[Screenshot] 50% "Experience Booster" - ZOS, can we get a confirmation or further details?

Varicite

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Flynch wrote: »

Come on guys - it's getting a bit daft now.

Anyone who bought the Imperial edition already had a much greater advantage than these pots will ever offer, and that was a year ago.

How exactly? The Ring of Mara? That was only a 10% increase, required both you and another person, that you were bound to, to be wearing it at the same time and took up a slot for any ring that would have actually been beneficial.

nicholaspingasb16_ESO wrote: »

nimander99 wrote: »

EXP boost pots are not p2w they are convenience items for people who don't have 6 hours a day to play ESO. Time can have price on it.

It's a video game, it shouldn't be designed to be as grindy and long as possible to make us buy things.

LMFAO! Is this your first MMO?

I assumed he was referencing the Imperial master race issue, which is still the case today.

eventide03b14a_ESO

Varicite wrote: »

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Flynch wrote: »

Come on guys - it's getting a bit daft now.

Anyone who bought the Imperial edition already had a much greater advantage than these pots will ever offer, and that was a year ago.

How exactly? The Ring of Mara? That was only a 10% increase, required both you and another person, that you were bound to, to be wearing it at the same time and took up a slot for any ring that would have actually been beneficial.

nicholaspingasb16_ESO wrote: »

nimander99 wrote: »

EXP boost pots are not p2w they are convenience items for people who don't have 6 hours a day to play ESO. Time can have price on it.

It's a video game, it shouldn't be designed to be as grindy and long as possible to make us buy things.

LMFAO! Is this your first MMO?

I assumed he was referencing the Imperial master race issue, which is still the case today.

All MMOs are long and grindy, but they still shouldn't be P2W. Imperials are not as OP as people claim them to be.

phreatophile

Varicite wrote: »

Honestly, I just think 50% is too much.

I don't mind if someone grinding at the same speed makes it to the end 10% faster than I do. I do care if they make it there twice as fast.

50% not 100%

There for 1.5X as fast not 2X as fast.

I'm wondering is half the rage in this thread comes from failure to understand how percentages work.

Dazin93

Sallington wrote: »

bg22 wrote: »

Bouvin wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

Screenshot from the game. Discuss.



ZOS, can we get a confirmation or further details?

Thanks in advance.

If this isn't pay to win I don't know what is.

How is this pay to win? It offers zero advantage to players other than leveling faster. It does not give you VR15, or some other stat boost, so explain...

$ = XP
XP = Champion points
Champion points = passive stat boosts
passive stat boosts = stronger toons

therefor $ = stronger toons

By your logic then, we should have never received any champion points from ZOS as those points only went to paying players and everyone that received them was a pay to win player as they received champion points because they were a paying customer.

Kova

Varicite wrote: »

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Flynch wrote: »

Come on guys - it's getting a bit daft now.

Anyone who bought the Imperial edition already had a much greater advantage than these pots will ever offer, and that was a year ago.

How exactly? The Ring of Mara? That was only a 10% increase, required both you and another person, that you were bound to, to be wearing it at the same time and took up a slot for any ring that would have actually been beneficial.

nicholaspingasb16_ESO wrote: »

nimander99 wrote: »

EXP boost pots are not p2w they are convenience items for people who don't have 6 hours a day to play ESO. Time can have price on it.

It's a video game, it shouldn't be designed to be as grindy and long as possible to make us buy things.

LMFAO! Is this your first MMO?

I assumed he was referencing the Imperial master race issue, which is still the case today.

Offers a unique set of racial skill players can only get by paying. This is literally the definition that everyone has been posting in this thread as a defense against the game being p2w.

Khaldar

PKMN12 wrote: »

Izzban wrote: »

PKMN12 wrote: »

GW2, LOL, Secret World, Planetside 2, etc they are all doing fine and have no P2W aspect to their cash shops, so yeah, your argument is complete and total BS to the extreme.

I don't know what you are trying to say. There is a laundry list of MMOs, RPGs, and various games that ARE P2W that are doing just fine. In fact, there are far more games that are P2W nowadays than those that are not (P2W being somewhat subjective) which could lead one to the conclusion that P2W games are doing BETTER than non-P2W. So what, exactly, did you prove with your list of MMOs that tow the no P2W line which invalidates Mr. Lion's point (if I may paraphrase) that XP boosts can be detrimental to, or at least cause a shift in, the current community?

