Maintenance for the week of November 18:
[IN PROGRESS] PlayStation®: EU megaserver for maintenance – November 19, 23:00 UTC (6:00PM EST) - November 20, 17:00 UTC (12:00PM EST) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
[IN PROGRESS] PlayStation®: EU megaserver for maintenance – November 19, 23:00 UTC (6:00PM EST) - November 20, 17:00 UTC (12:00PM EST) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
The Issue with Eye of the Storm (Destruction Ultimate Morph)
-
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Lava_Croft wrote: »
It's not an issue about Magicka versus Stamina but an issue about the balance of the game as a whole. Trying to create a divide amongst the players only makes them weaker when going up against the monkey developer that gives them these balance problems.
Right. Just swallow it and wait until ZOS finally push the button. And then complain in the bunker or wastelands why no one did anything. Great attitude, won't let you down.Lava_Croft wrote: »Hi stop the QQ about Magicka suffering from Stamina and Stamina suffering from Magicka. It's all broken as ***.
If you want to be a hooligan go to your local football club on a sunday afternoon and beat up some folks from the other team.I think Magicka NB makes the best EOTS troll build.
5x Burning spellweave OR 5x Vicious Death (1x armor, 3x jewelery, 1x fire staff front bar)
5x Clever Alchemist (4x armor + 1x Resto staff back bar)
2x Monster set - Maybe Grothdarr or Illambris
Setup - PVE up your ult, then stealth close to some enemies. Buff up (including proxy det) and hit an immovable pot on your resto bar, swap to your destro bar and lotus fan in, then trigger your ult. Continue spamming lotus fan on whoever you want to kill first. Use Mist Form if they try to focus you. Run away (or just die) once your ult is down and start back at step 1.
This is what i was seeing alot of last night. Or groups of 10 using destro ults and negate in towers. People didnt have a chance.
So, basically the best counter is siege...
- Non interruptable
- no negate
- AoE so cloak/stealth/dodge roll don't let you escape...
- no evasion...
Weren't bats the same at some point?Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭Lava_Croft wrote: »
It's not an issue about Magicka versus Stamina but an issue about the balance of the game as a whole. Trying to create a divide amongst the players only makes them weaker when going up against the monkey developer that gives them these balance problems.
Right. Just swallow it and wait until ZOS finally push the button. And then complain in the bunker or wastelands why no one did anything. Great attitude, won't let you down.Lava_Croft wrote: »Hi stop the QQ about Magicka suffering from Stamina and Stamina suffering from Magicka. It's all broken as ***.
If you want to be a hooligan go to your local football club on a sunday afternoon and beat up some folks from the other team.I think Magicka NB makes the best EOTS troll build.
5x Burning spellweave OR 5x Vicious Death (1x armor, 3x jewelery, 1x fire staff front bar)
5x Clever Alchemist (4x armor + 1x Resto staff back bar)
2x Monster set - Maybe Grothdarr or Illambris
Setup - PVE up your ult, then stealth close to some enemies. Buff up (including proxy det) and hit an immovable pot on your resto bar, swap to your destro bar and lotus fan in, then trigger your ult. Continue spamming lotus fan on whoever you want to kill first. Use Mist Form if they try to focus you. Run away (or just die) once your ult is down and start back at step 1.
This is what i was seeing alot of last night. Or groups of 10 using destro ults and negate in towers. People didnt have a chance.
So, basically the best counter is siege...
- Non interruptable
- no negate
- AoE so cloak/stealth/dodge roll don't let you escape...
- no evasion...
Weren't bats the same at some point?
The main issue with bat swarm was ultimate cost reduction stacking, to the point that sorcs for example could get the ult cost to 4 or so, meaning you could just spam it nonstop. However anyone could build to get the ult cost down to the 15-20 ult range back then.PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB0 -
Ishammael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Lava_Croft wrote: »
It's not an issue about Magicka versus Stamina but an issue about the balance of the game as a whole. Trying to create a divide amongst the players only makes them weaker when going up against the monkey developer that gives them these balance problems.
Right. Just swallow it and wait until ZOS finally push the button. And then complain in the bunker or wastelands why no one did anything. Great attitude, won't let you down.Lava_Croft wrote: »Hi stop the QQ about Magicka suffering from Stamina and Stamina suffering from Magicka. It's all broken as ***.
If you want to be a hooligan go to your local football club on a sunday afternoon and beat up some folks from the other team.I think Magicka NB makes the best EOTS troll build.
5x Burning spellweave OR 5x Vicious Death (1x armor, 3x jewelery, 1x fire staff front bar)
5x Clever Alchemist (4x armor + 1x Resto staff back bar)
2x Monster set - Maybe Grothdarr or Illambris
Setup - PVE up your ult, then stealth close to some enemies. Buff up (including proxy det) and hit an immovable pot on your resto bar, swap to your destro bar and lotus fan in, then trigger your ult. Continue spamming lotus fan on whoever you want to kill first. Use Mist Form if they try to focus you. Run away (or just die) once your ult is down and start back at step 1.
This is what i was seeing alot of last night. Or groups of 10 using destro ults and negate in towers. People didnt have a chance.
So, basically the best counter is siege...
- Non interruptable
- no negate
- AoE so cloak/stealth/dodge roll don't let you escape...
- no evasion...
Weren't bats the same at some point?
No. Bats has never done very much damage. At one point of the game you could simply reduce its cost to single digits.0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭More crying about EoTS by people that apparently can't tell the difference between it and the stationary morph.
