How Long Does it Take You to Get a Champion Point?

Joejudas

So yes i think the 400k/1 cp point thing is way to high and it takes way too long. For those of us who have high level vr toons who got nerfed armor and stats on 1.6 pts its important that we be able to gain our power back by using the champion system. Alot of us have done all the end game content there is to do and would prefer not to be forced into pvp. If we dont have a way that gain cp points at a decent rate instead of it taking years like is proposed right now....then i feel like your punishing the high level characters by taking away progression we have now and forcing us into a system that doesnt reward for putting long hours into the game.

Jando

helediron wrote: »

The direct comparison of all CP points to VR14 by @geoffreyb14_ESO‌ is plain wrong. With such speed the whole system is exhausted in a month.

Well, if you think the current VR progression system is too short, then you are right.

If you actually read my proposal, you'd realize that I suggest that they essentially break the current VR progression down into 1000 little pieces, doled out every13k xp. Compare that to the current Champion system on the PTS that breaks it down into 3600 increments doled out every 400,000 xp.

Simply put, completion of my proposal would be on par with the current VR progression and it makes each point more valuable. The version of Champion System currently on PTS stretches it out over the equivalent of over 1400 veteran ranks and necessarily makes each point meaningless.

If you think the current VR system feels grindy now, just wait. Unless they make a change, it's about to get a lot worse.

Do you really want to "grind" for 2+ hours only to be rewarded with a Champion point that gives you .2 % bonus to health? Really?

Joejudas

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

prototypefb wrote: »

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

a

prototypefb wrote: »

Can any1 test how long it takes currently on PTS to earn 1 CP while you do RP, or craft gear?
Why is XP only viable way to earn CP?
There is no balance, fix it, please, ZOS
you wonder how? there you go, check option 3, you're welcome!

Why do you need a MMO to RP in the first place?
Especially one that has so few RP elements as ESO.


There is a huge difference between RP and RPG that some don't seem to get.
The "G" - it stands for "game".
A game is defined to be "a form of competitive activity (...) played according to rules".
-> definition
Rules, those a the things that restrict you in whatever way the game designer wants.
Every game revolves around it's rules. Actually those rules are where the fun comes from.
Imagine chess if I could play like this on my first move: "See this pawn? He's an assassine and kills your king just like that. Checkmate."
Or imagine chess in a "fair" world, where every piece is a king.
Ether of those two would make playing the game pointless, because as I said:
games need rules.


I perfectly understand that sometimes you don't want to follow any rules.
But then tell my, why do you want to play a game with it's given rules at the same time?
There are plenty of other platforms, like forums, chats and virtual worlds (second life). Where you are free to do what ever you feel like.

ESO is already different mmo(for good or bad, up to you to decide) i believe this CP system will force too much grind(commonly known mmo feature) in the game and instead pigeonhole and bore the crap out of people while doing it.
System should be open not forced.

The question should be: "Am I really forced that much?"

This whole to me it seems as most people dislike the CP because they are in this "OMG I got to grind 3600 CP to be competitive"-kind of mindset.
Which I think could be considered BS.

What follows is my thoughts about the CP-system, I do not claim this to be correct.
With 30 points per constellation and you already have most of the gain that comes with the CP. Also at 30 points in one star you are at 7.5% of 15% max. (if I'm not mistaken)

Depending on role and play-style there is a priority star/constellation (each color) where one should dump their first 30 points. Like my NB surely wants her first 30 blue points put into ritual in order to be an acceptable damage dealer.
Those first 90 points to me feel like the "must have" that replaces the VR. But after that all points are more or less nice to have.

Sure things like +15% weapon damage from the atronach sounds good, but it only applies on light/heavy attacks which do like maybe 5% of my DPS (estimated value). Now +0,75% don't sound that good anymore.

Back to the first 90 points:
Those are the ones that you "need" to be competitive.
For someone who is VR14 now that means 20 additional points, which should be possible to achieve within a week.
For a casual player who might not even be V1 this still is less way to go than Veteran Ranks were since there is this enlightenment buff. With the buff you need only 9 million XP whereas you need 13 million XP to reach VR14.