Maybe you are trying to say the aforementioned games have a fine community (since it's obvious that subjective and undefined terms such as, "fine" and, "better" don't explain which aspect of the game the user wishes to define) and that is where my confusion over your post comes from. My personal experience with games has been that P2W has less of an impact on the community than the content purchase arrangement. F2P games, I have found, have by far the worst communities followed by B2P while P2P have the best.

The factor of P2W I think has an effect on the community to a lesser degree, but certainly measurable. To support this argument, I wish to refer you to 3 current MMOs with which I am familiar; NVW, DDO, and LoTRO. Each is F2P, each has P2W elements as well as Xp boosts.

Neverwinter has by far the most toxic community. It also has the highest potential for P2W with purchased Zen being easily traded for Astral Diamonds which can be used to buy various character power items, pets, and XP boosts. Gear, while some is gated behind BOD, is mostly a function of how much AD has been spent on the enchantments placed on it.

DDO has a more moderate community compared to NVW, but still far more toxic than, for instance, ESO has been. DDO is built around XP boosts as the main way to advance a character since "rerolling" and running through the content grants past lives which equate to character power. Therefore, the quicker a player can gain XP, the more power their character has. This element is tempered to a degree by gear which is random and sometimes not easily obtainable.

LoTRO has the least toxic community of the three. It has a level cap after which gear determines character power. XP boosts are available, but are not useful once max level is reached. No true character power other than the XP boosts is sold in the store.

In conclusion, XP boosts may be the least detrimental to the community of character power cash shop offers, but this is not to say that they do not have an effect on the community. This is something that everyone who plays should be concerned with.


TLDR: I believe XP boosts bring a deleterious element to any community, though other factors can play a much larger role.

yeah, and all of those P2W MMOS are considered a joke by any self-respecting gamer.

What is a self-respecting gamer? Someone that sits at the computer 8 hours a day eating pizza and drinking a case of Pepsi?

LOL... I'm really struggling to understand this concept.

Yes... People like me are the bane of MMOs once they enter P2W areas, because we are the whales. But the only way you catch a whale is by giving them something worth eating. +50% XP or 1.5 CP versus 1 CP for 1-3 hours of gaming is not incentive enough for me to drop $1000s in an MMO. Sorry. This is just a reason for everyone on these boards who needs face time to whine. It's really not that incentivizing in my opinion.

Make it 100% or 200% and I might think about blowing a wad of cash... But then again for what? CP? What is that good for? PvP? Trials? LOL... Again its not good for much because the whales still have to grind. And most whales have demanding careers that give them all this pocket change to blow on P2W games. Whales are not usually powergamers. Believe me I know quite a few whales (CEOs, Surgeons, lawyers, etc, etc) from being top 10 in GoW on two different maps. I'm not trying to be mean, but people here are crying just to cry.

ItsGlaive

bchulettub17_ESO wrote: »

Just throwing ideas out there, what are people's thoughts on an XP pot that gives 50% normal XP & 10% CP XP/2 hours?

That way it would be on par with ESO Plus members? Even if someone were to have it 24/7 the most they could really do is level alts quickly (which may or may not result in more CP gain with the current state of PvE xp, again just an idea) and ask themselves why not pay for ESO Plus. I don't see how that could be a terrible scenario for ZOS, we get 1500 crowns/mo, and if they were to release a 2500 crown mount every month that would still entice ESO Plus members to buy things from the Crown Store.

It's not that I'm 100% for whats in the screen shot, or 100% against, especially with lack of clarification, I just think ZOS is not going to give this up as lightly as the crown store pots they just pulled. The only thing they've really confirmed is that there will be XP pots introduced, and they will be available in the Crown Store (originally in-game was mentioned).

Therefore I really don't think that if they are going to listen to these concerns, that they will pick "No" or "Yes" to XP pots outright. There really has to be a median ground of some sort that should be pushed for rather than screaming "No!", as much as I get the frustration behind ESO possibly becoming a P2W scenario.

It'd be a step in the right direction, but ultimately the most acceptable solution is for them to be commonly craftable in game. IE like health pots, you can find them readily and buy them with in game gold. As was originally meant to happen with all "convenience" items on the store.

