The Day ESO Dies

Lannden

I really feel the need to support this thread. I keep hoping in the bottom of my heart ZOS will listen to us. I love ESO PvP when I first stepped into Cyrodil I knew this was the kind of game I could spend endless hours just PvPing away. How ever as a PvP player I want to be able to stand on the same level as every one else.

How ever what is not cool is the CP system it makes me feel like I do not stand a chance like I will never stand a chance. I hate grinding and I'm not going to grind zombies for 8 hours a day nor do I have the time to do so. I'll admit I haven't even made it to vr14 because I realized I would rather play the blackwater bracket than grind more levels.

But now I'm ready to level to vr14 and yet finding it almost discouraging, it's alot of time spent trying to catch up to every one else so I can be on their level. But will I ever be able to even catch up? I am a very competitive player and I just want to stand on equal footing with every one else so we can let skill do the talking.

What's even worse is I keep trying to get friends into ESO but the VR system and CP system ultimately leaves almost every one i've tried to get into ESO packing their bags as soon as they hit vr1. What's the worst is that EVERYONE I invited to play ESO with me found the 1-49 experience very enjoyable. This says something ZOS and I know i'm not a streamer or even a well known player but I'm not the only one saying this and that's why i'm saying this despite the fact that thousands of other players have said it. I just want you guys to listen because this can be the most amazing game on the MMO market if you just rework the CP/VR system.

Slonekb05

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/193927/zos-players-gimping-themselves-for-an-actually-challenge-eso-we-have-a-problem/p1

Mawgusta

I barely have 140 points and I like the champion system. Everyone is farming something. I feel like every advantage has been given in this game ahead of me. I've PvP'ed for 20 years since UO. This game has always been about advantages,,

No one here, so gallant, in this thread, made a stand to help the devs at release. No, they hid vampire knowledge and batwwarmed the player base into cancelling. Advantages. Like when someone was so awesome at PvP. They couldn't share their secret build... Until a week before ZoS was nerfing the expoits that they were using. THEN!!! OK here it is... One week before patch. This game has NEVER been fair.

Number crunchers. That build. How many top guilds do you think are filled with number crunchers? No, not a lot. A few figure all the numbers out and then give the secrets to their guildies. Who use them to get ahead in PvP and PVE. Imagine.. that you're wasted by a guy who just know hows to listen to his guilidy number cruncher... copies his builds and his gears.. but isn't as good as you... He kills you because his guildies gave him the ultimate set up.. That's this game... To cry here all day about advantages is too funny. BECAUSE this game, would have hundreds of thousands more subscribers if it wasn't always about advantages.

Lets look at Sypher.. He's trying to make a living by playing this game in PvP, right (like that's his job to pay rent)? Yes. So let's say he PvP's all day. How can he make videos in 5 months of everyone who enjoys PvE can 4 shot him because they have 3x his Champion points? He can't. He'll be like you watching their videos and trying to Lear to play. That's bad news for someone trying to make a living off of PvP... Right? But when the secret set ups allowed them to annihilate you... how many of them came to the forums to cry for equality? No, they made videoes and become PvP GODS.

That's my opinion with 140 CPS./.. If I wanted to be on equal footing every season. I would play WoW and get reset like a new player every 4 months... But I like earning something that will never be taken from my character..

These guys.. Bloggers... Twitchers.. Streamers that PvP... if they're getting 4 shot by people who don't live their life's creating PvP guides... and earn CP.. Then the guys that earn CP will 4 shot them.. Start making vidoes that you want to watch instead of theres.... then they can't pay rent.

Edit: to any dev who might be reading... You sold so many copies on PC. When it comes to skill base the beta testers run your profits off with knowledge that your profit margin doesn't have. So they new players cancel because of batswarm and not knowing the mechanics. You can't let beta testers have a year with the mechanics and then unleash them on the profits when it comes to a skill base system.. Go to an eula that the beta tester can't play release and pay them. Cut out all the marketing blogs too. Stop giving information to games to a select few who make money blogging.. Hire and make it inside.. So the exploits and secrets don't screw you at release..

jswoap

I concur with Deltia and Pinky. When these people speak and give intelligent aguments/solutions, ZOS needs to listen. They KNOW this game backwards and forwards. They are credible when they offer comment and should be consixered. They are not here just bit ching and moaning, they want to keep a great game great!

