This game is great, but not many realize it.

Mr.Turtlesworth

This game gets a bad rap... And honestly I'm not sure why... People are focusing on all the negatives in this game ( and too be honest, I can't think of many except maybe that there's no arena or duel function ), but people don't realize that there is NO perfect mmo. I had fun in WoW, I had fun in a Tera, Perfect World, Last chaos, ect but I can't think of anything that they do better than this game. The speed of updates in this game puts WoW to shame. People are just too damn picky. Thank you Zenimax and Bethesda for making this game and your constant updates and fixes to the game are extremely impressive.

lpool96

Well said, and I agree with you. Also looking forward to late August, September when half the world comes back from vacation. I my self will be gone for four weeks starting from next week and I'm sure going to miss this beautiful game through out my vacation!

Tavore1138

The nature of the interweb?

People rarely take time out to say nice things on forums about anything whether its ESO or anything else.

Past MMO players will grumble because they want it to be a pastiche of all their favourite bits from other MMOs (where's the AH? why can't I duel? I miss corpse runs?).

Past TES players want TES online (Why can't I roam anywhere anytime? I want a difficulty slider? I don't want to have to group?).

Many want the familiar and will focus on the bits they don't like instead of the bits they do.

And the game does still have some flaws, much fewer than it did, but there are still enough to justify some genuine complaints too.

Personally if I wasn't enjoying most of it I wouldn't still be paying & playing.

Hilgara

I can see the epitaph. Great game but no one got it.
Unfortunately in MMO's everyone has to get if for it to be considered great.

steveb16_ESO46

You don't get to tell people if they are having fun or not and it doesn't matter what people say on forums anyway. It's money that talks and what it's been saying to Zenimax is - make big changes because things aren't going well.

It's good that you're enjoying the game as is. Others aren't. But if you cannot imagine what other games have and this one is currently missing then I really cannot believe you've played many MMO's.

Cyanhide

I agree, this game has such a bad rep it isn't even funny. Most people want to play the game but to scared because of stupid reviews like angry gamer which is the first video you get when go to youtube.

The game may have had a terrible launch, but so far I have had zero bug. Overall the game feels very polished and smooth. I wish Zenimax would give out guest passes after update 3 so people can see for themselves.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO

Cyanhide wrote: »

The game may have had a terrible launch, but so far I have had zero bug. Overall the game feels very polished and smooth. I wish Zenimax would give out guest passes after update 3 so people can see for themselves.

Having suffered three different game-breaking progress-blocking quest bugs, and currently have 5 broken quests across 4 characters, I would just say consider yourself very lucky .. just look at all the patch notes ZOS have issued and see the DOZENS of broken quests and other game mechanics to see the impartial evidence.

@Mr.Turtlesworth you're right, there's no 'perfect MMO', sadly for ZOS, ESO is one of the least perfect ever when it comes to the array of broken parts of the game.

Even now, three months after release there are STILL progress-blocking quest bugs, people are unable to proceed to Coldharbour due to them or else unable to unlock VR content, I can't think of any game I played at launch (5 so far) which were still in that state 3 months later.

Tavore1138

steveb16_ESO46 wrote: »

It's good that you're enjoying the game as is. Others aren't. But if you cannot imagine what other games have and this one is currently missing then I really cannot believe you've played many MMO's.

And this is exactly what I mean - you are not totally happy because this does not feel like other MMOs you have liked? But if you liked them why are you not still playing them? (Not trying to give you an 'if you don't like it go away' type comment just get confused by why you'd leave a game which had features you prefer to one where you miss them).

Can't speak for the OP but I have not played other MMOs tried a couple very briefly, hated them because of the number of players who seemed to take enormous pleasure in ruining the playing experience of others - one of my favourite things here is that PvP is isolated and faction based with no built in way to abuse people you have just killed etc. And in the rest of the game the multiplayer is all about us against the beasties.

