Skafsgaard wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

3. I disagree entirely with you, yet again. Why should my shield scale off my health when I'm a magicka user? Also, if shields scaled off of health, then that would mean that anyone with over 25k health would have massive, massive shields, and your problem with shields recycles. Besides, that does entirely nothing for a LA sorc because then we have to sacrifice any sort of sustain just to achieve that shield. So, no, I don't agree at all with you. Our magicka = our key to survival; therefore, our shield bases off of magicka, and we have a better chance to survive.

And you dont think magicka templars has this problem? You can stack ur dmg resource and get MORE damage and MORE shield, why is it fair that a templar cannot?

Atm, this is the only problem I have with the sorc class - ur shield shall scale of health and u will have to make a choice like others, now its just roflstomp

he can and does as his heals are significantly increased by doing the same a sorc has to do to increase her survivability.
so by stacking magica a magica temp gets more heals and more dmg how is that fair to the "none existant" sorc class heals ?

well the heal of my temp heals my temp for 7-11k dmg while the dmg he recieves is affected by his mitigation, my sorcs shield is at 9.2k effective shielding without any mitigation applied to it. sounds well balanced effectivity wise or i would even give the temp a sligt advantage.

but this discussion should be about Bolt Escape.

Skafsgaard wrote: »

You can stack ur dmg resource and get MORE damage and MORE shield, why is it fair that a templar cannot?

You're 100% right. If it is a magicka based shield + their ability to do 1-8 ports, it would be inbalanced. Given that other classes, which want to play magicka-based DD specs, have nothing comparable.
A shield with a fixed value would be OK, or based on HP as most other shields are (Bone, Blazing Shield, etc.)

But with this team of devs the removal of such an imbalanced skill will take 6-9 months. DO NOT expect Eric Wroebel & Friends to immediately understand what comes with the removal of soft caps to the full extend (magicka based shields vs HP based shields inbalance). They'll argue that the templar (and other classes) just have to skill for more HP.

I'm not sure that the sorcerer shield percentage is based up on magicka, can someone confirm this?
If yes, how much does the sorc damage shield absorb at
2500 magicka
3000 magicka
3500 magicka?

3000+ magicka has become pretty much standard. DO NOT argue that no one can get that far!

Skafsgaard wrote: »

Comparing a heal to a damage shield doesnt make sense, as I said. Essentially, they are the same, except the shield is precast and in PvP that is THE advantage. You have shield up and CC'd? Np, not so with a heal.

Anyway, doesnt sound like we'll ever agree - I just hope ZoS can appreciate the 'problem' here.

well proactive as well a s reactive all have their own advantage and disadvantages.

Francescolg wrote: »

Skafsgaard wrote: »

You can stack ur dmg resource and get MORE damage and MORE shield, why is it fair that a templar cannot?

You're 100% right. If it is a magicka based shield + their ability to do 1-8 ports, it would be inbalanced. Given that other classes, which want to play magicka-based DD specs, have nothing comparable.
A shield with a fixed value would be OK, or based on HP as most other shields are (Bone, Blazing Shield, etc.)

But with this team of devs the removal of such an imbalanced skill will take 6-9 months. DO NOT expect Eric Wroebel & Friends to immediately understand what comes with the removal of soft caps to the full extend (magicka based shields vs HP based shields inbalance). They'll argue that the templar (and other classes) just have to skill for more HP.

I'm not sure that the sorcerer shield percentage is based up on magicka, can someone confirm this?
If yes, how much does the sorc damage shield absorb at
2500 magicka
3000 magicka
3500 magicka?

3000+ magicka has become pretty much standard. DO NOT argue that no one can get that far!

well see for yourself http://i.imgur.com/KuZC1zE.png [26792magica = 9487 shield value]

Skafsgaard wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

Skafsgaard wrote: »

Comparing a heal to a damage shield doesnt make sense, as I said. Essentially, they are the same, except the shield is precast and in PvP that is THE advantage. You have shield up and CC'd? Np, not so with a heal.

