Imperial City Info Released

AssaultLemming

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Darklord_Tiberius wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Can I get my questions answered about Veteran Dungeon sets and what is happening to them after the scaling up of dungeons? Are we going to have to re grind for all those sets?

I would also appreciate if my similar question is answered.

Do you plan to reconcile the fact that many players worked hard for gear under the impression that they wouldn't be made to feel bad for the time they invested into the game, but now must come to terms with that same gear being underleveled?

Would it be possible for you to introduce a way for players to increase the level of their items, along with possibility of armor type and trait changes, so that players can be proud of their progression and not feel bad about what they earned?

This is totally unrealistic. They want people to do the new content. The reason for doing new content is new gear. If they level up your old gear what incentive do you have? Sure if you want vr16 versions of your existing gear you have to grind again along with everyone else, but again it's a reason to keep doing content...

God-eater

Sausage wrote: »

"to win Tel Var Stones, the currency used to trade for mighty Veteran Rank 16 armor sets"

So token system confirmed? So boring tbh. Hopefully it does not mean we need to log in daily. Does this mean they are moving from RNG entirely too.

You could log in daily, or you could just kill other players and take their stones...

"Should you fall to an enemy player, they can claim your hard-earned Tel Var Stones in their own quest for glory."

Thanks for adding an element of personal loss to PvP, ZOS. Cannot stand games that do this. There is no four-asterisks-ing way I'm going to step outside with a stack of tokens on me if there's any chance whatsoever that I could lose them.

At least it'll save me the cost of the DLC...

SIXR_sCaR

I wanted to PvP
but
i got to pay $20 now
come on like wtf
this should be free because its imperial city

Mos-De-Atmo

God-eater wrote: »

Thanks for adding an element of personal loss to PvP, ZOS. Cannot stand games that do this. There is no four-asterisks-ing way I'm going to step outside with a stack of tokens on me if there's any chance whatsoever that I could lose them.

I love this change though as it adds a new element to PVP, makes it exciting, rewarding, etc. I suspect that I will be killed more times than I kill however this is all part of it for me. It will be quite difficult, especially for a "casual" like myself - but that's a good thing.

marcmyb14_ESO

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

What you're not understanding here is that we have been asking and waiting for content, while only having mostly vr12 pledges and trials to run for half a year, and instead of giving us two separate content updates together to try to make both PvP'ers and PvE'ers happy, they tried to kill two birds in one stone and throw it together in the same package. And then on top of it you can lose Tel Var stones if you die in PvP?

Sorry but this is just bad historically bad design. No other MMO has done this. But I guess ESO always has to be different.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Bashing and Slanderous comments]

Preyfar

Also, curious: since Cyrodiil is getting so much attention with this update... is Cloud Ruler Temple going to get love? It's seemed like a bunch of amazing content that got stripped from the game and never finished, and I want to get up there so damn bad!

Farorin

The stones sound like a good idea, risk of loss and opportunity of gain makes games more exciting and fun.

One thing that worries me though is the access to IC through owning keeps, if I pay for DLC, I expect to be able to play it when I want to. If it was for free, then restricting access based on PVP performance makes sense, but we are paying for it so to restrict it would be a real kick in the nuts.

I am one of the many annoyed players though, annoyed due to lack of meaningful content prior to this, lack of meaningful reason to subscribe, lack of communication from ZOS, and lack of accountability.

Ultimately though, I will try it out on PTS first, and if it is good, I will either buy it or sub for it, and if it is re-playable and worth the money, I will be happy with it, but if not, I doubt I will be playing ESO again, and if I do, I most certainly won't be putting anymore money into it.

Fingers crossed, hopes are there but guarded, because I love this game, I just hate the recent trend of poor customer service and management.

Tavore1138

Gotta say loving everything except the clartion call to the griefers of lootable currency.

Who can loot it (i.e. only people who have the dlc or any pvp player)? How much can they loot (i.e. can you spend several hours playing build up a nice stash and get it all taken by one lazy ganker)?

