Nightblade Stealth

AltusVenifus

Damage should not break your invisible status. Skill is useless, fix it already.

AlexDougherty

We know, everybody who has played a nightblade has said the same thing, so it's probably on the list.

Edit~ I've played a nightblade too, I'm agreeing with you, but saying it's got to be on the list of known bugs.

pmn100b16_ESO

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/143854/nb-cloak-broken-or-wai-video

Kind of been ignored thus far. I get the feeling ZoS isn't really interested.

http://youtu.be/qqBL7qHrEFk

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

yup, only been like 8+ months

AltusVenifus

Under its current mechanic it is working properly... but it is really stupid...

Your video shows how it is intended to work unfortunately... If they is any incoming damage coming your way, it will never work... notice the sword and board guards stop and start when u invis... but there is projectials, either already fired or in the process of being fired...

When u are hit with damage after you invis, you should remain invis, not have your invis broken... u are invis for 2.4 secs and stay that way...

If they find out that is OP, increase the cost... But fix it already...

AlexDougherty

AltusVenifus wrote: »

I'm not sure they think it is bugged. The mechanic of it is stupid...

They know it's bugged, they say AoE should break it, and Magelight and detect potion allow you to see through it.

Which means they know the other things are bugs, I mean how could they not, they've specified what isn't a bug, what's left no matter how ridiculous has to be a bug.

pmn100b16_ESO

AltusVenifus wrote: »

I'm not sure they think it is bugged. The mechanic of it is stupid...

When u are hit with damage after you invis, you should remain invis, not have your invis broken... u are invis for 2.4 secs and stay that way...

Your video shows how it is intended to work unfortunately... If they is any incoming damage coming your way, it will never work... notice the sword and board guards stop and start when u invis...

If they find out that is OP, increase the cost... But fix it already...

If you take the damage and stay invisible as you say, it would work. Its the fact that invis keeps breaking that allows the mobs to re target and fire a projectile. Thats whats the vid is showing. Stay invisible and only the first couple of projectiles would hit, then nothing further would be fired at you because they can't see you. Thats how I think it should work.

Vikestart

And what's up with tougher enemies (ones with cooler healthbars) being immune to your invisibility? Kinda lame since it's an important class trait.

AltusVenifus

AlexDougherty wrote: »

AltusVenifus wrote: »

I'm not sure they think it is bugged. The mechanic of it is stupid...

They know it's bugged, they say AoE should break it, and Magelight and detect potion allow you to see through it.

Which means they know the other things are bugs, I mean how could they not, they've specified what isn't a bug, what's left no matter how ridiculous has to be a bug.

That is my

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

AltusVenifus wrote: »

I'm not sure they think it is bugged. The mechanic of it is stupid...

When u are hit with damage after you invis, you should remain invis, not have your invis broken... u are invis for 2.4 secs and stay that way...

Your video shows how it is intended to work unfortunately... If they is any incoming damage coming your way, it will never work... notice the sword and board guards stop and start when u invis...

If they find out that is OP, increase the cost... But fix it already...

If you take the damage and stay invisible as you say, it would work. Its the fact that invis keeps breaking that allows the mobs to re target and fire a projectile. Thats whats the vid is showing. Stay invisible and only the first couple of projectiles would hit, then nothing further would be fired at you because they can't see you. Thats how I think it should work.

That is my point... I don't believe the skills is intended to work that way... Or it would have been fixed by now...

No damage should break your stealth... simple fix... Magelight and pots should reveal u to the player using it... not hard...

AltusVenifus

Vikestart wrote: »

And what's up with tougher enemies (ones with cooler healthbars) being immune to your invisibility? Kinda lame since it's an important class trait.

I personally don't mind the PVE side of it... I remember when u could stealth tank a boss into just standing there... that was broken as well

TheBull

AltusVenifus wrote: »

Under its current mechanic it is working properly... but it is really stupid...

Your video shows how it is intended to work unfortunately... If they is any incoming damage coming your way, it will never work... notice the sword and board guards stop and start when u invis... but there is projectials, either already fired or in the process of being fired...

When u are hit with damage after you invis, you should remain invis, not have your invis broken... u are invis for 2.4 secs and stay that way...

