Provisioning Revamp

eventide03b14a_ESO

rekina wrote: »

Cooking: Meat = health, fruit = magicka, vegetables = stamina

Shouldn't it be Meat = stamina, vegetables = health? lol

No, protein builds muscle and carbs (vegetables/grains) provide energy.

eventide03b14a_ESO

nudel wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

The regeneration benefit of drinking will now stack with food benefits (some balancing changes may occur)

Slightly worried that this will mean a nerf to food buffs across the board. Otherwise good changes overall.

I share your concern.

eventide03b14a_ESO

@ZOS_GinaBruno‌ Can you please rework the recipe book so that it's not a just a list of food you can make? It would be great if it looked more like the other TS and was organized better by level and tier and easier to find the stats you are looking for without having to look at each recipe.

justin.sniesakub17_ESO

Looks good overall. I especially like how the muti stat recipes will be rare. I will always be in favor of things being rare especially in regards to crafting.

justin.sniesakub17_ESO

shiva7663 wrote: »

I'd like to see actual farms with specifically harvestable crops. Even if the NPC farmers hire guards we have to defeat in order to take food crops.

badmojo wrote: »

I picked up thousands of ingredients, so I would have ingredients. Changing them to stale and making me sell them is not the right thing to do.

Also, THIS IS A PERFECT TIME TO INCORPORATE FISH INTO THE PROVISIONING SYSTEM!

This times 1000. I love the fishing system in this gane and to have it work with fishing would be icing on the cake

justin.sniesakub17_ESO

LonePirate wrote: »

I know 205 recipes at present and I have ingredients for about 20-25 of them currently stored in my bank or my bag. I think a conversion script is mandatory for existing accounts as I don't want to lose my current recipes and accumulated ingredients.

I have no issues with any of these changes and I like several of them. I just don't want to be left high and dry with almost no comparable recipes and ingredients for my character.

I would like to recommend one more change. Can the Provisioning Hireling be modified to deliver recipes? Here is what I propose.

Hireling Level I: One green recipe should be delivered with the single email received each day. No blue, purple or gold recipes should be delivered.

Hireling Level II: The daily emails should have a 25% chance of including a blue recipe thus a blue recipe would be delivered every 4 days. No purple or gold recipes should be included.

Hireling Level III: Each twice daily email should have a 50% chance of including a blue recipe; thereby the chances of receiving a blue recipe every day is high. Each of the two emails should also have a 5% chance of including a purple recipe, which is still far less than the chances of receiving purple upgrade materials from the blacksmithing/clothing/woodworking hirelings. Lastly, each of the two daily emails should have a 1%-2% chance of including a gold recipe, depending on how many of these recipes exist. The purple and gold recipes would still be rare; but they wouldn't be impossible like they are now.

No. I already hate the hireling system. Hirelings should never have a chance of delivering purple or gold mats. Items and recipes of that quality need to stay extremely rare, part of the fun. Not everything needs to obtainable quickly

Islyn

I cannot stand the whole thing aside from drinks and food stacking.

TRIP233

I like the new change. After I got to vet zones I haven't done any Provisioning because it's all low leveled stuff that would barely help me. I need vet leveled foods.

Mogdor

How will these new recipes be obtained;
by combining ingredients like in alchemy or will it stay the same?
How will you distribute the ingredients in the world, so that the trade will stay profitable? Does this mean there wont be ''level 1-12 meat'', just ''meat''? I hope it will be rewarding even if you dont have the best purple recipes.

timidobserver

Okay, the system changes sound good to me. My only remaining question is what kind of ETA do we have. Is this something that may be slipped into Update 3, or is it something that will be much further down the line?

@ZOS_GinaBruno‌

Night_Watch

There is a good arguement for including fish based recipes such as;

• Fishy Sticks
• Fish Fingers
• Crab Meat Cake (crabs could be killed or fished up)
• Fish Cakes
• Stargazer Pie
• Fish Soup (food or drink?)
• Fish Parcel
• Spiced Fish (could maybe use alchemy regent?)
• Oiled fish
• MANY more including drinks (probably)

Non of these need to be mandatory to leveling provisioning and no player should be forced to have to fish if they do not want to. Fish recipes would just be an additional way to supplement the provisioner that happens to like fishing or any provisioner that may find fish or buy fish from whatever source.

Where fishing recipes could be made to only appear in certain containers, fish or fish recipes or ingredients could be traded via vendor or guild store, guild store merchant or by face to face (so to say) trade.