I killed like one person streaking into them yesterday with EoTS. One. People normally moving away did just fine, and the damage ticks never exceeded 5K. Most were 3-4K
The potatoes absolutely sat and boiled in the stationary morph though. I cast it right on top of myself practically, and watched the AP flow in the fire storm. They sat there. Trying so hard to kill me they sat in a huge fire vortex with 20% extra damage. Try harder potatoes.
This was TF for about four hours last night. I used both. I'm going to have to say this is an L2P issue, and maybe add a bigger red circle.
Eye of Bullcrap? More like "Tunnel Vision Try-Hard"
It's really not as much of an issue when used in builds that aren't even remotely optimized for it, like yours. However, if someone intelligent picks it up and combines it with immovable pots and a gap closer (or vamp mist if zerg busting), maybe even adds clever alchemist... it's a different story. To be clear, I'm not accusing you of not being intelligent, but I am accusing you of using it on a build that doesn't take advantage of it and acting like it's all good because it isn't great for you. Sorcs don't have a class gap closer like NBs and Templars do, so you don't have it as easy to destroy people with it... but you could always build FOR it and run 1h/s or 2h for a gap closer to spam.
3500 spell damage, 44.5K max magicka, 54% crit, and stacked CP into elfborn and spell erosion.
The issue is that it just doesn't hit all that hard except for the stationary morph. I admit I'm not running a specialized nightblade bomb build, but I'm not exactly a slacker.
If this the EoTS morph gets nerfed it will be completely useless as an ultimate. Nobody will ever die to it, especially not stamina builds.
0 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭More crying about EoTS by people that apparently can't tell the difference between it and the stationary morph.
I killed like one person streaking into them yesterday with EoTS. One. People normally moving away did just fine, and the damage ticks never exceeded 5K. Most were 3-4K
The potatoes absolutely sat and boiled in the stationary morph though. I cast it right on top of myself practically, and watched the AP flow in the fire storm. They sat there. Trying so hard to kill me they sat in a huge fire vortex with 20% extra damage. Try harder potatoes.
This was TF for about four hours last night. I used both. I'm going to have to say this is an L2P issue, and maybe add a bigger red circle.
Eye of Bullcrap? More like "Tunnel Vision Try-Hard"
It's really not as much of an issue when used in builds that aren't even remotely optimized for it, like yours. However, if someone intelligent picks it up and combines it with immovable pots and a gap closer (or vamp mist if zerg busting), maybe even adds clever alchemist... it's a different story. To be clear, I'm not accusing you of not being intelligent, but I am accusing you of using it on a build that doesn't take advantage of it and acting like it's all good because it isn't great for you. Sorcs don't have a class gap closer like NBs and Templars do, so you don't have it as easy to destroy people with it... but you could always build FOR it and run 1h/s or 2h for a gap closer to spam.
3500 spell damage, 44.5K max magicka, 54% crit, and stacked CP into elfborn and spell erosion.
The issue is that it just doesn't hit all that hard except for the stationary morph. I admit I'm not running a specialized nightblade bomb build, but I'm not exactly a slacker.
If this the EoTS morph gets nerfed it will be completely useless as an ultimate. Nobody will ever die to it, especially not stamina builds.
I take it you're really enjoying killing people with it. Everyone else here has seen how hard it hits, you're not fooling anyone.PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB1 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭More crying about EoTS by people that apparently can't tell the difference between it and the stationary morph.
I killed like one person streaking into them yesterday with EoTS. One. People normally moving away did just fine, and the damage ticks never exceeded 5K. Most were 3-4K
The potatoes absolutely sat and boiled in the stationary morph though. I cast it right on top of myself practically, and watched the AP flow in the fire storm. They sat there. Trying so hard to kill me they sat in a huge fire vortex with 20% extra damage. Try harder potatoes.
This was TF for about four hours last night. I used both. I'm going to have to say this is an L2P issue, and maybe add a bigger red circle.
Eye of Bullcrap? More like "Tunnel Vision Try-Hard"
It's really not as much of an issue when used in builds that aren't even remotely optimized for it, like yours. However, if someone intelligent picks it up and combines it with immovable pots and a gap closer (or vamp mist if zerg busting), maybe even adds clever alchemist... it's a different story. To be clear, I'm not accusing you of not being intelligent, but I am accusing you of using it on a build that doesn't take advantage of it and acting like it's all good because it isn't great for you. Sorcs don't have a class gap closer like NBs and Templars do, so you don't have it as easy to destroy people with it... but you could always build FOR it and run 1h/s or 2h for a gap closer to spam.
3500 spell damage, 44.5K max magicka, 54% crit, and stacked CP into elfborn and spell erosion.
The issue is that it just doesn't hit all that hard except for the stationary morph. I admit I'm not running a specialized nightblade bomb build, but I'm not exactly a slacker.
If this the EoTS morph gets nerfed it will be completely useless as an ultimate. Nobody will ever die to it, especially not stamina builds.
I take it you're really enjoying killing people with it. Everyone else here has seen how hard it hits, you're not fooling anyone.
The stationary morph with the fire? Yes. It does 20% more damage, and then even more to every single vampire out there. They all roast like undead potatoes.
Don't like it? Try running in Cyrodiil without stage four for a change and quit whining about it.
"But but but... I NEED to spam mist form all day!"
