We would like more feminine armors

Keron

Then be a dear and point me to some good books on the topics.

I am no history major but I hate being wrong, which means that my OCD will make me go through a whole curriculum before it is satisfied

UrQuan

Keron wrote: »

Then be a dear and point me to some good books on the topics.

I am no history major but I hate being wrong, which means that my OCD will make me go through a whole curriculum before it is satisfied

Well, I went to university when the internet was still in its infancy (14.4 dial-up was top of the line, and it could take 10 minutes for a single image to load on a webpage), so all of the books on the topic that I studied back then were physical ones that I got from the library at UVic, which I no longer have access to. When I get home I'll see what I can dig up for you.

Keron

UrQuan wrote: »

Keron wrote: »

Then be a dear and point me to some good books on the topics.

I am no history major but I hate being wrong, which means that my OCD will make me go through a whole curriculum before it is satisfied

Well, I went to university when the internet was still in its infancy (14.4 dial-up was top of the line, and it could take 10 minutes for a single image to load on a webpage), so all of the books on the topic that I studied back then were physical ones that I got from the library at UVic, which I no longer have access to. When I get home I'll see what I can dig up for you.

That's very much appreciated and similar for me. started uni in '94, at that time in germany and that was internet stone age until 2000.

AhPook_Is_Here

I would like some good "cruising" armor for my male characters too please. Not just foofy wedding dresses, but hot leather cutoff pants, spiked leather vests and an assortment of glittery face-paint and colored hankies for rear pockets.

DaveMoeDee

Wintersage wrote: »

I would like more masculine light armor, myself. I'm tired of wearing dresses.

Robes are so boring. Even trash armor looks more interesting. And I'm someone who doesn't normally pay attention to gear.

Keron

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

I would like some good "cruising" armor for my male characters too please. Not just foofy wedding dresses, but hot leather cutoff pants, spiked leather vests and an assortment of glittery face-paint and colored hankies for rear pockets.

Red&Black right side?

Varicite

Vaerth wrote: »

ChuckyPayne wrote: »

My wife asked me to write to you.

As women in general, love to dress up. They like the beautiful feminine clothes. This is same in the game.
Argonian Cloth Lvl1 armor or the Dark Seducer costume is feminine armor.
It was pretty much the lineup the rest of armors is not feminine.

Of course this is a subjective opinion with a woman eye.

So a dress makes for good combat armor? Did you try the crown store dress out yet?

Certainly not any less effective than the robes and tunics that are already in the game.

OP just wants them to not ALL look frumpy.

phreatophile

UrQuan wrote: »

Keron wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Um, no. You're very very misinformed on this. Full plate weighs less than the full combat gear of most modern soldiers [...] (which would be over distances greater than 100m) were common.

Well then, I stand corrected and will do some more research. Nonetheless, my point is not that. It is:

Keron wrote: »

But I refuse to be dragged into the realism discussion. I hate that argument with a passion because it has nothing to do with computer gaming. It's not about realism, it's about a fun environment. A fun environment is usually an environment that allows freedom of choice and this is what I think the political-correctness-faction is removing from life and games alike.

And

Keron wrote: »

FREEDOM OF CHOICE. If you feel objectified by wearing revealing clothing/armor, don't wear it. If you feel contempt towards the character wearing it, ROLE PLAY it. But leave the CHOICE to the player who wants to run around in revealing clothing. Even if it is a fat hairy Nord man-bear who likes to show his back fur or the out-and-proud punk chick who doesn't give a s**t on political correctness and other people's clothing standards.

And that stands. So do not expect me to further be a part in this fact-this-misinformation-that-realism-those-discussion.

Oh and that's fine, I take absolutely no issue with those points. In fact, I agree with you. It's just that as a former History major with a minor in Medieval Studies, I can't sit by and not correct misconceptions like yours about full plate (which is a very common misconception, so don't feel too bad about it)...

I think the kind of Plate you are refering to cost the equivalent of high end sports car or mid range house so it wasn't all that common, time isn't the only reason there are few surviving examples.

A warrior in the kind of plate UrQuan is refering to could do cartwheels in it, but for every one suit like that there were hundreds if not thousands of ill fitting dented helms and breastplates and baggy mail shirts.

