesn't even get into the undaunted passives. PvE oriented players seemed to have no problem with that as they will have no problem when Wrothgar and Murkmire comes out (probably with VR increases again!) with zero PvP content.

I don't think anyone has ever thought infallible aether was a good pvp set, much less the regular aether. before 1.6 seducer/warlock with a little crit from somewhere was the way to go, ideally from another crafted set with impen like twilights or torug's. I said the helmets were cute and useful for pvp but they aren't necessary, nor are the undaunted passives. And vet dungeons are the easiest thing in the world to do, as a sorc you can even solo them if you don't have friends.

I understand how a lot of bad PVPers told themselves that they were losing to PVEers with better gear, because that is how the mind works, failure demands excuses so one can feel better and try again. But I am here to help the PVE failures this time, they will not have to feel common and bad, as I will travel to the dungeons for them, and for some modest fee in the 10k range, they may travel to me, US servers of course, campaign to be determined, prob Azuras though.

DenMoria

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Is it so hard to just let PvP players enjoy the only piece of new content they will probably ever see?

So unless you can gank newbs and steal their stuff you cant enjoy IC? Is that what you are saying?

Yes, killing people and taking their stones is indeed a very important part of the Imperial City DLC. A lot of PvP players have been wanting an actual penalty to dying and this seems to provide just that.

Deal with it.

How about "Dead is Dead" as a penalty for all you PvPers. You just set out to murder everyone around and then steal all their stuff.

I agree with the "catering to the sociopaths" sentiment stated above. If one of us non-sociopaths should happen to kill one of the sociopaths, they should remain dead and all their stuff should disappear with them.

PvP is one of the reasons why I am rapidly getting turned off to ESO. I don't so much mind the Group activities and the Guilds, it's the PvPers that ruin it for me.

Wreuntzylla

A little history lesson from DAoC.....

SUMMARY: Both PvErs and PvPers LOVED Darkness Falls.


DETAIL: Darkness Falls ("DF") was a favorite piece of content for both PvErs and PvPers, at least in the beginning.

Each realm started from a different location in the zone. When ownership was about to change, PvPers from the current owning realm flooded DF. After DF changed hands, PvPers AND PvErs from the new owning realm flooded DF, usually greatly outnumbering the previously owning realm. Many pure PvErs got the heck out before PvP happened (with some exceptions for raids).

The mobs were rather tightly packed and you could not stealth past many of them. If you wanted to get anywhere quickly, you had to run with a group, or trail a group. Solo gankers were often either pinned to a location or had to take hours to travel between points.

The mob difficulty grew the deeper you went until even large raids took time to move around. When PvErs went deep enough, away from either start point, they were fairly immune to PvP as the mobs repopped behind. The mobs were tough enough that they acted as a shield layer. Usually, one person in a raid was assigned as a spotter, and even if PvPers made it deep down, they would often be wiped by PvErs while pulling mobs to get to the PvErs. I mainly PvP'd and there were parts of DF I never saw except through posted pics.

It took the enemy about 20-30 min to cross from one start point to another after a change in ownership when there was little resistance, sometimes hours at primetime when resistance was high. In the process, most of the opposing realm was wiped out - releasing meant you were locked out.

Many times the majority of people from the previously owning realm would run back to their start point for a last stand. Rezzing was permitted and the start points could not be breached (except by exploiters who were eventually banned), so quite a bit of action. Siege was also permitted. Sometimes PvP continued for hours at the previous owner's start point. However, grouped PvErs could merrily go about their business shortly after the changeover.

I say 'start point' and not 'spawn point' because even if you owned DF, if you released, you respawned outside of DF and had to travel back. Led to serious contemplation, when another realm was close to taking DF, as to whether you should respawn or wait and hope you get rezzed.

Solo PvErs were subject to being killed by stealthers even after the clearing out part, because if you logged out in DF, you could log back into DF, even if ownership had switched hands. However, once the stealthers started killing, owning realm PvPers would fix the problem. Very crafty stealthers could be a pain, but ESO has different stealth mechanics.

DF was implemented incredibly well. If IC follows in the footsteps of DF, it could be loved by all.

dodgehopper_ESO

I understand the point you're making OP, but no reason to be an jackass to the PVE folks. I'm pretty happy they're adding a pvp expansion as well.

Though consider for a moment, if that guy who went out and ground 1000+ CP's isn't a pvp'er who also pve'd a lot as well (he had to). I hope you're not the sort who will cry about losing your Tel Var stones to this guy, just because he did too much PVE.

FireCowCommando

IMO this thread is the reason why we dont get much info from the developers. One Dev says something that could be taken the wrong way and immediately a large group of players grab their pitchforks to do mob justice on the forums.

Good luck hearing much from Richard in the future, as im sure the headache caused by the gut reaction from what he said already is enough to have the community managers to ask him to please calm his posting down.

There is PvE content in IC, if you followed all the information there is no reason at all for a PvEr to be concerned about getting greif ganked.