If they find out that is OP, increase the cost... But fix it already...

Not intended and not working properly. Cloak is supposed to grant 100% chance to miss from all direct attacks. Ask any NB in Cyrodiil at anytime (when working)clock is pressed before the incoming attack hits it will miss.

After the 1.5 change many of these attacks still track and fizzle on contact instead of the NB doing the dodge animations. This leads to a issue where if multiple attacks are coming in simultaneously some appear to get through and consistently breaks the NBs cloak. I think it's a server client issue and that the change to have attacks sometimes fizzle instead of miss attempted to fix but made things much worse...

Aeratus

I'm a NB main in PVP and I can't agree to having invisibility stay on damage, unless there are some restrictions to the usage of cloak.

If you do this, then there is no way to catch a fleeing NB. A magicka NB can chain cast cloak 10 times in a row while in combat.

Even a bolt escape sorc isn't bad, since a bolt escape sorc can be chased down by another bolt escape sorc.

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

AltusVenifus wrote: »

AlexDougherty wrote: »

AltusVenifus wrote: »

I'm not sure they think it is bugged. The mechanic of it is stupid...

They know it's bugged, they say AoE should break it, and Magelight and detect potion allow you to see through it.

Which means they know the other things are bugs, I mean how could they not, they've specified what isn't a bug, what's left no matter how ridiculous has to be a bug.

That is my

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

AltusVenifus wrote: »

I'm not sure they think it is bugged. The mechanic of it is stupid...

When u are hit with damage after you invis, you should remain invis, not have your invis broken... u are invis for 2.4 secs and stay that way...

Your video shows how it is intended to work unfortunately... If they is any incoming damage coming your way, it will never work... notice the sword and board guards stop and start when u invis...

If they find out that is OP, increase the cost... But fix it already...

If you take the damage and stay invisible as you say, it would work. Its the fact that invis keeps breaking that allows the mobs to re target and fire a projectile. Thats whats the vid is showing. Stay invisible and only the first couple of projectiles would hit, then nothing further would be fired at you because they can't see you. Thats how I think it should work.

No damage should break your stealth... simple fix... Magelight and pots should reveal u to the player using it... not hard...

I have been saying this for so long its rediculous by now.. cloak should not break on any damage, you should just take the damage..

when a Sorc casts Bolt Escape and takes damage does Bolt Escape fail to work ?? Nope.

When a Dragonknight casts Green Dragon Blood and he takes damage does that ability fail???Nope.

And nowhere in the tool tips does Shadow Cloak and its Morphs say it breaks on damage, no where...

pmn100b16_ESO

Aeratus wrote: »

I'm a NB main in PVP and I can't agree to having invisibility stay on damage, unless there are some restrictions to the usage of cloak.

If you do this, then there is no way to catch a fleeing NB. A magicka NB can chain cast cloak 10 times in a row while in combat.

Even a bolt escape sorc isn't bad, since a bolt escape sorc can be chased down by another bolt escape sorc.

mage light, detect pot, aoe...

AltusVenifus

Aeratus wrote: »

I'm a NB main in PVP and I can't agree to having invisibility stay on damage, unless there are some restrictions to the usage of cloak.

If you do this, then there is no way to catch a fleeing NB. A magicka NB can chain cast cloak 10 times in a row while in combat.

Even a bolt escape sorc isn't bad, since a bolt escape sorc can be chased down by another bolt escape sorc.

So increase cost... mage light and detect pots... there are counters... make them use one... instead of just spamming any ranged ability

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

Aeratus wrote: »

I'm a NB main in PVP and I can't agree to having invisibility stay on damage, unless there are some restrictions to the usage of cloak.

If you do this, then there is no way to catch a fleeing NB. A magicka NB can chain cast cloak 10 times in a row while in combat.

Even a bolt escape sorc isn't bad, since a bolt escape sorc can be chased down by another bolt escape sorc.

mage light, detect pot, aoe...

i have no problem with magelight, detect potion or the new ranged Flare aoe that is coming out.

Yes, a bolt escape person can be chased down but his Bolt escape ability does not fail does it.

I have no problem that Nightblades could get away, that is their skill, I mean hell they already Nerfed sneak attack damage vs other players in PvP ....what is left..