Again, is just as I see things at the very moment. This might be proven correct or wrong within the next few months.

first of all its 70 points for a vr14 not 90....and those 20 you need require you to go around the wheel three time each...so its an extra 60 points you need to gain 20 for a single area. At 1 cp every 3 or 4 hours...if you played the whole 7 day week without leaving your pc for any reason you would still only get around 45 points. So i would disagree with your statement

NukeAllTheThings

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

prototypefb wrote: »

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

a

prototypefb wrote: »

Can any1 test how long it takes currently on PTS to earn 1 CP while you do RP, or craft gear?
Why is XP only viable way to earn CP?
There is no balance, fix it, please, ZOS
you wonder how? there you go, check option 3, you're welcome!

Why do you need a MMO to RP in the first place?
Especially one that has so few RP elements as ESO.


There is a huge difference between RP and RPG that some don't seem to get.
The "G" - it stands for "game".
A game is defined to be "a form of competitive activity (...) played according to rules".
-> definition
Rules, those a the things that restrict you in whatever way the game designer wants.
Every game revolves around it's rules. Actually those rules are where the fun comes from.
Imagine chess if I could play like this on my first move: "See this pawn? He's an assassine and kills your king just like that. Checkmate."
Or imagine chess in a "fair" world, where every piece is a king.
Ether of those two would make playing the game pointless, because as I said:
games need rules.


I perfectly understand that sometimes you don't want to follow any rules.
But then tell my, why do you want to play a game with it's given rules at the same time?
There are plenty of other platforms, like forums, chats and virtual worlds (second life). Where you are free to do what ever you feel like.

ESO is already different mmo(for good or bad, up to you to decide) i believe this CP system will force too much grind(commonly known mmo feature) in the game and instead pigeonhole and bore the crap out of people while doing it.
System should be open not forced.

The question should be: "Am I really forced that much?"

This whole to me it seems as most people dislike the CP because they are in this "OMG I got to grind 3600 CP to be competitive"-kind of mindset.
Which I think could be considered BS.

What follows is my thoughts about the CP-system, I do not claim this to be correct.
With 30 points per constellation and you already have most of the gain that comes with the CP. Also at 30 points in one star you are at 7.5% of 15% max. (if I'm not mistaken)

Depending on role and play-style there is a priority star/constellation (each color) where one should dump their first 30 points. Like my NB surely wants her first 30 blue points put into ritual in order to be an acceptable damage dealer.
Those first 90 points to me feel like the "must have" that replaces the VR. But after that all points are more or less nice to have.

Sure things like +15% weapon damage from the atronach sounds good, but it only applies on light/heavy attacks which do like maybe 5% of my DPS (estimated value). Now +0,75% don't sound that good anymore.

Back to the first 90 points:
Those are the ones that you "need" to be competitive.
For someone who is VR14 now that means 20 additional points, which should be possible to achieve within a week.
For a casual player who might not even be V1 this still is less way to go than Veteran Ranks were since there is this enlightenment buff. With the buff you need only 9 million XP whereas you need 13 million XP to reach VR14.

Again, is just as I see things at the very moment. This might be proven correct or wrong within the next few months.

Those first 90 points are definitely "must have" because they finally get us VR14's (actually VR15) in the ballpark of where we currently stand on 1.5. In reality it will probably take 120-160 CP to get back to where we are.

Now, that wouldn't be a problem if ZOS stayed with their declaration they would still be tracking XP and it would convert into equivalent CP. Instead we have all been gutted and forced to re-earn the power we gained. And we are forced to do it with no new content so we have to keep grinding crap we have already done and we have to do it at 400k CP per clip which might be 1 hour of work or it could very well be 4-5 hours.

Berinima

I am aware that this is totally impossible but it's just a thought experiment. I think if they gave us a choice to pick between two servers, one with patch 1.6 and one with 1.5 plus the justice system... I am totally sure the one with 1.6 would be a ghost town in a couple of days.

ZOS, just delete 1.6... It's not even anywhere close to good.