Volrion

"To compete you have to be stronger.
The only way to get stronger is to get XP.
The only way to get XP is to quest/grind as fast as you can to keep up.

That's the problem.
To keep up you have to rush content or grind.
How can you enjoy a game if you have to ignore and bypass half the content to be competitive.
Whats the point of making content if you force players to rush it to compete ?
That means they just consume it faster and ZOS need to create content even quicker.

Is the point of the game to enjoy the journey (low XP/minute)....or to end the journey as fast as possible (high XP/minute) ?

I am an explorer. I want to see the scenery on the way. I want to admire the wildlife. I want to see the interactions of the world around me. I want to savour the stories of the quests and be pulled into them. I want to appreciate ALL the effort ZOS put into the game.
I cant. If I want to PVP I need to be as powerful as everyone else. Which means I have no time to savour the game experience.

So...
Savour PVE experience and be useless in PVP.
Savour the PVP experience and rush all the PVE experience.
I don't want to be forced into PVP or PVE.
I want to experience PVP and PVE to its full."


This is everything that is wrong with the current system.

I want to cruise, and soak up the rich story and world that Tamriel offers. But I also want to play competitive PVP....

...The ESO dilema.

Mojmir

the problem is a career gamer who isnt on the payroll doing the devs job for them.

pepperybrine

Good speech Deltia!

Avenias

jswoap wrote: »

I concur with Deltia and Pinky. When these people speak and give intelligent aguments/solutions, ZOS needs to listen. They KNOW this game backwards and forwards. They are credible when they offer comment and should be consixered. They are not here just bit ching and moaning, they want to keep a great game great!

U make it sound like ZOS needs to bow down to Deltia and kiss his ass when he speaks. Dont forget that Deltia makes his living from ZOS by making youtube videos. He should be the one kissing ZOS's ass.

NadiusMaximus

AND people that still refuse to see this entire system is the epitome of pay to win.
Don't believe it, xp potions can be bought a hell of a lot easier than they can be made. Double xp is double CP. Double your pleasure, double your fun. Most my guild left they day it released. Hell, we had a new guy join and in four days he caught up and passed us by, potions and constant grind. He said it was him and three guys playing the same toon night and day, but he did it,and that passed a lot of guys that have been here since day one off pretty bad.

Sad thing is, is its too late for this game now. They had a chance to make a really epic long lasting AAA game. It turned out to be a B list flounder in a year**. Admitted it, I finally saw flaws in the game I waited ages for and slowed my play down to a trickle. (**I see it in the $9.99 bin at Wal-Mart now and then, that constitutes a B game to me)

Main thing was just the pure grind of every little thing. Things like just trying to buy something at a decent price takes five times longer than it should, five different guilds= five times the length it takes to find it. Now try to find it outside of spamming chat and it's nearly impossible.

Next to change my mind was the grind for accomplishments that end up being impossible to achieve because they are broken in one way or another. I count five that I should have gotten but can't because ZOS just won't fix the problem.

But, you've heard it all before. I don't think the games dead or will actually be unplugged, but it's not as alive as it was last summer, back when they said I. C. was going to be released in September, the first time, last year. After that, it just got worse and worse, to the point nobody believed anything the company said, and a community of players split between groups tired of the constant canned responses given in ticket responses and almost rabid fan boys that could see nothing wrong at all with push backs, missed deadlines, broken patches that were made to fix broken patches.

In all, everyone has thier reason to stay or leave, I'm staying. I won't pay a dime now though. I'm getting tired of seeing videos from people I used to follow religiously for how well they covered the game and it's mechanism, become commercials for the crown store though. Instead of talking about new builds, or something cool, it's all about the store most times. How many times are they going to just reskins the SAME EXACT MODEL? That. .That is the one main reason above all others I have listed causing me the most grief. I can't stand the fact people are OK with release after release of the same exact thing. Something that in any other E. S. game is the simplest of simple reskin mod, in this game is worthy of stop the press OMG look at the new thing we just came out with. When ever I say this, someone always says "this is an mmo, they have to make money " yeah, I know. But I can't play a new horse and giving us new PLAYABLE content would make more money.

This is becoming a rant, sorry. Getting that stuff of my chest here is cheaper than therapy, which who ever came up with the idea of the new stone currency grind should seek.

Brightxdawn

SourishWhale wrote: »

"To compete you have to be stronger.
The only way to get stronger is to get XP.
The only way to get XP is to quest/grind as fast as you can to keep up.

