State of the Game -- A Former PVP Guild Lead's Commentary

Rasimir

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

With the present restrictions that prevent you from having characters from multiple alliances on one account assigned to the same campaign, we’re at our minimum for Veteran characters at three campaigns (+1 non vet).

I thought this restriction was dropped some time ago. I talked to a player who said he had both a dominion char and a pact char in the same campaign on EU, on the same account. Could you please check your database for a breach of this restriction?

Thank you.

frozywozy

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

I like how we still have people saying that a magicka nb isn't a true rogue class even though it has virtually the same gameplay as a stamina one. Like really the only difference is the ranged weapon setup

Anyway, who cares if a magicka nb isn't a true rogue. lmfao

They made the game so we could get any character doing any role. If you wanna play a rogue, go back to Wow and shut up already.

DDuke

frozywozy wrote: »

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

I like how we still have people saying that a magicka nb isn't a true rogue class even though it has virtually the same gameplay as a stamina one. Like really the only difference is the ranged weapon setup

Anyway, who cares if a magicka nb isn't a true rogue. lmfao

They made the game so we could get any character doing any role. If you wanna play a rogue, go back to Wow and shut up already.

Sure, that must be good for the game. Less subscribers

What exactly is the problem people have with the prospect of having more build diversity than "hold block & spam heals/shields while DPSing"?
Yes, that's essentially what combat becomes, when you can't one shot someone.
That, or trying to escape.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/144002/do-you-have-a-heal-or-a-dmg-shield-slotted-on-your-hotbar/p1

Does it somehow take away from your gameplay experience, if other people are allowed to enjoy the game? One would think it's the other way around.

Uploading Part 2 of my Stealth/Cloak tests as we speak.

DDuke

Part 2 of my tests, as promised:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3lHPj5SXAU&feature=youtu.be

Manoekin

DDuke wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

I like how we still have people saying that a magicka nb isn't a true rogue class even though it has virtually the same gameplay as a stamina one. Like really the only difference is the ranged weapon setup

Anyway, who cares if a magicka nb isn't a true rogue. lmfao

They made the game so we could get any character doing any role. If you wanna play a rogue, go back to Wow and shut up already.

Sure, that must be good for the game. Less subscribers

What exactly is the problem people have with the prospect of having more build diversity than "hold block & spam heals/shields while DPSing"?
Yes, that's essentially what combat becomes, when you can't one shot someone.
That, or trying to escape.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/144002/do-you-have-a-heal-or-a-dmg-shield-slotted-on-your-hotbar/p1

Does it somehow take away from your gameplay experience, if other people are allowed to enjoy the game? One would think it's the other way around.

Uploading Part 2 of my Stealth/Cloak tests as we speak.

Maybe you and all the people who wanna be rogues in this thread should go talk to Asian Mayhem or something

risen1981 wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

faernaa wrote: »

kelly.medleyb14_ESO wrote: »

Blocking is a very unique part of ESO combat and part of what makes it so great. Block casting is just a gives the combat depth and removing that would make the game more shallow.

LOL what? How come block casting gives such deep combat depth? You just hold block and spam 1-1-1.

I don't think taking it away adds anything, so what's your point? A shield will block the same whether you're wearing any kind of armor TBH. Problem isn't that 1h/s is adding too much mitigation, it's that heavy armor doesn't add enough. I leveled to VR10 with heavy armor because that's how I wanted to play, but had to discard it after realizing the survivability was the same in light armor. Everyone's hate is really misplaced here.

Also people use more than one spell. Not one player in this game uses only one spell, and if a player does it's a healer like me in pvp where 75% or more of my casts are breath of life.

Geez dude, step back and think for a sec, block casting is really a gamebreaking mechanic, as it is now you might as well have permablock on... like a toggle.. so i dont hurt my finger while holding down mousebutton (depth to combat? please.. )

How about adding a blockbreak... like the bash, now that would add actual skill to combat and penalizing those permablockers!

I have thought about it. Block casting will be a thing unless they rework how pve content works, or make shield mitigation passive and not activated. People think it's only a pvp issue. What if your trial tank needs to cast taunt, and the boss hits him with a crit attack and one shots him while his shield is down to cast the taunt? Should the tank let the boss kill someone else to avoid being hit by the attack while taunting?

Even so, in pvp it's going to be impossible to permablock in 1.6. You all will just have to wait and see the patch notes or hope it gets mentioned in this thread... The direction they're going in is the right direction imo.