Ideas for fishing containers and contents;

• Tackle box - random bait, recipe, fish
• Catch box / net - random fish
• Salt / ice crate - random fish / salted fish / cold fish
• (Fish) Crate - random fish, recipe
• Soggy backpack - random non provisioning items, rare (by some degree) fish recipe
• Book Shelf - (Cook Book) Fish or other recipe

The provisioner that did not want to fish would only be affected if they wanted to collect all provisining recipes and, even then, may not need to fish as the recipes could all be found by other means or bought (guild store etc).

These are just ideas that seem to make sense (to me at least).

ShiftControl

Something caught my eye today I was reading developer responds or statements and its said they will make the recipes common to rare along with the ingredients.
If ZoS will make mats rare it will jack up the price. The materials should be available widely period, not like todays Alchemy mats where Bugloss is 1:10 over other herbs and Wormweed is 3:1 to other essentials. ZoS is just that incompetent to balancing things, or its intended idiocy.
So I’m worried they will make nice recipes with “good” benefits nerfing the existing ones and wont be able to find the mats needed to create the new lower value food and drink. (I mean here compared to existing value)
As of today you will loot about 150 honeycomb and the same time about 30 Onions with it. What’s wrong with numbers?
My Provisioning hireling flooding me with useless grapes, I rarely getting gold material from my BS hireling. I would love to fire both of those guys but it would cost 24k to respect.
The folks programming have “F” in math or you let interns doing the loot balance? Or its intended?
You guys frustrate the player community left and right.
So ZoS please prove yourself this time so we have more smiley faces in game and on the forums THX

grizzbi

Thanks for these changes: they are all welcome and meaningful.

A few idea to add some spice:

- Fishing-when revamped- should be tied in a way to cooking. Many of us like the idea to cook their fish. It should not be required but it could provide additional recipes for cosmetics buff, temporary transformations, useless pets etc..like the collectible items which can already be obtained from a few quests.

- Let us organize our production. Recipes should be able to be tagged as favorites. Then the materials used in these recipes would be highlighted in our bank/inventory. Also, we should be able to apply filters to display the recipes (level, rarity, alphabetical order, most used, or even popular!)

- Introduce some randomness for some of the recipes. There should be some variance between the results. i.e Out of 100 attempts on the same recipe, I should be able to cook a few exceptional foods/drinks with additional or higher buffs. A small part of the additional materials needed for these recipes should be perishable and only found in particular location (and some of them from fishing). It should promote cooks to organize depending on what they want to try to achieve: the basic (good) result or the (slightly better) enhanced one.

- Keep the high rarity of purple recipes (but make them obtainable from everywhere). Everyone should not be able to obtain the exact same purple recipes after a week. Blue recipes should all be obtainable with some work, but purple recipes should remain very rare. One or two non repeatable quest should help to ensure any chief to be able to choose a purple recipe from a list and make it his specialty.

- Recipes should be found in bookshelves, bags. But also with a skill to use on Npcs.Like persuade or intimidate from the fighter and mage guilds. This would encourage people to do the quests and see if they got this option at some point or after the final step. Travelling merchants, and random npcs could also sometimes have this option enable.

Keep on the good job!

MKLS

Overall I like the idea as I think it will be an improvement, especially being able to eat and drink at the same time and being able to predict what items needs searching to find what you are looking for if you are looking for a specific type of ingredient.

My major concern is how the transition will be made:

I hate the stale food idea and would much prefer the food be changed to an equivalent rarity new style food item ie 4 particular old style items all change to the same single new style item.

I am also concerned re the recipes - not that I have many as the rares are too rare in my opinion at the moment - but those I do have - especially the health and magika I use at all times and would not be happy to lose. I can only imagine how annoyed players would be if they are not compensated by an equivalent recipe if they have spent huge amounts of gold or time to obtain it.

..............................................................................................................

Re possible extensions to the idea, personally I love the suggestion of adding fish to some recipes to make fishing useful - perhaps even have different recipes giving the same bonuses ie fish pie and beef pie give the same stats but allow players to look in different places so if players don't want to fish they don't have to.

Evolving it one stage further brings in the suggestion of fruit trees, fields, drops from beast etc so players can hunt in crates, barrels etc for items that NPC's have already found or actually become the "finders" themselves and collect the mats from the raw states

Edit: Added after reading above post:

I also like the idea of quests for chefs - but I would prefer giving recipes that are bound to the chef and can only be used by the chef so that at the end of the quest the chef could choose which variant of a recipe they wanted - that would encourage players to level the craft on more than one character - and the quest should be hard so that it takes time to finish so that you do not get all of the quest done within an hour.

reften

SO I've been planning a TON to build up to 60 purple VR5 foods...and about 70 blue +health+Magicka VR5 (Fortified sweetrolls).

Tell me those are not going to get nerfed...

kirnmalidus

Allowing food and drink to stack is a step in the right direction to make beverages worthwhile. Currently they are basically useless as people will have their primary regen stat soft-capped and prefer to use the food buff on two or three attributes instead.

