Make all damage shields in game scale with health.

Domander

This would make health more of a stat you would want defensively as opposed to getting double the benefit of offense and defense from another resource pool.

choices...choices..

Here's the damage shields that should change.

brawler
whitestrakes
annulment
conjured ward


Steadfast ward is a healing tool, and for the sake of balance already scales with health. It scales with missing health. A higher health pool will allow you to more easily take advantage of this scaling.

Barrier should stay scaling off highest stat, I think it should be changed to allow health to increase it's value, if that should be the highest stat. It is an ultimate after all. This is really the only exception that makes sense to me. It is technically a damage shield, but it's also an ultimate.

The other damage shields in the game scale with health, or are static.


discuss.

Cinnamon_Spider

Lertil

It's an interesting idea, boneshield and blazing shield work this way and are technically balanced, if boneshield would actually work...

Annulment - 30% of hp shield that absorbs only magic damage with an increase of 1/2/3/4% (increase per level) per piece of LA.

Obsidian Shield - 15% shield on allies, 30% on self.

Conjured Ward - 30% shield --- Hardened Ward 45% hp shield, i think it should be more than standard because of the squishy nature of magicka sorcs.

Healing Ward - 25% total hp heal, increases by 300%~ etc etc. Id like to keep this somewhat strong as a nightblade user its the only shield we get.

Brawler - 5/6/7/8% hp damage shield per target hit (max 6 target[48%])

Shielded Assault - 15% damage shield, Although i find this ability to be balanced as is, if you want to commit to this i would recommend converting all damage shields to %hp, otherwise its confusing and unfair to certain players.

I am all for these changes although i believe damage shields should also be changed to allow critting and proc extra effects like swallow soul/blood craze healing.

Edit:
An idea for a nightblade shield

Mirage - 20% dodge chance for 10 seconds. Every time you dodge you gain a 15% hp damage shield. Armour buff removed.
This skill would immediately change up people's builds. I personally love the speed burst from Double Take so i would have to take some time to decide which to use.

Teargrants

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Oh wait.

bloodenragedb14_ESO

simply no. The shields are fine, the only problem there really is is the shield stacking, when thats fixed, if its fixed, no one will have a problem with damage shields.

honestly, i dont get peoples problem with damage shields like ward, the shield stacking and such have been in the game since launch, yet no one said things then. What i think is that people want easy kills. get it in your head that sometimes your going to run into someone that is better than you, and they are going to kill you. Its not the game or spells in question, its that you simply are not as skilled a gamer as your PK'er

Cinnamon_Spider

Teargrants wrote: »

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Oh wait.

I figured I'd save you the trouble. I'm sure you were off mashing potatoes or whatever it is you do with them.

Domander

bloodenragedb14_ESO wrote: »

simply no. The shields are fine, the only problem there really is is the shield stacking, when thats fixed, if its fixed, no one will have a problem with damage shields.

honestly, i dont get peoples problem with damage shields like ward, the shield stacking and such have been in the game since launch, yet no one said things then. What i think is that people want easy kills. get it in your head that sometimes your going to run into someone that is better than you, and they are going to kill you. Its not the game or spells in question, its that you simply are not as skilled a gamer as your PK'er

LOL

Balance and skill are 2 very separate things, also damage shields do not kill, nor would making them scale off health = easy kills. Btw, what kind of logic is that? that this would mean easier kills? It would only be an easier kill against the glass cannons (which are tankier than many heavy armor wearers currently) that have no health.

If all shields scaled to health, I think there are some players that would consider adding some health, instead of just dumping everything into magicka because magicka = more shield. Health is kind of a weak stat compared to the others, this would give it a bit more use.

Health should = higher defense, magicka = higher spell offense and more ability to cast protective spells and higher healing, stamina = higher weapon offense and more ability to use defensive moves such as dodge and block.

With the few magicka scaling shields some players can have max offense and defense.

One example of how unbalanced this is, is going all magicka with reduction enchants, harness magicka will give more magicka back than it costs and take more than one spell to get through. (usually several, except for the really heavy hitters)

also if you think they are ever going to make them not stack, I really doubt it.

ToRelax

So you think one doesn't get more defensive capabilites adding some stamina?

