The Day ESO Dies

Vahrokh · July 2015

ch.ris317b14_ESO wrote: »

What people need to focus on is not whether the leveling is fair... but if it is FUN.

We should ALL be able to reach the conclusion that simply adding more levels and grind does not in any way make the game more fun, and actually makes it LESS fun.

Games are about FUN, not progression.... add more ways to have FUN and people will keep playing.... take away fun, make this a second job.... and people will not even make VR1

Sadly you are thinking outside of the box here.

MMO developers save huge bucks by creating guinea pig grinders, MMO players mostly come from WoW where they already got their brain shaped into a guinea pig grinder.

You are right and I truly am with you, but we are going to sit out alone, in the cold.

Vahrokh · July 2015

Gidorick wrote: »

RazzPitazz wrote: »

The topics keep changing. VR-> CP -> Grinding ->CP-> Cadwells -> XP rates -> CP-> endgame -> PVP -> CP.

All the cool kids want to be noticed. Don't you?

I'll admit.... I posted in this thread because the EXACT same points made in a thread made by someone else would be subjected to insults and verbal abuse. The naysayers have pretty much stayed away from this thread.

Maybe they're scared of Deltia.

True that. Back at the time when CPs were being implemented, I and other guys were already predicting the obvious outcome. A guy even posted a lot of formulas to prove how even diminishing returns would still provide massive power gaps over time.

All we got, had been to be ignored by devs and flamed by other yes-man players.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch · July 2015

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hey everyone, just a heads up that we are internally discussing your concerns (we've been reading them) -- we posted this in another thread, but it's worth repeating.

We're currently looking into ways we can help those new to the Champion System catch up a bit, and also decrease the gap between those who are just starting out and those who have accumulated a ton of points. Once we have a plan scoped out a bit more, we will be sharing it and looking to get everyone's thoughts.

Thanks for posting and taking time to discuss this issue.

SilentFox22 · July 2015

ZOINKS! When I heard about V16, I thought it was a joke (a bad one at that). I've been waiting for Vet levels to be removed before coming back to play. I HATE them.

DEATH to VET LEVELS! RAWR!

Isarii · July 2015

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

Hey everyone, just a heads up that we are internally discussing your concerns (we've been reading them) -- we posted this in another thread, but it's worth repeating.

We're currently looking into ways we can help those new to the Champion System catch up a bit, and also decrease the gap between those who are just starting out and those who have accumulated a ton of points. Once we have a plan scoped out a bit more, we will be sharing it and looking to get everyone's thoughts.

Great to hear! Please bear in mind that both points you noted are extremely important to address. While a catch-up mechanism like reduced XP cost for the first 300 points will help, addressing the extraordinary amount of power creep found at higher levels (particularly when capstoning multiple trees) is perhaps even more important to address. Of course, it's also a hell of a lot trickier, as well.

Vizier · July 2015

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

The playing field is even. Each person can quest or grind or whatever they want. That some are faster at leveling isn't my concern. Shouldn't be yours either. Just do better if your bitter about it.

Consoles and PC transfers completely nullify your point. Every console player has 0 CP available. Most PC transfers (copies really) are vr14 with at least a couple hundred CP. That gap will take months if not a year or more to overcome and every console player is playing within the release window. The playing field is incredibly lopsided and is exactly the same for any new PC player.

I honestly couldn't care less about your concerns. That someone newer to the game has fewer CP is not only expected it's reasonable. When VR is finally removed from the game the only thing separating folks will be CP and NOT the vast gulf of V1-V14 soon to be V16 AND CP. With the diminishing return on CP folks will close the gap fast enough...IF the WTF Play the game. After a time the difference will be negligible since the guy with less CP will always get more % increases then the guy with more.

You want to have "progression" with a virtually even playing field? Advocate for the removal of VR as they planned and SHHHHH about the CP. People will be competitive much much sooner than with the current system. But to act like it's somehow unfair that people that have been playing the game have more points is beyond the pail. Where were they when they had the chance to support the game? Folks had the same chance as anyone else to play. If they didn't have a PC that's on them, not ZoS or those that do. Welcome to the real world where people and circumstances are different. YOU ALL had the same access. Not mine or anyone else's problem or emergency that you didn't take advantage of it.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch · July 2015

Vahrokh wrote: »

MMO developers save huge bucks by creating guinea pig grinders, MMO players mostly come from WoW where they already got their brain shaped into a guinea pig grinder.

