Visualization of the Pantheon of the Elder Scrolls - FINAL VERSION UPLOADED! :D

Gidorick

Morimizo wrote: »

Very well done chart! Is there enough information about the other peoples of Nirn in regards to their beliefs to include them somehow (Akaviri, Sea Elves of Pyandonea, etc...)? Also, the Redgards certainly have a rich belief system. By Tava's Red Feather, you cannot forget Tall Papa!!

I honestly think the Redguard Pantheon is going to be my last inclusion.... but Ill get them in there.

Gidorick

Faulgor wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

Thanks @LMar & @Faulgor. I was grouping Sithis with Padomay... i dunno if I personally view them as seperate entities.... I'll look further into it. I used Sithis because that name is more common than Padomay.

Thanks for the input!

Yeah, I figured. Somehow Anu and Sithis are better known than Anuiel and Padomay, so it makes sense to use them for your chart. It's only a bit confusing when you put them on the same level, otherwise its fine.

TES lore is so wiggly, which is part of its appeal, but that also makes it incredibly hard to visualize.

Indeed! But the challange intrigued me!

Ganacampo

This is awesome!

I fear I know too little, to correct something, although I'm interested in it a lot.

Perhaps you should also add the Dwemer, Falmer and Maormer and show that Azura made the Chimer into Dunmer?

It probably is too complex to put it all in one picture without any mistakes, unclear decisions, but you did a great job.

Dracane

Humans didn't evolve from the Aldmer. They were created by Lorkhan.

Throren

Men did not come from Aldmer like you have in your chart.

And just a note to others, remember, the list of divines up on there are just the Imperial cult versions. Each race has their own pantheon and different versions for each aedra and with how weird gods work in TES, they all exist separately. For instance, Alduin and Akatosh are both two different and distinct beings yet they are both two shards/aspects of the larger AKA oversoul. Another way to look at it is like this, say the ocean is...Kynnareth. You then scoop two separate cups of water from said ocean. One is the imperial Kynnareth, the other is the nordic Kyne. Both are two separate/different cups of water with their own properties but they are both from/aspects of the same ocean. Idk, TES stuff gets really confusing when you get into this junk xD

Also I find so far this to be one of the best visual representation of the origins of the different races.

Egg_Death

I almost think it would be more appropriate to make several visualizations - one for each origin story. Some, or really most, of the gods don't appear in every belief system, but most of them share a lot of common themes. It would be particularly interesting to contrast the different perspectives of Men and Mer. I was surprised to see Sithis and Lorkhan as positive characters in the views of many of the non-elves.

BBSooner

Gidorick wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Great poster. Don't have a lot of time to look through it, but I noticed no Godhead. Curious if you left it out, CHIM, and the concept of Amaranth because a lot of the information is vague/out of game/broader than the direct line (all understandable). Not even really a nit-pick, I was just curious, love the graphic.

I tried to keep it simple... there's a lot to "miss" on things like this. With input like yours I plan on building the graphic up until it encapsulates almost all the ESO myths.

That's pretty awesome, and I appreciate your passion for the lore!

Throren

Egg_Death wrote: »

I almost think it would be more appropriate to make several visualizations - one for each origin story. Some, or really most, of the gods don't appear in every belief system, but most of them share a lot of common themes. It would be particularly interesting to contrast the different perspectives of Men and Mer. I was surprised to see Sithis and Lorkhan as positive characters in the views of many of the non-elves.

Well, at least for Lorkhan, he seems more celebrated by men than mer. Mer hate him because well, the Altmer (and the Thalmor later on) believe they were all aedra and Lorkhan helped create mundus and in a way, forced them to be mortal, where as to men, well, he is one of the reasons they/the world exists.

But Lorkhan takes on many forms in different cultures. In one he might be a cruel trickster, in othersa spirit with an endless hunger. And then to the nords, he is Shor, who you could liken to the real world viking's Odin. A mighty and powerful warrior god-king who represents honor and such who fought and died fighting the elven gods to protect his children (ie: the nords) and waist to welcome them into Sovngarde ( *cough Valhalla cough* )

Gidorick

Thanks @Throren. I've "pretty much" got what you have in that chart but will use that to help refine my visualization. Thank you!

Tonnopesce

Lord_Draevan wrote: »

Psst.

ARGONIANS MASTERACE

RDMyers65b14_ESO

I just wanna say "Wow, your chart is amazing. I am looking forward to seeing the final version."

Attorneyatlawl

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

/lurk

Rosveen

Faulgor wrote: »

1. I don't know of any source that claims Anu as the All-Maker of the Skaal
2. Sithis is not the corresponding subgradient to Anu. That would be Padomay. Below that are Anuiel and Sithis.
3. Would be nice if you could show that Meridia originated as Magna-Ge
4. Likewise, Malacath originated as Trinimac, an Aedra-of-sorts
5. Lorkhan does not belong on the left. Although he is no Daedra, his figurative father is Padomay.
6. Hist do not spring from Sithis afaik; at best, their origin is contentious. At worst, they are not even from this dream.
7. The line of men did not come from Aldmer, their common ancestor is earlier in the Ehlnofey, who eventually split into the Old (Mer) and Wandering (Men) Ehlnofey. This is of course a bit different for the Bretons due to their Elven past.



https://reddit.com/r/teslore/comments/2f53cf/world_map/

I hope this helps to confuse you a little bit more

This picture keeps getting better and better the longer I look at it.