Rev Rielle

Well I for one like the system, and think most of you are thinking far too short-term. It's supposed to be something that provides us some continual progression over a long period of time, not something to be grinded to max in a month or two.

The CP system is not 'the game', it's a background thing that ticks away whilst you play the actual game. Everyone in their insatiable rush to be the best, get to the 'max' or what-have-you, seems to forget that simple fact.

People keep talking like there's nothing to do to get CP's. Have you not read about what new content ZOS plans to release and work on over the next year? And do you think they will stop releasing content in two years time? In three, four? No, of course they won't. CP is not new content, it's a tweak to the mechanics that will hopefully provide us players with a meaningful, consistent and prolonged return for character development for years to come whilst new content is added. No one's expecting you to acquire the maximum amount of CP in the game in it's current state, ZOS has said as much plainly in previous ESO Lives broadcasts as well through other mediums of release.

The problem players have is that they are looking short term and selfishly and for some reasons refusing to realise what the CP system actually is for. It is not content, it's a mechanical change that provides the framework to build the game for years to come.

The same players that complain now that it's 'too much of a grind', are the players that will complain that there's 'no progress' in future when new content is released if ZOS reduce the CP experience requirements to trivial levels now.

Joejudas

Rev Rielle wrote: »

Well I for one like the system, and think most of you are thinking far too short-term. It's supposed to be something that provides us some continual progression over a long period of time, not something to be grinded to max in a month or two.

The CP system is not 'the game', it's a background thing that ticks away whilst you play the actual game. Everyone in their insatiable rush to be the best, get to the 'max' or what-have-you, seems to forget that simple fact.

People keep talking like there's nothing to do to get CP's. Have you not read about what new content ZOS plans to release and work on over the next year? And do you think they will stop releasing content in two years time? In three, four? No, of course they won't. CP is not new content, it's a tweak to the mechanics that will hopefully provide us players with a meaningful, consistent and prolonged return for character development for years to come whilst new content is added. No one's expecting you to acquire the maximum amount of CP in the game in it's current state, ZOS has said as much plainly in previous ESO Lives broadcasts as well through other mediums of release.

The problem players have is that they are looking short term and selfishly and for some reasons refusing to realise what the CP system actually is for. It is not content, it's a mechanical change that provides the framework to build the game for years to come.

The same players that complain now that it's 'too much of a grind', are the players that will complain that there's 'no progress' in future when new content is released if ZOS reduce the CP experience requirements to trivial levels now.

so am i not allowed to put 1000 hours into the game and be rewarded for it ? Cause if not a bunch of us will find another game to play

Berinima

Well, I am glad that you, Rev Rielle, like the new system. I personally find the new system disgusting. My points are:

- In order to install the system, every char has to be gimped.
- To be en par again, you have to grind out around 100 champion points which means several weeks of well, let's call it gameplay.
- Also, in the current state many activities one might enjoy don't count as gameplay.
- While this might be manageable for veteran players it's outrageously unfair to new players.
- You remember infamous gear score checks from other games? Here there will be CP checks. Trust me, it's going to happen.
- While you could "gear up" in other games more or less easily, you just can't CP up.
- This will slowly kill the game.
- Also many future balance issues will arise because you just can't assume a steady power growth for the whole population.
- In addition to these problems, pretty much everything else they did in the patch is crap, justice system aside (Sorcerer redesign, shield stacking PvP meta, hybrid invality).

The feedback along the board is very discouraging. I am not sure if you have actually been on the PTS, but if you have and still like it, then good for you.

Nazon_Katts

Alright, so Enlightment kicks in every 24h at noon and lasts for one CP. So you can get 1CP in an hour per day, or maybe 2CP in five hours per day by mob/quest grinding. The most hardcore could possibly invest 9h per day for 3CP, while the most casual probably won't even get more than 2CP per week.

So roughly a spread of 4 to 36 years to max out CP. Unless you actually play the game as it's meant to be, then it's back 50+ years. The grind seems to be the only play style that's at least somewhat rewarding. Tho you probably can forget mob grinding when everyone joins ya in their hunt for their daily CP.

