Visualization of the Pantheon of the Elder Scrolls - FINAL VERSION UPLOADED! :D

Faulgor

Beowulf_McCallum wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

1. I don't know of any source that claims Anu as the All-Maker of the Skaal
2. Sithis is not the corresponding subgradient to Anu. That would be Padomay. Below that are Anuiel and Sithis.
3. Would be nice if you could show that Meridia originated as Magna-Ge
4. Likewise, Malacath originated as Trinimac, an Aedra-of-sorts
5. Lorkhan does not belong on the left. Although he is no Daedra, his figurative father is Padomay.
6. Hist do not spring from Sithis afaik; at best, their origin is contentious. At worst, they are not even from this dream.
7. The line of men did not come from Aldmer, their common ancestor is earlier in the Ehlnofey, who eventually split into the Old (Mer) and Wandering (Men) Ehlnofey. This is of course a bit different for the Bretons due to their Elven past.



https://reddit.com/r/teslore/comments/2f53cf/world_map/

I hope this helps to confuse you a little bit more

.....correct me of I'm wrong, but shouldn't (Anu/Padomay) and (Anuiel/Sithis) switch places??
since Anu birthed anui-el and Padomay birthed sithis (subgradients)?

Anu and Padomay are the two eyes of the Godhead, the dreamer. They are not really part of the Aurbis (anymore), even though Anuiel and Sithis are their subgradients.
I think.

Gidorick

Faulgor wrote: »

Beowulf_McCallum wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

1. I don't know of any source that claims Anu as the All-Maker of the Skaal
2. Sithis is not the corresponding subgradient to Anu. That would be Padomay. Below that are Anuiel and Sithis.
3. Would be nice if you could show that Meridia originated as Magna-Ge
4. Likewise, Malacath originated as Trinimac, an Aedra-of-sorts
5. Lorkhan does not belong on the left. Although he is no Daedra, his figurative father is Padomay.
6. Hist do not spring from Sithis afaik; at best, their origin is contentious. At worst, they are not even from this dream.
7. The line of men did not come from Aldmer, their common ancestor is earlier in the Ehlnofey, who eventually split into the Old (Mer) and Wandering (Men) Ehlnofey. This is of course a bit different for the Bretons due to their Elven past.



https://reddit.com/r/teslore/comments/2f53cf/world_map/

I hope this helps to confuse you a little bit more

.....correct me of I'm wrong, but shouldn't (Anu/Padomay) and (Anuiel/Sithis) switch places??
since Anu birthed anui-el and Padomay birthed sithis (subgradients)?

Anu and Padomay are the two eyes of the Godhead, the dreamer. They are not really part of the Aurbis (anymore), even though Anuiel and Sithis are their subgradients.
I think.

I'm viewing Anuiel and Sithis as manifestations of Anu and Padomay. I personally think the Godhead is an abstract concept and not an actual being.

Gidorick

I've pretty much decided to only include Races that exist during the Elder Scrolls games. On this chart...

It gets kind of out of control.

TheBull

Aren't Redguard something different than man?

BBSooner

TheBull wrote: »

Aren't Redguard something different than man?

I remember reading hypothesis' that Redguard are a man-like race from another dream/godhead. Pretty sure that nothing in the games has said anything specifically that they aren't human, though.

theroyalestpythonnub18_ESO

TheBull wrote: »

Aren't Redguard something different than man?

Nope. Redguards are a race of men. They're just not Atmoran/Nedic.

Gidorick

TheBull wrote: »

Aren't Redguard something different than man?

The redguard Lineage separates a little further back than the rest of man. The Ehlnofey Wanderers settled in Yokuda and Atmora. Yokudans became Redguards and I believe the Atmorans pretty much became all the other races of men.

Throren

Ya TES lore gets a tad whacky when you get into concepts like the dreamer, godhead, towers and CHIM. Pretty much anything MK had a hand in making seems like it was made while he was really high xD

Ffastyl

Edit: All of this post was mentioned earlier in the thread. ...Shoulda read.

All mer races stem from the Altmer, which stem from the Aldmer. It is unclear if the Aldmer became the Altmer by the time the other mer diverged.

The Nords descend from Atmorans, not Aldmer. Atmorans hail from Atmora, far to the north. In earth terms it is antarctica and no one lives there now that all the Atmorans migrated to Tamriel and became the Nords.

The Redguards hail from Yokuda, where they lived as... Yokudans. There is very little mixed blood in the Redguards, so the name change may just be what Tamriel colloquially calls them.