GorraShatan

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Darklord_Tiberius wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Can I get my questions answered about Veteran Dungeon sets and what is happening to them after the scaling up of dungeons? Are we going to have to re grind for all those sets?

I would also appreciate if my similar question is answered.

Do you plan to reconcile the fact that many players worked hard for gear under the impression that they wouldn't be made to feel bad for the time they invested into the game, but now must come to terms with that same gear being underleveled?

Would it be possible for you to introduce a way for players to increase the level of their items, along with possibility of armor type and trait changes, so that players can be proud of their progression and not feel bad about what they earned?

Do you actually feel bad, or are you just looking for a quick way to bypass grinding out for new gear?

It's a tad ridiculous. Level caps increases come and go, and with that means acquiring new gear at level cap. I worked hard for all of my gear, and I don't feel bad whatsoever about that. You still get to feel proud of your progression. Neither should you.

Stop with the whining. You're coming across very poorly.

To answer your first question, yes.

To respond to your second point, though level cap increases do "come and go," such an idea ignores that players, including myself, have done things under the impression that level increases wouldn't be coming, but only going.

""we want to make sure when we do some more of the expanded system changes, we do them correctly. We don't want to give you a situation were you feel like you've put a time investment into the game and now it's all worth less or just doesn't feel right anymore." - Developer Joe Blackburn.

I'm asking simple questions that I hope that ZOS community managers are allowed to answer. Do not paint this as whining. Not only are you incorrect, but you are also not following the forums code of conduct.

It’s okay and very normal to disagree with others, and even to debate, but provoking conflict, baiting, inciting, mocking, etc. is never acceptable in the official The Elder Scrolls Online community. If you do not have something constructive or meaningful to add to a discussion, I strongly recommend you refrain from posting, and find another discussion to participate in instead.

If you thought your gear would never get out of date or become obsolete that's your fault, not the devs. Seriously.

Faulgor

GorraShatan wrote: »

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Takllin wrote: »

Personofsecrets wrote: »

Darklord_Tiberius wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom

@ZOS_BrianWheeler

Can I get my questions answered about Veteran Dungeon sets and what is happening to them after the scaling up of dungeons? Are we going to have to re grind for all those sets?

I would also appreciate if my similar question is answered.

Do you plan to reconcile the fact that many players worked hard for gear under the impression that they wouldn't be made to feel bad for the time they invested into the game, but now must come to terms with that same gear being underleveled?

Would it be possible for you to introduce a way for players to increase the level of their items, along with possibility of armor type and trait changes, so that players can be proud of their progression and not feel bad about what they earned?

Do you actually feel bad, or are you just looking for a quick way to bypass grinding out for new gear?

It's a tad ridiculous. Level caps increases come and go, and with that means acquiring new gear at level cap. I worked hard for all of my gear, and I don't feel bad whatsoever about that. You still get to feel proud of your progression. Neither should you.

Stop with the whining. You're coming across very poorly.

To answer your first question, yes.

To respond to your second point, though level cap increases do "come and go," such an idea ignores that players, including myself, have done things under the impression that level increases wouldn't be coming, but only going.

""we want to make sure when we do some more of the expanded system changes, we do them correctly. We don't want to give you a situation were you feel like you've put a time investment into the game and now it's all worth less or just doesn't feel right anymore." - Developer Joe Blackburn.

I'm asking simple questions that I hope that ZOS community managers are allowed to answer. Do not paint this as whining. Not only are you incorrect, but you are also not following the forums code of conduct.

It’s okay and very normal to disagree with others, and even to debate, but provoking conflict, baiting, inciting, mocking, etc. is never acceptable in the official The Elder Scrolls Online community. If you do not have something constructive or meaningful to add to a discussion, I strongly recommend you refrain from posting, and find another discussion to participate in instead.

If you thought your gear would never get out of date or become obsolete that's your fault, not the devs. Seriously.

Never? No.
Three times within a year? That's excessive.

Further, it's not just new gear, it's the same gear acquired by the same means, just better. Nobody wants to run through the same rat maze over and over again. Grinding for a VR16 Ebon armor to replace my VR12 Ebon armor is not fun. When level caps are increased in other MMOs, the new gear is usually acquired through new means - which is also the case within the Imperial City, but not in the upscaled group dungeons.

ragespell

AHahaha, some of you are really cheapasses (is it a word?).

