Provisioning Revamp

Giraffon

How about a "Favorites" option for your recipes? Usually I'm only after certain things based on my character's build.

I want to go out into the woods and kill deer and catch fish for meat and pick berries from berry plants! Why do I have to settle for stuff out of a crate? Those items should be of a higher quality too as they are the freshest.

How about buffs for horses? Not the permanent things like apples, but just like you can give your toons? Let's say I make dried apples for my horse and he's 5% faster for 10 minutes.

Cogo

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We’re considering a significant revamp of Provisioning, and we’d like to get your feedback on it. Our goals with this proposed change are to improve the experience of collecting ingredients, to get away from the idea of tiered components, and to make brewing more useful. In a nutshell, we want to allow you to utilize every basic foodstuff you see in the game with cooking.

Ingredients

• Cooking: What You See Is What You Get
  • You see grapes, you get grapes. You see cheese, you get cheese. No more clicking on a sack of green beans and getting aged meat.
• Brewing: Based on container type (barrels, sacks, and crates)
  • Brewing ingredients will be broken up by closed container type to keep them useful and to avoid overlap with cooking.

Functionality

• Food and drink categories will have clearer usage
  • Cooking: Meat = health, fruit = magicka, vegetables = stamina
  • Brewing: Alcohol = health, tea = magicka, tonic = stamina
• Combination recipes will be rarer, require more ingredients, and give multiple benefits as expected
  • Example: Rabbit (meat) and carrots (vegetable) may be combined if you have the Rabbit Stew recipe, and the result provides both a health and stamina pool increase (somewhat less than what a pure health or pure stamina food would provide, as in the current system).
• The regeneration benefit of drinking will now stack with food benefits (some balancing changes may occur)

By having ingredients sourced in clear ways and using combinations of food items instead of tiers of ingredients, we will be able to cut the number of ingredients in half while still providing just as many recipes as we have now (if not more). This will require most, if not all, of the existing recipes to be changed to accommodate this new paradigm.

Our current plan is to replace existing recipes and Provisioning items with the ones from the new system, matching quality as much as possible. Any additional unused basic ingredients from the previous incarnation of the system will be changed to “stale” versions of themselves, and we’d like to include some way to offload them that provides value.

We realize this is a major change and that many of you have invested heavily in leveling up Provisioning and collecting recipes, so we wanted to get your feedback before proceeding. We feel this would be a major improvement to the game and want to hear your thoughts on the matter!

I like the idea! And its needed.

1. If you can do this with balance in mind, I am ALL for mixing regen and buff food. So far its been a choice, but regen only really been useful lvl 1-50.
Very good idea.....balancing is important though.

2. RARE. Purple recipes or any NEW powerful recipes MUST be rare.
There need to be semi rare blue recipes like today, that you can use, but not always have access too....that way we keep the value of food buffs and dont just expect them all the time.

3. Regarding mats. I think its good as it is. Same like gear. It should be some sort of random and not just you know before you see it what it is. Exploring and being nosy about everything, should still pay off. This is also to not bring back "farming". Mats are not hard to come by when you to get them, have a guild who helps, or simply go buy em in a guild store.

This looks great!

Guild chef, for 50 players. Always have BLUE lvl 50 food buffs in guild bank for all to use.

SoulScream

I say yes!

Domander

My opinion is keep the current system and add recipes, and make drinks usable with food. Use the resources that were going to go into this revamp to improve another part of the game.

shiva7663

I'd like to see actual farms with specifically harvestable crops. Even if the NPC farmers hire guards we have to defeat in order to take food crops.

eventide03b14a_ESO

SirAndy wrote: »

joeparadis_ESO wrote: »

One thing that always bothered me was delving into a dungeon previously unexplored for hundreds of years but finding fresh wheat malt and grapes lying around inside lol.

@joeparadis_ESO
What always bothers me is that people expect realism in some of the oddest places while playing a fantasy game.

Your have walking lizards and talking cats and flying ghost dinosaur pets and you shoot fireballs out of a wooden stick and you can carry 100 swords and drink a potion that can heal you in a second and wear a hat that can knock back an opponent, yet you are bothered to find a bundle of grapes in a dungeon?