Elsonso

Very pretty.

Dunmer need to be fixed to show they a Chimer v2.0

Dwemer are missing, along with a few others.

Not as pretty, but the image posted by Throren seems much more complete.

Gidorick

lordrichter wrote: »

Very pretty.

Dunmer need to be fixed to show they a Chimer v2.0

Dwemer are missing, along with a few others.

Not as pretty, but the image posted by Throren seems much more complete.

Indeed it is!

I was thinking I would just use the races we've "ended up with" but I see where that does a disservice to the lore. I'll have to work on fixing that.

Gidorick

Rosveen wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

1. I don't know of any source that claims Anu as the All-Maker of the Skaal
2. Sithis is not the corresponding subgradient to Anu. That would be Padomay. Below that are Anuiel and Sithis.
3. Would be nice if you could show that Meridia originated as Magna-Ge
4. Likewise, Malacath originated as Trinimac, an Aedra-of-sorts
5. Lorkhan does not belong on the left. Although he is no Daedra, his figurative father is Padomay.
6. Hist do not spring from Sithis afaik; at best, their origin is contentious. At worst, they are not even from this dream.
7. The line of men did not come from Aldmer, their common ancestor is earlier in the Ehlnofey, who eventually split into the Old (Mer) and Wandering (Men) Ehlnofey. This is of course a bit different for the Bretons due to their Elven past.



https://reddit.com/r/teslore/comments/2f53cf/world_map/

I hope this helps to confuse you a little bit more

This picture keeps getting better and better the longer I look at it.

I like it because it's very much subject to interpretation, just like the lore!

Preyfar

This is pretty awesome, but how would other beast-races like the Igma and Lilmothiit fit into it?

Beowulf_McCallum

Faulgor wrote: »

1. I don't know of any source that claims Anu as the All-Maker of the Skaal
2. Sithis is not the corresponding subgradient to Anu. That would be Padomay. Below that are Anuiel and Sithis.
3. Would be nice if you could show that Meridia originated as Magna-Ge
4. Likewise, Malacath originated as Trinimac, an Aedra-of-sorts
5. Lorkhan does not belong on the left. Although he is no Daedra, his figurative father is Padomay.
6. Hist do not spring from Sithis afaik; at best, their origin is contentious. At worst, they are not even from this dream.
7. The line of men did not come from Aldmer, their common ancestor is earlier in the Ehlnofey, who eventually split into the Old (Mer) and Wandering (Men) Ehlnofey. This is of course a bit different for the Bretons due to their Elven past.



https://reddit.com/r/teslore/comments/2f53cf/world_map/

I hope this helps to confuse you a little bit more

.....correct me of I'm wrong, but shouldn't (Anu/Padomay) and (Anuiel/Sithis) switch places??
since Anu birthed anui-el and Padomay birthed sithis (subgradients)?

traigusb14_ESO2

Very cool!

I think you need 4th and 5th dimension representation lol.

LMar

Faulgor wrote: »

1. I don't know of any source that claims Anu as the All-Maker of the Skaal
2. Sithis is not the corresponding subgradient to Anu. That would be Padomay. Below that are Anuiel and Sithis.
3. Would be nice if you could show that Meridia originated as Magna-Ge
4. Likewise, Malacath originated as Trinimac, an Aedra-of-sorts
5. Lorkhan does not belong on the left. Although he is no Daedra, his figurative father is Padomay.
6. Hist do not spring from Sithis afaik; at best, their origin is contentious. At worst, they are not even from this dream.
7. The line of men did not come from Aldmer, their common ancestor is earlier in the Ehlnofey, who eventually split into the Old (Mer) and Wandering (Men) Ehlnofey. This is of course a bit different for the Bretons due to their Elven past.



https://reddit.com/r/teslore/comments/2f53cf/world_map/

I hope this helps to confuse you a little bit more

Just managed to get a closer look and indeed there are a few things in the original which do not agree on the lore but nevertheless it is a good start. And yes as others mentioned it is the imperial pantheon but we can base some things off of there.

Nevertheless @Faulgor your image is quite awesome and the symbolism rather intriguing. There are a few things which are strange but then ES lore is. One thing amongst others which I am not sure about is why is Sheogorath the hem of the hand. I kinda feel he should be something originating from a hole in Sithis, or kind be a hole near Sithis. Also Yffre I suppose could be closer or even inside Nirn

Whendim_ESO

This is truly beautiful. I would buy this and frame it, and maybe best of all, it makes me want to study the lore.

Thank you.

Audens

Fantastic! However, there are two errors that spring forward at me:
A: Sithis and Padomay are not the same being.
B: Aldmer did not spawn Men, I believe the ancestors of men were Nedes and Yokudans.

Gidorick

allankerbein11ub17_ESO wrote: »

Fantastic! However, there are two errors that spring forward at me:
A: Sithis and Padomay are not the same being.
B: Aldmer did not spawn Men, I believe the ancestors of men were Nedes and Yokudans.