Anyway, doesnt sound like we'll ever agree - I just hope ZoS can appreciate the 'problem' here.

well proactive as well a s reactive all have their own advantage and disadvantages.

Francescolg wrote: »

Skafsgaard wrote: »

You can stack ur dmg resource and get MORE damage and MORE shield, why is it fair that a templar cannot?

You're 100% right. If it is a magicka based shield + their ability to do 1-8 ports, it would be inbalanced. Given that other classes, which want to play magicka-based DD specs, have nothing comparable.
A shield with a fixed value would be OK, or based on HP as most other shields are (Bone, Blazing Shield, etc.)

But with this team of devs the removal of such an imbalanced skill will take 6-9 months. DO NOT expect Eric Wroebel & Friends to immediately understand what comes with the removal of soft caps to the full extend (magicka based shields vs HP based shields inbalance). They'll argue that the templar (and other classes) just have to skill for more HP.

I'm not sure that the sorcerer shield percentage is based up on magicka, can someone confirm this?
If yes, how much does the sorc damage shield absorb at
2500 magicka
3000 magicka
3500 magicka?

3000+ magicka has become pretty much standard. DO NOT argue that no one can get that far!

well see for yourself http://i.imgur.com/KuZC1zE.png [26792magica = 9487 shield value]

Well, if you can BE you only really need a proactive one...

Btw, nice shields dude. With around 26k hp as LA templar, I have a 5.8k blazing shield.

yeah and a 7-11k heal wich sorcs dont so you have the advantage of both worlds powerfull heals and shields nerf TEMPs nao!!

If a sword and board player sais to a shield/ward casting player: "Your shields are op"

Answer them: "If you agree to not block, I will agree to not cast wards"

IMO permblockers are as bad as before if not worst post 1.6.
And most people who complain about my ward(sorc) are permblockers in heavy/medium armor, its not my fault their build is focused on defence, they cant hope to bring down any decent players 1v1 with that crap dps.
Bolt Escape is the best escape in the game, yes, but any sorc build that can cast this spell more then 5 times in a row cant tank for ***.

Skafsgaard wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

Skafsgaard wrote: »

Tankqull wrote: »

Skafsgaard wrote: »

Comparing a heal to a damage shield doesnt make sense, as I said. Essentially, they are the same, except the shield is precast and in PvP that is THE advantage. You have shield up and CC'd? Np, not so with a heal.

Anyway, doesnt sound like we'll ever agree - I just hope ZoS can appreciate the 'problem' here.

well proactive as well a s reactive all have their own advantage and disadvantages.

Francescolg wrote: »

Skafsgaard wrote: »

You can stack ur dmg resource and get MORE damage and MORE shield, why is it fair that a templar cannot?

You're 100% right. If it is a magicka based shield + their ability to do 1-8 ports, it would be inbalanced. Given that other classes, which want to play magicka-based DD specs, have nothing comparable.
A shield with a fixed value would be OK, or based on HP as most other shields are (Bone, Blazing Shield, etc.)

But with this team of devs the removal of such an imbalanced skill will take 6-9 months. DO NOT expect Eric Wroebel & Friends to immediately understand what comes with the removal of soft caps to the full extend (magicka based shields vs HP based shields inbalance). They'll argue that the templar (and other classes) just have to skill for more HP.

I'm not sure that the sorcerer shield percentage is based up on magicka, can someone confirm this?
If yes, how much does the sorc damage shield absorb at
2500 magicka
3000 magicka
3500 magicka?

3000+ magicka has become pretty much standard. DO NOT argue that no one can get that far!

well see for yourself http://i.imgur.com/KuZC1zE.png [26792magica = 9487 shield value]

Well, if you can BE you only really need a proactive one...