P3ZZL3

ragespell wrote: »

AHahaha, some of you are really cheapasses (is it a word?).

Yep, it is

But to be fair, I wouldn't say it's being a cheap ass. 4 weeks ago I was seriously contemplating buying the full Shadow Walker set. It would have set me back 600,000g give or take.

Then there would be the cost of getting everything at Gold level. That would be 56 Gold Mats - so let's say +/- another 180-200k.

So unless you have 4-5m in gold sitting in your account and you're bored, the cost of getting all the gear you want and levelling it is not really cheap.

Ultimate Conclusion: Glad I didn't lol

kevlarto_ESO

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

So a question for either @ZOS_GinaBruno or @ZOS_BrianWheeler - does the paywall mean that ownership of specific keeps in Cyrodiil to gain access is no longer on the agenda?

On PTS we will be testing access the following access rules and deciding if certain campaigns have different Access rules or be universal across all Campaigns:

• Everyone has Access
• Access granted by owning your native 6 keeps
• Access granted by owning your native 6 keeps + 1 enemy keep
• Access granted by owning the majority of keeps

For clarification, "Access" means the doors in Cyrodiil around Lake Rumare (non slaughterfish side) that let you into the Sewers/City will let you click on them to go into the Sewers/City or not. These entrances will also be highlighted on your Cyrodiil map.

I would lean toward Everyone has Access or the 6 native keeps, I hope after the change of travel to friends is implemented this will stop the having multiple toons in different factions in the same campaign and hopefully spread things out a bit and help balance the population imbalance, but as it stands now there would be people buying the DLC and almost never have access to IC because their faction never has enough players to take the majority or even their home keeps in some cases, and I just don't see that as being fun for them.

Enodoc

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Farorin wrote: »

One thing that worries me though is the access to IC through owning keeps, if I pay for DLC, I expect to be able to play it when I want to. If it was for free, then restricting access based on PVP performance makes sense, but we are paying for it so to restrict it would be a real kick in the nuts.

I agree with this, and that was the reason I was trying to promote IC being free. The keep-limited access sounds like a very interesting gameplay mechanic, and I would love to see it, but I don't think it would be fair combined with a paywall.

marcmyb14_ESO

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

ragespell

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

What you're not understanding here is that we have been asking and waiting for content, while only having mostly vr12 pledges and trials to run for half a year, and instead of giving us two separate content updates together to try to make both PvP'ers and PvE'ers happy, they tried to kill two birds in one stone and throw it together in the same package. And then on top of it you can lose Tel Var stones if you die in PvP?

Sorry but this is just bad historically bad design. No other MMO has done this. But I guess ESO always has to be different.

Ok, I think it's the right time for you to leave. This is what ZOS CAN do.
They can deliver THIS content, and they NEED to make us pay directly or being subbed.
If they could do better, they would.

Is it not enough for you? Look for a mmorpg that suits you better or you can even stop playing mmorpg.

P.S. I suspect that the toxic part of this community, will be toxic in every other games.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]

JamilaRaj

MCMancub wrote: »

JamilaRaj wrote: »

23 completely new Veteran Rank 16 item sets, only available in Imperial City

So, aside from crafted stuff (?), the only VR16 gear in the entire game behind a paywall? I, for one, welcome our new P2W DLC overlords!

All pledges and vet dungeons have had their gear reworked and now scaled to V16. Get off your soap.

Awesome, we will be able to grind dungeons!
And, apparently, to craft VR16 gear, unless we pay for the IC, we will must.

Enodoc

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

I guess I just don't see it that way. I see it as PvP content where there is also a bit of PvE stuff to do, just like the rest of Cyrodiil.

Amdirial

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

I guess I just don't see it that way. I see it as PvP content where there is also a bit of PvE stuff to do, just like the rest of Cyrodiil.