LtCrunch

Let's be honest here this is another "nerf hardened ward" complaint thread. Call it what it is because hardened ward is the only damage shield that does not scale off of your max HP besides maybe brawler(haven't tested it). If you're going to ask for that then I demand the amount of times one can dodge roll is limited across the board regardless if how much stamina/stamina regeneration someone stacks along with it. In my eyes dodge monkey builds are a much larger problem than hardened ward and/or shield stacking. I do think that the healing received debuff should have some type of effect on damage shields though. Since a damage shield is just preventative healing vs reactive healing.

Fact is without hardened ward scaling the way it does Sorc's would be severely effected in a negative capacity in PVP. I actually think all class damage shields should scale off of magicka to give magicka more utility for other classes and. help make up for the extreme squishy nature of light armor. Either that or give light armor much more powerful bonuses for DPS/burst output as it is medium has the best offensive bonuses along with the 3/4 the defenses of heavy. Light armor gets a bit worse offensive bonuses and much worse defenses(1/4 of heavy armor)

As it is there is a reason Sorc's are pretty much the only formidable magicka light armor builds atm, because they are capable of effective defense unlike other classes. So I propose all class damage shields scale off of max magicka to give light armor proper utility as well as a means of potential effective defense across all classes.

bloodenragedb14_ESO

Brandalf wrote: »

Let's be honest here this is another "nerf hardened ward" complaint thread. Call it what it is because hardened ward is the only damage shield that does not scale off of your max HP besides maybe brawler(haven't tested it). If you're going to ask for that then I demand the amount of times one can dodge roll is limited across the board regardless if how much stamina/stamina regeneration someone stacks along with it. In my eyes dodge monkey builds are a much larger problem than hardened ward and/or shield stacking. I do think that the healing received debuff should have some type of effect on damage shields though. Since a damage shield is just preventative healing vs reactive healing.

Fact is without hardened ward scaling the way it does Sorc's would be severely effected in a negative capacity in PVP. I actually think all class damage shields should scale off of magicka to give magicka more utility for other classes and. help make up for the extreme squishy nature of light armor. Either that or give light armor much more powerful bonuses for DPS/burst output as it is medium has the best offensive bonuses along with the 3/4 the defenses of heavy. Light armor gets a bit worse offensive bonuses and much worse defenses(1/4 of heavy armor)

As it is there is a reason Sorc's are pretty much the only formidable magicka light armor builds atm, because they are capable of effective defense unlike other classes. So I propose all class damage shields scale off of max magicka to give light armor proper utility as well as a means of potential effective defense across all classes.

agreed.

Also, a little wordplay. what do you think when you hear the word sorcerer

Is is a sword wielding maniac? no? is it a bow firing perfectionist? no? an old, frail man throwing a fireball? yes?

Point is, whether you want to believe it or not, each class is best suited after its namesake. dragonknights are great tanks, templars are great healers, sorcerers are great magicka casters, nightblades are great assassins. Completely balancing the classes would make the game boring, the classes need variety and differences, they need different power levels. Stop getting mad that someone killed you and strive to get better at the game.

Septimus_Magna

This may sound good in theory but will be total crap in reality, no offence.
Shield stacking is only effective 1v1, maybe 1v2 bad players. When 2 or more players do damage the shields are gone in no time. Making all shields scale off health will greatly boost stamina builds with decent a health pool, their main weakness is not having good shields but they have dodge roll to prevent getting hit. Giving them good shields will simply make them unkillable because they can dodge most attacks and absorb the damage of undodgeable attacks.

Also magicka builds who have little defense agianst physical attack and a relative small health pool get very squishy because they have small shields.

Result, magicka builds cant do any damage to stamina builds because they dodge and absorb all damage. Stamina builds will now 2-3 shot every magicka build because they have no defense at all.

bloodenragedb14_ESO

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

This may sound good in theory but will be total crap in reality, no offence.
Shield stacking is only effective 1v1, maybe 1v2 bad players. When 2 or more players do damage the shields are gone in no time. Making all shields scale off health will greatly boost stamina builds with decent a health pool, their main weakness is not having good shields but they have dodge roll to prevent getting hit. Giving them good shields will simply make them unkillable because they can dodge most attacks and absorb the damage of undodgeable attacks.

Also magicka builds who have little defense agianst physical attack and a relative small health pool get very squishy because they have small shields.