LIke a number of posters have said, the realism argument is pointless, and I hate it too. Every player has a right to enjoy the game, provided we aren't talking actual chain bikinis, there ought to be some aesthetically pleasing options for those of us who don't want our characters wearing a nun's habit like there are now for the other side of this one. All though the skin police get almost every armor in every style for their side.

Iduyenn

This is a very important topic for me too.
I would Love to have the Freedom of Choice for everyone.

I for my end like Linda solid armor. Not to fancy. The undaunted armor Helmet and shoulders: i hate the fact, that you cant transform them to imperial Style. I Even wrote a ticket about this.

When i am at my pc again i will Add some more thoughts about this stuff.

UrQuan

phreatophile wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Keron wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Um, no. You're very very misinformed on this. Full plate weighs less than the full combat gear of most modern soldiers [...] (which would be over distances greater than 100m) were common.

Well then, I stand corrected and will do some more research. Nonetheless, my point is not that. It is:

Keron wrote: »

But I refuse to be dragged into the realism discussion. I hate that argument with a passion because it has nothing to do with computer gaming. It's not about realism, it's about a fun environment. A fun environment is usually an environment that allows freedom of choice and this is what I think the political-correctness-faction is removing from life and games alike.

And

Keron wrote: »

FREEDOM OF CHOICE. If you feel objectified by wearing revealing clothing/armor, don't wear it. If you feel contempt towards the character wearing it, ROLE PLAY it. But leave the CHOICE to the player who wants to run around in revealing clothing. Even if it is a fat hairy Nord man-bear who likes to show his back fur or the out-and-proud punk chick who doesn't give a s**t on political correctness and other people's clothing standards.

And that stands. So do not expect me to further be a part in this fact-this-misinformation-that-realism-those-discussion.

Oh and that's fine, I take absolutely no issue with those points. In fact, I agree with you. It's just that as a former History major with a minor in Medieval Studies, I can't sit by and not correct misconceptions like yours about full plate (which is a very common misconception, so don't feel too bad about it)...

I think the kind of Plate you are refering to cost the equivalent of high end sports car or mid range house so it wasn't all that common, time isn't the only reason there are few surviving examples.

A warrior in the kind of plate UrQuan is refering to could do cartwheels in it, but for every one suit like that there were hundreds if not thousands of ill fitting dented helms and breastplates and baggy mail shirts.

Not exactly. Those with the money to do so were able to have suits of full plate made to measure, and these suits would undoubtedly allow much greater mobility than ones not made to measure. A suit made to measure could easily cost more than a commoner's wages over several years, and for kings and princes it could even cost more than a commoner would make in a lifetime.

Having said that, full suits of plate could also be obtained much more cheaply when they weren't made to measure (pre-made suits were commonly available, or suits could be obtained second hand, or looted from battlefields). Such a suit might require some alterations to fit properly, and would never fit as well as a suit made to measure would, but it would still allow a great deal of mobility. That's the type of suit I was really talking about. You may or may not be able to do cartwheels and jump on and off a horse in such a suit (probably not - you'd likely need one of the high end sports car suits you're talking about to do those types of acrobatics), but if you were in good shape and trained you would still be able to easily run and fight on foot. These are the types of suits that thousands of men-at-arms wore on foot during the Hundred Years War and the War of the Roses. Other conflicts too, of course, those are just the ones that immediately come to mind as examples where there were large numbers of fully armoured men-at-arms on foot in many battles.

Lettigall

Yep

UrQuan wrote: »

Keron wrote: »

Still, a full plate wearer, no matter the customization and craftsmanship, will drop dead after a 100m-run. Give him 500m if he is highly trained. It's no wonder that heavily armed fighters were usually mounted or using war carriages. Every foot soldier was clad in something like "medium armor", even if that consisted of a mail shirt.

Um, no. You're very very misinformed on this. Full plate weighs less than the full combat gear of most modern soldiers (you're typically looking at roughly 50-60 lbs for full plate, vs around 90-100 lbs for typical modern infantry combat gear). On top of that, unlike mail or modern gear, the weight is relatively evenly distributed around the body, which makes it much less tiring (as long as you're used to it - if you're not then the very fact that you've got added weight on your arms and legs is going to tire you out faster). During the time period when both mail and plate were common, a man wearing plate could wear his armour for much longer than a man wearing mail before being too tired out by the weight to fight effectively, even though the mail typically weighed somewhat less.