Cyanhide

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

..

Every single mmo has bug/quest fixes in patchnotes. an MMO is a living thing, you have your opinion, i have mine.

All I can say is, people tell the game is in a worse state then it actually is. And 3 months in launch is nothing, this is normal.

Rivqua

Mr.Turtlesworth wrote: »

This game gets a bad rap... And honestly I'm not sure why... People are focusing on all the negatives in this game ( and too be honest, I can't think of many except maybe that there's no arena or duel function ), but people don't realize that there is NO perfect mmo. I had fun in WoW, I had fun in a Tera, Perfect World, Last chaos, ect but I can't think of anything that they do better than this game. The speed of updates in this game puts WoW to shame. People are just too damn picky. Thank you Zenimax and Bethesda for making this game and your constant updates and fixes to the game are extremely impressive.

I agree with you and i would like to add, that alot of ppl are saying that Ooo this is a easy fix how come that it takes so long to fix.
I will issue a challenge to anyone that says that it is so easy to fix this game.

Make your own MMo and make it bugg free, and once that is done. Then you got my attention..

lpool96

Cyanhide wrote: »

I agree, this game has such a bad rep it isn't even funny. Most people want to play the game but to scared because of stupid reviews like angry gamer which is the first video you get when go to youtube.

The game may have had a terrible launch, but so far I have had zero bug. Overall the game feels very polished and smooth. I wish Zenimax would give out guest passes after update 3 so people can see for themselves.

No, the game had a very smooth and good launch, the problems started after a few weeks when some people where hitting VR10 and complained about no endgame! Go figure. I have now 5 characters from lvl 27 - VR10 divided on all factions, people are complaining about bugged quests and this and than, WHY do I not have any problems? There are not a single quest I have not been able to complete so far.

Mo-ack

i can only agree withe the TO. Most of ppl i hear from other TS server the wont play the game because of the bad reputation!

Wolfshead

Rivqua wrote: »

Mr.Turtlesworth wrote: »

This game gets a bad rap... And honestly I'm not sure why... People are focusing on all the negatives in this game ( and too be honest, I can't think of many except maybe that there's no arena or duel function ), but people don't realize that there is NO perfect mmo. I had fun in WoW, I had fun in a Tera, Perfect World, Last chaos, ect but I can't think of anything that they do better than this game. The speed of updates in this game puts WoW to shame. People are just too damn picky. Thank you Zenimax and Bethesda for making this game and your constant updates and fixes to the game are extremely impressive.

I agree with you and i would like to add, that alot of ppl are saying that Ooo this is a easy fix how come that it takes so long to fix.
I will issue a challenge to anyone that says that it is so easy to fix this game.

Make your own MMo and make it bugg free, and once that is done. Then you got my attention..

I have to agree with you both and if i reminder right i think it was in a interview with leader of Dev Team a question was ask "why do take so long to fix bug in the game" and he asnwer " Well it is not just to fix bug if fix something you need to see so that thing don't mess something else up so that thing become broken instead" and he have very good point you have check so thing you fix don't bug out something else and so that is why thing take time to fix.

Cyanhide

Mo-ack wrote: »

i can only agree withe the TO. Most of ppl i hear from other TS server the wont play the game because of the bad reputation!

I actually try to post something about ESO when ever I see an article on massively or reddit about doubts or wanting to join.

Because I myself almost didn't buy this game because of the ESO bashing. Its like a hype, heck half those people might not even tried the game.

Loco_Mofo

Thanks for making me realise OP!

LOL

Now, back to reality...

Mr.Turtlesworth

steveb16_ESO46 wrote: »

You don't get to tell people if they are having fun or not and it doesn't matter what people say on forums anyway. It's money that talks and what it's been saying to Zenimax is - make big changes because things aren't going well.

It's good that you're enjoying the game as is. Others aren't. But if you cannot imagine what other games have and this one is currently missing then I really cannot believe you've played many MMO's.