And the problem is EoTS?! No...0 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭More crying about EoTS by people that apparently can't tell the difference between it and the stationary morph.
I killed like one person streaking into them yesterday with EoTS. One. People normally moving away did just fine, and the damage ticks never exceeded 5K. Most were 3-4K
The potatoes absolutely sat and boiled in the stationary morph though. I cast it right on top of myself practically, and watched the AP flow in the fire storm. They sat there. Trying so hard to kill me they sat in a huge fire vortex with 20% extra damage. Try harder potatoes.
This was TF for about four hours last night. I used both. I'm going to have to say this is an L2P issue, and maybe add a bigger red circle.
Eye of Bullcrap? More like "Tunnel Vision Try-Hard"
It's really not as much of an issue when used in builds that aren't even remotely optimized for it, like yours. However, if someone intelligent picks it up and combines it with immovable pots and a gap closer (or vamp mist if zerg busting), maybe even adds clever alchemist... it's a different story. To be clear, I'm not accusing you of not being intelligent, but I am accusing you of using it on a build that doesn't take advantage of it and acting like it's all good because it isn't great for you. Sorcs don't have a class gap closer like NBs and Templars do, so you don't have it as easy to destroy people with it... but you could always build FOR it and run 1h/s or 2h for a gap closer to spam.
I kind of agree with him though. The only people I kill with this are people who are being way to aggressive. people will try to fight you in the storm. It's pretty much the same for any aoe ultimate I see peopleMore crying about EoTS by people that apparently can't tell the difference between it and the stationary morph.
I killed like one person streaking into them yesterday with EoTS. One. People normally moving away did just fine, and the damage ticks never exceeded 5K. Most were 3-4K
The potatoes absolutely sat and boiled in the stationary morph though. I cast it right on top of myself practically, and watched the AP flow in the fire storm. They sat there. Trying so hard to kill me they sat in a huge fire vortex with 20% extra damage. Try harder potatoes.
This was TF for about four hours last night. I used both. I'm going to have to say this is an L2P issue, and maybe add a bigger red circle.
Eye of Bullcrap? More like "Tunnel Vision Try-Hard"
It's really not as much of an issue when used in builds that aren't even remotely optimized for it, like yours. However, if someone intelligent picks it up and combines it with immovable pots and a gap closer (or vamp mist if zerg busting), maybe even adds clever alchemist... it's a different story. To be clear, I'm not accusing you of not being intelligent, but I am accusing you of using it on a build that doesn't take advantage of it and acting like it's all good because it isn't great for you. Sorcs don't have a class gap closer like NBs and Templars do, so you don't have it as easy to destroy people with it... but you could always build FOR it and run 1h/s or 2h for a gap closer to spam.
3500 spell damage, 44.5K max magicka, 54% crit, and stacked CP into elfborn and spell erosion.
The issue is that it just doesn't hit all that hard except for the stationary morph. I admit I'm not running a specialized nightblade bomb build, but I'm not exactly a slacker.
If this the EoTS morph gets nerfed it will be completely useless as an ultimate. Nobody will ever die to it, especially not stamina builds.
I take it you're really enjoying killing people with it. Everyone else here has seen how hard it hits, you're not fooling anyone.
I kind of agree with him I have 55k magicka and the damage ticks on PvP spec players are around 5k on crits so if you sit in it it will hit you for around 35k, but people don't just sit it in. On vampires I've seen it crit as high as 8k. The only time this is ultimate is op is when people are too aggressive and try to fight you in it, that's me talking from a solo perspective. For group play this ultimate is way too OP if organized ball groups stack these together with a negate and roots and snares its all over. But if you are just playing solo in cyrodiil the ultimate is fine and it really isn't anywhere near as bad as some other things in the game. It should probably be nerfed though because this is a group based game, and this ultimate has too much of a negative effect on group play0 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭More crying about EoTS by people that apparently can't tell the difference between it and the stationary morph.
I killed like one person streaking into them yesterday with EoTS. One. People normally moving away did just fine, and the damage ticks never exceeded 5K. Most were 3-4K
The potatoes absolutely sat and boiled in the stationary morph though. I cast it right on top of myself practically, and watched the AP flow in the fire storm. They sat there. Trying so hard to kill me they sat in a huge fire vortex with 20% extra damage. Try harder potatoes.
This was TF for about four hours last night. I used both. I'm going to have to say this is an L2P issue, and maybe add a bigger red circle.
Eye of Bullcrap? More like "Tunnel Vision Try-Hard"
It's really not as much of an issue when used in builds that aren't even remotely optimized for it, like yours. However, if someone intelligent picks it up and combines it with immovable pots and a gap closer (or vamp mist if zerg busting), maybe even adds clever alchemist... it's a different story. To be clear, I'm not accusing you of not being intelligent, but I am accusing you of using it on a build that doesn't take advantage of it and acting like it's all good because it isn't great for you. Sorcs don't have a class gap closer like NBs and Templars do, so you don't have it as easy to destroy people with it... but you could always build FOR it and run 1h/s or 2h for a gap closer to spam.
3500 spell damage, 44.5K max magicka, 54% crit, and stacked CP into elfborn and spell erosion.
The issue is that it just doesn't hit all that hard except for the stationary morph. I admit I'm not running a specialized nightblade bomb build, but I'm not exactly a slacker.
If this the EoTS morph gets nerfed it will be completely useless as an ultimate. Nobody will ever die to it, especially not stamina builds.