Btw, nice shields dude. With around 26k hp as LA templar, I have a 5.8k blazing shield.

yeah and a 7-11k heal wich sorcs dont so you have the advantage of both worlds powerfull heals and shields nerf TEMPs nao!!

you have OP pet heal.. nuff said


edit, pls answer my previous off topic Q, if you are a true gent

hmmm you have an even more overpowered healing ritual wich takes as long to be casted and heals ~20% more than our pet heal and heals 5 other targets aswell. do i need to say more

to your off topic question its one of the ggframes internal options you have to activate

Skafsgaard wrote: »

also, we have the reduced heal debuff from battle spirit and let me tell u templar burst healing is EXPENSIVE, as I can understand stacking shields, not so much. Anyway, tell yourself whatever - but compared to a sorc, magick templars are in a bad spot, of c unless you're content as the group healer only - yea, easy AP, also VERY boring

my sorcs shield cost 1.8k magica while my templars BoL costs 2k thats ~10% difference in spell cost and roughly 1% difference in max magica. i would not call bursthealing more expensive than casting shields

but again this thread is about BE. shield thread is over there -> klickey

Spangla wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

Spangla wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

Spangla wrote: »

Sorc is BS in PVP atm you know it - Stop defending this crap.

Please can someone from zenimax build a character to v14 and pvp - Then you will see.

Much insightful, such descriptive. Care to be more specific about your complaints?

Not really one for explaining the blindingly obvious.

So you want to play that game? Ok.

DK/Temp/NB is BS in PVP atm you know it - Stop defending this crap.

Please can someone from zenimax build a character to v14 and pvp - Then you will see.

Except none of those have a reliable escape.

I'm not going to try and out whine a sorc on the forums - it doesnt work, hence why sorcs were buffed when they didnt need it. You guys are good.

Buffed? i'd like to kno exactly how we were buffed?

Bolt Escape still has a 50% cost penalty

Oh we got a 25% damage bonus on Crystal Frag procs that are 100% RNG based and require spamming another spell to have "a chance" to get.

Everything else is pretty much the same class skill wise, They nerfed Crushing Shock damage by 23% (No longer benefits from Flawless Dawnbreaker passive + another 10% nerf)

Daedric Curse is now blockable = nerf

Damage Sheild Values reduced 15% in Cyrodiil = nerf

Surge has a 0.25sec cool down making it useless = nerf

Streak no longer builds ultimate at all and gives CC immunity when used = nerf

Expert Mage no longer gives 10% Storm Calling Spell cost reduction = nerf (The spell damage you get in return is a joke,its not even noticable)

Clannfear given a stupid long cast time making it unusable in PVP because you know, heaven forbid anyone have a heal close to as good as GDB = nerf

Negate was gutted no longer stuns players, no longer dispels effects folks cast inside it, no longer heals, the skill is junk now in comparison to what it was. This was the biggest nerf any class has ever taken in this game bar none = mega nerf

FFS man, Sorcs were nerfed more in PTS then any other class.

All the QQ here is because Sorcs are now finally viable in pvp for 1 reason and 1 reason only:

"Prior to 1.6 Sorcs were handicapped by soft/hard caps more then any other class, Now that their is no softcaps, Sorcs can actually stack Spell Damage, Magicka, and Magicka Regen and not be absurdly penalized for it., this is really the only thing we got a buff on"

Sorcs are running around with low health, we have the lowest health in PVP. We can easily be 1 shotted by archers and are ridiculously vulnerable if caught in melee. Every class in this game has weaknesses including Sorcs.

woodsro wrote: »

Yup, leper got me last night outside glade lumbermill, , good play by him and pure stupidity on my part.

I I help him fix his crossfire, he kills me, hows that for gratitude! @cozmon3c_ESO just messing bro, its all in good fun! That was one hell of a burst rotation though. Hats off to you.

Yeah thanks for the help with that crossfire, game runs pretty well, except in large keep battles, (i dont think there is anything that will fix that through video power.)