That's the problem.
To keep up you have to rush content or grind.
How can you enjoy a game if you have to ignore and bypass half the content to be competitive.
Whats the point of making content if you force players to rush it to compete ?
That means they just consume it faster and ZOS need to create content even quicker.

Is the point of the game to enjoy the journey (low XP/minute)....or to end the journey as fast as possible (high XP/minute) ?

I am an explorer. I want to see the scenery on the way. I want to admire the wildlife. I want to see the interactions of the world around me. I want to savour the stories of the quests and be pulled into them. I want to appreciate ALL the effort ZOS put into the game.
I cant. If I want to PVP I need to be as powerful as everyone else. Which means I have no time to savour the game experience.

So...
Savour PVE experience and be useless in PVP.
Savour the PVP experience and rush all the PVE experience.
I don't want to be forced into PVP or PVE.
I want to experience PVP and PVE to its full."


This is everything that is wrong with the current system.

I want to cruise, and soak up the rich story and world that Tamriel offers. But I also want to play competitive PVP....

...The ESO dilema.

You can do both. It is not as complicated as your making it out to be.

EnglishDragon17

LOL with 43 pages of complaints I think ZOS will be stupid to ignore

I support this thread as pvp is unfair

Alucardo

I've been playing ESO since I was two years old. I'm now 32 and finally made my first Veteran rank 3. When we were informed about the increase to VR16, it did somewhat kill me inside.. it's nice to know I'm not the only one.
On to Champion Points, I'm on the fence. Yes, they are very unbalanced in PvP, but when I'm creating a new alt and levelling him up, they come in extremely helpful. If you've made Veteran ranks before, I believe you deserve some kind of boost the next time around - Champion Points provide this. Should they be accessible in PvP? No, not at all. But to keep them as some kind of reward to Vet players while grinding their new characters might be a good idea. I believe if you invest time into something, you should get something back. But it should never cause unbalance in the end game, which is PvP.

Mojmir

CheeseDivinity wrote: »

I've been playing ESO since I was two years old. I'm now 32 and finally made my first Veteran rank 3. When we were informed about the increase to VR16, it did somewhat kill me inside.. it's nice to know I'm not the only one.
On to Champion Points, I'm on the fence. Yes, they are very unbalanced in PvP, but when I'm creating a new alt and levelling him up, they come in extremely helpful. If you've made Veteran ranks before, I believe you deserve some kind of boost the next time around - Champion Points provide this. Should they be accessible in PvP? No, not at all. But to keep them as some kind of reward to Vet players while grinding their new characters might be a good idea. I believe if you invest time into something, you should get something back. But it should never cause unbalance in the end game, which is PvP.

uhm what actual F? sorry its late

VincentBlanquin

CheeseDivinity wrote: »

I've been playing ESO since I was two years old. I'm now 32 and finally made my first Veteran rank 3. When we were informed about the increase to VR16, it did somewhat kill me inside.. it's nice to know I'm not the only one.
On to Champion Points, I'm on the fence. Yes, they are very unbalanced in PvP, but when I'm creating a new alt and levelling him up, they come in extremely helpful. If you've made Veteran ranks before, I believe you deserve some kind of boost the next time around - Champion Points provide this. Should they be accessible in PvP? No, not at all. But to keep them as some kind of reward to Vet players while grinding their new characters might be a good idea. I believe if you invest time into something, you should get something back. But it should never cause unbalance in the end game, which is PvP.

its mmo and not single player game. if you invest you dont need to get anything back. You should enjoy your unlimited rising power in single player, but mmo is about competitive playground

Vizier

jswoap wrote: »

I concur with Deltia and Pinky. When these people speak and give intelligent aguments/solutions, ZOS needs to listen. They KNOW this game backwards and forwards. They are credible when they offer comment and should be consixered. They are not here just bit ching and moaning, they want to keep a great game great!

How many of these people were involved in the guild summits or had representatives there? The game get alot better? The solution is to homogenize the play even more? ARE WE PLAYING A RPG? I don't know anymore. I guess character development doesn't mean anything anymore if we are to listen to them. Bah.