I'll try to explain it to you. There is this concept in fiction called suspension of disbelief. With this we are able to accept the fiction as realistic within the framework of the creator. Things that we are unfamiliar with behave in ways that are defined by the universe's rules. If things we are familiar with behave in unexpected ways without explanation however, then it can be very jarring. So we accept that there is this energy called magicka that can allow for fireballs to be shot from staves, or that some sort of evolutionary path has allowed for lizard men. Fruit that has been sitting in a barrel for 1,000 years without rotting and no explanation given? That's breaking the suspension of disbelief and hence the immersion.

Armitas

Could you add an additional tree to the provisioning UI to sort by level requirement?
Example. (____ added to keep format)

+Level 50-V5
_________+Grilling
_________+ Baking
________________Sweet Roll
________________Fortified Sweet Roll
_________+ Stews
+Level 40-50
+Level 30-40
+Level 20-30
+Level 10-20
+Level 1-10

This is going to be really great.


Update.

Could you also give the grocer (common ingredient merchant) a unique map signature? It can be very difficult to find a grocer on the map because they share the same signature as the common food merchants. I think some major cities even lack a grocer.

eventide03b14a_ESO

Domander wrote: »

My opinion is keep the current system and add recipes, and make drinks usable with food. Use the resources that were going to go into this revamp to improve another part of the game.

They are going to allow drinks useable with food per the OP.

Maverick827

Cogo wrote: »

2. RARE. Purple recipes or any NEW powerful recipes MUST be rare.

Why?

shiva7663

Rotting or desiccated into fragile husks. On the other hand, I can imagine Dwemer ruins with exquisitely preserved foodstuffs: their understanding of the nature of reality was phenomenal.

Gilvoth

sounds Awesome! let's do it!
Time to Eat!
ty

Tarukmockto

purple-magicb16_ESO wrote: »

Probably simply by using the crafter's level as a multiplier when determining benefits & level of provision.

If that's the case, how do you make low level items for alts or sale to players at lower levels?

Gilvoth

shiva7663 wrote: »

I'd like to see actual farms with specifically harvestable crops. Even if the NPC farmers hire guards we have to defeat in order to take food crops.

ok, this right here is kind of scary request you made, because, what might end up happen is that the garden might only be available in cryodiil if you own a keep then you can go to the farm it's connected to. but if not, well, then your out of luck and out of food

RazielSR

I COMPLETELY agree with these changes. Mainly What You See Is What You Get and the container type comment. Absolutely amazing!!!

eventide03b14a_ESO

Hlaren_shortsheath wrote: »

shiva7663 wrote: »

I'd like to see actual farms with specifically harvestable crops. Even if the NPC farmers hire guards we have to defeat in order to take food crops.

ok, this right here is kind of scary request you made, because, what might end up happen is that the garden might only be available in cryodiil if you own a keep then you can go to the farm it's connected to. but if not, well, then your out of luck and out of food

Why not have some sort of crafting bonus when you control a resource? It makes sense and would be another way to encourage people to take and protect those resources.

ShiftControl

As a crafter /provisioner I love the idea as long as lvl 50 provisioner with all know recipes won't loose my knowledge.

Only questions are how long would it take to implement it 1 month 3 months 6 months?
And how many new bugs will be created with it? If we can fish with the bugs or we could cook them let it be asap please more to the poor players.
Oh could you guys make some "real epic" and legendary recipes as well please which would drop time to time?
We all Appreciate the hard work thank you

Gilvoth

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Hlaren_shortsheath wrote: »

shiva7663 wrote: »

I'd like to see actual farms with specifically harvestable crops. Even if the NPC farmers hire guards we have to defeat in order to take food crops.

ok, this right here is kind of scary request you made, because, what might end up happen is that the garden might only be available in cryodiil if you own a keep then you can go to the farm it's connected to. but if not, well, then your out of luck and out of food

Why not have some sort of crafting bonus when you control a resource? It makes sense and would be another way to encourage people to take and protect those resources.

sounds good

Armitas

phunkeymonkehb16_ESO wrote: »

This doesn't bode well for my 900 strong supply of Fortified Sweetroll

Nazon_Katts

My, I found drinks to be rather pointless not only because of the lesser benefit compared to food, but mainly due to the fact I was beyond the softcap anyways.