Either award CP directly through alliance ranks/quests/achievements/time passed or considerably increase/add xp gains to these kind of activities to make them a better choice than following a mindless grind. Or just drop the entire system (or move it down to the pre50 experience) and just rely on gear progression instead.

kimboh

Grunim wrote: »

Ishammael wrote: »

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

Cyrodiil:
10 Quests in Cheydinhal
10 Quests in Cropsford
(plus some exploration XP)

Took me 1h 10min on a slow horse.

I earned 500k CP-XP, with enlightenment.

Thanks for doing this and reporting. Here's the problem for ZOS: if I'm in Cyrodil, I want to be pvp'ing, not doing quests.

Exactly, and I can envision being grouped up with my PvP guild, trying to do the best we can for our alliance when an Enlightenment message pops up. Sorry guys, but I need to drop group and stop contributing to the war effort so I can have a chance at earning a CP today.

I think this is the problem in general.

Every day, log in and immediately start grinding Xp until your enlightenment is gone, then return to your 'normal' activities.

I don't think any one wants to play like this, but if it's the only realistic way to earn CP then we wont have much choice.

Either do the grind or not get CPs.

Berinima

kimboh wrote: »

I don't think any one wants to play like this, but if it's the only realistic way to earn CP then we wont have much choice.

At least for me, canceling my sub feels like a very valid choice at the moment though.

trimsic_ESO

I would love the following changes:
- 200 points per star instead of 100
- 200k XP to get a CP instead of 400k
- 200 points in a star be scaled down to what 100 points grant, although I would prefer if they were a bit more rewarding than the current 100 points (the high end bonuses are a bit too low)

Darkintellect

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

I would love the following changes:
- 200 points per star instead of 100
- 200k XP to get a CP instead of 400k
- 200 points in a star be a bit more rewarding than the current 100 points (the high end bonuses are a bit too low)

200 per star is vastly overpowered with regard to magicka reduction star etc.

trimsic_ESO

Darkintellect wrote: »

trimsic_ESO wrote: »

I would love the following changes:
- 200 points per star instead of 100
- 200k XP to get a CP instead of 400k
- 200 points in a star be a bit more rewarding than the current 100 points (the high end bonuses are a bit too low)

200 per star is vastly overpowered with regard to magicka reduction star etc.

I meant 200 per star should be scaled down to what 100 grant today, although I would prefer if they were a bit more rewarding (high end bonuses are slightly too low)

But the problem with 200 per star is that the final points would not be rewarding enough. So may be the current system is fine.

ashlee17

The diminishing returns of the champion system along with it being 4x harder to earn a CP when not enlightened feels like a double kick in the teeth to dedicated players.

Scrap enlightenment. Let us earn CPs at a fair rate all the time.

helediron

geoffreyb14_ESO wrote: »

helediron wrote: »

The direct comparison of all CP points to VR14 by @geoffreyb14_ESO‌ is plain wrong. With such speed the whole system is exhausted in a month.

Well, if you think the current VR progression system is too short, then you are right.

If you actually read my proposal, you'd realize that I suggest that they essentially break the current VR progression down into 1000 little pieces, doled out every13k xp. Compare that to the current Champion system on the PTS that breaks it down into 3600 increments doled out every 400,000 xp.

Simply put, completion of my proposal would be on par with the current VR progression and it makes each point more valuable. The version of Champion System currently on PTS stretches it out over the equivalent of over 1400 veteran ranks and necessarily makes each point meaningless.

If you think the current VR system feels grindy now, just wait. Unless they make a change, it's about to get a lot worse.

Do you really want to "grind" for 2+ hours only to be rewarded with a Champion point that gives you .2 % bonus to health? Really?

You are proposing a system which exhausts the whole progression in a month. For me making a new toon to VR14 takes roughly that long in 1.5 .

The proposition is not on par with VR progression. You should compare a VR14 toon to 100..200 CP points - not to 3600 points. The VR14 template with 70 CP feels like maybe VR12 now. I can clear content upto lower Craglorn but can't yet solo in upper overland. And that is partly because of skill morphs missing in template, non-optimal gear and 1.6 skill changes.