I take it you're really enjoying killing people with it. Everyone else here has seen how hard it hits, you're not fooling anyone.
The stationary morph with the fire? Yes. It does 20% more damage, and then even more to every single vampire out there. They all roast like undead potatoes.
Don't like it? Try running in Cyrodiil without stage four for a change and quit whining about it.
"But but but... I NEED to spam mist form all day!"
And the problem is EoTS?! No...
Basically I understand their point, though it seems it's addressed in the wrong way. The skill doesn't need the sweet kiss of the nerf hammer, what it needs is a counter strategy. Same for DBoS.
Asking for a nerf at this point does no goodSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭I love it how the rabid defenders have been completely ignoring the talk of combining this with immovable pots and gap closers. "Just walk out of it" they say. That works when you're not the one being targetted by the gap closer spam or the user of the ultimate is just running around trying to hit random people with it. I'd be glad to hear an effective counter for that unlucky person they are spamming, though.Edited by Kutsuu on 10 November 2016 20:12PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB2 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭I love it how the rabid defenders have been completely ignoring the talk of combining this with immovable pots and gap closers. "Just walk out of it" they say. That works when you're not the one being targetted by the gap closer spam or the user of the ultimate is just running around trying to hit random people with it. I'd be glad to hear an effective counter for that unlucky person they are spamming, though.
If you are magicka base you can literally just shield through it or a Templar just heal through it. I tested it on my friend in 5 pieces of heavy armor with vigor and rally ticking and had him just stand in it didn't even take him to 50% health and after he popped rally and was right back to full. As for a medium armor wearers I have not tested it. It does seem really effective against stamina nightblades in medium armor though from just me using it in open word PvP. I'm not saying it doesn't need to be nerfed because I feel it's way too strong when it's supported by other players. The build I tested it with has 55k magicka and 2800 spell damage, and it was the eots morph1 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭I hope you are not serious...
The ultimate is very balanced, the problem is people hwo don't want to learn how counter it (don't need to change anything, just need to learn how counter it).
Here is how counter the ultimate :
For all :
- You can snare/imobilize the user : this can be do in anybuild : there is the trap in fighter guild for stamina, and somes others ways for magicka (classes skills or frost clench)
- If you are not able to do it, you can stun the user : don't need to learn how stunning people right ?
- You can escape the AoE : streak, running, porting on an target, using shadow Image, using mist form, hurricane ect.
- If you are in Heavy armor you can dance in the ultimate and outheal it.
- if you are a magicka templar you can out heal it.
- If you are a sorc you can shield it.
Now, let's speak about the ultimate :
There 2s before the ultimate hit ==> Previsible.
This is the most expensive ultimate ==> You can't spam it.
Damage is over time. ==> You have time.
It's undogeable : hopefully, people need to have a brain instead of dodge everything.
It's unblocable : hopefully, people need a brain instead of keeping the right click.
Seems unfair because it's unblocable and undogeable ?
No, medium armor can run for escape it and heavy armor have ton of resistance and very good heal plus, there is counter for everyone without change anything in your build !
The main problem with the ultimate is the bus of the storm.
It's easy to do it cuz it don't need organisation to use the ultimate in the same time : (2s before it hit and 7s duration).
But, if an organize group use DBOS in the same time, which is instant burst damage, you will die anyway.
78966541230 ultimate in the same time always mean your dead. It's just more easy with Eye of the Strom, but it's less effective than true OP ultimate (SBOS).
DBOS is better than Eye of the storm :
Cheaper.
Undodgable (the impact + some ticks if you are stun)
Unblocable if you don't have the block button hold before it hit.
Almost invisible if you cut anim it ==> you can't react to it.
It stun people.
It's burst damage (better in PvP than dots)
It's stamina so it's big damage.
You CAN'T QQ about Eye of the strom when you have an instant invisible AoE burst Stunning and cheap ultimate.
(Yeah, I think only lazy people qq for that ultimate, meaning tons of stamina heavy armor (75% of people ?) because they can't act like always, as a god tanking while attacking with monster damage with closes eyes. They need to use their brain, and it's hard when your heavy armor usually do all the job (Killing people, bring you sustain and better resistance.))Edited by Aedaryl on 10 November 2016 20:472 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭I hope you are not serious...
The ultimate is very balanced, the problem is people hwo don't want to learn how counter it (don't need to change anything, just need to learn how counter it).
Here is *** counter the ultimate :
For all :
- You can snare/imobilize the user : this can be do in anybuild : there is the trap in fighter guild for stamina, and some other way for magicka (classes skills or frost clench
- If you do it, you can stun the user : don't need to learn how stunning people right ?
- You can escape the AoE : streak, running, porting on an target, using shadow Image, using mist form, hurricane ect.
- If you are in Heavy armor you can dance in the ultimate and outheal it.
- if you are a magicka templar you can out heal it.
- If you are a sorc you can shield it.
Now, let's speak about the ultimate :
There 2s before the ultimate hit ==> Previsible.
This is the most expensive ultimate ==> You can't spam it.
Damage is over time. ==> You have time.
It's undogeable : hopefully, people need to have a brain instead of dodge everything.
It's unblocable : hopefully, people need a brain instead of keeping the right click.
Seems unfair because it's unblocable and undogeable ?
No, medium armor can run for escape it and heavy armor have ton of resistance and very good heal plus, there is counter for everyone without change anything in your build !
The main problem with the ultimate is the bus of the storm.