If a 120 lb female US Army second lieutenant can run a full marathon (that's 42,195m) wearing an 85 lb bomb suit, a trained knight wearing a 60 lb suit of full plate can definitely run over 500m without dropping dead.

You also have no understanding of medieval warfare if you think that foot soldiers always wore "medium armour" during the era of full plate. Do a little research on the Hundred Years War and the War of the Roses and you'll find that battles often consisted of thousands of men-at-arms on foot in full plate, typically alongside archers and cavalry. Often the majority of the foot were in full plate, and infantry charges (which would be over distances greater than 100m) were common.

Second that! I myself have run in full equipment with around 45kg equipment and it was nothing. 100m? pff just a warm up. And medieval knight armor wasn't heavy at all 15-25kg. My backpack only with most necessary things and without additional ammo a weighted 20kg, tactical vest + body armor around 15kg, gun 3.5 kg(around weight of 2-hander).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1YEkuWYUKM

Rune_Relic

Slurg wrote: »

curlyqloub14_ESO wrote: »

...

I think the real issue is that these requests are almost always targeted at female characters. It hits on a much deeper issue - men wanting to objectify women. I know it is not the case 100% of the time, but this is really why you have so many people (a lot of whom are women) so vehemently opposed to it. Maybe it wasn't such a big deal in the past because there were less women playing games. Maybe back in the 90's that ghastly Arena cover that has been linked so many times would be ok. I wonder the ratio of male/female players in those games back then versus today. But as gaming has become more mainstream and attracted a larger female audience, there is a much larger resistance to the p*rn armor, and for good reason. Sorry guys, but this is no longer a man's world. To all those guys who keep arguing "but I play a female character and I want to [be turned on when I] look at her"...tough sh*t. There are plenty of other outlets where you can get your T & A fix - by yourself, where the rest of the world doesn't have to see it also. Unless of course you'd like to see male characters also running around in speedos and codpieces... but I don't see too many requests here for that.

If what the OP and pretty much every male in this thread who defines feminine as skin-baring is requesting comes to pass, I can't wait to create my muscular blond Nord beefcake male and put him a thong chainkini. Any skimpy costumes introduced should be equally revealing on either gender, to stay in line with the spirit of equality that I so appreciate in this game.

But I would be strongly opposed to changing any of the armor styles to show more skin. If people want to dress their characters less, costuming their own characters is the way to get there. Don't force me and other female characters to cater to the men who want to see more T and A in game by changing our armor. Practically speaking, developing a wider variety of exposure in costumes for the crown store seems like it would be quite profitable based on some of the comments in this thread.

Of course you have the right to ask for that. I don't think any male would object to that to be honest. I am sure many would have a good laugh and joke about it along the lines of the nords wearing the wedding dresses. You have just as much right to covet, desire and lust after the male physique as men do for the female physique. Go see the Chippendales or something.

I guess its how male and female view the world. To me it seems women want to be viewed for their character rather than their form and deny that form is part of their personality now days. Men dont have that hang up. If you can call it a hang up. I am sure there has been a lot of cultural history that's developed this view point.

I am a male after all so I could have this view all twisted and biased....correct me if you wish.
I have absolutely no issue with women requesting more C & A.
In fact I would positively encourage it TBH.

BUT...yes. Save the smut for the out of combat clothing. No point having a butt flap on heavy armour....practical or not.

AhPook_Is_Here

Keron wrote: »

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

I would like some good "cruising" armor for my male characters too please. Not just foofy wedding dresses, but hot leather cutoff pants, spiked leather vests and an assortment of glittery face-paint and colored hankies for rear pockets.

Red&Black right side?

Kelly green left, red right, no yellow.

I_killed_Vivec

Shunravi wrote: »

tallenn wrote: »

I_killed_Vivec wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

IrishGirlGamer wrote: »

Eliteseraph wrote: »

Don't forget these guys. They're clearly wearing armor, just with the 'Show body Armor" and 'Show Leg Armor' option checked off. xD

Um ... didn't they die? All of them?

No. 299 of them died.

Well, 298 died at Thermopylae.