Well then you havn't give it a thought.
That would force the tanks to actual time their taunts more or less instead of spamming it once every few second? you figure it out, i bet the good tanks would have no issue with it.
Also the removal of caps would make a tank in HA to be able to actuallly take more dmg without getting insta-killed
Think again but a bit harder... You're probably smart, think of a smart way instead of a lazy way

Please shut up already. I already told you your issue with block in pvp has several indirect fixes in pvp, not even including stuff I don't know about.

The problem with taunts is the taunt mechanic in this game requires you to cast it every so often and punishes you for casting it too much. It's not something where you can just do it at convenient times. Also there is no AOE taunt, so basically your solution is to make one those trash pulls of 10 mobs become 5minute fights where you need 3-4 of your 12 people to be tanks, or your DPS just don't do DPS because they will get one shot.

If they're going to disallow block casting they literally have to change how the pve game works, so please, YOU give it more thought other than "herp derp I don't like dis zos this isn't how my mind interprets this game to work zos".

Sensesfail13

I totally agree with this last response by @manoekin, Ive played a tank in every MMO I have played since I was a kid, Including top warrior on my server in EQ for consecutive years... and this is definitely the worst most penalizing game as far as tanks are concerned. Block casting as far as shields are concerned I see nothing wrong with, people are getting angrier and angrier that they have to deal with tanks in Cyrodiil... Well you wont have to wait much longer DK tanks will be extinct as soon as they "fix" reflective scales making it just and archer/staff wielding love experience all you permanewbs seem to want out on the battlefield.

Its amazing the bs we have to deal with from all the casters and archers get 20 spamming lethal arrow for 1.5k per or MORE get another 20 mages with volcanic rune or crushing shock or what have you and another 10 templars spamming their stuns... Tanks will be extinct as will PVE playing because we will all be gone. So have fun with your arrow/spell/stun spamming bs if it keeps on because there wont be any dks to save you soon enough.

DDuke

Sensesfail13 wrote: »

I totally agree with this last response by @manoekin, Ive played a tank in every MMO I have played since I was a kid, Including top warrior on my server in EQ for consecutive years... and this is definitely the worst most penalizing game as far as tanks are concerned. Block casting as far as shields are concerned I see nothing wrong with, people are getting angrier and angrier that they have to deal with tanks in Cyrodiil... Well you wont have to wait much longer DK tanks will be extinct as soon as they "fix" reflective scales making it just and archer/staff wielding love experience all you permanewbs seem to want out on the battlefield.

Its amazing the bs we have to deal with from all the casters and archers get 20 spamming lethal arrow for 1.5k per or MORE get another 20 mages with volcanic rune or crushing shock or what have you and another 10 templars spamming their stuns... Tanks will be extinct as will PVE playing because we will all be gone. So have fun with your arrow/spell/stun spamming bs if it keeps on because there wont be any dks to save you soon enough.

I dont think anyone wants tanks to become obsolete.

The problem is that tanks (and healers) are able to deal pretty much equal damage to the DPS, while maintaining that tankiness, making it more of a must-do playstyle than a specific role.

Those 1.5k Lethal Arrows? Yeah, you can do that, and then swap to S&B bar and tank 20 people. Even easier with a magicka setup.

I'd be fine with ZOS just creating a counter ability to block however, that way you could get rid of it in PvP & wouldn't have to change the PvE aspect.

I proposed something like this in another topic:

"Shatter - 5 Meter range. Breaks block and prevents target from blocking for X seconds, deals 300% damage to blocking targets."

"Penetrating Arrow - 1 second cast, 28m range. Breaks block and prevents target from blocking for X seconds, stuns the target for X seconds"

Well, you get the idea. Giving these skills a cast time or short range makes you able to avoid being hit by them, essentially making PvP less of a "hold right mouse button & spam skills", but more of an active experience.

Just my thoughts

Roechacca

What this game started as ...






What this game has become ....

DDuke

roechacca wrote: »

What this game started as ...






What this game has become ....

omg that's exactly how I feel in Cyrodiil and in these forums

Here:

Mojomonkeyman

And another objective, interesting and important thread just got turned into an NB whine *** by @DDuke‌ ...

It`s hilarious, how he managed to turn the thread completely from page 6+ on and now we have more pages diuscussing cloak and his assassin fantasies than actual PvP related stuff.

Wow, just wow....

DDuke

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

And another objective, interesting and important thread just got turned into an NB whine *** by @DDuke‌ ...