It's easy to do it cuz it don't need organisation to use the ultimate in the same time : (2s before it hit and 7s duration).
But, if an organize group use DBOS in the same time, which is instant burst damage, you will die anyway.
78966541230 ultimate in the same time always mean your dead. It's just more easy with Eye of the Strom, but it's less effective than true OP ultimate (SBOS).
DBOS is better than Eye of the storm :
Cheaper.
Undodgable (the impact + some ticks if you are stun)
Unblocable if you don't have the block button hold before it hit.
Almost invisible if you cut anim it ==> you can't react to it.
It stun people.
It's burst damage (better in PvP than dots)
It's stamina so it's big damage.
You CAN'T QQ about Eye of the strom when you have an instant invisible AoE burst Stunning and cheap ultimate.
(Yeah, I think only lazy people qq for that ultimate, meaning tons of stamina heavy armor (75% of people ?) because they can't act like always, as a god tanking while attacking with monster damage with closes eyes. They need to use their brain, and it's hard when your heavy armor usually do all the job (Killing people, bring you sustain and better resistance.))
Have you ever heard of Immovable potions? How about gap closers? I'd love to see you sprint and run away from someone who is using EOTS effectively. You're just doing the same thing that the Stamina Proctatoes do when people say that proc builds need to be toned down - telling everyone to L2P while you happily abuse it. Good point on Mist Form though. That's probably the only viable counter. I haven't used it in ages, but I assume you can still get bashed out of the mist form channel right?
And you did nail it on the head - it's yet another punishing mechanic for medium armor users. Go tanky heavy armor proc build, go magicka build, or get ***.Edited by Kutsuu on 10 November 2016 20:59PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB2 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭I hope you are not serious...
The ultimate is very balanced, the problem is people hwo don't want to learn how counter it (don't need to change anything, just need to learn how counter it).
Here is *** counter the ultimate :
For all :
- You can snare/imobilize the user : this can be do in anybuild : there is the trap in fighter guild for stamina, and some other way for magicka (classes skills or frost clench
- If you do it, you can stun the user : don't need to learn how stunning people right ?
- You can escape the AoE : streak, running, porting on an target, using shadow Image, using mist form, hurricane ect.
- If you are in Heavy armor you can dance in the ultimate and outheal it.
- if you are a magicka templar you can out heal it.
- If you are a sorc you can shield it.
Now, let's speak about the ultimate :
There 2s before the ultimate hit ==> Previsible.
This is the most expensive ultimate ==> You can't spam it.
Damage is over time. ==> You have time.
It's undogeable : hopefully, people need to have a brain instead of dodge everything.
It's unblocable : hopefully, people need a brain instead of keeping the right click.
Seems unfair because it's unblocable and undogeable ?
No, medium armor can run for escape it and heavy armor have ton of resistance and very good heal plus, there is counter for everyone without change anything in your build !
The main problem with the ultimate is the bus of the storm.
It's easy to do it cuz it don't need organisation to use the ultimate in the same time : (2s before it hit and 7s duration).
But, if an organize group use DBOS in the same time, which is instant burst damage, you will die anyway.
78966541230 ultimate in the same time always mean your dead. It's just more easy with Eye of the Strom, but it's less effective than true OP ultimate (SBOS).
DBOS is better than Eye of the storm :
Cheaper.
Undodgable (the impact + some ticks if you are stun)
Unblocable if you don't have the block button hold before it hit.
Almost invisible if you cut anim it ==> you can't react to it.
It stun people.
It's burst damage (better in PvP than dots)
It's stamina so it's big damage.
You CAN'T QQ about Eye of the strom when you have an instant invisible AoE burst Stunning and cheap ultimate.
(Yeah, I think only lazy people qq for that ultimate, meaning tons of stamina heavy armor (75% of people ?) because they can't act like always, as a god tanking while attacking with monster damage with closes eyes. They need to use their brain, and it's hard when your heavy armor usually do all the job (Killing people, bring you sustain and better resistance.))
Have you ever heard of Immovable potions? How about gap closers? I'd love to see you sprint and run away from someone who is using EOTS effectively. You're just doing the same thing that the Stamina Proctatoes do when people say that proc builds need to be toned down - telling everyone to L2P while you happily abuse it. Good point on Mist Form though. That's probably the only viable counter. I haven't used it in ages, but I assume you can still get bashed out of the mist form channel right?
And you did nail it on the head - it's yet another punishing mechanic for medium armor users. Go tanky heavy armor proc build, go magicka build, or get ***.
Only NB have a gap closer for users of that storm. You can still outheal the damage if you are in heavy armor or shield it in light armor, and for medium armor, spaming heal and dodge roll (you can dodge the attacks from the user) and out heal the damage of the storm, because yes, you can Attacking/Healing WHILE you dodge roll.
0 -
Kutsuu✭✭✭✭✭I hope you are not serious...
The ultimate is very balanced, the problem is people hwo don't want to learn how counter it (don't need to change anything, just need to learn how counter it).
Here is *** counter the ultimate :
For all :
- You can snare/imobilize the user : this can be do in anybuild : there is the trap in fighter guild for stamina, and some other way for magicka (classes skills or frost clench
- If you do it, you can stun the user : don't need to learn how stunning people right ?
- You can escape the AoE : streak, running, porting on an target, using shadow Image, using mist form, hurricane ect.
- If you are in Heavy armor you can dance in the ultimate and outheal it.
- if you are a magicka templar you can out heal it.