Thanks @Allankerbein. I've made the separation of Sithis and Padomay in the next version.

If the Nedes and Yokudans are the ancestors of men, where did they come from? In Rev 1, I have them coming directly from the Ehlnofey

Armann

Are Nedes really related to Atmorans?

On the origin of Nedes

The usual Imperial arrogance. The hoary old "Out of Atmora" theory has been widely discredited (no reputable archaeologist would publicly support it these days), but the Imperial Geographers continue to beat the drum of the Nordic Fatherland in the best tradition of the Septim Empire. They seem to think that the imprimature of officialdom gives their outdated scholarship added weight -- which, unfortunately, it appears to in the eyes of the ever-gullible public which continues to snap up the latest Pocket Guides along with the rest of their Imperial Certified pablum.

-Hasphat Antabolis

Source: http://www.imperial-library.info/content/kurt-kuhlmann-posts


Another dev who no longer works at BGS and wrote many of the TES books had this to say.

Sinder Velvin:
From now on, you won't hear the words "Daedra Princes" from me again. Anyway, isn't it true that the Tamriellic human races besides Redguards are related to each more than they are related to Redguards?

Ted Peterson:
Yes, common lore says that all humans on Tamriel can be traced back to the continent of Atmora, except for the Redguards who came from Yokuda.

Source: http://www.imperial-library.info/content/interviews-ted-peterson

Throren

The nedes, Yokudans and Atmorans are technically all separate lines of men *points to chart he posted earlier*

Gidorick

Throren wrote: »

The nedes, Yokudans and Atmorans are technically all separate lines of men *points to chart he posted earlier*

Who I think came from the Ehlnofey. I disagree that the Wanderers were a people. When the Ehlnofey spread across Nirn they began to loose their divinity. Those Elnofey diverged into the races of Man. There was no specific unified group of people like the Aldmer from which the races of men descended.

I'm curious... anyone know where the Akavir races came from? What about the Sload?

LMar

Gidorick wrote: »

Throren wrote: »

The nedes, Yokudans and Atmorans are technically all separate lines of men *points to chart he posted earlier*

Who I think came from the Ehlnofey. I disagree that the Wanderers were a people. When the Ehlnofey spread across Nirn they began to loose their divinity. Those Elnofey diverged into the races of Man. There was no specific unified group of people like the Aldmer from which the races of men descended.

I'm curious... anyone know where the Akavir races came from? What about the Sload?

It has been suggested that Akavir races are the remnants of other wandering Ehlnofey that never made it back to Tamriel. Unless they are what some other theries suggest, just the future versions of Tamriel. It is all a bit vague really on that front. As for the Sload... I don't think I have seen anything about where they came from. Though their dealings with Daedric Princes might show them to be a corruption of some original Ehlofey or even denizens of Oblivion who just came to live to Nirn. This is just speculation though.

Gidorick

LMar wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

Throren wrote: »

The nedes, Yokudans and Atmorans are technically all separate lines of men *points to chart he posted earlier*

Who I think came from the Ehlnofey. I disagree that the Wanderers were a people. When the Ehlnofey spread across Nirn they began to loose their divinity. Those Elnofey diverged into the races of Man. There was no specific unified group of people like the Aldmer from which the races of men descended.

I'm curious... anyone know where the Akavir races came from? What about the Sload?

It has been suggested that Akavir races are the remnants of other wandering Ehlnofey that never made it back to Tamriel. Unless they are what some other theries suggest, just the future versions of Tamriel. It is all a bit vague really on that front. As for the Sload... I don't think I have seen anything about where they came from. Though their dealings with Daedric Princes might show them to be a corruption of some original Ehlofey or even denizens of Oblivion who just came to live to Nirn. This is just speculation though.

Most of the Ehlnofey races are of men and mer. Khajiit were changed by Azura so I kind of assume other princes have dabbled in Racial Alteration as well. The question is, did ALL the races aside from Argonian begin as Ehlnofey? It's hard to imagine that the Sload did.

I like to think the Sload was a product of Hermaeus Mora. Perhaps even an unintended result.

As for the Akaviri. I totally think the Akaviri men were Ehlnofey. Now the best races of Akavir? I only have wild speculative guesses on those.

Rosveen

Another thing. Can we be sure that Magnus and the Magna-Ge are considered Aedra? Especially the Magna-Ge, because Magnus at least provided (one of) the schematics and is worshipped by the Altmer. Perhaps their lines should go directly to the et'Ada.

Gidorick

Rosveen wrote: »

Another thing. Can we be sure that Magnus and the Magna-Ge are considered Aedra? Especially the Magna-Ge, because Magnus at least provided (one of) the schematics and is worshipped by the Altmer. Perhaps their lines should go directly to the et'Ada.

I consider aedra an "et' ada that has consumed is own essence to create mundus." So the Magnus and Magna-Ge apply. So does Lorkhan. That's why I have him coming from the Aedra, he sacrificed himself to make Mundus.

TECHNICALLY it was the Et'ada that became the Ehlnofey too.