Result, magicka builds cant do any damage to stamina builds because they dodge and absorb all damage. Stamina builds will now 2-3 shot every magicka build because they have no defense at all.

but thats what they want, they want the easy kills they used to get. Its frustrating, when people talk balance this, balance that, uncle sheo hit me with a nerf ball bat. For all the nerf crying, all they really want is to remove the few things that keep other classes viable so they can kill them

aco5712

or i would also suggest, making frag shield (since its useless in its current state) scale off magicka. Same as radiant ward (the useless morph of blazing shield). This would give a bit more variety in builds because you can either get good damage shield for protection but a crap secondary effect, or a bigger effect and crappier shield.

Stamden

Yes please.

Ezareth

cozmon3c_ESO

if there is not shield stacking you will never see a sorc streak again, streak sorcs have to stack harness magicka and hardened ward to even be viable on the battle field and not get wtf pwned. i dont like using two slots to be viable though so i use the ball of lightening morph which basically sticks harness magicka and bolt escape effectively into one ability. so i can have more room for activities on my bars.

Xsorus

There are multiple abilities in this game that go through dodge, So Dodge users have to get some health...

It doesn't work that way for some Shield Users....So make Shields scale off health and be done with it.

Ffastyl

One method of doing this I had thought of is to make damage shield capacity cap at the user's Max Health. i.e. with 15k Health you can get up to a 15k total shield, and at 9k Health up to a 9k total shield. It indirectly ties shield strength to the Health stat and helps balance shield stacking. Afterall, to get a 30k shield you need 30k Health, and who has the Magicka/Spell Power to go that high after getting Health to 30k?

FENGRUSH

Ffastyl wrote: »

One method of doing this I had thought of is to make damage shield capacity cap at the user's Max Health. i.e. with 15k Health you can get up to a 15k total shield, and at 9k Health up to a 9k total shield. It indirectly ties shield strength to the Health stat and helps balance shield stacking. Afterall, to get a 30k shield you need 30k Health, and who has the Magicka/Spell Power to go that high after getting Health to 30k?

Interesting idea, not too bad

Ezareth

Xsorus wrote: »

There are multiple abilities in this game that go through dodge, So Dodge users have to get some health...

It doesn't work that way for some Shield Users....So make Shields scale off health and be done with it.

Dodge rollers users use Medium Armor which has three times the armor and spell resist that Light Armor has. Higher passive defensive means less need for more robust active defenses.

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

RinaldoGandolphi

Radiant Ward has the potential to be more powerful then Blazing Shield if you can tap a few targets, its also considerably cheaper. I think all sheilds should scale off either magic or stamina, whichever is higher. Scaling them off health i always thought was a bad idea, and why the Templar's did never made sense to me.

Xsorus

Ezareth wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

There are multiple abilities in this game that go through dodge, So Dodge users have to get some health...

It doesn't work that way for some Shield Users....So make Shields scale off health and be done with it.

Dodge rollers users use Medium Armor which has three times the armor and spell resist that Light Armor has. Higher passive defensive means less need for more robust active defenses.

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

And Light armor users have shields, which can't be crit...(Plus the fact that you can overcap spell resist with light as well with nirn, leaving only physical resist, which can be vastly ignored simply because using a armor debuff + 2 handed mace esp if they're in medium armor) Just the fact that shields can't be crit gives them better mitigation when medium armor does with its armor/spell resist.

Do you know what I hit someone in Medium Armor for with Focused Aim crit? around 13k...

Do you know what I hit a Sorc for in Light armor with a Shield up? 8.2k

Snit

Here's an MMO Basic: Health and Mitigation (armor) synergize well. Characters with high armor mitigation benefit the most by stacking health, in terms of "Time To Live" calculations. Characters with low armor values gain relatively little from stacking health. They need to focus on things like avoidance or absorb shields.

If every absorb shield were based on health, that would simply tip the scales further away from light armor toward medium and heavy, and mixes of the two. Light armor is already in pretty bad shape. Medium is already in very good shape. No further push here is justified.

Some people haven't figured out how to kill shielded opponents, especially sorcs. The issues in their build, gear or rotation should not be confused with an overall imbalance, as other players absolutely have figured it out.

LtCrunch

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

if there is not shield stacking you will never see a sorc streak again, streak sorcs have to stack harness magicka and hardened ward to even be viable on the battle field and not get wtf pwned. i dont like using two slots to be viable though so i use the ball of lightening morph which basically sticks harness magicka and bolt escape effectively into one ability. so i can have more room for activities on my bars.