It`s hilarious, how he managed to turn the thread completely from page 6+ on and now we have more pages diuscussing cloak and his assassin fantasies than actual PvP related stuff.

Wow, just wow....

PvP build/playstyle diversity isn't PvP related stuff? Cloak being broken isn't PvP related stuff?

Ok, whatever you say...

Rylana

I am just going to point out that the gank/assassin build is just as viable today as it has always been.

you either go weapon damage 2h or bow and go for the 3 shot kill from range, or you stack spell damage using a staff or whatever and use class abilities to ambush/impale.

Just because siphonblades with SnB exist doesnt mean the rogue ganker doesnt still function just as well as it always has.

O_o Whenever I get on mine I have the highest K/d of any char I run, play for hours, and log out the moment i get killed five times (its my rule, five deaths = logout). Best run on five death rule? Eight hours twenty minutes 411 kills. Most from gank or small engagement. Nearly all by just my damage with no ones help.

So seriously, the whole notion that this playstyle doesnt work is BS.

DDuke

Rylana wrote: »

I am just going to point out that the gank/assassin build is just as viable today as it has always been.

you either go weapon damage 2h or bow and go for the 3 shot kill from range, or you stack spell damage using a staff or whatever and use class abilities to ambush/impale.

Just because siphonblades with SnB exist doesnt mean the rogue ganker doesnt still function just as well as it always has.

O_o Whenever I get on mine I have the highest K/d of any char I run, play for hours, and log out the moment i get killed five times (its my rule, five deaths = logout). Best run on five death rule? Eight hours twenty minutes 411 kills. Most from gank or small engagement. Nearly all by just my damage with no ones help.

So seriously, the whole notion that this playstyle doesnt work is BS.

Of course you can gank low health targets and then run away (no, I don't think anyone should be able to get killed in 1-2 seconds either). You can do that with almost any build.

And before 1.5, you could deal almost twice the burst damage than is currently possible, so saying that this playstyle is as viable as before is ridiculous.

Also, what happens when you fail to "one shot" someone? Oh, right... you run away & pray that cloak works, and that you won't get stuck in combat.

Well, that's not how it works in other MMOs/RPGs, since you're usually able to keep fighting by utilizing CC, stealth & burst damage.

Besides, currently the only difference between a gank build with stealth and a gank build with dmg shield/heal is that the other one can stay in the fight & tank people, while the other one has to run away and hope for the best.

Obviously, people tend to choose the stronger option, leading to a lack of build diversity.
See: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/144002/do-you-have-a-heal-or-a-dmg-shield-slotted-on-your-hotbar/p1

Mojomonkeyman

DDuke wrote: »

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

And another objective, interesting and important thread just got turned into an NB whine *** by @DDuke‌ ...

It`s hilarious, how he managed to turn the thread completely from page 6+ on and now we have more pages diuscussing cloak and his assassin fantasies than actual PvP related stuff.

Wow, just wow....

PvP build/playstyle diversity isn't PvP related stuff? Cloak being broken isn't PvP related stuff?

Ok, whatever you say...

I`m pretty sure, this thread was not supposed to serve as a platform to discuss your issues with your class.

But you are a lost cause, I got that months ago. Never stop whining, buddy, never stop!

Rylana

DDuke wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

I am just going to point out that the gank/assassin build is just as viable today as it has always been.

you either go weapon damage 2h or bow and go for the 3 shot kill from range, or you stack spell damage using a staff or whatever and use class abilities to ambush/impale.

Just because siphonblades with SnB exist doesnt mean the rogue ganker doesnt still function just as well as it always has.

O_o Whenever I get on mine I have the highest K/d of any char I run, play for hours, and log out the moment i get killed five times (its my rule, five deaths = logout). Best run on five death rule? Eight hours twenty minutes 411 kills. Most from gank or small engagement. Nearly all by just my damage with no ones help.

So seriously, the whole notion that this playstyle doesnt work is BS.

Of course you can gank low health targets and then run away (no, I don't think anyone should be able to get killed in 1-2 seconds either). You can do that with almost any build.

And before 1.5, you could deal almost twice the burst damage than is currently possible, so saying that this playstyle is as viable as before is ridiculous.

Also, what happens when you fail to "one shot" someone? Oh, right... you run away & pray that cloak works.

Well, that's not how it works in other MMOs/RPGs, since you're usually able to keep fighting by utilizing CC, stealth & burst damage.

Besides, currently the only difference between a gank build with stealth and a gank build with dmg shield/heal is that the other one can stay in the fight & tank people, while the other one has to run away and hope for the best.