- If you are a sorc you can shield it.
Now, let's speak about the ultimate :
There 2s before the ultimate hit ==> Previsible.
This is the most expensive ultimate ==> You can't spam it.
Damage is over time. ==> You have time.
It's undogeable : hopefully, people need to have a brain instead of dodge everything.
It's unblocable : hopefully, people need a brain instead of keeping the right click.
Seems unfair because it's unblocable and undogeable ?
No, medium armor can run for escape it and heavy armor have ton of resistance and very good heal plus, there is counter for everyone without change anything in your build !
The main problem with the ultimate is the bus of the storm.
It's easy to do it cuz it don't need organisation to use the ultimate in the same time : (2s before it hit and 7s duration).
But, if an organize group use DBOS in the same time, which is instant burst damage, you will die anyway.
78966541230 ultimate in the same time always mean your dead. It's just more easy with Eye of the Strom, but it's less effective than true OP ultimate (SBOS).
DBOS is better than Eye of the storm :
Cheaper.
Undodgable (the impact + some ticks if you are stun)
Unblocable if you don't have the block button hold before it hit.
Almost invisible if you cut anim it ==> you can't react to it.
It stun people.
It's burst damage (better in PvP than dots)
It's stamina so it's big damage.
You CAN'T QQ about Eye of the strom when you have an instant invisible AoE burst Stunning and cheap ultimate.
(Yeah, I think only lazy people qq for that ultimate, meaning tons of stamina heavy armor (75% of people ?) because they can't act like always, as a god tanking while attacking with monster damage with closes eyes. They need to use their brain, and it's hard when your heavy armor usually do all the job (Killing people, bring you sustain and better resistance.))
Have you ever heard of Immovable potions? How about gap closers? I'd love to see you sprint and run away from someone who is using EOTS effectively. You're just doing the same thing that the Stamina Proctatoes do when people say that proc builds need to be toned down - telling everyone to L2P while you happily abuse it. Good point on Mist Form though. That's probably the only viable counter. I haven't used it in ages, but I assume you can still get bashed out of the mist form channel right?
And you did nail it on the head - it's yet another punishing mechanic for medium armor users. Go tanky heavy armor proc build, go magicka build, or get ***.
Only NB have a gap closer for users of that storm. You can still outheal the damage if you are in heavy armor or shield it in light armor, and for medium armor, spaming heal and dodge roll (you can dodge the attacks from the user) and out heal the damage of the storm, because yes, you can Attacking/Healing WHILE you dodge roll.
Sure if there's another enemy player around you can gap close to them to get away. That's far from guaranteed. I can tell you for sure that spamming dodge roll and vigor/rally will not save a medium armor user. It's far too much incoming damage. All this "it only hits for 3k a tick" stuff is complete fabrication or they are talking about hitting a 33k spell resist heavy armor tank.Edited by Kutsuu on 10 November 2016 21:12PC/NA
Envy Me - Sorc
Kutsus - NB
Kutsmuffin - Temp
Kutsuu the Destroyer - NB
Kutsuu - Temp
Natsu Dragoneel - DK
Kutsumo - NB0 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭Even if it's 6k tick second, a rally tick each second + a vigor tick will reduces the damage enough for survive.
If you have a 1k rally tick + a 2k vigor tick, you reduce the ultimate to 3k tick per second.
3kx7 = 21k.
You are alive.0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Yeah, I think stam builds are simply salty they now have to think about their combat approach. Stamblades, for example, can dish out a lethal burst with an ultimate that costs a fifth of EotS. And is not telegraphed. I see lots of L2P issues here in this thread.
Regarding ball groups, well, whether you get gapclosed to death or bombed, it doesn't matter in my book. Cyrodiil has always been about numbers, so just gather a good group yourself to counter the enemy?
I guess lessening the damage and cost is probably what's gonna happen. Would be fine, presumably. In the meantime, I kindly suggest, ladies and gentlemen, to deal with it.0 -
mtwiggz✭✭✭✭✭Eye of the Storm is not a balanced counter to proc sets to all of you balance experts out there.
Balance is not a case of "counter OP skills with other OP skills".
With that said, Eye of the Storm wouldn't be all that OP if you could actually see the red circles or animation of the skill going off while in battle.Edited by mtwiggz on 10 November 2016 22:271 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I hope you are not serious...
The ultimate is very balanced, the problem is people hwo don't want to learn how counter it (don't need to change anything, just need to learn how counter it).
Here is how counter the ultimate :
For all :
- You can snare/imobilize the user : this can be do in anybuild : there is the trap in fighter guild for stamina, and somes others ways for magicka (classes skills or frost clench)
- If you are not able to do it, you can stun the user : don't need to learn how stunning people right ?
- You can escape the AoE : streak, running, porting on an target, using shadow Image, using mist form, hurricane ect.
- If you are in Heavy armor you can dance in the ultimate and outheal it.
- if you are a magicka templar you can out heal it.
- If you are a sorc you can shield it.
Now, let's speak about the ultimate :
There 2s before the ultimate hit ==> Previsible.
This is the most expensive ultimate ==> You can't spam it.
Damage is over time. ==> You have time.
It's undogeable : hopefully, people need to have a brain instead of dodge everything.
It's unblocable : hopefully, people need a brain instead of keeping the right click.
Seems unfair because it's unblocable and undogeable ?
No, medium armor can run for escape it and heavy armor have ton of resistance and very good heal plus, there is counter for everyone without change anything in your build !