No game studio should ever try to copy anything WoW has done in regards to MMORPGs. A large part of WoW's success is due to it releasing after Everquest 2 was a bust because it was buggy as hell and a lame rehash of the original Everquest. Plus this new movie came out, Lord of the Rings so it was more acceptable to a broader audience to play this type of game. Right place, right time sort of thing.

Also we live in a time where instant gratification is crucial to any medias success. I remember 10+ years ago if you saw a preview for a movie, you would have to wait 6+ months before it hit theaters and another year to own a personal copy of it. Now previews come out a month maybe 2 before theater release and a few months later a personal copy is released. This is the same across all media platforms. If people hear about something today, next week they will forget about it cause something new has come along.

End-game is crucial to the longevity and success of an MMO nowadays. So if a game studio releases a game that requires a large time investment to reach end-game. The majority of it's customers will quit and move on to something else.

Since I started playing at pre-release, I can't count the number of people who quit the game before reaching Veteran 5. I see the same thing happening with console players.

Also, it used to be casuals out numbered hardcore players. I don't think that is the case anymore. Gaming has gone ultracompetitive with more and more people playing online. People now more than ever buy a game and try to be first to level cap, first to clear such and such zone, so they can brag about it on the internet.

If Zenimax doesn't embrace this, they are simply out of touch with society. They need to focus there efforts on rewarding their players not for putting thousands of hours into their game but keeping their attention by releasing fun content regularly.

Also if players are asking for a particularly popular feature, they need to put their own ambitions aside and release it. They are biting the hand that feeds them by not releasing new content regularly, Arenas, player housing, Dark brotherhood, etc etc.

LrdRahvin · July 2015

Vizier wrote: »

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

The playing field is even. Each person can quest or grind or whatever they want. That some are faster at leveling isn't my concern. Shouldn't be yours either. Just do better if your bitter about it.

Consoles and PC transfers completely nullify your point. Every console player has 0 CP available. Most PC transfers (copies really) are vr14 with at least a couple hundred CP. That gap will take months if not a year or more to overcome and every console player is playing within the release window. The playing field is incredibly lopsided and is exactly the same for any new PC player.

When VR is finally removed from the game

+1 for Adorableness

You still believe what ZOS says...

Cute kitten pic time

Vizier · July 2015

Sallington wrote: »

wenxue2222b16_ESO wrote: »

The issue seems to me, at the core, to boil down to lack of new content.

They need to keep players in the game doing something. With no new zones and little expansion in crafting then grinding for something (anything) keeps people logging in. CP points are there for that reason and that reason only really. If you cap them then you restrict that 'content'. Instead of gradual character progression through new zones and new quests what you are now getting is a desperate grindfest for the 'top'.

This is EXACTLY why I stopped playing. The progression in ESO right now is not what I enjoy. I enjoy a more "gear-centric" progression where you need to complete/master certain content before you can complete other, harder content effectively. In my opinion, this is exactly what made WoW such a popular and long lasting game.

I think part of the problem is that in ESO, they are basically handing out epic gear for free. You can have pretty much the best gear within a week, and then what? You just grind for CPs. We should be in mostly greens and blues for a while after hitting the level cap while we gear up slowly, getting better both in gear and skill as we complete progressively harder content.

Maybe that's just too much of an "old school" train of thought though.

I'm the opposite. Every MMO I ever played was "gear centric." That meant Raid, raid raid...the same instances over and over and over for a chance to get gear. If that was the case just shoot me now and get it over with. ESO is different and that is what makes it better IMO. All the gear is fairly accessible or craftable. Accessible in that when you dungeon dive everyone has a shot at loot. It's not "split" among the whole raid. (great feature and keeps delve grinding down.) And if that's not for you, you can purchase it or for regular sets (which are good) craft it or have a friend craft it. This lets me worry play how I want to since I'd rather be PvPing. I get xp. I earn AP and cash and I buy what I can't get on my own. Now all that's left is CP and that's fine by me. I don't grind. I play normally and I'm a full time student with little to no time to play. I have earned just under about 175 CP. I really don't see the issue. The OP's CP worries is fear mongering IMO.

Gear grinding is so last decade.