Are there any plans to raise the regen softcap?

Otherwise - and I take it the balancing means reducing the effects of food and drink overall - this balancing will only result in a nerf and I'd rather just keep my single food buff in that case.

Other than that, I believe this to be good and very much needed changes, as the rather simple system was too bloated with all too many ingredients.

Gilvoth

Armitas wrote: »

phunkeymonkehb16_ESO wrote: »

This doesn't bode well for my 900 strong supply of Fortified Sweetroll

considering the fact that the creature in this short film appiers to be using a "nord shout" and considering this character seems to love sweetrolls, i must believe we are looking at the typical nord living quarters.
i cannot say "im surprised" as that would be an untruth.

shiva7663

Hlaren_shortsheath wrote: »

shiva7663 wrote: »

I'd like to see actual farms with specifically harvestable crops. Even if the NPC farmers hire guards we have to defeat in order to take food crops.

ok, this right here is kind of scary request you made, because, what might end up happen is that the garden might only be available in cryodiil if you own a keep then you can go to the farm it's connected to. but if not, well, then your out of luck and out of food

I can imagine both PvE and PvP applications of my idea. It doesn't have to be exclusively one or the other.

LonePirate

I know 205 recipes at present and I have ingredients for about 20-25 of them currently stored in my bank or my bag. I think a conversion script is mandatory for existing accounts as I don't want to lose my current recipes and accumulated ingredients.

I have no issues with any of these changes and I like several of them. I just don't want to be left high and dry with almost no comparable recipes and ingredients for my character.

I would like to recommend one more change. Can the Provisioning Hireling be modified to deliver recipes? Here is what I propose.

Hireling Level I: One green recipe should be delivered with the single email received each day. No blue, purple or gold recipes should be delivered.

Hireling Level II: The daily emails should have a 25% chance of including a blue recipe thus a blue recipe would be delivered every 4 days. No purple or gold recipes should be included.

Hireling Level III: Each twice daily email should have a 50% chance of including a blue recipe; thereby the chances of receiving a blue recipe every day is high. Each of the two emails should also have a 5% chance of including a purple recipe, which is still far less than the chances of receiving purple upgrade materials from the blacksmithing/clothing/woodworking hirelings. Lastly, each of the two daily emails should have a 1%-2% chance of including a gold recipe, depending on how many of these recipes exist. The purple and gold recipes would still be rare; but they wouldn't be impossible like they are now.

psufan5

joeparadis_ESO wrote: »

I have some feedback:

1) I really like the idea of cutting down the amount of provisioning ingredients and placing them in proper containers as well as the re-organization of those materials.

2) How will looting these items change when we move to the justice system? Will we be stealing these items out of vendor stalls and from all the containers on the docks in Vulkel guard? or will it be free looting per usual?

3) how will this effect dungeons? One thing that always bothered me was delving into a dungeon previously unexplored for hundreds of years but finding fresh wheat malt and grapes lying around inside lol.

4) I DON'T like the idea of nerfing recipe drops. It's hard as hell to find combo recipes as it is. Especially epic recipes. I've been playing the game since prelaunch and I've only found a single purple recipe while playing 8 toons.

The people that are finding these recipes in bulk are professional players of the game who are constantly online farming mats, chests, dungeons etc. Please don't Nerf it for the rest of us more casual players. Also regarding epic recipes one of the things that makes them Less "Epic" is the fact that their buff values are nerfed.

I'd rather see a fourth legendary tier recipe bracket which requires more ingredients than even epic meals and will give the player non-nerfed buffs for 2 hrs.

Did you just say you have 8 toons, followed by you are a casual player?