Obviously, people tend to choose the stronger option, leading to a lack of build diversity.
See: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/144002/do-you-have-a-heal-or-a-dmg-shield-slotted-on-your-hotbar/p1

Typically dont run unless counterambushed. I might reset the fight and wait for a different opportunity or until theres some distance between them and an ally.

Not many truly hard targets out there I cant burst down. Even shield stackers drop pretty quickly as I back away from them. Only real counter is a flappyflap DK but I have other tricks for that can of worms (swap to other bar and use stamina sapping antics and survival abilities like shields)

I never said the playstyle was easy, and no, I dont like to linger for long as I am not a tank by any stretch on that char. But my gamble is that I will burn them down before they burn me down. Works most of the time.

Only the few well known exceptionals I cannot bring down by myself, low health targets? I drop 3700 health templars all the time (blazing shield spammers are actually my favorite prey)

DDuke

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Mojomonkeyman wrote: »

And another objective, interesting and important thread just got turned into an NB whine *** by @DDuke‌ ...

It`s hilarious, how he managed to turn the thread completely from page 6+ on and now we have more pages diuscussing cloak and his assassin fantasies than actual PvP related stuff.

Wow, just wow....

PvP build/playstyle diversity isn't PvP related stuff? Cloak being broken isn't PvP related stuff?

Ok, whatever you say...

I`m pretty sure, this thread was not supposed to serve as a platform to discuss your issues with your class.

But you are a lost cause, I got that months ago. Never stop whining, buddy, never stop!

Yes, this may come as a surprise to you, but my class is one of the four classes that can enter Cyrodiil and you know, PvP.
Even though at times it might seem there are only DKs, trust me there are other classes as well.

"My issues" are also not only my issues, but quite universal to people who want to play a stealth focused character.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/145348/nightblade-stealth/p1
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/143698/my-nb-build-and-i-cant-play-the-way-i-like
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/145447/why-do-some-offensive-dots-still-break-cloak
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/144876/cloak-useless

So go spread your ignorance elsewhere please, there is enough of it here as is.

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

We're gathering a few more questions from this thread to get answers and/or clarification on. In the meantime, know we are still keeping an eye on it.

You must have missed that.

Koensol

Wow thanks guys for ruining this awsome opportunity of asking questions to the devs that actually get answered, by littering the last couple of pages with bickering. I figure they won't bother reading through any of that crap to find any legit questions. Way to go!

Lava_Croft

'Real' Nightblades are Magicka Nightblades. Yes, Magicka Nightblades.

I have linked the Nightblade class from three different Elder Scrolls games. Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion. These three games span twenty years of The Elder Scrolls.

You Stamina Nightblades have just as much right and reason to exist as anyone else, but please stop claiming that Nightblades are like Rogues in other, mostly lesser games.

"Nightblades use their magic abilities as an aid to subterfuge. The Nightblade is often like a thief with the capability to use magic."

"Nightblades are spellcasters who use their magics to enhance mobility, concealment, and stealthy close combat. They have a sinister reputation, since many nightblades are thieves, enforcers, assassins, or covert agents."

"Spell and shadow are their friends. By darkness they move with haste, casting magic to benefit their circumstances."

DDuke

Rylana wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

I am just going to point out that the gank/assassin build is just as viable today as it has always been.

you either go weapon damage 2h or bow and go for the 3 shot kill from range, or you stack spell damage using a staff or whatever and use class abilities to ambush/impale.

Just because siphonblades with SnB exist doesnt mean the rogue ganker doesnt still function just as well as it always has.

O_o Whenever I get on mine I have the highest K/d of any char I run, play for hours, and log out the moment i get killed five times (its my rule, five deaths = logout). Best run on five death rule? Eight hours twenty minutes 411 kills. Most from gank or small engagement. Nearly all by just my damage with no ones help.

So seriously, the whole notion that this playstyle doesnt work is BS.

Of course you can gank low health targets and then run away (no, I don't think anyone should be able to get killed in 1-2 seconds either). You can do that with almost any build.

And before 1.5, you could deal almost twice the burst damage than is currently possible, so saying that this playstyle is as viable as before is ridiculous.

Also, what happens when you fail to "one shot" someone? Oh, right... you run away & pray that cloak works.

Well, that's not how it works in other MMOs/RPGs, since you're usually able to keep fighting by utilizing CC, stealth & burst damage.

Besides, currently the only difference between a gank build with stealth and a gank build with dmg shield/heal is that the other one can stay in the fight & tank people, while the other one has to run away and hope for the best.