I'm not telling people if they are having fun or not. I am telling them that it is unfair to bash an extremely good mmo for reasons that are particularly present in most successful mmos. People complain about bugs and bots most of all but nearly every mmo has bots and bugs when it first comes out. Not only that, but they fixed these problems for the most part. Of Course it will have issues. This mmo has probably the best graphics out of any game in the genre, so of course it's going to have bugs to start with! I watched the angry joe show review on the game and nearly every negative aspect he's pointed out has been fixed. The fact is too many people are sheep and follow what the masses tell them.

I edited some spelling errors... Damn auto correct!

Hilgara

I wouldn't say the game has been fixed. It has been changed. Which fixed it for some and broke it for others. The mark of a great MMO is not one that never needs fixing but one where fixing improves it for everyone

Cyanhide

steveb16_ESO46 wrote: »

It's good that you're enjoying the game as is. Others aren't. But if you cannot imagine what other games have and this one is currently missing then I really cannot believe you've played many MMO's.

Please do tell what other mmo's have that this one hasn't? I consider myself a mmorpg vet, there is little I haven't touched and I started with DAOC.

These changes they are making is in fact all the right stuff an mmo player needs. There is no mmo out there that can make you quest without making it feel like your grinding your a** of. Interactive items in mmo? Where have you seen that before?

There are some things ESO needs to change, but overall compared to its competition its right out there.

One of the reasons so many people are mad is because they expect the same game experience from a single player, which is ludicrous.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO

Hilgara wrote: »

I wouldn't say the game has been fixed. It has been changed. Which fixed it for some and broke it for others. The mark of a great MMO is not one that never needs fixing but one where fixing improves it for everyone

And which MMO has ever pulled that off?

Given the almost entirely contradictory 'wants' between the hardcore groupers who want 'hard' content and phat lewt rewards, and those who find hitting their heads against a brick wall repeatedly 'unfun' and who enjoy content the hardcore deride as 'easy' then the old adage about pleasing all the people all the time seems to apply, as I see it.

lpool96

Mr.Turtlesworth wrote: »

steveb16_ESO46 wrote: »

You don't get to tell people if they are having fun or not and it doesn't matter what people say on forums anyway. It's money that talks and what it's been saying to Zenimax is - make big changes because things aren't going well.

It's good that you're enjoying the game as is. Others aren't. But if you cannot imagine what other games have and this one is currently missing then I really cannot believe you've played many MMO's.

I'm not telling people if they are having fun or not. I am telling them that it is unfair to bash an extremely good mmo for reasons that are particularly present in most successful mmos.

THIS ^!

Mr.Turtlesworth

Cyanhide wrote: »

steveb16_ESO46 wrote: »

It's good that you're enjoying the game as is. Others aren't. But if you cannot imagine what other games have and this one is currently missing then I really cannot believe you've played many MMO's.

Please do tell what other mmo's have that this one hasn't? I consider myself a mmorpg vet, there is little I haven't touched and I started with DAOC.

These changes they are making is in fact all the right stuff an mmo player needs. There is no mmo out there that can make you quest without making it feel like your grinding your a** of. Interactive items in mmo? Where have you seen that before?

There are some things ESO needs to change, but overall compared to its competition its right out there.

One of the reasons so many people are mad is because they expect the same game experience from a single player, which is ludicrous.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Enkil

Cyanhide wrote: »

I started with DAOC

That explains a lot. This game is more like DAoC2 with Elder Scrolls lore and races.

It's natural that those of us that have been playing the sandbox single player games and have played sandbox MMOs would be a little disappointed that the ESO dev team has strayed from so many basic Elder Scrolls elements when we know they could work in an MMO.

Jarnhand

Yes its a great game, right now the best PvP game for me. But the game has serious issues and Zenimax do not seem to focus on fixing them, instead push out fluff for the PvE crowd, while they are bleeding PvPers like crazy.