The main problem with the ultimate is the bus of the storm.
It's easy to do it cuz it don't need organisation to use the ultimate in the same time : (2s before it hit and 7s duration).
But, if an organize group use DBOS in the same time, which is instant burst damage, you will die anyway.
78966541230 ultimate in the same time always mean your dead. It's just more easy with Eye of the Strom, but it's less effective than true OP ultimate (SBOS).
DBOS is better than Eye of the storm :
Cheaper.
Undodgable (the impact + some ticks if you are stun)
Unblocable if you don't have the block button hold before it hit.
Almost invisible if you cut anim it ==> you can't react to it.
It stun people.
It's burst damage (better in PvP than dots)
It's stamina so it's big damage.
You CAN'T QQ about Eye of the strom when you have an instant invisible AoE burst Stunning and cheap ultimate.
(Yeah, I think only lazy people qq for that ultimate, meaning tons of stamina heavy armor (75% of people ?) because they can't act like always, as a god tanking while attacking with monster damage with closes eyes. They need to use their brain, and it's hard when your heavy armor usually do all the job (Killing people, bring you sustain and better resistance.))
You forgot one obvious counter:
* Kill the gap closing magicka night blade.
When you do, the spell immediately drops. I Did that last night and it works, all of my timed burst hit right when the flame EoTS started. Then it stopped and he died.
If a freaking Sorc can do it, a medium armor stamina nightblade should be able to as well.0 -
Stratforge✭✭✭✭Every single person defending this skill 100% runs behind their zerg and drops it on command.PC NA
Xbox One NA (retired)2 -
Valencer✭✭✭✭✭
✭People saying EotS is balanced...
Group play is so dumbed down and blatantly comes down to who brings more destro ultis to a fight. Because we really needed even more emphasis on numbers. Anyone insta-melts when 3 or 4 of these storms are stacked together.
Any medium armour stamina build is done for the moment any not-totally-braindead EotS user uses this ulti and stays on them. Way to force the heavy armour meta down everyone's throatsI hope you are not serious...
The ultimate is very balanced, the problem is people hwo don't want to learn how counter it (don't need to change anything, just need to learn how counter it).
Here is how counter the ultimate :
For all :
- You can snare/imobilize the user : this can be do in anybuild : there is the trap in fighter guild for stamina, and somes others ways for magicka (classes skills or frost clench)
- If you are not able to do it, you can stun the user : don't need to learn how stunning people right ?
- You can escape the AoE : streak, running, porting on an target, using shadow Image, using mist form, hurricane ect.
- If you are in Heavy armor you can dance in the ultimate and outheal it.
- if you are a magicka templar you can out heal it.
- If you are a sorc you can shield it.
Now, let's speak about the ultimate :
There 2s before the ultimate hit ==> Previsible.
This is the most expensive ultimate ==> You can't spam it.
Damage is over time. ==> You have time.
It's undogeable : hopefully, people need to have a brain instead of dodge everything.
It's unblocable : hopefully, people need a brain instead of keeping the right click.
Seems unfair because it's unblocable and undogeable ?
No, medium armor can run for escape it and heavy armor have ton of resistance and very good heal plus, there is counter for everyone without change anything in your build !
The main problem with the ultimate is the bus of the storm.
It's easy to do it cuz it don't need organisation to use the ultimate in the same time : (2s before it hit and 7s duration).
But, if an organize group use DBOS in the same time, which is instant burst damage, you will die anyway.
78966541230 ultimate in the same time always mean your dead. It's just more easy with Eye of the Strom, but it's less effective than true OP ultimate (SBOS).
DBOS is better than Eye of the storm :
Cheaper.
Undodgable (the impact + some ticks if you are stun)
Unblocable if you don't have the block button hold before it hit.
Almost invisible if you cut anim it ==> you can't react to it.
It stun people.
It's burst damage (better in PvP than dots)
It's stamina so it's big damage.
You CAN'T QQ about Eye of the strom when you have an instant invisible AoE burst Stunning and cheap ultimate.
(Yeah, I think only lazy people qq for that ultimate, meaning tons of stamina heavy armor (75% of people ?) because they can't act like always, as a god tanking while attacking with monster damage with closes eyes. They need to use their brain, and it's hard when your heavy armor usually do all the job (Killing people, bring you sustain and better resistance.))
You forgot one obvious counter:
* Kill the gap closing magicka night blade.
When you do, the spell immediately drops. I Did that last night and it works, all of my timed burst hit right when the flame EoTS started. Then it stopped and he died.
If a freaking Sorc can do it, a medium armor stamina nightblade should be able to as well.
The difference is a magicka sorcerer has refreshable shields (that prevent storm crits, very important) whereas any stamina build simply cant outheal that damage by any stretch of the imagination. Especially a nightblade which lacks major mending.Edited by Valencer on 11 November 2016 04:453 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Not seen anyone who is defending it come up with a convincing defence in group play.
Shame I didn't catch the screen shot - but had a death cap the other day with 5 EOTS (all different people) , 1 Grothdarr, 1 Sap. Took 1-2 seconds to die (40k mag shielded sorc in heavy armour). There were others in the same area who also died in 1-2 seconds.
This is where it's overpowered - People here are either just not looking at it from a group perspective or are using it in this way themselves (probably while complaining about stam-procs).