Mystikkal

Audigy wrote: »

EQBallzz wrote: »

mcurley wrote: »

Well since there is so much hate about these potions I have to say that I LOVE the idea. Thank you ZOS for potentially an awesome convenience item!

Most of the complainers (who make up a very small percentage of the games population btw) already have the opportunity to play this game much much more than the vast majority of the games population who have families and jobs irl.

As an ex-hardcore gamer I can understand why you are pissed, but your reasoning is irrelevant to the much larger casual player base and hopefully to ZOS as well. How your arguement breaks down is something like this:

The people making up the v14 community are probably around 1% of the games player base. Of those 1%, lets say half use the potions and half do not. So 0.5% of the player base thinks it's unfair that 0.5% will have more CP than they do in the long run. Do you see how trivial this sounds from a buisness standpoint?

TLDR: Most of the people using these pots will be doing so to get to v14 faster, not to grind CP.

So you love the idea that ZOS nerfs current XP gains into the ground and then introduces XP potions for cash when they clearly said numerous times that TU would be the same game as before and the 10% boost to XP would be on top of the existing game structure? That was total lie. Everyone knows that XP has been nerfed into the ground and now we are supposed to pay cash to get it back? You must be some kind of masochist to love being taken advantage of like this.

Also, if you think people aren't going to use these pots to grind CP and put you even farther behind than you are now then I have a bridge for sale you might be interested in.

You don't understand what p2w is.

P2W is a term used to describe if someone is able to gain something, that the other player can not have unless he also pays real money.. If you have bank or char slots like at GW2, SWTOR then this is a p2w situation, as someone not investing money can not have these.

If someone now buys a potion at ESO or grinds mobs, then he is maybe morally a "nuisance", maybe he is even playing the game wrong, but its nothing you cant do yourself. XP is not limited to paying real money, you will level just fine without paying, its only slower.

I hope I could be of assistance, helping you to understand what P2W in online gaming is.

Sorry, but I disagree. P2W means using real money to help you win (i.e. give you a competitive advantage over someone else). Just because something is available in game, doesn't mean that it isn't P2W. P2W means paying to win - Given the length of time it takes to get to max CP, these potions are P2W because you aren't going to get to max CP [any time in the near furture] whether you use the potions or not. So the potions are giving you a significant advantage over someone not using the potions.

Selling progress is P2W when the progression is not easily obtainable. In this instance, the final progression is near impossible (and is impossible in the near future). The form of progression is irrelevant. If they introduced the best gear as an exclusive crown store item, what would ppl say? P2W obviously. What is the difference here? There really is no gear progression anymore. Progression is measured by CPs. They are selling progression, which is P2W.

My suggestion would be to tone down from 50% and make them last longer (e.g. a whole week). People could handle paying $5 for a weeks worth of 20% more XP.

Look they need to make money somehow.. and people are only going to buy so many new cosmetic pieces (and they will only make so much of DLC). So I'm OK with the concept, but it needs to be dialed back. Actually the whole CP system needs to be dialed back. There isgoing to be too large of power gaps within a few weeks.

prototypefb

Akselmo wrote: »

I don't see any problem with this, since exp boosts aren't pay 2 win.

Or does reaching VR 14 and having all the champion points before some other guy count as winning? Give me a break.

while not being p2w item, it still gives too much IF it is only available in crown shop.

Gyudan

I'd like to buy a potion for instant VR14, all achievements and 3600 CPs. After all, this would just be convenience.
@ZOS_GinaBruno, can we agree on 200$ ?

angel59

Varicite wrote: »

angel59 wrote: »

PKMN12 wrote: »

yup, and those same people who are playing much more than you are ALSO using those potions, keeping the gap not only intact, but increasing the gap because not every players wants to spend money on a game calling itself B2P

So what is your point? They will hit a wall then come back to the forum whining about the lack of hard content. Meanwhile, most of us will continue paying and plugging our way to cap. My ego does not deflate because someone gets ahead of me in a video game. If that were so, I would have been long gone after the exploiters zoomed to max level.

No, the only problem I see in this thread are people being afraid that someone gets xp by not doing exactly what you do. So what happens if someone has more cp than you? Where is the issue? What do we win?

I do hope they put this exp potion in. It will help me keep up with the majority. I dont realky care about the race to end crowd.