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

sorry, pmn100b16_ESO, that last one wasn't against you it was meant for Aeratus.

Vikestart

AltusVenifus wrote: »

Vikestart wrote: »

And what's up with tougher enemies (ones with cooler healthbars) being immune to your invisibility? Kinda lame since it's an important class trait.

I personally don't mind the PVE side of it... I remember when u could stealth tank a boss into just standing there... that was broken as well

Yeah, I don't mean dungeon bosses, I mean tougher mobs like Trolls in Grahtwood. It's weird.

NukeAllTheThings

don't worry guys, after 1.6 cloak & stealth will break again during weapon swap so we will stay consistent. I have come to look forward to how many things are broken during updates then fixed later while ignoring stuff that has been broken for months

XEVENEX

Stealth is cool, it adds a lot to PvP, but using it to escape a fight that YOU started is ***. You shouldn't be able to stealth up while in combat, and I can't wait for the stealth revealing flares to be added.

TLDR:

More Nightblades need to come up with builds that can actually fight toe to toe instead of relying on ganking people on horseback.

reften

I've learned to live with it. roll, dark cloak, roll dark cloak...until I get my full 2.4 seconds.

I use dark cloak exclusively as a run away tactic...or as a purge

Lava_Croft

XEVENEX wrote: »

Stealth is cool, it adds a lot to PvP, but using it to escape a fight that YOU started is ***. You shouldn't be able to stealth up while in combat, and I can't wait for the stealth revealing flares to be added.

TLDR:

More Nightblades need to come up with builds that can actually fight toe to toe instead of relying on ganking people on horseback.

Or you start quaffing detection potions, use Radiant Magelight, throw Caltrops, use AoE skills.

Suntzu1414

Here is a better question to ask:

1. if Reflective Scales reflects everything (almost) after implemented . Even spells "on their way".
2. why isn't NB Dark Cloak / Disguise treated the "same".

There seems to be TWO standards (mind the pun) in this game. DK abilities, and everyone else...

Treat DC/D same as RS. ALL projectiles/attacks "on their way" miss...


Kill Well
ST

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

Suntzu1414 wrote: »

Here is a better question to ask:

1. if Reflective Scales reflects everything (almost) after implemented . Even spells "on their way".
2. why isn't NB Dark Cloak / Disguise treated the "same".

There seems to be TWO standards (mind the pun) in this game. DK abilities, and everyone else...

Treat DC/D same as RS. ALL projectiles/attacks "on their way" miss...


Kill Well
ST

Actually, Reflective Scales is getting Nerfed, its gonna be 4 projectiles or 4 sec's in the future, But it will still atleast work for them, not like Shadow Cloak for Nightblades..

XEVENEX

Im not defending RS, but hiding while in combat a terrible mechanic. Nerd-UP and fight like the rest of us.

XEVENEX

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Actually, Reflective Scales is getting Nerfed, its gonna be 4 projectiles or 4 sec's in the future, But it will still atleast work for them, not like Shadow Cloak for Nightblades..

Which is still OP 1v1. You can barely cast 4 projectiles in 4 seconds if at all, which changes nothing.

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

Lava_Croft wrote: »

XEVENEX wrote: »

Stealth is cool, it adds a lot to PvP, but using it to escape a fight that YOU started is ***. You shouldn't be able to stealth up while in combat, and I can't wait for the stealth revealing flares to be added.

TLDR:

More Nightblades need to come up with builds that can actually fight toe to toe instead of relying on ganking people on horseback.

Or you start quaffing detection potions, use Radiant Magelight, throw Caltrops, use AoE skills.

Lava_Croft is basically saying you need to learn to play..

XEVENEX

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

XEVENEX wrote: »

Stealth is cool, it adds a lot to PvP, but using it to escape a fight that YOU started is ***. You shouldn't be able to stealth up while in combat, and I can't wait for the stealth revealing flares to be added.

TLDR:

More Nightblades need to come up with builds that can actually fight toe to toe instead of relying on ganking people on horseback.

Or you start quaffing detection potions, use Radiant Magelight, throw Caltrops, use AoE skills.

Lava_Croft is basically saying you need to learn to play..