Aquanova wrote: »

Bolt escape is probably the most annoying ability in the game to any other class trying to finish off a sorc, but I can understand why they have that skill. What I also understand but can't believe is that sorcs still want more. More dps, more heals, more utility, WTF? There is no other skill in the game that allows one to escape death when confronted by superior numbers like BE. It's "fight till I'm in trouble, then bolt escape, bolt escape, bolt escape, I'm out of trouble, let regen kick in then repeat". The worst part is you guy's cry that your dps is low compared to other classes. Yeah, tell that to the sorc who nailed me with an 8000+ dmg crystal fragment. With such a powerful ability like bolt escape, why would you need higher dps? In PvP I only ever see are sorcs running around soloing groups of 3 or more and getting away with it, all thanks in large part to bolt escape. I don't see DKS or temps do that.

Dude if you think 8k is alot of damage you need to check how hard stam builds hit for lol. 18k lethal arrow hit me the other day one shotting me. lethal arrows hit me from around 15-17k all the time. wrecking blows 14-16k all the time. my highest frags hit for 12k crit. 8k is nothing in this game right now.

Aquanova wrote: »

What I also understand but can't believe is that sorcs still want more. More dps, more heals, more utility, WTF?

Three things to keep in mind:

- "Sorcs" are not one person. Also, have you met any people? They tend to want stuff, always more stuff
- The folks who want more DPS are probably yelling into the wind at this point, as it certainly looks like sorc DPS is competitive with other ranged DPS. We'll still see demands for more, but that's partly because people don't adjust their playstyles quickly in some cases (see point one, above, again)
- Sorc self-healing and utility are fine, if you count Ward as a pseudo-heal (I do). But demands for more group heals and utility are more sensible. Sorcs bring nothing to the table as group healers, other than a slot for a resto staff

Sorcs can be roadrunners in PvP. BE is a good skill, and sorcs can be a tough kill for someone who doesn't have a strategy to deal with a mobile, shielded enemy. Those who do have such a strategy (and the skills on the bar to implement it) have a different experience.

Skafsgaard wrote: »

because a heal is nothing near as powerful as a damage shield and heals are available to everyone

This sounds like a very templar-centric view And as for templars, I don't think many people are finding them to be particularly flimsy in battle. They're tough nuts to crack, even if you're built glass cannon. They don't seem particularly mobile, though, unless they've loaded Retreating Manuevers or such.

Ezareth wrote: »

Snit wrote: »

Skafsgaard wrote: »

because a heal is nothing near as powerful as a damage shield and heals are available to everyone

This sounds like a very templar-centric view And as for templars, I don't think many people are finding them to be particularly flimsy in battle. They're tough nuts to crack, even if you're built glass cannon. They don't seem particularly mobile, though, unless they've loaded Retreating Manuevers or such.

Who cares if they're mobile IMO! They can ress players in about 1 second with the right setup.. 1 templar left alive can ress an entire group of dead players in a heartbeat.

The other day I cleared a keep of EP players and 1 night blade escaped my wrath. He ressed the templar from stealth and suddenly it was like The Walking dead! The corpses all stood up so fast I got swarmed down.

Indeed. Templars should really not be on here complaining about Sorcs imo.

Their rezzes are insane, their heals are still wild, their shield is very good, they can do mass damage, they have one of the best ultimates in the game, they have a really nice class gap closer, an execute, what else do they want? I've not one time cried for nerfs on any class, nor will I. I think that all classes have advantages and disadvantages, but seeing everyone want to get Sorc nerfed immensely more into the ground is just so ridiculous I 'can't even.'

I run about 28k magicka, my shield is about 9.5k or so, I'll check again when I get back on. My shield shrivels extremely fast, And if I don't get it back up in enough time, I'm done for pretty much. You all do realize that most major skills now hit for between 7-15k, right? That's my whole shield + a good chunk of my health if I'm hit for 15k.

As for Sorcerers having a class heal, um, what? Okay, Dark Conversion. Try casting that when you're in range of enemies lol. Not only does it take stam, but come on, it's nothing compared to a Green Dragon Blood or Breath of Life. Nightblades and Sorcerers don't have viable class heals, which is why we use healing ward. I'm sorry, do you want us to get rid of our only heal too?

Seriously all you people in this thread want is for Sorcerers to be super easy kills in PvP, like most were pre-1.6 unless they were excellent players.