• There is safe zones for all factions in all 6 districts
• Access to the citys is CONTROLLED by the outside keeps, lock them down and you dont have to look over your shoulder
• Bring a friend, or two! Solo gankers wont be able to troll you as well if you enjoy playing with people you can talk to
• There are quests, which give you loot box's that contain the same resource thats dropped from players or npc, these boxes DO NOT DROP.
• The dungeons inside IC, once discovered can be teleported to directly just like all other dungeons! No PvP greifers involved.
• The zone is large enough to allow time to move out of the way of a zergball, by the time they clear one wing players will have warned the other 5 districts. You can move out of the way before it hits you to a safe zone, unless you were the unlucky one.
• See a zergball rolling through? walk outside and lock them in by capturing the keep(s) they took. They can either go outside to regain access, or stay inside and slowly lose members.
• MAIN POINT: There are ways to combat all the complaints i have seen thus far. Unless you were looking for another zone were you can afk in stealth with zero chance of losing anything.

JMadFour

Wreuntzylla wrote: »

A little history lesson from DAoC.....

SUMMARY: Both PvErs and PvPers LOVED Darkness Falls.


DETAIL: Darkness Falls ("DF") was a favorite piece of content for both PvErs and PvPers, at least in the beginning.

Each realm started from a different location in the zone. When ownership was about to change, PvPers from the current owning realm flooded DF. After DF changed hands, PvPers AND PvErs from the new owning realm flooded DF, usually greatly outnumbering the previously owning realm. Many pure PvErs got the heck out before PvP happened (with some exceptions for raids).

The mobs were rather tightly packed and you could not stealth past many of them. If you wanted to get anywhere quickly, you had to run with a group, or trail a group. Solo gankers were often either pinned to a location or had to take hours to travel between points.

The mob difficulty grew the deeper you went until even large raids took time to move around. When PvErs went deep enough, away from either start point, they were fairly immune to PvP as the mobs repopped behind. The mobs were tough enough that they acted as a shield layer. Usually, one person in a raid was assigned as a spotter, and even if PvPers made it deep down, they would often be wiped by PvErs while pulling mobs to get to the PvErs. I mainly PvP'd and there were parts of DF I never saw except through posted pics.

It took the enemy about 20-30 min to cross from one start point to another after a change in ownership when there was little resistance, sometimes hours at primetime when resistance was high. In the process, most of the opposing realm was wiped out - releasing meant you were locked out.

Many times the majority of people from the previously owning realm would run back to their start point for a last stand. Rezzing was permitted and the start points could not be breached (except by exploiters who were eventually banned), so quite a bit of action. Siege was also permitted. Sometimes PvP continued for hours at the previous owner's start point. However, grouped PvErs could merrily go about their business shortly after the changeover.

I say 'start point' and not 'spawn point' because even if you owned DF, if you released, you respawned outside of DF and had to travel back. Led to serious contemplation, when another realm was close to taking DF, as to whether you should respawn or wait and hope you get rezzed.

Solo PvErs were subject to being killed by stealthers even after the clearing out part, because if you logged out in DF, you could log back into DF, even if ownership had switched hands. However, once the stealthers started killing, owning realm PvPers would fix the problem. Very crafty stealthers could be a pain, but ESO has different stealth mechanics.

DF was implemented incredibly well. If IC follows in the footsteps of DF, it could be loved by all.

I loved Darkness Falls, and IC reminds me of it soooo much.

Being inside DF when the Doors switched to another faction was probably one of the most hectic situations in the history of MMOs. You wanna stay in and get loot, but the stupid Hibernians just got their Door Open, and now they are flooding through trying to eliminate any straggling competition. And your door is locked, so if you die, you can't come back in.

the biggest "oh ***..." moments I've ever experienced in a MMO.

and they didn't even need to incude a silly "Steal Your Stuff" mechanic to make it worthwhile!

imo, Corpse-Looting is not necessary for PVP to be worth doing. It's just for griefers to feel better about themselves.

If you need to loot stuff from someone's corpse to justify PVP, then the game is not the problem.

Arato

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Arato wrote: »

Morvul wrote: »

RazzPitazz wrote: »

What remains unclear is how PvErs will get equivalent gear for their PvE without the IC purchase as you need it to be able to obtain any gear specific to IC. They failed to discuss this and I think a lot of PvErs have jumped to the conclusion that they are being restricted from the gear if they do not purchase, making the TVS system unappealing. I highly doubt this is the case but I can see how it escalated. If ZoS can hint at equivalent gear outside of Cyrodiil I think a lot of the fires will die down.

even if there is no equivalent gear outside of IC - "carebears" without the IC DLC can buy that gear from the gankers. Just as they can buy PvP gear right now...

.... do you even understand how inflated the prices will be?

Buying the gear will be out of most people's budget.