Made a list in previous post, do not bother to list it again, check my post history if interested in understanding what the issues are the give this game a bad rep...

Hilgara

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

Hilgara wrote: »

I wouldn't say the game has been fixed. It has been changed. Which fixed it for some and broke it for others. The mark of a great MMO is not one that never needs fixing but one where fixing improves it for everyone

And which MMO has ever pulled that off?

.

Which games have managed to fix things without breaking other things. Quite a few. Some make proper use of a PTS. The development may be slower but its progressive and doesn't have to 'one step forward 2 back' problem we have here.

Cyanhide

Enkil wrote: »

Cyanhide wrote: »

I started with DAOC

That explains a lot. This game is more like DAoC2 with Elder Scrolls lore and races.

It's natural that those of us that have been playing the sandbox single player games and have played sandbox MMOs would be a little disappointed that the ESO dev team has strayed from so many basic Elder Scrolls elements when we know they could work in an MMO.

I can sympathies with that, I can really understand that feeling, but from my personal observation, it seems to me to many people expect single player mechanics/features in an mmorpg. It just isn't possible. It isn't up to the fans of the elder scrolls series to hold it over their head saying stuff like " we didn't ask for an mmo " frankly its not up to them. From an mmorpg standpoint ESO has succeeded in many ways most mmorpg'ss couldn't.

I just came from Wildstar, the new big thing, even tho on paper it has more " features" but really behind all the "humor" its empty content wise.

Again, people should give Zenimax a break, most mmo developers have a hard time creating balance for PVE and PVP players. In ESO's case they have to mix 3 types of players. PVE/PVP and Elder Scroll fans.

I wish people would just make a clear distinction between ESO's success as an Elder scroll title, or ESO as an mmorpg.

Guppet

I think the game is great too. For me the only thing missing is small scale PVP like warzones or battlegrounds, not too fussed about arenas.

I did struggle at first to see it the way I do now. Comming from many previous MMO's I started out with the mindset that getting to max level was the goal, as that is traditionally the case.

Due to this VR was a heck of a hurdle to hit. Especially with the spurious reason for it.

Now I play the game in an episodic way. I do two or three quests, one after the other, fully taking in the story. Each quest is kind of a worthy adventure in its own right. Each quest is it's own reward and would have been a Sunday afternoon of playing D&D, back when I was

Played for the pure story it's probably the best game I have ever played. It's a bonus that it has group activities and friends to chat to if I choose to do that.

I think if less people tried to rush through and enjoyed the journey, the game would get much better press.

Omnevolus

Mr.Turtlesworth wrote: »

This game gets a bad rap... And honestly I'm not sure why... People are focusing on all the negatives in this game ( and too be honest, I can't think of many except maybe that there's no arena or duel function ), but people don't realize that there is NO perfect mmo. I had fun in WoW, I had fun in a Tera, Perfect World, Last chaos, ect but I can't think of anything that they do better than this game. The speed of updates in this game puts WoW to shame. People are just too damn picky. Thank you Zenimax and Bethesda for making this game and your constant updates and fixes to the game are extremely impressive.

Agree 100%, and I've got 12 years of MMO experience across many games. This is already one that I enjoy more than most, and it's just going to get ALOT better.

Almost all of the dissent on these forums is unfair, or surprisingly selfish. Not that there is never anything wrong, but it's almost always blown way out of proportion, as you've noticed. I'm always surprised by the amount and degree of unreasonable and/or malicious posts on these forums, almost always over things that are just different than their preconceived expectations, or things that happen in every MMO, as you've also noticed.

I think TES had/has a very unique popularity and reputation, so people's expectations were inordinately high. And how negatively they react seems to be in direct proportion to how high those expectations were. Which throws reason right out the window.