One was sent as a messenger and didn't get back in time. He hanged himself.

One was sent home injured. The shame caused him to lead the charge at Platea, and be the first Spartan to die in that battle.

It didn't end well for any of the 300

Didn't it? 2500 years later, people are still talking about them. That's essentially immortality. Everyone dies, but the vast majority of us will be completely forgotten within decades.

And that's in addition to their culture, where dying in battle was a honor.

Indeed the "beautiful death".

And the monument is still there...

"Go tell the Spartans, thou who passest by,
That here, obedient to their laws, we lie"

Hardcore.

Keron

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Keron wrote: »

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

I would like some good "cruising" armor for my male characters too please. Not just foofy wedding dresses, but hot leather cutoff pants, spiked leather vests and an assortment of glittery face-paint and colored hankies for rear pockets.

Red&Black right side?

Kelly green left, red right, no yellow.

And no black at all? Shame, shame...

Islyn

Wintersage wrote: »

I would like more masculine light armor, myself. I'm tired of wearing dresses.

Wear a tunic/shirt. Fixed.

Islyn

AngryNord wrote: »

ChuckyPayne wrote: »

Skyrim Nocturnal's Clothes
http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Nocturnal's_Clothes

That looks like something out of a low-Budget *** :P

Lol you'd know xD

IrishGirlGamer

curlyqloub14_ESO wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

I'm actually one of the female players who finds the cloth armor painfully nun-like. So do I want the painted on stripes of that horrible Arena cover? Gods, no. But why can't we have a cloth robe with THIS neckline?



Why is this reserved for only Medium leather armor? And heck, how long will it be before they take that away as well?

That neckline in itself is fine by me... if, like others have said, it has reduced armor rating to go along with it. But I'm curious what armor that is - never seen any med armor that looked like that in the game.

MornaBaine wrote: »

curlyqloub14_ESO wrote: »

Eliteseraph wrote: »

Omg, I would farm motifs infinitely or shell out however many crowns necessary for armor like this. ^^ Love the way there is an obvious chest space, but it's not the ridiculous defined "cups". It looks more like the way an actual shirt looks in RL. Love the accents, the details, it's feminine, but not slutty (which is the word I think the OP was really looking for - based on the image examples he linked). Only issue I would have is with the heeled boots - fighting and running around in high heels - please no. But, I would take heels any day over slutty revealing armor.

People keep bringing up all the mods available for Skyrim as if that is some kind of valid argument for ZoS to make this slutty armor. But I think it's a rather faulty argument - those are MODS - they were not made by the maker of the game (afaik). The makers have created a game where slutty armor is not part of this world. It wasn't a part of the maker's creation in Skyrim either. People don't want slutty armor b/c it's not part of what these games are. But even moreso than that...

I think the real issue is that these requests are almost always targeted at female characters. It hits on a much deeper issue - men wanting to objectify women. I know it is not the case 100% of the time, but this is really why you have so many people (a lot of whom are women) so vehemently opposed to it. Maybe it wasn't such a big deal in the past because there were less women playing games. Maybe back in the 90's that ghastly Arena cover that has been linked so many times would be ok. I wonder the ratio of male/female players in those games back then versus today. But as gaming has become more mainstream and attracted a larger female audience, there is a much larger resistance to the p*rn armor, and for good reason. Sorry guys, but this is no longer a man's world. To all those guys who keep arguing "but I play a female character and I want to [be turned on when I] look at her"...tough sh*t. There are plenty of other outlets where you can get your T & A fix - by yourself, where the rest of the world doesn't have to see it also. Unless of course you'd like to see male characters also running around in speedos and codpieces... but I don't see too many requests here for that.

I'm actually one of the female players who finds the cloth armor painfully nun-like. So do I want the painted on stripes of that horrible Arena cover? Gods, no. But why can't we have a cloth robe with THIS neckline?



Why is this reserved for only Medium leather armor? And heck, how long will it be before they take that away as well?

This is something I wonder about, too. Modesty aside, it doesn't even really make sense. So it's like this:

Heavy armor is heavy armor. Covers all the vital organs. Gotcha.

Medium Armor is leather armor. Still should get most of the organs but leave some room for movement.

Light armor is .... clothing. Without a separate clothing class, that's all light armor is. And clothing should look like ... clothing.