Your post seems all over the place. You don't care about getting to the end, but you need to get there faster. You call people who did it faster than you "exploiters", but if you're doing it faster than others, that's totally cool.

As to "what happens if someone has more cp than you?", every competitive arena of this game is based on performance. Trials has leaderboards. PvP has leaderboards and Emperorship. More CP gives you a huge advantage when trying to make it onto those leaderboards, that's simple fact.

PS) Console players will not be playing w/ PC players. So no, console players will not need to use these to "catch up" to anyone, they are all starting fresh.

I apparently was not clear enough, or you cannot understand. Getting to the end and getting there faster are mutually exclusive. As I said, I will work towards cap. However, I would like to get there in 10 years, rather than 15, hence the appreciaton for an exp potion.

I understand the need of competitiveness. Maybe I just dont see the obsession for winning (whatever that is in an MMO) that some have in the game. Someone has more power than you. So what. There will always be someone with more and someone with less.

I often wonder how many people, out of the whole population, even have a desire to try for the top? I can guarantee you that not everybody does. Then there is the small number who will do anything to get there as fast as possible, including the use of exploits and any other method to get an edge. The rest just want to play a game that is entertaining, and sometimes social. It is not as black and white as some make it out to be.

DDuke

Khaldar wrote: »

What is a self-respecting gamer? Someone that sits at the computer 8 hours a day eating pizza and drinking a case of Pepsi?

LOL... I'm really struggling to understand this concept.
-snip-

Clearly, as you have that kind of stereotypes.

How is devoting your life to being good at video games any different than devoting your life to football in order to play at the high leagues?

Can you imagine the outrage, if some baddie team won by tipping off the referee every match?

It's no different here. A competitive environment, and you are begging for cheats because you can't win otherwise. You should feel ashamed.

Khaldar

DDuke wrote: »

Khaldar wrote: »

What is a self-respecting gamer? Someone that sits at the computer 8 hours a day eating pizza and drinking a case of Pepsi?

LOL... I'm really struggling to understand this concept.
-snip-

Clearly, as you have that kind of stereotypes.

How is devoting your life to being good at video games any different than devoting your life to football in order to play at the high leagues?

Can you imagine the outrage, if some baddie team won by tipping off the referee every match?

It's no different here. A competitive environment, and you are begging for cheats because you can't win otherwise. You should feel ashamed.

I'm not trying to win at this MMO... lmao... I value tangible assets.

EDIT: And ESO isn't Madden Football. There is no trophy or cash prize for finishing first in a trial or pvp. Just an e-peen stroke and more pixels.

PKMN12

Let me put it to you guys another way. Saying this kind of thing is ok is EXACTLY like saying it is ok for a sports team to pay off the referee so they have an advantage in tournament.

c0rp

A lot of people in this thread are math defunct. If one person was going to normally earn 1 CP in a 2 hour time, a 50% XP pot earns him 1.5 CP in that time frame (not 2 or 4 or w/e number people are spouting out). Big frikin deal, grow up people. Boosters are not p2w, and the only people who think they are have never played a real p2w game.

And LOL at these folks who want the XP pots to be 10%...you guys need to wake up and realize that zos needs to actually SELL these pots, not have them sit in the store forever (which is what will happen if they are 10%) 50% booster is fine, and will bring income to zos. More income is more shiny things for you. Everyone wins, and without the need to sell armor and weapons. Be happy.

It was also mentioned, that these pots will most likely be offered IN GAME for gold too...

angel59

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

angel59 wrote: »

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

I don't care if someone get's ahead because of hard work and dedication. I do take exception to someone who is more powerful simply because they spent more money. Do you honestly not see the distinction?

The distinction you refer to is called fear, or possibly envy. You dont want someone to catch up to you or overcome you unless they spend the exact same amount of time doing exactly what you do. And it has to be exact. Point me to this mythical person who is at exactly the same place as you, doing exactly what you did. It will not happen.

People progress at different rates for multiple reasons. The exp potion is not pay to win because someone gets more cp by not doing it "your" way. They are on the same journey to end cap as you. I dont have time to play that much. Why do you insist that I have to spend the same time as you to get the benefits? It all boils down to "my way or the highway".

What a compelling argument. Seriously though, try again.

liquid_wolf wrote: »

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Glass house my friend. Where is all of your empirical evidence to the contrary? Just because you want to pay for your CP doesn't mean it's a good idea.