Obviously, people tend to choose the stronger option, leading to a lack of build diversity.
See: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/144002/do-you-have-a-heal-or-a-dmg-shield-slotted-on-your-hotbar/p1

Typically dont run unless counterambushed. I might reset the fight and wait for a different opportunity or until theres some distance between them and an ally.

Not many truly hard targets out there I cant burst down. Even shield stackers drop pretty quickly as I back away from them. Only real counter is a flappyflap DK but I have other tricks for that can of worms (swap to other bar and use stamina sapping antics and survival abilities like shields)

I never said the playstyle was easy, and no, I dont like to linger for long as I am not a tank by any stretch on that char. But my gamble is that I will burn them down before they burn me down. Works most of the time.

Only the few well known exceptionals I cannot bring down by myself, low health targets? I drop 3700 health templars all the time (blazing shield spammers are actually my favorite prey)

Maximum burst is 2-3k with bow (1,2k-1,6k Lethal+Heavy Attack (600-1k~)+Poison Injection (400-600~), so 3,7k health target doesn't go down, unless he's got reaction time of a rock.

Except if target happens to be a vampire & you're running one of those cheesy builds with combat prayer, aggressive maneuvers etc.

If you have evidence to the contrary, I'd like to see a video of that.
I only know that I've never been killed by another archer in 1v1, even while purposefully trolling them by jumping around with my horse. Maximum damage they deal is around 60% of my health (3.6k).

Regardless, you just stated what the issue is in your own comment:

flappyflap DK but I have other tricks for that can of worms (swap to other bar and use stamina sapping antics and survival abilities like shields)

Urai

Only have one question,

About the heavy armor vs light armor; people want this changed because it would make more sense that a HA wearer is a lot more tanky then LA but if it means that Cyrodiil will be full of...for those who remember unkillable Blood Dk's with a gazillion HP...then what's the point ?

Most people want Heavy armor to be viable because it looks better then light armor but if the outcome is just a switch...

DDuke

Lava_Croft wrote: »

'Real' Nightblades are Magicka Nightblades. Yes, Magicka Nightblades.

I have linked the Nightblade class from three different Elder Scrolls games. Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion. These three games span twenty years of The Elder Scrolls.

You Stamina Nightblades have just as much right and reason to exist as anyone else, but please stop claiming that Nightblades are like Rogues in other, mostly lesser games.

"Nightblades use their magic abilities as an aid to subterfuge. The Nightblade is often like a thief with the capability to use magic."

"Nightblades are spellcasters who use their magics to enhance mobility, concealment, and stealthy close combat. They have a sinister reputation, since many nightblades are thieves, enforcers, assassins, or covert agents."

"Spell and shadow are their friends. By darkness they move with haste, casting magic to benefit their circumstances."

I'm not claiming Nightblades alone should be able to play the rogue archetype, that'd be selfish.
Any class can wear any type of armour in this game (even ones not typically worn by their class, e.g. Sorcerer can wear heavy or medium armour) and use any weapon.

What I'm talking about is the playstyle, not a build or a class, and a good step towards making it more viable would be fixing the only stealth skill in game.

In case someone missed it, here is my second video proving how broken it is currently.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3lHPj5SXAU

Pancake-Tragedy

DDuke wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

'Real' Nightblades are Magicka Nightblades. Yes, Magicka Nightblades.

I have linked the Nightblade class from three different Elder Scrolls games. Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion. These three games span twenty years of The Elder Scrolls.

You Stamina Nightblades have just as much right and reason to exist as anyone else, but please stop claiming that Nightblades are like Rogues in other, mostly lesser games.

"Nightblades use their magic abilities as an aid to subterfuge. The Nightblade is often like a thief with the capability to use magic."

"Nightblades are spellcasters who use their magics to enhance mobility, concealment, and stealthy close combat. They have a sinister reputation, since many nightblades are thieves, enforcers, assassins, or covert agents."

"Spell and shadow are their friends. By darkness they move with haste, casting magic to benefit their circumstances."

I'm not claiming Nightblades alone should be able to play the rogue archetype, that'd be selfish.
Any class can wear any type of armour in this game (even ones not typically worn by their class, e.g. Sorcerer can wear heavy or medium armour) and use any weapon.

What I'm talking about is the playstyle, not a build or a class, and a good step towards making it more viable would be fixing the only stealth skill in game.