But the light armor (particularly the robes) in ESO looks like was designed by someone who has never, ever worn a long dress on a humid rainy day. Apart from how hot it is, ever try to keep a long dress clean? I know there are jerkins and pants, but literally every "robe" in the game is a long, down to the feet, robe. Why? Because we're women and we like dresses?

No, no, no. It's impractical and uncomfortable. I don't think any character I've made has ever worn a robe in ESO. Imagine wearing your graduation gown to a fight! Because that would be comfortable, right?

There's a reason women wear t-shirts and jeans. There's a reason why shorter (but not shortest) skirts are comfortable for us. And there's a reason why, when we're working out, we wear sports bras. I would like a skirt and leggings (tights) outfit. I would like a more comfortable neckline for clothing. Maybe some kilts for the guys, eh?

Ironically, this attitude is catching on in the real world, too. The gym I belong to recently posted a sign in the women's locker room asking women to "wear a comfortable t-shirt over their sports bra." What??

LordSkyKnight

Iduyenn wrote: »

This is a very important topic for me too.
I would Love to have the Freedom of Choice for everyone.

I for my end like Linda solid armor. Not to fancy. The undaunted armor Helmet and shoulders: i hate the fact, that you cant transform them to imperial Style. I Even wrote a ticket about this.

When i am at my pc again i will Add some more thoughts about this stuff.

Who is that in the second picture? That looks like the Patrick Thaden cuirass that Grace Holley wore.

phreatophile

Slurg wrote: »

If what the OP and pretty much every male in this thread who defines feminine as skin-baring is requesting comes to pass, I can't wait to create my muscular blond Nord beefcake male and put him a thong chainkini. Any skimpy costumes introduced should be equally revealing on either gender, to stay in line with the spirit of equality that I so appreciate in this game.

Bring it on. I want Conan's fur briefs, Tarzan's Loincloth, Sai Sahan's getup too. I'll have a male caster in a Xivalai costume and a tiny Female bosmer dressed up in form fitting leathers and wielding a sword bigger than she is, and I'll love every minute of playing both.

It's not so much that any of us define feminine as more revealing, who am I kidding, look at woman's magazines, prom dresses, evening dresses, swimsuits, business powersuits, pretty much anything a woman wears to be noticed, the list goes on. I'm sure I've commited some sort of micro agression by saying that and the PC Overladys will be on their way to begin my re-education any minute.

Besides, showing a little (w/emphasis on little) skin is a go to strategy for most woman I've met if they are trying to look attractive. There's a reason why evening dresses are usually form fitting with a bit of skin here and there: it's attractive and the attention garnered makes the wearer feel good.

Personaly, I don't even care if there's more skin, it would be nice, provided it was kept within the bounds of good taste, take my beloved Bosmer armor for example, if I could get the higher level full coverage chest armor without the hideous retread tire parts, I'd be happy. Most of the armor gets uglier as we level up, in most cases, to the point that you'd have to look pretty closely to know there's a woman inside of all the beastly looking plate/leather/cloth.

There is a middle line between PC scolds dressing everybody in frumpy clothes and adolescents dressing their characters like they're shake'n for dollars, can we find that line instead of pretending this is about chainkinis and thongs and pasties.

dietlime

Wintersage wrote: »

I would like more masculine light armor, myself. I'm tired of wearing dresses.

They gave us shirts!

phreatophile

IrishGirlGamer wrote: »

...Maybe some kilts for the guys, eh?

Heck ya. I've had some interesting conversations wearing a Kilt out and about.

Ironically, this attitude is catching on in the real world, too. The gym I belong to recently posted a sign in the women's locker room asking women to "wear a comfortable t-shirt over their sports bra." What??

Really!?!? What?? No!!

IrishGirlGamer

phreatophile wrote: »

Ironically, this attitude is catching on in the real world, too. The gym I belong to recently posted a sign in the women's locker room asking women to "wear a comfortable t-shirt over their sports bra." What??

Really!?!? What?? No!!

I sense some sarcasm. But some sports bras cover more "area" than your basic halter top and are designed to double as an athletic top that allows comfort and freedom of motion, particularly for aerobic sports. Covering them with a t-shirt kind of defeats the purpose.