Its not a "bit" of PVE content it is PVE specific content that is gated behind PVP. PVE Dungeons to include Vet Dungeons. Crafting Stations, All the new gear etc....That doesn't sound like a PVP thing to me.

So expecting those of us that don't enjoy PVP or wish to rely on PVP to pay for the DLC or the PVE portion of the content that is gated specifically behind PVP is simply ridiculous. The players that don't enjoy ESO PVP but enjoy the PVE aspect of the game are going to be making choices and if the choice is not to purchase the DLC then they are going to be faced with a gear progression / character progression issue. Not to mention they are going to be stuck with no way to level to VR16 other then to grind some mobs which we all know takes a lot of time.

Enodoc

Amdirial wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

I guess I just don't see it that way. I see it as PvP content where there is also a bit of PvE stuff to do, just like the rest of Cyrodiil.

Its not a "bit" of PVE content it is PVE specific content that is gated behind PVP. PVE Dungeons to include Vet Dungeons. Crafting Stations, All the new gear etc....That doesn't sound like a PVP thing to me.

The dungeons are not gated behind the PvP content. The Crafting stations are, sure, but with the other gear sets being changed to include V16 variants anyway I don't think that's a big problem.

Amdirial

Enodoc wrote: »

Amdirial wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

I guess I just don't see it that way. I see it as PvP content where there is also a bit of PvE stuff to do, just like the rest of Cyrodiil.

Its not a "bit" of PVE content it is PVE specific content that is gated behind PVP. PVE Dungeons to include Vet Dungeons. Crafting Stations, All the new gear etc....That doesn't sound like a PVP thing to me.

The dungeons are not gated behind the PvP content. The Crafting stations are, sure, but with the other gear sets being changed to include V16 variants anyway I don't think that's a big problem.

To Quote from their announcement:

Imperial City DLC Game Pack Features & Content

With the purchase of the Imperial City DLC game pack, you get access to the full Imperial City zone. That includes the following:

All content is available to players that are level 10 and up
A brand new PvP/PvE space, including the six Imperial City Districts
New quests and key characters within the Imperial City
One new Imperial City PvP Public Dungeon: The Imperial Sewers
Two new PvE Imperial City group dungeons with Normal and Veteran versions: White-Gold Tower and Imperial City Prison
The Tel Var Stone system
23 completely new Veteran Rank 16 item sets, only available in Imperial City
Treasure Vaults that contain new Veteran Rank 16 set jewelry and a chance for even rarer finds
Xivkyn racial motif style
New collectibles only available in Imperial City (pets, polymorphs, and a costume)

Not only the Crafting stations are gated behind PVP. Unless this portion of their announcement is incorrect ? They specifically state PVP/PVE Space ..........of course that could also mean the only PVE Space here is the Dungeons ? But I seriously doubt that. I mean New Quests and Key Characters within the Imperial City .......that sure sounds like PVE to me.

Now if you or someone else tells me officially that the only thing that is PVP is the public dungeon and I don't have to rely on my faction within my home campaign owning a specific number of keeps to get access to said content and I can go to said content any time I like without the worry of forced PVP then I'd buy it in a heartbeat. As it stands with this explanation however, I'm forced to rely on PVP to enter content to have access to more aspects of the game for PVE content.

Not to mention the fact that it also forces me to Grind my levels as well as lose out on all the new gear sets available.

marcmyb14_ESO

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

I guess I just don't see it that way. I see it as PvP content where there is also a bit of PvE stuff to do, just like the rest of Cyrodiil.

That's fine but that's not what it is. It is PvE content. An entire city with PvE quests, two PvE only group dungeons that drop gear tokens and other items/sets that people will want for their character regardless of whether or not they PvE or PvP.

I don't know how many other MMOs you've played but I've played many, and did endgame raiding in quite a few of them. Most of them have separate gear for PvP and PvE. In fact, the PvE sets are usually no good for PvP and vice versa due to differences in stats (such as a certain stat that is only useful in PvP). In those games, PvE dungeons are completely separate from PvP and drop nothing a PvP'er would want.

The only way to usually get PvP gear is to... guess what? PvP, and then use the currency from PvP to buy the gear, which is basically how the current system works, except that in ESO, PvP gear is best in slot for PvE'ers as well.