That would be the case no matter what content the DLC included. It's not as though anyone is being forced to buy the Imperial City anyway. Instead of whining that you can't or don't want to do any PvP bug them to expedite their PvE content too. We have had way more content added to PvE than PvP so quite complaining.

certain set gears would be expensive no matter how it's implemented sure, but crafted sets would be relatively cheap and most people would be able to afford VR16 gear.

But I'm thinking a lot of people won't be able to get VR16 gear because of how they're implementing the crafting items.

Selique

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

JMadFour wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Which is exactly why this will be one gigantic disaster on par with the NGE thing SWG did. People will talk for years how ZOS killed ESO with this DLC.

yeah, now your are just being melodramatic.

this isn't really that bad. It's not anywhere close to the NGE, so just stop already.

enough with the hyperbole, you sound like a child throwing a tantrum.

again, Imperial City was not made for you. SO DON'T BUY IT.

period.

People said the same thing when Sony screwed up SWG. ZOS should learn from the mistakes of others but instead they insist this time it will be different. It wont be. It'll be the exact same thing. The game is already a joke and now it will be a laughing stock.

Stuffs not even close to the NGE.... People forget so much over time. How is a DLC with some minor stone stealing feature even CLOSE to an overhaul of the core game, change up of all the skills, animations, difficulty, and basic game design (Sandbox to Sandpark anyone?)? How will this drive hundreds or thousands of players to demand refunds (And get them) and bleed the game dry of subs for years to come? How will this spark people to create a Pre-IC Emulated server of ESO? Please. Don't even compare it.

mythlaub17_ESO

Sigh. People either have short memories or haven't played many MMO's. ANY major systemic change will make a large portion of the player base angry, another large portion happy, and leave many more somewhere in the middle. The vocal minority from the happy/angry camps will storm the forums with either "This Game is Ruined!" Or "You're all idiots for thinking that!" The reasonable ones will get shouted down by the vocal minorities, or avoid the discussion altogether. Thus has it ever been, so it is now, as it will always be.

DDuke

mythlaub17_ESO wrote: »

Sigh. People either have short memories or haven't played many MMO's. ANY major systemic change will make a large portion of the player base angry, another large portion happy, and leave many more somewhere in the middle. The vocal minority from the happy/angry camps will storm the forums with either "This Game is Ruined!" Or "You're all idiots for thinking that!" The reasonable ones will get shouted down by the vocal minorities, or avoid the discussion altogether. Thus has it ever been, so it is now, as it will always be.

Except this patch doesn't change anything, simply brings something different for people who want something different for PvP (and/or PvE).

New content that doesn't cater to particular entitled (yes, entitled) crowd, and this entitled crowd is up in arms about it even though they still have rest of the game to enjoy and 2 new group dungeons (just like other group dungeons, no major game mechanic changes there).

I've been playing MMOs for quite a while, and I've never seen something like this.
It truly makes me lose a bit of faith in humanity (and in the community of this MMO).

When WoW introduced Battlegrounds for the first time, people were happy about it (even though the game was/is even more PvE focused than ESO).

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

GaldorP wrote: »

Hm, I'm trying to think of a card or board game now where you can steal your enemy's possessions. There must be hundreds of examples

My children have a Harry Potter board game which has a card that allows the holder to take one item from another player.

It is the single most guaranteed cause of fights and tears that I know.

I suspect "stone ganking" might have a similar effect

Yet ZOS is somehow convinced this will save the game. All its going to do is drive away customers. The ones stealing the stones wont be paying a sub. They might pay for the DLC but they are not going to pay per month. Every dime they spend they will drive off $1000 in business. Until like UO ZOS will be forced to rethink everything. Meanwhile 2016 is coming and again nothing for the PVE player. Only more PVP fixes and balances.

Violynne

JMadFour wrote: »

the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

Is this a PC DLC because I don't see this in the Crown Store/XBox Store.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

Violynne wrote: »

JMadFour wrote: »

the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

Is this a PC DLC because I don't see this in the Crown Store/XBox Store.

Orsinium is not even in testing yet. Be lucky to see it by spring 2016 on console.

JMadFour

Violynne wrote: »

JMadFour wrote: »

the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

Is this a PC DLC because I don't see this in the Crown Store/XBox Store.

Orsinium is the next DLC after Imperial City.

Samadhi

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

How is asking for me TV stones not to be looted translate into I want the whole IC geared towards me. All I want is some bratty kid who is upset because he cant get a date killing me over and over AND looting my stuff. Its not my fault you cant find a girlfriend.

This example makes me laugh, because my girlfriend PvPs with me, and the new system is one that appeals to us.
Only real dislike is how healers (she is a healing build Templar) stand to get screwed over by a killing blow system.
At least if the stones go to me though, can buy the gears for her.

Apparently it does not appeal to you though. Guessing it does not appeal to your girlfriend either.

That is unfortunate, but not all content in the game is made to appeal to everyone.

Craglorn, Veteran Dungeons, Undaunted Pledges -- all untouched on all of our characters.

Can totally relate to the disappointment you likely feel over waiting for Orsinium. Been waiting for Imperial City for ages.