After maybe 200 CP points in 1.6 character progression definitely goes beyond VR14 in 1.5 . There are surely some essential champion passives i am going to grind, but that is only maybe 100..120 points. After that they are merely nice-to-have.

Testing in PTS is showing that the fastest rate of gaining CP is maybe half of what i expected. Turning that to CP per few minutes is the other end of silliness.

Joejudas

@ZOS please take note of how many people...myself included think that the time needed to gain a CP when combined with the whole bunch of nerfs you guys put in is unacceptable.

Aziz006

Right-clicking, left clicking or using ability cancels Werewolf transformation but also uses all ultimate

Jando

helediron wrote: »

You are proposing a system which exhausts the whole progression in a month. For me making a new toon to VR14 takes roughly that long in 1.5 .

The proposition is not on par with VR progression. You should compare a VR14 toon to 100..200 CP points - not to 3600 points. The VR14 template with 70 CP feels like maybe VR12 now. I can clear content upto lower Craglorn but can't yet solo in upper overland. And that is partly because of skill morphs missing in template, non-optimal gear and 1.6 skill changes.

After maybe 200 CP points in 1.6 character progression definitely goes beyond VR14 in 1.5 . There are surely some essential champion passives i am going to grind, but that is only maybe 100..120 points. After that they are merely nice-to-have.

Testing in PTS is showing that the fastest rate of gaining CP is maybe half of what i expected. Turning that to CP per few minutes is the other end of silliness.

It seems to me that we both agree that the current amount of XP necessary to gain a CP is excessive. We agree that it needs to be sped up. I just think it should be even faster than you do.

Clearly your play style is not the norm. Most people can't level a toon from 0 - VR14 in a month. That's very fast. Do you really think they should balance the game for everyone based on your personal extreme leveling speed?

Also, the point that i am not getting across to you is that there is a huge sacrifice that has to be made if there is going to be an endless progression system. The longer the progression is the less impact it can actually have. That's because they need to keep the player power relatively close in order to keep groups together and balance content. Big gaps in player power is bad. You can't have a long progression that has any significant impact on player power because new players would never be able to catch up. So the longer the progression the weaker it must be. The problem is that a long weak progression is called a grind. It's boring, and feels unrewarding. It becomes meaningless.

Instead of a long weak progression, i think a shorter and stronger progression is better, more exciting, accessible, and solves the problems associated with game balance and player separation. It doesn't mean the game is over at the end of the Champion progression, there's plenty of time to grind gear and do end-game content...but it is gear driven at that point.

Tankqull

from my PoV grinding CP should not be mandatory at all regardless if its done by quests or mob killing.
as granting xps in a way that would please players is contrary to what ZOS want ("endless" time sink)the effect of invested CPs needs to be drastically changed.
as an example we have 9 constallations if the first 11 spent points in each nets you 90% of the possible power increase by CP in that constallation. you would be pretty much "maxed" out at 99CP wich would correspond to a vr20 for an extrem casual player (all CP aquired with enlightment). and every point spend above would equalize to a power increasement of 0.000027% that way the CP points above 100 would be a nice addiotion but nothing mandatory you are hunting for.
but thats not the case currently the first 20 points are giving sth like 5% of the potential power increasement and thus gaining the first 1-2k CP is mandatory wich is a horrible.
to illustrate what i mean:

Joejudas

^^^^ yeah and add across the board nerfs to everything on top of that.

Tavore1138

If they hadn't nerfed the hell out of everything the amount of time to gain a CP would be much less of an issue because we wouldn't feel we had to grind several hundred of the damn things just to get back to where we started.

ZOS need to employ someone with at least a vague grasp on basic human psychology...

Tavore1138

P.S. You want to give reward for people plus long term progression for the completionistas?

Simple stagger the points needed per CP like it is for levels 1-50 and was for VR1-12.

You can even average at 400k per CP across the whole system but you can start at 50k per and work up to 400k for number 1,800 and so on.