The problem with this system is that people are already forced to either PvP or pay lots of gold to buy PvP gear if they want their best in slot gear. This should never be the case. You should never have to PvP to get PvE gear or PvE to get PvP gear. That's just simply bad design.

Imperial city takes it to a whole new level, by requiring PvE'ers to PvP (if your faction doesn't own keeps) to get to the city, and PvP'ers to do PvE dungeons that they would otherwise not be interested in.

The fact remains, if either a pure PvE'er or a pure PvP'er want their best in slot gear, they will be required to do something they aren't interested in.

It's bad, mmkay?

JD2013

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

I guess I just don't see it that way. I see it as PvP content where there is also a bit of PvE stuff to do, just like the rest of Cyrodiil.

That's fine but that's not what it is. It is PvE content. An entire city with PvE quests, two PvE only group dungeons that drop gear tokens and other items/sets that people will want for their character regardless of whether or not they PvE or PvP.

I don't know how many other MMOs you've played but I've played many, and did endgame raiding in quite a few of them. Most of them have separate gear for PvP and PvE. In fact, the PvE sets are usually no good for PvP and vice versa due to differences in stats (such as a certain stat that is only useful in PvP). In those games, PvE dungeons are completely separate from PvP and drop nothing a PvP'er would want.

The only way to usually get PvP gear is to... guess what? PvP, and then use the currency from PvP to buy the gear, which is basically how the current system works, except that in ESO, PvP gear is best in slot for PvE'ers as well.

The problem with this system is that people are already forced to either PvP or pay lots of gold to buy PvP gear if they want their best in slot gear. This should never be the case. You should never have to PvP to get PvE gear or PvE to get PvP gear. That's just simply bad design.

Imperial city takes it to a whole new level, by requiring PvE'ers to PvP (if your faction doesn't own keeps) to get to the city, and PvP'ers to do PvE dungeons that they would otherwise not be interested in.

The fact remains, if either a pure PvE'er or a pure PvP'er want their best in slot gear, they will be required to do something they aren't interested in.

It's bad, mmkay?

OR you're not going to please all the people all of the time.

Some like purely PVE, some prefer PVP and when either a new PVP or PVE zone is announced a group will complain.

Me? I like both PVE and PVE and even some RP sometimes! I like solo and group content. I like fishing and crafting. But most of all I love Elder Scrolls having played them since Arena.

marcmyb14_ESO

JD2013 wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

I guess I just don't see it that way. I see it as PvP content where there is also a bit of PvE stuff to do, just like the rest of Cyrodiil.

That's fine but that's not what it is. It is PvE content. An entire city with PvE quests, two PvE only group dungeons that drop gear tokens and other items/sets that people will want for their character regardless of whether or not they PvE or PvP.

I don't know how many other MMOs you've played but I've played many, and did endgame raiding in quite a few of them. Most of them have separate gear for PvP and PvE. In fact, the PvE sets are usually no good for PvP and vice versa due to differences in stats (such as a certain stat that is only useful in PvP). In those games, PvE dungeons are completely separate from PvP and drop nothing a PvP'er would want.

The only way to usually get PvP gear is to... guess what? PvP, and then use the currency from PvP to buy the gear, which is basically how the current system works, except that in ESO, PvP gear is best in slot for PvE'ers as well.

The problem with this system is that people are already forced to either PvP or pay lots of gold to buy PvP gear if they want their best in slot gear. This should never be the case. You should never have to PvP to get PvE gear or PvE to get PvP gear. That's just simply bad design.

Imperial city takes it to a whole new level, by requiring PvE'ers to PvP (if your faction doesn't own keeps) to get to the city, and PvP'ers to do PvE dungeons that they would otherwise not be interested in.

The fact remains, if either a pure PvE'er or a pure PvP'er want their best in slot gear, they will be required to do something they aren't interested in.

It's bad, mmkay?

OR you're not going to please all the people all of the time.

Some like purely PVE, some prefer PVP and when either a new PVP or PVE zone is announced a group will complain.