Bretons and Imperials descended from the Nedes and Nibenese respectively. Both were enslaved by Aldmer/Altmer/Ayleids, the difference in how each race overthrew their masters.

The Imperials rebelled violently, as is often mentioned in history lessons, particularly ones on the Ayleids. It all started with the legendary Pelinal Whitestrake, to whom little is known beyond his deeds.

The Bretons rose up peacefully, forcing a cultural inversion of sorts. The Aldmer/Altmer ruling the Nedes bred with them, creating the Manmer mongrel race. The Manmer lived as second class citizens among their elven masters, the mer gradually bestowing more responsibilities (and power) unto the "slaves" until the mer found their positions swapped without bloodshed or uproar. The Manmer simply governed so well the elves had no objection to letting them rule.
Bretons are Manmer, there is little difference in the bloodline, but their physical appearance changed from being close to that of elves to the pale skinned men we see today.

Dunmer and Orsimer were created by Daedric Princes altering a portion of the Aldmer/Altmer population.

The chart is a good representation until you get down to the descendants of the modern races. Reasons above.

crytantrevors

When did molag bal become king of unwanted advances towards women?

UTG_Zilla

crytantrevors wrote: »

When did molag bal become king of unwanted advances towards women?

Are You attracted to him romantically? Not a lot of women are
Lol..

Ffastyl

crytantrevors wrote: »

When did molag bal become king of unwanted advances towards women?

When he created vampires by

*** Lamae,

hence Daughters of Coldharbour is the alternate name for vampires.

ShedsHisTail

What would be cool, @Gidorick , would be if you could add little notations to the various races which explain in a sentence or two what source you're citing for the connections you've made. Maybe just a brief snippet from a lore book or something or a citation. Sort of like you did for the Aedra, and Daedric Princes.

That way, whomever was consulting your chart would know where to look for more information or would at least know why you've come to the conclusions you have.

crytantrevors

No not attracted to him, just dont remember him being being into r a p e.... So thats how he turned serana i guess

crytantrevors

I mean molag bal does have a nice tounge....

UTG_Zilla

crytantrevors wrote: »

No not attracted to him, just dont remember him being being into r a p e.... So thats how he turned serana i guess

Well...Serena told you...if you asked that is, she explains it all.

UTG_Zilla

crytantrevors wrote: »

I mean molag bal does have a nice tounge....

And is quite horny...I mean on his head! Oh dear god that didn't help, I'll just see myself out...

ShedsHisTail

crytantrevors wrote: »

No not attracted to him, just dont remember him being being into r a p e.... So thats how he turned serana i guess

Yeah, it's one of the beefs I had with the Molag Bal statue you could get once upon a time.
I didn't really want an idol to cruelty and r a p e sitting on my desk. . . Even a fictional one.

Gidorick

ShedsHisTail wrote: »

crytantrevors wrote: »

No not attracted to him, just dont remember him being being into r a p e.... So thats how he turned serana i guess

Yeah, it's one of the beefs I had with the Molag Bal statue you could get once upon a time.
I didn't really want an idol to cruelty and r a p e sitting on my desk. . . Even a fictional one.

I actually thought it was a weird statue to include... I would have much rather have had an uroburos statue and a really nice map.

crytantrevors

Well he is suppose to be evil so it fits i just never realized to the extent of how evil he really is , and funny enough the guy they got to voice him malcolm mcdowell played the role of caligula in the 1979 caligula movie and his character pretty much r a p e s every chick he meets and even a dude.... In the movie that is so hes got the experience playing messed up roles

Saddiq

Since I don't think it has been mentioned, as awesome as your work on the forums always is Gidorick, the alternate 'painting' that's been referenced gets another thing right that you can easily fix in yours--which is that it's a pre-copernican view of the universe. While the 'internal lore' could be debated, from a more 'academic' perspective ES lore like nearly all fantasy lore heavily pulls from ancient and medieval folklore at its roots (and since much modern fantasy comes from Tolkien, that's incredibly easy to prove). As such, fantasy lore should nearly always, I think, hold to a pre-copernican view with a flat 'earth' that's the centre of the universe, with fixed stars and planetary bodies being lights that are fixed on predetermined routes in the sky (one thing that makes the Serpent in ES lore that much cooler is its unique violation of this attribute).

To display ES lore with Nirn as a sphere in 'space' is in my opinion a mistake. Unfortunately, though, I have a faint memory of some ES lore that might violate this. Can't recall it at the moment though.

Thanks Gidorick, awesome posts.