Let us regain the nerfs & build the characters we want within a plausible time frame but make those last few percent harder.

Also put in some better perks at 180, 250, 330 & 400 stars (for example) to keep the motivation going.

Tankqull

Rev Rielle wrote: »

Well I for one like the system, and think most of you are thinking far too short-term. It's supposed to be something that provides us some continual progression over a long period of time, not something to be grinded to max in a month or two.

The CP system is not 'the game', it's a background thing that ticks away whilst you play the actual game. Everyone in their insatiable rush to be the best, get to the 'max' or what-have-you, seems to forget that simple fact.

People keep talking like there's nothing to do to get CP's. Have you not read about what new content ZOS plans to release and work on over the next year? And do you think they will stop releasing content in two years time? In three, four? No, of course they won't. CP is not new content, it's a tweak to the mechanics that will hopefully provide us players with a meaningful, consistent and prolonged return for character development for years to come whilst new content is added. No one's expecting you to acquire the maximum amount of CP in the game in it's current state, ZOS has said as much plainly in previous ESO Lives broadcasts as well through other mediums of release.

The problem players have is that they are looking short term and selfishly and for some reasons refusing to realise what the CP system actually is for. It is not content, it's a mechanical change that provides the framework to build the game for years to come.

The same players that complain now that it's 'too much of a grind', are the players that will complain that there's 'no progress' in future when new content is released if ZOS reduce the CP experience requirements to trivial levels now.

several issues
1. the CP system is either to powerfull in its whole contribution to the char power or each point spend has a far to linear effect towards char power. thus having or not having a CP is a severe difference. you´ll soon be not invited to raids if you cant proof spending 1000 CP properly. or you cant comped in pvp with someone grinding for 2 month while you havent. simply because the effects provided by the CP system in its current form is by far to linear and/or to much at all.
2. we are not going to see any content updates ´till late 2015. so 8+months where we are stuck to the current content and 6+ after 1.6 release at march 17th.
3. the prolonged development is a myth. you will have the peeps grinding quests and mobs 24/7 who will have an advantage of 40-60 CP per week over you, and you will either do the best to keep up or youll be left out of every kind of endgame content either pvp or pve (see point 1)
4. the only way to get a hold on that is the skill implementation of EvE with even further changes to give newcomers the chance to close the gap. (but to be honest who wants a automated progress?)

Rev Rielle

Joejudas wrote: »

Rev Rielle wrote: »

Well I for one like the system, and think most of you are thinking far too short-term. It's supposed to be something that provides us some continual progression over a long period of time, not something to be grinded to max in a month or two.

The CP system is not 'the game', it's a background thing that ticks away whilst you play the actual game. Everyone in their insatiable rush to be the best, get to the 'max' or what-have-you, seems to forget that simple fact.

People keep talking like there's nothing to do to get CP's. Have you not read about what new content ZOS plans to release and work on over the next year? And do you think they will stop releasing content in two years time? In three, four? No, of course they won't. CP is not new content, it's a tweak to the mechanics that will hopefully provide us players with a meaningful, consistent and prolonged return for character development for years to come whilst new content is added. No one's expecting you to acquire the maximum amount of CP in the game in it's current state, ZOS has said as much plainly in previous ESO Lives broadcasts as well through other mediums of release.

The problem players have is that they are looking short term and selfishly and for some reasons refusing to realise what the CP system actually is for. It is not content, it's a mechanical change that provides the framework to build the game for years to come.

The same players that complain now that it's 'too much of a grind', are the players that will complain that there's 'no progress' in future when new content is released if ZOS reduce the CP experience requirements to trivial levels now.

so am i not allowed to put 1000 hours into the game and be rewarded for it ? Cause if not a bunch of us will find another game to play

To say such is simply just not true: There are plenty of other rewards you get for playing, not just CP.

Wolfsspinne

Joejudas wrote: »

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

prototypefb wrote: »

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

a

prototypefb wrote: »

Can any1 test how long it takes currently on PTS to earn 1 CP while you do RP, or craft gear?
Why is XP only viable way to earn CP?
There is no balance, fix it, please, ZOS
you wonder how? there you go, check option 3, you're welcome!