In case someone missed it, here is my second video proving how broken it is currently.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3lHPj5SXAU

Guess what? All classes are getting a hard look in 1.6, so do you want to just let this whole "rogue" thing go for a while so we can ask Mrs. Folsom the important questions?

Thanks.

Roechacca

We need Pirate Nightblades

http://youtu.be/JRcEH-cMTFg

risen1981

Manoekin wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

I like how we still have people saying that a magicka nb isn't a true rogue class even though it has virtually the same gameplay as a stamina one. Like really the only difference is the ranged weapon setup

Anyway, who cares if a magicka nb isn't a true rogue. lmfao

They made the game so we could get any character doing any role. If you wanna play a rogue, go back to Wow and shut up already.

Sure, that must be good for the game. Less subscribers

What exactly is the problem people have with the prospect of having more build diversity than "hold block & spam heals/shields while DPSing"?
Yes, that's essentially what combat becomes, when you can't one shot someone.
That, or trying to escape.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/144002/do-you-have-a-heal-or-a-dmg-shield-slotted-on-your-hotbar/p1

Does it somehow take away from your gameplay experience, if other people are allowed to enjoy the game? One would think it's the other way around.

Uploading Part 2 of my Stealth/Cloak tests as we speak.

Maybe you and all the people who wanna be rogues in this thread should go talk to Asian Mayhem or something

risen1981 wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

faernaa wrote: »

kelly.medleyb14_ESO wrote: »

Blocking is a very unique part of ESO combat and part of what makes it so great. Block casting is just a gives the combat depth and removing that would make the game more shallow.

LOL what? How come block casting gives such deep combat depth? You just hold block and spam 1-1-1.

I don't think taking it away adds anything, so what's your point? A shield will block the same whether you're wearing any kind of armor TBH. Problem isn't that 1h/s is adding too much mitigation, it's that heavy armor doesn't add enough. I leveled to VR10 with heavy armor because that's how I wanted to play, but had to discard it after realizing the survivability was the same in light armor. Everyone's hate is really misplaced here.

Also people use more than one spell. Not one player in this game uses only one spell, and if a player does it's a healer like me in pvp where 75% or more of my casts are breath of life.

Geez dude, step back and think for a sec, block casting is really a gamebreaking mechanic, as it is now you might as well have permablock on... like a toggle.. so i dont hurt my finger while holding down mousebutton (depth to combat? please.. )

How about adding a blockbreak... like the bash, now that would add actual skill to combat and penalizing those permablockers!

I have thought about it. Block casting will be a thing unless they rework how pve content works, or make shield mitigation passive and not activated. People think it's only a pvp issue. What if your trial tank needs to cast taunt, and the boss hits him with a crit attack and one shots him while his shield is down to cast the taunt? Should the tank let the boss kill someone else to avoid being hit by the attack while taunting?

Even so, in pvp it's going to be impossible to permablock in 1.6. You all will just have to wait and see the patch notes or hope it gets mentioned in this thread... The direction they're going in is the right direction imo.

Well then you havn't give it a thought.
That would force the tanks to actual time their taunts more or less instead of spamming it once every few second? you figure it out, i bet the good tanks would have no issue with it.
Also the removal of caps would make a tank in HA to be able to actuallly take more dmg without getting insta-killed
Think again but a bit harder... You're probably smart, think of a smart way instead of a lazy way

Please shut up already. I already told you your issue with block in pvp has several indirect fixes in pvp, not even including stuff I don't know about.

The problem with taunts is the taunt mechanic in this game requires you to cast it every so often and punishes you for casting it too much. It's not something where you can just do it at convenient times. Also there is no AOE taunt, so basically your solution is to make one those trash pulls of 10 mobs become 5minute fights where you need 3-4 of your 12 people to be tanks, or your DPS just don't do DPS because they will get one shot.

If they're going to disallow block casting they literally have to change how the pve game works, so please, YOU give it more thought other than "herp derp I don't like dis zos this isn't how my mind interprets this game to work zos".

Wow you turned agressive.. how long does it take to "cast" the taunt?... 0.5 seconds?... that would mean a window of 0.5 seconds where you are vulnerble...
If you can't adapt to that..

TheBull

DDuke wrote: »

Part 2 of my tests, as promised:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3lHPj5SXAU&feature=youtu.be

This deserves it's own thread man.

You show exactly what all of us have been going through. The "dodge but take damage and cloak breaks" is the one I've been trying to describe since 1.5.