Nicky_W

LonePirate wrote: »

Hireling Level III: Each twice daily email should have a 50% chance of including a blue recipe; thereby the chances of receiving a blue recipe every day is high. Each of the two emails should also have a 5% chance of including a purple recipe, which is still far less than the chances of receiving purple upgrade materials from the blacksmithing/clothing/woodworking hirelings. Lastly, each of the two daily emails should have a 1%-2% chance of including a gold recipe, depending on how many of these recipes exist. The purple and gold recipes would still be rare; but they wouldn't be impossible like they are now.

Personally I don't want recipes from my hirelings.
In your scenario, great, I get all the recipes in a few weeks. After that I get swamped with duplicate recipes that I no longer need.
I don't want the few items I receive daily to be things I have absolutely no use for, such as duplicate recipes.
Maybe the purple ones with a small 1% chance, but blue ones...no thanks. I find tons of those every day.

SirAndy

eventide03b14a_ESO wrote: »

Fruit that has been sitting in a barrel for 1,000 years without rotting and no explanation given? That's breaking the suspension of disbelief and hence the immersion.

@eventide03b14a_ESO

Then let me explain this to you in words you can understand:

The fruit in the dungeons is of course *not* thousands of years old. It is in fact fresh.
It is replenished by the spirits of the dead that still linger in those dungeons as an offering to those who delve into their domain.
An offering to the living to honor their service to Nirn.

There, i just fixed your broken immersion. You're welcome ...
;-)

ShiftControl

Reading all this responds my head already spinning don't you guys asking to much? let them do what they wanna do how they want it done, bc if you gave them new ideas more complex things we going to end up bug infested crops and such we ain't getting anything out of bugs unless we can fish with it. but its not going to happen Instead you will burn your food and will taste bad with no benefits

logsplitter69b14_ESO

I would like a complex provisioning system, just not ineffectively complex as it is now. Basically level restricted recipes plus level restricted mats. (to me)This suggestion basically says you want to get rid of level restricted mats. I really like that idea. But I do think level restricted recipes should go too.

I'm not a big fan of level restricted foods. I would rather see all foods edible at all levels where your level dictates the bonus. So that rabbit stew may give you +100 health/stamina at lvl 25 and +248 health/stamina at VR12 (4 stat points per level). Else you just have a bunch of recipes you hardly ever use.

Mortosk

@ZOS_GinaBruno‌

Do you have anything to say about the drop rates of Purple provisioning recipes and the bottle neck of oats and tomatoes perhaps going a little to far?

As I stated in my other post I average only 2.5 tomatoes and 2.7 oats per day with my main + 3 provisioning mules so if you divide that by 4, a person who only has 1 provisioner gets 0.675 oats and 0.625 tomatoes per day. Seems kind of low.

With respect to purple provisioning recipes, I am almost VR9, and I am a bit OCD about opening every cupboard, wardrobe, chest, etc. that I see, and have been doing that since beta, and I have never, not once, seen a purple provisioning recipe. In fact, I even farmed all my own rare motifs instead of buying them, and that involved hours of logging in and out to reset containers. Still, I never saw a single purple recipe.

That tells me that they are probably too rare. In addition to this, I see people selling V5 provisioning recipes for upwards of 800K gold. That seems a little ridiculous and if someone has to pay that they will never recoup their investment by selling purple food. In fact, they could buy a year's worth of food @ the going rate of 300g EA with that kind of gold.

badmojo

I picked up thousands of ingredients, so I would have ingredients. Changing them to stale and making me sell them is not the right thing to do.

Also, THIS IS A PERFECT TIME TO INCORPORATE FISH INTO THE PROVISIONING SYSTEM!

Mortosk

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Our current plan is to replace existing recipes and Provisioning items with the ones from the new system, matching quality as much as possible. Any additional unused basic ingredients from the previous incarnation of the system will be changed to “stale” versions of themselves, and we’d like to include some way to offload them that provides value.

I think you should seriously consider putting a fair gold value on the ingredients you decide to make stale. At least 5g each. Certainly not 0 gold like stale radishes.

It is only fair to those that have been sacrificing space to store these all this time. I have an entire 170 slot shared bank full of 4 or 5 stacks of Tier IV/V/VI ingredients. What can I say? I was saving for a rainy day.

I would hope that I could vendor them for something, as I have been collecting them since launch.