You are playing the "Prove X Doesn't Exist" card?

Come on... this is the business world. If you have a legitimate concern, and have the evidence to support it, then prove the company should spend the time and energy trying to fix it.

Right now, no one here has any evidence this will be a problem. At the very least, I want to wait and see what the prices are. As my previous posts stated... at even $2 they don't prove to have any real value except to the most elite and richest of players.

$5 for a bundle of 10? Maybe... if someone knows where to spend them to get the greatest bang for their buck. A free player using this might be put on par with a Subscribers constant 10% every time he chugs a potion. But assuming both players play 60 hours a month, I still think the subscriber gets more of a benefit with their constant 10%. That person doesn't really have to worry about making sure they get the most out of every 2 hours... Less stress.

But until we see the numbers, this is just... fear. 10 pages of fear that I'm certain ZOS has taken into consideration at this point.

No, that's what you are doing. If you payed attention to what the dissenters are saying you would see that we have many several attempts to explain in no uncertain terms how this has effected other MMOs. Nobody says they need to spend any time or energy, just don't include it. Simple. This is a game folks it's meant to be played. If you wanted a game that requires you spend money to advance just play Candy Crush.

Resorting to insults does not make an argument. Sorry. An intelligent rebuttal does.You are afraid that people will get a head of you. That is it.

The dissenters are concerned that the game will change from what they want it to be. It wont reflect your desires 100%, so it is a bad change. That is the only thing I see in this thread.

In summary, I had to spend so much time to get where I am at, everyone else has to do the same or it is not legit and theeefore should not be allowed.

Dazin93

DDuke wrote: »

Khaldar wrote: »

What is a self-respecting gamer? Someone that sits at the computer 8 hours a day eating pizza and drinking a case of Pepsi?

LOL... I'm really struggling to understand this concept.
-snip-

Clearly, as you have that kind of stereotypes.

How is devoting your life to being good at video games any different than devoting your life to football in order to play at the high leagues?

Can you imagine the outrage, if some baddie team won by tipping off the referee every match?

It's no different here. A competitive environment, and you are begging for cheats because you can't win otherwise. You should feel ashamed.

Your analogy is completely off. Sports often are pay to win, case in point the Yankees. The only thing that is shameful here is the sense of entitlement some people have just because they possibly put more hours/effort into a video game. I bet half or more also took advantage of exploitative grinding spots in Craglorn or elsewhere that are no longer available to players, yet still aren't content.

Khaldar

PKMN12 wrote: »

Let me put it to you guys another way. Saying this kind of thing is ok is EXACTLY like saying it is ok for a sports team to pay off the referee so they have an advantage in tournament.

No it is not. Because sports can be bet on. Vegas makes a lot of money on sports betting and fantasy leagues where winning and losing swings the pendulum by millions of dollars. This is about pixels. There is no cash reward for winning ESO.

ItsGlaive

c0rp wrote: »

A lot of people in this thread are math defunct. If one person was going to normally earn 1 CP in a 2 hour time, a 50% XP pot earns him 1.5 CP in that hour (not 2 or 4 or w/e number people are spouting out). Big frikin deal, grow up people. Boosters are not p2w, and the only people who think they are have never played a real p2w game.

And LOL at these folks who want the XP pots to be 10%...you guys need to wake up and realize that zos needs to actually SELL these pots, not have them sit in the store forever (which is what will happen if they are 10%) 50% booster is fine, and will bring income to zos. More income is more shiny things for you. Everyone wins, and without the need to sell armor and weapons. Be happy.

It was also mentioned, that these pots will most likely be offered IN GAME for gold too...

Okay so based on your numbers:

Time - Normal - Potion
2hr - 1cp - 1.5cp
4hr - 2cp - 3cp
6hr - 3cp - 4.5cp
8hr - 4cp - 6cp
10hr - 5cp - 7.5cp

And of course the gap continues to widen from there...

They need to be readily available in game for gold, affordable prices like health or magicka pots. No super secret ingredient that jacks the price up to 500g a pot. Although even then this is a very slippery slope and we've reached it much faster than I'd anticipated.