I'm not sure what you're talking about but I use streak and don't have a need for harness magicka. On the topic of ball of lightning, it needs a nerf. There needs to be a maximum amount of projectiles it can absorb just like every other absorb/reflect in the game.

LtCrunch

Snit wrote: »

Here's an MMO Basic: Health and Mitigation (armor) synergize well. Characters with high armor mitigation benefit the most by stacking health, in terms of "Time To Live" calculations. Characters with low armor values gain relatively little from stacking health. They need to focus on things like avoidance or absorb shields.

If every absorb shield were based on health, that would simply tip the scales further away from light armor toward medium and heavy, and mixes of the two. Light armor is already in pretty bad shape. Medium is already in very good shape. No further push here is justified.

Some people haven't figured out how to kill shielded opponents, especially sorcs. The issues in their build, gear or rotation should not be confused with an overall imbalance, as other players absolutely have figured it out.

Exactly this! It's not too difficult to counter the Sorc build in question if you know what you're doing and know the builds weakness. This is kind of a PVP basic, isn't it? If you don't know how to capitalize on enemy weaknesses or are incapable of due to your own build limitations then that's user error, not a balance issue.

cozmon3c_ESO

Brandalf wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

if there is not shield stacking you will never see a sorc streak again, streak sorcs have to stack harness magicka and hardened ward to even be viable on the battle field and not get wtf pwned. i dont like using two slots to be viable though so i use the ball of lightening morph which basically sticks harness magicka and bolt escape effectively into one ability. so i can have more room for activities on my bars.

I'm not sure what you're talking about but I use streak and don't have a need for harness magicka. On the topic of ball of lightning, it needs a nerf. There needs to be a maximum amount of projectiles it can absorb just like every other absorb/reflect in the game.

and get wrecked because i can defend against magicka damage and you cant.

FENGRUSH

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

Brandalf wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

if there is not shield stacking you will never see a sorc streak again, streak sorcs have to stack harness magicka and hardened ward to even be viable on the battle field and not get wtf pwned. i dont like using two slots to be viable though so i use the ball of lightening morph which basically sticks harness magicka and bolt escape effectively into one ability. so i can have more room for activities on my bars.

I'm not sure what you're talking about but I use streak and don't have a need for harness magicka. On the topic of ball of lightning, it needs a nerf. There needs to be a maximum amount of projectiles it can absorb just like every other absorb/reflect in the game.

and get wrecked because i can defend against magicka damage and you cant.

Its really a matter of play style. Ball is good for the type of play you do out there between keeps.

LtCrunch

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

Brandalf wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

if there is not shield stacking you will never see a sorc streak again, streak sorcs have to stack harness magicka and hardened ward to even be viable on the battle field and not get wtf pwned. i dont like using two slots to be viable though so i use the ball of lightening morph which basically sticks harness magicka and bolt escape effectively into one ability. so i can have more room for activities on my bars.

I'm not sure what you're talking about but I use streak and don't have a need for harness magicka. On the topic of ball of lightning, it needs a nerf. There needs to be a maximum amount of projectiles it can absorb just like every other absorb/reflect in the game.

and get wrecked because i can defend against magicka damage and you cant.

I've fought you several times in Cyrodiil and you never "wrecked" me. In fact most of our fights ended up in one of us retreating due to a stalemate and/or incoming enemy forces.You're using conjecture as a basis of argument against my choice in morphing to streak instead on BOL without any information about my build and that's silly.

Soris

Domander wrote: »

This would make health more of a stat you would want defensively as opposed to getting double the benefit of offense and defense from another resource pool.

choices...choices..

discuss.

Sir you are so right here

Whyn Aurum

Domander wrote: »

This would make health more of a stat you would want defensively as opposed to getting double the benefit of offense and defense from another resource pool.

choices...choices..

discuss.

Any you play DK am i right?

eventide03b14a_ESO

This is a sorc nerf dressed up like some sort of balance issue. Sure it's defensive and it scales off of a damage resource pool. News flash Einstein block and dodge roll are also used by the stamina pool which is also a damage resource. So basically we should need to spread out pools but stamina builds shouldn't. LMFAO.