Something that is almost always left out of consideration, is all MMO's are a bare-boned mess of trial and error for a long time after release, and most are not actually good games until the second year, sometimes later. There is always a sparse end-game at first, always awkward mechanics, always class imbalances, and many of these issues last for years in those games. And ZOS is using trailblazing technology and ideas, yet for some reason, everyone expects everything to be perfect out of the box. No MMO ever has been, nor ever will be.

Yet here in the third month after release people are actually infuriated, quitting the game!, over the lack of features that most MMO's don't have until well past their first year on the market. I've seen people demanding features here, saying they should have been implemented at launch! lol, that EQ2, for example, and many other games, did not have until their third or fourth year. And often those are features that very few other games even attempted, much less at the beginning.

All of those MMO's also break something every time they fix/patch something. It's incredibly common, yet it's the end of the world here. Tantrum, and ragequit.

It really is inexplicable. But hey, it's their loss. Once they've left and played other games again, gotten a better perspective, I think many of them will be back.

Hilgara

The game set off as an MMO rpg but is now becoming a RPG mmo.

The question is where is the market? it might be able to calve a niche out of the market as a RP focused MMO but gamers nowadays tend to be less interested in the RP element. Especially franchised RP because for many the lore means nothing.

dodgehopper_ESO

Actually I think many people do realize that this game is great. The bad press exists on many games, that end up also being Game of the Year rewards earners, and streaming with accolades. Just like the press, forums and forum writers have a vested interest in nitpicking on the flaws. For the press there is a need to properly critique games (Just as movie critics or food critics do the same thing). Nothing is perfect, and most critics can enjoy a good meal at a restaurant that they critiqued. So why do they do it? Because their job is to point out the negatives and the positives, so that if something is a dealbreaker for a particular person they can avoid the trap. The same is true of game reviewers. Forum posters on the other hand often love the game, and seek to mold it into the image that they find preferential. We are all aware that MMO's are living changing worlds, and many of us gripe about the flaws (as we see them) in order to exact positive change. While some/many individuals are a bit strident or crass in their approach I think this is often where the perception of vitriol comes from. Throw in a mix of internet anonymity and the overall vile manner in which many people communicate on the internet, and you get the strange sense that the sky is falling by reading forums.

In short, I think if you can take what people are writing with a grain of salt it wouldn't be so hard to read the forums. I have a number of critiques I could make about ESO, but in the balance I find it to be a great game. I also have a number of positive points I could make about the game as well. Just remember, patting the Developers backs won't get them to fix or improve what is currently there. If people simply learned to keep the polemics out of their conversations it might actually be a bit more constructive. (And yes, I do realize that Feedback is a much more direct approach to communicating with developers, however it is very limited in scope. Some people like to use both forums to communicate with the game designers).

steveb16_ESO46

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

steveb16_ESO46 wrote: »

It's good that you're enjoying the game as is. Others aren't. But if you cannot imagine what other games have and this one is currently missing then I really cannot believe you've played many MMO's.

And this is exactly what I mean - you are not totally happy because this does not feel like other MMOs you have liked?

Rubbish. I don't dislike ESO - it just wasn't fit for release and probably still isn't given all the technical and imbalance problems.

It lacks very basic features of an MMO right down to the ability to group (except under very limited circumstances). Apart from the entertaining story it has nothing that lifts it from the crowd. There just isn't that much to it.

It is an unambitious limited featured combat grinder whose limitations are already causing Zen to have a serious rethink.

Hopefully at some point it will solve its issues and expand its content.

it's nothing to do with it not being like other mmo's and everything to do with what it is.

steveb16_ESO46

Cyanhide wrote: »

steveb16_ESO46 wrote: »

I

Please do tell what other mmo's have that this one hasn't? I consider myself a mmorpg vet, there is little I haven't touched and I started with DAOC.

Ridiculous troll post if you have the experience you claim. You know full well what other games have that this doesn't from freedom to explore through functioning guilds, housing, proper social and RP features to the ability to actually group together as and when we want.