PKMN12

Khaldar wrote: »

PKMN12 wrote: »

Let me put it to you guys another way. Saying this kind of thing is ok is EXACTLY like saying it is ok for a sports team to pay off the referee so they have an advantage in tournament.

No it is not. Because sports can be bet on. Vegas makes a lot of money on sports betting and fantasy leagues where winning and losing swings the pendulum by millions of dollars. This is about pixels. There is no cash reward for winning.

LOL, StarCraft, Pokemon all say differently.......

eventide03b14a_ESO

phreatophile wrote: »

Varicite wrote: »

Honestly, I just think 50% is too much.

I don't mind if someone grinding at the same speed makes it to the end 10% faster than I do. I do care if they make it there twice as fast.

50% not 100%

There for 1.5X as fast not 2X as fast.

I'm wondering is half the rage in this thread comes from failure to understand how percentages work.

Maybe some people don't, but 50% is still too large. Anything more than a 10% increase is too much and only if there is a significant cool down on it.

Dazin93 wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

bg22 wrote: »

Bouvin wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

Screenshot from the game. Discuss.



ZOS, can we get a confirmation or further details?

Thanks in advance.

If this isn't pay to win I don't know what is.

How is this pay to win? It offers zero advantage to players other than leveling faster. It does not give you VR15, or some other stat boost, so explain...

$ = XP
XP = Champion points
Champion points = passive stat boosts
passive stat boosts = stronger toons

therefor $ = stronger toons

By your logic then, we should have never received any champion points from ZOS as those points only went to paying players and everyone that received them was a pay to win player as they received champion points because they were a paying customer.

No...We did the work for those CPs. Remember "we will track your XP" and the outrage when they decided they were not? That's because we did the work. Why is this so difficult to understand? It's really a very basic concept.

c0rp wrote: »

A lot of people in this thread are math defunct. If one person was going to normally earn 1 CP in a 2 hour time, a 50% XP pot earns him 1.5 CP in that hour (not 2 or 4 or w/e number people are spouting out). Big frikin deal, grow up people. Boosters are not p2w, and the only people who think they are have never played a real p2w game.

And LOL at these folks who want the XP pots to be 10%...you guys need to wake up and realize that zos needs to actually SELL these pots, not have them sit in the store forever (which is what will happen if they are 10%) 50% booster is fine, and will bring income to zos. More income is more shiny things for you. Everyone wins, and without the need to sell armor and weapons. Be happy.

It was also mentioned, that these pots will most likely be offered IN GAME for gold too...

Oh no! Digital inventory! Give me a break. They are not "sitting" anywhere. It's a completely intangible item.

Khaldar

PKMN12 wrote: »

Khaldar wrote: »

PKMN12 wrote: »

Let me put it to you guys another way. Saying this kind of thing is ok is EXACTLY like saying it is ok for a sports team to pay off the referee so they have an advantage in tournament.

No it is not. Because sports can be bet on. Vegas makes a lot of money on sports betting and fantasy leagues where winning and losing swings the pendulum by millions of dollars. This is about pixels. There is no cash reward for winning.

LOL, StarCraft, Pokemon all say differently.......

You are not talking about ESO... ESO is not in the same genre of competition as those games. And those games like Madden are competition based. While ESO is not.

Sallington

Dazin93 wrote: »

Sallington wrote: »

bg22 wrote: »

Bouvin wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

Screenshot from the game. Discuss.



ZOS, can we get a confirmation or further details?

Thanks in advance.

If this isn't pay to win I don't know what is.

How is this pay to win? It offers zero advantage to players other than leveling faster. It does not give you VR15, or some other stat boost, so explain...

$ = XP
XP = Champion points
Champion points = passive stat boosts
passive stat boosts = stronger toons

therefor $ = stronger toons

By your logic then, we should have never received any champion points from ZOS as those points only went to paying players and everyone that received them was a pay to win player as they received champion points because they were a paying customer.

They gave us champion points for all of the time we spent on our toons past VR1, the same exact way it works now.

Your post makes no sense.

DDuke

Dazin93 wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Khaldar wrote: »

What is a self-respecting gamer? Someone that sits at the computer 8 hours a day eating pizza and drinking a case of Pepsi?

LOL... I'm really struggling to understand this concept.
-snip-

Clearly, as you have that kind of stereotypes.

How is devoting your life to being good at video games any different than devoting your life to football in order to play at the high leagues?