Why do you need a MMO to RP in the first place?
Especially one that has so few RP elements as ESO.


There is a huge difference between RP and RPG that some don't seem to get.
The "G" - it stands for "game".
A game is defined to be "a form of competitive activity (...) played according to rules".
-> definition
Rules, those a the things that restrict you in whatever way the game designer wants.
Every game revolves around it's rules. Actually those rules are where the fun comes from.
Imagine chess if I could play like this on my first move: "See this pawn? He's an assassine and kills your king just like that. Checkmate."
Or imagine chess in a "fair" world, where every piece is a king.
Ether of those two would make playing the game pointless, because as I said:
games need rules.


I perfectly understand that sometimes you don't want to follow any rules.
But then tell my, why do you want to play a game with it's given rules at the same time?
There are plenty of other platforms, like forums, chats and virtual worlds (second life). Where you are free to do what ever you feel like.

ESO is already different mmo(for good or bad, up to you to decide) i believe this CP system will force too much grind(commonly known mmo feature) in the game and instead pigeonhole and bore the crap out of people while doing it.
System should be open not forced.

The question should be: "Am I really forced that much?"

This whole to me it seems as most people dislike the CP because they are in this "OMG I got to grind 3600 CP to be competitive"-kind of mindset.
Which I think could be considered BS.

What follows is my thoughts about the CP-system, I do not claim this to be correct.
With 30 points per constellation and you already have most of the gain that comes with the CP. Also at 30 points in one star you are at 7.5% of 15% max. (if I'm not mistaken)

Depending on role and play-style there is a priority star/constellation (each color) where one should dump their first 30 points. Like my NB surely wants her first 30 blue points put into ritual in order to be an acceptable damage dealer.
Those first 90 points to me feel like the "must have" that replaces the VR. But after that all points are more or less nice to have.

Sure things like +15% weapon damage from the atronach sounds good, but it only applies on light/heavy attacks which do like maybe 5% of my DPS (estimated value). Now +0,75% don't sound that good anymore.

Back to the first 90 points:
Those are the ones that you "need" to be competitive.
For someone who is VR14 now that means 20 additional points, which should be possible to achieve within a week.
For a casual player who might not even be V1 this still is less way to go than Veteran Ranks were since there is this enlightenment buff. With the buff you need only 9 million XP whereas you need 13 million XP to reach VR14.

Again, is just as I see things at the very moment. This might be proven correct or wrong within the next few months.

first of all its 70 points for a vr14 not 90....and those 20 you need require you to go around the wheel three time each...so its an extra 60 points you need to gain 20 for a single area. At 1 cp every 3 or 4 hours...if you played the whole 7 day week without leaving your pc for any reason you would still only get around 45 points. So i would disagree with your statement

I don't know why you wrote this. But you should either think before answering or don't answer at all if you are tired.

Because I have written that you start with a total of 70 points.

And if you do so you need to earn another 20 points to have a total of 90.
You stupid idea (sorry, but that's what it is) of getting another 60 points would result in you having 130 points total.

Getting 20 points will take you like a week as a non-casual player.

Berinima

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

Getting 20 points will take you like a week as a non-casual player.

I highly doubt that. I have not gained a single CP with grinding out skills and PvP. But maybe I am just ineffective.

Wolfsspinne

3rdwardhobocub18_ESO wrote: »

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

prototypefb wrote: »

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

a

prototypefb wrote: »

Can any1 test how long it takes currently on PTS to earn 1 CP while you do RP, or craft gear?
Why is XP only viable way to earn CP?
There is no balance, fix it, please, ZOS
you wonder how? there you go, check option 3, you're welcome!

Why do you need a MMO to RP in the first place?
Especially one that has so few RP elements as ESO.