Isarii · July 2015

Vizier wrote: »

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

The playing field is even. Each person can quest or grind or whatever they want. That some are faster at leveling isn't my concern. Shouldn't be yours either. Just do better if your bitter about it.

Consoles and PC transfers completely nullify your point. Every console player has 0 CP available. Most PC transfers (copies really) are vr14 with at least a couple hundred CP. That gap will take months if not a year or more to overcome and every console player is playing within the release window. The playing field is incredibly lopsided and is exactly the same for any new PC player.

But to act like it's somehow unfair that people that have been playing the game have more points is beyond the pail. Where were they when they had the chance to support the game? Folks had the same chance as anyone else to play. If they didn't have a PC that's on them, not ZoS or those that do. Welcome to the real world where people and circumstances are different. YOU ALL had the same access. Not mine or anyone else's problem or emergency that you didn't take advantage of it.

People who have been playing the game longer should absolutely have a steep climb to catch up, but if they can never get caught up - as is the case in the current system - they just won't play the game. That perception keeps people away from EVE, and that game's progression is all horizontal, so the concern isn't even valid.

If TESO isn't somehow accessible to new players, it will eventually wither away and die as a direct result, and those of us playing the game now are going to be the ones who suffer and lose the most. Infinite and unfettered vertical progression is not conducive to the long-term health of a competitive multiplayer game. ZOS seems to be figuring this out as well. They will fix it, and all of us - not just the new players - will enjoy the benefits.

Isarii · July 2015

Vizier wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

wenxue2222b16_ESO wrote: »

The issue seems to me, at the core, to boil down to lack of new content.

They need to keep players in the game doing something. With no new zones and little expansion in crafting then grinding for something (anything) keeps people logging in. CP points are there for that reason and that reason only really. If you cap them then you restrict that 'content'. Instead of gradual character progression through new zones and new quests what you are now getting is a desperate grindfest for the 'top'.

This is EXACTLY why I stopped playing. The progression in ESO right now is not what I enjoy. I enjoy a more "gear-centric" progression where you need to complete/master certain content before you can complete other, harder content effectively. In my opinion, this is exactly what made WoW such a popular and long lasting game.

I think part of the problem is that in ESO, they are basically handing out epic gear for free. You can have pretty much the best gear within a week, and then what? You just grind for CPs. We should be in mostly greens and blues for a while after hitting the level cap while we gear up slowly, getting better both in gear and skill as we complete progressively harder content.

Maybe that's just too much of an "old school" train of thought though.

I'm the opposite. Every MMO I ever played was "gear centric." That meant Raid, raid raid...the same instances over and over and over for a chance to get gear. If that was the case just shoot me now and get it over with. ESO is different and that is what makes it better IMO. All the gear is fairly accessible or craftable. Accessible in that when you dungeon dive everyone has a shot at loot. It's not "split" among the whole raid. (great feature and keeps delve grinding down.) And if that's not for you, you can purchase it or for regular sets (which are good) craft it or have a friend craft it. This lets me worry play how I want to since I'd rather be PvPing. I get xp. I earn AP and cash and I buy what I can't get on my own. Now all that's left is CP and that's fine by me. I don't grind. I play normally and I'm a full time student with little to no time to play. I have earned just under about 175 CP. I really don't see the issue. The OP's CP worries is fear mongering IMO.

Gear grinding is so last decade.

Now don't get me wrong - in theory - I support the idea of a mechanic like the Champion System over gear treadmills. That said, the treadmill has a major advantage over CP because, as the name implies, players aren't going anywhere.

Any time World of Warcraft introduces a new iLvl tier, easy to obtain starting sets are added so that new players can quickly get up to speed, and every few years, the playing field is completely leveled when a level cap raise resets all gear progression across the board. The CP has no equivalent, and that's not a healthy situation to be in if you ever want to attract new blood to the game (which of course you do).

k2blader · July 2015

I don't think anyone likes grinding; but if I'm forced to grind I'd rather grind for a pleasurable and very useful gear reward than some "[word that sounds awesome] point" that ups my ability to form squiggles by 0.2%.

[edit]
And I don't mean grinding PvE..

LrdRahvin · July 2015

k2blader wrote: »

I don't think anyone likes grinding; but if I'm forced to grind I'd rather grind for a pleasurable and very useful gear reward than some "[word that sounds awesome] point" that ups my ability to form squiggles by 0.2%.