The recipe changes sound good, as long as my VR5 blue and purple recipes translate in some way and I don't lose the value I had in them to make the foods I use, and beverages I would use if they stacked.

I don't really like the way ingredients will be handled per this post. I have huge stockpiles of ingredients that would be useful for food types if I bought the last ingredient from the grocer, but I buy those sparingly so I have the other ingredients in abundance. It would really be lame if I lost that and had to start from scratch in building up my provisioning stockpile.

MasterSpatula

lancepro wrote: »

psufan5 wrote: »

Did you just say you have 8 toons, followed by you are a casual player?

Yeah I think the average casual player by now has about 8 characters; 1 or 2 of which has probably broken into veteran levels in different alliances, with the rest being used as crafters/pack mules or sitting around looking pretty.

I have a character for each craft, and I level them all (but not at the same rate) to get the skill points necessary to keep leveling crafting. I also have 2 mules. I consider myself pretty casual.

MasterSpatula

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey folks, just wanted to clarify a few things based on questions or comments that have been raised so far in this thread:

• When we say "Combination recipes will be rarer, require more ingredients, and give multiple benefits as expected", this means that they are rarer than non-combination recipes, not rarer than they are now.
  
• The ingredients themselves will not be tiered, but the recipes themselves and the food made from them, will be. The plan is to make each recipe be a specific unique combination of ingredients that is not duplicated in any other recipe. This means that putting venison and cheese together may result in a level 5 recipe, but putting venison and flour together may result in a level 50 recipe, even though all the base materials are available immediately.

These make me a happy Spatula.

Islyn

I just do not want to lost the main recipes I use after walking all over creation 2x a day to build a pile of Red Wheat/Honeycomb/Onions/Salt/Pepper.

Please just make the drinks and food stack and leave the rest alone.

I am already so SOO bummed re twilights/willows changes and the loss of SOOOO MANY dreugh wax and rosin - a big part of me feel like quitting already.

After saving and saving and saving food items; to have all those hours (and sub money) become WORTHLESS just *I have no words.* it is horrible.

WaySeeker0

Well, this is certainly interesting. But I would really like to see other avenues for getting recipes as well. That would be a big improvement! What is so wrong about being able to BUY recipes? The rarity could be kept if it costs more, or are only available from certain Merchants (perhaps even some of the traveling ones or harder towns to free or to get to/not on the map?)
What would be fun is if quests could implement this! Say you go to a provisioner merchant, and you have found him accosted on the road. He complains that he was attacked. You can go to some dungeon, fight your way to the culprit (it could be a chain if you wanted), (and perhaps get a recipe drop). Then you return to the merchant, who offers you a copy of that very recipie (or one as a reward for the Quest if there is no recipe drop)!
It would be simply nice to buy recipes from Provisioner Merchants as well, but the higher/rare ones that do more for you could be much more fun to gain via this manner.
You could find a town of cooks and save the town, one recipe at a time OK, now I am just being silly! :-) But if Magic and Thieves can have a God, why not Provisioning? Sorry, still being silly ~_^
I would also like to see a "VR" version of capped Provisioning so you can continue the crafting after you have capped it so it is worth something after cap. Whatever your character level is, that is. And more guiding the player to getting recipes instead of simple random object-search drops. This should also be implemented if the Justice System is installed to provide a different way to craft recipes than risking jail simply to getting a slight chance of gaining a recipe (unless it is rare, then it could be a quest/mission/challenge to steal a recipe).
Another idea I just had, after I wrote this and was about to post, is .... what if it becomes like Alchemy? This may not keep Provisioning as unique apart from alchemy, but it is just an idea I had just now. You could discover recipes this way, or simply create dishes/drinks from experimenting with combinations just like Alchemy. I admit this is a far more complicated idea, changes Provisioning far more, and makes it too like Alchemy. I'm keeping it in because it is kind of interesting never-the-less.

Islyn

@ZOS_GinaBruno
Also: Why didn't you just make a poll?

• Leave provisioning as-is
• Spend loads of time and money to do all kinds of unnecessary things to provisioning
• stack food and drink

I will bet you 100000000000g that I know what the majority would say.

Also, aren't there enough things wrong?

So everyone doesn't have a purple recipe. Well so what?

I don't have 67 rosin/kuta/whatever from my hireling!

My guild bank has LOADS and LOADS of blue recipe dupes; so no shortage there.

We are once again where people who don't make any effort have the most sway thus making the effort that WE made since day one POINTLESS.

Why bother playing a game if every effort and choice and time spent will turn out to be worthless and pointless?