Please make a new thread with this video. It's definitive proof of our issues. Thank you.
@ZOS_JessicaFolsom‌
@ZOS_GaryA‌
@ZOS_BrianWheeler‌
@ZOS_MattFiror‌

DDuke

Pancake-Tragedy wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

'Real' Nightblades are Magicka Nightblades. Yes, Magicka Nightblades.

I have linked the Nightblade class from three different Elder Scrolls games. Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion. These three games span twenty years of The Elder Scrolls.

You Stamina Nightblades have just as much right and reason to exist as anyone else, but please stop claiming that Nightblades are like Rogues in other, mostly lesser games.

"Nightblades use their magic abilities as an aid to subterfuge. The Nightblade is often like a thief with the capability to use magic."

"Nightblades are spellcasters who use their magics to enhance mobility, concealment, and stealthy close combat. They have a sinister reputation, since many nightblades are thieves, enforcers, assassins, or covert agents."

"Spell and shadow are their friends. By darkness they move with haste, casting magic to benefit their circumstances."

I'm not claiming Nightblades alone should be able to play the rogue archetype, that'd be selfish.
Any class can wear any type of armour in this game (even ones not typically worn by their class, e.g. Sorcerer can wear heavy or medium armour) and use any weapon.

What I'm talking about is the playstyle, not a build or a class, and a good step towards making it more viable would be fixing the only stealth skill in game.

In case someone missed it, here is my second video proving how broken it is currently.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3lHPj5SXAU

Guess what? All classes are getting a hard look in 1.6, so do you want to just let this whole "rogue" thing go for a while so we can ask Mrs. Folsom the important questions?

Thanks.

I like how you decide what is important and what is not, really mature of you

Epsilon_Echo

Koensol wrote: »

Wow thanks guys for ruining this awsome opportunity of asking questions to the devs that actually get answered, by littering the last couple of pages with bickering. I figure they won't bother reading through any of that crap to find any legit questions. Way to go!

Trayyacakes

risen1981 wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

I like how we still have people saying that a magicka nb isn't a true rogue class even though it has virtually the same gameplay as a stamina one. Like really the only difference is the ranged weapon setup

Anyway, who cares if a magicka nb isn't a true rogue. lmfao

They made the game so we could get any character doing any role. If you wanna play a rogue, go back to Wow and shut up already.

Sure, that must be good for the game. Less subscribers

What exactly is the problem people have with the prospect of having more build diversity than "hold block & spam heals/shields while DPSing"?
Yes, that's essentially what combat becomes, when you can't one shot someone.
That, or trying to escape.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/144002/do-you-have-a-heal-or-a-dmg-shield-slotted-on-your-hotbar/p1

Does it somehow take away from your gameplay experience, if other people are allowed to enjoy the game? One would think it's the other way around.

Uploading Part 2 of my Stealth/Cloak tests as we speak.

Maybe you and all the people who wanna be rogues in this thread should go talk to Asian Mayhem or something

risen1981 wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

risen1981 wrote: »

Manoekin wrote: »

faernaa wrote: »

kelly.medleyb14_ESO wrote: »

Blocking is a very unique part of ESO combat and part of what makes it so great. Block casting is just a gives the combat depth and removing that would make the game more shallow.

LOL what? How come block casting gives such deep combat depth? You just hold block and spam 1-1-1.

I don't think taking it away adds anything, so what's your point? A shield will block the same whether you're wearing any kind of armor TBH. Problem isn't that 1h/s is adding too much mitigation, it's that heavy armor doesn't add enough. I leveled to VR10 with heavy armor because that's how I wanted to play, but had to discard it after realizing the survivability was the same in light armor. Everyone's hate is really misplaced here.

Also people use more than one spell. Not one player in this game uses only one spell, and if a player does it's a healer like me in pvp where 75% or more of my casts are breath of life.

Geez dude, step back and think for a sec, block casting is really a gamebreaking mechanic, as it is now you might as well have permablock on... like a toggle.. so i dont hurt my finger while holding down mousebutton (depth to combat? please.. )

How about adding a blockbreak... like the bash, now that would add actual skill to combat and penalizing those permablockers!

I have thought about it. Block casting will be a thing unless they rework how pve content works, or make shield mitigation passive and not activated. People think it's only a pvp issue. What if your trial tank needs to cast taunt, and the boss hits him with a crit attack and one shots him while his shield is down to cast the taunt? Should the tank let the boss kill someone else to avoid being hit by the attack while taunting?

Even so, in pvp it's going to be impossible to permablock in 1.6. You all will just have to wait and see the patch notes or hope it gets mentioned in this thread... The direction they're going in is the right direction imo.