But...but...SQUIGGLES

CFodder1977 · July 2015

How is grinding for some RNG gear piece better than grinding for a stat point that the player can actually control in terms of a) getting it to "drop" in the first place and b) having complete control over how the earned point can increase your stats? Go pound your head against a wall playing the same repeated content for 1000+ hours in Destiny only to still never to get the one item you desperately want to drop (i.e. Ghorn for many Destiny players). Then we'll see how much you enjoy blindly grinding for gear drops alone.

k2blader · July 2015

LrdRahvin wrote: »

k2blader wrote: »

I don't think anyone likes grinding; but if I'm forced to grind I'd rather grind for a pleasurable and very useful gear reward than some "[word that sounds awesome] point" that ups my ability to form squiggles by 0.2%.

But...but...SQUIGGLES

You no take squiggle!!

Vizier · July 2015

Isarii wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

wenxue2222b16_ESO wrote: »

The issue seems to me, at the core, to boil down to lack of new content.

They need to keep players in the game doing something. With no new zones and little expansion in crafting then grinding for something (anything) keeps people logging in. CP points are there for that reason and that reason only really. If you cap them then you restrict that 'content'. Instead of gradual character progression through new zones and new quests what you are now getting is a desperate grindfest for the 'top'.

This is EXACTLY why I stopped playing. The progression in ESO right now is not what I enjoy. I enjoy a more "gear-centric" progression where you need to complete/master certain content before you can complete other, harder content effectively. In my opinion, this is exactly what made WoW such a popular and long lasting game.

I think part of the problem is that in ESO, they are basically handing out epic gear for free. You can have pretty much the best gear within a week, and then what? You just grind for CPs. We should be in mostly greens and blues for a while after hitting the level cap while we gear up slowly, getting better both in gear and skill as we complete progressively harder content.

Maybe that's just too much of an "old school" train of thought though.

I'm the opposite. Every MMO I ever played was "gear centric." That meant Raid, raid raid...the same instances over and over and over for a chance to get gear. If that was the case just shoot me now and get it over with. ESO is different and that is what makes it better IMO. All the gear is fairly accessible or craftable. Accessible in that when you dungeon dive everyone has a shot at loot. It's not "split" among the whole raid. (great feature and keeps delve grinding down.) And if that's not for you, you can purchase it or for regular sets (which are good) craft it or have a friend craft it. This lets me worry play how I want to since I'd rather be PvPing. I get xp. I earn AP and cash and I buy what I can't get on my own. Now all that's left is CP and that's fine by me. I don't grind. I play normally and I'm a full time student with little to no time to play. I have earned just under about 175 CP. I really don't see the issue. The OP's CP worries is fear mongering IMO.

Gear grinding is so last decade.

Now don't get me wrong - in theory - I support the idea of a mechanic like the Champion System over gear treadmills. That said, the treadmill has a major advantage over CP because, as the name implies, players aren't going anywhere.

Any time World of Warcraft introduces a new iLvl tier, easy to obtain starting sets are added so that new players can quickly get up to speed, and every few years, the playing field is completely leveled when a level cap raise resets all gear progression across the board. The CP has no equivalent, and that's not a healthy situation to be in if you ever want to attract new blood to the game (which of course you do).

I hear you. Look. I'm all for a fair fight. I'm just not into this premature panic over what essentially is a non-issue. People are going to catch up within a few % points very fast. Think of it this way. Takes about 30 CP to get to the first 10% passive bonus. It takes about 30 more CP to get an additional 5-6%. For instance I have 43 points into Thaumaturge. I only get .2% per point and it will soon drop to .1% For the most part anyone a tier lower than I trying to level that category is at the least leveling it twice as fast. By the time they get to where they are earning .1% the difference is negligible.

IF ZoS actually follows through with their plan to remove VR ranks. The largest gaps in abilities right now aren't from the CP but rather that newer players are lower levels and sporting green and blue gear, whereas an established V14 has his V14 gear maxed out to Legendary. You'd be surprised but it makes a difference.

I'd much rather see them remove VR ranks and reset gear to lvl 50. I'd even be willing to eat the mats for gear improvement. IMO this would go furthest in bringing older and newer players together stats wise.