I was thinking the same about Nightblades who want to play Peek-A-Boo Online. =D

Besides, nobody should have to use gold, their potion timer, or absurd amounts of magika/stamina to find someone who STARTED the fight.

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

XEVENEX wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

XEVENEX wrote: »

Stealth is cool, it adds a lot to PvP, but using it to escape a fight that YOU started is ***. You shouldn't be able to stealth up while in combat, and I can't wait for the stealth revealing flares to be added.

TLDR:

More Nightblades need to come up with builds that can actually fight toe to toe instead of relying on ganking people on horseback.

Or you start quaffing detection potions, use Radiant Magelight, throw Caltrops, use AoE skills.

Lava_Croft is basically saying you need to learn to play..

I was thinking the same about Nightblades who want to play Peek-A-Boo Online. =D

Besides, nobody should have to use gold, their potion timer, or absurd amounts of magika/stamina to find someone who STARTED the fight.

Actually it is called Guerrilla warfare, you could look it up but I'll help you.

"Tactically, the guerrilla army would avoid any confrontation with large units of enemy troops, but seek and eliminate small groups of soldiers to minimize losses and exhaust the opposing force. Not limiting their targets to personnel, enemy resources are also preferred targets. All of that is to weaken the enemy's strength, to cause the enemy eventually to be unable to prosecute the war any longer, and to force the enemy to withdraw."

So yes, you should have to use your gold, potion timer, etc to find and fight someone, it is a war of attrition and tactics and can be mental as well.

By the way, do you think America won the war against England by standing toe to toe with them??? the answer is no, they used guerrilla warfare or Why the Ninja in Japan were so good at what they did, namely subterfuge and assassination, do you think they were good by standing on a battlefield and not using combat tactics, stealth and operations tactics like they did, nope that was the samurai and bushi who died for their lords.

The Nightblades are the spec ops navy seal warriors of Tamriel. The Templars are the mystic healer warrior monks, the DK's are the big bad Samurai's and the Sorc's are the wizards with DPS support.

You should know your role when you play, I do.

Lynnessa

Vikestart wrote: »

And what's up with tougher enemies (ones with cooler healthbars) being immune to your invisibility? Kinda lame since it's an important class trait.

Even though you see "Target is too powerful for that effect", you do still get the increased damage (from the Master Assassin passive) and the increased amor/spellpen (from the Shadow Barrier passive).

Also, I think the stealth might still work on those types of enemies despite the "Target is too powerful" thing--I have snuck past plenty of dungeon bosses during foolhardy solo play.

DDuke

There are big problems with cloak, have been for months, and I don't think ZOS even cares about fixing them.

Today I saw another Nightblade go into stealth. I popped a stealth detection potion, spotting him instantly and proceeded to Heavy Attack->Poison Injection him with bow. After being hit, he cast cloak and started (still crouching) moving back where he came from. I walked behind him, hitting him with light attacks & flying blades all the while he was spamming cloak to no effect, until he was dead.

Seriously, something like this should not happen.

If I wanted to negate someone's invisibility or stealth, I would atleast expect that to take some skill (like a well placed AoE or a DoT on target), not having a toggleable ability or potion active, that takes zero skill from my part.

How are you supposed to play a sneaky rogue character, when you can suddenly be seen from miles away (41m vision infront of you with potion, 27m vision with magelight), and your only supposed tool for survival doesn't work (and you can't even really know it's not working or why it's not working)?

This alone would be bad, but add to this the fact that your cloak (and stealth) can and will be broken by:

• Charging enemy
• AoE
• DoTs (Dark Cloak sometimes fixes this problem)
• Random projectiles
• NPCs within 50m (especially the guards in Cyrodiil)

Also, after accidentally sneaking too close to a resource or keep & being instantly spotted by the flag NPCs (and subsequently by the huge zergball next to you), you are unable to restealth for anything between 20 seconds to 2 minutes. What is up with that?

8 Months, how can all these things still be an issue?

Scrap that - some of these weren't even issues before 1.4/1.5 patches.

How is 1.6 going to break the only ability for the rogue archetype even more?

I'm not sure it's even possible to break it even further, but that's what I though before 1.5.