Can you imagine the outrage, if some baddie team won by tipping off the referee every match?

It's no different here. A competitive environment, and you are begging for cheats because you can't win otherwise. You should feel ashamed.

Your analogy is completely off. Sports often are pay to win, case in point the Yankees. The only thing that is shameful here is the sense of entitlement some people have just because they possibly put more hours/effort into a video game. I bet half or more also took advantage of exploitative grinding spots in Craglorn or elsewhere that are no longer available to players, yet still aren't content.

I don't watch American football, so can't comment on that. But usually paying to win a game is not considered ethical, or even legal in most cases.

I've had this argument before, so before you say "oh, but they have to pay to get the best players, so it's P2W derp derp".

1) On an individual level, you don't pay to be in a good team, it's the other way around. You don't pay to be good at what you do either.
2) You can actually expect a return on your investment if you purchase the right players. Most sports aren't non-profit.


Also, there is no entitlement in what I say. I'm not saying those who play the most should win, I'm saying those who are the most skilled should win (if this comes through a lot of practice, then so be it, if it is natural talent, then so be it).

The fact that the Champion System is as it is, an infinite grind, is an unfortunate byproduct of them wanting to extort players with XP Boosters.

Khaldar

Xabien wrote: »

c0rp wrote: »

A lot of people in this thread are math defunct. If one person was going to normally earn 1 CP in a 2 hour time, a 50% XP pot earns him 1.5 CP in that hour (not 2 or 4 or w/e number people are spouting out). Big frikin deal, grow up people. Boosters are not p2w, and the only people who think they are have never played a real p2w game.

And LOL at these folks who want the XP pots to be 10%...you guys need to wake up and realize that zos needs to actually SELL these pots, not have them sit in the store forever (which is what will happen if they are 10%) 50% booster is fine, and will bring income to zos. More income is more shiny things for you. Everyone wins, and without the need to sell armor and weapons. Be happy.

It was also mentioned, that these pots will most likely be offered IN GAME for gold too...

Okay so based on your numbers:

Time - Normal - Potion
2hr - 1cp - 1.5cp
4hr - 2cp - 3cp
6hr - 3cp - 4.5cp
8hr - 4cp - 6cp
10hr - 5cp - 7.5cp

And of course the gap continues to widen from there...

They need to be readily available in game for gold, affordable prices like health or magicka pots. No super secret ingredient that jacks the price up to 500g a pot. Although even then this is a very slippery slope and we've reached it much faster than I'd anticipated.

Yeah, but whatever everyone fails to realize is that a true "Whale" doesn't have 10 hours to grind a video game 7 days a week. While powergamers who are not typically spending money in cash shops are playing 60-80+ hours a week.

c0rp

Xabien wrote: »

c0rp wrote: »

A lot of people in this thread are math defunct. If one person was going to normally earn 1 CP in a 2 hour time, a 50% XP pot earns him 1.5 CP in that hour (not 2 or 4 or w/e number people are spouting out). Big frikin deal, grow up people. Boosters are not p2w, and the only people who think they are have never played a real p2w game.

And LOL at these folks who want the XP pots to be 10%...you guys need to wake up and realize that zos needs to actually SELL these pots, not have them sit in the store forever (which is what will happen if they are 10%) 50% booster is fine, and will bring income to zos. More income is more shiny things for you. Everyone wins, and without the need to sell armor and weapons. Be happy.

It was also mentioned, that these pots will most likely be offered IN GAME for gold too...

Okay so based on your numbers:

Time - Normal - Potion
2hr - 1cp - 1.5cp
4hr - 2cp - 3cp
6hr - 3cp - 4.5cp
8hr - 4cp - 6cp
10hr - 5cp - 7.5cp

And of course the gap continues to widen from there...

They need to be readily available in game for gold, affordable prices like health or magicka pots. No super secret ingredient that jacks the price up to 500g a pot. Although even then this is a very slippery slope and we've reached it much faster than I'd anticipated.

Yeah..in a system with 3600 points and DR. Its insignificant with DR. A player with a 1000 CP does not have a giant gap of separation over someone with 500. If we had a 500 point system with no DR then maybe you could complain..maybe.

The game needs XP boosters because its income for ZoS and because anything that makes leveling an alt in this horrendous VR grind faster is welcome.