Me? I like both PVE and PVE and even some RP sometimes! I like solo and group content. I like fishing and crafting. But most of all I love Elder Scrolls having played them since Arena.

I like to do both PvP and PvE as well. But there are plenty of people that don't. It's easy to say "you can't please everyone", but as I said, no other MMO does this. Most have the common sense not to try and force players to do something they don't like. But again, ESO has to try to be different.

urkonse

i want that patch more than dlc , lol

JD2013

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

I guess I just don't see it that way. I see it as PvP content where there is also a bit of PvE stuff to do, just like the rest of Cyrodiil.

That's fine but that's not what it is. It is PvE content. An entire city with PvE quests, two PvE only group dungeons that drop gear tokens and other items/sets that people will want for their character regardless of whether or not they PvE or PvP.

I don't know how many other MMOs you've played but I've played many, and did endgame raiding in quite a few of them. Most of them have separate gear for PvP and PvE. In fact, the PvE sets are usually no good for PvP and vice versa due to differences in stats (such as a certain stat that is only useful in PvP). In those games, PvE dungeons are completely separate from PvP and drop nothing a PvP'er would want.

The only way to usually get PvP gear is to... guess what? PvP, and then use the currency from PvP to buy the gear, which is basically how the current system works, except that in ESO, PvP gear is best in slot for PvE'ers as well.

The problem with this system is that people are already forced to either PvP or pay lots of gold to buy PvP gear if they want their best in slot gear. This should never be the case. You should never have to PvP to get PvE gear or PvE to get PvP gear. That's just simply bad design.

Imperial city takes it to a whole new level, by requiring PvE'ers to PvP (if your faction doesn't own keeps) to get to the city, and PvP'ers to do PvE dungeons that they would otherwise not be interested in.

The fact remains, if either a pure PvE'er or a pure PvP'er want their best in slot gear, they will be required to do something they aren't interested in.

It's bad, mmkay?

OR you're not going to please all the people all of the time.

Some like purely PVE, some prefer PVP and when either a new PVP or PVE zone is announced a group will complain.

Me? I like both PVE and PVE and even some RP sometimes! I like solo and group content. I like fishing and crafting. But most of all I love Elder Scrolls having played them since Arena.

I like to do both PvP and PvE as well. But there are plenty of people that don't. It's easy to say "you can't please everyone", but as I said, no other MMO does this. Most have the common sense not to try and force players to do something they don't like. But again, ESO has to try to be different.

Whilst I agree that other MMO's don't do this, and it would have been lovely to see Orsinium coming at the same time for PVE only players, the simple fact is that nobody is forcing anyone to do anything. I also do not get why people are unwilling to try PVP. Full disclosure; I hate PVP usually. It's very little fun. But here it's . . . Different. I love grouping up with Guildies to fight through Cyrodiil and capture keeps and scrolls. I love the excitement.

Now before you counter with "being forced to do it to level to VR16" yes, I can see that point. But if people are not even willing to try the new content or PVP then ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Ravens-Sonata

Alot of players prefer PvE - So Im Hoping this new DLC will included PvE zones for those of us that dont PvP

Elsonso

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Imperial city takes it to a whole new level, by requiring PvE'ers to PvP (if your faction doesn't own keeps) to get to the city, and PvP'ers to do PvE dungeons that they would otherwise not be interested in.

The fact remains, if either a pure PvE'er or a pure PvP'er want their best in slot gear, they will be required to do something they aren't interested in.

It's bad, mmkay?

Gamers that only want to PVE and gamers that only want to PVP will be the ones that will consider this bad. The gamers that go back and forth between PVP and PVE, which could be a larger group than either of the other two (I dunno), will be more likely to be fine with Imperial City since they can do both in one place.

The BIG problem with Imperial City is that the Alliances that can get into Imperial City will be starved for manpower in the rest of Cyrodiil. I already hear people complaining that no one comes to defend or attack keeps because too many people are PVE. Imperial City will just make this worse, and on top if it, all of those people will be out of touch with the rest of Cyrodiil. When this goes live, we will have locked campaigns that are ghost towns for any Alliance that can access the City.

marcmyb14_ESO

JD2013 wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

marcmyb14_ESO wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Don't then. You can buy orsinium when it launches soon. We already had numerous pve additions and none to pvp. That's the great thing about the model here... if a dlc package doesn't offer what you like, you can keep playing without buying it.