There is a huge difference between RP and RPG that some don't seem to get.
The "G" - it stands for "game".
A game is defined to be "a form of competitive activity (...) played according to rules".
-> definition
Rules, those a the things that restrict you in whatever way the game designer wants.
Every game revolves around it's rules. Actually those rules are where the fun comes from.
Imagine chess if I could play like this on my first move: "See this pawn? He's an assassine and kills your king just like that. Checkmate."
Or imagine chess in a "fair" world, where every piece is a king.
Ether of those two would make playing the game pointless, because as I said:
games need rules.


I perfectly understand that sometimes you don't want to follow any rules.
But then tell my, why do you want to play a game with it's given rules at the same time?
There are plenty of other platforms, like forums, chats and virtual worlds (second life). Where you are free to do what ever you feel like.

ESO is already different mmo(for good or bad, up to you to decide) i believe this CP system will force too much grind(commonly known mmo feature) in the game and instead pigeonhole and bore the crap out of people while doing it.
System should be open not forced.

The question should be: "Am I really forced that much?"

This whole to me it seems as most people dislike the CP because they are in this "OMG I got to grind 3600 CP to be competitive"-kind of mindset.
Which I think could be considered BS.

What follows is my thoughts about the CP-system, I do not claim this to be correct.
With 30 points per constellation and you already have most of the gain that comes with the CP. Also at 30 points in one star you are at 7.5% of 15% max. (if I'm not mistaken)

Depending on role and play-style there is a priority star/constellation (each color) where one should dump their first 30 points. Like my NB surely wants her first 30 blue points put into ritual in order to be an acceptable damage dealer.
Those first 90 points to me feel like the "must have" that replaces the VR. But after that all points are more or less nice to have.

Sure things like +15% weapon damage from the atronach sounds good, but it only applies on light/heavy attacks which do like maybe 5% of my DPS (estimated value). Now +0,75% don't sound that good anymore.

Back to the first 90 points:
Those are the ones that you "need" to be competitive.
For someone who is VR14 now that means 20 additional points, which should be possible to achieve within a week.
For a casual player who might not even be V1 this still is less way to go than Veteran Ranks were since there is this enlightenment buff. With the buff you need only 9 million XP whereas you need 13 million XP to reach VR14.

Again, is just as I see things at the very moment. This might be proven correct or wrong within the next few months.

Those first 90 points are definitely "must have" because they finally get us VR14's (actually VR15) in the ballpark of where we currently stand on 1.5. In reality it will probably take 120-160 CP to get back to where we are.

Yeah, maybe we need 180 CP to get back to where we are right now.
But right now we all run this "Jack-of-all-Trades"-spec.
To give an example:
At the moment all V14 Kajiit Nightblades (with same gear) are equal when it comes to sneaking, physically DPS, evasion, sprinting, stamina-reg, max-stamina, whatever.

Now with chances of 1.6 and the CP your (example) Kajiit looses some of his capability in each of those abilities. In order to "get back where you are now" you'd need to put points in sneaking, weapon damage, phys. crit, stamina, stamina-reg, evasion, and anything else.

But, and that is what i was about:
Say you want to play the role of a damage dealer in a group.
Then you don't need the points in sneaking, neither do you need those points in evasion for you have a healer, and stamina-reg might be the least desired stat of all.
So half of what you would need to get back to where you are is something that you don't actually need. Which shrinks our 180 CP back down to 90 CP again.

Francescolg

How is the relation of an average PvP-player, lets say 20 kills per hours to an average PvE-farmer, that does a 20 quests per hour. Numbers are just "invented".
I simply suspect that farming CP with player kills in PvP will be nearly impossible for the average casual gamer. Will he have to grind PvE?

Wolfsspinne

Berinima wrote: »

Wolfsspinne wrote: »

Getting 20 points will take you like a week as a non-casual player.

I highly doubt that. I have not gained a single CP with grinding out skills and PvP. But maybe I am just ineffective.

I already stated in another post that PvP-XP needs adjustment.
But I won't repeat that over and over and over again.
Sorry for you feeling offended, that was not my intention.


As for "grinding out skills":
"Summon Image" requires 394,828 XP to get from III to IV
"Mass Hysteria" requires 412,726 XP to get from III to IV
Which in fact is as much as 1 CP.