PKMN12

Khaldar wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

c0rp wrote: »

A lot of people in this thread are math defunct. If one person was going to normally earn 1 CP in a 2 hour time, a 50% XP pot earns him 1.5 CP in that hour (not 2 or 4 or w/e number people are spouting out). Big frikin deal, grow up people. Boosters are not p2w, and the only people who think they are have never played a real p2w game.

And LOL at these folks who want the XP pots to be 10%...you guys need to wake up and realize that zos needs to actually SELL these pots, not have them sit in the store forever (which is what will happen if they are 10%) 50% booster is fine, and will bring income to zos. More income is more shiny things for you. Everyone wins, and without the need to sell armor and weapons. Be happy.

It was also mentioned, that these pots will most likely be offered IN GAME for gold too...

Okay so based on your numbers:

Time - Normal - Potion
2hr - 1cp - 1.5cp
4hr - 2cp - 3cp
6hr - 3cp - 4.5cp
8hr - 4cp - 6cp
10hr - 5cp - 7.5cp

And of course the gap continues to widen from there...

They need to be readily available in game for gold, affordable prices like health or magicka pots. No super secret ingredient that jacks the price up to 500g a pot. Although even then this is a very slippery slope and we've reached it much faster than I'd anticipated.

Yeah, but whatever everyone fails to realize is that a true "Whale" doesn't have 10 hours to grind a video game 7 days a week. While powergamers who are not typically spending money in cash shops are playing 60-80+ hours a week.

um, no, not true at all, those same powergamers ARE likely going to pay money if it helps them get an even bigger advantage....you do not play MMOs at ALL do you?

Khaldar

PKMN12 wrote: »

Khaldar wrote: »

Xabien wrote: »

c0rp wrote: »

A lot of people in this thread are math defunct. If one person was going to normally earn 1 CP in a 2 hour time, a 50% XP pot earns him 1.5 CP in that hour (not 2 or 4 or w/e number people are spouting out). Big frikin deal, grow up people. Boosters are not p2w, and the only people who think they are have never played a real p2w game.

And LOL at these folks who want the XP pots to be 10%...you guys need to wake up and realize that zos needs to actually SELL these pots, not have them sit in the store forever (which is what will happen if they are 10%) 50% booster is fine, and will bring income to zos. More income is more shiny things for you. Everyone wins, and without the need to sell armor and weapons. Be happy.

It was also mentioned, that these pots will most likely be offered IN GAME for gold too...

Okay so based on your numbers:

Time - Normal - Potion
2hr - 1cp - 1.5cp
4hr - 2cp - 3cp
6hr - 3cp - 4.5cp
8hr - 4cp - 6cp
10hr - 5cp - 7.5cp

And of course the gap continues to widen from there...

They need to be readily available in game for gold, affordable prices like health or magicka pots. No super secret ingredient that jacks the price up to 500g a pot. Although even then this is a very slippery slope and we've reached it much faster than I'd anticipated.

Yeah, but whatever everyone fails to realize is that a true "Whale" doesn't have 10 hours to grind a video game 7 days a week. While powergamers who are not typically spending money in cash shops are playing 60-80+ hours a week.

um, no, not true at all, those same powergamers ARE likely going to pay money if it helps them get an even bigger advantage....you do not play MMOs at ALL do you?

I have spent $10,000s on P2W games and played MMOs since UO. So I'm not sure you know the mindset of a "whale."

And ESO is not a competitive game. There is no winning!

Attorneyatlawl

Dazin93 wrote: »

Statements like " it should only be about skill" are always bandied about and the fact is it is always about skill, especially in PvP. Grinding PvE mobs for hours on end isn't a reflection of skill and neither is your gear or amount of CP's. True skill will always win out when the rubber meets the road.

Other than destroying the game's integrity as a hobbyist match of skill, that is patently false. Two people of equal skill collide, one guy has 1500 champ points and the other has 1000 because he didn't pay up. The 1500 guy factually and objectively has the statistical edge.

Empty_Emotions

As long as it isn't a store exclusive, that is fine.. maybe make them have a possibility of dropping from Alchemist writs, perhaps the ability to craft them with rare alchemy ingredients, finds in chests/containers, and available for AP. This way it truly is a convenience item as there would be multiple in-game ways to obtain them.

That'd be kinda cool...