LrdRahvin wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

The playing field is even. Each person can quest or grind or whatever they want. That some are faster at leveling isn't my concern. Shouldn't be yours either. Just do better if your bitter about it.

Consoles and PC transfers completely nullify your point. Every console player has 0 CP available. Most PC transfers (copies really) are vr14 with at least a couple hundred CP. That gap will take months if not a year or more to overcome and every console player is playing within the release window. The playing field is incredibly lopsided and is exactly the same for any new PC player.

When VR is finally removed from the game

+1 for Adorableness
You still believe what ZOS says...
Cute kitten pic time

:-) I try to be optimistic. I'm a glass half full kind of guy. At least until the world is on fire.

eonowakb16_ESO · July 2015

Xendyn wrote: »

Nice wake up call, I hope they listen.
I'm not a "well-known" player, streamer or anything, just a plain ol joe but I've been here the whole time, subbed until I let it run out in May.

We saw a vision for a game that was different, that's why we came and that's why we've stayed this long. The vision was beautiful, the game still is beautiful, but the management of it is becoming a nightmare.

Listen up ZOS, you are at the point where you could have it all or lose it all.

Choose wisely
We still want the vision.

But what was the vision? It is really unimportant, guys, if you ar V14 or V16 - or you call it Level 114 or whatever....one of the biggest part of the vision was that we get regular content updates, and now we get nothing for over a half year. I would bet if Zeni would have carried on to deliver small but nice content updates as they have done until 1.6 nobody here would whine about CP, a slight increase in Veteran-Ranks or whatever. If people are bored they look for everything to complain.

Good that they have to deliver the Console-Version, finally, i can understand completly. But now Zeni keep the playerbase busy, and not with dailies or whatever, deliver great content and not big ones, small nice DLCs, and nobody would have time to complain about unimportant things like here

And if ZOS can do one thing, it would be content - they proofed it.

But personalyl i fear that ZOS would tend to deliver in the future bigger updates, so called Add-On'S as everyone else does it.

Hiero_Glyph · July 2015

Vizier wrote: »

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Vizier wrote: »

The playing field is even. Each person can quest or grind or whatever they want. That some are faster at leveling isn't my concern. Shouldn't be yours either. Just do better if your bitter about it.

Consoles and PC transfers completely nullify your point. Every console player has 0 CP available. Most PC transfers (copies really) are vr14 with at least a couple hundred CP. That gap will take months if not a year or more to overcome and every console player is playing within the release window. The playing field is incredibly lopsided and is exactly the same for any new PC player.

I honestly couldn't care less about your concerns. That someone newer to the game has fewer CP is not only expected it's reasonable. When VR is finally removed from the game the only thing separating folks will be CP and NOT the vast gulf of V1-V14 soon to be V16 AND CP. With the diminishing return on CP folks will close the gap fast enough...IF the WTF Play the game. After a time the difference will be negligible since the guy with less CP will always get more % increases then the guy with more.

You want to have "progression" with a virtually even playing field? Advocate for the removal of VR as they planned and SHHHHH about the CP. People will be competitive much much sooner than with the current system. But to act like it's somehow unfair that people that have been playing the game have more points is beyond the pail. Where were they when they had the chance to support the game? Folks had the same chance as anyone else to play. If they didn't have a PC that's on them, not ZoS or those that do. Welcome to the real world where people and circumstances are different. YOU ALL had the same access. Not mine or anyone else's problem or emergency that you didn't take advantage of it.

Its blatantly obvious that you do not care because you cannot even comprehend how not everyone owns a gaming PC. Your opinion is far too polarized for you to ever understand why account copies are detrimental to a burgeoning community. If ZoS had upheld their offer and only offered a true account transfer where you would lose your PC characters and items when transferring then this would be a very different conversation. As it stands now the experience gap for both VR and CP is far too much for an entire community of new players to overcome without months of playing time. We are talking about a non, cross-platform game that just released so this gap is entirely negative within the release window. Again, your opinion is noted but you are far too entrenched in your argument to even fathom how this gap hurts the continued revenue of the console versions.

Elijah_Crow · July 2015

Removed for self moderation.

k2blader · July 2015

Elijah_Crow wrote: »

Looking forward to the day this thread dies...

You really shouldn't have posted that.. ;-)

e1team · July 2015

At least we were luckier than EVE players

You could train skills there even when offline so there was no chance at all you could reach those ahead.