Ruin my class: I respec and learn all new stuff and make all new armour and weapons.
Ruin my brand new armor/weapon sets I just made: (August) OoooKaayyy....I am thinking of quitting because I just cannot have anything good here no matter how hard I work for it or how many times.
Ruin my very first crafting skill: Well THANKS. The only thing that works just fine and somehow there is a reason to change it; are there not enough broken things in this?

Islyn

TRIP233 wrote: »

I like the new change. After I got to vet zones I haven't done any Provisioning because it's all low leveled stuff that would barely help me. I need vet leveled foods.

You only need a few ingredients, depending on what you make.

For VRs these are located in:
Rwal Ka, Riften, Alik'r Bangkorai (sorry bad with names).

Sorted.

Mortosk

Islyn wrote: »

TRIP233 wrote: »

I like the new change. After I got to vet zones I haven't done any Provisioning because it's all low leveled stuff that would barely help me. I need vet leveled foods.

You only need a few ingredients, depending on what you make.

For VRs these are located in:
Rwal Ka, Riften, Alik'r.

Sorted.

Think you meant Bangkorai not Alik'r.

Mortosk

Maverick827 wrote: »

Cogo wrote: »

2. RARE. Purple recipes or any NEW powerful recipes MUST be rare.

Why?

Even the dev acknowledged the drop rate on purple provisioning recipes is "Insane" (his words) and unintended.

Cogo's a little off her rocker if she thinks the drop rate is OK the way it is.

Woolenthreads

ShiftControl wrote: »

Something caught my eye today I was reading developer responds or statements and its said they will make the recipes common to rare along with the ingredients.

I think they're wanting to bring it into line with the other crafting skills which use that system of increasing rarity development

Goibot

@ZOS_GinaBruno a sweet roll for you

Shennynerd

As a recipe collector, I am very much against the removal of recipes unless you were able to somehow grant their new equivalents to people that had the old ones. Also I think it would be beneficial to change recipes and ingredients back to being leveled based on the zone and not the character level. Let's face it, it's easier to relog and farm these things in one area than to go all over the face of Tamriel for them.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

[*] The regeneration benefit of drinking will now stack with food benefits (some balancing changes may occur)

ElfFromSpace

1. Ingredients: Cutting down on ingredients is good. With 180 bank I STILL need to store most of my ingredients in a guild bank. Downside: rare ingredients like pepper make hirelings worthwhile. Blue recipes should still require one seasoning and purples 2. So rabbit + carrots + salt = "blue" rabbit stew health/stamina. Rabbits +carrots +fruit + salt + pepper = purple food (what kind of food does that make??? Perhaps the third type should be grains. Meat = Health Stamina = grains, magic = veggies. Fruits can go in wines) . Get rid of excess seasonings like garlic and onion still cut ingredients by half.

2. Replacements I've invested about 70K and HOURS into recipe collecting. Others have spend 500K+. I also have a stockpile of foods in my guild worth 50-100k, so maintaining the value is important. I understand the risk of investing in a changing game, but giving players replacement recipes and foods of the same type would be the fairest solution.

3. Stacking food and drink. GOOD! I want to be the best Elf Wench in the game, but nobody wants my brews! Donning the drindl and serving foods just isn't the same Stacking both would be very cool!



Regarding Current Ingredient Hunting:
I'm NOT happy with the most recent change to looting ingredients. I used to go to Mobal Tor when I wanted to make level 35 foods and now I can't A woodworker who wants oak can go to Greenshade. If he wants to hunt Orcish Motif's and is a vet player, he can still go back to his home area and find basic motifs. We should be able to find level 35 recipes and ingredients in level 35 zones please and vet zones can still drop vet level stuff. Please add ALL ingredients. Vet players are have absolutely NO chance and no way to try to complete their collections.

Also agree with purple recipes being just a little too rare and wanting a V10 or V12 tier of provisions.

Iam_Epiphany

My only 2 concerns have primarily been addressed in the post, but I want to hit it home. As main provisioner for my guild, I am 100% OK with this system if:

1. My Purple recipes are all still available, they weren't cheap.
2. The stockpiles of blue and purple V5 food in our guild bank all have alternatives which increase the same resources. I'd hate to see hundreds of purple pieces of food turning stale or blue food offering resources we don't need.

I understand that these issues were covered, but in the case of V5 food and purple recipes, which weren't cheap to make, it should absolutely be ensured that these things transfer as closely as possible to their current roles.

I'm not so bothered about ingredients.

wenchmore420b14_ESO

How about some new recipes, rare, that use the rare fish caught for achievements? The Fishing Achievements are broke at present, and I know it's not a priority, but when you do catch a rare fish, it doesn't go to inventory. But if we could keep them, they could be sold to provisionrs to make rare foods to sell to Tamriel..Help the economy, get more people fishing, adds something new to game. Thank you for a great game!