Rosveen

Saddiq wrote: »

Since I don't think it has been mentioned, as awesome as your work on the forums always is Gidorick, the alternate 'painting' that's been referenced gets another thing right that you can easily fix in yours--which is that it's a pre-copernican view of the universe. While the 'internal lore' could be debated, from a more 'academic' perspective ES lore like nearly all fantasy lore heavily pulls from ancient and medieval folklore at its roots (and since much modern fantasy comes from Tolkien, that's incredibly easy to prove). As such, fantasy lore should nearly always, I think, hold to a pre-copernican view with a flat 'earth' that's the centre of the universe, with fixed stars and planetary bodies being lights that are fixed on predetermined routes in the sky (one thing that makes the Serpent in ES lore that much cooler is its unique violation of this attribute).

To display ES lore with Nirn as a sphere in 'space' is in my opinion a mistake. Unfortunately, though, I have a faint memory of some ES lore that might violate this. Can't recall it at the moment though.

Thanks Gidorick, awesome posts.

While I love the style of maps you're talking about and I think it works well with what we're trying to show here, there's just this teeny tiny bit of a problem...

WolffenBloodseeker

Saddiq wrote: »

Since I don't think it has been mentioned, as awesome as your work on the forums always is Gidorick, the alternate 'painting' that's been referenced gets another thing right that you can easily fix in yours--which is that it's a pre-copernican view of the universe. While the 'internal lore' could be debated, from a more 'academic' perspective ES lore like nearly all fantasy lore heavily pulls from ancient and medieval folklore at its roots (and since much modern fantasy comes from Tolkien, that's incredibly easy to prove). As such, fantasy lore should nearly always, I think, hold to a pre-copernican view with a flat 'earth' that's the centre of the universe, with fixed stars and planetary bodies being lights that are fixed on predetermined routes in the sky (one thing that makes the Serpent in ES lore that much cooler is its unique violation of this attribute).

To display ES lore with Nirn as a sphere in 'space' is in my opinion a mistake. Unfortunately, though, I have a faint memory of some ES lore that might violate this. Can't recall it at the moment though.

Thanks Gidorick, awesome posts.

TES lore is quite different from classic medieval and ancient folklore, there is advanced technology like space travel, airships, giant robots of death, orbital stations like the imperial battlespire and etc, people have an understanding of celestial bodies (the moons being the split body of lorkhan, the sun a portal to aetherius and the planets in oblivion being the realms of daedric princes who are basically aliens, the religious part of the lore also takes from various religious cultures (since Michael Kirkbride who is behind great part of tes lore studied comparative religion and applied it to create the tes mythology )

Saddiq

Touché. And I just played red guard (the 1998) game last year too. Only had the faint memory of the observatory on Stros mkai there.

Is it ok if I pretend the dwemer as the scientists of tamriel were the only ones that went Copernican on their view of the universe, while the other races are more magical (ancient) in their worldview?

Or can that notion be easily punctured with an image too?

Svartiloghin713

/lurk

Enodoc

Very nice! Just a bit on spatial representation, per Rosveen; Nirn is the "centre" of the Mundus, and the attendant Aedric planets are around it. Magnus (the Sun) and the stars are holes in Oblivion, and are all the same distance away from Nirn.

This picture represents that pretty well (although I don't agree with their representation of Oblivion realms as planets in a void-space):

Whereas this one is pretty good for showing spatial relation between Oblivion and the rest of the Aurbis, and is the best representation of "The Wheel" that I have seen:

Faulgor

crytantrevors wrote: »

When did molag bal become king of unwanted advances towards women?

Anyone. Anything.

Gidorick

Enodoc wrote: »

Very nice! Just a bit on spatial representation, per Rosveen; Nirn is the "centre" of the Mundus, and the attendant Aedric planets are around it. Magnus (the Sun) and the stars are holes in Oblivion, and are all the same distance away from Nirn.

This picture represents that pretty well (although I don't agree with their representation of Oblivion realms as planets in a void-space):

I absolutely LOVE this one @Enodoc

Of course, what I'm going for isn't so much a cosmological view of Mundus but more of a relational view between the mortal and immortal realm.

Gidorick

I uploaded the first revision. I opened up the bottom of the image a bit to make room for some of the racial lineage. Still trying to decide exactly what I'm going to include.

Gidorick

Faulgor wrote: »

crytantrevors wrote: »

When did molag bal become king of unwanted advances towards women?

Anyone. Anything.

I always thought that was because of how he "created" the first vampire.