MisterBigglesworth · July 2015

Sorry, couldn't help myself.

Vahrokh · July 2015

e1team wrote: »

At least we were luckier than EVE players You could train skills there even when offline so there was no chance at all you could reach those ahead.

Please don't even try comparing EvE with ESO.

EvE is a difficult awesome AAA MMO that after 13 years is still proudly subscription based and constantly updated both in graphics, gameplay and new features.

EvE is still here because levelling in it is neither vertical nor horizontal (so what you say it's just wrong). You have an "horizontal forest" of skills, each skill got 5 (not 5000) steps from zero to "elite" (it's the actual in game name). ALL the basic and intermediate skills may be trained to "very competent" (level 4) from few days to 2 week-ish. Being level 4 usually gives like 90% of the "eliteness" of a level 5. It's also not really important to go level 5 (my 100 million skill point main has a lot of level 4s) because the total character "power" in the end is the sum of all the "forest".

Put in practice, in a couple of days you can be an asset to any fleet, in few weeks you can be competent to at least 1 important ship. Also, there are dozens of ships to learn and each ship comes with dozens of gear setups and each of these setups may take weeks of practice in real life to be mastered. In the end the player gets "EvE certified" to fly a ship well before he truly learned it so nobody past the first weeks feels slowed down because of game artificially braking him.

sadownik · July 2015

Vahrokh wrote: »

e1team wrote: »

braking him.

i too fondly remember EvE

e1team · July 2015

You missed my point. I never said EVE is a bad game, and I played it enough to understand how the skill system works there. Thing is you will never catch up with anyone who has even a week start ahead of you. Skills can be trained while you are logged off. You only have to come online to put a next skill to train.
And I played it enough to know that even you got a certificate to fly a dreadnought doesn't mean you also got all the necessary skills along with it. I have flown an interdictor. Cost me a fortune to equip it. But I still had to invest time to learn the associated skills. And there no shortcuts no workarounds. Fine with me. But offline skill training means you have no chance. So don't tell me not to compare the two games. Because I'm comparing only the skill systems. And ESO wins in that regard.

Kazzy56 · July 2015

PS4 EU

Wait! Its still alive!!!

e1team · July 2015

What I am saying is that people complain over nothing. Some games like EVE (don't bash me plz) leave you no chance to catch up to other players skillwize so long as these other people have an active account and care log in to slot the next skill to train. While in ESO, if you play just an hour more every day you can get yourself to an appropriate level and CP amount. The chances are slim of course. But it is possible.
Don't flame me please.
Sorry if I sounded offensive to anyone.

BuggeX · July 2015

e1team wrote: »

What I am saying is that people complain over nothing. Some games like EVE (don't bash me plz) leave you no chance to catch up to other players skillwize so long as these other people have an active account and care log in to slot the next skill to train. While in ESO, if you play just an hour more every day you can get yourself to an appropriate level and CP amount. The chances are slim of course. But it is possible.
Don't flame me please.
Sorry if I sounded offensive to anyone.

The diffenrece between Teso and eve is, that eve was Long time the only sci fi mmo, so ppl who like this genere will Play it anyway.
But now, up the releas of Elite and Feature star citizen, eve have to rethink about the never catch up System.

there are to many mmos wich could replace teso for most players

silky_soft · July 2015

Why not just give us enlightenment all the time until we reach the top 3% of CP holders? Once you get to that top percent you can't get enlightenment again until you fall below that top 3%. Also give a champ point to the daily quests, just complete 1 daily anywhere in the game to get it.

Way to many bots in the pve grind spots that never get cleared to get anything done.

Tors · July 2015

A quick note, my main toon is Pact, we NEVER have buff campains in EU (Thornblade sometimes gives a buff, but no way am I queueing for half and hour to get in)

So in order to make my 4-5 Cp a day Ive rolled a Blue toon to take advantage of the buffs and better Cadwells gold grind zones.

It took me a week to get to 50 and then VR 10 in the next week,

This is me playing at lunchtimes and a few hours in the eveing (I tend to ALT F4 when I get to the point in Cryodil that we are just standing on flags to turn them because the server side lag is so bad we cant hurt each other)

What is the problem with VR levels again? I am level VR10 after 2 weeks of non-intensive play. Some of my equipment was even level 40 when I remembered to check it and replace from crap zombies drop.