Well then you havn't give it a thought.
That would force the tanks to actual time their taunts more or less instead of spamming it once every few second? you figure it out, i bet the good tanks would have no issue with it.
Also the removal of caps would make a tank in HA to be able to actuallly take more dmg without getting insta-killed
Think again but a bit harder... You're probably smart, think of a smart way instead of a lazy way

Please shut up already. I already told you your issue with block in pvp has several indirect fixes in pvp, not even including stuff I don't know about.

The problem with taunts is the taunt mechanic in this game requires you to cast it every so often and punishes you for casting it too much. It's not something where you can just do it at convenient times. Also there is no AOE taunt, so basically your solution is to make one those trash pulls of 10 mobs become 5minute fights where you need 3-4 of your 12 people to be tanks, or your DPS just don't do DPS because they will get one shot.

If they're going to disallow block casting they literally have to change how the pve game works, so please, YOU give it more thought other than "herp derp I don't like dis zos this isn't how my mind interprets this game to work zos".

Wow you turned agressive.. how long does it take to "cast" the taunt?... 0.5 seconds?... that would mean a window of 0.5 seconds where you are vulnerble...
If you can't adapt to that..

He isn't just talking about the impact it has on tanks. Good PVE Tanks would have minimal problems adapting to tanking bosses without block casting. The problem would come on the trash pulls. In Trials and most 4 mans a tank can't Taunt the whole pack of mobs. It is not the way this game works. There is no AOE taunt. The tanks job is cc and taunt the biggest threats and try to interrupt everything he can, but guess what *** happens the DPS and heals are going to take damage on these trash pulls. If the glass cannon DPS/heals aren't block casting, they die.

I also think in a pvp aspect removing block casting won't be a good thing unless you lower the damage dealt by a decent portion in pvp.

Have you ever been ganked on a horse in cyrodiil? TTK off of a horse is pretty low. remove block casting and that would be close to what TTK is everywhere, not quite as extreme because you can stun break when you aren't on your horse but still.

In short if they get rid of block casting a game wide rebalance of sorts would need to take place.

Good players will always adapt, so it will only matter to casuals. Whiners will whine regardless, so In the end if it will make a minimal difference what's it matter.

Poxheart

Whether or not cloak breaks is not on the same level of importance as the comments that are found in the original post.

Regarding your second video: 1) the 21 weapon damage is likely from your opponent's weapon enchant. Status effects/weapon enchants seem to proc even though the main attack misses. 2) I'll wager that if we watched the footage from your opponent's perspective, you would have been invisible for the entire duration of cloak (that is what happened during my tests of the ability). It could very well be that there is a visual discrepancy between the cloaking player and the enemy player. 3) most of the deaths at the end of your video? Most likely the result of your enemies using detect pots.

Kinda funny how you ignored my video.

DDuke

Poxheart wrote: »

Whether or not cloak breaks is not on the same level of importance as the comments that are found in the original post.

Regarding your second video: 1) the 21 weapon damage is likely from your opponent's weapon enchant. Status effects/weapon enchants seem to proc even though the main attack misses. 2) I'll wager that if we watched the footage from your opponent's perspective, you would have been invisible for the entire duration of cloak (that is what happened during my tests of the ability). It could very well be that there is a visual discrepancy between the cloaking player and the enemy player. 3) most of the deaths at the end of your video? Most likely the result of your enemies using detect pots.

Kinda funny how you ignored my video.

So is this a knee jerk reaction for "ignoring" your video, or what?

I dont think "one shotting" 2 players on horses proves anything, except that the TTK in this game is way too low.

Any build can do that, and I'm quite certain that if those targets hadn't died, you'd have just started spamming the dmg shields/heals on your second bar.

If you were playing rogue archetype, you wouldn't have heals/dmg shield, you'd have stealth skills & CC. You also wouldn't be wearing robes, you would be wearing leather armour.

As for my tests, if I had been invisible for my opponents then I probably wouldn't be have been hit/killed by their attacks would I?

And no, my opponent's most likely were not using stealth detection potions (should I whisper and ask them next time? Something tells me you'd just claim they were lying)

In fact, I demonstrated in controlled environment how cloak breaks from charge attacks, and how it breaks from your own DoTs, and in next video I will demonstrate how it breaks when multiple player projectiles are shot towards you (since NPC projectiles I already showcased in first video), or how skills like Crushing Shock or Rapid Strikes break it.

Try to see past your prejudice & accept you're wrong.