CheeseDivinity wrote: »

I've been playing ESO since I was two years old. I'm now 32 and finally made my first Veteran rank 3. When we were informed about the increase to VR16, it did somewhat kill me inside.. it's nice to know I'm not the only one.
On to Champion Points, I'm on the fence. Yes, they are very unbalanced in PvP, but when I'm creating a new alt and levelling him up, they come in extremely helpful. If you've made Veteran ranks before, I believe you deserve some kind of boost the next time around - Champion Points provide this. Should they be accessible in PvP? No, not at all. But to keep them as some kind of reward to Vet players while grinding their new characters might be a good idea. I believe if you invest time into something, you should get something back. But it should never cause unbalance in the end game, which is PvP.

IMO there should almost always and in every circumstance be some "imbalance" between long term players and someone much newer to the game. I see nothing wrong with that. Never expected to be on par with people that got here before me unless I in the end put more time in. Shrug. Players should get tangible benefits from accumulated experience in the various xp trees....period.

Vizier

.

Digiman

I haven't really been playing this game for a couple of reasons, first off I am sorta getting sick of sitting around waiting for LFG tool for some group play, secondly there isn't really a single player daily mission center I can do to sit back and chill.

Being max level I either have to head Cyrodiil where I will likely get mopped up by other players pvping inorder to do dailies or head to craglorn where I have to sit and WAIT to FORM A FOUR PLAYER GROUP just to complete the quests in the zone.

Not to mention its either a dead zone or I have to spend my time back tracking so new players can get to the quest progression I am and by then I have to log off.

It's sickening to my soul and craglorn is obviously a poor design choice for FOUR PLAYER GROUPING since the initial launch groups blazed through it.

My obvious suggestion is to nerf it down so only two players can get through the zone.

Create a simple non pvp zone for daily quests where people can grind and chill out when they can't find or don't want to wait hours to form a group.

This isn't including the broken LFG tool that is incredible basic and lacks proper search functions! And no! Telling people to use a broken system to see if it works for 2 years is a weak and insulting excuse.

Lastly guilds are a mess, where I have to sift through making sure ones is active on top of others having proper trade which isn't really useful, I vendor nearly all my stuff unless I know it's something in high demand.

Sadly this game either requires you to be in specific place waiting around to form a group so you can't do anything else, the most fun I have had is through single player quests where I get to do things but when your spinning your wheels looking through chat for groups you want time adds up and I have to log off.

I LOVE THIS GAME and have continually subbed to this game since launch hoping that improvements would be made even with its buy to play model, but have fallen silent on the current plans for future DLC as Imperial city seems like another smaller cyrodiil with Dungeons. Something I hope the LFG tool actually becomes functional with.

This is really sad, I doubt the developers will read this or take note of it and when the DLC hits I will have to wonder if it's just another damn craglorn or cyrodiil forced PVP for single player quests. Especially now other interesting games are coming out and MMO's are releasing new expansions.

I don't want this games epitaph to be get more friends to buy the game to continue playing.

Avenias

Digiman wrote: »

I haven't really been playing this game for a couple of reasons, first off I am sorta getting sick of sitting around waiting for LFG tool for some group play, secondly there isn't really a single player daily mission center I can do to sit back and chill.

Being max level I either have to head Cyrodiil where I will likely get mopped up by other players pvping inorder to do dailies or head to craglorn where I have to sit and WAIT to FORM A FOUR PLAYER GROUP just to complete the quests in the zone.

Not to mention its either a dead zone or I have to spend my time back tracking so new players can get to the quest progression I am and by then I have to log off.

It's sickening to my soul and craglorn is obviously a poor design choice for FOUR PLAYER GROUPING since the initial launch groups blazed through it.

My obvious suggestion is to nerf it down so only two players can get through the zone.

Create a simple non pvp zone for daily quests where people can grind and chill out when they can't find or don't want to wait hours to form a group.

This isn't including the broken LFG tool that is incredible basic and lacks proper search functions! And no! Telling people to use a broken system to see if it works for 2 years is a weak and insulting excuse.

Lastly guilds are a mess, where I have to sift through making sure ones is active on top of others having proper trade which isn't really useful, I vendor nearly all my stuff unless I know it's something in high demand.

Sadly this game either requires you to be in specific place waiting around to form a group so you can't do anything else, the most fun I have had is through single player quests where I get to do things but when your spinning your wheels looking through chat for groups you want time adds up and I have to log off.

I LOVE THIS GAME and have continually subbed to this game since launch hoping that improvements would be made even with its buy to play model, but have fallen silent on the current plans for future DLC as Imperial city seems like another smaller cyrodiil with Dungeons. Something I hope the LFG tool actually becomes functional with.