I'm not saying that the attacking ball group shouldn't have won - but pre-EOTS, their ulti dump was instant, at one spot, and usually killed you instantly. Now it follows them for 5 (or is it 7?) seconds, instantly killing any who they gap-close to or pull in or simply catch up to while sprinting with rapids. It kills a LOT more people - and since in cyro, kills replenishes ulti, then despite the cost - it replenishes much more quickly than I think was intended.
btw, how does negate work with it? I'm sure I was killed by it once while standing in my negate bubble. Does it stop it from being cast? Does it supress the effects if the user runs through the bubble and they turn back on after leaving? Does it stop the effect permenently as soon as they enter? or does it simply not work on stuff that's already active?Edited by Biro123 on 11 November 2016 12:29Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.0 -
Dasovaruilos✭✭✭✭✭It really needs a better graphic / telegraph.
Yesterday we had to keep shouting to the group which ultimate was ours and which was not because we had 5 or 6 at the same time and it is very, very hard to see, specially the lightning one when you are inside keeps or trying to go through gates.
But seeing it in use in large scale fights yesterday (about 50~70 x 80~100) I'm sure it will be changed A LOT on the next update, probably nerfed to the ground.
I really like it in PvE, but it is a little bit off for PvP.Edited by Dasovaruilos on 11 November 2016 13:260 -
Sa0n✭✭✭Bye-bye to ability to self-cast it and things will be a lot nicer once again.Literally eat my assflaps.
Uninstalled.
Time wasted: 6 years.0 -
Takes-No-Prisoner✭✭✭✭✭
✭It really needs a better graphic / telegraph.
Yesterday we had to keep shouting to the group which ultimate was ours and which was not because we had 5 or 6 at the same time and it is very, very hard to see, specially the lightning one when you are inside keeps or trying to go through gates.
But seeing it in use in large scale fights yesterday (about 50~70 x 80~100) I'm sure it will be changed A LOT on the next update, probably nerfed to the ground.
I really like it in PvE, but it is a little bit off for PvP.
Negate needs a better telegraph too. But I call out which one is mine whether I am grouped or not. That isn't necessarily a bad thing though. It certainly helps when you're in a group.0 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Sooooo when will this ultimate be reverted to its original status (half damage, double duration)? In group play, even the first edition of this ultimate would be overpowered and utilized by ball groups. The solo/duo insta-kill ultimate we have now is a little to much if you ask me.
I really don't wanna have to slot bombard or an ice destro as stamina just to immobilize these destro ult trains ive been seeing lately. I really don't wanna switch to magicka to turn into one of the destro ult users either.
The pvp combat team has been so quiet lately......
Edited by GreenSoup2HoT on 11 November 2016 15:11PS4 NA DC0 -
Dasovaruilos✭✭✭✭✭Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »It really needs a better graphic / telegraph.
Yesterday we had to keep shouting to the group which ultimate was ours and which was not because we had 5 or 6 at the same time and it is very, very hard to see, specially the lightning one when you are inside keeps or trying to go through gates.
But seeing it in use in large scale fights yesterday (about 50~70 x 80~100) I'm sure it will be changed A LOT on the next update, probably nerfed to the ground.
I really like it in PvE, but it is a little bit off for PvP.
Negate needs a better telegraph too. But I call out which one is mine whether I am grouped or not. That isn't necessarily a bad thing though. It certainly helps when you're in a group.
I agree, it does need a better telegraph as well.
The thing is, negate doesn't kill you automatically in 3 seconds, so you can see your skills are not firing and get out.
The destro ulti just kill to fast to be allowed to be cast without a huge obvious telegraph.
Yesterday AD was putting the static lightning ulti rght under the gate to the scroll. The cloud would be hidden by the gate itself. Almost impossible to see until you saw your health melting away.1 -
Anti_Virus✭✭✭✭✭
✭sodantokb16_ESO wrote: »Would be interested to know how many of you here, who complain about the damage, are running stage4 vampire...
Not saying its balanced ult, doesnt need nerf, etc... but I bet most players wouldnt cry about it that much if they werent running with 25% fire weakness.
I see the lightning one the most tbh
Lightning gets the small damage bonus from Sorc and can proc disintegration, it also gets two more seconds with the stationary morph.
Fire I see more often though because so many people run sharpened fire destro staves.
I'm just not seeing the kind of damage people are complaining about though except for those that I know to be vampires. Can this ult be empowered or something?
Mine isn't exactly a low damage build...
You don't see the dmg because you are protected by 3 nice giant wards.Power Wealth And Influence.1 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Anti_Virus wrote: »sodantokb16_ESO wrote: »Would be interested to know how many of you here, who complain about the damage, are running stage4 vampire...
Not saying its balanced ult, doesnt need nerf, etc... but I bet most players wouldnt cry about it that much if they werent running with 25% fire weakness.
I see the lightning one the most tbh
Lightning gets the small damage bonus from Sorc and can proc disintegration, it also gets two more seconds with the stationary morph.
Fire I see more often though because so many people run sharpened fire destro staves.
I'm just not seeing the kind of damage people are complaining about though except for those that I know to be vampires. Can this ult be empowered or something?
Mine isn't exactly a low damage build...
You don't see the dmg because you are protected by 3 nice giant wards.
I mean, that I dont see it in my own combat logs using it on other people. 3500 spell damage, 44.5K max magicka, 54% crit. 3-4K most ticks. 5K on a crit.
Three wards? If you manage to stack three, it will last for two seconds. Try again. The shields are done in less time than it takes to read this.
1