I'm much more concerned as to the XP gap between mob grinding in pve versus what we get for pvp'ing. Will this be brought to better parity with the imperial city patch, @ZOS_BrianWheeler ?

Nice logic here. If you don't like it don't buy it. Sure, that works, and then when all of your friends/guildies are vr16 with all the best gear, etc and need people to the dungeons with, you'll just say "sorry, I don't have it." that'll totally work out. I can even foresee people getting kicked from guilds because of this.

Just pay your guildies in gold to have them craft some VR16 IC gear for you and get them to mail it over. Problem solved.

Still missing the point.

Asking us to pay for PvE content that is gated behind PvP is just bad.

I guess I just don't see it that way. I see it as PvP content where there is also a bit of PvE stuff to do, just like the rest of Cyrodiil.

That's fine but that's not what it is. It is PvE content. An entire city with PvE quests, two PvE only group dungeons that drop gear tokens and other items/sets that people will want for their character regardless of whether or not they PvE or PvP.

I don't know how many other MMOs you've played but I've played many, and did endgame raiding in quite a few of them. Most of them have separate gear for PvP and PvE. In fact, the PvE sets are usually no good for PvP and vice versa due to differences in stats (such as a certain stat that is only useful in PvP). In those games, PvE dungeons are completely separate from PvP and drop nothing a PvP'er would want.

The only way to usually get PvP gear is to... guess what? PvP, and then use the currency from PvP to buy the gear, which is basically how the current system works, except that in ESO, PvP gear is best in slot for PvE'ers as well.

The problem with this system is that people are already forced to either PvP or pay lots of gold to buy PvP gear if they want their best in slot gear. This should never be the case. You should never have to PvP to get PvE gear or PvE to get PvP gear. That's just simply bad design.

Imperial city takes it to a whole new level, by requiring PvE'ers to PvP (if your faction doesn't own keeps) to get to the city, and PvP'ers to do PvE dungeons that they would otherwise not be interested in.

The fact remains, if either a pure PvE'er or a pure PvP'er want their best in slot gear, they will be required to do something they aren't interested in.

It's bad, mmkay?

OR you're not going to please all the people all of the time.

Some like purely PVE, some prefer PVP and when either a new PVP or PVE zone is announced a group will complain.

Me? I like both PVE and PVE and even some RP sometimes! I like solo and group content. I like fishing and crafting. But most of all I love Elder Scrolls having played them since Arena.

I like to do both PvP and PvE as well. But there are plenty of people that don't. It's easy to say "you can't please everyone", but as I said, no other MMO does this. Most have the common sense not to try and force players to do something they don't like. But again, ESO has to try to be different.

Whilst I agree that other MMO's don't do this, and it would have been lovely to see Orsinium coming at the same time for PVE only players, the simple fact is that nobody is forcing anyone to do anything. I also do not get why people are unwilling to try PVP. Full disclosure; I hate PVP usually. It's very little fun. But here it's . . . Different. I love grouping up with Guildies to fight through Cyrodiil and capture keeps and scrolls. I love the excitement.

Now before you counter with "being forced to do it to level to VR16" yes, I can see that point. But if people are not even willing to try the new content or PVP then ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

There's plenty of reasons people don't like to PvP, but that's irrelevant to the matter.

As for no one is being forced, yes, we aren't exactly forced to do anything, or even play the game. But if people want their best in slot gear, they will either be required to do those things or pay large sums of gold in order to buy the items, unless they're bound which in that case they'll just be required to do the content which they may not want to do. That is what we mean by "being forced".

mtwiggz

This all sounds fine and dandy... but...

You add a game "DLC" that is based almost entirely on PvP to access the content, or most of it anyways. When the PVP system at this point is very, very, flawed. No new news to fixing PvP? Sounds awesome. Can't wait.