This is really sad, I doubt the developers will read this or take note of it and when the DLC hits I will have to wonder if it's just another damn craglorn or cyrodiil forced PVP for single player quests. Especially now other interesting games are coming out and MMO's are releasing new expansions.

I don't want this games epitaph to be get more friends to buy the game to continue playing.

If u dont like pvp, dont waste ur time with imperial city. Go straight for orsanium which is for pve. The devs specially mentioned that ic is for pvp players only cos many pvp players have been begging ZOS for a smaller scale pvp instead of cyrodill which is just too big to enjoy.

TheBull

/yawn

Reznique

The day ESO dies is when devs will listen to conservative Skyrim-gamers which ask for housing and other nonsense.

IOUAT

Wow this is disgusting. Wake up zos

Gidorick

Mugetsu wrote: »

Wow this is disgusting. Wake up zos

Uhm... They're doing what deltia suggested. Seasonal caps PLUS some sort of catch up mechanic. How much more awake do you want them to be?

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO

Gidorick wrote: »

Uhm... They're doing what deltia suggested. Seasonal caps PLUS some sort of catch up mechanic. How much more awake do you want them to be?

HUGE step in the right direction, and I applaud them for that.

But I'm still of the opinion that Champion Points should be squished, too. I'm thinking that no more than a 12%-15% bonus (with each CP being worth 1.2%-1.5%) would be the way to go.

That way, we still have customization options without having to scrap the whole thing and without the glaring disparities we're seeing now.

I apologize for mentioning it before, but I just figured I'd do it again for splits and giggles.

HeathenDeacon

SourishWhale wrote: »

"To compete you have to be stronger.
The only way to get stronger is to get XP.
The only way to get XP is to quest/grind as fast as you can to keep up.

That's the problem.
To keep up you have to rush content or grind.
How can you enjoy a game if you have to ignore and bypass half the content to be competitive.
Whats the point of making content if you force players to rush it to compete ?
That means they just consume it faster and ZOS need to create content even quicker.

Is the point of the game to enjoy the journey (low XP/minute)....or to end the journey as fast as possible (high XP/minute) ?

I am an explorer. I want to see the scenery on the way. I want to admire the wildlife. I want to see the interactions of the world around me. I want to savour the stories of the quests and be pulled into them. I want to appreciate ALL the effort ZOS put into the game.
I cant. If I want to PVP I need to be as powerful as everyone else. Which means I have no time to savour the game experience.

So...
Savour PVE experience and be useless in PVP.
Savour the PVP experience and rush all the PVE experience.
I don't want to be forced into PVP or PVE.
I want to experience PVP and PVE to its full."


This is everything that is wrong with the current system.

I want to cruise, and soak up the rich story and world that Tamriel offers. But I also want to play competitive PVP....

...The ESO dilema.

totally agree. It saddened me to see hordes of players sittign on the beach in stonefells grinding dreugh all day long while i was questing through the zone the other day. I can't for th elife of me understand why questing doesnt reward more xp than sitting in one spot hitting a heavy attack button a million times in a row. Why wouldnt the devs want people to actually play the game?

Zorrashi

OLIVI3R wrote: »

The day ESO dies is when devs will listen to conservative Skyrim-gamers which ask for housing and other nonsense.

Is this sarcasm? Because I honestly can't tell

Housing and "other nonsense" (like spellcrafting, more skill lines, VR removal) FTW!!

Avenias

This thread needs to be shut down for good.

icontested

I don't know why no one else is trying to stream and make youtubes?! I guess if call of duty players are smarter than ESO players but that statement offends me.

I'm pretty sure you could start up a great ESO stream and make youtubes. Even a small cod streamer makes decent money a year. ESO is prime. Who's going to grind for it?

markt84

Avenias wrote: »

This thread needs to be shut down for good.

Why?

aco5712

markt84 wrote: »

Avenias wrote: »

This thread needs to be shut down for good.

Why?

coz he is probs a CP grinder and needs maths to help him win because l2p issue?

fjellreven-nalla

I guess that means the grind to veteran rank 14 was only the start..

My fix to this problem would simply be:

- Setting a maximum limit of achievable champion points = The new max level.

I think that the "pick and choose" part of the game is very important, espeacially at end game!
The champion system would be great as a tool for the final tweeks!


Keep the system, change the rules!