Kind of like some of the Bosmer tops.

CaptainObvious

UrQuan wrote: »

CaptainObvious wrote: »

The problem to contend with is that proper armor is not stylish

Are you trying to tell me that this isn't stylish:

Or this:

Not saying it can't be. Not saying armor I've owned or made wasn't either. If there was a pure focus on functionality then you would basically see all heavy armor types be minor variations of the pictures you linked.

Even then, things like embossing do change deflection sometimes for the worse.

Then you have the common commoner tactic of zerg ball on the armored dude, pin them and stab them in the under arm where there is 0 protection. That being said, the major point is there needs to be a suspension of reality or the world becomes minor variations of gray.

phreatophile

IrishGirlGamer wrote: »

phreatophile wrote: »

Ironically, this attitude is catching on in the real world, too. The gym I belong to recently posted a sign in the women's locker room asking women to "wear a comfortable t-shirt over their sports bra." What??

Really!?!? What?? No!!

I sense some sarcasm. But some sports bras cover more "area" than your basic halter top and are designed to double as an athletic top that allows comfort and freedom of motion, particularly for aerobic sports. Covering them with a t-shirt kind of defeats the purpose.

Kind of like some of the Bosmer tops.

No sarcasm at all. I know what a sports bra is and does, my wife has a many of them, it's a look I love on her. I also understand that covering one up with a t shirt for any reason but avoiding a light breeze is a self defeating proposition. That is completely ridiculous at a gym. It's ridiculous most everywhere else too, but the cover them all up crowd's influence is growing every year.

I shudder to think what it will be like a couple decades from now.

bellanca6561n

MornaBaine wrote: »

bellanca6561n wrote: »

curlyqloub14_ESO wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

I'm actually one of the female players who finds the cloth armor painfully nun-like. So do I want the painted on stripes of that horrible Arena cover? Gods, no. But why can't we have a cloth robe with THIS neckline?



Why is this reserved for only Medium leather armor? And heck, how long will it be before they take that away as well?

That neckline in itself is fine by me... if, like others have said, it has reduced armor rating to go along with it. But I'm curious what armor that is - never seen any med armor that looked like that in the game.

I don't think anyone answered your question. It's Bosmer, level 16-24.

Actually I did. But thanks.

Should have known, buddy

Eliteseraph

Iduyenn wrote: »

God damn that's a sexy woman right there. She was my favorite character from the Man of Steel movie.

AhPook_Is_Here

I want this, but with more glitter.

bellanca6561n

UrQuan wrote: »

Keron wrote: »

Still, a full plate wearer, no matter the customization and craftsmanship, will drop dead after a 100m-run. Give him 500m if he is highly trained. It's no wonder that heavily armed fighters were usually mounted or using war carriages. Every foot soldier was clad in something like "medium armor", even if that consisted of a mail shirt.

Um, no. You're very very misinformed on this. Full plate weighs less than the full combat gear of most modern soldiers (you're typically looking at roughly 50-60 lbs for full plate, vs around 90-100 lbs for typical modern infantry combat gear). On top of that, unlike mail or modern gear, the weight is relatively evenly distributed around the body, which makes it much less tiring (as long as you're used to it - if you're not then the very fact that you've got added weight on your arms and legs is going to tire you out faster). During the time period when both mail and plate were common, a man wearing plate could wear his armour for much longer than a man wearing mail before being too tired out by the weight to fight effectively, even though the mail typically weighed somewhat less.

If a 120 lb female US Army second lieutenant can run a full marathon (that's 42,195m) wearing an 85 lb bomb suit, a trained knight wearing a 60 lb suit of full plate can definitely run over 500m without dropping dead.

You also have no understanding of medieval warfare if you think that foot soldiers always wore "medium armour" during the era of full plate. Do a little research on the Hundred Years War and the War of the Roses and you'll find that battles often consisted of thousands of men-at-arms on foot in full plate, typically alongside archers and cavalry. Often the majority of the foot were in full plate, and infantry charges (which would be over distances greater than 100m) were common.

Me too, UrQuan....couldn't have made it through school without the middle ages. Oops, picked that up from another of your posts.

But this is a dangerous road. When War of the Roses was released - the game I mean - folks went wild about its realism.

My thought was, oh god, I hope the hell not. I mean, hours and hours of hacking and hewing, trying like mad, using those weapons, to make someone die.

It wasn't pretty or easy. Nor was the game. Imagine this, an online game where it took some work to get an opponent down. Then, for full credit, you had to ram whatever pointed weapon you had into any gap you could find in their helmet - ram right into the eye socket, yes sir!

And, as the victim, you lay there helplessly, hands raised as if pleading for mercy, as you saw the person straddling you body shove a sword into your face as the screen went black.

Oh, what a community builder that tender title was.

Do not imagine, do not entertain the notion that realism is what you want here. It was not an entertainment activity. It was gruesome, it was slow agony in most cases, and it stank.

And the vast majority of soldiers who perished died of disease.

No. Online fantasy roleplaying games are about ritual. And ritual is the enactment of a myth. Thus what we're discussing here is mythology and the imagery that either serves that mythology or detracts from it.

Slurg

Rune_Relic wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

curlyqloub14_ESO wrote: »

...

I think the real issue is that these requests are almost always targeted at female characters. It hits on a much deeper issue - men wanting to objectify women. I know it is not the case 100% of the time, but this is really why you have so many people (a lot of whom are women) so vehemently opposed to it. Maybe it wasn't such a big deal in the past because there were less women playing games. Maybe back in the 90's that ghastly Arena cover that has been linked so many times would be ok. I wonder the ratio of male/female players in those games back then versus today. But as gaming has become more mainstream and attracted a larger female audience, there is a much larger resistance to the p*rn armor, and for good reason. Sorry guys, but this is no longer a man's world. To all those guys who keep arguing "but I play a female character and I want to [be turned on when I] look at her"...tough sh*t. There are plenty of other outlets where you can get your T & A fix - by yourself, where the rest of the world doesn't have to see it also. Unless of course you'd like to see male characters also running around in speedos and codpieces... but I don't see too many requests here for that.

If what the OP and pretty much every male in this thread who defines feminine as skin-baring is requesting comes to pass, I can't wait to create my muscular blond Nord beefcake male and put him a thong chainkini. Any skimpy costumes introduced should be equally revealing on either gender, to stay in line with the spirit of equality that I so appreciate in this game.

But I would be strongly opposed to changing any of the armor styles to show more skin. If people want to dress their characters less, costuming their own characters is the way to get there. Don't force me and other female characters to cater to the men who want to see more T and A in game by changing our armor. Practically speaking, developing a wider variety of exposure in costumes for the crown store seems like it would be quite profitable based on some of the comments in this thread.

Of course you have the right to ask for that. I don't think any male would object to that to be honest. I am sure many would have a good laugh and joke about it along the lines of the nords wearing the wedding dresses. You have just as much right to covet, desire and lust after the male physique as men do for the female physique. Go see the Chippendales or something.

I guess its how male and female view the world. To me it seems women want to be viewed for their character rather than their form and deny that form is part of their personality now days. Men dont have that hang up. If you can call it a hang up. I am sure there has been a lot of cultural history that's developed this view point.

I am a male after all so I could have this view all twisted and biased....correct me if you wish.
I have absolutely no issue with women requesting more C & A.
In fact I would positively encourage it TBH.

BUT...yes. Save the smut for the out of combat clothing. No point having a butt flap on heavy armour....practical or not.

The point is more that if our characters are to be viewed as sex objects in the game, you bet I'm adding some beefcake to Tamriel for parity. All in good fun of course.

Yes there is a lot of cultural history that results in some women getting a little snippy about being told their armor in a game should be converted into a fur-kini or something equally ridiculous to look more "feminine". Many women in many cultures have always been viewed only for their form as you put it and rarely for their character at all. It's worse for attractive women. I dont think most men have had the daily experience of being judged by their looks and not their personality so I agree most men would probably not have that "hang up". So while this is just a game, it is also someplace an attractive woman can go and just be a lizard or an orc and whomp on monsters for a while and not have to worry about some *** following her around and telling her she has a nice ass.

We all come to this game with different experiences and that colors what we want in the game. And that's perfectly fine, nothing wrong with that. I would just want the sort of thing being requested by the OP to be optional costuming, not taking up an armor style, and that there be equivalent options for both genders.